Bishops screen priests for cruises

[Hondu]

PORT EVERGLADES, Fla. - The U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops has started screening priests who celebrate Mass aboard cruise ships to prevent unqualified clergy from ministering to Catholic passengers.

The bishops have approved more than 650 priests to work on cruise lines in a process designed to weed out unsuitable candidates such as clergy who were suspended in the church's sex abuse scandal or those who have left the priesthood.

Priests who apply for the program, which started a year ago, must have their bishops' approval and are subject to yearly review. All dioceses conduct their own background checks on priests, said Doreen Badeaux, secretary general of the Apostleship of the Sea, a Catholic ministry devoted to seafarers.

Celebrity and Holland America lines are working with priests approved by the Apostleship, while other cruise lines continue hiring clergy privately or using agencies such as Rent-A-Priest, a group that provides former, now-married priests who are no longer authorized to conduct Mass.

Eventually, the bishops hope all cruise lines will adopt a more thorough screening process for clergy.

"It wasn't being regulated by the bishops' conference and they weren't doing background checks on these guys," said the Rev. Sinclair Oubre, president of the AOS-USA, a chaplains' organization affiliated with the Apostleship of the Sea. "Since we started this, some of the cruise lines have become more alert."

Lee Breyer left the priesthood when he married a former nun in 1969, yet has been conducting Mass on cruise ships with Rent-A-Priest since 2002. He does not announce to Mass attendees that he's married.

"By mentioning it upfront, it can come across as a confrontational issue between me and the Catholic Church," Breyer told The Miami Herald.

Catholic leaders believe that's deceptive.

"For them to represent themselves as being connected with the Catholic Church in this country would be disingenuous at best," said Mary Ann Walsh, a spokeswoman for the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops. "They have left the ministerial priesthood, so they should not be ministering."

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050117/ap_on_re_us/cruise_ships_clergy

[Himself]

I happen to be one of the priests who has been known to act as a Cruise Ship Priest. All of us--Catholic Priest in the United States--were notified that we would have to be registered with AOS USA to act on the cruise ships.
There is a membership fee and every year we have to get a letter from our Bishop saying that we are in good standing and have his permission to act as Cruise ship Chaplain.
Last year as soon as I signed on and paid my dues Celebrety Contacted me by e-mail but as of this date I still do them only with Holland America.

I have been writing on these threads for a number of years and while I knew two people knew I was a priest, I did not know others knew it. Last November a lady came up to me and said "Father, you are HIMSELF." She told me there were a group of posters on the cruise and invited me to have a drink with them but I didn't know where they were meeting and so it never happened.
Himself

[Sage]

Hondu, thank you for the most interesting article. We always attend Mass while aboard, and I would have never thought to question if the Priest were in good standing with the Church. I'm glad that HAL cares enough to provide us with Priest in good standing.

Himself, thank you and Bless You.

[grannynurse]

My friend just returned from a Hawaii cruise on the island Princess where there was an incident with a priest who got unruly and hit some kids. I don't know all the details, except that he was put off at the next port.
GN

[Himself]

At the time I started doing Chaplaincies for HAL I had to supply the guest Chaplain Recruiters with a Celebrat stating that I was a priest in good standing. I would doubt any x-priest, laiczed priest, or any other priest not in good standing could have served on a Holland America Ship. I don't know what line would let a priest on from "Rent-a-priest dot com" but I am sure it was not HAL.

As for the incident on Princess. I wonder if that priest was a PAX who happened to offer Mass. It is my understanding that Princess does not take guest Chaplains but if a priest is a passenger they will ask him to offer Mass. Holland America, on the Other hand, (and Celebrity) bring along guest Chaplains who Offer Mass every day, visit the sick, hear confessions and do other priestly duties.
Himself

[tomc]

This is from a thread on the CC Princess board. I'm quoting it here in good faith that this is allowed. If not, Host Walt or Host Doug can remove it.

Hi Nora:

I was the second or third night of the cruise, about 10:30 pm. The DJ was there in the "Off Limits" teen room and the music was turned up quite loud. Hey - they're teenagers and this was a supervised activity! Anyhow, out of nowhere this older man storms in there in a rage and SCREAMS at the kids that he's sick and tired of this music and he' GOING to get some sleep tonight, etc, etc, etc... This guy was cussing and stomping around and the kids were really scared. Jessie said that at first they thought he must be someone's grandpa, 'cause adults aren't allowed in there. Anyway, the counselor, Gosia, that was there along with the DJ, went to try to calm him down and asked him to leave, and the man flung her into the wall. One of the teenage boys attempted to come to Gosia's rescue and he too was flung againt the wall by the enraged man. They got him out of there and locked him out, the kids in. The man then started POUNDING on the walls and SCREAMING at them through the round windows. Security came and they escorted this guy to who knows where.

At first I thought that it was just a rumor that this man was a priest...

Anyhow, through talks with Heidi, she told me that the man would be put off the ship in Hawaii, that everyone was ok, (Gosia is Heidi's roomate on the ship), and that all that were there were ok. This situation was a huge deal - The captain was involved and there'd been several meetings regarding this man. As it turns out, the man never complaind to the Purser's Desk about the noise or to anyone else, either... He just went down there in a rage, accosted a woman and a child and scared the lot of them. The staff had even been considering letting him stay on the ship (probably because he was a priest), but he showed absolutely no remorse. He didn't think he did anything wrong! Can you believe that?

Anyhow, after hearing that this WAS a priest from so many people, I went back and asked Heidi if he really was a priest and she rolled her eyes in dusgust and said yes... It was true. I am still floored at the whole thing. My Jessie is a toughie and she's seen crazy people before, so she chalked it up to another strange experience. I think I was more shocked than she was.

Here's to Princess sending him packing!

* * * * *

Thanks Annie for letting me know what happened. What he did was unexcusable behavior and I am glad that he was asked to leave the ship. That was assualt and battery in my eyes. I am glad to hear that your Jessie was not hurt, but I am sorry she had to witness such a scene. Let's hope your next cruise doesn't have that on the agenda. Nora

* * * * *

Annie:
Ships usually have a few clergy on board for religious services. They get a free ride so they don't get assigned the best locations. Better them than one of us paying full freight. In this case both he and a minister were given accomodations right under the Off Limits area. According to my sources on board, he was an 81 year old retired priest that Princess got off the internet. That is a surprise when one hears about the process they go through for other people on board but I can see how they'd feel they wouldn't need the same kind of detailed checking for a person of the cloth. Who knows if he had other problems too? The minister put up with it.

Supposedly the assistant manager from the casino was doing security - a little woman. The story went that when she confronted him, he put his hands around her neck, slammed her into a wall and said something like "Woman, you will listen to me".

The story goes on that he was still going to be allowed to say midnight mass but refused. And it isn't clear as to whether getting off at Hilo was his idea or the cruise lines. Some people thought that if they were going to put a priest off the ship, they should also put some of those families off too. But that would entail confronting a paying passenger - something chicken Princess was probably reluctant to do.

BTW, our waiter told us that they have the same problem every year with the Mexican families. It is not the same families, just different affluent ones that lead a pretty pampered life and are quite demanding on board.

* * * * *

So Frank, I am assuming then, that this man threw another woman against the wall, the casino assistant supervisor, after he was locked out of "Off Limits". Wow - What a monster.

From what Heidi had to say, I feel like it was the cruise line's decision to send him off in Hilo. She was very adamant that he felt no remorse... Said it was the cruise line's decision. But who knows? Anyhow, I feel that it was in the best interest of the crusie line and the passengers on board to get him out of there. No way would I want this guy wandering around with all of those unsupervised TINY LITTLE children around. Who knows what other things this guy was capable of doing.

I think that we tend to automatically feel safe and secure once on board a cruise ship, what with all the passenger screening, post 9/11 security measures, those no-fly lists and extra bag checks we all endure. Unfortunately, if someone's not a fellon and can obtain a passport, one is free to roam the world. Princess screwed up by not doing their own background check on him... Something they can do for a very small fee through a private company if they don't want to do it themselves. I can only hope that Princess learned a lesson from this situation and will do a better job in their hiring practices in the future. I want my daughter to be safe. Period. Hell - I want to be safe. Frank, I want you and your family to be safe.

Yikes.

Annie

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=121217

[JDee]

tomc, Thanks for taking time for the posting......Could it have been too much sacramental wine??http://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon10.gif This could very well be the excuse the cruise lines need to prohibit bringing the stuff on board....http://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[RevNeal]

Thanks, tomc ... that's a sobering account and it embarrasses me to read that it happened.

Regarding Protestant clergy, HAL uses Helen Kelly Lectures International to contract with clergy. Helen Kelly vets each chaplain candidate, requiring a current resume with references and an endorsement letter from denominational superiors (i.e., one's Bishop) or from one's Church Board (as is the case for those clergy coming from denominations without an eccleasial structure beyond the local church).

We are considered part of the ships "entertainment." :D

[Ziggy7]

This is from a thread on the CC Princess board. I'm quoting it here in good faith that this is allowed. If not, Host Walt or Host Doug can remove it.



http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=121217whew glad it wasnt the RevNeal! just kidding everyone! I know he would never do that :)

[RevNeal]

hardy-har-har.

I'm not a catholic priest, so it couldn't have been me. :D ;) United Methodists don't use wine in Holy Communion. :(

[LAFFNVEGAS]

hardy-har-har.

:D ;) United Methodists don't use wine in Holy Communion. :(

Yupe, I grew up on Good Ole Welch's and Paper tasting Wafers:p for Sunday Communion:D

[Himself]

Tomc: Thanks for filling us in. It is my understanding that Princess does not take priests as chaplains. If they have started, this guy might make them rethink it. Teens can be loud. I was once a teen and was probably loud and not so nice.

Rev Neal:

You were embarrassed. How do you think I feel? EMBARASSED

Himself

[Himself]

As of Last Week the ONLY cruise lines that require the Catholic Chaplains to be a part of AOS USA are Holland America and Celebrity. And I am sure both of these lines would suspend a priest who got the way the guy did on the Princess Cruise.

By the way, I get a crew cabin and I never have trouble getting to sleep

Himself

[RevNeal]

Yupe, I grew up on Good Ole Welch's and Paper tasting Wafers for Sunday Communion

Most UMCs I've served have long ago given up the awful wafers in favor of real bread, and the shot glasses for a common cup and communion by intinction (i.e., one is "given a piece of bread and invited to dip it into the cup, and thereby receive both elements of our Lord's most precious Body and Blood together").

[RevNeal]

Himself, I know ... I know. Thankfully, jerks like that are rare.

[tomc]

Pax: "I'm going to take a cruise but I want to make sure there is an authorized priest on it. How can I know this?"

TA: "Go to HAL."

Pax: "Pardon me? I asked you a civil question. Where are they?"

TA: "Where? In HAL."

Pax: "That's right; where in hell are they?"

TA: "They're in HAL, just as I told you. Go to HAL and you'll find all the authorized priests you want."

Pax: "Are you some sort of Catholic-hating Protestant?"

TA: "If it's any of your business, I'm Catholic and my priest has spent a lot of time in HAL. You'll love it there; it's your kind of place."

Pax: "You must think you're some kind of funny, saying all the Catholic priests are in hell and it's my kind of place."

TA: "Take it easy; take it easy. Once you've tried HAL you'll see why so many people would stay there forever."

Pax: "No, thanks; I'm looking forward to Ecstacy."

TA: "I can book you there, too, but there aren't any priests."

[dakrewser]

TA: "I can book you there, too, but there aren't any priests."

Very good, Tom - you've still got the touch, no matter what they say! :rolleyes:

-dave

[Himself]

Do you lay awake at night trying to come up with these touches of humor?
That last little dialogue you put together between a PAX and a TA was outstanding.

Himself

[cruzincurt]

I think it's a shame that people who can't go for seven days without having a spiritual advisor along get shortchanged with "rent-a-priests". Perhaps the ship could play a "mass-on-tape" like they do here on the cable channel, then at least it would be a real priest.

[Himself]

Catholics are bound to attend Mass on Sundays and certain Solemnities.
One of the "selling points" of HAL among Catholics and Protestants is that HAL has Church services for both on Sunday. I am not sure why the Confernece got involved. As I say, the priest has to supply a letter from the ordinary to the recruiter saying that he is a priest in good standing. I don't think HAL ever got a "rent a priest." FYI: A "rent a priest" is from a website by that name. It is made up of x-priests who left to get married and want to "have their cake and eat it at the same time."

Himself

[General Max]

Who screens the bishops that are supposed to screen the priests? And some of the bishops still need to be screened.

Cheers

General Max

[cruzincurt]

Being a "catholic" in my past, I think they spend too much time with "rules" and miss the big picture.

I don't understand how attending mass at 6:00pm on Saturday substitutes for going to mass on Sunday?? What kind of rule is that? Such convenience and sacrifice; either you have to go to mass on Sunday or you don't.

Also, you can get dispensation for missing a Sunday mass.

[Host Walt]

Please keep to the topic; that is placement of religious staff on ships.

Cruise Critic is not an appropriate forum to discuss religion and theologic dictum.

Thanks.

[Himself]

Walt:

Good point and well taken. Very often if there is not a minister on the ship, I must also do the Protestant service on Sunday and I find these people most appreciative of the time I take to pray with them and give them a good sermon. I have also found that the Catholics appreciate the fact they have daily Mass. When on the ship I try to be friendly, outgoing and helpful to all.
I also take time out each day to check the infirmary to see if any one is sick and in need of a pastoral visit. I find the passengers and crew appreciate this very much.
Best Wishes always,
Himself

[KAKcruiser]

I think the story of the misbehaving Priest on Princess was probably highly unusual. Since he was 81, it is entirely possible that he was having emotional problems that often comes with old age. This is not the behavior of a rational person -- Priest or not.

[Himself]

I hope I am not that way when I am 81--which is in another 16 years.
Himself

[KAKcruiser]

I didn't mean to imply that everyone has emotional problems when they reach 81, only a certain number of people. But, it could explain his behavior.