Veendam Norwalk Virus

[oldarthur]

We are about to take a cruise on the Veendam and have heard that there is a lot of virus on board. Any news on the last cruise? We depart Feb 26 from Tampa.

[RuthC]

Scroll down the page and you should find a couple of threads with reports from recent Veendam cruisers.

The consensus is that the problem has been dealt with successfully.

[sail7seas]

Veendam had super-sanitizing cleaning and is in very good shape now.

[trubey]

Veendam had super-sanitizing cleaning and is in very good shape now.

I just read quite a few pages on norovirus and other unhappy things, (e.coli O157:H7, for instance) from the US Government CDC sites and a few 5 year studies by universities.

There are expected to be 23 million cases of a stomach bug in the US each year, and 50% are Norovirus. Of those 23 million, roughly 10% are from "vacations or cruise ships".

Though they cite there is a risk from surface contact and hand-to-hand contact as secondary transmission, over 50% of the reported cases are from food handling, primarily through contact with fecal material or vomitus from infected persons. The virus can remain active for as long as 5 days after symptoms disappear. Humans are the only known host.

This is a NASTY bug -- it can infect with as few as TEN viral spheroids!

They suggest paid quarantine for infected food handlers (so they don't come to work just for a paycheck) and stringent-- VERY stringent -- observation of personal cleanliness both for passengers and foodhandlers (and everybody else); and increased use of utensils and gloves in food service, in buffets especially.

Unfortunately norovirus is somewhat resistant to chlorine and even the alcohol wipes; so their best advice is WASH YOUR HANDS IN HOT WATER FOR A MINIMUM OF 20 SECONDS, THEN RINSE IN HOT WATER FOR A MINIMUM OF 20 SECONDS.

We'll all be healthy and love our cruises, I hope. :)

Lane

[nevis92]

The Veendam is sick again:

Check out this link:

http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/surv/outbreak/2005/update_march11veendam.htm

[sail7seas]

Yes.....they had the ship totally clean of it and some 'arriving passengers' brought it back aboard. It is on alot of ships/hotels/dormitories/schools and nursing homes etc Second most contagiuous disease we catch. Second only to the common cold.

Wash your hands, wash your hands, wash your hands and if you do get it, REMAIN IN QUARANTINE AS REQUIRED. That is the only way people will stop spreading it.

[arzz]

I teach in a large high school and all I can say is that this year the viruses in general, and stomach viruses specifically, have been and are present everywhere. My classes have been running 10-20% absent for over a week now. With those stats out there it seems to me to be almost impossible to keep it from getting on board.

We must all be vigilant for ourselves.

[sail7seas]

My two high school age nieces both came home from school suffering from NLV. There has been alot of it in our area this winter.

[nevis92]

It's easy to put a positive spin on this if you are not the one who has spent thousands of dollars for a dream vacation that you've been saving for and anticipating for months or even years. Then you find out the ship you are about to board for a week had an outbreak with 7% of the passengers ill and not allowed to leave their cabins. Call me picky, but given the choice, I'll stay home. As of this posting, HAL is NOT giving passengers an option to cancel without losing the entire cost of the cruise. The passengers on the 3/5-3/12 sailing were informed and given the option to cancel for a full refund before they boarded so it was serious enough to alert passengers. I'll be interested to hear what happens on the sailing going on right now. But one thing is for sure, I am not putting my wife and two small children on that ship if given the choice.

Sail7Seas, you said it is common this time of year with all the flu going around but how come I don't hear or read about any other HAL ship? Look at the CDC website and see how many times there have been outbreaks on the Veendam in the last 6 months. There is obviously a problem unique to that ship and they can't seem to solve it.

[ron46936]

Maybe a recent returnee can let us know whether HAL has yet started using hand sanitizing stations at the buffet lines. NCL has been doing it for some time and now Celebrity is also doing it. It is a cheap method of really helping to cut down on spreading infections. You can clean the ship to within an inch of its life but the first passenger with a "bug" on his hands can pass it along to many passengers the first time thru a buffet. The sanitizers used by X and NCL use a photocell to detect your hand and dispense a small amount of disinfecting lotion. It's somewhat similar to Purel. It's pleasant to use. They have these stations at the start of each buffet line and the attendants encourage use before they hand you a tray.

I was so impressed that I did some research and the stations only cost $200. Even enough to cover every line would certainly be money well spent to prevent even a small outbreak.

They did have a hand sanitizer aboard the Noordam but it was only used on the gangway. That's not the place most germs are "shared."

[nevis92]

I was made aware of the outbreak on the Veendam through a friend who was on the sailing that the CDC references. Her husband was one of the unfotunate ones who was forced to remain in his cabin for the duration of the cruise and was not allowed off the ship at the port stops. Yes, there were and are always hand sanitizing stations at buffet lines and around the ship. The ship also started the week in a high alert mode because of illnesses the prior week. No salt/pepper shakers at the table, no captain's cocktail party, no shaking hands, etc., yet 88 passengers and 6 crew still became ill.


I called HAL last night when I read the CDC report dated 3/14/05. I talked to a total of 5 different people, reservations, ship services, supervisors, and supervisors OF supervisors. Nobody claimed to know of the outbreak and was not aware of the CDC report until I directed them to it. I was told, "yes sir, I understand your concern about bringing your family onboard the ship this weekend but you will forfeit your entire cruise fare should you choose not to sail with us." Unless they make the determination that there is a risk, no options will be given. Okay, it sails again in 3 days, HAL isn't aware that one of their ships again is in trouble. So they'll make the determination an hour before the cruise when we are ready to board? I tend to be proactive and stay ahead of the problem. I'm either cancelling or having HAL see if they can get me on another ship this Saturday.

[dakrewser]

It's easy to put a positive spin on this if you are not the one who has spent thousands of dollars for a dream vacation that you've been saving for and anticipating for months or even years.

Every time you take a cruise you're taking a chance on norovirus. But a bit of understanding about the virus might help. First, like all viruses, it can't live very long outside of a host. So there's really no call to label one ship as somehow "harboring" the virus. Second, I'm not aware of any outbreak in the past 20 years that's been traced to a ship's crew - but many traceable to passengers. Sometimes it can be traced to port personnel if one port appears to be more susceptible than others (Celebrity's Xpedition comes to mind).

Third, of course, this isn't limited to - nor even most prevelent on - cruise ships. An outbreak here in the Bay Area a couple of weeks ago killed two people at a nursing home. Outbreaks are also common in boarding schools and other places where people from diverse areas and backgrounds come together for a length of time in close quarters. For some reason, the press only seems to pay attention when the outbreak is on a cruise ship.

Go on your cruise, take proper precautions and enjoy. Don't let the scare tactics of people wanting to sell more newspapers spoil your vacation.

[PennyB]

I just returned on Saturday from the Oosterdam and had sanitizing liquid soaps all over the ship. Several in the Lido, in the Casino, outside the Vista Lounge, by the gangway and several ramdon spots to boot! I didn't hear or see any signs of the virus on our cruise (thank goodness!) :)

[Sigtau21]

So they'll make the determination an hour before the cruise when we are ready to board? I tend to be proactive and stay ahead of the problem. I'm either cancelling or having HAL see if they can get me on another ship this Saturday.


They dont want to give you the option of cancelling until you get to thepier because too many people would cancel if they could. If you are at the peir, you are less likely to cancel.

[nevis92]

Just spoke to HAL's PR dept. and was told that this week's sailing has so far reported 35 cases of the illness. He said that IF the ship continues in "red alert" mode and the number of cases grows, there will most likely be the option to cancel made available. The problem is that won't be made available until Friday or Saturday.

[trubey]

I'm really glad this thread is up!

This is a link to the CDC norovirus fact sheet: I think reading it would be a good idea for anyone taking a cruise, to dispel rumors and familiarize themselves with what this virus is, how it's transmitted, and how to minimize its risk.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dvrd/revb/gastro/norovirus-factsheet.htm

Lane

[~Nereus~]

I was aboard the Veendam Jan 15. When we arrived in Tampa we were handed a letter stating there was an illness onboard and we could opt out of cruising... after flying down, hotel etc... now fly home again..

We were impressed by the procedure to eliminate the outbreak.. but the Veendam outbreak is too repetitive..After all the cleansing.. and it is thorough, the disease is not going away.
We were aboard the Zenith last week... also a sick ship. HAL was more professional and thorough than the procedure in place on the Zenith.

If the NLV was random, than your chance of getting it on any ship should be the same. CDC reports show that this is not the case. Another explanation is not forthcoming but I would not recommend cruising on the Veendam at this time. We are booked for a two week cruise again in Nov. but I have doubts about the ship.

[sail7seas]

It's easy to put a positive spin on this if you are not the one who has spent thousands of dollars for a dream vacation that you've been saving for and anticipating for months or even years. Then you find out the ship you are about to board for a week had an outbreak with 7% of the passengers ill and not allowed to leave their cabins. Call me picky, but given the choice, I'll stay home. As of this posting, HAL is NOT giving passengers an option to cancel without losing the entire cost of the cruise. The passengers on the 3/5-3/12 sailing were informed and given the option to cancel for a full refund before they boarded so it was serious enough to alert passengers. I'll be interested to hear what happens on the sailing going on right now. But one thing is for sure, I am not putting my wife and two small children on that ship if given the choice.

Sail7Seas, you said it is common this time of year with all the flu going around but how come I don't hear or read about any other HAL ship? Look at the CDC website and see how many times there have been outbreaks on the Veendam in the last 6 months. There is obviously a problem unique to that ship and they can't seem to solve it.



I know of what I speak. I do not put a 'spin on it'. I am one of those passengers who spent thousands of dollars for my vacation and became infected with NLV. I know I caught it aboard the ship due to the timing of my first symptoms. We had been out of the hotel we stayed in pre-cruise for 10 days when I became ill; we had not left the ship for days in any port; we had stayed aboard. I know I caught it aboard the ship. SO WHAT!!!! I (and everyone else) can catch it anywhere. I have serious, underlying other health issues and I was free of SERIOUS symptons of NLV in three days. I had lingering symptons for a little longer.

So What!!! It is no one's fault. Except maybe the selfish, inconsiderate boars who originated the virus aboard the ship and as soon as they started to feel a little better thought only of themselves and went out and about on the ship. Had they stayed quarantined as required/requested, NO ONE ELSE WOULD HAVE BEEN EXPOSED.

So....please do not say something like 'it's easy for me to say' unless you know what you are saying.

Princess, Celebrity, Carnival, RCI, you name the cruise line.......they all have had it aboard.

Schools, hotels, dormitories, nursing homes.....they all have outbreaks.

[sail7seas]

Veendam has hand sanitizers everywhere....all over the ship. We used them constantly. We washed our hands constantly. I carry Purell in my purse and we use it often. We have been aboard a number of ships when NLV was present and we never caught it before.

Because, as I said above, I have other health issues, my resistance is lower than some other people. DH did not catch it from me because we are very careful. Not just on a ship...but everywhere. It is so common that we are always aware to always wash often and know the things to avoid doing which 'can trap you'.

"Ship" happens; I caught it. So What!! Am I supposed to blame HAL that some selfish pig didn't care enough about anyone but themselves and spread it around?

Use the hand sanitizers; use care; and if you become infected, it is not the end of the world. Would I want to catch it again on my next cruise? Of course not. But it won't keep me from cruising; or going out to dinner in my neighborhood; or visiting a sick friend in a hospital; or my niece in her dormitory; or an elderly relative in a nursing home.......you get my point.

[sail7seas]

Maybe a recent returnee can let us know whether HAL has yet started using hand sanitizing stations at the buffet lines. NCL has been doing it for some time and now Celebrity is also doing it. It is a cheap method of really helping to cut down on spreading infections. You can clean the ship to within an inch of its life but the first passenger with a "bug" on his hands can pass it along to many passengers the first time thru a buffet. The sanitizers used by X and NCL use a photocell to detect your hand and dispense a small amount of disinfecting lotion. It's somewhat similar to Purel. It's pleasant to use. They have these stations at the start of each buffet line and the attendants encourage use before they hand you a tray.

I was so impressed that I did some research and the stations only cost $200. Even enough to cover every line would certainly be money well spent to prevent even a small outbreak.

They did have a hand sanitizer aboard the Noordam but it was only used on the gangway. That's not the place most germs are "shared."

Veendam has hand sanitizers at 'strategic' points in Lido; on the gangway; in the casino; in the card room; outside the dining room doors; they are everywhere.

[swannie]

This is an interesting thread...as a massage therapist I'm wondering if anyone knows what a ship does as far as the spa is concerned. Do they close it down? After all, as an MT, I have my hands in contact with other people for an average of 25 hours per week. And those on cruise ships can usually double this figure. This would be a good opportunity for me to remind people of another good practice: always shower prior to getting a massage or body treatment. It's not just about whether you might offend your therapist with a little body odor. It's about limiting the chance of spreading bacteria and germs from your skin, to the therapist, and then to other clients. Even with washing our hands before and after every massage, and following good hygiene and sanitation principles, we still need our clients to do their part by coming to the spa as clean as possible. And while I have an audience :-) please, never get a massage when you are sick or contagious. It's hard for us to turn you down in a lot of situations...we lose money, or we might have pressure from those we work for (who would lose money too). Have the common sense to cancel or not schedule if you are coming down with something (or have poison ivy, or warts or athlete's foot or whatever). Your therapist is more than likely to catch it from you, and you could put them out of work for days or weeks, not to mention spread it to other customers.

[sail7seas]

The gym was closed on Veendam when the ship went into Code Red.

[sail7seas]

I was aboard the Veendam Jan 15. When we arrived in Tampa we were handed a letter stating there was an illness onboard and we could opt out of cruising... after flying down, hotel etc... now fly home again..

We were impressed by the procedure to eliminate the outbreak.. but the Veendam outbreak is too repetitive..After all the cleansing.. and it is thorough, the disease is not going away.
We were aboard the Zenith last week... also a sick ship. HAL was more professional and thorough than the procedure in place on the Zenith.

If the NLV was random, than your chance of getting it on any ship should be the same. CDC reports show that this is not the case. Another explanation is not forthcoming but I would not recommend cruising on the Veendam at this time. We are booked for a two week cruise again in Nov. but I have doubts about the ship.


Veendam had several cruises in a row when NLV was present. They finally obliterated it and the ship was virus free. Everything went back to normal.

Then, it was brought aboard again by pax. They spread it (I sure it was not intentional AT FIRST when they may not have even known they were contagious.) BUT, did they remain in quarnatine for the required 72 hours before going out and about. I think probably not and that is how is spread again.

[Adk~Cruiser]

I googled this and could not quite find what I was looking for... I always wondered about having the sanitizers prior to using the buffet. Doesn't that work only if everyone uses it? I mean, let's say the person ahead of me does not - and they are shedding the virus and have ickily not washed their hands... they grab the handles and the tongs, etc... I hand sanitize and then I grab the handles behind them... I've just re-infected my hands, haven't I?? If I had selected a bagel or something that might be eaten with my hands, if I didn't sanitize again prior to eating said item... it seems I'm at risk for exposure regardless because the sanitizer is at the beginning of a long line of objects touched by many hands.

I always wondered if the hand sanitizer lasts a certain amt of time? Otherwise, it always seemed to me the best defense was to have your own bottle and use it right before you are going to eat. Just curious if anyone knows how long the protection from a hand sanitizer lasts.

[nevis92]

So....please do not say something like 'it's easy for me to say' unless you know what you are saying.

Princess, Celebrity, Carnival, RCI, you name the cruise line.......they all have had it aboard.

Schools, hotels, dormitories, nursing homes.....they all have outbreaks.


Anyone that chooses to cruise and is not aware of the risks involved is kidding themselves. HOWEVER, I agree it happens on all ships but you cannot deny that the Veendam has been problematic. And I do know what I'm saying.......I'm not the only one to consider here, I have my wife and two small children. We all know that kids are less careful than adults when it comes to cleanliness so I'd be minimizing risk onboard a vulnerable ship by not bringing my family onboard.

Anyway, I made my decision and have cancelled our cruise and have made other plans. (Now watch one of us will come down with the flu or something!). For the same reason I don't travel to Mexico on vacation, I don't want to have to be on guard all the time worrying about what I touch or eat. Vacations are about relaxing and that is what I intend to do next week.

[sail7seas]

What a shame you cancelled your cruise. Of course, you must do what you think is right for your family.

I hope you all remain healthy but what an irony it would be if someone got NLV in a hotel you may decide to stay in. Of course, it would be naive to think there is no risk in a hotel or an amusement park, restaurant or such.

Have a great vacation whatever you decide to do.

[BruceMuzz]

One of the biggest mistakes we make is assuming that Norwalk-like Viruses are random. They are not. They live and thrive in environments where a majority of the people present do not wash their hands after using the toilet.
In a study conducted by the CDC in 2004, they found that 79% of Americans do not regularly wash their hands after using the toilet. The only country that scored worse was Mainland China ! (and they don't have soap and running water in most cases).
Older Americans generally do not wash as often or as thoroughly as younger ones. If you want to find a lot of older Americans, Tampa Florida would be a good place to start. Guess what ship sails out of Tampa?

You want to avoid a ship with Norovirus?
Take a cruise on a ship that has no American passsengers - especially older ones.

[sail7seas]

One of the biggest mistakes we make is assuming that Norwalk-like Viruses are random. They are not. They live and thrive in environments where a majority of the people present do not wash their hands after using the toilet.
In a study conducted by the CDC in 2004, they found that 79% of Americans do not regularly wash their hands after using the toilet. The only country that scored worse was Mainland China ! (and they don't have soap and running water in most cases).
Older Americans generally do not wash as often or as thoroughly as younger ones. If you want to find a lot of older Americans, Tampa Florida would be a good place to start. Guess what ship sails out of Tampa?

You want to avoid a ship with Norovirus?
Take a cruise on a ship that has no American passsengers - especially older ones.


With all due respect, ships have sailed from Tampa for years and have remained virus free. There are a slew of hotels in Tampa and no excessive reports of wild bouts of NLV. How do you account for the fact I, who practice excellent hygiene, became infected?

DO NOT for one minute think you will be guaranteed to be 'protected' by carefully washing your hands with hot water for the prescribed length of time (btw.....it is recommended you wash as long as it takes you to sing happy birthday through two times). I am an example of 'the most careful', the most informed re: NLV falling victim.

There is even some speculation that is possibly can be airborne as well.....through sneezing. I do not think there is a definitive answer to that speculation. I have read expects who come down on both sides of that question.

Oh....I forgot to add. I'm not from Tampa and we did not interact (directly) with anyone who is from Tampa. I am sure there were some aboard but the ship wasn't loaded with only seniors from Tampa (who probably would not very much like to hear such a negative opinion about their hygiene. :( ) I must admit I definitely question that theory....but, I guess it's something to think about.

[mechcc]

NEVIS92 - If you are that concerned about exposing yourself and your family, why did you book a cruise in the first place? With all the press about the virus on cruise ships I would think that would be the last place you would want to spend thousands of dollars on when you have underlying medical conditions. Okay, flame me but I have also had the displeasure of being a victim and it was on the last day of the cruise. You take that risk when you book your cruise.

[JDee]

Guess a lot of us seniors from Tampa must have booked a lot of cabins sailing on those Disney ships a year or so ago....

Wonder what the results would be for a Seniors Only cruise on the Veendam?? Lots jello desserts....plenty mashed potatoes....soft meatloaf.....plenty hot oatmeal.....and of course, plenty of prunes.....

All you "kids" just stay away from our beloved retirement heaven......

Happy cruising.....

[Sueseb]

Interestingly, many have recommended Purell or other hand sanitizers. These are anti-bacterial, not anti-viral. Good old soap and hot water is the best deterrent.
On a recent crusie had a situation in which one of our tablemates became ill at the table the first night. As he rushed from the table his wife announced that he had been ill since the day before. Obviously, they did not have enough sense to stay in their cabin. Luckily, none of the rest of us was infected. ( and, they never appeared at the table again)

[sail7seas]

On a recent crusie had a situation in which one of our tablemates became ill at the table the first night. As he rushed from the table his wife announced that he had been ill since the day before. Obviously, they did not have enough sense to stay in their cabin. Luckily, none of the rest of us was infected. ( and, they never appeared at the table again)


That's my point. Selfish, inconsiderate Boars who didn't give a whit about anyone but themselves.

You are correct that Purell is not a protector against NLV but NLV is not the only contagious thing 'out and about' in public. Colds and upper respitory infections etc.........

Purell is better than nothing but nothing is better than soap and hot water.

[cruzermon]

That's my point. Selfish, inconsiderate Boars who didn't give a whit about anyone but themselves.



Let's also put the cruise lines and airlines in this category. I'm sure that if a person called 2 days prior to sailing saying they had some sort of viral infection, the cruise line wouldn't allow them to reschedule without losing their payment, nor would the airline waive the rebooking penalty. Not that I condone the person's behavior, but I understand why they do it.

Given the choice of staying at home and losing a bunch of money, or going on the trip to try to get something out of it, I can see where they would risk going on the cruise to salvage some of their investment.

I can't see the passengers forgoing their trip, nor can I see the cruise line granting them dispensation if they cancel. But, at least in my case, I find that Jack Daniels is a fine anti-viral agent, so caveat sailor.

[sail7seas]

I SO TOTALLY agree with you.


If the cruiselines would say.....thank you for advising us of your contagious illness. We will allow you to reschedule perhaps some of these outbreaks could be avoided.

HOWEVER......we all know that policy would be abused. Mr. Smith, who last minute has some business responsibilities, would say.......what the heck!!! I'll tell them I have NLV.

Most folks would not take insurance....they'd simply conjure up a case of NLV last minute.

I know someone will say....Well, okay, require a doctor's note. That is not hard to arrange for many folks. AND, I have other health issues but saw no need to see a doctor. I knew what I had. I had meds with me if I chose to take them. I DID LET AN APPROPRIATE OFFICER aboard the ship know I was ill so they would be sure to sanitize our cabin when we left the ship.

But, I totally agree that cutting a little slack to a person who will be infecting others and allowing them a refund or right to reschedule could keep the rest of us healthier.

[gaylenhazel]

Nevis, I for one think you made the right decision. We were on the Veendam in Feb. and were at red alert. It made what we hoped to be a "relaxing" time; a time of worry. Not to mention the hot tubs were closed, food service procedures were confusing and anoying, and seeing workmen dressed in spacesuits disinfecting was disturbing! It was good they were doing it, but weird when you are stretched out on a lounge chair and this is going on behind you. You never forget you are on an "infected" ship! If given the choice we would have canceled too. But, we would have lost our money. I hope you and your family have a wonderful vacation where ever you go. Stay well!

[dakrewser]

Let's also put the cruise lines and airlines in this category. I'm sure that if a person called 2 days prior to sailing saying they had some sort of viral infection, the cruise line wouldn't allow them to reschedule without losing their payment, nor would the airline waive the rebooking penalty. Not that I condone the person's behavior, but I understand why they do it.


Sorry, but that's why insurance should be mandatory.

[Nickthedogboy]

The wife and I sail of the Veendam April 2. Has anyone heard anything of outbreaks of NLV on recent Vdam sailings?

[GAYLSIE]

I just returned from a western caribbean cruise on the Veendam out of Tampa. As concerns the virus, I feel the ship has taken extrodinary measures to control this. Upon boarding, the Captain told us that he had denied boarding to a couple of parties that had showed symptoms of the virus. The virus is not on the ship itself, but brought in from passengers who bring it on upon boarding. There are sanitation stations all over the ship, everywhere, including from the time you embark, to where ever you go. including any restaurant, and getting off and on the ship on shore cruises. You must pass your hands under one of these, to sanitize your hands. You see the crew everywhere thru out the day, constantly wiping down bannisters, and hand rails. There is no self service in the buffets. All servers wear gloves, and they serve you.You are not allowed to touch anything. They have even removed all salt and pepper shakers in the main dining room. They will come around with them. On our cruise, starting in 3/12/05, The captain announced on the 2nd day that 4 people had come down with the virus. They were quarantened, and he further announced that after that, no further outbreaks had been reported. We had a really wonderful cruise, as did everyone else we met.

[cruzingqueen]

I know someone who was a crewmember on Veendam during the outbreaks in Jan/Feb this year. She transferred to the Zuiderdam, but when she came there, she was quarantined for 4-5 days even though she had not been sick. To me, that's going a step above by HAL.

[nansi]

We just returned from a trip on Rotterdam Mar.6-16th....no illnesses to our knowledge....sanitizers were everywhere, although we noticed most people just walked past them. I guess you can bring the horse to water but you can't make him drink. Great cruise by the way.
Nancy

[Ryndam2002]

Just wondering how the last couple Veendam cruises went with regard to Norwalk. I realize it is generally thought to be brought aboard by pax, but one crew member with NV who handles food is all it takes to make a ship sick.

[ROZO'SBEAU]

Does anyone out there have info on how the 3/19-3/26 cruise on VEENDAM went?
A neighbor of ours told us some friends of hers were going on that cruise and they were very sick (before the cruise) on 3/18. I wonder if they were intercepted at the pier or if anything spread on the ship.
Beau

[beachjeweler]

Our practice on cruises, particularly during flu season, is to avoid buffets, avoid touching handrails and elevator buttons (no kidding) and wash hands immediately upon returning to the cabin. We carry Purell and use it whenever we feel it is needed. If people would just wash their hands and stay away from public contact when they were ill, this stuff wouldn't spread so rapidly. Just use common sense! If somebody gets ill on day 2 of the cruise they likely caught it someplace other than the ship.

[nevis92]

I do know for a fact that the 3/12-3/19 cruise of the Veendam had 35 ill passengers as of the middle of the week during the cruise. I was told that info directly from a Holland America PR Representative. That was the final straw that made me decide to cancel our 3/19-3/26 cruise on the Veendam. I checked the CDC's website and there has not been an update since the March 15 report. But I will continue to check to see if it was resolved.

We booked a cruise on the MSC Opera two days before departure and everyone stayed healthy and had a great week. They also had hand sanitizing stations throughout the ship but it was annoying to see passengers walk past them without using them.

By the way, having sailed HAL many times, including RCCL and NCL, I was VERY impressed with MSC. Maybe I had low expectations but it was a stunningly beautiful ship and only sailed with 1500 passengers while it can hold 1800-2200 packed. I booked directly with the cruise line two days before departure and they were fantastic. They upgraded us to a suite with balcony and we loved it.

I'll write more on the MSC message board. I'm still a big fan of HAL but the whole Veendam illness fiasco ended up being a great experience because we discovered a new and wonderful cruise line that we'd definitely cruise again.

[~Nereus~]

Our practice on cruises, particularly during flu season, is to avoid buffets, avoid touching handrails and elevator buttons (no kidding) and wash hands immediately upon returning to the cabin. We carry Purell and use it whenever we feel it is needed. If people would just wash their hands and stay away from public contact when they were ill, this stuff wouldn't spread so rapidly. Just use common sense! If somebody gets ill on day 2 of the cruise they likely caught it someplace other than the ship.

At the dinner table, the waiter removes the plate and cutlery from a contagious passenger, gets the fecal matter (the way the NLV spreads) on his hands, gets your order, places your dish, now contaminated by your waiter, you pick up your knife, fork or coffee cup..... and now you will get ill.... despite all your precautions because you don't wash or sanitize between courses...

What I want to know... why does the Veendam continue to be plagued by this virus despite the efforts taken.... and while we were on board we were impressed by how HAL strived to eliminate it..

[whalers4ever]

Obviously in a small community like a ship, you do run a higher risk. But then again, people get staff infections in a hospitals so no one place it truly safe from disease. But sailing for me is worth the risk.

And remember, they do sell Travel Insurance. A cruise is the one trip you should alway buy it for. Can't get you back your time spent being ill but if you do want to not go on the ship at all, you should then get your $ back. 7% isn't that high a number to warrant HAL to cancel a sailing.

Does anybody know what the magic # is? Just curious.

[Tonklily]

We sailed the Veendam from February 26th to March 5th. Yes, they did go into Code Red, however, everyone on the ship did everything that they could to contain the virus. No one in my party of 10 got sick. There were hand sanitizers on the Lido and at the Dining Room entrance. The captain made an announcement every day to "please wash your hands" as much as possible. If everyone would just do that much, the virus would not spread. This virus is not unique to any particular ship or line. Unfortunately, passengers bring it on the ship. Three weeks prior to our cruise, the Veendam replaced all of their linens, towels, etc. which were very new to begin with. I was very impressed with their concern for all of their passengers. Hooray for HAL and the Veendam!

[whalers4ever]

Glad to hear that your party is doing well and didn't get sick.

Hopefully, people will be more cautious on the 5/2 sailing!

[ROZO'SBEAU]

As far as I have been able to determine, no one came down with Noro on either the March 26 or April 2 sailings of Veendamand Code Red was lifted.
Beau

[Nickthedogboy]

We sailed on the Veendam 4/2 - 4/9. 2nd Officer told me at the end of the week that there were three cases aboard early in the week. All three were released from Q after 2 days. Our cruise aboard the Veendam was fantastic and unaffected by NLV.

[Ryndam2002]

We sailed on the Veendam 4/2 - 4/9. 2nd Officer told me at the end of the week that there were three cases aboard early in the week. All three were released from Q after 2 days. Our cruise aboard the Veendam was fantastic and unaffected by NLV.

We were on the 4/2 Veendam sailing also. I heard second-hand that two of those quarantined had become ill after eating "off the ship". I also met one man who had a severe NV-like symptoms for 24 hours early in the cruise but didn't report it as he felt better after a day or so.

There were hand-sanitizing stations everywhere, but it was self-serve at the Lido buffet where I witnessed PAX on several occasions coughing or sneezing directly onto their hands or rubbing their eyes or nose before handling serving utensils AFTER sanitizing their hands at the start of the line. I also witnessed one Lido supervisor (in white uniform) not wash his hands after using the restroom. Some people just don't get it. I'm surprised there isn't MORE Noro on ships than there is!

We also had a great cruise with almost perfect weather after a windy start upon departing Tampa (40-knot winds leaving Tampa Bay). Smooth sailing after that!

[TedC]

If I saw a member of the crew not sanitizing after using the restroom, especially one associated with a dining area, I would immediately report it and also note it on the comment card.

Many of the crew are from cultures that don't always have the hygiene standards that we strive for. I have placed my faith in HAL training its crew members in the importance of sanitizing their hands, especially when dealing with food. Personal hygiene is critically important in the close cruise ship environment!

[KateBobbi]

The Maasdam has not had any outbreaks, and while I was onboard, they had a sanitizor with alcohol in it, everywhere you needed it. The only sickness, was sea sickness! :)