Do you let you children miss school?

[ekerr19]

Ok, I am going out on this limb - on the Spring Break thread I posted that I think we don't have a problem allowing our children to miss 2 - 3 days of school for a cruise. Usually just one time per year, at Spring Break.

Our kids attend private school and we don't have to worry about the "truancy officer" ;) or enforced absenteeism policies.

We always make certain they do their assignments ahead of time or take them with us. We also set aside certain amounts of time each day for their lessons.

We have never had a problem doing this - but I read that many cruisers think this is horrible. We try and make each vacation a learning experience and I believe that it is just as important to expose our kids to different avenues of education aside from the classroom. We receive quite a bit of support and encouragement from both theschool and teachers.

I'm curious what others think and what experiences anyone else may have.

[grandma bev]

You have absolutely the right idea!!!! My children were taken out of public school a few times for trips, and they grew up just fine, thank you! They also learned a lot that cannot be taught in the classroom.

Bev

Packing for Ryndam Christmas Cruise Dec. 18. Wooooo Hooooooo and
Ho Ho Ho!

[Pudgesmom]

I agree with travel as a learning experience. Unfortunately, our public school system prevents high schoolers from exempting their exams if they have "unexcused" absences. Money is doled out from the state according to the attendance rate, and this is how they keep our children in school!


Beth

[Vicar]

If at all possible I try and arrange vacations when my daughter and fiancees son are out of school, but sometimes that is not always possible.

I think this has happened only once or twice in the past, and then it was only a day or two of school that was missed. I spoke with the school well in advance and the teachers had no problem giving the work they would miss either in advance or to do while away.

Like I said I think in all my daughters school years and she is a senior in high school now. This happened once maybe twice, so its not like we were excessive.

[Tatka]

It's really depends on the situation, learning abilities, grade etc.

My son isn't very good student..mostly due to his organizational skills. I am trying not to take him from school at all as he really needs consistent learning process. (I like an idea of year around schools). However we usually take him with us on Thanksgiving trips to Europe. He only misses 2.5 days and Europe is trully educational experience.:)

I would never take him on our n-th "Caribbean cruise" instead of school. It would be very convenient and cheap though.

But this is our situation. What people do with their children it's their business...Hey some people homeschool their kids.

[bethd]

Back in February, my parents offered to take my 10 year old son(then in 5th grade) on the Rotterdam for a cruise to the Panama Canal. My husband and I thought it would be a wonderful learning expierence for him. Unfortuntly, his school administrators disagreed, but left the decision up to to us as the parents, whether we would allow him to have 7 days unexcused. We let him go and he still speaks about this cruise and how cool it was to see how the ships go through the canal. We made sure he took any missed work with him that his teachers provided. The teachers were also very good about allowing him to make up any tests he may have missed. It seems the only ones who thought he should not go was the Principal. The teachers all agreed that it would be a great expierence to see the canal operation first hand.

I sometimes think that the schools forget that

I think the older the child the harder it would be to miss school for an extended period of time.

Just my opinion.

Beth

[Gardendog]

HI, I'm new here on this board. I have only cruised twice, both times in the Caribbean. I have traveled alot by plane and car and have 3 kids. When our oldest (who is now a twenty something) was in 5th grade, I took him out of school for a week around Easter for a trip to Europe. The teacher was concerned about missing school--but I was not, and he got "fully educated" despite missing a week of 5th grade.:)

My other son was in 3rd grade at the time, and that teacher didn't bat an eye.
Now they boys are in college and I would never take them out--it's too expensive!!!
I would never take a high schooler out of school for more than a day or two at the most--they end up missing too much.

[KenM]

When our kids were younger , we took them many times on cruises and cut school. This was from elementary through high school.
Today they still talk about the good times that WE all had as a family when we cruised together...
They certainly don't bring up the fact that they wish that they had spent more time in school...
One is an accountant and the other finishes law school next year...so it didn't have any impact at all- BUT IT SURE MAKES OUR MEMORIES SWEET..

Enjoy your kids because they do grow up faster then you can imagine..
I am glad that we pulled them from school...

[lyndamr]

My personal feeling on this is what kind of a parent would I be if I let my children miss school? BUT there are times when they do not do much in school, such as the few days before Spring Recess, or the week before school ends....I have found the kids (at least mine here in Florida) get term papers, reports, projects around the two weeks before winter recess, so I would never travel during those times.
My daughter is in special classes (she is in 7th grade) above the honors/advanced classes, she is doing high school algebra since last year, I would not want her to miss any classes (other than for being ill) as the classes are excillerated and she can fall behind. My son in high school, is in honors classes, I feel at this age it is also important to teach a child in these soon to be adult coming up years the meaning of responsibility and committment. Sure those things are always taught in this household, but he will be an adult in two years graduating high school and going into college then the work force, so my concern is to teach him responsibility, and his responsibility is to attend classes each day (unless ill) do his best and know that vacations will be given. We choose times when they are off school such as the many weeks they are off during the summer, spring recess, long weekened trips such as over Martin Luther King, or Presiden't Day to name a few, but at this age of my children school is more important. My opinion, vacations can be taken other times when the do not have school.

There are times when parents can only go certain times, if I had this situation where I could not travel when the children are off from school, I would choose one of the times when not much work is given in school before a long weekened, the week before school ends or a few days before spring recess.

Its just my opinion.......to each their own.

[longtimecruiser]

When my daughter was nine, we took her out of school for an extened Spring Break. She missed several days of school. I made sure that she got her assignments before she left. I was an Elementary teacher so I informed her that she would have to do her work. We went on Hal through the Panama Canal. She has never forgotten that trip. Funny thing, when she got back, she was AHEAD of the class.

[bepsf]

Leave the kids at home??? What a perfectly horrible idea!!!

I'm not a parent (obviously), but I'm not so old that i've forgotten the parties we had as kids when other kid's parents were out of town!!! Even if there was an adult around, these kids got away with murder while M&D were gone! And what kind of message does that send the kids when M&D can't bother to adjust their travel schedules - or worse, don't want their kids along for the ride!

Travel is one of the most educational experiences for people of every age. Travel also can supply fodder for future school reports and projects in science, geography, history and social studies. Simple things like currency exchange can be used as lessons in math! Kids also benefit from seeing other societies and cultures where folks don't necessarily speak English and everyone doesn't have TV's, cellphones, cars, fastfood, etc. which can help them to appreciate the benefits of what they do have. Why anyone would deprive children of those life lessons is completely beyond me...

EKerr - ignore the "teachers" and school administrators. Take the kids with you!!!

[Fran0521]

We just recently returned from the Western Caribbean on the Norwegian Sun. We took our 16 yr old granddaughter who is in her Junior Year. One of her teachers gave some homework assignments, which she was able to finish before we left, and a chance to make up a couple test when she returned. Her english class teacher, had her read two chapters in a novel they were reading ( so this went on the plane with her). The others said you will be fine, go have a good time and bring back pictures. The school also listed her as absent with excused absence. We also took her out of school to a Disney trip when she was in the first grade then again in third. Again, she had assignments which were completed before we left. I see nothing wrong in taking them out for a family vacation during the school year especially if thats the only time the family could take one together. The only time I wouldn't do it would be during regents weeks.

[CaptData]

Due to beening in military and travelling during school for a posting the children learned alot the year we moved in late Oct. There are differences in education from Province to Province. But they also learned a hard lesson as well, that missing school can and does reflect in their marks. My children are grown now and they talk about all of the moving around. It was good for some things but bad for other things. They did like the learning experience.

Both of my children have children now and both have told me that they do not wish to take their children out of school for a vacation. I can take them during their breaks if Iwish but they do not want them to miss school or their friends. I will abide by their wishes for their children.

[Gardendog]

Travel is wonderful for the family and for the kids. I thought the original question was whether to take the kids out of school or not. We didn't leave the kids home to go on a cruise, but we went on a cruise when they were out of school. School kids have lots of time off, at least where I live, Christmas break, Easter break, Martin Luther break etc.

bepsf--I do agree, don't leave the kids at home to go on a cruise, but schedule your vacation around the kids' breaks, as much as possible. That's my 2 cents worth.

I think that school is more than just doing assignments. Teachers teach:) and the kids have labs or other things that cannot be done on the vacation. I have taken my kids out of school for ski vacations or trips to Europe, but without fault, something was taught that they missed.

This is not to increase anyones guilt. Travel in peace!:)

[ozarkn]

I'm taking my daughter along with me on a cruise. She is 13 and in 8th grade. She has the blessings of all her teachers including the Principal. Her Mother and I are divorced and she, in spite of this, has done very well in school and is active in many school programs. Her school seems to think it will be very educational, and beneficial in other ways as well.
"all she wants for Christmas is a real good tan" (borrowed from Kenny Chesney). Talk about a tough request! She lives above 40 degrees north.

It's close now...

[intandemNV]

We have taken our now, 9 year old, out of school for probably one week each year since she started school. She earns all A's and does very well in school and also is a wonderful traveler. I think it has only enhanced her education. I will probably stop this practice once she is in Jr High School so that she doesn't have the added pressure to make up the more advanced work. She will be taking a weeks worth of work when we cruise in January, which she will have done very quickly. We enjoy travelling when there are less crowds, so,for now, that is what we do.

[AmyinVail]

We live in a resort area and the only time my husband can take off to vacation is during May and October (when the mountain is closed)- so that is when we vacation. Unfortunately that is during school. Our now 10 year old daughter has been travelling her whole life. Her teachers have never had an issue with it. What we have done is put together a travel "report", including pictures and interesting facts and/or history of each location we go to. In 1st grade it was, "a palm tree" with a pic of our daughter in front of a palm tree, etc. We've been lucky, her teachers have always valued travel and it gives other kids in her classroom the opportunity to see the world through our daughter's eyes.

[doone]

My sisters have taken the kids out of school for a few days for a family vacation. Unfortunately, the school system frowns upon this, where I live anyways, and really socks it to the kids for make up work. I don't believe in how the school systems work here, they basically tell you you CANNOT take your kids out of school for a vacation, NOT EVEN 1 DAY, and if you dare, the kids suffer!!! I think that is horrible. My dad, a retired educator, has always said, and I wholeheartedly believe in this as well, that there is no better education in the world than a family vacation, all together, doing family things, together. No teacher in the world could provide a better education than that, IMHO, of course. So yes, I believe in taking kids out of school for a family vacation for a few days.

[Orcrone]

I guess I'm the only dissenting vote, or others don't want to chime in and say so.

Our kids have 2 1/2 months off during the summer, almost two weeks at Christmas time and another week around Easter. That doesn't include all the three and four day weekends. I personally feel that allows plenty of time to vacation. I also don't like the message it sends. If we say that vacationing is more important than school, then what else can we, or our children decide, is more important than school.

Our last cruise was from Oct. 30 to Nov. 9, including six school days (election day is a school holiday). There was one mother we met on board who took her three kids with her, telling the school there was a family emergency. There's no way I am convinced that vacation is more important than those six days of school. How easy is it going to be for those teenagers to rationalize missing school, if a vacation was more important?

Do children learn something new everyday at school? Of course not. But I think that taking children out of school, saying there is so much for them to learn on vacation is nothing more than rationalizing on the parent's part. There will plenty of time, after our kids are out of school, to vacation anytime of the year that we want. Until then, we will vacation when our kids are off from school, or arrange for them to stay in school as when my mother came up and watched them last month.

[doone]

Ocrone, with all due respect, some people don't have the luxury of vacationing anytime and need to take the time when the time permits, not just when school vacations are. So for those reasons, I certainly understand why parents, and rightfully so, need to take children out of school, even for a few days.

We want to do a family cruise for 10-days. We will cruise during the February school vacation week, but being 10-days, the kids will miss some school, but only a couple of days. I think its well worth it.

[lgt]

ok; I'm guilty. We are taking our senior in high school out of school for a week (the week they return from Winter Break) for a family reunion cruise. She is the youngest and most everybody else has the dreadful year end work stuff and couldn't go until the next week, so we are taking her out of school. Most of her teachers didn't mind at all; she's a good student and will make up her work when we return; they couldn't give it to her before break begins. Now I feel really bad about this, with the majority saying it shouln't be done.

[Orcrone]

Ocrone, with all due respect, some people don't have the luxury of vacationing anytime and need to take the time when the time permits, not just when school vacations are. So for those reasons, I certainly understand why parents, and rightfully so, need to take children out of school, even for a few days.

We want to do a family cruise for 10-days. We will cruise during the February school vacation week, but being 10-days, the kids will miss some school, but only a couple of days. I think its well worth it.Doone,

I know that people are not going to be happy about what I said, but I want to point out, this is not a fact, but my opinion. Our upcoming cruise is also a family reunion (celebration of my mom's 75th birthday). But we limited it to a 7 day cruise, because that is all that we could fit in without taking the kids out of school. Our cruise leaves on Saturday morning and we're flying to FLL on a 7:15 flight the night before.

But that's what we're doing. Everyone's entitled to make their own choices. I honestly don't wish to defend my opinion, or have others defend theirs. Ekerr just asked people about what they do, so I figured I'd share our views, even if it doesn't agree with the other posters.

But I certainly respect everyone's right to do as they choose (at least until I get elected as dictator of the world).;)

[doone]

Lgt, don't you feel one bit guilty, what your daughter will experience with a family reunion cruise she could never learn in school.

What my sisters did when we did a family cruise a few years back, and this may be a good idea for you as well, is the kids had to take 1/2 hour per day and write a journal of what they did each day. Believe it or not, the kids still refer to this journal of their family cruise and all the fun they had with their parents, aunts, uncles, cousins and grandparents. This cruise they only missed 1 day of school, but if they had to miss a whole week, it was still worth it to us. As I said above, we're planning a 10-day cruise Feb. school vacation week of 2006, and these kids are already planning what they are going to do and with who in the family. They will miss a couple of days of school, but its so worth it to us. Go and enjoy every minute with your family, you'll find it priceless.

Ocrone, no offense taken, you, me and everyone all have different opinions and circumstances, everyone needs to do what is right for them and I respect that. You have a wonderful cruise and enjoy every minute of it.

[AmyinVail]

We've taken our daughter out of school for at least a week since kindergarten. She takes books with her to read, sometimes assignments (if the teachers even give assignments, most of the time they don't) and we document our trip. She's in 5th grade now and we've just planned a cruise for April, when she's in school. We don't have the luxury of vacationing anytime we want as a previous poster has indicated. We can ONLY vacation during October and May - period. My husband's job is busy every other month but that and that is when we vacation - period. She's never fallen behind, has always enriched her life with vacation and we have a great time!

[kryos]

Ok, I am going out on this limb - on the Spring Break thread I posted that I think we don't have a problem allowing our children to miss 2 - 3 days of school for a cruise. Usually just one time per year, at Spring Break.

I'm a big believer in all things in moderation. If it's only occasionally and only for a couple of days, I personally see no problem with it. But, what galls me is when I see parents ... and believe me, I work with some of them ... who pull their kids out of school routinely for family vacations. What the heck? There's not enough time in the year where they are off anyway?

But it sounds like you're doing it the right way ... making sure they have their assignments and do them. Also, I would try to schedule at least one "educational" type shore excursion that they could do ... maybe an eco tour or whatever. Then they'll have a subject they can write a neat paper on that will really impress their teacher! :)

By the way ... I'm far from a kid (49), but I am taking a court stenographer course at a local tech school. Originally they told us the winter term wouldn't start until January 18, so I booked my cruise accordingly ... the 1/8 sailing of the Sun which returns on 1-18 and would have had me back in Philly in time for class that evening. Well, the school changed all the start dates and now classes resume on 1-10. Now I gotta bring my stenotype machine with me so that I can practice for an hour or so a day. He actually wants the tape strips handed in. :(

Good lord, that thing is heavy. :(

Blue skies ...

--rita

[gwilli]

I work in a private school. I have taken my kids out of school for a few days for vacation - but the older they get the harder it is! They can make up any missed school work - but once they become involved in sports, they don't want to miss a day!

Many of our students have the opportunity to travel with their parents - some for long periods of time. We have a procedure to give them the assigned work, and have faxed work (even to a cruise ship!) to them. They seem to learn so much from traveling!

gwilli

[Arubalisa]

My brother and I were both taken out of school during our school years for one week of family vacation each January. My parents worked together for the same employer and were not give a choice on their vacation dates. Use it or lose it! The teachers never liked it (jealousy perhaps- nothing like a golden tan in the dead of winter). Needless to say these are treasured memories and surprise surprise, DB & I have both grown to be college educated, law abiding, tax paying adults.

Nowadays, each school district is different. Maybe someday a parent will hire a lawyer and sue our district for their policy below, however in the meantime, we have no choice but to abide by the rules. Below is our the policy of the school system which our daugther attends. Text in bold is such that is most relavent to this topic.

"Attendance (http://www.forsyth.k12.ga.us/article.asp?spt=167&article=165)
Good daily attendance correlates directly with success in school. Parents need to let their students know how important school is to their future success.
Each day a student is absent from school, it is the responsibility of the parent(s) to call the school to report the absence. It is necessary that a note explaining the absence be sent with the student upon return to school within two days. If no parental/doctor note is received, the absence will be unexcused. Non-school related activities and vacations are considered unexcused per school board and state policy. If excessive absences occur, the school can require a doctor’s note be provided for every absence. Parents should read the student handbook to familiarize themselves with procedures. Parent conferences and a referral to the school social worker may be necessary for chronic absences/tardies. If the situation does not improve, a referral will be made to the Juvenile Court for truancy. The court can take punitive action against parents and students. When a high school student has accrued more than 6 unexcused absences in a specific class, the student will not receive credit for that class. Any extenuating circumstances will have to be reviewed by the principal or designee. A loss of credit will mean the class will have to be repeated. All parents should be aware of absences from school. The new online program, “Parent Connect,” will assist parents with attendance, grades and discipline.
Vacation days taken during non-vacation time are unexcused absences. The principal or designee determines if make up work may be made up during extenuating circumstances. This policy is for any unexcused absence."

[dakrewser]

Where you are does have some effect on what you learn. The Louvre (http://vquill.com/gallery/Image/PAsculptures.html), the British Museum, the Smithsonian Institution, as well as Martinique's Gauguin & Mt. Pelee museums, The National Archaeological Anthropological Museum of the Netherlands Antilles, Chichen Itza and Tulum, The aquariums in Sydney and Monterey (http://www.mbayaq.org/), The Prado, Sitka's Raptor Center - I could go on and on. Many of these places are mentioned in school textbooks, but how much better it is to see them in person!


Education is a life-long activity which takes places no matter where you are. School, like "the office", is a place not a way of life.

Teachers are always asking parents to become more involved in their children's education. So do that - take them to a museum, a cultural site, an ethnic heritage celebration and do it when the event, or trip, is possible.

Learning a multiplication table can be done anywhere. But there's only one place you can see the Saxman Native Village (http://vquill.com/gallery/Image/AKtlingit_story.jpg), or the mosaics of Pompeii (http://vquill.com/gallery/pompeiart.html).

When I was 9 years old, my father took me out of school for a week to accompany him to Washington, DC. I learned more about our government in that week than I did in 8 years of elementary school.

I wouldn't take my kids away just to lie on a beach, but I wouldn't hesitate to take them on a learning experience.

-dave

[Orcrone]

I wouldn't take my kids away just to lie on a beach, but I wouldn't hesitate to take them on a learning experience.

-daveDave,

I think that's an excellent point. However, it's also a two-edged sword when children are taken out of school, as the parents now have to ensure that the vacation is educational.

[ekerr19]

Wow-

Thanks for such great responses...

We took our kids through the Panama Canal one year at Christmas break - I wish I could say they were as interested in the transition as we were, but they really weren't. It was their first cruise and they were having a blast. They missed no school, however.

We used to always cruise over their Christmas break, but lately they have preferred to remain at home for the holidays.

Last year was the first time we cruised over Spring Break and it was such a wonderful time, we decided to do it again. My biggest concern is about the message we may be sending - they will miss 2 days of school, one reason we chose the Volendam over the Maasdam, the Maasdam is an 11-day and they would miss an extra day.

Both our kids know we feel school is important, our son is in High School and is taking extremely difficult advanced college prep courses - he has never fallen behind because of absences. Because his classes are very small and very structured, he gets a lot of one-on-one time with his teachers.

I guess I don't feel guilty - we aren't the type of parents who will book a vacation without considering the kids school, music and sports schedules - but so much is made of taking kids out of school for vacations, I thought I'd ask.

Obviously it's a problem in some areas of the country, just reading Arubalisa's childs school policy reinforces that there are some parents that just don't care.

Thanks everyone. :)

[RuthC]

and not wishing to start an argument, I would like to ask about something:

Especially those of you supporting taking a child out of school, would you also support a teacher taking extra time for a family vacation? Suppose that was the only time the spouse could get, would that be all right, in that case?
If the teacher left lesson plans for the substitute, and promised to correct papers upon return, is that o.k.?
Couldn't the teacher argue that if it's o.k. for the students to take extra time it should be o.k. for the teachers?

How would you---as a taxpayer---feel in that case?
Would you---as a parent---feel your child was losing a continuity in the classroom?

When I was a child my mother made it very clear that she had her job and studying and going to school was my "job". I knew I better show up for work, too! That lesson has carried over to my real "work life". Many a morning I don't feel like getting up and going to work; so I get up and go to work anyway. I worry that too many of today's children are not taught that lesson.

[ekerr19]

Ruth-

I certainly have no problem if a teacher wishes to take extra time off for a vacation.. I remember my 6th grade teacher taking off a few days before Christmas break for a honeymoon and we had a substitute teacher.

Our kids have two teachers and a teacher's assistant in each class, with a class size of 20 children or less. When one teacher is out, it is not difficult for the remaining teachers to handle the class. But, I also know that our situation is not the norm.

As a parent, I don't think our children loose the continuity of the classroom when one of their teachers is out sick or on vacation. Their classroom structure is very disciplined and traditional - there is little, if any, deviation from the norm and it helps maintain continuity.

You also ask, "as a taxpayer" ... well, in all honesty, unfortuantely we must pay taxes to support public schools, yet our children don't attend those schools - nothing we can do about it. :)

We have friends who have occupations of choice that simply do not allow for time off during specific periods - for example a CPA with a small tax firm - he will tell us, "no way can we vacation during tax time"...

Not long ago, DH was offered a lucrative position that had very specific vacation periods. He declined the position for the simple reason he'd rather choose when to vacation, rather than have his employer make that choice.

Thanks for bringing up the other "point of view" - it certainly gives one food for thought and I'm interested what others (especially those with children in public schools) think. :)

[dakrewser]

and not wishing to start an argument, I would like to ask about something:

Especially those of you supporting taking a child out of school, would you also support a teacher taking extra time for a family vacation?
Yes I would, but the circumstances are vastly different. If you take a child or two out of the class, it's still a class. If you take the teacher out, it's a playground.

The teacher also chooses to be in the school setting, the child doesn't have that choice.

So I do see this as apples and oranges. Maybe it's a cultural thing, after all we were brought up on different sides of the bay :rolleyes: (and I was on the "left bank" :) )

-dave

[kryos]

The teacher also chooses to be in the school setting, the child doesn't have that choice.

The teacher is also under contract ... the children are not. The teacher is getting an entire summer off, along with time off during the year at various school holidays. I believe the teacher is expected to take his/her vacation time during those periods and such language is probably written into the teacher's contract (or union contract).

I, too, was raised with parents who would have never pulled me out of school for ANY reason. Even if I was sick, it was rare that I was permitted to stay home. Mom's attitude was you can have cramps in the classroom just as well as at home, so you might as well sit in the classroom. I had to be running a fever or throwing up before my parents would have even considered letting me stay home sick. My folks instilled in me a work ethic which said that school was my job, just as repairing shoes was my father's job ... later on delivering the mail ... and that mom's job was keeping a home for us. I was expected to show up at my job each day and to perform to the best of my abilities.

Today, however, I guess things are a bit different. People have more money than they did in my parents' day and thus could give their children more educational opportunities in terms of world travel, and those opportunities can probably justify a few days missed from the classroom. Unfortunately, I never had those opportunities available to me and maybe that's why my parents insisted my little behind be sitting at that school desk ... each and every day. :)

Blue skies ...

--rita

[Rotterdam]

I'll start by saying I do not have children but am most happy to support the education system with my hard earned tax dollars & other donations during the year.

That being said - I wouldn't take children out of school unless there was an emergency. A cruise certainly does not fall in that category. The structure of the education gives the kids learning tools, fellow contemporaries & regime.

With all the activities the kids have at home the family hardly eats a dinner together on a regualr basis. Yes the cruise is a wonderful experience - but most are not seeing the Pyramids, Great Wall or the Vatican.

The kids get plenty of days off during the year plus summer vacation....ample time to cruise.

[K&RCurt]

We have taken our kids out of school for vacations in the past and found, as was mentioned in a previous post, that the teacher's were fine with it (but they assigned a report on the area the trip was as an extra assignment) yet the principal had issues. We had to sign forms ahead of time and they were marked as being "unlawfully absent" (our district's code for unexcused). The Teacher's encouraged it and the administrators tried to make us feel like criminals. (Yet all 3 somehow managed to stay on the honor roll).

HOWEVER...Last year both of our DD went on a trip with the High School marching band. This is a VERY competitive band that has won 8 consecutive state and regional championships. The trip was to a band competition in Florida. The trip consisted of practice, practice, practice, the competition and a day at Universal Studios. There was NOTHING educational about it as they practice every night at home anyway. But THIS trip was fully approved by the administration and school district even though they missed a week of school.

There is a double standard, at least with our school district, as to PARENTS taking the kids out of school vs. the school deciding that something is good PR for the district. The same amount of class work was missed but one is "Unlawful" and one is a "valuble educational experience".

[halos]

I have been there done that.

I have a daughter in college (sophomore) and one in high school (junior).

My husband and I made it a point never to take them out of school for anything.
IN HINDSIGHT...I see that it wouldn't have hurt them a bit.

But....things are changing and because of new laws (No Child Left Behind Act) you may not be able to take your kids out any more. Be careful of the rules in your state at your particular school.

[ekerr19]

HOWEVER...Last year both of our DD went on a trip with the High School marching band. This is a VERY competitive band that has won 8 consecutive state and regional championships. The trip was to a band competition in Florida. The trip consisted of practice, practice, practice, the competition and a day at Universal Studios. There was NOTHING educational about it as they practice every night at home anyway. But THIS trip was fully approved by the administration and school district even though they missed a week of school.

There is a double standard, at least with our school district, as to PARENTS taking the kids out of school vs. the school deciding that something is good PR for the district. The same amount of class work was missed but one is "Unlawful" and one is a "valuble educational experience".
The public High School we used to live close to was also our state marching band champs - about 8 - 10 years running. They do the same thing, but the kids had 3 days in the parks around Orlando... they also got to miss school to perform in the Rose Parade... they were always fund raising for trips - we were made to feel almost criminal if we didn't support some fund raiser or another. :( I'm glad we moved last year, now we don't have to listen to practice (7:00am on Saturdays) or be constantly solicited for funds...

[Cruising Jake]

When I was a girl (and lived in Maryland) my grandmother traveled a bit, even if it was to D.C. to visit my godmother. She would never take me because I was in school. I remember that to this day and regret what I might have missed. I was a great student and very responsible, but no dice with her.

DH and I took our girls out of school infreuently for trips when it had to be an extra day or two around a regular school holiday. They were good students and could make up the work. The schools did not have a problem with it either.

IMHO it is good to be a bit flexible about most things in life.

[mcduck]

What better way to spend quality time with your children but on a cruise?

We pay the premium to travel over the Christmas break with the kids, but if it means missing a few days of school, like it does this year for our Westerdam cruise, BIG DEAL. Little, if any learning, happens in those last days before the break, and the usual reaction fron the teachers is "can I go with you".

My daughter is an "A" student and my son is on the Dean's list at university, so it has obviously not hurt them over the many years we have taken them out of school to travel with us. (Doesn't hurt that they got their mom's smarts!), and they have many memories of great times with their parents visiting numerous ports of call, not to mention experiencing the some times eye opening different lifestyles of the countries visited.

[melissa76]

HI everyone,

I've always felt that many people LIKE to think that being strict about things like clothing results in children with good morals, and that being strict about school attendance results in children with good educations.

This is NOT the case, folks!!

I had friends who weren't allowed to go out much, so they snuck out or smoked in the bathrooms at school. I had friends who weren't allowed to wear sexy clothing so they gained popularity by sleeping around. I also had friends who were NEVER allowed to miss school. And you know what? They grew to resent school and did NOT do well.

Education is not about a building or an attendance record!!!

I always loved school, and did really well. I also stayed home days in elementary school when it was snowing. My friend and I always had permission from our parents to stay home together and go sledding!! By the way... her mom was a teacher and her dad was a principal :).

Same thing in middle school.

In high school, I stayed home a lot. My mom had no problem with it. It wasn't for vacation (we didn't have money for that). Some days I just needed a rest or didn't feel like going. I also took AP classes, had a 4.2 GPA, and graduated at 16.

My attendance in college was even worse. And you know what? I got 4 degrees. I've been teaching college since I was 22.

I think we should all be careful about our ideas about school and education (which, by the way, are NOT the same thing). Taking your kids out of school for a vacation is not going to hurt them. If kids aren't doing well in school...it has nothing to do with their attendance. I know parents would like to think that, because it's easier to think that as long as you're sending them off in the morning, you're doing your job.

just my 2 cents....
Melissa :)

[MandyGirl]

The teacher also chooses to be in the school setting, the child doesn't have that choice.

As a secondary mathematics teacher with about 140 students I see every day (6 classes), I agree with this statement. I CHOSE to take the $25,000+ annual pay cut to go back to the classroom and make a difference in young lives. Along with that choice came losing my frequent flyer status, losing my ability to vacation during off-peak (less expensive) timeframes, losing decent healthcare insurance, and losing flexibility in scheduling (such as making doctor/dentist appts during the day and just scheduling my meetings around those, or taking lunches that actually last longer than 30 minutes from bell to bell). That decision also allowed me to squeeze a wedding cruise into Spring Break, not missing a single day of school that year. Spring Break allowed our families to fork out extra money to attend our wedding since the only times we could get married were when I wasn't in school - peak seasons. In the corporate world, I would get 6-wk paid maternity leave (short term disability) when that time comes, as that was a "given" in the companies I did project management for. In the teaching world, I get to save my 10 days per year (assuming I don't use any days), remain in the same district so they accumulate, and hopefully have enough for maternity leave should we be fortunate enough to have a successful pregnancy. Will we try to schedule that around school? Of course, but some things in life just aren't scheduled.

So, yes, teachers make that choice to devote their lives to helping our future.:)

I appreciate Ruth for sharing things from a different perspective.

As far as having "summers off" mentioned in a previous post, that would be a dream. Teachers in my district are paid only for the days they work - not paid for holidays, vacation time, etc (I usually had 10 paid holidays and 10-15 paid vacation days when working corporate). We do get ten paid "personal leave" days each year - otherwise known as sick days. My "summer" last year was a total of 8 weeks... minus about 14 days of unpaid professional development classes I took and minus several days of moving classrooms and getting things ready for the new year. As hubby put it, the only week I did not go to school for at least one day was the week we went on vacation. But even then, we flew home from London on a Tuesday and I was in a curriculum writing meeting the next morning - jetlag and all.

Do I have students who take time off for vacation? Yes. Does it cause me extra work? Yes - grading all papers individually upon return, reteaching concepts on my own time if necessary since the other 100+ students are moving on ahead as scheduled, making time after school to make up quizzes/tests, etc. But I live with the philosophy you are not guaranteed to wake up tomorrow, so live life now. I have one student leaving this weekend for a week-long cruise to the Caribbean. I made sure he had my lesson plans, any worksheets, etc before he left on Friday, and also made sure we had discussed his ports of call so that we could share any past experiences with those ports. :) And of course I told him to have lots of fun. As he shared with me, his family had always wanted to take a cruise but the pricing when school was out was just too expensive for them, so they are cruising right after his older sister finishes college exams.

Teaching is something I love dearly, and I come home each day with the hope that I made a positive difference in one young life. When I worked in the corporate world, although I came home with a much better paycheck, less stress, and a bunch of other perks, I never came home with the feeling that I was making as much of a contribution to society as I could, even though I did volunteer work through nonprofit organizations. As dakrewser said above, teaching in a school setting is a choice teachers make.

Just my personal opinion.

[teencruiser18]

My friend and I will be missing one of our final exams to make a Carribean cruise. We have the same classes, and are taking 3 honors and one college class this year. We're both only high school sophomores. We both have the same grades: straight A's and coming up with 4.35 GPA's. Our parents feel that as long as we are doing this well, there's no reason we can't miss one day of school.

[halos]

Teaching is something I love dearly, and I come home each day with the hope that I made a positive difference in one young life.


I have a feeling you are an amazing teacher. :D

[HeatherInFlorida]

Laura, you know I consider you a friend so I hope I don't risk that, but I don't support taking your children out of school for any vacation unless it is a purely educational one. A Caribbean cruise wouldn't fit that rule. That said, if you're only talking about 2 days (not a full week), I don't think it's that big a deal.

I agree with Orcrone that between summer vacation and all the other vacations given by the school system, families owe it to their children to work around those schedules ... particularly in high school, such a vital part of their education.

And it isn't only about the academic side of it because I think you've got that part covered. It's about the message we send our children when we say, "Oh, it's okay for you to miss school because we're going on a vacation". Is that really the message you want to send your children when they get into whatever profession they choose?

These days our kids are growing up with a complete misconception about the real world. We're not teaching them anymore that maybe they're not the "best". Seems like every kid is an honor student in one way or another. We're saying it's okay to "act up" because they have "issues". And everyone gets picked for some team or other because we don't want to stifle the fact that they're at least trying no matter how bad they may be at the sport. Life isn't like that and a lot of these kids are in for a rude awakening when they're finally "out there". Frankly, it scares me.

So here is another situation where we're saying that if it's convenient with most of the group to go on a cruise, then it's okay for them to miss time they were scheduled and expected to work.

Again ... 2 days really isn't a big deal and I don't mean to make it so. And from what I know of you I can tell you're a tremendously responsible parent. I just wanted to give you a part of the picture you might not have thought about.

Please forgive if I've overstepped:o .

[RuthC]

I always loved school, and did really well. I also stayed home days in elementary school when it was snowing. My friend and I always had permission from our parents to stay home together and go sledding!! By the way... her mom was a teacher and her dad was a principal :).
...
In high school, I stayed home a lot. My mom had no problem with it. It wasn't for vacation (we didn't have money for that). Some days I just needed a rest or didn't feel like going.
...
My attendance in college was even worse. Melissa :)If you were to tell me this while interviewing for a job I can promise that you would be given less consideration than other candidates with a stronger work ethic.

If another candidate had lesser, but otherwise good, credentials that would be preferable to me. I can always teach someone the particulars of their job (assuming a basic competency). Intrinsic motivation to get up, go to work, and do a good job is something that can't be taught by then.

That's a primary lesson of the school years.

[Macwoman]

When you are in the "real" world you can adjust your vacations when you are able to go. I use to take my kids out of school, but do not now. I have met other people on cruises who's children's teachers have just made different assignments for these students while they are gone. We have been unable in the past to take vacations during the expensive summer months.
Once we had to take a week off due to a family wedding in Utah in May. I got grieve the entire time. This was not MY choice. Nor do I get a vacation of a week's time in Dec, Feb, and April. I know teachers work very hard during their "off" time. No disrespect to them. However I think others need to realize that we all cannot take vacation during the optimal summer month time.

If you have this great average.........Bravo.......and keep up the work. Just bring the work you will miss with you or ask your teacher if you may have it ahead of time.

[dakrewser]

If you were to tell me this while interviewing for a job I can promise that you would be given less consideration than other candidates with a stronger work ethic.
Now Ruth, it really isn't the "work ethic" melissa76 was posting about, but the "attendance ethic". While there are still jobs that require being at a certain place for a certain amount of time, most jobs she would be applying for are those where "getting the job done" is the important thing. Sometimes that requires 60-80 hours a week, sometimes 20-30. Sometimes it means being in an office, sometimes the work can be done from home - or on the beach in Maui. Times are changing, and many of us think it's for the better...

-dave

[halos]

If you were to tell me this while interviewing for a job I can promise that you would be given less consideration than other candidates with a stronger work ethic.

If another candidate had lesser, but otherwise good, credentials that would be preferable to me. I can always teach someone the particulars of their job (assuming a basic competency). Intrinsic motivation to get up, go to work, and do a good job is something that can't be taught by then.

That's a primary lesson of the school years.




Horsepucky.

I'd hire Melissa in an instant...and her mother to boot.
Mental health is just as important as physical. There is more to every human being than what they do for a living...and what they do for a living should never encompass more of their life than family.
I frequently asked my daughters when they were stressed if they want a mental health day from school. Most times they didn't take it, but on rare occasions, they did. I think because of this, they had very few actual days sick...they are healthy mentally AND physically. Both of my girls were/are honor students...without being pushed or harrassed or manipulated and threatened by their parents. Both of my girls held summer jobs from the age of 14. They earned money to buy their own cars, register them (auto registration is very $$$$ in Maine) AND they pay their own insurance and buy their own clothes. During the school year they baby-sat and worked weekend jobs. My (soon to be) 17 year old currently works at Panera Bread every weekend, on top of school and being on the swim team, the yearbook commitee and a Peer Mediator. My girls employers have always LOVED them...their work ethic is unbelievably better than most teens. The teens with the worst work ethics are the ones with over-achieving parents that make them feel like having perfect grades and attendance in school is the most important thing in the world...these kids may get in the door to jobs with employers like you, but they burn out quick. A well balanced human being is one that I would hire. Melissa sounds like just that.

Oh...and PS...I've NEVER interviewed for a job where they asked me how my attendance was in school. :rolleyes:
And I've never interviewed anyone for hire and asked them that.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Dave, Melissa has been teaching college since she was 22 according to her post. How do you see that as .... "most jobs she would be applying for are those where "getting the job done" is the important thing.Sometimes that requires 60-80 hours a week, sometimes 20-30. Sometimes it means being in an office, sometimes the work can be done from home - or on the beach in Maui."?

College must have changed a whole heck of a lot since I was there because not one of my professors called it in from Maui!!!!

The corporate world as well as most other professions still require you to be on the job wherever that may be. You are not expected to go sledding when it snows or take "mental health days" when you simply feel you "need a rest". If you do this in school, you do this in life.

This isn't rocket science ... it's common sense. Much of how we behave in our adult life is derived from how we behaved and what we were taught in our childhood.

We are way off the beaten path from Laura's question which was whether she should take her kids out of school for 2 or 3 days. That's not the same as just taking off whenever you please, your parents allowing it and now insisting you have a good work ethic. I just don't buy it.

[halos]

[The corporate world as well as most other professions still require you to be on the job wherever that may be. You are not expected to go sledding when it snows or take "mental health days" when you simply feel you "need a rest". If you do this in school, you do this in life

again, I say...horsepucky.
You are comparing stressed out adults in an adult corporate world to kids.....I'm glad that I parented my kids with some slack. Jeeze!

and yes...sometimes kids AND adults need a rest. It's so sad to see that so many people have no idea how to live. I've taught my kids that it's not all about making a living...it's about making a life.
Because of this, they've turned out very cool, and what a surprise...they aren't slackers at all! They're probably more productive than most people, because they have balance.

[HeatherInFlorida]

again, I say...horsepucky.
You are comparing stressed out adults in an adult corporate world to kids.....I'm glad that I parented my kids with some slack. Jeeze!

and yes...sometimes kids AND adults need a rest. It's so sad to see that so many people have no idea how to live. I've taught my kids that it's not all about making a living...it's about making a life.
Because of this, they've turned out very cool, and what a surprise...they aren't slackers at all! They're probably more productive than most people, because they have balance.Halos, I think your overuse of the word "horsepucky" speaks volumes.

I respect your right to your opinion. For the record, I did not say you shouldn't have balance in your life. Actually I don't think you could find anyone who believes in "all work and no play...." more than I do. Nor did I say we don't all need a rest. Unfortunately, out there in the big bad world MOST people in MOST professions have to schedule that rest so it doesn't conflict with OTHER people's rest who deserve it just as much. In other words, it's not just all about you.

[halos]

Halos, I think your overuse of the word "horsepucky" speaks volumes.

I respect your right to your opinion. For the record, I did not say you shouldn't have balance in your life. Actually I don't think you could find anyone who believes in "all work and no play...." more than I do. Nor did I say we don't all need a rest. Unfortunately, out there in the big bad world MOST people in MOST professions have to schedule that rest so it doesn't conflict with OTHER people's rest who deserve it just as much. In other words, it's not just all about you.


Didn't mean to sound so flip...it's just that I see a lot of kids over stressed by parents who expect too much from them and there is definitely a balance deficit. I do stand by what I said, I just would like to soften it a little. My girls have friends that are pretty messed up from anal parents who expect WAY too much. My girls also have friends that are spoiled rotten as well. Either is bad.
If more parents stressed tha value of just being a decent human being, and put less value on grades, attendance and competition (as in sports...have you ever seen one of those coaches from he**?) Kids would grow up to be more responsible and more motivated and they'd become excellent parents themselves. Sometimes, getting quality time with your child, on a vacation...or on a 'mental health day' from school is more important than a day in the classroom.
I said in my first post on this thread, my kids are older now. When they were young, I WAS the anal parent. I loosened up a bit during middle school thank God, (that's when the 'mental health days began) but I still never took them out of school for a vacation. In hindsight (which is 20/20) I wish I had.
You're right, everyone has their own opinion on this...every adult parents differently...so it bothers me when people make judgements about those who take their kids out of school. Every parent is different, every child is different (of course you wouldn't pull a child from school if he/she was a struggling student) so every situation is different. No one should judge. And I thought it was really out of line for the one poster to say she wouldn't hire the other because she missed some school days when she (GASP! :eek: ) wasn't really sick.

What DOES speak volumes for me is that my oldest, attends a small, pretty exclusive Liberal Arts School and is doing fabulous...pretty far away from home; is extremely independent and self motivated. She will come out with a teaching degee. She is a Bio major...she'll teach middle school science while she works her way through Vet school. The youngest is still in high school but already knows that she wants to go to school for hotel/restaurant management (this is the one that has been working since she was 14) and to think...they took days off from school on occasion.
What I want most for my girls, is that if (God forbid) they are in jobs that cause them that much grief..., where scheduling time off is THAT difficult, they'll find something else. I've taught them the importance of living....that's definitely not how most people think...I totally understand that. But that's how I am raising my girls. And I still don't understand your comparrison of a child sledding to an adult in the corporate world. Do you have children??

When you volunteer at a grieving center as I do...your outlook on life changes a LOT....I think for the better. You understand how precious life is, and how most stuff that people go nuts over is just nonsense in the long run.

[Lisa63]

Mandy -- great post! My husband recently decided to go into teaching after spending 15 years in the information technology field. He is currently finishing his Master of Education in special education. It's a substantial pay cut, and it will also require a lot more work than his previous career. Yet, as you say, making a difference in the life of a child is the real payoff.

Back to the original question -- we have an 11-year-old, and even when my husband and I both had jobs with flexible vacation times, we would restrict our cruising and land trips to school vacation periods. It cost a lot more, but 5 consecutive days of school is just too much for our son to miss, in our opinion, especially as he is a special ed student.

That said, we did struggle with our decision to take him out of school for one day prior to our upcoming cruise. We are doing a Saturday-to-Saturday cruise from the opposite coast, and confirmed with the teacher that there will not be much going on the Friday before vacation week. Because of his needs, we continue to reinforce his schoolwork during vacations, but I still wouldn't pull him out for more than one day. JMHO.

[super_grover]

just my two cents....I think it depends on the kid. For me missing a week of highschool to go on some fabulous vacation/band trip/athleteic endevour/whatever didnt really matter at all. Kept the grades up and all was good. Parents wrote a note to the school to explain the absence and it was no longer "unexplained". Apperently we had rather lax attendance policies compared to some that I have read here. After I turned 18 I could even write my own notes :o
On the other hand, for my brother missing even a day of school means that he is behind and it may result in masses of work to catch up. My parents therefore don't let him miss that much school.
If your kids are great students and can make it up, then go for it.
If they are going to be worse off because of it then be responsable and play the "I know what is best for you" card....Isn't that what parenting is about?

[HeatherInFlorida]

Halos, thank you so so much for taking the time to explain further. Your point is taken and I love reading the great pride you have in your children.

I think the story you tell is just a bit different than the one young Melissa described and in earlier posts I was reacting to that.

In the end, there are so many different situations, so many different stories and experiences that there does not end up being any one answer for everyone. We all just have to do the very best that we can and in the end, hope for the best.

Again, I really appreciate your post.

[halos]

Halos, thank you so so much for taking the time to explain further. Your point is taken and I love reading the great pride you have in your children.

I think the story you tell is just a bit different than the one young Melissa described and in earlier posts I was reacting to that.

In the end, there are so many different situations, so many different stories and experiences that there does not end up being any one answer for everyone. We all just have to do the very best that we can and in the end, hope for the best.

Again, I really appreciate your post.

And I, yours. :D
Kids and parenting is always a tough topic.

[ekerr19]

These days our kids are growing up with a complete misconception about the real world. We're not teaching them anymore that maybe they're not the "best". Seems like every kid is an honor student in one way or another. We're saying it's okay to "act up" because they have "issues". And everyone gets picked for some team or other because we don't want to stifle the fact that they're at least trying no matter how bad they may be at the sport. Life isn't like that and a lot of these kids are in for a rude awakening when they're finally "out there". Frankly, it scares me.

Please forgive if I've overstepped:o

Heather-

I have been so busy the past few days, I just wanted to respond to your post and let you know that I do agree with you. :D

I hope you don't mind - I will share a story with you (a long one, sorry) that I believe touches on what you are saying.

When Katie started 1st grade (at our local public school) she could already read very well for her age and loved reading. Being such an avid reader myself, I was thrilled that one of my children seemed to share the joy books provide - I was anticpating her progress now that she was starting school.

Unknown to us, the school had just implemented a new pilot educational program, and the first grade classes were to be the guinea pigs, so to speak. Part of the new program philosophy was that no single child is any different or special than any other. A nice sounding concept... but, I admit to being a bit apprehensive. Being that we didn't really have a choice or say, we went along with it. One aspect of the program involved pairing a really strong student reader with a weaker student in an effort to help the weaker student advance to the level of his or her peer. Since our daughter had the highest reading score out of her 31 fellow classmates, she was paired with the boy who had the lowest reading score. Within weeks we could tell that she was having difficulties. She hated having to feel "responsible" for another student and she wasn't being challenged at her level. Her reading scores slipped dramatically within the first few months. Worst of all, she no longer enjoyed reading.

The teacher's explanation was that they were trying to achieve a situation where no single student excelled - they would all be the same academically. I couldn't grasp this - all kids have different strengths and weaknesses, this whole concept seemed a bit "off", while it certainly may sound good - it is far from reality. There were also no grades, no right or wrong answers (I kid you not) and the kids were part of a 4-person group called a "pod" and each child in a pod was responsible for the academic levels of the others in his/her pod. In essence what they were trying to teach was "sameness" - no one was encouraged to excel, in fact kids were discouraged from excelling. It was a such a sad waste of time and energy, and rather than fight it, we enrolled our kids in a private Christian school for the following school year.

The new school follows a traditional based curriculum and the results we saw during the first year were amazing. We are happy that our kids actually do have to try out for things and that not all kids are selected - Katie tried out for the Volleyball team and did not make either the A or B squad, but she will try again next year, she didn't practice, and knew that her chances were slim because of it. Kyle must keep all grades at C or better or he can't play or participate in sports or any other extra-curricular activites.

I think many of the schools (and parents) today are still in the mindset that "ok" is equal to "best"... we found out the hard way and chose to take action to ensure that our kids do understand that there is hard work involved with success, and being just "good enough" to get by isn't the same thing.

So, sorry for my long-winded post, but I wanted to let you know that from our own personal experience I can agree with what you are saying. Also - no, you can never overstep, I always welcome your insight and input and respect your opinion. :)

[HeatherInFlorida]

Laura, many thanks for that post and your story. Of course, as you can guess, I totally agree with how you handled the situation. But the frightening thing is that they are probably still following that as-------- program and these kids are growing up in "pods":eek: . If it wasn't so stupid, it would be funny.

While I think it's great for kids to learn to help others less fortunate than they are, I don't think the educational system is the place to learn it. That lesson can and should be taught by parents.

Glad I wasn't out of line:) .

[halos]

ekerr19...I totally feel your pain on that one. You absolutely did the right thing changing your child's school.
That pod program was instituted on the east coast (mid-Atlantic States)more than a decade ago.
My children went to public school and I struggled with it the same as you did. The program does look good on paper. I understand the concept of not wanting children who may be a bit slower academically to feel 'stupid', by not grouping tham according to 'ability'....but having them in pods didn't prevent that anyway...every child knows what their capabilities are, and also their limitations when they are in groups of other children. They aren't blind. So, although that concept did seem like the right thing to do, it certainly wasn't good for the kids. Teachers never focused on spelling...they had the kids journal and write phonetically, and never corrected mispellings. They had them estimate in math (that still boggles my mind. I can't 'estimate' what's in my bank account every month, I need to balance it correctly or else :eek: )
Although the schools have now (at least over here in the east) modified that concept a bit, I still wish they were back to the good old days when you had a 20 word spelling list that had to be memorized by the end of the week for a spelling test. I basically had to do this teaching at home with my kids on my own. It didn't get done in school....which brings me around to the point of...sometimes, in certain circumstances, if a child misses a day or so of school, they aren't missing all that much. Every circumstance is different.
I hope your child is enjoying her new school....it sounds as if she'll get a great education there.

[Kabana]

We took our 9 year old (now 10) son out of school for our 7 day cruise last year and will do the same this year. We tell the school and teacher where we are going and ask that the teacher either send his school work along or assign him a project to do (and yes we follow through and have him do his schoolwork in the evenings on the cruise). We feel that seeing new places and experiencing different cultures is educational and if his grades don't suffer why not? My son misses very little school and last year he presented his photo album, mementos from our cruise and his daily cruise to his teacher and classmates and they really enjoyed it. I don't see how it could possibly be detrimental to his education or set a bad example.

[Vicar]

HALOS,

That estimateing in math class still gripes me, and I had the same arguement as you did. I have two apples and you have two apples , you give me an apple Now I have three apples and you have one. End of the story!!!!

But no, you have to find the estimated number of apples I have. PLEASE!!!!!!!!

That and the politcally correct whitewashing of American History in history class.

It is scary what these kids DO NOT know these days

[Dolphins]

Perhaps I am cynical, but I suspect the lofty reasons some parents give for taking their children out of school for a cruise has less to do with providing them with an educational experience and more to do with the quality of their vacation free of hordes of other people's children.
Since there are only 180 school days per year and numerous vacations at least a week in length, to say nothing of 10 weeks during the summer, I fund it hard to believe that a cruise cannot be scheduled when school is not in session. I don't think that aiding and abetting truancy is setting a good example for your children.
Finally, when these parents retire, they will be planning their vacations when school is in session and they will start wondering why the children on board are not in school.

[Lisa616]

[ I don't think that aiding and abetting truancy is setting a good example for your children.

Don't you think that's a rather dramatic statement? Bottom line is that it's up to every parent to decide what's best for their family and it really doesn't matter what other people think. Aiding and abetting truancy? That's absolutely ridiculous..

[halos]

[ I don't think that aiding and abetting truancy is setting a good example for your children.

Don't you think that's a rather dramatic statement? Bottom line is that it's up to every parent to decide what's best for their family and it really doesn't matter what other people think. Aiding and abetting truancy? That's absolutely ridiculous..

LOL!
Lisa, I have to agree with you there...that was a bit dramatic.
It's a shame that some people get so stuck in their opinions. Things are not all black and white. There are definite shades of gray. You can be a good, responsible parent and take your child out of school. Although, like I posted early on, this isn't going to be easy any more. The No Child Left Behind Act is putting a halt to all of that anyway. Pretty soon, this discussion won't be taking up space on these boards.
To Dolphins...I mean no disrespect...I, too once thought like you did (when I was a young mother and VERY uptight) My girls are older now and my priorities and way of thinking has changed dramatically...I call it "getting into Grandmother mode". :D
The bottom line is that NO parent should judge another. It would be best for everyone if we all gave support to each other because raising children is an amazingly difficult (though rewarding) task.
Let's all be nice. :D

[halos]

HALOS,

That estimateing in math class still gripes me, and I had the same arguement as you did. I have two apples and you have two apples , you give me an apple Now I have three apples and you have one. End of the story!!!!

But no, you have to find the estimated number of apples I have. PLEASE!!!!!!!!

That and the politcally correct whitewashing of American History in history class.

It is scary what these kids DO NOT know these days

Yes Vicar...frustrating!!
My children had this POD sytem in Parochial school when they were very young and we lived in Philadelphia....when we moved out of the city, and were comfortable putting them in public school, we found that they had this program 65 miles away in the public schools as well. This was many years ago. To this day school frustrates me. I now live in Maine...that system is alive and well here as well, although, like I said before, it has been modified somewhat. I still have one left in high school. Right now she has been working on a National History Day project...all of you with kids in high school should know what this is because it is a national project for all public high schools...to me, all these 'projects' should be wiped off the curriculum and more time spent with writing/grammar. My daughters (both) learned most of their writing skills from a history teacher...who was appalled at their lack of writing ability. With math...it's a nightmare. If you can't grasp the basics, you get lost totally later on. The scariest thing is that I live in a supposedly 'fabulous' school district. I'd hate to see what the kids in the poorer school districts are learning. Other than a handful of wonderfully devoted people, there are way to many awesome, talented intelligent people leaving the teaching profession...or people who would love to teach but don't go that route because teachers are under paid. It's a shame.

[HeatherInFlorida]

[ ........Bottom line is that it's up to every parent to decide what's best for their family and it really doesn't matter what other people think.
I only wish that this were so. Not that I question that it isn't "up to every parent" which of course it is. It is definitely the responsibility of every parent.

But sadly, it is not so that every parent knows what's best for their children. If they did we wouldn't have the many sad situations we are faced with in our society today.

None of which, of course, has anything to do with cruising or taking your child on a cruise while school is in session.

[Dolphins]

My dictionary defines truancy as..."staying away from school without permission...an unauthorized absence from school...neglectful of duty or responsiblity." Why is it "ridiculous" to state that condoning and encouraging an unauthorized absence from school is aiding and abbetting truancy?

Since many school districts receive state aid based upon attendance, it is rare that a school district would authorize the absence of students to go on a cruise. If many parents chose the cruise option, school districts would suffer greatly financially.

Far be it from me to criticize any parent who feels a cruise is more important than the education of their children. We all have our priorities.

[dakrewser]

The bottom line is that NO parent should judge another. It would be best for everyone if we all gave support to each other because raising children is an amazingly difficult (though rewarding) task.
Let's all be nice. :DYa know, that sort of sentiment is what leads to educational "pods" and math as estimation - it's the urge to validate as fact everybody's "feelings". But not everything is opinion, and not all opinions are equally valid.

My dictionary defines truancy as..."staying away from school without permissionWhen my children stayed away from school it was with my permission. I do not need the permission of the civil servants to raise my children.

[Dolphins]

dakrewser- I believe we have Compulsory Education Laws in this country and unless your children are taught by an approved private tutor, they must go to school until they are 16. No parent can legally permit their children to be excused from going to school for other than valid reasons.

[ekerr19]

dakrewser- I believe we have Compulsory Education Laws in this country and unless your children are taught by an approved private tutor, they must go to school until they are 16. No parent can legally permit their children to be excused from going to school for other than valid reasons.

There ae MANY unqualified folks out there who are "home schooling" their children because of the convienence it provides for them as parents! I am appalled at the number of parents I know who are home schooling - and are allowed to do it. One woman I know dropped out of High School in her sophomore year - I would love to know where your information is coming from. Any parent can choose to home school their children as long as they "follow" a curriculum approved by the school district.

[halos]

[QUOTE=dakrewser]Ya know, that sort of sentiment is what leads to educational "pods" and math as estimation - it's the urge to validate as fact everybody's "feelings". But not everything is opinion, and not all opinions are equally valid.
QUOTE]

dakrewser....so you think it's ok to judge people?? Am I misunderstanding your statement?
You don't have to agree with someone to support them....unless you are that type of person. Until you've walked in someone's shoes you have no right to invalidate their feelings, beliefs or question their choices.

[ekerr19]

Far be it from me to criticize any parent who feels a cruise is more important than the education of their children. We all have our priorities.

Well, you just hit the nail on the head, imo. Why criticize? Just state your point of view - we all have differing opinions. I can tell you, our son knows more Grammer, Vocabulary and English as a Freshman in private school than most kids learn in four years of college. Many subjects and classes are no longer considered a priority by school districts, and English is one of them.

I can totally relate to what halos is referring to - the "new" math without a correct answer - we went through that with our daughter. Many schools focus on "life skills" like shopping for nutrition, budgeting, balancing checkbooks, etc. and while these are admirable and most kids should learn them - if you are lacking basic math skills, even balancing a checkbook can be a challenge.

The days of traditional education are long gone from the public school systems nationwide, imo. Did you see the post by Arubalisa? Her district has very strict policies regarding absentism... I wonder how effective they are...

[Lisa616]

dakrewser- I believe we have Compulsory Education Laws in this country and unless your children are taught by an approved private tutor, they must go to school until they are 16. No parent can legally permit their children to be excused from going to school for other than valid reasons.

Again, for fear of being redundant...I have to say 'ridiculous'. We have taken our boys out of school for the past 3 years in a row with the teachers and principals blessings. A parent certainly has the right to do that..there is no such law, or at least not one that would ever be enforced. Our boys took all their assignments for the week and did their homework every night just as they would at home. They have memories that are precious to us, to them, and learned things that they wouldn't of learned otherwise.. and didn't lose a beat at school. They also, haven't had a sick day in years and am sure that other non vacations kids have missed far more days of school then mine. I am very grateful that we can spend this time together as a family, and quite honestly..I am grateful that I am not as close minded as you are regarding this issue. I'm not sure which statement you made is more mind boggling..the truancy one, or the illegal one. Amazing. I believe the difference between us is that I would support your decision to only vacation during school breaks because that is what is right for your family. You, on the other hand are passing strong judgements, and laws..which again, are ridiculous.

[Dolphins]

I fully respect the right of anyone to obey the laws they wish to obey and deny the existance of laws they consider ridiculous. This is the era we now live in. We all can now easily rationalize any decision we find convenient. Take solace in the fact that those of us who still maintain standards, however ridiculous, are a vanishing breed rapidly becoming extinct. We take solace in the fact that we won't be around to see the brave new world you have created.

[ekerr19]

I fully respect the right of anyone to obey the laws they wish to obey and deny the existance of laws they consider ridiculous. This is the era we now live in. We all can now easily rationalize any decision we find convenient. Take solace in the fact that those of us who still maintain standards, however ridiculous, are a vanishing breed rapidly becoming extinct. We take solace in the fact that we won't be around to see the brave new world you have created.

Dolphins-

Laws and opinions are two different thigs! I have my opinion about this matter - and I am CERTAINLY not breaking any laws!

I would bet my standards are a lot higher than yours - so please, if you must insist on criticizing, stick to FACTS! You are about spouting things "being the law" when they clearly are not.

Many of us in the younger generation have very high standards and values - and don't think them ridiculous at all. Your blanket statement about "rationalizing the conveniece of our decisions" just shows arrogance. I am certain you can convince yourself that you are much better than the rest of us... ;)

[dakrewser]

I fully respect the right of anyone to obey the laws they wish to obey and deny the existance of laws they consider ridiculous. This is the era we now live in. We all can now easily rationalize any decision we find convenient. Take solace in the fact that those of us who still maintain standards, however ridiculous, are a vanishing breed rapidly becoming extinct. We take solace in the fact that we won't be around to see the brave new world you have created.
As a number of people have pointed out, you are the one unfamiliar with the law - unless you're living somewhere outside the US (France, maybe?). I believe in the rule of law. I also believe that not all laws are right, correct or proper and work to have them changed. In extreme circumstances I also believe in civil disobedience and am ready to take the consequences of my actions to prove my point. Are you?

-dave

[dakrewser]

[dakrewser....so you think it's ok to judge people?? Am I misunderstanding your statement?
You don't have to agree with someone to support them....unless you are that type of person. Until you've walked in someone's shoes you have no right to invalidate their feelings, beliefs or question their choices.
Everyone is entitled to their own feelings and opinions. I'll support that right while reserving my right to disagree with those opinions.

As to beliefs - I'll question those which have no sound basis. As to choices, people make their own choices and have to live with the consequences. I'll applaud the choices some make, denigrate others and not pass comment on most.

[caribbean girl]

So many interesting views. And in the end, it is all relative. We have two children, senior and eighth grader. We have taken them on our vacations and they have missed some school. They always bring work along and we do it together on the trip. This year, we took an 11 day cruise and by the week after our return home, everyone was back on track with some minor adjustments. I do believe that travel is invaluable and unscheduled time together is also priceless. In my youth, my family seldom allowed any time off from school and I think we missed out on many family opportunities. It comes down to the child and the parents. Personally, we talk about the fun times had on these special trips for a LONG time after, and I believe the children will remember them, long after the fact. That is enough for me!!!

[Landlubber54]

There are so many variables in this issue, and every child is different. Our youngest is an excellent student, taking honors classes in middle school. I wouldn't hesitate to take her out of school for a week for the experience of going to a different part of the country/world. The school district she attends issues work packets to students who are planning on missing a week or more of school (whether it be for cruises, out-of-town sports competitions or family vacations with elementary school siblings who attend year-round school, etc.). Worst case scenario is that she struggles for a VERY short time upon return.

On the other hand, I'm not sure that I would have been willing to do the same with her older brother (now 22, and a college senior) who was a "less motivated" student...

Lots of gray here.:cool:

[Himself]

If I had to seriously answer that question because it touched my life, you would know that I would not be suitable to serve on a Ship as a Catholic Chaplain.

I will say this. My folks NEVER would have pulled me out of school to go on a cruise or any other type of vacation.

Himself

[Michelle!]

So many interesting views. And in the end, it is all relative. We have two children, senior and eighth grader. We have taken them on our vacations and they have missed some school. They always bring work along and we do it together on the trip. This year, we took an 11 day cruise and by the week after our return home, everyone was back on track with some minor adjustments. I do believe that travel is invaluable and unscheduled time together is also priceless. In my youth, my family seldom allowed any time off from school and I think we missed out on many family opportunities. It comes down to the child and the parents. Personally, we talk about the fun times had on these special trips for a LONG time after, and I believe the children will remember them, long after the fact. That is enough for me!!!

You say it very well, this year is the last year I felt that I could take my son out of school - he is in grade 5. The previous years we have travelled during school time, have been great learning experiences of cultures outside of our own. I work in the tourism industry and when the kids are out of school I am working 24/7. Being a single parent, I will take the quality time with my son, when I can get it. It is so rare to spend good old fashioned fun together - we also have serious time, where I ensure all the homework is done and everyone is happy. We take at least enough homework to keep us busy a few hours a day.

Just another opinion.

[trubey]

:p :p Taking kids out of schoool . . . hmmm.

I always took the philosophical position that younger children, say up to nine or ten, should concentrate on basic math, reading, grammer, and so forth. After that, continual repetition and refining is just mind-dulling; and anything that can open a new avenue of exploration -- and a chance to use the skills acquired in those first years -- is an extremely important part of letting a child begin to see that the world is a heck of a lot more complicated than 'Mr. Middleton's social studies class'.

How many 13-year-olds have spent the Vernal Equinox camping in Orkney? How many 11-year-olds have tooled around by themselves-- giggling all the way -- in the 9eme Arrondissement, or gone into a fromagier and asked for "fromage sans odeur"?

Take 'em out! In the long run I think those few days or weeks they 'miss' are returned a thousandfold.

Lane :p :p

[caribbean girl]

Good for you, Michelle! My mother was a single parent and she never allowed herself any treats. I think we all missed out-she needed breaks and we needed to enjoy her. During these trips, one has an opportunity to spend unscheduled time, in different sorroundings. It's interesting to try new things together, to figure out how things work with the children. I think they need to see their parents pehaps not knowing how everything works, the way we seem to at home. The change is refreshing and I find that we laugh at each other, as we learn together. 'Learning' in my opinion, is not just about books and classrooms. And it's not even just museums and exhibits. It's the everyday situations which present themselves to one, how one chooses to approach them and what one does with those experiences. I see my son relating to people in a wonderful, uninhibited way, on these trips. He shows interest and compassion in ways which surprise and delight me. I'm sure, Michelle that your son appreciates and will cherish these times, as he grows up. What lovely memories you are creating!!