Have you ever observed maltreatment of a crew member

[COLLEYBERRY]

Have you ever observed maltreatment of a crew member by a passenger?. If so did you feel compelled to intervene?

On our first cruise I remember passing a cabin steward in the hall who was being loudly berated by a very irate lout of a man (air was blue)

I don't know what the issue was ,but frankly ,short of sleeping with the man's wife I can't imagine what would warrant that behavior..
I felt so sorry for the cabin steward, The best I could do as I passed them was roll my eyes, and smile encouragingly at the cabin steward
I hoped my gestures conveyed to the steward that I thought this guy was a jerk and to take heart.

But somehow I always felt I should have done more ,exactly what I don't know.
Hubby wasn't with me , I did walk slowly incase the passenger became violent (he seemed that mad) but he did finally go into his cabin and shut the door.

Anyone else ever find themselves in a similar situation ?

[E-500]

Have observed a passenger totally out of line swearing at a young lady in the pursers office and another time a guest yelling at a server behind the line in the lido cafe. In both cases the crew member remained calm and just dealt with situation. By the way these both happened on Princess, not HAL.

[durangoscots]

On a HAL cruise we heard the people next door to us yelling at the steward because their room was not made up. It was early afternoon (about 1:00) at they had the "do not disturb" sign up until after noon hour ... I had seen it when I came back just before I went to lunch. They seemed under the impression they had their own personal steward. I had left my cabin at 7:30, eaten breakfast and my room was ready when I came back down after breakfast.

The steward just went about his work. These people were pretty agressive other places also. glad they were with us only 14 of the 28 days.

Susan

[velvetred]

On the Ryndam this past summer on our cruise to Alaska there was a sale of items on the pool deck for some small stuffed animals 2 for 5 dollars. My sister bought several of these and wanted to buy one additional stuffed animal because of her odd number of kids (she is the mother of 7). A crew member sold the stuffed animal to my sister for 2.50 in addition to her other purchases of several at the 2 for 5. After the purchase was completed, the supervisor began loudly berating the crew member telling him no single sales and going on and on about the crew member's mistake. My sister had already wandered off but I was still browsing and heard every word. I felt badly for the crew member and I thought the supervisor was totally out of line to reprimand his subordinate in front of guests. I almost offered to pay for another stuffed animal but I decided to stay out of it.

[Colakid]

Heard an older lady before the trayless era order a lido steward to carry her loaded tray over to her table. He walked away and she let him have it. She expected him to unload her stuff and set the table. She had not asked him to do so before he left. He came back like a flash and did as she asked. She called over his boss and chewed this poor fellow out. Many passengers in the area of this lady sided with the steward and told his boss and let her have it. She was not happy. I do not think this was the last of her problems by what I saw and heard. This was not necessary. Sorry I witnessed this problem.

[0verboard]

I think you can relax. Holland America is pleased to take this opportunity to inform you that any richly deserved staff beatings are not administered in areas which may be directly observed by the passengers.

[HWY 101]

:DYes, normally we beat them below the decks argh argh like the pirates would.. Mind if I smoke and pass gass":o

[kakalina]

One cruise in the Lido at dinner there was this man who put his dinner on the table and then went out to the bar area to finish his cocktail. When he returned the man started to cuss out and berate one of the servers because his food was cold. He was cussin' and fussin' and I had enough. I stood up and told the man I was eating my dinner and we didn't appreciate hearing the Lord's name taken in vain.
I also advised him if he had a problem with the crew he should talk to the Lido manager or anyone else in white jackets and not take it out on the crewmember.
Eventually the man shut up and the crew member with tears in his eyes thanked me for rescuing him from the pax.
For the rest of that cruise the crew was especially nice to me and many thanked me for standing up for them when they can't stand for themselves.

[COLLEYBERRY]

One cruise in the Lido at dinner there was this man who put his dinner on the table and then went out to the bar area to finish his cocktail. When he returned the man started to cuss out and berate one of the servers because his food was cold. He was cussin' and fussin' and I had enough. I stood up and told the man I was eating my dinner and we didn't appreciate hearing the Lord's name taken in vain.
I also advised him if he had a problem with the crew he should talk to the Lido manager or anyone else in white jackets and not take it out on the crewmember.
Eventually the man shut up and the crew member with tears in his eyes thanked me for rescuing him from the pax.
For the rest of that cruise the crew was especially nice to me and many thanked me for standing up for them when they can't stand for themselves.

Knew I liked you .:)
Wish you had been with me in the hall. So should have spoken up. I'll be ready next time.:mad::mad:

[Cruising-along]

One cruise in the Lido at dinner there was this man who put his dinner on the table and then went out to the bar area to finish his cocktail. When he returned the man started to cuss out and berate one of the servers because his food was cold. He was cussin' and fussin' and I had enough. I stood up and told the man I was eating my dinner and we didn't appreciate hearing the Lord's name taken in vain.
I also advised him if he had a problem with the crew he should talk to the Lido manager or anyone else in white jackets and not take it out on the crewmember.
Eventually the man shut up and the crew member with tears in his eyes thanked me for rescuing him from the pax.
For the rest of that cruise the crew was especially nice to me and many thanked me for standing up for them when they can't stand for themselves.

LOVE IT! 3 cheers for Kakalina!!!! :):):)

[suse]

Knew I liked you .:)
Wish you had been with me in the hall. So should have spoken up. I'll be ready next time.:mad::mad:
But, take it easy on yourself; it's very hard to confront people. You don't know where they're coming from. There are bad people everywhere, kind of like your mother warned you about.
I've seen very crabby people on board and sometimes think that it's because they're not feeling well or something. It's embarassing to even see this. But, let your light shine and don't let it bring you down.:)

[kakalina]

I like to think I would have stood up even if DH wasn't standing by my side. Wouldn't swear to it though. I just can't stand to see anyone bullied or mistreated. :o
If we ever get the chance to sail together I will tell you about the time it almost got me lynched in the deep South. :eek:

[COLLEYBERRY]

But, take it easy on yourself; it's very hard to confront people. You don't know where they're coming from. There are bad people everywhere, kind of like your mother warned you about.
I've seen very crabby people on board and sometimes think that it's because they're not feeling well or something. It's embarassing to even see this. But, let your light shine and don't let it bring you down.:)


Thanks Suse. that was nice..I like to give people benefit of the doubt also,but this guy was way beyond crabby...the crew is at such a disadvantage. He was just a big bully( probably henpecked:D)felt he could say whatever he wanted.

You are right, it was embarassing I felt ashamed a fellow passenger was behaving this way.not to mention how awful for the steward

[COLLEYBERRY]

I like to think I would have stood up even if DH wasn't standing by my side. Wouldn't swear to it though. I just can't stand to see anyone bullied or mistreated. :o
If we ever get the chance to sail together I will tell you about the time it almost got me lynched in the deep South. :eek:

Injustice makes me nuts too. I guess that's why it still bothers me.:)

Hope our cruise paths do cross one day. Sounds like quite a story.:eek:

[Sprocket]

Fortunately I have never witnessed that kind of behavior on a cruise. However I worked in retail management for years and had to deal with many irate customers. Some remained reasonable but a few became verbally abusive, swearing at the staff etc. At that point I would call our Security people, amazing how the sight of 2 six footers would make even the most aggressive "customers" back down.

On Remembrance Day a woman loudly berated one of my former staff for being late in opening the doors, when told the staff were observing the 2 minutes of Silence she could have cared less. That is the kind of person that just makes you shake your head.

[robcool]

The bottom line is that in any service industry you are going to have to deal with idiots. That does not make it easy, but it is a part of the game.

[AWOL]

We were on the Amsterdam in the Crows Nest one afternoon with our 2 year old daughter and one other passenger in the room.

The bar server was quietly playing with Katerina. The other person got up from where he was sitting and started yelling at the server for playing with her.

I will have to say I stopped being a gentleman for a little bit and mentioned a few things to him that he most likely did not want to hear.

Regards
Roger

[pipedreams62]

One cruise in the Lido at dinner there was this man who put his dinner on the table and then went out to the bar area to finish his cocktail. When he returned the man started to cuss out and berate one of the servers because his food was cold. He was cussin' and fussin' and I had enough. I stood up and told the man I was eating my dinner and we didn't appreciate hearing the Lord's name taken in vain.
I also advised him if he had a problem with the crew he should talk to the Lido manager or anyone else in white jackets and not take it out on the crewmember.
Eventually the man shut up and the crew member with tears in his eyes thanked me for rescuing him from the pax.
For the rest of that cruise the crew was especially nice to me and many thanked me for standing up for them when they can't stand for themselves.


Why didn't you finish the job?


http://pipedreams62.eaph2.com/share/afunstuffmay/42153044131.jpg (http://pipedreams62.eaph2.com/programs/iDrive.cgi?VIEWER&http://pipedreams62.eaph2.com/share/afunstuffmay/42153044131.jpg|640|422|72#)

[GatorV]

...and you think all those passengers that go missing really jumped over board:D

[steeragelady]

On a cruise to Hawaii with Celebrity Cruise Lines a man at the next table at lunch berated his server. He got louder and meaner by the minute. The manager of the restaurant came over to try and calm him. The poor server was humiliated. After a poorly digested lunch I went to the manager and complained that all the rest of us had to put up with this horses **s. I then went to the purser who took down my story, to make it short I went to everyone I recognized from lunch and told them to please put in a complaint about this man who had a horrid reputation. Soon after he went off again on a crewmember and was then kept in his stateroom for the rest of the cruise by the captain. Sometimes there is justice.

[SwissMyst]

Yes, on the Maasdam a very nasty encounter at the entrance to the Main Dining Room. Whether it was over reservations and/or dress code the passenger was totally out of line. The very large head chef and a few other hefty staff members formed a human line to back up the situation and I do believe the passenger (who clearly was being the obnoxious perpetrator) was banned from the MDR from that point on.

[Luke Warmwater]

I believe that this happens rather more often than is realised. I have seen people, I have to say, mostly Americans, show a distinct lack of respect to service staff, not just on cruises. "Gimme a beer", "I want the beef", "I wanna coke" with no hint of a "Thank you" when the ignorant request has been willingly complied with. Once common courtesy has gone, respect goes next and then comes abuse. Many of those I have seen on cruises believe that, because they have paid for the priviledge of cruising, those who serve them are somehow inferior. One man, a veteran from Texas, told me that he didn't have to treat waiting staff well because they were getting a tip.

[treasure4two]

As a former lead flight attendant for 27 years on TWA, I had to handle situations where a passenger got out of hand with me, my crew, or another passenger. Usually there were two reasons-alcohol or someone who had no control or authority any place else in their lives and this was what they thought was their chance to finally be in control or listened to. WRONG!! People are usually 'conflicters' or 'avoiders'-I am a conflicter and I feel that has come in handy for me, in my former occupation and in life in general, as I always want to help the underdog/person being treated unfairly. I think Kakalina is probably, like me, a conflicter and proud of it!! I like to think we stick up for others when they can not themselves. Crew members are not working on these cruises because they just want to travel, but because they have families to support and they have to take all the guff they get or lose their jobs. Usually the ones that are so rude, loud, or pick on others are very unhappy people who have no other outlet and no life.:p I am glad to hear that if someone gets really bad, that the captain or senior crew control them. If you do not feel comfotable saying something to the abusive person who is yelling at a crew member, then please, take a moment to let senior staff know that the cruiser was out of line and not the crew member. Just my two cents worth!

[May4]

I have observed passenger behavior that crossed the line more times than I care to admit. It is upsetting for sure.

An elderly passenger (quite) was seated with us one day at breakfast. We were in the dining room and were receiving customarily excellent service. But this passenger was mentally foggy and so very offensive. She had a companion sailing with her who seemed intimidated and bullied by her, so no help there.

Eventually she said something very insulting and bigoted to our steward and actually slapped him on the arm.

My sister and I spoke up and told her to stop. Then ds wrote a report to the Assistant Dining Room Manager. The upshot was that the steward was consulted and a plan was put into action. There was one steward to whom this lady would be kind. It was decided that he would serve her table when possible.

The stewards showed such compassion for a women who was obviously not thinking straight, but at the same time was as mean as sin. I am in awe of that level of kindness. (I thought the lady needed a proverbial good swift kick in the pants.)

[sapper1]

Fortunately I have never witnessed that kind of behavior on a cruise. However I worked in retail management for years and had to deal with many irate customers. Some remained reasonable but a few became verbally abusive, swearing at the staff etc. At that point I would call our Security people, amazing how the sight of 2 six footers would make even the most aggressive "customers" back down.

On Remembrance Day a woman loudly berated one of my former staff for being late in opening the doors, when told the staff were observing the 2 minutes of Silence she could have cared less. That is the kind of person that just makes you shake your head.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYlrrAWCTRg

You have probably seen this but it never fails to raise a lump in my throat.

[ottawa_traveler]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYlrrAWCTRg

You have probably seen this but it never fails to raise a lump in my throat.

I saw this video for the first time yesterday at my kids' school Remembrance Day ceremony. While I thought it was a wonderful song, I thought the video was so strange--why were they portraying such an ugly moment? I didn't realize until I looked at the youtube description that the song is based on a real-life incident! Wow. Although I've witnessed store clerks being treated rudely before (though not that rudely), I've never seen such disrespectful behaviour on Remembrance Day, and I hope I never do.

[sapper1]

I saw this video for the first time yesterday at my kids' school Remembrance Day ceremony. While I thought it was a wonderful song, I thought the video was so strange--why were they portraying such an ugly moment? I didn't realize until I looked at the youtube description that the song is based on a real-life incident! Wow. Although I've witnessed store clerks being treated rudely before (though not that rudely), I've never seen such disrespectful behaviour on Remembrance Day, and I hope I never do.
It was also played at the ceremonies for the city of Saint John but they included an explanation prior to the screening. I actually heard it for the first time last year when it was also played at the ceremonies---and of course it makes the email rounds at this time of year.

[Pam in CA]

I have two stories, both of which happened on Princess but could have happened on any cruiseline.

Several years ago, my daughter and I were on a Caribbean cruise over the holidays. I can't remember now why I was at the Pursar's Desk but there was a man (I won't say gentleman) berating and arguing with one of the staff. He and his family had been in port that day and taken motor scooters on an independent tour, completely separate from the ship. His wife had fallen and hurt herself (not badly) and he wanted Princess "to do something about it." The person behind the desk was very calm and tried to explain that Princess had nothing to do with the accident and he was welcome to take his wife to the Medical Center. He then got coarser and louder, demanding that Princess get their money back for the excursion and "do something" about the tour company. When told they couldn't do that, he practically got violent and demanded to see the Pursar, who came and explained the same thing. However, he invited the man to go to an office around the corner so they could discuss what Princess could do for him. I thought that was handled pretty well.

My other experience was also on a Christmas cruise in the Caribbean (different cruise.) We were checking in and a man with his wife, two children and Nanny were in front of us. He demanded to change the dinner time for his kids and the Nanny. Which, of course, they can't do on the pier. You have to do it onboard the ship. He went away steaming. As luck would have it, we were on the line to see the Maitre D' to confirm our seating arrangements and he was ahead of us. The Maitre D' was in his office at the back of the dining room and would close the door after each person/group entered for privacy. The guy entered and everyone on the line could hear the string of 4-letter words, yelling and screaming. It turns out that he was a step-father, his wife's children (about 6 and 8) had a completely different last name and their TA hadn't linked the bookings. The kids and Nanny were in first seating, the parents in second. The Maitre D' was happy to put them all in first seating but the argument was that they wanted second seating, including the kids. His wife came by while he was in there, heard the yelling and screaming, and told those of us in line that it took two hours for her to get her daughter ready for dinner so there's no way they could do early seating. I guess being rude and demanding works because that night, they were all seated at late seating -- at the table next to us. Like a bad itch, they seemed to be near/around us the entire cruise.

[room010]

This is just another manifestation of how people in general have become much more rude and beligerant and not just on cruise ships. In most cases I suspect that alcohol plays a large part. It certainly brings out the Inner A**h*le in many people. And some people just like to find fault in anything and everything [looks at Reviews with amusement] and need to take it out on someone, preferably someone who can't answer back.

[IRL_Joanie]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYlrrAWCTRg

You have probably seen this but it never fails to raise a lump in my throat.

sapper1, I'd not seen this before. Thank you so very much for it.

I will remember not only on 11-11 of every year, but every day of my life.

God Bless you!!

Joanie

[OHCruiser]

I believe that this happens rather more often than is realised. I have seen people, I have to say, mostly Americans, show a distinct lack of respect to service staff, not just on cruises. "Gimme a beer", "I want the beef", "I wanna coke" with no hint of a "Thank you" when the ignorant request has been willingly complied with. Once common courtesy has gone, respect goes next and then comes abuse. Many of those I have seen on cruises believe that, because they have paid for the priviledge of cruising, those who serve them are somehow inferior. One man, a veteran from Texas, told me that he didn't have to treat waiting staff well because they were getting a tip.

Please refrain from attributing "most" of the bad behavior to a single nationality.:cool:

I've seen equally as many ugly Europeans, Asians, and Australians on cruises in various parts of the world.

Beliefs in personal entitlement don't begin and end at the US borders.

[HoneyGV]

One cruise in the Lido at dinner there was this man who put his dinner on the table and then went out to the bar area to finish his cocktail. When he returned the man started to cuss out and berate one of the servers because his food was cold. He was cussin' and fussin' and I had enough. I stood up and told the man I was eating my dinner and we didn't appreciate hearing the Lord's name taken in vain.
I also advised him if he had a problem with the crew he should talk to the Lido manager or anyone else in white jackets and not take it out on the crewmember.
Eventually the man shut up and the crew member with tears in his eyes thanked me for rescuing him from the pax.
For the rest of that cruise the crew was especially nice to me and many thanked me for standing up for them when they can't stand for themselves.

Good for you! I think it's totally classless to berate a crew member. Some people just "ain't had no fetchin' up"!

[HoneyGV]

Please refrain from attributing "most" of the bad behavior to a single nationality.:cool:

I've seen equally as many ugly Europeans, Asians, and Australians on cruises in various parts of the world.

Beliefs in personal entitlement don't begin and end at the US borders.

I was once on a cruise, can't remember the line, but I was in line in the Lido and a little Japanese man cut in front of me and bumped me. He was so embarassed because he didn't realize he cut in front of me that he bowed, and bowed, and bowed and kept bowing to me through the WHOLE cruise everytime he saw me. That poor man was just so sorry. I kept TRYING to tell him it was ok, but the poor guy felt so bad for so long. Bless his heart.:)

[Sprocket]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYlrrAWCTRg

You have probably seen this but it never fails to raise a lump in my throat.

Thank you Sapper 1 for posting this...

[PROCRUISE]

The bottom line is that in any service industry you are going to have to deal with idiots. That does not make it easy, but it is a part of the game.

You are soooo right. As an emergency room RN it amazes me, even after 20+ years in the ER, how some patients will yell and even direct the F word toward me because they feel they've waited too long or want this and that, right now. I just smile and think to myself: how stupid must you be cursing at the nurse who chooses what size needle to stick you with and can deliver pain medication very quickly OR maybe not so quickly!!! I've always found that those who are really ill or injured are never demanding and those who don't even need to be in an ER are often demanding and abusive.

Likewise, on cruise ships I've noticed that most passengers are very appreciative of the service they receive and the ongoing hard work that the crew members put in everyday. In two instances when I saw crew members being yelled at, the passengers who were doing the yelling apparently thought themselves to be very important, when indeed, they were not.

[Tamaracboy]

One cruise in the Lido at dinner there was this man who put his dinner on the table and then went out to the bar area to finish his cocktail. When he returned the man started to cuss out and berate one of the servers because his food was cold. He was cussin' and fussin' and I had enough. I stood up and told the man I was eating my dinner and we didn't appreciate hearing the Lord's name taken in vain.
I also advised him if he had a problem with the crew he should talk to the Lido manager or anyone else in white jackets and not take it out on the crewmember.
Eventually the man shut up and the crew member with tears in his eyes thanked me for rescuing him from the pax.
For the rest of that cruise the crew was especially nice to me and many thanked me for standing up for them when they can't stand for themselves.

I wasn't even there and I thank you.
Petty Bullies SHOULT be made to feel like the very SMALL people they are !

[JimVrhovac]

The really frustrating part is the fact that we, the older generation, are the ones that raised these kids and instilled them with so called values.

Sometimes we get the feeling that we missed the point some where along the line....

Ours arn't perfect either.....

Ruth & Jim

[COLLEYBERRY]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYlrrAWCTRg

You have probably seen this but it never fails to raise a lump in my throat.


Thankyou Sapper.... their sacrifice is a poignant reminder of why it is so important to stand up to bullies.

[shandryl]

I think you can relax. Holland America is pleased to take this opportunity to inform you that any richly deserved staff beatings are not administered in areas which may be directly observed by the passengers.


lol

[IRL_Joanie]

Just noticed a new thread where the guy was ticked off that his stateroom was made up in 13 minutes morning of disembarkation. He has no sympathy from me AT ALL!! http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1090927
I've not heard of the Stewards piling anyones belongings in a pile. They will make up the bed, thinking you are up for good, but this guy went off and disresoected a hard working crew member doing his job. Not one iota of sympathy from me for the pax.

Joanie

[iamaqt2]

Just noticed a new thread where the guy was ticked off that his stateroom was made up in 13 minutes morning of disembarkation. He has no sympathy from me AT ALL!! http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1090927 (http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1090927)
I've not heard of the Stewards piling anyones belongings in a pile. They will make up the bed, thinking you are up for good, but this guy went off and disresoected a hard working crew member doing his job. Not one iota of sympathy from me for the pax.

Joanie


I've read your cross-reference on both of these boards, and to give you the benefit of the doubt, I'm going to assume you read it incorrectly the first time.

This gentleman clearly states he was up very early. And he also states that he was upset about what happened. However... he also states that he spoke with the steward and then went to the front desk to deal with it where it really counts... gratuities.

I seriously doubt that this gentleman is in the category of the pax that are the topic here. I may be wrong, but unless someone actually brings this gentleman up as someone they heard personally berating the staff, then he didn't deserve to brought into this board.

[Luke Warmwater]

Please refrain from attributing "most" of the bad behavior to a single nationality.:cool:

I've seen equally as many ugly Europeans, Asians, and Australians on cruises in various parts of the world.

Beliefs in personal entitlement don't begin and end at the US borders.

Please read my post again. I told you what I had seen and was not generalising on a particular nationality. I have done 30 cruises, visited 71 countries and 16 US states in the last 15 years. Tell me honestly, do you think that, generally, US citizens are courteous to service staff? Do you say please and thank you to bar staff and waiters or anyone else all the time? Most of your countrymen will not, in my experience. Of course there are people from all over who get ugly. I just observed what I regularly see as an explanation for the phenomenon. A US friend of mine once asked me on a cruise after a land based incident of terrorist activity, "Why does the rest of the world hate us?" I told her that I could not answer but she should put herself in the place of a member of the crew and observe the behaviour of her fellow countrymen for the rest of the day. By dinner time, she knew the answer. You are welcome to say I'm wrong and your experiences are different, but have another unbiased look next time you cruise.

[HWY 101]

Some of us actually travel without wearing disneyland tank tops... go figure.. 6 continents here and I have seen plenty of bad behavior from all Countries... not just one.. Please stop stereotyping and go see for yourself, imo..

"Tell me honestly, do you think that, generally, US citizens are courteous to service staff?" Quote...:p

[Taxguy77]

LOVE IT! 3 cheers for Kakalina!!!! :):):)

Cheer Cheer Cheer!:)

[Bakincakes]

Please read my post again. I told you what I had seen and was not generalising on a particular nationality. I have done 30 cruises, visited 71 countries and 16 US states in the last 15 years. Tell me honestly, do you think that, generally, US citizens are courteous to service staff? Do you say please and thank you to bar staff and waiters or anyone else all the time? Most of your countrymen will not, in my experience. Of course there are people from all over who get ugly. I just observed what I regularly see as an explanation for the phenomenon. A US friend of mine once asked me on a cruise after a land based incident of terrorist activity, "Why does the rest of the world hate us?" I told her that I could not answer but she should put herself in the place of a member of the crew and observe the behaviour of her fellow countrymen for the rest of the day. By dinner time, she knew the answer. You are welcome to say I'm wrong and your experiences are different, but have another unbiased look next time you cruise.

Oh yes..America is hated by the rest of the world.

Which is probably why thousands of the Worlds citizens clamor to get within our borders every year. Check out the lines at your local INS and see just how many of those who "hate" us can't wait to get in here.

They take to rickety boats, hide in planes and hire Coyotes to get them into our country.;)

[IRL_Joanie]

I've read your cross-reference on both of these boards, and to give you the benefit of the doubt, I'm going to assume you read it incorrectly the first time.

This gentleman clearly states he was up very early. And he also states that he was upset about what happened. However... he also states that he spoke with the steward and then went to the front desk to deal with it where it really counts... gratuities.

I seriously doubt that this gentleman is in the category of the pax that are the topic here. I may be wrong, but unless someone actually brings this gentleman up as someone they heard personally berating the staff, then he didn't deserve to brought into this board.


I believe it does deserve to be brought here as an example.

I quote: "With my anger growing I found the room guy, I let him know my feelings, I then decided to fill out the questionaire and gave him a poor rating, also went and reduced the tips as well, felt a little better." Unquote

He laid into the steward and then went to the main desk and reduced the tips.

You tell me this is acceptable?? I think not. This is exactly the type of behavior we have been discussing.

The man, I will not say gentleman, behaved badly and in my mind deserves no sympathy for his behavior at all.

So he wanted to avoid the Lido crowd? He could have had room service, he could have just removed the luggage bed covering and climbed back into bed. He could have done may things, but instead he berated the steward while irate and then reduced the poor mans tips because he was doing his job.....

On the last morning on the Zaandam Hawaii cruise I get up the last morning, go to the Lido at 5:50am (I noticed the do not disturb sign was gone from the door) to beat the crowd and grab a quick breakfast, run back to the room (gone about 13 minutes) for a couple more hours of sleep only to find the beds put together and remade for the next cruise, even the luggage mats were out on the bed.

He had to be waiting and the second I was out of the room, they did all of this in 13 minutes.

All our things, cell phone, ipod, papers, bags, clothes, shoes, hats, shampoo, toiletries etc, which were still all over the room, were all gathered up and thrown into a pile on the couch.

Needless to say I was ticked. I thought we had the room until 8am or so.

With my anger growing I found the room guy, I let him know my feelings, I then decided to fill out the questionaire and gave him a poor rating, also went and reduced the tips as well, felt a little better.

Never seen this in 52 cruises. I have been asked to leave the room before 8 but have never seen this before.



Joanie

[babyher]

Fortunately I have never witnessed anyone really abusing a staff member on a cruise. A few Grumpy Gus's , but no one that bad .

But I have seen some real "Basty Nastards" on land in stores , restaurants. etc.

It really makes me sick.

I have been working with the public for 30 years now in one form or another and it is just un called for. And your heart has to go out to the poor service worker who just has to hold back and take it or else lose their job.

The older I get , the less I suffer fools gladly . My kids tell me I am gonna get shot one day with muy big mouth *LOL*

I was in line at the grocery store behind some witch. Woman was completely in the wrong but had to attack the poor girl at the register while she was trying to explain to her.

The manager comes over and the woman tells a completely made up story about what the cashier said to her.

I just had to break in . I told the manager exactly what happened and the youg lady at the cashier never said a cross word and was trying to be completely helpful.

This witch turns to me and says "What are you the store police ?" "How big is your badge"

I said "A little bigger than your mouth and not quite as big as your a$$."

I eventually check out and leave the store , I see the manager walk torward me. I figured here it comes I am no longer welcome to shop here because of my big mouth.

The manager walks up to me and says "Thank you sir , for speaking up" She is in here several times a week and always has a groundless rant or rave about something or someone. She is a customer and an older lady so what can you do? My hands are tied"


He told me I was going to be a folk legend around the store when it gets passed around. *LOL*

So see stand up to "bullies". Better they should get "Acida" than you.

[suse]

Fortunately I have never witnessed anyone really abusing a staff member on a cruise. A few Grumpy Gus's , but no one that bad .

But I have seen some real "Basty Nastards" on land in stores , restaurants. etc.

It really makes me sick.

I have been working with the public for 30 years now in one form or another and it is just un called for. And your heart has to go out to the poor service worker who just has to hold back and take it or else lose their job.

The older I get , the less I suffer fools gladly . My kids tell me I am gonna get shot one day with muy big mouth *LOL*

I was in line at the grocery store behind some witch. Woman was completely in the wrong but had to attack the poor girl at the register while she was trying to explain to her.

The manager comes over and the woman tells a completely made up story about what the cashier said to her.

I just had to break in . I told the manager exactly what happened and the youg lady at the cashier never said a cross word and was trying to be completely helpful.

This witch turns to me and says "What are you the store police ?" "How big is your badge"

I said "A little bigger than your mouth and not quite as big as your a$$."

I eventually check out and leave the store , I see the manager walk torward me. I figured here it comes I am no longer welcome to shop here because of my big mouth.

The manager walks up to me and says "Thank you sir , for speaking up" She is in here several times a week and always has a groundless rant or rave about something or someone. She is a customer and an older lady so what can you do? My hands are tied"


He told me I was going to be a folk legend around the store when it gets passed around. *LOL*

So see stand up to "bullies". Better they should get "Acida" than you.
You must be from New York. I love New Yorkers. No flies on their backs.:)

[babyher]

You must be from New York. I love New Yorkers. No flies on their backs.:)


I am from Connecticut , but was brought up by a mother from Brooklyn :)

So fuggeddaboutit !!!!! *LOL*

[suse]

I am from Connecticut , but was brought up by a mother from Brooklyn :)

So fuggeddaboutit !!!!! *LOL*
Just the way you talk...........you know.
Ok back to the subject. Yeah I don't like rude people either.:)

[babyher]

Just the way you talk...........you know.
Ok back to the subject. Yeah I don't like rude people either.:)


*LOL* I have a friend from Oregon who always teases me and goads me to "Talk like a Goodfella " *LOL* And I do my best Joe Pesci impression for her . She dies laughing :)

Yes back on topic "Mean People Suck " *LOL*

[Rosethorn40]

The older I get , the less I suffer fools gladly . My kids tell me I am gonna get shot one day with muy big mouth *LOL*

This witch turns to me and says "What are you the store police ?" "How big is your badge"

I said "A little bigger than your mouth and not quite as big as your a$$."




I love it! Thanks for my first laugh of the day. Do you mind if I "borrow" it?:)

[babyher]

I love it! Thanks for my first laugh of the day. Do you mind if I "borrow" it?:)


Oh please feel free.


I am sure there are just as many people who need to be told off in Virginia as there are in CT. *LOL*

[suse]

Oh please feel free.


I am sure there are just as many people who need to be told off in Virginia as there are in CT. *LOL*
but they are all nice in Rhode Island where I live. I kid you not.:) I have this friend, Michael, in NY who is from Brooklyn and I confess, I do call him to hear his gangster voice. I can't help it. I am very immature.:)

[Rosethorn40]

Just noticed a new thread where the guy was ticked off that his stateroom was made up in 13 minutes morning of disembarkation. He has no sympathy from me AT ALL!! http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1090927
I've not heard of the Stewards piling anyones belongings in a pile. They will make up the bed, thinking you are up for good, but this guy went off and disresoected a hard working crew member doing his job. Not one iota of sympathy from me for the pax.

Joanie

Joanie,

I've noticed you haven't had much support regarding your opinion on that other thread so I thought I would come to your defense.

While it's true none of us witnessed how the man expressed his anger, and don't know if he was calm or over-the-top in his displeasure, I do know that after a lifetime in customer contact fields it's never pleasant dealing with an angry person. While the passenger in question had every right to explain to his steward his displeasure in the bed being made up and personal belongings piled on the couch, I do not feel that taking the survey at the 11th hour and giving a steward a low mark for the entire cruise is not appropriate for one perceived moment of poor service. I also noticed that the passenger didn't say by how much he had reduced the gratuities by. Was it by a small percentage, or did he dock the entire cruise length worth?

I wish people would realize just how much weight a poor mark on a survey can carry, and would consider carefully the mark they are going to give. I am a manager in a call center for a mortgage servicer, and my reps get scored by customers regarding the level of service they provide. It's amazing how many people penalize my reps with low scores when what they are really displeased with are; The economy, big business in general, they didn't have enough funds to cover their mortgage payment and when we drafted their payment it caused them to be overdrawn and now they want us to pay their fees, and any other of a million things that are not my reps fault, but the customer lays at their door. There is a good chance that the steward in question was just following the direction given to him by his supervisor.

[babyher]

but they are all nice in Rhode Island where I live. I kid you not.:) I have this friend, Michael, in NY who is from Brooklyn and I confess, I do call him to hear his gangster voice. I can't help it. I am very immature.:)


*LOL*

My friend and I have a long list of Oregon/New York Jokes that we add to all the time. Immature yes ...but fun :)

[COLLEYBERRY]

You are soooo right. As an emergency room RN it amazes me, even after 20+ years in the ER, how some patients will yell and even direct the F word toward me because they feel they've waited too long or want this and that, right now. I just smile and think to myself: how stupid must you be cursing at the nurse who chooses what size needle to stick you with and can deliver pain medication very quickly OR maybe not so quickly!!! I've always found that those who are really ill or injured are never demanding and those who don't even need to be in an ER are often demanding and abusive.

Likewise, on cruise ships I've noticed that most passengers are very appreciative of the service they receive and the ongoing hard work that the crew members put in everyday. In two instances when I saw crew members being yelled at, the passengers who were doing the yelling apparently thought themselves to be very important, when indeed, they were not.


I hear you.:) I have also spent years in health care (senior xray technologist)

I know what you mean about those noble patients who endure there lot with such grace and then those that seem to hold you personally responsible for whats wrong with them.
I have often thought why would you tick off someone who is about to radiate you :D

I have come to believe that most are frighten or nervous and don't have the skills to handle the situation.But there are some and I am parapharsing here.. who are just plain "poopey heads"

I have learned many techniques over the years to diffuse a hostile patient.
But I found myself out of my element in ship's hall.... truth is a "poopey head" is a" poopey head "where ever they are.:D Next time I'll stop and with a smile and a soft voice I'll say "What seems to be the problem here?" ( and try not to get myself shot babyher ;))

Oh and most of my "poopey heads" ....are Canadian;)

[babyher]

I hear you.:) I have also spent years in health care (senior xray technologist)

I know what you mean about those noble patients who endure there lot with such grace and then those that seem to hold you personally responsible for whats wrong with them.
I have often thought why would you tick off someone who is about to radiate you :D

I have come to believe that most are frighten or nervous and don't have the skills to handle the situation.But there are some and I am parapharsing here.. who are just plain "poopey heads"

I have learned many techniques over the years to diffuse a hostile patient.
But I found myself out of my element in ship's hall.... truth is a "poopey head" is a" poopey head "where ever they are.:D Next time I'll stop and with a smile and a soft voice I'll say "What seems to be the problem here?" ( and try not to get myself shot babyher ;))

Oh and most of my "poopey heads" ....are Canadian;)










Hmmmm so this is what we have to look forward to if Obamas Health Plan goes through? Hospitals full of Poopey Heads *LOL*

Relax ..From what I hear there aren't many shootings in Canada ......Just a lot of "Hunting Accidents " *LOL*

[Parrot57]

We were on a Disney cruise and the weather was horrible, causing us to divert from a scheduled port and go to another. It was announced that they were getting together as many shore excursions as they could on short notice (by the way, they did an excellent job of this). Of course the lines were long at the excursions desk even though several extra staff were on duty. I was in line and a woman and her husband came behind me and started to loudly complain that they should not have to wait. They kept saying "don't they know who we are". The man went several times to the front and again loudly complained that he should not have to wait. They made perfect as...of themselves complaining loudly about having to wait in line with the "riff-raff". I finally had enough, told them to shut up in a not so kind way. Several others joined in and the couple left. I saw them several times later, always complaining about the lack of respect being shown to them.

[TucsonRick]

I believe it does deserve to be brought here as an example.

I quote: "With my anger growing I found the room guy, I let him know my feelings, I then decided to fill out the questionaire and gave him a poor rating, also went and reduced the tips as well, felt a little better." Unquote

He laid into the steward and then went to the main desk and reduced the tips.

You tell me this is acceptable?? I think not. This is exactly the type of behavior we have been discussing.

The man, I will not say gentleman, behaved badly and in my mind deserves no sympathy for his behavior at all.

So he wanted to avoid the Lido crowd? He could have had room service, he could have just removed the luggage bed covering and climbed back into bed. He could have done may things, but instead he berated the steward while irate and then reduced the poor mans tips because he was doing his job.....
JoanieJoanie -
Were you there? I believe this thread is titled "Have you ever observed maltreatment of a crew member." If you were not there, how do you know the OP "laid into" and "berated" the man when he says he "let him know my feelings"???

I think you and Budget Queen are really off base on this one. The steward had no business in the man's cabin at that time of the morning regardless of what the OP was doing!

[swanseajack]

Heard an older lady before the trayless era order a lido steward to carry her loaded tray over to her table. He walked away and she let him have it. She expected him to unload her stuff and set the table. She had not asked him to do so before he left. He came back like a flash and did as she asked. She called over his boss and chewed this poor fellow out. Many passengers in the area of this lady sided with the steward and told his boss and let her have it. She was not happy. I do not think this was the last of her problems by what I saw and heard. This was not necessary. Sorry I witnessed this problem.

.......was that if any of the waiters in the Palms cafe and on my table 107 in the main restaurant saw me carrying plates of food, they were there like a shot to take it back to my table for me - and I am hardly decreipt. This level of courtesy was by far the best part of my time afloat on this ship and I commend these lovely people for their consideration and care.
On the other hand, several incidents were discussed where passengers - whose age might dictate that they had been brought up in more courteous times - spoke very harshly to staff. Shame on them! They know they can get away with it but they are such bullies. I would intervene if I saw it, without doubt.

[treasure4two]

I believe that this happens rather more often than is realised. I have seen people, I have to say, mostly Americans, show a distinct lack of respect to service staff, not just on cruises. "Gimme a beer", "I want the beef", "I wanna coke" with no hint of a "Thank you" when the ignorant request has been willingly complied with. Once common courtesy has gone, respect goes next and then comes abuse. Many of those I have seen on cruises believe that, because they have paid for the priviledge of cruising, those who serve them are somehow inferior. One man, a veteran from Texas, told me that he didn't have to treat waiting staff well because they were getting a tip.


I have traveled over 15,000,000 miles and have met rude people from all different countries? Just curious where you are from, as you take hits on Americans? Admittedly, some are rude but no need to generalize about
200,000,000 people for what you have seen a few do.

[CDiamond]

Joannie misrepresented why the OP was ticked off.:cool: She said he was ticked because his room was made up in 13 minutes. He stated he was ticked off because it was before 6:00 am, he was only out of the room 13 min, steward came in, made up the bed for new passengers and dumped his personal belongings on the couch.
She then said she has never heard of a steward dumping a persons belongings on the couch. So?? Are you saying that means the OP made it up because you have not heard of it? I think she was way off base for connecting these two posts.
Now, I do agree with her as far as the tips. I would not have decreased his tip. I would have talked to him just as the OP did. Many people can be angry and talk to someone without "laying into" them as she seems to say the OP did.
I would have put it on the survey. Why? Because if stewards are getting to the point of being so overwhelmed with their duties they have to come into a passengers room at 6:00am without permission, Holland needs people to bring it to their attention.

[SwissMyst]

My first reaction about the guy on the other thread who berated the room steward etc was uncalled for, but decided to stay out of this petty argument.

If he found the room steward to "berate him" why did he not simply ask the room steward to put things back the way he found them, instead of flying off the handle.

I would assume first a mistake was made, or the poor room steward thought he could get a little bit ahead of his schedule on this turn-around day which has to be the most intense one of all.

But surely with the tradition of friendly HAL service, I would expect this to be settled right then and there instead of the tirade and rampage that ensued.
And who knows what other accumulated abuses prior to this final incident might have taken place the illicited little sympathy from the steward at this point. Perhaps he was overjoyed to get rid of the guy at this point in time. But that is just pure devils advocate speculation nor does it justify any breach in protocol of leaving passengers their cabin privacy even on the last day.

[bob brown]

I have seen nasty people think that just because an employee is in uniform and subject to discipline, that gives them a license to abuse them.
These same people probably wouldn't dare to do the same if they happened to run into the same employee off duty somewhere, where they wouldn't have to take such abuse.
Fortunately, this ill behavior is more prevalent ashore in retail establishments, then on board ship where most people are in a 'cruise' frame of mind.
Perhaps the cruise lines should adapt the no-tolerance policy that airlines have adapted, where interfering with a flight-crew member is a punishable federal offense? Or maybe something not quite as drastic, but better than the current attitude of the passenger is always right?

[kyriecat]

The only time I've seen someone acting completely out of line with a crewmember was on Royal Caribbean. We had late dinner seating a few tables away from a couple who let their 2-3 year old daughter run loose in the dining room. She seemed incapable of sitting through dinner without causing a scene so rather than leave or eat somewhere else, they let her run around and paid no attention to her. She hid under tables, ran, grabbed things off others' tables, and was a general annoyance to the surrounding tables. I just knew a disaster was coming. On the third night, she ran out from under a table into the path of a waiter carrying a tray with about 20 plates stacked on it. He stopped quickly enough not to run into her, but the plates became unbalanced and about 5 of them slid off the tray, landing around the girl and splattering her with some food. Fortunately she was scared but did not appear to be hurt. Her father, upon hearing the crashing of breaking plate, came from 4 tables away and began to LOUDLY cuss at the waiter, calling him "stupid" as well as using racial slurs. It was horrible. The waiter didn't seem to know what to say so just apolozied. The maitre d' came over and rather than telling the man to shut up, apologized for the clumsiness of the waiter, offered compensation for the girl's clothes, and free drinks for the man and his wife. I was appalled!! The waiter did absolutely nothing wrong! He was doing his job. Kids should NEVER be allowed to run through the dining room. The PARENTS were the stupid ones.

[tarps14]

instead of the tirade and rampage that ensued.

Okay, sorry, where exactly did the "tirade and rampage" come from? While I don't agree with judging an entire cruise on one action and consequently reducing the tip, I do feel this dude was justified in his displeasure. We are putting a whole lot of words in his mouth past that.

Joanie, you contribute so much positive and truly valuable info to this board and I personally am incredibly thankful for that. However (sorry), I'm not so sure I can agree with your take on this situation. He was well within the confines of restraint in voicing that displeasure to the cabin attendant. How will the steward know not to do this next time if it isn't pointed out? I think the tone he might have used would be pure conjecture on our parts.

We have, on occasion, seen other passengers beyond rude and all you can really do in most situations is just shake your head and move on. The offending person does nothing but make a total a$$ of themselves but unfortunately even if it is pointed out, they are completely oblivious to it. They have deluded themselves into thinking that they are above all others and anything you say only tends to escalate the situation. That's not to say I haven't on occasion said my peace to someone who is mistreating a service person. Sometimes it is just so dang hard to hold your tongue when seeing this kind of thing.

[Alliea]

I have.. while on NCL.. a couple sat down to dinner, and the very friendly waiter came by to ask what they wanted.. and they were so put off that they could not understand him perfectly.. they became so rude to him. It was sad to watch.:(

[brfan]

The only time I've seen someone acting completely out of line with a crewmember was on Royal Caribbean. We had late dinner seating a few tables away from a couple who let their 2-3 year old daughter run loose in the dining room. She seemed incapable of sitting through dinner without causing a scene so rather than leave or eat somewhere else, they let her run around and paid no attention to her. She hid under tables, ran, grabbed things off others' tables, and was a general annoyance to the surrounding tables. I just knew a disaster was coming. On the third night, she ran out from under a table into the path of a waiter carrying a tray with about 20 plates stacked on it. He stopped quickly enough not to run into her, but the plates became unbalanced and about 5 of them slid off the tray, landing around the girl and splattering her with some food. Fortunately she was scared but did not appear to be hurt. Her father, upon hearing the crashing of breaking plate, came from 4 tables away and began to LOUDLY cuss at the waiter, calling him "stupid" as well as using racial slurs. It was horrible. The waiter didn't seem to know what to say so just apolozied. The maitre d' came over and rather than telling the man to shut up, apologized for the clumsiness of the waiter, offered compensation for the girl's clothes, and free drinks for the man and his wife. I was appalled!! The waiter did absolutely nothing wrong! He was doing his job. Kids should NEVER be allowed to run through the dining room. The PARENTS were the stupid ones.


And the even more sad thing is I wouldn't be surprised if the waiter was demoted and had to pay for the broken plates.

[imsulin]

I like to think I would have stood up even if DH wasn't standing by my side. Wouldn't swear to it though. I just can't stand to see anyone bullied or mistreated. :o
If we ever get the chance to sail together I will tell you about the time it almost got me lynched in the deep South. :eek:

Hear ya loud and clear! I live in the DS (although not from there), and within three days, my mantra became, "Do not talk about politics or religion".

[SarasMommy]

I have.. while on NCL.. a couple sat down to dinner, and the very friendly waiter came by to ask what they wanted.. and they were so put off that they could not understand him perfectly.. they became so rude to him. It was sad to watch.:(

Horrible.

On our Transatlantic cruise, we were at a table with a middle-aged couple and their 20-something daughter. The daughter wasn't directly rude to our wait staff but instead muttered snide comments more than once about them after they walked away, as well as rolling her eyes out of their sight. Even though I'm sure they didn't see or hear her behaviour, I still felt so bad for them that I went out of my way to smile at them and thank them for everything.

[Tamaracboy]

The only time I've seen someone acting completely out of line with a crewmember was on Royal Caribbean. We had late dinner seating a few tables away from a couple who let their 2-3 year old daughter run loose in the dining room. She seemed incapable of sitting through dinner without causing a scene so rather than leave or eat somewhere else, they let her run around and paid no attention to her. She hid under tables, ran, grabbed things off others' tables, and was a general annoyance to the surrounding tables. I just knew a disaster was coming. On the third night, she ran out from under a table into the path of a waiter carrying a tray with about 20 plates stacked on it. He stopped quickly enough not to run into her, but the plates became unbalanced and about 5 of them slid off the tray, landing around the girl and splattering her with some food. Fortunately she was scared but did not appear to be hurt. Her father, upon hearing the crashing of breaking plate, came from 4 tables away and began to LOUDLY cuss at the waiter, calling him "stupid" as well as using racial slurs. It was horrible. The waiter didn't seem to know what to say so just apolozied. The maitre d' came over and rather than telling the man to shut up, apologized for the clumsiness of the waiter, offered compensation for the girl's clothes, and free drinks for the man and his wife. I was appalled!! The waiter did absolutely nothing wrong! He was doing his job. Kids should NEVER be allowed to run through the dining room. The PARENTS were the stupid ones.

There should have been MANY complaints to the DRM about the kid's behavior AND also the parents for permitting it.
If this were more than a one-time thing I would think there would be a long list of complainers resulting in the Parents being instructed as to what they could do with their BRAT ! (I'm thinking Duct Tape and a Straight Jacket ;) )
I would at least have expected the trio be banned from ALL dining venues.
In addition to the nuisance factor to the other diners, there is a proven safety issue.

[babyher]

There should have been MANY complaints to the DRM about the kid's behavior AND also the parents for permitting it.
If this were more than a one-time thing I would think there would be a long list of complainers resulting in the Parents being instructed as to what they could do with their BRAT ! (I'm thinking Duct Tape and a Straight Jacket ;) )
I would at least have expected the trio be banned from ALL dining venues.
In addition to the nuisance factor to the other diners, there is a proven safety issue.


father of three here and nothing NOTHING annoys me more than a screaming brat.

Can't remember the show or movie but I loved the line.

Woman is in a restaurant having lunch, at the next table is a child screaming , yelling, throwing things, banging the table , while the parents sit there doing nothing.

While waiting to be served , the woman takes out her cell phone to quicly check her messages. The waiter runs over and tells her cell phones are not allowed in the restaurant, they disturb the other diners.

The woman points to the child , who is now flinging food at everyone in sight and says "And that doesn't disturb other diners?"

The waiter shakes his head and says "There's nothing we can do about that"

The woman says "Haven't you heard of Roe V. Wade ?" :)

[sapper1]

I hear you.:) I have also spent years in health care (senior xray technologist)

I know what you mean about those noble patients who endure there lot with such grace and then those that seem to hold you personally responsible for whats wrong with them.
I have often thought why would you tick off someone who is about to radiate you :D










My goodness, Colleyberry---you have a diabolical streak.;) I guess if I go to TO and encounter a rude person who glows in the dark I can chalk it up to "Colleyberry's Revenge":D.

[COLLEYBERRY]

My goodness, Colleyberry---you have a diabolical streak.;) I guess if I go to TO and encounter a rude person who glows in the dark I can chalk it up to "Colleyberry's Revenge":D.


Nah... I have never acted on the impluse ( they'll take your license for stuff like that).:D I just have bad thoughts sometimes.:o:D But only when provoked... I treat all patients with kindness and respect even the "poopey heads" :D

[babyher]

Nah... I have never acted on the impluse ( they'll take your license for stuff like that).:D I just have bad thoughts sometimes.:o:D But only when provoked... I treat all patients with kindness and respect even the "poopey heads" :D

I know what you are saying.

I am a 9-1-1 dispatcher and when someone is faced with a true life or death emergency they are not always in their right mind and yes can be rather irate. I can certainly understand that and don't pay it no mind. I just thank God I am not in their shoes and hope that I can be of help.

Of course we have the regulars that call for every little piddiling thing and expect us to jump at their command. those people get a "have a nice day" and a dial tone rather fast :)

[GatorV]

Not to promote stalking....but has anyone ever thought of finding the cabins of seriours offenders and leaving a note to them...doesn't need to be ugly but to the point....You were observed doing .....now straighten up. HA...the mind does dream a bit.

[COLLEYBERRY]

Funny you should bring this up My next short story is about a stalker on a cruise ship ( happy little tale:D, not so funny however for anyone experiencing this in real life....But to your idea,might give them pause for thought...Murphy's Law however suggests they would open the door just as you post it:D

I think reporting the behavior is probably the best bet....that way if a crew
member has an issue with this passenger they will have already been flaggged.

[kyriecat]

There should have been MANY complaints to the DRM about the kid's behavior AND also the parents for permitting it.
If this were more than a one-time thing I would think there would be a long list of complainers resulting in the Parents being instructed as to what they could do with their BRAT ! (I'm thinking Duct Tape and a Straight Jacket ;) )
I would at least have expected the trio be banned from ALL dining venues.
In addition to the nuisance factor to the other diners, there is a proven safety issue.As long as the parents were letting her roam freely, she was relatively quiet - just the usual babbling, giggling, and singing that 2 or 3 year olds do. It was when they attempted to make her sit in her seat that she screamed and banged the table. I guess the parents figured that they were doing everyone a favor by not making her sit at a table so she'd be quiet. However, I found the sudden touch of a child's hand on my leg, the brushing of a child running under my chair, and the sudden disappearance of silverware grabbed by a small hand equally disturbing during dinner. Our waiter told us that they weren't supposed to say anything to the parents because it would make the cruiseline appear to be unfriendly towards families. We saw the family, including the free-range daughter, a couple more times during dinner. Apparently the plate incident did not hinder the girl's ability to run around. Some of the passengers did attempt to restrain her while waiters were passing by with the loaded trays to prevent another incident.

[COLLEYBERRY]

As long as the parents were letting her roam freely, she was relatively quiet - just the usual babbling, giggling, and singing that 2 or 3 year olds do. It was when they attempted to make her sit in her seat that she screamed and banged the table. I guess the parents figured that they were doing everyone a favor by not making her sit at a table so she'd be quiet. However, I found the sudden touch of a child's hand on my leg, the brushing of a child running under my chair, and the sudden disappearance of silverware grabbed by a small hand equally disturbing during dinner. Our waiter told us that they weren't supposed to say anything to the parents because it would make the cruiseline appear to be unfriendly towards families. We saw the family, including the free-range daughter, a couple more times during dinner. Apparently the plate incident did not hinder the girl's ability to run around. Some of the passengers did attempt to restrain her while waiters were passing by with the loaded trays to prevent another incident.

Then they will wonder at sixteen why she doesn't seem to have any boundries... Maybe the dining room of a cruise ship isn't the best venue for a two year to be taught restraint but those lessons should begin very early it saves a whole lot of grief later on.

Not to mention the hapless passenger with hot soup down their back because the parents forgot their boundries.:rolleyes:

[knitlady037]

As long as the parents were letting her roam freely, she was relatively quiet - just the usual babbling, giggling, and singing that 2 or 3 year olds do. It was when they attempted to make her sit in her seat that she screamed and banged the table. I guess the parents figured that they were doing everyone a favor by not making her sit at a table so she'd be quiet. However, I found the sudden touch of a child's hand on my leg, the brushing of a child running under my chair, and the sudden disappearance of silverware grabbed by a small hand equally disturbing during dinner. Our waiter told us that they weren't supposed to say anything to the parents because it would make the cruiseline appear to be unfriendly towards families. We saw the family, including the free-range daughter, a couple more times during dinner. Apparently the plate incident did not hinder the girl's ability to run around. Some of the passengers did attempt to restrain her while waiters were passing by with the loaded trays to prevent another incident.
I can't understand how parents can be so inconsiderant. They enlisted other diners to be their babysitters without their consent. I know how on edge I feel when I see a child roaming around unsupervised. You never know what can hppen in the blink of an eye. Suppose one of the pieces of swiped silverware was a sharp knife? Or a bowl of hot soup. No one should have to pull someone elses child out of harms way. I took my children to restaurants from the time they were infants and now take my 2 grandaughters(ages 3 & 6) also. I bring something to keep them occupied at MY table. If they start to become bored or out of sorts I take my meal to go and leave. I do not feel I have the right to disturb others that are going out for an evening of relaxation. I have seen many eye rolls when we walked in, but have also received many compliments on the way out for their behaviour. Manners and a respect for others have to be taught at an early age and it seems that the parents of that young child were never taught. If you child cannot be controlled, room service should be ordered.

[justjen321]

[quote=IRL_Joanie;22021815]I believe it does deserve to be brought here as an example.

I quote: "With my anger growing I found the room guy, I let him know my feelings, I then decided to fill out the questionaire and gave him a poor rating, also went and reduced the tips as well, felt a little better." Unquote

He laid into the steward and then went to the main desk and reduced the tips.

No, Joanie. -You- decided he LAID into the steward. He doesn't even imply it in his OP.

So he wanted to avoid the Lido crowd? He could have had room service, he could have just removed the luggage bed covering and climbed back into bed. He could have done may things, but instead he berated the steward while irate and then reduced the poor mans tips because he was doing his job.....

There a lot of 'he could haves' in here. Sure, he could have, I'll grant you that. The point is, he didn't WANT to. It's his cruise, and cruises are marketed on the point that you can do as little or as much as you please. There was NO reason for him to have any expectation of a steward turning his room around before 6am. None. It would NEVER enter my mind that it was possible, frankly.

His 'job' is to turn the ship around once cabins are vacated at the requested time. He is in a service position, you seem to forget that. Perhaps some research on what service means?

I'd agree with you, NO staff member should EVER be berated or humiliated, in public OR in private. However, your anger over this is ALL based on assumptions you made, and NOT anything you saw or read.

As a consumer, I will always speak up when I feel the service I've been told I will be provided with isn't up to par. I do so pleasantly, politely, and with an expectation that there's been miscommunication that can easily be cleared up with some discussion. Sometimes, I understood wrong, and that's okay too. It honestly sounds like the OP handled it the same way, and you just have your knickers in a wad cause maybe you like drama. :)

Just sayin.

[nu2sea]

As long as the parents were letting her roam freely, she was relatively quiet - just the usual babbling, giggling, and singing that 2 or 3 year olds do. It was when they attempted to make her sit in her seat that she screamed and banged the table. I guess the parents figured that they were doing everyone a favor by not making her sit at a table so she'd be quiet. However, I found the sudden touch of a child's hand on my leg, the brushing of a child running under my chair, and the sudden disappearance of silverware grabbed by a small hand equally disturbing during dinner. Our waiter told us that they weren't supposed to say anything to the parents because it would make the cruiseline appear to be unfriendly towards families. We saw the family, including the free-range daughter, a couple more times during dinner. Apparently the plate incident did not hinder the girl's ability to run around. Some of the passengers did attempt to restrain her while waiters were passing by with the loaded trays to prevent another incident.

This type of behavior would have prompted me to file a complaint with the restaurant manager. Although the waiters are restrained from dealing with the family, there is no reason why any other passenger should be groped by another person, regardless of age. If parents cannot control their children during dinner they should consider room service, as it is not the responsibility of other passengers to protect the children of others.

[room010]

Modern parenting requires that you allow your child to do anything they want, when and where they want because if you impose discipline or boundaries you will inflict permanent psychological damage and low self esteem and it will then be someone else's fault that the little monsters turn into grown up monsters.

[Pam in CA]

The only time I've seen someone acting completely out of line with a crewmember was on Royal Caribbean. We had late dinner seating a few tables away from a couple who let their 2-3 year old daughter run loose in the dining room. She seemed incapable of sitting through dinner without causing a scene so rather than leave or eat somewhere else, they let her run around and paid no attention to her. She hid under tables, ran, grabbed things off others' tables, and was a general annoyance to the surrounding tables. I just knew a disaster was coming. On the third night, she ran out from under a table into the path of a waiter carrying a tray with about 20 plates stacked on it. He stopped quickly enough not to run into her, but the plates became unbalanced and about 5 of them slid off the tray, landing around the girl and splattering her with some food. Fortunately she was scared but did not appear to be hurt. Her father, upon hearing the crashing of breaking plate, came from 4 tables away and began to LOUDLY cuss at the waiter, calling him "stupid" as well as using racial slurs. It was horrible. The waiter didn't seem to know what to say so just apolozied. The maitre d' came over and rather than telling the man to shut up, apologized for the clumsiness of the waiter, offered compensation for the girl's clothes, and free drinks for the man and his wife. I was appalled!! The waiter did absolutely nothing wrong! He was doing his job. Kids should NEVER be allowed to run through the dining room. The PARENTS were the stupid ones.I've seen this as well, even in late seating (where there shouldn't be a small child.) The kid was a danger to himself and the waiters as every night, throughout dinner, they had to be aware where the little brat was so they wouldn't trip over them, fall and/or drop their trays. It was disruptive to everyone in that area of the dining room who were just trying to enjoy their dinner. IMHO, we have rights too, and that includes not being subjected to a bratty, screaming kid. Parents who allow their children to do that should be removed from the dining room and asked to eat in the buffet.

[justjen321]

I wonder if anyone has ever approached the Maitre'd about this type of thing?

Aside from being flat out rude, it's very unsafe. I've never witnessed it, but I absolutely would approach the Maitre'd if I were to do so.

Anyone have any experience with that? Did you feel like the situation was handled after you approached it?

Jen

[Tamaracboy]

As long as the parents were letting her roam freely, she was relatively quiet - just the usual babbling, giggling, and singing that 2 or 3 year olds do. It was when they attempted to make her sit in her seat that she screamed and banged the table. I guess the parents figured that they were doing everyone a favor by not making her sit at a table so she'd be quiet. However, I found the sudden touch of a child's hand on my leg, the brushing of a child running under my chair, and the sudden disappearance of silverware grabbed by a small hand equally disturbing during dinner. Our waiter told us that they weren't supposed to say anything to the parents because it would make the cruiseline appear to be unfriendly towards families. We saw the family, including the free-range daughter, a couple more times during dinner. Apparently the plate incident did not hinder the girl's ability to run around. Some of the passengers did attempt to restrain her while waiters were passing by with the loaded trays to prevent another incident.

Since it went on every night, If the HotMan or Captain did not restrict them to their cabin, I would recommend a Tether or Ankle Chain in addition to the Straight Jacket and Duct Tape !
All this might go for the Parents as well :rolleyes:

r.

[lorekauf]

Since it went on every night, If the HotMan or Captain did not restrict them to their cabin, I would recommend a Tether or Ankle Chain in addition to the Straight Jacket and Duct Tape !
All this might go for the Parents as well :rolleyes:

r.
You are too funny :D and I totally agree!

[Pokeynose]

Modern parenting requires that you allow your child to do anything they want, when and where they want because if you impose discipline or boundaries you will inflict permanent psychological damage and low self esteem and it will then be someone else's fault that the little monsters turn into grown up monsters.

My answer to this would not be printable.:mad: My three boys just had to see the look on my face when they were doing something wrong and stopped immediately. I didn't need to raise my hand to them but that was another time, oldest is 50.:)

[CowPrincess]

I've seen this as well, even in late seating (where there shouldn't be a small child.) The kid was a danger to himself and the waiters as every night, throughout dinner, they had to be aware where the little brat was so they wouldn't trip over them, fall and/or drop their trays. It was disruptive to everyone in that area of the dining room who were just trying to enjoy their dinner. IMHO, we have rights too, and that includes not being subjected to a bratty, screaming kid. Parents who allow their children to do that should be removed from the dining room and asked to eat in the buffet.

BRAVA! :D Well-said!

[room010]

I'd be interested to know what the cruiseline expects employees to do when faced with abusive or rude behaviour from passengers. Do they just have to smile and "suck it up" or in cases where the passenger is way out of line does the cruiseline take firmer action? I know that in extreme circumstances disruptive passengers can be thrown off the boat (not literally but boy, I bet it's tempting sometimes) but I wonder if there's a Black List of people who will no longer be welcome or some other action that can be taken. In any event I would expect the senior officers to back up the crew member/victim of unwarranted abuse rather than punish them which, sadly, seems to be happening. Sometimes the customer is NOT always right.

[durangoscots]

I know that sometimes passengers are asked to disembark before they intended to .... and I also know that the staff really can not respond to situations, even to defend themselves. However, I have several friends who have gone either to the purser's office, or other senior staff, to defend a steward or waiter from retribution which is undeserved.

.... and like others have said, if I had been in the dining room with the running kid I would have gone straight to the maitre'de..... that situation is dangerous and I don't like someone's grubby little hands around my food.... especially if they have been crawling on the floor. But some parents think their offspring should be free spirits, and then of course they sue when the little darling is injured or scared.

Susan

[GatorV]

I know that sometimes passengers are asked to disembark before they intended to .... and I also know that the staff really can not respond to situations, even to defend themselves. However, I have several friends who have gone either to the purser's office, or other senior staff, to defend a steward or waiter from retribution which is undeserved.

.... and like others have said, if I had been in the dining room with the running kid I would have gone straight to the maitre'de..... that situation is dangerous and I don't like someone's grubby little hands around my food.... especially if they have been crawling on the floor. But some parents think their offspring should be free spirits, and then of course they sue when the little darling is injured or scared.

Susan

Its amazing how quickly I could spill iced tea on the little darling....and I would.

[usha]

I always cringe when I hear someone say to a wait staff member: "Gimme some..." or "I want..."
That seems to be the most common abuse I've noticed.
How can people be so clueless?

[sparky-elpaso]

My answer to this would not be printable.:mad: My three boys just had to see the look on my face when they were doing something wrong and stopped immediately. I didn't need to raise my hand to them but that was another time, oldest is 50.:)

Same here - and my 2 are mid-30's. We started taking them out as toddlers and they weren't allowed to run around, etc. even if it was just McDonald's or Wendy's. We used to have people compliment us on how well they behaved.

[kyriecat]

At least 90% of children are very well behaved although they have the occasional outburst. It's the other 10% whose parents allow them free-rein that really give ALL children a bad name. It's usually the parents who are letting their children run wild who will attack you for reminding that child about good behavior. It's much easier to ignore a child's poor behavior than to risk being assaulted by a beligerant parent. It's a different world today than when I was growing up. I'm late 30s now. If someone else had to discipline me, my mom would have thanked the person and apolozed for my behavior, then I would have been disciplined worse than if she had caught me doing whatever. I might get away with a few things at home but NEVER in public.

Based on the father's reaction when the waiter dropped the plates, I'm sure he would have also verbally attacked anyone (staff or passenger) who mentioned that his daughter might not be ready for a sit-down style dinner. I think the maitre d' should have defended the waiter, but I assume he was trying to diffuse the situation as best he could by offering compensation to the parents. I don't think he wanted the father to become physically violent, which might have happened if anyone contradicted that the waiter was completely at fault. It is very fortunate that the girl was not injured since the plates are heavy. I noticed that other passengers would grab her hand, corral her under a table, or try to engage her attention on subsequent evenings when the waiters were coming by with food and drinks. I also noticed that the waiters walked very slowly and paid careful attention to their surroundings while they were walking. I don't think anyone wanted to risk having another scene.

[Kluge]

"With my anger growing I found the room guy, I let him know my feelings, I then decided to fill out the questionaire and gave him a poor rating, also went and reduced the tips as well, felt a little better." I have to go with Joanie on ths one. A person whose anger "grows" after discovering that his bed has been made and his belongings placed on the couch, and who only feels "a little better" after exacting financial revenge on a poorly paid domestic worker has serious anger issues. It is unlikely that he has exaggerated his response; not so unlikely that he has edited it somewhat.

I'll admit - I'm as cheap as they come but I'm still a softie for the hard working, poorly paid (by U.S. standards) staff, who sacrifice a lot to achieve some financial security for their families. My wife and I sought out the waiter at Canalettos (where we ate twice) to give him a tip at the end of our trip because we figured those guys probably don't get much personal attention, unlike the stewards and regular dining staff. (Added a tip for our steward, too.) I could only admire and yet feel for the waitress at the Pinnacle Grill who was unsure of whether she would sign another 10 month contract - as she missed her 3 year old daughter. Who among us would make that kind of sacrifice? The idea of punishing one of them for something as innocuous as misinterpreting the passenger's absence from a stateroom as signifying that he was preparing to depart when he actually intended to return doesn't speak well for the passenger, IMHO.

[MrsCruiseBabe]

[quote=IRL_Joanie;22021815]I believe it does deserve to be brought here as an example.

I quote: "With my anger growing I found the room guy, I let him know my feelings, I then decided to fill out the questionaire and gave him a poor rating, also went and reduced the tips as well, felt a little better." Unquote

He laid into the steward and then went to the main desk and reduced the tips.

No, Joanie. -You- decided he LAID into the steward. He doesn't even imply it in his OP.

So he wanted to avoid the Lido crowd? He could have had room service, he could have just removed the luggage bed covering and climbed back into bed. He could have done may things, but instead he berated the steward while irate and then reduced the poor mans tips because he was doing his job.....

There a lot of 'he could haves' in here. Sure, he could have, I'll grant you that. The point is, he didn't WANT to. It's his cruise, and cruises are marketed on the point that you can do as little or as much as you please. There was NO reason for him to have any expectation of a steward turning his room around before 6am. None. It would NEVER enter my mind that it was possible, frankly.

His 'job' is to turn the ship around once cabins are vacated at the requested time. He is in a service position, you seem to forget that. Perhaps some research on what service means?

I'd agree with you, NO staff member should EVER be berated or humiliated, in public OR in private. However, your anger over this is ALL based on assumptions you made, and NOT anything you saw or read.

As a consumer, I will always speak up when I feel the service I've been told I will be provided with isn't up to par. I do so pleasantly, politely, and with an expectation that there's been miscommunication that can easily be cleared up with some discussion. Sometimes, I understood wrong, and that's okay too. It honestly sounds like the OP handled it the same way, and you just have your knickers in a wad cause maybe you like drama. :)

Just sayin.


I am so glad you said this.................some people ...............

[Zappa Fan]

.....His 'job' is to turn the ship around once cabins are vacated at the requested time. He is in a service position, you seem to forget that. Perhaps some research on what service means?......

Excellent post. I agree completely.

[Kluge]

His 'job' is to turn the ship around once cabins are vacated at the requested time. He is in a service position, you seem to forget that. Perhaps some research on what service means? Just what justification does the term "service position" provide for you in this situation? The steward is a human being, working lord-knows what hours for less pay than any of us would work for, whose "crime" appears to have been to fail to read the mind of a passenger who was able to work himself into a sense of increasing anger and self-righteousness instead of dealing with the problem with good grace and reasonableness.

If it's "the principle of the thing" write a letter to HAL. Don't stiff the workers. Three cents apiece may not seem like much to you but these are people who have signed on to multi-month contracts, to work far from home, for just one reason - the money. Stiffing the workers - even a little - is a petty response to a trivial misunderstanding. I don't see "the principle" in that.

And by the way - I agree with Joanie. Anyone who feels he has to "share his feelings" as his "anger grows" over something like this is unlikely to have been as inoffensive about the manner in which it was done as you feel it is appropriate to conclude. Anyone who would "feel better" about stiffing all of the workers on a cruise ship - even "just a little" over something like this should not be congratulated or supported.

My two cents.

[justjen321]

Just what justification does the term "service position" provide for you in this situation? [/COLOR]
The steward is a human being, working lord-knows what hours for less pay than any of us would work for, whose "crime" appears to have been to fail to read the mind of a passenger who was able to work himself into a sense of increasing anger and self-righteousness instead of dealing with the problem with good grace and reasonableness.

If it's "the principle of the thing" write a letter to HAL. Don't stiff the workers. Three cents apiece may not seem like much to you but these are people who have signed on to multi-month contracts, to work far from home, for just one reason - the money. Stiffing the workers - even a little - is a petty response to a trivial misunderstanding. I don't see "the principle" in that.

And by the way - I agree with Joanie. Anyone who feels he has to "share his feelings" as his "anger grows" over something like this is unlikely to have been as inoffensive about the manner in which it was done as you feel it is appropriate to conclude. Anyone who would "feel better" about stiffing all of the workers on a cruise ship - even "just a little" over something like this should not be congratulated or supported.

My two cents.
[/COLOR]

Hi there :)

I'm really unclear here -why- several feel the need to alter what the OP actually said, (and came back I believe to clarify even further) in order to be up in arms over the treatment of the poor, overworked staff.

In trying for clarity, let me explain that I worked in the service industry for years, and my opinion of my job was to provide a service for my guests.

I've also stated clearly I don't think berating, or humiliating a staff member is EVER acceptable, and more than once in my life, I've gladly stood up for one who has been. And I will again. I despise rude, arrogant behavior.

The biggest issue here is that the OP got what amounted to pretty crappy treatment on their last morning. I'm shocked that ANYONE on these boards would have even the slightest expectation that their cabin would be 'turned' before 6am.

I am well aware that the staff on these ships are typically not paid well by American standards. I'm also well aware that by the standards of most of their countries, they are paid VERY well. Yes, it's sad that they are away from their family for extended periods of time, but it's a choice.

I could go work in Iraq for private contractors, cause it's REALLY highly paid. It's also unsafe, but it's a CHOICE.

I feel for people from third world countries, I do. However, I simply reject the notion that by mere fact of their country of origin, I am required to pony up money if I feel I've been treated in a rather crappy manner.

I am an extravagant tipper. (Most from the service industry are). Mistakes don't phase me. Things taking extra time don't phase me. What WOULD phase me is someone who is supposed to be providing me a service trying hard to bully me out of my cabin.

And please, let's do revisit the notion of 'tipping'. A tip is NOT required. (although we ALL know that those who work for tips make lower wages, let's please don't ever forget that). Tipping is for SERVICE given. Keep me moderately happy and I'll tip you as if you delivered my child. Treat me as if I'm bothering you, or hindering you in your SERVICE job by requesting that you do for me what you are supposed to, and I probably won't.

[superdee]

On the Westerdam 2 years ago there was this miserable old lady that never read the menu right and called the waiter over and said she never ordered her sandwich with the sauce. He said he would get her another one plain right away and she said she didn't have time. I thought this odd being a sea day and knowing what I know now I would have felt blessed if she had to hurry to jump overboard. The kid no sooner got 10 paces away and was "Waiter! Waiter hey Stupid!!!" . That did it for my wife. She was all over that miserable bitch like a pack of wild dogs on a three legged cat. She went and got the menu and pointed out the old bitch's mistake and demanded she apologize. My wife is Native Indian and has been subject to racism and abuse and there is no way anybody gets away with crap like that around her. I know why I am proud of her because she stands up for her belief's and doesn't let anybody bully others. We both treat all our waiters,cabin stewards and everybody as equals. Hell she is a factory worker and I work in a machine shop so on the social scale we're nothing special. If a mistake is made and it sometimes happens it is only a mistake until it is corrected. I know for a fact that if the worst thing that ever happened to me was to get a Pastrami sandwich with Dijon /Mayo on it then life's been mighty good. I cannot believe how rude some people are to these great employees. HAL has the best bar none.

[justjen321]

Kudos to your wife, superdee!!

Sometimes, we must stand up for those who cannot stand up for themselves. :)

[Zappa Fan]

Excellent posts, Jen. I applaud you! (I see that you cruise Carnival.... you'll quickly learn that ANY negative review about a HAL cruise will get you attacked by a certain group of posters- don't get me wrong... I simply adore Holland America... but, I will not be bullied by blowhards behind a keyboard) ;)

[room010]

Perhaps people simply don't know how to deal with "the help" and assume that being rude, disrespectful and plain ornery is the way to go. Or maybe they work in a service industry themselves and are so fed up with obnoxious customers they see this as an opportunity for some payback. I have also noticed how so many people have a hair trigger anger response to even the slightest misunderstanding, error or inconvenience. Or maybe there are just many more unpleasant people out there who cannot show self-restraint and don't feel the slightest bit ashamed or embarrassed to show their true colours. Ultimately the joke is on them but in the meantime some poor victim has to bear the brunt of a reaction that's totally disproportionate to the original "offence".

[justjen321]

LOL Zappa fan

Blowhards with a keyboard is often appropriate on a forum!

We've only ever cruised Carnival. With the kids, they really love it, so we've stayed with it. My husband and I intend to hit the other cruise lines for comparison sake (oh, the horror, more cruising) and HAL is on my list. :)

[momofmeg]

Hi there :)

I'm really unclear here -why- several feel the need to alter what the OP actually said, (and came back I believe to clarify even further) in order to be up in arms over the treatment of the poor, overworked staff.

In trying for clarity, let me explain that I worked in the service industry for years, and my opinion of my job was to provide a service for my guests.

I've also stated clearly I don't think berating, or humiliating a staff member is EVER acceptable, and more than once in my life, I've gladly stood up for one who has been. And I will again. I despise rude, arrogant behavior.

The biggest issue here is that the OP got what amounted to pretty crappy treatment on their last morning. I'm shocked that ANYONE on these boards would have even the slightest expectation that their cabin would be 'turned' before 6am.

I am well aware that the staff on these ships are typically not paid well by American standards. I'm also well aware that by the standards of most of their countries, they are paid VERY well. Yes, it's sad that they are away from their family for extended periods of time, but it's a choice.

I could go work in Iraq for private contractors, cause it's REALLY highly paid. It's also unsafe, but it's a CHOICE.

I feel for people from third world countries, I do. However, I simply reject the notion that by mere fact of their country of origin, I am required to pony up money if I feel I've been treated in a rather crappy manner.

I am an extravagant tipper. (Most from the service industry are). Mistakes don't phase me. Things taking extra time don't phase me. What WOULD phase me is someone who is supposed to be providing me a service trying hard to bully me out of my cabin.

And please, let's do revisit the notion of 'tipping'. A tip is NOT required. (although we ALL know that those who work for tips make lower wages, let's please don't ever forget that). Tipping is for SERVICE given. Keep me moderately happy and I'll tip you as if you delivered my child. Treat me as if I'm bothering you, or hindering you in your SERVICE job by requesting that you do for me what you are supposed to, and I probably won't.

Thanks Justein. I do feel the OP has been treated unfairly and was justifiably angry. He stated in a second post that he lowered the steward's tips by $15- not all the steward's tips. Now perhaps, he should have lowered the tips by $5, (what I would have chosen) but that was his prerogative. He wanted to make a point that he did not like his bed sheets being changed at 6 am. I would not liked that either. I may get up early and get coffee also, but I do want to go back to my room, relax, sit on the bed and watch TV a bit before I finish my last minute packing and go to breakfast. If the bed was changed, I would also feel I should not sit on the bed, out of consideration for the next passengers who would stay in the room.

I did like HAL allowing us to stay in the room, and when after 8 am our bed was changed when we returned from breakfast, we were not bothered, we simply sat on the settee and our daughter who was with us, went out and sat on the balcony, while we waited to debark. That did not bother us-because 8 am was a reasonable time to be denied sitting on the bed, and we were debarking at 8:30 am.

I do think some people on these boards are too quick to jump to conclusions. Even with my long winded posts, I have often found if I left out one minute point when discussing a situation I had, someone will jump in and accuse me of things, simply becuase I failed to give that information. That is sad. Why do people always want to believe the worst?

Yes, perhaps we need more facts-but why not ask the OP if he completely removed the steward's tips-if he said yes-then lay into him.

[momofmeg]

LOL Zappa fan

Blowhards with a keyboard is often appropriate on a forum!

We've only ever cruised Carnival. With the kids, they really love it, so we've stayed with it. My husband and I intend to hit the other cruise lines for comparison sake (oh, the horror, more cruising) and HAL is on my list. :)

I want to apologize. I thought your name was "Justin" and your name was spelled a little different. I see now you are a woman named Jen. I thought that "j" was an "i"-sorry!

[gkny]

I gave my cabin steward an extra $20 for the first week on a back to back cruise. It might not have been enough for him. During the second week he wasn't as pleasant to my wife and I. That is my only complaint because we were always nice to him and the staff.

[justjen321]

I want to apologize. I thought your name was "Justin" and your name was spelled a little different. I see now you are a woman named Jen. I thought that "j" was an "i"-sorry!

Don't worry about it. :) I knew who you meant.

You know, in puzzling out why this thread has gone the way it has, I've got a few ideas.

1. People feel safe behind a keyboard, and say things they wouldn't normally say. That's the way of the internet, and certainly the way of forums of any type. It's often a way to feel more important, or for those who are very meek in their day to day lives, a way to feel as if they've some power for once.

2. (And I think this one comes into play here in a big way) When given a situation (like the OPs) we often prescribe our OWN feelings and reactions to the person. I think the word 'anger' is what triggered it here. The posters who are blasting the OP for his 'irrational anger' (Their words, NOT the OPs) are using the word in their OWN context. Perhaps when they get 'angry', that's how they handle it. Perhaps the concept of an adult who is angry and yet fully capable of handling a situation calmly is foreign.

It's important, anytime we are reading the written word, to understand that we all use words differently, and that it's RARE to get a complete picture of a situation through a post. You always only get one side of the story, and you will always miss the nuances that come with face to face human interaction. The semantics of words also come into play. We have all prescribed particular meaning to the words we use, and we hear through those filters. That's how life works.

Had someone walked out into the hall to see the OP having a quiet conversation with the steward, they wouldn't be on the bandwagon they are now. But because they didn't, and because of the completely unreliable translation of the written word, here we are. :)

Not that I ever have anything against healthy debate.

[babyher]

Superdee

I would love to have you and your DW as tablemates. You sound like great people.

My DW is the same way . She is a wonderful person, and will do anything for anyone, has a heart as big as the sky, is the greatest mother in the world (after my own:))

Just don't deliberately piss her off *LOL*

We both can't stand bullies (and that is what people who abuse service workers are) but my wife just goes for the jugular with these fools.

[PatsyAnne]

On the Westerdam 2 years ago there was this miserable old lady that never read the menu right and called the waiter over and said she never ordered her sandwich with the sauce. He said he would get her another one plain right away and she said she didn't have time. I thought this odd being a sea day and knowing what I know now I would have felt blessed if she had to hurry to jump overboard. The kid no sooner got 10 paces away and was "Waiter! Waiter hey Stupid!!!" . That did it for my wife. She was all over that miserable bitch like a pack of wild dogs on a three legged cat. She went and got the menu and pointed out the old bitch's mistake and demanded she apologize. My wife is Native Indian and has been subject to racism and abuse and there is no way anybody gets away with crap like that around her. I know why I am proud of her because she stands up for her belief's and doesn't let anybody bully others. We both treat all our waiters,cabin stewards and everybody as equals. Hell she is a factory worker and I work in a machine shop so on the social scale we're nothing special. If a mistake is made and it sometimes happens it is only a mistake until it is corrected. I know for a fact that if the worst thing that ever happened to me was to get a Pastrami sandwich with Dijon /Mayo on it then life's been mighty good. I cannot believe how rude some people are to these great employees. HAL has the best bar none.
One of Dave Barry's rules of life:
"A person who is nice to you, but rude to the waiter, is not a nice person. (This is very important. Pay attention. It never fails.) "

[Cruising-along]

One of Dave Barry's rules of life:
"A person who is nice to you, but rude to the waiter, is not a nice person. (This is very important. Pay attention. It never fails.) "


SO true!!

[sparky-elpaso]

On the Westerdam 2 years ago there was this miserable old lady that never read the menu right and called the waiter over and said she never ordered her sandwich with the sauce. He said he would get her another one plain right away and she said she didn't have time. I thought this odd being a sea day and knowing what I know now I would have felt blessed if she had to hurry to jump overboard. The kid no sooner got 10 paces away and was "Waiter! Waiter hey Stupid!!!" . That did it for my wife. She was all over that miserable bitch like a pack of wild dogs on a three legged cat. She went and got the menu and pointed out the old bitch's mistake and demanded she apologize. My wife is Native Indian and has been subject to racism and abuse and there is no way anybody gets away with crap like that around her. I know why I am proud of her because she stands up for her belief's and doesn't let anybody bully others. We both treat all our waiters,cabin stewards and everybody as equals. Hell she is a factory worker and I work in a machine shop so on the social scale we're nothing special. If a mistake is made and it sometimes happens it is only a mistake until it is corrected. I know for a fact that if the worst thing that ever happened to me was to get a Pastrami sandwich with Dijon /Mayo on it then life's been mighty good. I cannot believe how rude some people are to these great employees. HAL has the best bar none.

"Class" has nothing to do with jobs, income or anything else. And you have class.

[momofmeg]

Don't worry about it. :) I knew who you meant.

You know, in puzzling out why this thread has gone the way it has, I've got a few ideas.

1. People feel safe behind a keyboard, and say things they wouldn't normally say. That's the way of the internet, and certainly the way of forums of any type. It's often a way to feel more important, or for those who are very meek in their day to day lives, a way to feel as if they've some power for once.

2. (And I think this one comes into play here in a big way) When given a situation (like the OPs) we often prescribe our OWN feelings and reactions to the person. I think the word 'anger' is what triggered it here. The posters who are blasting the OP for his 'irrational anger' (Their words, NOT the OPs) are using the word in their OWN context. Perhaps when they get 'angry', that's how they handle it. Perhaps the concept of an adult who is angry and yet fully capable of handling a situation calmly is foreign.

It's important, anytime we are reading the written word, to understand that we all use words differently, and that it's RARE to get a complete picture of a situation through a post. You always only get one side of the story, and you will always miss the nuances that come with face to face human interaction. The semantics of words also come into play. We have all prescribed particular meaning to the words we use, and we hear through those filters. That's how life works.

Had someone walked out into the hall to see the OP having a quiet conversation with the steward, they wouldn't be on the bandwagon they are now. But because they didn't, and because of the completely unreliable translation of the written word, here we are. :)

Not that I ever have anything against healthy debate.

LOL! I not only got your name wrong, I posted on the WRONG thread. I thought I was posting on the thread where the man was justifiably angry about his bed sheets being changed while he was out of his room at 6 am to pick up coffee, on debarkation day.

I HAVE seen people be rude to the crew, fortunately, not as bad as these stories, and I am not saying they are untrue, because I have seen similar terrible scenes in restaurants and stores. ( Twice, the person was escorted OFF the premises by management) It saddens me that this would happen on cruise ships-and as severe as some of these have been reported, I do think the cruise line should bann such people, if they were that extreme, and these stories were not exaggerated. I hope I never experience such a scene, because I am afraid I also would have to stand up for the poor crew member-so if I ever go missing on a ship-please know I did not jump-I probably put my nose into something like this. (bad joke, I know, as this is not funny)

Now the worst I have seen on a ship, was an elderly woman at breakfast on Caribbean Princess. She wanted a table by the window- the waiter told her that all the tables by the window were full in the area being used-so she proceeded to an area not being used and plopped herself down, looking daggers at him defying him to object. He did not object, he simply went over and took her order for breakfast-and there she sat by herself for the whole meal, as that area was not opened up while I was there. Perhaps it was good no one sat with her. I am sure she would have been a "pill" to deal with, one of those that would complain about everything and make you feel miserable. The waiters were still very kind to her, they went out of their way, LITERALLY, to fill her coffee, water, and juice glasses, and to offer her pastries.

I am starting to get a little age on me. I HOPE I never turn into such an unkind, bitter, person, but I suppose it is possible. I pray I don't. Anyway, that is the worst situation I have seen and I felt that was bad enough.

[IRL_Joanie]

I've seen this as well, even in late seating (where there shouldn't be a small child.) The kid was a danger to himself and the waiters as every night, throughout dinner, they had to be aware where the little brat was so they wouldn't trip over them, fall and/or drop their trays. It was disruptive to everyone in that area of the dining room who were just trying to enjoy their dinner. IMHO, we have rights too, and that includes not being subjected to a bratty, screaming kid. Parents who allow their children to do that should be removed from the dining room and asked to eat in the buffet.


I disagree with you!!!

I think they should have been restricted to dining via room service instead of any open dining on the ship.

If the child misbehaved in the dining room why would the parents have not allowed the same or worse in the more relaxed atmosphere of the Lido??

Joanie

[babyher]

LOL! I not only got your name wrong, I posted on the WRONG thread. I thought I was posting on the thread where the man was justifiably angry about his bed sheets being changed while he was out of his room at 6 am to pick up coffee, on debarkation day.

I HAVE seen people be rude to the crew, fortunately, not as bad as these stories, and I am not saying they are untrue, because I have seen similar terrible scenes in restaurants and stores. ( Twice, the person was escorted OFF the premises by management) It saddens me that this would happen on cruise ships-and as severe as some of these have been reported, I do think the cruise line should bann such people, if they were that extreme, and these stories were not exaggerated. I hope I never experience such a scene, because I am afraid I also would have to stand up for the poor crew member-so if I ever go missing on a ship-please know I did not jump-I probably put my nose into something like this. (bad joke, I know, as this is not funny)

Now the worst I have seen on a ship, was an elderly woman at breakfast on Caribbean Princess. She wanted a table by the window- the waiter told her that all the tables by the window were full in the area being used-so she proceeded to an area not being used and plopped herself down, looking daggers at him defying him to object. He did not object, he simply went over and took her order for breakfast-and there she sat by herself for the whole meal, as that area was not opened up while I was there. Perhaps it was good no one sat with her. I am sure she would have been a "pill" to deal with, one of those that would complain about everything and make you feel miserable. The waiters were still very kind to her, they went out of their way, LITERALLY, to fill her coffee, water, and juice glasses, and to offer her pastries.

I am starting to get a little age on me. I HOPE I never turn into such an unkind, bitter, person, but I suppose it is possible. I pray I don't. Anyway, that is the worst situation I have seen and I felt that was bad enough.



You notice a good amount of these "Pills" are alone?

I don't think it is by coincidence *LOL*

Either that or they have some poor whipped puppy of a spouse alongside who has been worn down by all the years with them. They either just stand there and say nothing or nod in agreement with them.

[room010]

What IS it about cranky old ladies on cruises :confused:

[COLLEYBERRY]

[quote=momofmeg;22057584]LOL! I not only got your name wrong, I posted on the WRONG thread.

Hi momofmeg, don't feel bad :)
.I am the OP of this thread, the two threads seem to have morphed into one another and taken on lives of their own.:D

[IRL_Joanie]

[quote=momofmeg;22057584]LOL! I not only got your name wrong, I posted on the WRONG thread.

Hi momofmeg, don't feel bad :)
.I am the OP of this thread, the two threads seem to have morphed into one another and taken on lives of their own.:D

Sorry about that COLLIEBERRY! I am the Bad Bad person who morphed them. I just thought the subjects fit so well together.

Joanie

[COLLEYBERRY]

[quote=COLLEYBERRY;22062239]

Sorry about that COLLIEBERRY! I am the Bad Bad person who morphed them. I just thought the subjects fit so well together.

Joanie

No harm Joanie, clearly they do .... I to was getting confused as to which was which:D

[Nancyquilts]

What IS it about cranky old ladies on cruises :confused:
Hmmm. Must be a comment from a young man to be so biased.;)

[room010]

Hmmm. Must be a comment from a young man to be so biased.;)

You could not possibly be further from the truth! :D

[babyher]

Hmmm. Must be a comment from a young man to be so biased.;)


Possibly the son of a cranky old lady , who knows where of he speaks :)

[MrsCruiseBabe]

I was on the Zuiderdam and we went to the meet and greet, we met some nice folks but this one couple was just looking for anything to be wrong. They were nasty to the staff at the meet and greet saying the OJ was warm, then when the staff got them some cold fresh OJ they didn't drink it. We never saw them on the cruise again untill the desert buffet, the DH at the top of his lungs yelling about how the line was working..........it was over the top. Then they both got two lagre plates with every kind of goodie, my bad luck had us sitting near them as they complained " the cake was to sweet, the ice cream was melting, why didn't they have this that or the other thing " . Wow I must just be easy to please I thought the staff was great, the ship was so clean and nice, our room guy was even funny singing songs while he worked asking if we had ice for our bucket. The band did the songs we asked for even doing a modern rap tune for the kids..........not my choice!!! but they did it for the kids making them happy. How can you spend all that HARD earned money for a trip/vacation to just find the BAD things. LIFE IS SHORT LOOK FOR THE GOOD AND THE GOOD WILL FIND YOU ;-}

[IRL_Joanie]

On the Westerdam 2 years ago there was this miserable old lady that never read the menu right and called the waiter over and said she never ordered her sandwich with the sauce. He said he would get her another one plain right away and she said she didn't have time. I thought this odd being a sea day and knowing what I know now I would have felt blessed if she had to hurry to jump overboard. The kid no sooner got 10 paces away and was "Waiter! Waiter hey Stupid!!!" . That did it for my wife. She was all over that miserable bitch like a pack of wild dogs on a three legged cat. She went and got the menu and pointed out the old bitch's mistake and demanded she apologize. My wife is Native Indian and has been subject to racism and abuse and there is no way anybody gets away with crap like that around her. I know why I am proud of her because she stands up for her belief's and doesn't let anybody bully others. We both treat all our waiters,cabin stewards and everybody as equals. Hell she is a factory worker and I work in a machine shop so on the social scale we're nothing special. If a mistake is made and it sometimes happens it is only a mistake until it is corrected. I know for a fact that if the worst thing that ever happened to me was to get a Pastrami sandwich with Dijon /Mayo on it then life's been mighty good. I cannot believe how rude some people are to these great employees. HAL has the best bar none.


I REALLY LIKE YOUR WIFE!!!

I would have done the exact same thing as your wife!!

I've been a Waitress in various classes of restaurants, from fast food to a 3 star restaurant, and the crap we had to put up with can be so abusive!!

I've owned my own business and had to deal with crappy customers there also. It aint pleasant when you've only followed the customers directions and orders and still be demeaned verbally. And all you can do is to take it at that moment. Luckily for me, as the business owner, I could remove them from my client list and not have to deal with them again. But the poor hapless individual who was not so fortunate as I may have to (and often does) put up with the loutish person or others just like him/her over and over again.:(

I appreciate your wide standing up to the B***H as she did and hope you will pass on to her my Thanks!!

And let me add that job description/type does not make you a classy person. You can be the President of the world and still be a low life scum bag. You and your wife are TOP Class in my book!!

Joanie

[Nancyquilts]

Possibly the son of a cranky old lady , who knows where of he speaks :)
You may be quite right. We never know what our children really think of us. ;)

[momofmeg]

What IS it about cranky old ladies on cruises :confused:

LOL! I don't know. I just hope I don't turn into one some day.

[mimigirl54]

I know what you are saying.

I am a 9-1-1 dispatcher and when someone is faced with a true life or death emergency they are not always in their right mind and yes can be rather irate. I can certainly understand that and don't pay it no mind. I just thank God I am not in their shoes and hope that I can be of help.

Of course we have the regulars that call for every little piddiling thing and expect us to jump at their command. those people get a "have a nice day" and a dial tone rather fast :)

I have a friend who is a 9-1-1 dispatcher and he tells me horror stories all the time about people who call on Thanksgiving to ask...gasp...how do I cook a turkey!!!!! Wow.

[babyher]

I have a friend who is a 9-1-1 dispatcher and he tells me horror stories all the time about people who call on Thanksgiving to ask...gasp...how do I cook a turkey!!!!! Wow.


Oh I have gotten that and more .

And it is at this time of year as a fire department dispatcher thank I can't thank the inventor of those deep fat turkey fryers enough.

Much of the general public shouldn't be trusted with an Easy Bake oven let alone a large vat of hot oil sitting a top an open flame.

Its right up there with handing a loaded revolver to an infant ...... Oh wait I have had that call too

[Mary Ellen]

On our recent cruise DH, I, and Ruth witnessed two (beyond) cranky old men berate a member of the cruise director's staff - because they couldn't have the number of members on their trivia team that they wanted. Both became red in the face and one started shaking so much we thought he might be having a seizure. They were so bad we were thinking that security might need to be called. We gave her our cabin numbers (as did others who witnessed this) if they complained and she needed support. That evening the Hotel Manager stopped by to chat with Ruth, as he often did while we had our pre-dinner drinks. She took the opportunity to compliment the staff member (by name) on her professional manner in dealing with these two idiots.