Bringing Alcohol on board???

[Machforce1]

Dave (Dakrewser), I was reading a response you wrote to another first time cruiser which you said it was okay to bring wine on board a Holland America ship. I'm not disputing that at all, but I thought bringing alcohol on board was strictly prohibited on HAL ships? I've heard that you can't get anything on board without having it confiscated. Have they changed the rules or am I confused? HAL sent us a bunch of pre-cruise literature and I could have swore that I read alcohol could not be brought aboard. :confused:

[jcrandle]

Dave (Dakrewser), I was reading a response you wrote to another first time cruiser which you said it was okay to bring wine on board a Holland America ship. I'm not disputing that at all, but I thought bringing alcohol on board was strictly prohibited on HAL ships? I've heard that you can't get anything on board without having it confiscated. Have they changed the rules or am I confused? HAL sent us a bunch of pre-cruise literature and I could have swore that I read alcohol could not be brought aboard. :confused:I'm not Dave but perhaps you should reread their policy, this time with both eyes open. It can be found at http://www.hollandamerica.com/guests/category.do?category=obpolicies&topic=alcohol

[TinaLee]

I'm sure what Jim meant (in the kindest way possible) was the opening sentence to their policy.

Bringing Alcoholic Beverages Onboard
Except for wine and champagne, alcoholic beverages purchased in the vessel's shops or otherwise brought on the ship cannot be consumed on the ship. Bottles and other containers will be collected for safekeeping and delivered to your stateroom on the last day of the voyage.

You'll be fine bringing wine and bubbly aboard, just no 'hard' liquor.

TinaLee

[Machforce1]

Thanks Jim! Glad to see there's such cheerful people here to 'help' out.

[Lisa616]

I'll cheerfully help you out! We just got back from the Zui and yes, liquor isn't allowed to be brought onboard. We carried a case of wine with us, for in cabin and also dining room usage with a corkage. They searched the entire box to make sure there wasn't any liquor in it. They had no problem with the wine. I really don't get the difference..but that's another thread!!

[FoxyTerrier]

I'll cheerfully help you out! We just got back from the Zui and yes, liquor isn't allowed to be brought onboard. We carried a case of wine with us, for in cabin and also dining room usage with a corkage. They searched the entire box to make sure there wasn't any liquor in it. They had no problem with the wine. I really don't get the difference..but that's another thread!!

I don't see the difference either. Some people carefully pack spirits in their checked luggage and have not had a problem. Not that I would break HAL's rules or anything :) You can also purchase spirits from Room Service for an inflated price, but it is nice to have a drink pre dinner out on the balcony.

[woodburykt]

Mac,

We just returned from the Feb 13 sailing of the Westerdam and this is what we did:

Since we arrived 2 days early and stayed at the Hyatt Pierr 66, we bought our liquor in Ft. Lauderdale and then wrapped it up well in bubble wrap that we had brought from home. On sail away day, we packed the liquor in our suitcases and left our luggage outside our rooms for the HAL bus transport to take to the ship along with us.

At embarkation, I had soda and tonic water with my carry on luggage and I had no problem. But, there were some people that we met immediately on board in the elevator that were laughing with excitement because their booze had made it through the security check point. Also, we spoke to a few others that also were able to get liquor through as well, so I can't explain the differences. All I know is that my Saphire Gin was fine in my suitcase when my luggage was delivered to our cabin and my partner's scotch survived as well.

Am I suggesting you do what we did? No. I'm only letting you and others know that we were able to get around some of the rules.

[michmike]

Count me among those who think the differentiation between wine/champagne and alcohol/beer is a crock. I'll continue to back a bottle or two (plastic liters) in my checked baggage (sealed in large ziploc bags) and enjoy a drink in my room. Don't take it out to public areas and still spend plenty in the bars onboard, but I'm not gonna pay $28 for a bottle I can buy in St Thomas for $10. Particularly as long as this disparity in alcohol policy exists re wine/alcohol.

[cru1s1ng]

I'm telling (joking).:D

[jaguarstyper]

Count me among those who think the differentiation between wine/champagne and alcohol/beer is a crock. I'll continue to back a bottle or two (plastic liters) in my checked baggage (sealed in large ziploc bags) and enjoy a drink in my room. Don't take it out to public areas and still spend plenty in the bars onboard, but I'm not gonna pay $28 for a bottle I can buy in St Thomas for $10. Particularly as long as this disparity in alcohol policy exists re wine/alcohol.

I'm totally with you on this. For me, its not so much the cost difference as it is the availability of what I like. My favorite scotch simply is not available through HAL. Since I'm spending a ton of money on my cruise already, I dont have much guilt in smuggling a bottle of it in my suitcase. If HAL would sell it, I wouldnt smuggle it. The bottom line is I am not going to be on my hard earned vacation without my favorite scotch. We'll still spend plenty on booze in the bars.

Tim

[woodburykt]

cru1s1ing: Stool pigeon!! lol

Hey you do what you gotta do to have the kind of vacation that you want. When we on our 2 previous HAL cruises, this alcohol rule was not in effect. As soon as the gift shop opened after leaving Ft.Lauderdale, we bought it and brought it back to our cabins to enjoy drinks on the veranda. That didn't stop us from spending $$ at the bars, it just made for a nicer time that we could have it when we wanted. For us, it was not so much a matter of cost/money, it was a matter of convenience.....although the money matter is a valid concern.

[Disnyfan83]

I thought you could bring wine AND beer on board. Has that policy changed?

[dakrewser]

Only wine is allowed.


As to the various smugglers and "what can I get away with" people, you agreed - in a binding contract - to abide by the rules of the cruise line. Figure out what the total costs are of getting yourself back home after being thrown off the ship in Tortola. Then decide if that "special" Scotch is really worth it.

[jaguarstyper]

Wine yes, beer no. The policy changed at least a year ago. Not exactly sure when.

Whats the difference between wine and beer? I guess HAL feels that wine will generally be served more with dinners and subject to a corkage fee.

Tim

[jaguarstyper]

Figure out what the total costs are of getting yourself back home after being thrown off the ship in Tortola. Then decide if that "special" Scotch is really worth it.

I have, and yes, to me, the risk is worth it. I guess the other question one must ask, is whether HAL is willing to do that to a paying customer who is likely to book a Cat S suite at least once a year for the next 40 or so years? If they are, well then I'll have to find another cruiseline to spend my money on.

Tim

[sail7seas]

I'm totally with you on this. For me, its not so much the cost difference as it is the availability of what I like. My favorite scotch simply is not available through HAL. Since I'm spending a ton of money on my cruise already, I dont have much guilt in smuggling a bottle of it in my suitcase. If HAL would sell it, I wouldnt smuggle it. The bottom line is I am not going to be on my hard earned vacation without my favorite scotch. We'll still spend plenty on booze in the bars.

Tim



So you'll be bringing that smuggled 'I can't get it on HAL' scotch into the lounges? Drinking it outside of your room? If that is the only scotch you drink, and you reference you'll still spend plenty on booze in the bars.....you plan on drinking your scotch in the bar? Or maybe you'll be drinking something else in the bar while your companion(s) have a drink, as well? So there is another liquor you like besides your 'HAL doesn't sell it" brand?

DH drinks scotch....lots of our friends do. While they really like Johnnie Walker Green..... they find a choice of other decent scotches to choose from when that it not available. HAL has plenty of fine scotches.

IMO....The rules are not just for some of us. They are for all of us. You agreed to those rules when you purchased a cruise from HAL.

[woodburykt]

dakrewser:

I agree that indeed a contract has been signed and in signing said contract, rules/regulations need to be followed. I won't argue that point, because there is no room for argument or debate.

What I am willing to debate is the extreme case you have stated of a cruise line dropping someone off at port because they were caught for having snuck booze on board, oooooooooo, bad, bad people. Do you have a particular case that you are citing to make that statement? Have you documentation from a cruise line actually removing passengers because they brought booze on board? Can you honestly think that a cruise line would actually throw someone off the ship because they have their own booze on board? I think not. jaguarstyper is correct......and we too have paid to stay in S Suites each year......in this situation, at best, I would think the booze would be taken away and that would be that.

Yes, we broke the terms of the contract, sure, but I seriously doubt we would have been removed from the ship over an "infraction" like that.

[Time2sail]

There seems to be three ship rules that (I read over and over) on this board that people justify and often encourage others to break:

Bringing alcohol other than wine or champagne on board
Putting babies or children in the pool who are not potty trained
Not following the dress codes on the nights they are requested

Simple rules that HAL has asked us to follow as guests on their ship--I don't understand the boasting and whining of adults who don't consider their actions as pure defiance. Just because you pay for a cabin doesn't mean you CAN HAVE YOUR WAY.:mad:

[jaguarstyper]

sail7seas, you are correct, HAL has many fine scotches on board. Alas, not the one that I like best. I do not bring it to other parts of the ship and only drink in our cabin or on our verandah. I would never, ever bring it to a public room. I also have plenty of drinks in the bars, but not scotch. I also enjoy martinis, wine and other spirits. My bar bill on our last cruise was well over $1000. I also enjoy treating my friends and aquaintences to drinks in the bars.

I contacted HAL well in advance of our trip to see if they could provide a bottle of what I like. I would have gladly paid whatever price they charged. They could not, or possibly would not do it.

The bottom line here is that no one, and I do mean NO ONE is losing anything or being harmed by me bringing a bottle of my favorite scotch onboard.

I hesitate to write this because I know that tastes are very subjective and everyone likes what they like. But, with all due respect to your DH, Johnnie Walker Green label is no substitute for what I like. And, I'm sure finding a suitable substitute for it is not a problem as its a very typical mass produced "single malt" scotch. I have no desire to get into a debate with anyone on these boards about scotch whiskey. It would serve no useful purpose.

I'm sorry if I offend anyone.

Tim

[Machforce1]

I don't think they'll kick you off the ship for trying to smuggle a measly little bottle of liquor aboard. That's a bit extreme. I've heard others say that they simply confiscate it and return it to you at the end of the cruise. Big deal. It's worth a shot.

[woodburykt]

Well friends, the tone of this thread is getting to a point where I think, well...lets just say that I'm done. I would love to say more, much, much more........like

No one is encouraging anyone to do anything............or the differences of bringing your own booze on board for private use/fun on your veranda and a non potty trained kid in a pool.......

Enough for me!! I'll wait for another thread for something that everyone can agree and smile about.

Para mi, no mas, lo siento

nos vemos!

[jaguarstyper]

Very well said. I too, am done with this thread.

Tim

[dakrewser]

No one is encouraging anyone to do anything............or the differences of bringing your own booze on board for private use/fun on your veranda and a non potty trained kid in a pool.......


So where do you draw the line between the rules everyone should follow and those we can break if they inconvenience us?

[jaguarstyper]

So where do you draw the line between the rules everyone should follow and those we can break if they inconvenience us?

Dave,

I know your a smart guy and can clearly see the difference between these two examples. I also think you know where the line is.

Have you ever exceeded the speed limit?

Tim

[dakrewser]

Dave,

I know your a smart guy and can clearly see the difference between these two examples. I also think you know where the line is.

Have you ever exceeded the speed limit?

Probably. Certainly I've been ticketed for doing so. But did I say to myself "hmm, the speed limit here is 40 MPH, but I think I'll drive 60."? No, I didn't. I could have been jailed for exceeding the speed limit, fortunately (for me) I wasn't. You could be tossed off the boat for violating the contract. It's a chance I'd ratherr not take. But while you can "see the difference" others might feel the diapers in the pool rule was a needless hastle (and others have, here on this board). Who, then, decides which rules should be obeyed and which can be ignored?

[sail7seas]

Who, then, decides which rules should be obeyed and which can be ignored?


The Captain, me thinks?

[Sigtau21]

wHOA! I did not realize they now arrest people and throw them in jail for speeding. I think that is extreme... Just like saying they are going to throw off the ship for bring on a bottle of the hard stuff.

Some people really get worked up on these boards.

[dakrewser]

wHOA! I did not realize they now arrest people and throw them in jail for speeding.

Maybe not in Akron, but most state laws allow for jailing speeders. Plus, of course, most people on this board don't only drive in the US. This link (http://shorterlink.com/?SK04L2) to Norway's speed laws shows what can happen...

And the cruise ship can toss you in any port for any violation. Read that contract again. Many of us have seen, or know of, people getting thrown off a ship.

[Sigtau21]

I find it hard to believe even in california that they arrest you and throw you in jail for speeding. They dont have enough room in the jail system.

Sure they could throw you off the ship if you break the rules. You sneak on some hard stuff. I imagine they would take it away. Done deal. However, if the passenger gets abrassive and argumentative and gets physical about it, I could see that person get thrown off the ship.
.

It depends how you handle things.

[ekerr19]

wHOA! I did not realize they now arrest people and throw them in jail for speeding. I think that is extreme...

They do in Utah! It happened to me while driving from California to Colorado several years ago. I did not realize I had exceeded the speed limit as far as I had - when I was pulled over the State Trooper said he was going to take me in, it was the state law. I had to post bond right then and there before being released!

[ekerr19]

I find it hard to believe even in california that they arrest you and throw you in jail for speeding. They dont have enough room in the jail system.


Just because YOU find it hard to believe, doesn't make it so. Some states don't tolerate people who break the law.

[Sigtau21]

How much over where you going?

I geuss it it happens. Its amazing just amazing that a speeder would get thrown in jail and real criminals get slaps on the wrist. The justice system is not balanced, but that is a whole other topic.

I just think that a cruise line is not going to throw someone off the ship for liquor.

[ekerr19]

I also think Dave has a good point - who decides which rules and laws we should abide and which are just silly and to be ignored?

Believe me, there are many on this board who don't give a whit about exposing others to Norwalk and will do as they please... is this fair? Why should I be exposed because they refuse to follow a few "silly" rules and keep their kids out of the pool or remain quarantined in their cabin? I happen to feel it's a good rule but because they don't - my health is at risk.

Sure, smuggling liquor on board is not putting anyone at jeopardy that we know of - but it's still a rule. I try and set a good example for my kids, and because HAL forbids bringing liquor on board, I don't do it. I can always find something to drink.

Have a teenage child and then see which rules can be broken, bent and ignored - it just doesn't work.

[Lisa616]

In all seriousness, does anyone really know why they don't allow liquor and do allow wine? It hardly seems fair. We walk right on with our wine, not having to smuggle it in, and others who prefer liquor can't. We bring our own wine because usually we have our favorites that the ship may not have. Or, quite honestly, it's because the wine is so overpriced on the ship. That said, we still had a hefty bar tab, so we do believe in supporting the cruise line. RCCL has the same policy. We sailed on them last year, and carried wine with us onboard and they checked it over. When I was laying at the pool later that day with my water bottle, a waiter came over and told me I couldn't bring my own liquor to the pool! He thought my water bottle (with no label, it had peeled off) was vodka!! So, I'm honestly curious..why the difference?

[Sigtau21]

We as individuals get to decide which to follow and which to break.

Then it is the individual has to deal with the consequences.

Personally, I have never snuck on any alcohol on any trip. I did not want to do it. But I am not going to judge someone who does or try to police them about it either.

[ekerr19]

How much over where you going?

I geuss it it happens. Its amazing just amazing that a speeder would get thrown in jail and real criminals get slaps on the wrist. The justice system is not balanced, but that is a whole other topic.

I just think that a cruise line is not going to throw someone off the ship for liquor.

The speed limit was 75 and I was told I was doing 96 - which to this day I have a hard time believing, but far be it for me to argue with the State patrol. I had my child with me and sure enough, we both got hauled into town and had the option paying the fine and being released. Had I not been able to pay, I would have had to spend the night in jail until a magistrate could hear my plea.

I was then escorted all the way to the Colorado state border. It was a very unnerving experience that I don't care to repeat but a very valuable lesson was learned.

While the cruise line may not throw someone off the ship for smuggling liquor - it's still a rule and pax should abide by it, imo.

[ekerr19]

We as individuals get to decide which to follow and which to break.

Then it is the individual has to deal with the consequences.


That scares me... there are some very twisted people in this world who believe they have the right to perform some of the hideous acts they do - all in the name of whatever "right" they think they are entitled to.

For many of these people, consequences mean absolutely nothing and certainly are not a deterrent.

[Sigtau21]

I never said anyone has the right to break any rules or laws. I said people make decisions or choices every day. And I never said I approved of someone breaking the rules.

Would love to chat about this further, but Im off to play some raquetball.

[BruceMuzz]

Most cruisers entirely miss the reasoning behind the no alcohol rules that are now in effect on nearly every major cruiseline.
Revenues have nothing to do with it.
My previous employer experimented with confiscating alcohol on one cruise and then allowing it on the next. The Bars had the same revenue in both cases.

But in America we have a rather strange law that holds the server of alcohol legally responsible for the actions of those who get drunk in his establishment.
If I spend a lot of time and money training my Bar Staff on responsible alcohol service, and then you go back to your cabin and drink three or four bottles of tequila that you brought in your suitcase, I am still legally responsible for the conseques of all your actions when you are drunk.
My former employer currently has over $500,000,000 (that's half a BILLION) in pending litigation against the company, brought by guests who got drunk in their cabins, started a fight, fell down and broke something, fell overboard, you name it. Most are frivolous lawsuits that will be thrown out of court. But the company estimates that it will cost them about $50,000,000 in legal costs to fight the lawsuits. $50,000,000 will pay for a great many SS cabins over the course of the next few decades.

If you owned a cruise line and faced the problems of:

1. Alienating a small percentage of your clientele by not allowing them to bring their favorite spirits to drink in their cabins.
or
2. Losing 10s of Millions - or even 100's of millions of dollars to idiots who cannot be responsible for their own behaviour on your ships,

what would you do?

Like many cruise line companies, I would prove to the courts that we are making every possible effort to control the amount of liquor brought onboard and consumed by our guests. I would set up a system where the only alcohol served onboard is served responsibly by crew who are schooled in dealing with drunks and reporting them to the proper managers. I would set up a system where all alcohol consumed is tracked on a Point of Sale System, so that it can be monitored hourly, daily, and weekly.
Then the inevitable happens; some idiot manages to smuggle several bottles of whiskey into his cabin, gets drunk and falls overboard in the middle of the Caribbean, in the middle of the night. He is dead. His family sues the cruise line for a billion dollars for letting him get drunk and kill himself (it happens all the time folks. Remember McDonalds and the hot coffee?).
At that point the cruise line can prove that they acted responsibly, made every reasonable attempt to prevent this from happening, and avoids paying the billion dollars to the idiot's widow.
What does that mean to the average cruiser?
It means that the price of your cruise will not be raised significantly to cover the billion dollar loss that the company's alcohol policy thankfully avoided.

Having a bottle of booze in your cabin is a great delight for most cruisers - myself included. I didn't behave badly and cause all these problems. Neither did you. But enough morons did. The legal eagles at the cruise lines finally said, "Enough is enough". And now we all suffer for the actions of a few.

[Lisa616]

That doesn't make much sense to me..Do you realize how drunk you can get off wine? Alcohol is alcohol..if you drink enough, no matter the kind, you will be drunk.

[sail7seas]

Thank you for your excellent post, Bruce.


Why allow wine and champagne?

[sail7seas]

We bring our own wine because usually we have our favorites that the ship may not have. Or, quite honestly, it's because the wine is so overpriced on the ship.

Thank you for your honesty, Lisa.

It really does tickle me when I read someone has to bring their own soda, liquor, wine, bottled water....whatever ONLY because the ship doesn't carry their brand and they cannot possibly enjoy their 7 day vacation if they have to do without their special brand of --------- (fill in the blank).

It is refreshing for someone to say it like it is.

[Lisa616]

Thank you for your honesty, Lisa.

It really does tickle me when I read someone has to bring their own soda, liquor, wine, bottled water....whatever ONLY because the ship doesn't carry their brand and they cannot possibly enjoy their 7 day vacation if they have to do without their special brand of --------- (fill in the blank).

It is refreshing for someone to say it like it is.

Thank you. I couldn't say it was just about our favorite wines, because that wasn't the reality. Last year, on our last RCCL cruise we ordered a bottle of Coppola Merlot, my DH favorite. It was $45.00 on the ship, and we buy it at home for $16.00. So, even with a $10.00 corkage, it was quite a savings. Now, in all honestly, we found the wine prices on HAL to be better than RCCL, but still considerably higher than a restaurant. I wish cruiselines would have the standard restaurant markup and we wouldn't bring any wine with us at all!

[Majika]

I need to butt in here regarding the responsibility of the cruise line for serving alcohol. Ive seen kids toasted and staggering on board ships and in ports. Ive also seen underage kids at the bars ordering alcohol on several cruise ships. So whether or not you smuggle or pay full price if a kid wants to drink he/she is going to find a way.

Personally I have never smuggled booze on board but this year I think i might give it a whirl. As a paying passenger I seriously do not believe I will be tossed anywhere. The only thing I can see about smuggling liquor is that the bar wont make a few bucks off DH and myself for a couple of glasses of bailey's on the rocks.

[ekerr19]

Lisa-

I hear you! It's ridiculous, even with the wine package. We bought the wine package for the last time a few years ago. It was about $129 for 6 bottles back then but the selections were horrible. There were virtually no Chardonnay selections - one Merlot and it was Walnut Crest (about $8 here in Denver) and the one that killed it for me - Sutter Home White Zinfandel (about $5 here).

That White Zin worked out to be $21.50 for the bottle!!! :eek:

There wasn't a decent wine among the group. I was surprised I didn't see Blue Nun, Mateus, or Boones Farm, LOL!

[RedmondCruiser]

The reason for not allowing liquor to be purchased in the duty free store and then consumed in your cabin is MONITARY. A bottle of JWB was $23 - add the old 20% surcharge and the total cost for a liter was $27.60. Now figure that you have to buy your 12 year old scotch by the drink. At 21 shots per bottle and at $5 per drink -- plus 15% built in tip -- that comes to $120 a bottle. You do the math. --- In 2002 - 2003, with cruise prices at an all time low the lines looked for new income streams. Thats were manditory tipping came in also (it then become an expense deduction for the cruise lines) not an off the books cash transaction.

Only problem is that when prices firm back up all these methods to squeeze more money out of the passenger will remain.

As far as the cruise contract, who some of you have confused as a LAW ??, it is a non-read document that only tells you, in 14 pages, what they are not liable for. Why do you think these ships are all owned by off shore LTDs and leased to the line? Why do you think almost every activity on the ship is through a vendor (not the line)? --- Its to avoid liability - blame it on someone else. --

[CruiseVA]

I really can't understand not allowing us to bring beer on board. There are many people that like more than lager's which is pretty much all that is available on the ships. Just as there are many different types and brands of wines in the world, there are many different beers. I like to drink many types of beer's, ales, bock's, ipa's, lagers, wheats, etc - it is a shame that there isn't much to pick from on the ship. On my last cruise I ended up buying some beers in port and smuggling them back on board to drink at dinner. I still purchased many, many buckets of beer at the Dolphin Bar, so it didn't really impact HAL's income.

My other $.02 worth - I wish they would implement a beer card, just like the wine card instead of making us tote bucket's of beer around.

[michmike]

*laffin at the sheer predictability of where this thread has gone* We have this same discussion every 6 weeks it seems.. And none of us are going to change the other's opinion... and the speeding discussion is completely off the point. Those of us who bring it on board are going to continue to do so and those who wish to take offense at that attitude are welcome to do so. A year from now folks will still be kicking this topic around along with the diapers in the pool thread, chair hogs at the pool and flaunting of the dress code. All to no avail.

Take responsibility for your own behavior and don't get your shorts in a knot over what others do because ultimately, you can do little to impact it.

So enjoy your wine, I'll enjoy my smuggled bourbon and we can all feel smug about basking in the sun while others sit here in Michigan with temps in the teens and a foot of snow outside the door.. Now THERE'S an issue worth indignation.. *S*

[ekerr19]

michmike-

Good points, all of them... for me, it's always fun to have a few little semi-heated discussion now and again. ;)

I don't think anyone else here will react the same way cr1s1ng (aka biteme666) did. For most of us, it's all about opinion. No matter how much I enjoy the bantering, at the end of the day, the only opinion that counts is mine! :D LOL

[dakrewser]

I'm really easy to get along with once you people learn to see
it my way.:rolleyes:

[dakrewser]

That doesn't make much sense to me..Do you realize how drunk you can get off wine? Alcohol is alcohol..if you drink enough, no matter the kind, you will be drunk.

Well, there are differences, though.

Beer is approx. 5% alcohol, delivered in 12 oz. bottles. 1 bottle of beer = .6 oz. alcohol

Wine is approx. 12% alcohol, delivered in approx. 25 oz bottles. 1 bottle of wine = 3 oz. alcohol

Whiskey is approx. 40% alcohol, delivered in approx. 25 oz bottles. 1 bottle of whiskey = 10 oz. of alcohol.

So 1 btl of whiskey equals 3.33 bottles of wine or 16.67 bottles of beer.

It takes a lot more wine than whiskey, is my point.

[Machforce1]

MichMike, LMFAO! Now those are words of wisdom. :D

[sail7seas]

I was surprised I didn't see Blue Nun, Mateus, or Boones Farm, LOL!



Mateus, Blue Nun......I haven't heard of those for YEARS!!! Are they still bottled? Do people still drink that stuff?

[MsJ]

Hi..we were on the Zuiderdam last week and my husband asked the security at the checkin point at the gangplank... if he bought beer would he be able to take it on board and they said yes..... he asked them if they would confiscate it and they said... no we will not take it.....he bought some and no one said anything to him...

[Gardendog]

Lisa 616 wrote: " . . . we ordered a bottle of Coppola Merlot, my DH favorite".
We are also Coppola wine drinkers. We like the Claret for a table wine. We will bring wine on our cruise, because of money and selection. We will bring wines we enjoy and have collected over the years, and will be OK (I was going to write "happy", but that's taking it too far) with paying the corkage fee. DH says that the wines don't travel on planes well. Does anyone know? We think cruising would be a great time to drink that special wine that is waiting for a "special occasion".

[dakrewser]

DH says that the wines don't travel on planes well. Does anyone know? We think cruising would be a great time to drink that special wine that is waiting for a "special occasion".

Any one of enough age to require decanting (i.e., one throwing some sediment) would need weeks to settle down after a plane trip. And I'm not sure if your on-board "sommelier" would be very good at decanting anyway. Still, others claim they've done this and enjoyed the wine...

[jaguarstyper]

Whiskey is approx. 40% alcohol, delivered in approx. 25 oz bottles. 1 bottle of whiskey = 10 oz. of alcohol.

So 1 btl of whiskey equals 3.33 bottles of wine or 16.67 bottles of beer.

It takes a lot more wine than whiskey, is my point.

I wasnt going to further this thread, but I cant resist :D

The Scotch Whiskey I love is 60% alcohol and is delivered in 23.1oz (700ml) bottles. When I drink it, I drink 1, maybe 2 onces at a time.

When DW and I drink wine, we almost always drink the entire bottle. Afterall, a half bottle of wine is extremely perishable.

The bottom line is that it really doesnt make much sense to allow wine and champagne and not allow beer and liquor. Alcohol is still alcohol, no matter how you bottle or can it.

It would be like only allowing diapered girls in the pool and not allowing diapered boys. Poop in the pool is still poop in the pool, no matter which gender it comes from.

Ok, now I am truely done with this thread. :rolleyes:

Tim

[ekerr19]

Mateus, Blue Nun......I haven't heard of those for YEARS!!! Are they still bottled? Do people still drink that stuff?

Sail - This is so funny, we have a huge liquor supplier here in the suburbs and it is well stocked. If it is brewed, distilled, bottled, canned or otherwise contains alcohol - in any way, shape or form - it is sold here.

It is always crowded, so DH & I take our time perusing the offerings... and we get such a kick out of some of the "old school" labels!!! They have them and more... remember Lancer's? Oh yes, we can purchase all these and many more..!

They even have Annie Greenspring's Crabble Apple Farm, screwtop and all - lol!

We don't drink it, but we probably used to! Someone must... :D

[sail7seas]

Lancers........:D Yes, I certainly do remember it. It's been alot of years since I've seen it, but someplace way in the back of my brain, I have a memory of drinking it once upon a time.

[stanford's girl]

I would love to know what state the laws that BruceMuzz was talking about. If his reasoning holds true, that would mean that anyone who has a couple drinks in a bar and then has quite a few more at home and then does something stupid or harmful, that the bar is held responsible? Explain the difference between that or on a cruise ship. I have to hold a OLCC license in Oregon to be able to serve alcohol at my restaurant and they have really strict policies. Even in this case, I could not be held responsible. As most of you know, in this day and age, anyone can file a lawsuit. Whether it is a legitimate or not is not the issue. Lawsuits with no legal basis are thrown out evey day!!!!

[stanford's girl]

Just for some info: 1 ounce of hard alcohol, a 6 ounce glass of wine or a 12 ounce beer ALL HAVE THE SAME IMPACT ON THE HUMAN BRAIN. They all go through the blood stream at the same rate.

[stanford's girl]

BruceMuzz,
The alcohol consumed IS TRACKED on a point of sale system. It's on your "sail and sign card" and you are charged on your bill. This is evidence that can be used in a court of law.:)

[richnorto]

Bruce,
The first time I heard the arguement about cruise line responsibility as the reason for no hard liquor, I bought it. I then started looking at the preorder forms. Guess what? I can order bottles for my room and nobody is looking over my shoulder to see if I'm stupid enough to sit and drink a liter in a night...:rolleyes: . No difference except the cruise line gets their percentage! I don't plan to smuggle because 1) even with the upcharge, HAL is comparable to Alabama liquor prices (really high tax) and 2) we've got our kids with us - got to act sane!;) Alcohol is alcohol though, in whatever form.

[Lisa616]

Lisa 616 wrote: " . . . we ordered a bottle of Coppola Merlot, my DH favorite".
We are also Coppola wine drinkers. We like the Claret for a table wine. We will bring wine on our cruise, because of money and selection. We will bring wines we enjoy and have collected over the years, and will be OK (I was going to write "happy", but that's taking it too far) with paying the corkage fee. DH says that the wines don't travel on planes well. Does anyone know? We think cruising would be a great time to drink that special wine that is waiting for a "special occasion".

The only time sediment will be an issue is if you're taking aged wines. If you're taking young wines, like we do...you won't have a problem. Also, we didn't pack them in our luggage. We carried them on the plane. That helps alot!

[Lisa616]

Any one of enough age to require decanting (i.e., one throwing some sediment) would need weeks to settle down after a plane trip. And I'm not sure if your on-board "sommelier" would be very good at decanting anyway. Still, others claim they've done this and enjoyed the wine...

Oops! So sorry, I didn't read ahead of her post to see that you already answered her!!

[Lisa616]

I wasnt going to further this thread, but I cant resist :D

The Scotch Whiskey I love is 60% alcohol and is delivered in 23.1oz (700ml) bottles. When I drink it, I drink 1, maybe 2 onces at a time.

When DW and I drink wine, we almost always drink the entire bottle. Afterall, a half bottle of wine is extremely perishable.

The bottom line is that it really doesnt make much sense to allow wine and champagne and not allow beer and liquor. Alcohol is still alcohol, no matter how you bottle or can it.

It would be like only allowing diapered girls in the pool and not allowing diapered boys. Poop in the pool is still poop in the pool, no matter which gender it comes from.

Ok, now I am truely done with this thread. :rolleyes:

Tim


I totally agree. My point was that you can drink enough of anything to equal something else, that's why I never understood the rule. But..like I tell my children..'You don't have to understand my rules..you just need to follow them"!!!

[Sigtau21]

michmike-

Good points, all of them... for me, it's always fun to have a few little semi-heated discussion now and again. ;)

I don't think anyone else here will react the same way cr1s1ng (aka biteme666) did. For most of us, it's all about opinion. No matter how much I enjoy the bantering, at the end of the day, the only opinion that counts is mine! :D LOL

True ... I enjoyed the little debate yesterday... I wasn't bothered by anyone's opinion.

[sail7seas]

Pretty hard to argue that the liquor policy isn't about revenue,

As stated above:

If it's about liability......why do they allow pre-order of bottles to be delivered to your cabin or being able to order it from Room Service and have as many bottles as you wish delivered.

Until it was mentioned above, I had forgotten that. We never have any liquor in our cabin except for complimentary/gift bottles of wine which are sent to us.

We prefer to drink in the lounges so it did not occur to me anyone can order bottles delivered.

[jcrandle]

--- In 2002 - 2003, with cruise prices at an all time low the lines looked for new income streams. Thats were manditory tipping came in also (it then become an expense deduction for the cruise lines) not an off the books cash transaction.I confess that I am not an accountant, but I don't see the benefit to the cruise line of having tips charged to your account. The tip income should equal the dip disbursement to the crew. Also, I disagree with your characterization of gratuities being charged on the account as "manditory (sic) tipping" All cruise lines that I've sailed on (HAL, RCI, CC) that have done this have allowed you to adjust the amount, or remove entirely.

Please help me understand the income and expense issues with sign & sail tipping vs cash directly to the employee.

[BruceMuzz]

Alcohol certainly is a very hot subject these days on cruise ships.

Yes, regardless of the form or type, it is still alcohol - and you can still get drunk with it if you want.
I think that HAL is making a big mistake by allowing us to bring wine and champagne onboard. But I have been told their reasoning is; 1. You are more likely (but not guaranteed) to drink it in the restaurant, where staff are monitoring your condition and behaviour, and 2. It takes a bit longer to get drunk on wine than on spirits (the idea being that it is easier to get out of control with spirits).

This week, on a cruise ship on the Mexican Riviera, a young woman (30ish) burst out of her cabin, screaming and carrying on, running naked down the ships corridors, pounding on other cabin doors, shouting obscenities, and urinating on the floor everytime she stopped to take a breath. You can imagine that the other passengers were a bit alarmed. When the security team caught her and walked her back to her cabin, they found alcohol hidden in shampoo bottles, mouthwash bottles, ziploc bags, water bottles, etc. The next morning this woman and her husband were thrown off the ship in Mexico.
If the captain had chosen to inform the local authorities of the reason for their departure, these two would be in a Mexican Jail today. As it is, they had no passports, which caused them quite a bit of trouble with the authorities. They also had to find a hotel, and purchase new air tickets to get home.

If this woman had been drinking in the ship's bars, the staff would have reported her condition to their supervisors before she got so out of control. Since she was drinking alone in her cabin, they had no chance to monitor her.

If this woman had decided to jump overboard, who would be blamed? Would the cruise line suffer negative publicity for allowing her to get so drunk and take her life? Would the passengers on that cruise be upset that they had to miss a port because the ship had to stop at sea to look for the missing woman? If her family sued the cruise line and won, would you mind paying an extra $50 for your cruise to cover the cost of legal fees and million dollar settlements?

It's all about CONTROLS. The cruise lines must prove to the courts that they are making "reasonable" efforts to control alcohol on their ships in order to fend off all the frivolous lawsuits brought against them by people who wanted to have a little fun and just got out of control.
By the way, the arilines do the same thing.If you read the fine print on the passage ticket, you will find that consuming your own alcoholic beverages on an airplane is strictly forbidden - for just about the same reasons they are forbidden on ships. Are the airlines trying to protect their beverage profits? They barely sell any alcohol these days anyway. There are no profits to protect. They are looking at safety and legal liability - just like the cruise lines.

[dakrewser]

Oops! So sorry, I didn't read ahead of her post to see that you already answered her!!

No worries. Now if we had disagreed......:rolleyes:

[xpcdoojk]

michmike-

Good points, all of them... for me, it's always fun to have a few little semi-heated discussion now and again. ;)

I don't think anyone else here will react the same way cr1s1ng (aka biteme666) did. For most of us, it's all about opinion. No matter how much I enjoy the bantering, at the end of the day, the only opinion that counts is mine! :D LOL

I have my own feeling about smuggling, basically it comes down to it is smuggling when I take a product that is illegal across a border. It is not smuggling when I take a legal product into a private venue. It may not be allowed, but smuggling it is not. If convenient to do so, I will take my own wines with me. I usually put them into a waterproof floatbag, and wrap them carefully with bubble wrap. I admit the primary reason I do so is to save money. I would never drink these wines by the pool in a public area. If I want them in the dining room I would gladly pay any corkage fee. I do this occassionally at local restaurants. I am not a big alcohol drinker, but from my viewing of the prices for a bottle of hard alcohol on the HAL website for preordering seem reasonable to me. Sure they are more expensive than the duty free store, but still quite reasonable if you look at the math Dave shared with the amount of alcohol in a drink. I tend to drink higher alcohol wines than 12 (usually minimum of 14%), but that is a trivial difference to his analysis.

The real reason, however, that I posted to this thread is do you really feel that biteme666 was cru1s1ng with a high degree of confidence? I am pretty sure that biteme666 is a particular poster, but had not considered the possibly it was cru1s1ng, too....

jc

[xpcdoojk]

Alcohol certainly is a very hot subject these days on cruise ships.

Yes, regardless of the form or type, it is still alcohol - and you can still get drunk with it if you want.
I think that HAL is making a big mistake by allowing us to bring wine and champagne onboard. But I have been told their reasoning is; 1. You are more likely (but not guaranteed) to drink it in the restaurant, where staff are monitoring your condition and behaviour, and 2. It takes a bit longer to get drunk on wine than on spirits (the idea being that it is easier to get out of control with spirits).

This week, on a cruise ship on the Mexican Riviera, a young woman (30ish) burst out of her cabin, screaming and carrying on, running naked down the ships corridors, pounding on other cabin doors, shouting obscenities, and urinating on the floor everytime she stopped to take a breath. You can imagine that the other passengers were a bit alarmed. When the security team caught her and walked her back to her cabin, they found alcohol hidden in shampoo bottles, mouthwash bottles, ziploc bags, water bottles, etc. The next morning this woman and her husband were thrown off the ship in Mexico.
If the captain had chosen to inform the local authorities of the reason for their departure, these two would be in a Mexican Jail today. As it is, they had no passports, which caused them quite a bit of trouble with the authorities. They also had to find a hotel, and purchase new air tickets to get home.

If this woman had been drinking in the ship's bars, the staff would have reported her condition to their supervisors before she got so out of control. Since she was drinking alone in her cabin, they had no chance to monitor her.

If this woman had decided to jump overboard, who would be blamed? Would the cruise line suffer negative publicity for allowing her to get so drunk and take her life? Would the passengers on that cruise be upset that they had to miss a port because the ship had to stop at sea to look for the missing woman? If her family sued the cruise line and won, would you mind paying an extra $50 for your cruise to cover the cost of legal fees and million dollar settlements?

It's all about CONTROLS. The cruise lines must prove to the courts that they are making "reasonable" efforts to control alcohol on their ships in order to fend off all the frivolous lawsuits brought against them by people who wanted to have a little fun and just got out of control.
By the way, the arilines do the same thing.If you read the fine print on the passage ticket, you will find that consuming your own alcoholic beverages on an airplane is strictly forbidden - for just about the same reasons they are forbidden on ships. Are the airlines trying to protect their beverage profits? They barely sell any alcohol these days anyway. There are no profits to protect. They are looking at safety and legal liability - just like the cruise lines.

I would like a blood test done on this lady, and I would bet a dollar to a donut that something other than alcohol would have been found. :D

jc

[michmike]

running naked down the halls and peeing on the floor... those darn carnival types... *S*

enjoyed the trip down memory lane re boones farm and annie green springs.. we could never get thru a football game at Mich State in our undergrad days w/o a half dozen smuggled bottles of those and a pint or two of blackberry brandy... (alas, I was a rogue even then)

My how our tastes change over the years...

[ekerr19]

The real reason, however, that I posted to this thread is do you really feel that biteme666 was cru1s1ng with a high degree of confidence? I am pretty sure that biteme666 is a particular poster, but had not considered the possibly it was cru1s1ng, too....

jc

jc - I'm pretty certain. Before the "poll" thread was yanked - he posted the name he used to acess the newspaper article regarding the crash and that logon was biteme666 - if you were not on the boards last night you did not witness his immature posting to the forum moderators, which appeared on every single board and brought the site down for several minutes.

I think this post is in danger of being pulled if continued reference is made to the event. When I made my original post about it on this thread - it was under the radar screen.

you can email me if you want more info: lskerr@comcast.net

[tbroido]

BruceMuzz,
The alcohol consumed IS TRACKED on a point of sale system. It's on your "sail and sign card" and you are charged on your bill. This is evidence that can be used in a court of law.:)

But you would have to prove that the person who signed also drank. Some people will buy a drink for the whole bar. Does anyone know someone on the Westerdam next week who is like that and when they will be in the bar?

[tbroido]

I also enjoy treating my friends and aquaintences to drinks in the bars.
You aren't on the Westerdam next week, are you?

[CGTNORMANDIE]

The arguments being used about hiding or sneaking alcohol onboard are silly. I have never been on a ship that wouldn't deliver all the booze you wanted via room service...just pick up the phone and order it. So the argument goes right out the porthole. The liability argument is just as effective if they cruise line sold you the booze and then you decided to jump or go for a naked romp LOL!!! OBTW...if you have a big enough suite they will stock your bar for you and they will allow you to bring on as much as you want...you should see the nice refridgerators and wine coolers in some of those suites. IT IS ALL ABOUT REVENUE...

If you take the time and read the cruise contract you will find that "It is up to the discretion of the company to allow onboard..." or some such wording. So even though the brochure says booze is not allowed...the contract says a different thing.

I have always believed that what you do in your cabin is your business...as long as you are not bothering or disturbing anyone else. It is really poor form to take any of your private stock outside your room to a public area...BIG NO-NO!!! I will continue to pack my favorite bourbon and whatever into my luggage and I will continue to enjoy the sanctity of my cabin with the libation of my choice made the way I like it. I will continue to invite my friends to my cabin for a libation before lunch/dinner or sailaway. My bar bill in the public rooms will go on being just as big as it was on my last cruise and I will continue to enjoy the cruise the way it was meant to be enjoyed.

HAPPY SAILING TO ALL!!! (And don't forget the corkscrew!!!)

ROSS

[smoosh21]

I think the big difference is justifying the rules people feel they can breakor not break come down to a few issues
1) no un-potty trained children in the pool is an obvious health risk. The cruise line is only looking out for the health of its guests
2) Must be dressed up for formal night--I admit it can be a little petty, but people have paid the cruise fee to expect a certain measure of dress-up at those dinners. You also have the option of going to other dinning options at no extra cost.
3) No private booze in your room brought from outside--This can be attributed to nothing more than the Cruise line (and I say that because I believe most lines now prohibit it) wanting more money. I think some people justify breaking this rule because of how much they charge. Not just for alcohol, but also for non-alcoholic beverages.

A bar or tavern needs to charge more for drinks because that IS their income. People aren't paying to sit in the bar and enjoy the scenery. People on cruise ships have already paid a fare to be on that ship and to cover that ships amenities. You can easily feel that cruise lines shouldn't charge more for a drink than you would pay on shore, especially because you now become a 'trapped' customer

Even if I were to smuggle a bottle of gin or rum on board, most likely I would still buy drinks at the bar, as I am certainly not going to smuggle a blender on board to make margaritas. And the argument that prohibiting alcohol privately brought on board can limit public intoxication doesn't hold water because I have seen plenty of people walking around ships who have had too much and not being told to stop drinking. Having a bottle of booze in your room that you consume in your room, does not effect anyone elses cruise experience.

So to conclude, I am not arguing that breaking some rules is OK and breaking others is not. I can just more easily accept the reasoning for breaking some rules and not others

[dakrewser]

I think the big difference is justifying the rules people feel they can breakor not break come down to a few issues

Bottom line is that there are rules and we either choose to accept hem or we don't.

Some rules raise ethical issues, people violate them to commit acts of civil disobediaence in the hope of being caught so that the rule itself can be debated. This people also accept that when they are caught they will suffer the consequences.

For others, it's simply a case of feeling that "the rules don't apply to me," or "the rule is silly," or "I paid my money and I'll do what I want." All of which I construe as uncivil behavior. Sure, we all occasionally infract a rule accidently or through ignorance, I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about knowing the rule and deliberately ignoring it. THe problem is that once one rule is ignored with impugnity then it's open season on all of them.

How long a journey is it from "I'll drink what I want in my cabin, and bring it aboard if I have to," to "I need to press my skirt, so I'll bring my travel iron with me," to "I don't want the steward to see this, I'd better flush it down the toilet," and oh, so much more.

-dave
"what, I can't bring my lighter on the plane? How will I smoke in the lavatory, then?"

[jcrandle]

Alcohol certainly is a very hot subject these days on cruise ships.

Yes, regardless of the form or type, it is still alcohol - and you can still get drunk with it if you want.
I think that HAL is making a big mistake by allowing us to bring wine and champagne onboard. But I have been told their reasoning is; 1. You are more likely (but not guaranteed) to drink it in the restaurant, where staff are monitoring your condition and behaviour, and 2. It takes a bit longer to get drunk on wine than on spirits (the idea being that it is easier to get out of control with spirits).

This week, on a cruise ship on the Mexican Riviera, a young woman (30ish) burst out of her cabin, screaming and carrying on, running naked down the ships corridors, pounding on other cabin doors, shouting obscenities, and urinating on the floor everytime she stopped to take a breath. You can imagine that the other passengers were a bit alarmed. When the security team caught her and walked her back to her cabin, they found alcohol hidden in shampoo bottles, mouthwash bottles, ziploc bags, water bottles, etc. The next morning this woman and her husband were thrown off the ship in Mexico.
If the captain had chosen to inform the local authorities of the reason for their departure, these two would be in a Mexican Jail today. As it is, they had no passports, which caused them quite a bit of trouble with the authorities. They also had to find a hotel, and purchase new air tickets to get home.

If this woman had been drinking in the ship's bars, the staff would have reported her condition to their supervisors before she got so out of control. Since she was drinking alone in her cabin, they had no chance to monitor her.

If this woman had decided to jump overboard, who would be blamed? Would the cruise line suffer negative publicity for allowing her to get so drunk and take her life? Would the passengers on that cruise be upset that they had to miss a port because the ship had to stop at sea to look for the missing woman? If her family sued the cruise line and won, would you mind paying an extra $50 for your cruise to cover the cost of legal fees and million dollar settlements?

It's all about CONTROLS. The cruise lines must prove to the courts that they are making "reasonable" efforts to control alcohol on their ships in order to fend off all the frivolous lawsuits brought against them by people who wanted to have a little fun and just got out of control.
By the way, the arilines do the same thing.If you read the fine print on the passage ticket, you will find that consuming your own alcoholic beverages on an airplane is strictly forbidden - for just about the same reasons they are forbidden on ships. Are the airlines trying to protect their beverage profits? They barely sell any alcohol these days anyway. There are no profits to protect. They are looking at safety and legal liability - just like the cruise lines.As long as HAL will allow you to have several liters of whiskey delivered to your room via room service, and will allow you to bring several bottles of wine on board, I will totally discount that they are concerned with controlling the amount that you imbibe. It is obviously profit motivated, and I suspect it won't be long until they quit allowing you to bring wine on. And when it happens, many posters will insist that it was done to keep the pax sober, rather than to increase the bottom line at HAL.

Mind you, I'm not saying that they don't have the RIGHT to keep you from bringing your own alcohol on board, but please don't insult our intelligence by purporting that it is done for any motive other than profit.

[dakrewser]

but please don't insult our intelligence by purporting that it is done for any motive other than profit.

And your source of information is??????

Oh, that's right, it's "obvious" to you. No proof needed!

Note that it's solely your opinion, while BruceMuzz qualifies his remarks by referring to actual events ("My former employer currently has over $500,000,000 [that's half a BILLION] in pending litigation against the company, brought by guests who got drunk in their cabins, started a fight, fell down and broke something, fell overboard, you name it.")

Which do you suppose carries the greater impact, your opinion or his facts?

You do, of course, enjoy the freedom to give your opinion, while I (and others) enjoy the fredom to reject it. But, then, that's only my opinion. :rolleyes:

[michmike]

"I'm talking about knowing the rule and deliberately ignoring it. THe problem is that once one rule is ignored with impugnity then it's open season on all of them." per dakrewser


I was watching the Today show earlier this week and one of their "experts" claims that as much as 60% of married women cheat and speculated that the number for men is in that vicinity or higher. (spose it's that carnival crowd again?)

At any rate , IF that is anywhere close to true then it strikes me we're 3/4 of the way down the slippery slope already and us booze smugglers are only penny ante miscreants.

Pretty certain that DW would take vigorous exception to me being in the first group.. so I guess I'm in good company in the latter.

Now I guess I need to ask more questions when SHE is "working late" *lol*

[michmike]

and perhaps MORE to the point.... why do I only meet the other 40% ? *L*

[jcrandle]

And your source of information is??????

Oh, that's right, it's "obvious" to you. No proof needed!

Note that it's solely your opinion, while BruceMuzz qualifies his remarks by referring to actual events ("My former employer currently has over $500,000,000 [that's half a BILLION] in pending litigation against the company, brought by guests who got drunk in their cabins, started a fight, fell down and broke something, fell overboard, you name it.")

Which do you suppose carries the greater impact, your opinion or his facts?

You do, of course, enjoy the freedom to give your opinion, while I (and others) enjoy the fredom to reject it. But, then, that's only my opinion. :rolleyes:Then if you believe it is to reduce their liability, why Dave, do they allow you to purchase liters of alcohol from room service?

[dakrewser]

Then if you believe it is to reduce their liability, why Dave, do they allow you to purchase liters of alcohol from room service?

Well, according to Bruce, they can still monitor your drinking that way. Which, I believe, is true. Still - you can always believe what you want. :rolleyes:

[jcrandle]

And your source of information is??????

Oh, that's right, it's "obvious" to you. No proof needed!

Note that it's solely your opinion, while BruceMuzz qualifies his remarks by referring to actual events ("My former employer currently has over $500,000,000 [that's half a BILLION] in pending litigation against the company, brought by guests who got drunk in their cabins, started a fight, fell down and broke something, fell overboard, you name it.")

Which do you suppose carries the greater impact, your opinion or his facts?

You do, of course, enjoy the freedom to give your opinion, while I (and others) enjoy the fredom to reject it. But, then, that's only my opinion. :rolleyes:So a posting by someone who says they are an expert, is valued more than logic? AFAIK, there is no way for us to identify posters, and determine who they are, much less, whether they possess any expert credentials.

[dakrewser]

So a posting by someone who says they are an expert, is valued more than logic?

No, but you didn't offer logic, just a surmise. Bruce offered a logical explanation with enough verifiable facts (you had none) that lent greater credence to his explanation, at least in my mind.

-dave

[jcrandle]

No, but you didn't offer logic, just a surmise. Bruce offered a logical explanation with enough verifiable facts (you had none) that lent greater credence to his explanation, at least in my mind.

-daveMy facts are 1) HA will sell you multiple liters of 80 proof alcohol via room service. 2) They have no way to determine if one person or 20 will be be consuming them, and they certainly don't know over what period of time.

So why do you believe that provides any control over someone making an ass of themselves?

[stanford's girl]

Alcohol certainly is a very hot subject these days on cruise ships.

Yes, regardless of the form or type, it is still alcohol - and you can still get drunk with it if you want.
I think that HAL is making a big mistake by allowing us to bring wine and champagne onboard. But I have been told their reasoning is; 1. You are more likely (but not guaranteed) to drink it in the restaurant, where staff are monitoring your condition and behaviour, and 2. It takes a bit longer to get drunk on wine than on spirits (the idea being that it is easier to get out of control with spirits).

This week, on a cruise ship on the Mexican Riviera, a young woman (30ish) burst out of her cabin, screaming and carrying on, running naked down the ships corridors, pounding on other cabin doors, shouting obscenities, and urinating on the floor everytime she stopped to take a breath. You can imagine that the other passengers were a bit alarmed. When the security team caught her and walked her back to her cabin, they found alcohol hidden in shampoo bottles, mouthwash bottles, ziploc bags, water bottles, etc. The next morning this woman and her husband were thrown off the ship in Mexico.
If the captain had chosen to inform the local authorities of the reason for their departure, these two would be in a Mexican Jail today. As it is, they had no passports, which caused them quite a bit of trouble with the authorities. They also had to find a hotel, and purchase new air tickets to get home.

If this woman had been drinking in the ship's bars, the staff would have reported her condition to their supervisors before she got so out of control. Since she was drinking alone in her cabin, they had no chance to monitor her.

If this woman had decided to jump overboard, who would be blamed? Would the cruise line suffer negative publicity for allowing her to get so drunk and take her life? Would the passengers on that cruise be upset that they had to miss a port because the ship had to stop at sea to look for the missing woman? If her family sued the cruise line and won, would you mind paying an extra $50 for your cruise to cover the cost of legal fees and million dollar settlements?

It's all about CONTROLS. The cruise lines must prove to the courts that they are making "reasonable" efforts to control alcohol on their ships in order to fend off all the frivolous lawsuits brought against them by people who wanted to have a little fun and just got out of control.
By the way, the arilines do the same thing.If you read the fine print on the passage ticket, you will find that consuming your own alcoholic beverages on an airplane is strictly forbidden - for just about the same reasons they are forbidden on ships. Are the airlines trying to protect their beverage profits? They barely sell any alcohol these days anyway. There are no profits to protect. They are looking at safety and legal liability - just like the cruise lines.

Bruce,
I would like some clarification on a few statements you made:
1. " I have been told their reasoning is it takes a bit longer to get drunk on wine than on spirits." Who told you this? Was it a representative from HAL? I find it hard to believe that anyone, who knows anything about alcohol and the effects ALL ALCOHOL has on the human brain would say this. It is easy "to get out of control" with any alcohol.

2. "If the captain had chosen to inform the local authorities of the reason for their departure, these two would be in a Mexican Jail today." What would the charge be? Why would the husband be charged? If it's drunk and disorderly, she obviously was but what about him? Does the Mexican police have jurisdiction over cruise ships in international waters?

Just wondering about these things.:confused:

[parrotcruiser]

My 2 cents:

We smuggled booze aboard for cabin consumption. Played some poker, had some drinks, then on to the disco. My bar bill was more the nights we started in the cabin, had to keep the buzz going and the room seemed very far away at that point.

We certainly didn't knock on doors and pee in the hallway!

I am more offended my men in speedos than someone drinking "taboo" liquor in their room. But that's just me.

BTW is smuggling alcohol the cruise message board equivalent to sports talk radio debating wether Pete Rose should be in the Hall of Fame?

[Kayelache]

We were on the Amsterdam in December/Jan. We had two liters of vodka and two liters of scotch that did not get caught. I'm posting this for two reasons. One, I think the whole thing is infantile, after all alcohol consumption is legal, and what one does in the privacy of ones cabin ought not be off limits. After all, the shops sell toothpaste, maybe they ought to force passengers to purchase these items in their shops instead of bringing your own on board. Where will it end?
Anyhow, at home, we bought cheap mouthwash. It was on sale at Walmart, two liter sized bottles for $3. Empty out the mouthwash at least a couple of weeks before you sail. Fill the bottles with VERY hot water, change a couple of times a day. When you open the bottles, and this is VERY important. Do NOT discard the plastic seal that is on the bottles. Fill the bottles with booze. We used "peppermint" mouthwash bottles for vodka, with about a drop of blue food coloring in each, and "original" flavor for the scotch. We also took along another, identical bottle, with about an inch of the original mouthwash in it. Now comes the best part. Take the plastic seals that you removed to empty the mouthwash, and reattach them, using plain old Elmer's glue. It looks like the original seal. Wrap each bottle in bubblewrap, and then in a two quart ziplop bag. We've done this a dozen times in the last five years and have yet to be caught. It is true, most cruise lines have cared less if we smuggled booze aboard. HAL never did a few years ago. We like a drink in our cabin before dinner. Out "bar bills" have always been zero, whether or not we would be able to do this. We are not "bar people:" By the way, we are not youngsters, my husband just turned 92 and I'm not far behind. I think this whole liquor thing is very juvenile, and we intend to look into some of the more "mature" cruise lines. We thought that HAL was one of those, evidentally not.
If one checks into a very exclusive hotel, they do not x-ray your luggage to see if you are smuggling in liquor. Actually, I think the only reason we do it now, is that it's a challenge. At 82, it's fun to smuggle a bra full of miniature bottles aboard. On the other hand, I hate to think that the cruise lines are so dependant on liquor sales that they are forced to take these extreme measures.
We did a river cruise in Europe last summer where we could bring wine and any other spirits at any time with no censorship. Interesting that we did very little, and purchased bar drinks quite often.
Just my humble opinion......
Two very aged seniors who like a drink before dinner in our cabin......

[TeresaJenkins]

I too believe this whole "alcohol rule" is so the ship can sell their own firewater to generate money.

Why not just tell us the reasons/facts? Why not give us some options?

ex:
I would not be opposed to paying a $25 fee to bring my own unlimited hard stuff from home. Of course that would be up to each person to decide.

However, they won't do this because it might "look" like they are being greedy, and some people won't want to cruise. Well that's crap too! As an adult I get that the cruise industry is a business, and as a business they are into making a profit.
Do they really think they are fooling everyone?

What bothers me the most is that the cruiselines treat me/you like we are not capable of making reasonable decisions on our own. Plus, when they won't just come out with the facts, it is as if we are too "sensitive" to handle the truth!
GRR!!!! I'm not some Sensitve "New Age Chic"!

I am with you all the way Kayelache.

[dakrewser]

for all of you who believe that the reason you're not allowed to bring booze to your cabin is so that the cruise lines can "gouge" you:

Why do they allow wine, beer, soda, etc?

We've seen reasonable explanations, based on the liability laws, why this is so. But if the only reason to ban hooch is to make a pile of money - why not ban all alcohol?

[lambcom]

Let's put a little realism in this discussion, folks. There's just no way HAL is going to examine or x-ray all of the checked baggage to see if pasengers are smuggling bottles of liquor on board for in-cabin consumption. On a Vista class ship you've got about 2,000 passengers each with 2 plus suitcases or garment bags. That's about 5,000 bags. If you examined each one of these, passengers would be getting bags delivered to their cabins the second day of the cruise. And somehow I can't imagine HAL's on board security force knocking on your cabin door and demanding that you open your suitcase in their presence and turn over your bottle of scotch that showed up during an x-ray scan.

I'll take my chances and smuggle a bottle or two. And yes, I'll still buy enough wine and liquor in the bars to ensure a health profit for Carnivore Corporation.

[ekerr19]

One, I think the whole thing is infantile ....After all, the shops sell toothpaste, maybe they ought to force passengers to purchase these items in their shops instead of bringing your own on board.

HAL does not request that you not bring toothpaste onboard - BIG difference, imo.

Anyhow, at home, we bought cheap mouthwash. It was on sale at Walmart, two liter sized bottles for $3. Empty out the mouthwash at least a couple of weeks before you sail. Fill the bottles with VERY hot water, change a couple of times a day. When you open the bottles, and this is VERY important. Do NOT discard the plastic seal that is on the bottles. Fill the bottles with booze. We used "peppermint" mouthwash bottles for vodka, with about a drop of blue food coloring in each, and "original" flavor for the scotch. We also took along another, identical bottle, with about an inch of the original mouthwash in it. Now comes the best part. Take the plastic seals that you removed to empty the mouthwash, and reattach them, using plain old Elmer's glue. It looks like the original seal. Wrap each bottle in bubblewrap, and then in a two quart ziplop bag. We've done this a dozen times in the last five years and have yet to be caught...

Please tell me you are kidding here! This has got to be a joke, right? No one in their right mind would go to all this trouble to smuggle booze onto a cruise ship, would they? Don't you think using food coloring would make the Vodka look more like mouthwash? Oops, I see you already thought of this..

Some of us choose to follow the cruise line rule requesting that we not bring alcohol onboard. While, that may be infantile to you - we like to think that we are law abiding citizens - thus by following rules, we are also setting a good example for our children.

Hardly infantile, wouldn't you agree? ;)

[TinaLee]

Actually, I think the only reason we do it now, is that it's a challenge. At 82, it's fun to smuggle a bra full of miniature bottles aboard.

ROFLMAO! :eek:

I just don't understand why everyone gets so up in arms on this subject. Those that want to will, those that don't... won't. It makes no nevermind to me. It's hard to tell the obnoxious drunks who are drunk on 'room booze' from the ones drunk on 'cruise line booze'. Although, dollars to donuts it's the unguarded 'room booze' the younger ones are buzzing around on!

TinaLee :cool:

[ekerr19]

I also meant to add to my post that I really don't care if someone chooses to smuggle - it's obviously a personal choice - I just choose not to and shouldn't be called names because of it.

I also think it's hysterical the lengths some folks will go to save a buck after spending thousands to cruise in the first place... oh well. :rolleyes:

[HeatherInFlorida]

I wish I'd never happened on this thread. A bird let me to it. So prepare to flame me.

I continue to be amazed by people who will come up up any excuse to rationalize bad behavior. The mere use of the word "smuggle" makes it clear that all who boldly post here about how they "get away" with smuggling tells us that they completely understand it's something they are prohibited from doing by the cruise contract they have accepted. Whether or not you agree with HAL's reasons, think they're untrue, think they're unfair really is inconsequential.

So you can argue until doomsday and it doesn't change the fact that you're defying HAL's request. And that speaks volumes of the kind of people you are. Probably the same 60% who cheat on their spouses. A cheat is a cheat is a cheat.

[dakrewser]

So you can argue until doomsday and it doesn't change the fact that you're defying HAL's request. And that speaks volumes of the kind of people you are. Probably the same 60% who cheat on their spouses. A cheat is a cheat is a cheat.


Oh, Heather! :eek:

And you promised not to start trouble any more!!!

:rolleyes: -dave

[HeatherInFlorida]

I know, Dave, and I've been very very good.

But there's something wrong with me today. I think it's the water:o

[Time2sail]

"At 82, it's fun to smuggle a bra full of miniature bottles aboard. On the other hand, I hate to think that the cruise lines are so dependant on liquor sales that they are forced to take these extreme measures. "

Note to HAL hq Board:

Please be on the lookout for two desperate elderly people--male, female approximately 80 to 90 years old. The female has pointy, perky breasts due to miniature bottles of booze being smuggled inside her bra (they could be pointing up or down).


Also, be sure to smell their breath--if it is not minty fresh please check the two or more liter bottles of cheap Wal Mart mouthwash to see if liquor is in them (note it could be cheap mouthwash so gargle to be sure).

Please unscrew the tip of the cane on the 92 year old man--what could be stashed in there!

In case this post from the elderly lady, please disregard.

[BLonde_4_ever]

I am quite enjoying this whole discussion...but what is bugging me is the mention of waiters coming around inspecting your cups poolside to see what is in them. Surely this isn't a common occurence? I plan on bringing my own covered mug and putting whatever I want in it....sometimes it will be coffee...sometimes juice...sometimes "other" things...but I will be annoyed if I am inspected!

[Nasmas]

Why do they ask you not to bring liquor on board? This is strictly my opinion but I think its because people abused the policy before. I personally never saw it, but I've read of people bringing their coolers to the pool. I really don't think anyone would say anything to you if you stay in your room with it and don't flaunt it. My husband and I enjoy a cocktail in the afternoons on the verandah, and we would really like to have our drink when we want it, not when they want to bring it to us. So, until they throw us off, we'll continue. (BTW, our bar bill usually runs $700 + week, so I really doubt they're going to throw us off the ship for BYOB:cool:

[parrotcruiser]

And that speaks volumes of the kind of people you are. Probably the same 60% who cheat on their spouses. A cheat is a cheat is a cheat.

My wife helped me stash it, we drank it together on our anniversary cruise. We really are couple of cheats and idiots.

To give you an idea of who THESE people are: I work with autistic children and spouse works for a non-profit charity. I think THAT speaks volumes for what kind of people we are, NOT that we enjoy getting a bottle of rum on the ship to drink before going to casino, dinner, disco. Some people can't afford to pay inflated cruise bar prices. I guess we are too busy paying child support for our illegitimate kids we are racking up by cheating all the time.

We also cheated our way to master's degrees.

We also cheat on our taxes.

Get over yourself.

[ekerr19]

You know what? The prices in the bar on cruise ships are no higher than any other restaurant or bar, less - in many cases. If you can't afford them, perhaps you should re-think your vacation. :confused:

How can you justify smuggling alcohol on board? I don't care if you are the Pope himself, it's against the rules and you are breaking them. Plain & simple.

Basically you are saying if you perform a specific type of work, such as working with autistic children or for a charity - it's means you are allowed special dispensation to break the rules and get away it??? That's nonsense. Btw -what you do (smuggling) actually does speak volumes about you.

If I were to apply your logic shouldn't this also apply to the thousands of dollars we donate to various charities throughout the year? Come on...

Talk about getting over ones self. :)

Also, to the previous poster - no, they don't go around checking your cup or glass for alcohol. :)

[peaches from georgia]

Also, to the previous poster - no, they don't go around checking your cup or glass for alcohol. :)
This is a new rumor to me. Must have missed something. BUT- how telling. We have gone from 'I only smuggle liquor because HAL doesn't carry the one and only brand I like' to 'I only drink in my cabin and still buy drinks at the bar' to what is probably more the truth from this poster above and most of the others who would deny it- 'I plan on bringing my own covered mug (to the pool) and putting whatever I want in it'. :(

[parrotcruiser]

:eek: .

Basically you are saying if you perform a specific type of work, such as working with autistic children or for a charity - it's means you are allowed special dispensation to break the rules and get away it??? That's nonsense. Btw -what you do (smuggling) actually does speak volumes about you.

If I were to apply your logic shouldn't this also apply to the thousands of dollars we donate to various charities throughout the year? Come on...



No what I was saying is that just b/c we choose to sneak booze does not mean we are cheating scuz buckets. In no way do I think I am special and allowed to break a rule. You can't just throw out a brash generalization the way the previous poster did.

I am a booze sneaker, yes. Do I cheat on my wife and lead an otherwise deviant lifestyle, no. I go to work, play with my kid, love my wife, cut grass on the weekends, attend kid's soccer games. Never been arrested, never even had a speeding ticket.

Again, I DON'T think I am special and realize the cruise line wants my rum $$$. I don't appreciate being called scum because I sneak alcohol on the cruise.

Everyone's closet has at least one skeleton in it. If this is mine, well I guess I have surely punched my ticket straight to hell. :eek:

[ekerr19]

This is a new rumor to me. Must have missed something. BUT- how telling. We have gone from 'I only smuggle liquor because HAL doesn't carry the one and only brand I like' to 'I only drink in my cabin and still buy drinks at the bar' to what is probably more the truth from this poster above and most of the others who would deny it- 'I plan on bringing my own covered mug (to the pool) and putting whatever I want in it'. :(

You know what Peaches - you are right! I hadn't thought of it, but that will most likely be the next step.

I can picture the whole smuggling issue running the gamut -

From:

"They don't carry the ONLY unblended scotch whiskey I can possibly stomach so I must bring my own"

To:

"Well, it's kind of expensive to purchase through Room Service or buy it in advance from Ship Services... and since I WILL only be drinking it in my cabin, it can't hurt.."

To This:

"Oh, you better hide the cup - we don't want to get caught drinking our smuggled booze at the Lido pool!"

I am amazed at the amount of people wondering why HAL changed the policy in the first place - it's called abuse. In the past (when it was still allowed) we used to see people carrying cases of beer onto the ship and then running into the Sam's Club in Mexico for more... like they say, a few bad apples spoiled it for everyone - and next thing you know they will have someone in charge of sniffing the private containers and cups around the pools - if people continue to break the rules.

[HeatherInFlorida]

I always try (sometimes I fail) to be non-combative on these threads and I also try not to direct any venomous remarks directly at someone ... particularly lately. But it becomes exceedingly difficult when someone confronts me personally who I have not confronted or criticized in any way. I simply called it the way I saw it.

Methinks the gentlemen doth protest too much.

I have known many a man in my life (which is quite lengthy) who had a wonderful, loving anniversary toast with his darling wife only to turn around and cheat on her the next day. Who anyone works for or with does not in any way give them the right to cheat on anything.

I repeat ... a cheat is a cheat. No way you can rationalize it or convince me otherwise. You can't be a little bit pregnant and you can't be a little bit of a liar. You are or you aren't.

BTW, I got over myself a long time ago. Perhaps that particular remark should be held to a mirror.

[Lisa616]

This is a new rumor to me. Must have missed something. BUT- how telling. We have gone from 'I only smuggle liquor because HAL doesn't carry the one and only brand I like' to 'I only drink in my cabin and still buy drinks at the bar' to what is probably more the truth from this poster above and most of the others who would deny it- 'I plan on bringing my own covered mug (to the pool) and putting whatever I want in it'. :(

That was my post several days ago. It was an isolated event on a RCCL ship where a waiter came up to me while I was lying at the pool and pointed to my bottle of water and said 'you're not allowed to bring your own liquor to the pool". He felt foolish when I told him it was water. Not too smart a fellow if you ask me!!

My take on this issue, is that I do not have to smuggle liquor to take onboard to enjoy in my cabin because I am a wine lover. I carried, or rather DH carried several bottles of wine(very heavy) right onboard with their blessing. We enjoyed a glass of wine, or 2 each evening while dressing, or just relaxing on our balcony. I don't see the difference between what I did, or the gentleman who would like to enjoy a glass of scotch on his balcony. What difference does it make if it was a nice, smooth merlot...or a fabulous scotch?

And to the poster who commented on the bar prices saying there are similiar to land bars..I agree. I was fine with the bar prices everywhere on the ship, and the daily drink was a deal. It's the prices for wine by the bottles which is staggeringly high. Restaurants, and land bars, typically double the price of wine. The cruiseline, quadrupled the prices. It's just too high. If they had a reasonable markup for wine, I wouldn't carry one single bottle on board. Because, let's face it...It's a pain! We did take wine to dinner with us a few nights and were happy to pay a corkage. We were never, however, charged one. We did tip the wine steward though. It was his fault we didn't order wine from him, and we wanted him compensated.

[ekerr19]

:eek:

No what I was saying is that just b/c we choose to sneak booze does not mean we are cheating scuz buckets. In no way do I think I am special and allowed to break a rule. You can't just throw out a brash generalization the way the previous poster did.

I am a booze sneaker, yes. Do I cheat on my wife and lead an otherwise deviant lifestyle, no. I go to work, play with my kid, love my wife, cut grass on the weekends, attend kid's soccer games. Never been arrested, never even had a speeding ticket.

Again, I DON'T think I am special and realize the cruise line wants my rum $$$. I don't appreciate being called scum because I sneak alcohol on the cruise.

Everyone's closet has at least one skeleton in it. If this is mine, well I guess I have surely punched my ticket straight to hell. :eek:

That's not it at all - and no one is calling you a "scuz bucket", merely trying to point out that you are going against a policy that has been put into place and because you disagree with it, does it make it right to break it?

What if we applied that rationalization to everything in our lives? Also, what kind of message do you think it sends to your children? As a parent of a teen, I can assure you, parents that bend and break rules they think are "lame or wrong" are only asking for kids that will try and do the same.

I am not trying to make you feel bad or denigrate you for bringing your alcohol onboard - to each his own, but when you tried to rationalize it with references to what you do for a living, it bothered me. Actually, it doesn't cost all that much to pre-order your 1-litre bottle of Bacardi (or whatever your preference happens to be) from Ship Services. It will be waiting in your cabin when you arrive and will not have broken any rules...:)

[peaches from georgia]

What difference does it make if it was a nice, smooth merlot...or a fabulous scotch?

I don't know or care about RCCL. The difference on HAL between bringing your own wine and bringing hard liquor onto a HAL ship is that, in the case of wine, HAL allows you to bring on whatever wine you choose and as much as you like.

With scotch or any hard liquor, HAL regulations do NOT allow you to bring it on the ship. Pure and simple. If you do, you are smuggling and any amount of excuses is just that- an excuse. You know the regs on HAL (and any other cruiseline). Don't book HAL if they are not what you want. Find a cruiseline that carries the scotch one prefers or allows you to bring it on. But don't try to BS that smuggling is not cheating.

[Lisa616]

I wish I'd never happened on this thread. A bird let me to it. So prepare to flame me.

So you can argue until doomsday and it doesn't change the fact that you're defying HAL's request. And that speaks volumes of the kind of people you are. Probably the same 60% who cheat on their spouses. A cheat is a cheat is a cheat.

Wow! Now, come on..that was pretty rude. I'm not even one who smuggles liquor onboard, but to say that someone who does, is probably a spouse cheater..is just ridiculous. No one, and I repeat, no one.. is that holier than thou. You have never cheated in your life? Not on a game? Never broke a little rule, once? To generalize someone to that extent, I think..is beyond reproach. I would only be grateful that I'm not held up to that high a standard.

[HeatherInFlorida]

When I posted above, several posts hit before mine including Parrot's most recent so I feel compelled to add a comment.

I'm a little confused as to why one person has taken what I said earlier so personally. I directed my post to no one in particular. I simply believe that if a corporation has a rule as it relates to using their service, then we adhere to that rule. We may not always like it, but we agree to it.

If everyone decides to pick and choose which rules and laws they choose to live by then chaos will ensue. Some might argue it already does, but I'm quite amazed every day that more cars don't hit each other. People are driving (for the most part) in the lanes they're asked to drive in.

I'm sure the poster is a very nice person. But there's something a little screwy with his rationale. It's not "okay" simply because you believe it's "okay".

[parrotcruiser]

That's not it at all - and no one is calling you a "scuz bucket", merely trying to point out that you are going against a policy that has been put into place and because you disagree with it, does it make it right to break it?

What if we applied that rationalization to everything in our lives? Also, what kind of message do you think it sends to your children? As a parent of a teen, I can assure you, parents that bend and break rules they think are "lame or wrong" are only asking for kids that will try and do the same.

I am not trying to make you feel bad or denigrate you for bringing your alcohol onboard - to each his own, but when you tried to rationalize it with references to what you do for a living, it bothered me. Actually, it doesn't cost all that much to pre-order your 1-litre bottle of Bacardi (or whatever your preference happens to be) from Ship Services. It will be waiting in your cabin when you arrive and will not have broken any rules...:)

All right, that I can handle. A few points:

1. I wasn't trying to rationalize by pointing out chosen occupations. Just an example to show I am not a social degenerate cheat. That REALLY bothered me.

2. I realize that I am breaking their "Contract".

3. I snuck booze on to my first cruise in Feb. Hadn't really discovered this sight and delved into it. Was unaware of a cabin liquor set - up for purchase until the week I left for cruise. The poster listed the procedure to get an in-room and you had to order 3 weeks prior. Now I know, live and learn. Believe me, I would rather pay a bit more and have my bottle in the room then go through hassle of sneaking.

4. Again, I got so aggravated b/c previous poster had made a blanket statement challenging mine/others personal integrity. If you want to say I made a bad choice in that instance, fine, but don't say I made that bad choice is b/c I am a bad person and I obviously lead a deviant lifestyle. Just not true.

There are some who would say (I've seen it on other message boards) that cruisers in general are bad people b/c we support companies built with US tourist dollars that hire people from poor countries and pay them poorly and require them to work 7 days a week for months. Others say meat eaters support animal torture. These generalizations are not true and just examples of how a blanket statement, without gathering all details is just a bad idea.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Wow! Now, come on..that was pretty rude. I'm not even one who smuggles liquor onboard, but to say that someone who does, is probably a spouse cheater..is just ridiculous. No one, and I repeat, no one.. is that holier than thou. You have never cheated in your life? Not on a game? Never broke a little rule, once? To generalize someone to that extent, I think..is beyond reproach. I would only be grateful that I'm not held up to that high a standard.

Lisa, you can believe it or not ... but no I never have.

What I said was not rude. What I said is what I believe. I think you're getting a little carried away with it being "beyond reproach". Little strong don't you think? I said "probably the same people" ... very generalized and it means absolutely nothing.

[Lisa616]

Lisa, you can believe it or not ... but no I never have.

What I said was not rude. What I said is what I believe. I think you're getting a little carried away with it being "beyond reproach". Little strong don't you think? I said "probably the same people" ... very generalized and it means absolutely nothing.

Means absolutely nothing???? You just told someone that he was probably the same type of person that would cheat on his spouse, because he snuck in a bottle of booze..and you think that is 'nothing'? I stand, that is was rude.

[HeatherInFlorida]

All right, that I can handle. A few points:

1. I wasn't trying to rationalize by pointing out chosen occupations. Just an example to show I am not a social degenerate cheat. That REALLY bothered me.

2. I realize that I am breaking their "Contract".

3. I snuck booze on to my first cruise in Feb. Hadn't really discovered this sight and delved into it. Was unaware of a cabin liquor set - up for purchase until the week I left for cruise. The poster listed the procedure to get an in-room and you had to order 3 weeks prior. Now I know, live and learn. Believe me, I would rather pay a bit more and have my bottle in the room then go through hassle of sneaking.

4. Again, I got so aggravated b/c previous poster had made a blanket statement challenging mine/others personal integrity. If you want to say I made a bad choice in that instance, fine, but don't say I made that bad choice is b/c I am a bad person and I obviously lead a deviant lifestyle. Just not true.

There are some who would say (I've seen it on other message boards) that cruisers in general are bad people b/c we support companies built with US tourist dollars that hire people from poor countries and pay them poorly and require them to work 7 days a week for months. Others say meat eaters support animal torture. These generalizations are not true and just examples of how a blanket statement, without gathering all details is just a bad idea.

Okay, after this I'm really finished with this because it's gotten silly.

I never accused anyone of anything! I never questioned anyone's personal integrity. I never said anyone was a "bad" person and I most certainly never said anyone led a "deviant lifestyle". Where are you getting this from? I made a generalized statement which is an absolute fact and if Dr. Phil said it his audience would clap and cheer (as a matter of fact I believe he has said this). Generally speaking, a cheat is a cheat! That is all I said.

[ekerr19]

Generally speaking, a cheat is a cheat! That is all I said.

That is indeed what she said. Also, a lie is a lie and pregnant is pregnant... all of which I agree with wholeheartedly. Very general, not specific to anyone. Those who choose to take it personally are overreacting, in my mind.

Believe it or not, there are some people in this world who see everything as "all or nothing" when it comes to honesty and truthfulness - my DH is one of those people. He would never steal, cheat, sneak, or lie - not for any reason. His personal integrity means that much to him.

I think there have been really good discussions on this thread and I hate to see it disintegrate like this.

I really don't think Heather was being harsh - and isn't she also entitled to her opinion? You don't have to agree with it, but she certainly has the right to voice it the same way the rest of us do. :)

[TeresaJenkins]

When I posted above, several posts hit before mine including Parrot's most recent so I feel compelled to add a comment.
I'm a little confused as to why one person has taken what I said earlier so personally. I directed my post to no one in particular. I simply believe that if a corporation has a rule as it relates to using their service, then we adhere to that rule. We may not always like it, but we agree to it.
If everyone decides to pick and choose which rules and laws they choose to live by then chaos will ensue. Some might argue it already does, but I'm quite amazed every day that more cars don't hit each other. People are driving (for the most part) in the lanes they're asked to drive in.
I'm sure the poster is a very nice person. But there's something a little screwy with his rationale. It's not "okay" simply because you believe it's "okay".

Well count me in as "Another" person who thinks what you wrote was quite nasty, and taking this to a whole other level. You have no right to make that stretch about any of us. You can think what you want, but that doesn't mean it has to be said. If you choose to say what you think don't be so surprised when you are challenged.

I have come across many of your posts here on CC and quite a few struck the same tone with me. I'm not sure if you mean to write this way to stir things up, or if you don't realize what you write is at times can be quite offensive.

Getting personal is something I try to never do online, but I couldn't let this pass without saying something.

[Lisa616]

[QUOTE=ekerr19]
I think there have been really good discussions on this thread and I hate to see it disintegrate like this.

You're right, this has been a great thread and I apologize for my part in disintegrating it. That comment about the same type of person being a spouse cheater really got under my skin, no matter who it was directed towards. Geez, I don't even sneak booze in and I ended up spatting on this thread! I should of stayed out of it!! On to a wonderful evening at home with a roaring fire (it's freezing outside) and a spongebob movie with the kids and hubbie!

[ekerr19]

To the poster above Lisa (our post crossed and I can't quote now):

How can you possibly take this as "personal?" Was your name mentioned? It was a complete generalization.


You make a conscious, informed decision to break the rules (and you know from these boards that HAL prohibits bringing some alcohol on board), but don't like be called on it? Sorry, but you can't have it both ways. ;)

If you are posting that you are choosing to smuggle, be prepared to take some heat.

[ekerr19]

[QUOTE=ekerr19]
I think there have been really good discussions on this thread and I hate to see it disintegrate like this.

Geez, I don't even sneak booze in and I ended up spatting on this thread! I should of stayed out of it!!

I was wondering about that! You didn't even do it - you said DH hauled all your wine on board... that's great, we usually bring a bottle or two as well.

I hope you have a great evening, we just got that movie today. :)

[dakrewser]

No what I was saying is that just b/c we choose to sneak booze does not mean we are cheating scuz buckets. In no way do I think I am special and allowed to break a rule.

Well, you must think you are "special and allowed to break a rule," because you admitted that you did! So besides being ethics-challenged you're also logic-challenged!

It isn't the booze that bothers me, bring aboard an entire distillery if you want. What does bother me (and some others) is this notion that you can pick and chose which rules to abide by and which to ignore. Some of those rules impact my safety and well-being. I don't want anybody ignoring those...

[ekerr19]

If you choose to say what you think don't be so surprised when you are challenged. And if you choose to post about smuggling, you will challenged...

I have come across many of your posts here on CC and quite a few struck the same tone with me. I'm not sure if you mean to write this way to stir things up, or if you don't realize what you write is at times can be quite offensive.


Now this I take offense to - you have gotten personal and Heather didn't.

Heather does not write "to stir things up"... she calls it like she sees it (as many of us do) and if you can provide a good rebuttal - please feel free, I like a good debate.

I don't find Heather's post offensive in the least - but I do take offense to those cruisers who think they are above certain rules and regulations and will continue to do as they please with little or no regard for the rest of the passengers.

[parrotcruiser]

Well, you must think you are "special and allowed to break a rule," because you admitted that you did! So besides being ethics-challenged you're also logic-challenged!

It isn't the booze that bothers me, bring aboard an entire distillery if you want. What does bother me (and some others) is this notion that you can pick and chose which rules to abide by and which to ignore. Some of those rules impact my safety and well-being. I don't want anybody ignoring those...

I bet you've never chosen to drive 56 in a 55.

If you think that in sneaking I made a bad choice so be it. But everyone single one of us has had their own private "sneak on a bottle of liquor" moment(s). If you haven't, why cruise when you can obviously walk on water to get to the ports.

[parrotcruiser]

but I do take offense to those cruisers who think they are above certain rules and regulations and will continue to do as they please with little or no regard for the rest of the passengers.

Not sure how a bottle of alcohol snuck on board is showing "little or no regard for the rest of the passengers".

How would you have known? How would this compromise the enjoyment of your vacation?

[dakrewser]

I bet you've never chosen to drive 56 in a 55.

If you think that in sneaking I made a bad choice so be it. But everyone single one of us has had their own private "sneak on a bottle of liquor" moment(s). If you haven't, why cruise when you can obviously walk on water to get to the ports.

So it's your belief that everyone breaks the rules? Is that how you justify your own lapses ("gee mom, everybody's doin' it!")? And why, in heaven's name, would someone "choose" to drive 56 in a 55 mph zone? Just so they can say they did it? How infantile.

In fact, driving over 55 is less culpable then smuggling booze on board. Speeding violates a law that's been imposed on you. The smuggling violates a contract that you've agreed to. That is to say, you're breaking your word.

It isn't really difficult to understand, it isn't rocket science.

-dave

[ekerr19]

Not sure how a bottle of alcohol snuck on board is showing "little or no regard for the rest of the passengers".

How would you have known? How would this compromise the enjoyment of your vacation?

Don't you get it yet??? It's not about the alcohol! Let me pose a hypothetical question for you -

Suppose you and your wife and kids are enjoying a warm, sunny afternoon in the pool... all of a sudden you see someone with the small child/infant in the pool wearing only his/her Huggies diaper - and that small child has an accident... obviously, you are fortunate to witness it and jump right out of the pool. Your wife and children contract the Norwalk virus anyway and are confined to the cabin (and the one small bathroom) for the remainder of the cruise, thus ruining your long planned and awaited family vacation... wouldn't you be just a little upset that somene thought the "little, silly rule" about not having kids in diapers in the pool could be ignored???? It happens all the time, trust me.

Sure, you say - Norwalk virus is dangerous, sneaking alcohol onboard isn't - BUT (and here's the BIG but) they are both rules -

So who decides which are enforced and which aren't? You, or the lady that sticks her kid in the pool wearing a diaper? You tell me...

[parrotcruiser]

So it's your belief that everyone breaks the rules? Is that how you justify your own lapses ("gee mom, everybody's doin' it!")? And why, in heaven's name, would someone "choose" to drive 56 in a 55 mph zone? Just so they can say they did it? How infantile.

In fact, driving over 55 is less culpable then smuggling booze on board. Speeding violates a law that's been imposed on you. The smuggling violates a contract that you've agreed to. That is to say, you're breaking your word.

It isn't really difficult to understand, it isn't rocket science.

-dave

Yes I would say that every single person who has lived on this earth has broken a rule. Jesus excluded.

No I don't use a everyone's doing attitude to rationalize sneaking booze. I did it because I wanted to. I am saying anyone who blasts me for it has chosen to break a rule or do something unethical at some point in their life, doesn't make them ethics challenged, it makes them human!

Breaking a law, in my opinion is far worse, thus punishment is prison, a fine, etc. Sneaking booze means getting it back in 7 days. Speeding, etc. endanger others. I hardly think having some smuggled drinks in my room put the other 1800 passengers in danger, they wouldn't let me steer the ship!

[star453]

Heather,

That's perfect. I agree totally

Dennis

[parrotcruiser]

Don't you get it yet??? It's not about the alcohol! Let me pose a hypothetical question for you -

Suppose you and your wife and kids are enjoying a warm, sunny afternoon in the pool... all of a sudden you see someone with the small child/infant in the pool wearing only his/her Huggies diaper - and that small child has an accident... obviously, you are fortunate to witness it and jump right out of the pool. Your wife and children contract the Norwalk virus anyway and are confined to the cabin (and the one small bathroom) for the remainder of the cruise, thus ruining your long planned and awaited family vacation... wouldn't you be just a little upset that somene thought the "little, silly rule" about not having kids in diapers in the pool could be ignored???? It happens all the time, trust me.

Sure, you say - Norwalk virus is dangerous, sneaking alcohol onboard isn't - BUT (and here's the BIG but) they are both rules -

So who decides which are enforced and which aren't? You, or the lady that sticks her kid in the pool wearing a diaper? You tell me...

Sure they are both rules but I still haven't heard why so many are upset about people having a rum in coke in cabin with smuggled booze.

In the diaper analogy, people will directly have vacation ruined, I still don't see how it ruins a vacation.

How about a truce ekerr19? I will admit breaking a rule is bad, if you admit sneaking booze for cabin consumption would have zero effect on your vacation. Can we move on?

[HeatherInFlorida]

Well count me in as "Another" person who thinks what you wrote was quite nasty, and taking this to a whole other level. You have no right to make that stretch about any of us. You can think what you want, but that doesn't mean it has to be said. If you choose to say what you think don't be so surprised when you are challenged.

I have come across many of your posts here on CC and quite a few struck the same tone with me. I'm not sure if you mean to write this way to stir things up, or if you don't realize what you write is at times can be quite offensive.

Getting personal is something I try to never do online, but I couldn't let this pass without saying something.


This is an extremely personal insult which you have absolutely no right to make. Not only are you attacking me for my view of how one should live on this earth, but now you are attacking my posts in general.

Teresa, if you don't like me personally, that's fine. But you have absolutely no right to say it here. One of the "rules" here is you cannot attack anyone personally and I did not. I attacked a way of life and I stand by it.

No one can honestly say that it's a stretch to say "a cheat is a cheat". It is a fact. Cheating is a nice word for breaking a law or rule. If you find my belief offensive, it is because you want to pick and choose what rules you will follow. It simply isn't right and I don't see how anyone can rationalize it.

Parrot, I'm not going to speak for the rules I may have broken as a child because I honestly don't remember. But as an adult I have been honest always. I have absolutely never lied to anyone. I read every document, every law, every rule and I abide by it. If I'm not supposed to plant a geranium in my front yard, I don't do it. I might not like every rule and I might find it silly and stupid, but I believe it is my agreement to abide by the rules of where I live or where I travel.

You don't have to agree with me but neither should you flame me because I disagree with you.

[ekerr19]

How about a truce ekerr19? I will admit breaking a rule is bad, if you admit sneaking booze for cabin consumption would have zero effect on your vacation. Can we move on?

Sure, why not? We consume booze in our cabin all the time - DH loves his Bacardi and cokes... we got a litre and 3-4 cokes for about $40 last year, though I've heard it's gone up a bit. We didn't order any for our upcoming voyage or for our November 2004 cruise because we just have more fun drinking in the lounges.

That said, I love a debate, but I think this horse is dead!

I hope you have fun on your next cruise. :)

[parrotcruiser]

Sure, why not? We consume booze in our cabin all the time - DH loves his Bacardi and cokes... we got a litre and 3-4 cokes for about $40 last year, though I've heard it's gone up a bit. We didn't order any for our upcoming voyage or for our November 2004 cruise because we just have more fun drinking in the lounges.

That said, I love a debate, but I think this horse is dead!

I hope you have fun on your next cruise. :)

I've enjoyed the debate as well. Kind of fun when people feel so strongly about their position.

Come find me on your next cruise I'll be the guy drinking Cruzan from a Big Gulp mug while my toddler is wearing a diaper in the pool :D :D

No seriously, would be fun to BUY you a drink and find a light topic we could have fun with like politics...

[ekerr19]

This is an extremely personal insult which you have absolutely no right to make. Not only are you attacking me for my view of how one should live on this earth, but now you are attacking my posts in general. I agree, and I dont like it either - as you can see from my previous post.


No one can honestly say that it's a stretch to say "a cheat is a cheat". It is a fact. Cheating is a nice word for breaking a law or rule. If you find my belief offensive, it is because you want to pick and choose what rules you will follow. It simply isn't right and I don't see how anyone can rationalize it.
This is another point I completely agree with and I think if most people think about it, they will see that it's right on the money. Society as a whole - does not and should not have the right to arbitrarily decide which rules and laws are "ok" to follow and which are not... this is why we vote. Sure, this is a cruise forum, but I still believe those that choose to bend, break or otherwise ignore certain rules are those who also believe they are "special" or exempt and no amount of rationalization will convince me otherwise.

You don't have to agree with me but neither should you flame me because I disagree with you.

I agree with this 110%!!! Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion - if you believe in something strongly enough, present an argument instead of flaming... ! Heather gave clear, concise reasons for her argument, while others just reacted to what she posted.

[Pheton]

If the cruise line wanted to stop this, the technology exists to do so. (Norwegian Dawn). The fact is that they (HAL) know people will bring liquor aboard and allow it. This occurs regularly from embarkation and from those returning from port. They choose to allow it. They would like to discourage it for revenue purposes (against the "rules"). There are no liability issues or they would take drunks (coming from port or shipboard bars) into custody or room confinement. You could probably also find "rules" against being drunk on board if you read all of the fine print. For those of you that see it as a law or binding contractual obligation, you are are gullible and need to enlist common sense. For those who believe that the cruise line will "send you home", I have a bridge to sell you in NY.

[dakrewser]

If the cruise line wanted to stop this, the technology exists to do so. (Norwegian Dawn). The fact is that they (HAL) know people will bring liquor aboard and allow it. This occurs regularly from embarkation and from those returning from port. They choose to allow it. They would like to discourage it for revenue purposes (against the "rules"). There are no liability issues or they would take drunks (coming from port or shipboard bars) into custody or room confinement. You could probably also find "rules" against being drunk on board if you read all of the fine print. For those of you that see it as a law or binding contractual obligation, you are are gullible and need to enlist common sense. For those who believe that the cruise line will "send you home", I have a bridge to sell you in NY.

<sigh>

People have been put off ships (just read thru these boards a tad).

The technology also exists to ticket every speeder and red light runner. But the police don't do that. Does that mean that speeding and running red lights is OK? Is it that they only stop folks when they need the revenue?

Have you ever actually read your cruise contract? You know, the one you agree to when you purchase passage? You do agree to abide by the rules.

As for drunks boarding the ship, the ship has no liability for those who get drunk ashore - the bar they were in does.

I just cannot believe the lengths people will go to in an effort to show that breaking rules, breaking contracts and breaking laws really "isn't bad". Maybe its a maturity thing....

[michmike]

*still laffin* 140 posts and a whole lot of vitriol later and what have we resolved? NADA.... same as the last dozen times this debate raged. Not asking your approval or acceptance of bringing a bottle or two on board and not the least bit affected by your disapproval.

Surely there are bigger issues in this life that are worthy of our passion??

[TeresaJenkins]

This is an extremely personal insult which you have absolutely no right to make. Not only are you attacking me for my view of how one should live on this earth, but now you are attacking my posts in general.
Teresa, if you don't like me personally, that's fine. But you have absolutely no right to say it here. One of the "rules" here is you cannot attack anyone personally and I did not. I attacked a way of life and I stand by it.
No one can honestly say that it's a stretch to say "a cheat is a cheat". It is a fact. Cheating is a nice word for breaking a law or rule. If you find my belief offensive, it is because you want to pick and choose what rules you will follow. It simply isn't right and I don't see how anyone can rationalize it.

I don't know you or have any opinion on whether I like you or not. I was simply saying that I found your post offensive. I went on to say that I don't know if you mean it that way or if your wording has been taken wrong (like mine).
I have read a lot of your posts here, and yes some of yours seem to stir things up a bit, but that neither makes me like or dislike you. I added this because I wasn't sure if you mean to offend or not, but I have found more than one to be offensive. I can still not like it if you say that the people who break the rules are the same folks who cheat on their husbands or wives without disliking you personally.

I am sorry my post came accross as attacking you, please know that was not my intention. I was trying to disagreeing with you, and was trying tell you what I thought about your statement. I see I worded it poorly.

[stanford's girl]

Wow!!! I go to work today and come back and log in and and all h*** has broken loose on this thread. I think it all boils down to this: If you choose to "sneak or smuggle" booze on board, it IS BREAKING THE RULES. Justify any way you want to. Even it it costs more to buy it from room service or call ahead to ship services, you can drink it knowing that you have played by THE RULES. This is the way I CHOOSE to live my life!!!:)

[guzikim]

Hey,

I've just joined and have been lurking here really enjoying this thread. On the topic of who gets to make the rules, and who gets to decide which ones can be broken, uh, how about we all agree that we ALL decide for OURSELVES which rules we can morally live with bending/breaking?

Kim

[TeresaJenkins]

And if you choose to post about smuggling, you will challenged...
Now this I take offense to - you have gotten personal and Heather didn't.
Heather does not write "to stir things up"... she calls it like she sees it (as many of us do) and if you can provide a good rebuttal - please feel free, I like a good debate.
I don't find Heather's post offensive in the least - but I do take offense to those cruisers who think they are above certain rules and regulations and will continue to do as they please with little or no regard for the rest of the passengers.

I never said I "smuggle" or not (I have only been on 1 other cruise). I was addressing that just because someone "smuggles" the booze does not make them someone who cheats on their spouse. If I break choose to break this rule or -ANY RULE- it doesn't mean I will cheat on my husband.


I didn't mean to attack Heather, and have since told her I was sorry. I was trying to say I have read other posts of hers that I found offensive, but I wasn't sure if she meant them to be offensive or not. I worded my post poorly, and it looks like I was trying to attack her, but that was not my intention. This was the point I was trying to make; maybe she doesn't mean to offend, just like I didn't mean to offend.

You said:
"I do take offense to those cruisers who think they are above certain rules and regulations and will continue to do as they please with little or no regard for the rest of the passengers"

If I choose to break any rule, it has nothing to do with any other passengers. I would not do anything to put any other person in harms way. If you said this because you think the alcohol rule is about safety, let me make my point clear.
Booze from home is no more dangerous than booze sold in a package from any cruise line. It can be bought by the bottle/s.
So if I choose to bring my booze from home or buy it from the ship people can rest assured the risk factor is the same. If I am going to be irresponsible it doesn't matter where the booze was purchased to make it happen.

[bonnyweed]

The HAL wesbite states " Other than wine and/or champagne, bottles of alcoholic beverages purchased onboard or otherwise brought on the ship cannot be consumed on the ship. If the bottles are purchased duty free from the ship's gift shop or at ports of call, they will be collected for safekeeping and delivered to your stateroom on the last day of the voyage. A member of our Security Staff and Housekeeping Staff will be at the gangway to assist with the storage of your alcoholic beverage purchases. "
Please not that the consequence for bringing liquor on board is that it may be "collected." The posted consequences are not that you will be thrown off the ship.
I choose to bring a bottle or two of liquor on board. I accept that I may need to pay the consequences of having it confiscated till the end of the cruise. That has never happened, but I will be gracious and compliant if my liquor is discovered. Adds a little suspense to an otherwise dull embarkation process. I keep the liquor in plain view in my cabin and my steward has always been gracious about providing appropriate glassware for my in-cabin stash of liquor or wine.
I bring the liquor on board as a cost saving measure. Just because I can afford to pay for a cruise does not mean that I want to waste my hard-earned money at the bar.
In my opinion, it is inflammatory to call a person or persons a "cheat. " It really doesn't wash to say that the epithet was generalized and not "personal." Puhlease! And the linkage to marital infidelity was also over the top. Heather has expressed her opinion. It is her right. It is any reader's right to find her opinion rude or to find it sage wisdom.
I think Heather can take the heat of agreeing to disagree. I can certainly take the heat of whatever you toss back at me for tossing back a few in my cabin.
I will continue to bring my supplemental liquor and will drink it with a clean conscience and my favorite mixer. Cheers!

[Spender Nui]

It wasn't that long ago that HAL not only allowed you to bring booze aboard but they actually sold it, at duty free rates in the boarding lounge. Most other lines did too, but HAL continued the service longer than the others. They were one of the last cruise lines to stop treating passengers as children (although the real reason for the change is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$) and one of the reasons we sailed them for many cruises. We don't drink a lot during the day but always share a bottle of wine at dinner. Additionally we enjoy a liesurely drink while getting ready for dinner the same as we always do if on a land vacation. We don't want to call room service for a drink and wait until it arrives. We don't want to go to a bar and bring the drinks back to the cabin. WE WANT TO HAVE A DRINK IN OUR CABIN WHILE WE GET READY FOR DINNER! I don't know what's wrong with that and I'm really turned off with everyone talking about "sneaking, smuggling, cheating, etc.

[stanford's girl]

Bottles of alcoholic beverages purchased on board cannot be consumed on the ship???? Then why can you buy it from ship sevices or room service and drink it on the ship?:confused: If you bring it or buy it elsewhere, it's not O.K. but if you buy it from HAL it's O.K.?:rolleyes: Sounds like profit to me.:D

[ekerr19]

I never said I "smuggle" or not (I have only been on 1 other cruise). I do believe I've seen your posts on other threads supporting "smuggling", but I suppose I could be wrong.



If I choose to break any rule, it has nothing to do with any other passengers. I would not do anything to put any other person in harms way. If you said this because you think the alcohol rule is about safety, let me make my point clear. Well, let's get this clear... I, personally never referred to safety as the issue.

I am not going to continue this argument. You are simply missing the point which I will reiterate for the final time... who gets to decide which rules should be enforced? If I believe I am right and you believe you are, who decides? Without rules and laws where would we be? Sure, this is an insignificant matter; but without conscience, ethics, "right & wrong", morals, etc. – as a society, where would we be? I believe it is the responsibility of each and every individual to do what is right – and if that means abiding by a few insignificant “rules”, so be it…

This is the end of the discussion (or argument) for me.

[dakrewser]

Additionally we enjoy a liesurely drink while getting ready for dinner the same as we always do if on a land vacation. We don't want to call room service for a drink and wait until it arrives. We don't want to go to a bar and bring the drinks back to the cabin. WE WANT TO HAVE A DRINK IN OUR CABIN WHILE WE GET READY FOR DINNER! I don't know what's wrong with that and I'm really turned off with everyone talking about "sneaking, smuggling, cheating, etc.

There's nothing wrong with having a drink in your cabin. No one said there was. But if you sneak the booze in concealed in your luggage that's what we call smuggling and that makes you a cheat. It's really quite simple.

Now you can attempt to justify this any way you want, it's still breaking the rules, rules you agreed to abide by.

Still, I can see that no one is going to change their opinion much less their behavior. So I'm thru.

[Ziggy7]

Bottles of alcoholic beverages purchased on board cannot be consumed on the ship???? Then why can you buy it from ship sevices or room service and drink it on the ship?:confused: If you bring it or buy it elsewhere, it's not O.K. but if you buy it from HAL it's O.K.?:rolleyes: Sounds like profit to me.:D You missed the words "duty free" purchases :)

[stanford's girl]

Ziggy,

I didn't miss the words "duty free". I was going by Bonnyweed's post and the first sentence didn't say anything about that. It said "purchased on board or otherwise brought on board". The second sentence talked about duty free shops or brought back from ports which would be taken and stored for safe keeping. I understand that. The way the first sentence reads, one would have to assume that ANY bottles purchased on a HAL ship would be put away for safekeeping. Whether it's from ship's services, room service or duty free. Maybe they need to change the wording.:) Still think it's about the profit. But if they didn't make a profit, we would have to find another cruise line.:eek:

[Ziggy7]

Ziggy,

I didn't miss the words "duty free". I was going by Bonnyweed's post and the first sentence didn't say anything about that. It said "purchased on board or otherwise brought on board". The second sentence talked about duty free shops or brought back from ports which would be taken and stored for safe keeping. I understand that. The way the first sentence reads, one would have to assume that ANY bottles purchased on a HAL ship would be put away for safekeeping. Whether it's from ship's services, room service or duty free. Maybe they need to change the wording.:) Still think it's about the profit. But if they didn't make a profit, we would have to find another cruise line.:eek: Ahhhh ok just thought you missed that :)

[stanford's girl]

No problem and no offense taken Ziggy.:D

[stanford's girl]

Thought I'd throw that in as it's been a really weird day on the boards.:)

[Ziggy7]

No problem and no offense taken Ziggy.:D
Thanks, no offense was intended :)

[Vic The Parrot]

Continuing the boozing thing, thought I'd add my 2 cents to this. :)


Last month, after coming back on the ship in Cabo, I had a bottle of tequila in me bag. Paid a visit to Cabo Wabo, and picked up a t-shirt, and a bottle of the 'blue'.

Those were the only 2 items in that bag. Didn't try to conceal the bottle (of course, it's impossible .... the shape will still stand out thru the cloth) and put the bag on the belt upon my arrival on board.


Claimed it on the other side, and I wasn't stopped, nor questioned on the 'bottle'. I just continued on to the stairs, and to my cabin. There it was placed in the closet along with my other purchases from that day. And remained that way til I got off in San Diego.

BUT!

Did they know that bottle of tequila was opened on board?
Did they know it remained sealed until I got home?
Did they know the bottle leaked, and left a tan spot on that
Sammy Hagar t-shirt??

Anyways ... I'm not sure how that policy works.
It could be random, or they were too busy that day to dig thru peoples bags, or the whole thing is blown out of proportion.

Try it .... if they take the bottles, no big whoop.
And if they don't, no big whoop either ... just enjoy.

[tbroido]

Pre-post disclaimer: This post is not intended to insult anyone, so the taking of offense is expressly forbidden.

The person who wrote that Jesus is the only person who ever did not break a rule while on earth is grossly mistaken. Jesus broke plenty of rules. They are now seen in retrospect as rules that he had a right, even responsibility to break, but they were the rules in force at that time. Just preaching in public while not permitted by the Sadducees and Pharisees, which he did on many occasions.

While I am not comparing that rule or any of the following to smuggling alcohoil on board a cruise ship, the WWII era GERMAN government ruled by having rules and getting people to follow them. It was illegal to teach a slave how to read and write in the south until after the Civil War. It was illegal to harbor a fugitive slave in a non-slave sate before 1863. It was illegal for women to vote until 1920!!! I could go on and on.

Rules are important for an orderly and successful society but the rules in place in any one society in any one time can be viewed as harsh, unfair even ridiculous in retrospect.

To the person who advanced the straw man argument that those who break any rule will also cheat on spouses, well, why stop there. If I jaywalk doesn't that mean I have no compunction about murdering someone? That one is too easy to knock out of the park. Ghandi broke just about every rule and law relating to civil disobedience that the British had in India. I have never heard any reports that he cheated on his wife, although I suppose he may have. When he was starving himself he wasn't very attractive anyway.

I think it is obvious that HAL's rule is an economic one. They want the exclusive franchise on liquor service aboard their ships. They have the right to insist, but they also are permitting, even inviting, violations because the only penalty is you get your hooch back at the end of the cruise. If they felt this was a serious violation they would confiscate the stuff permanently but they know, because it is just an economic measure, that they cannot get away with that. Think about it. The fact that you get your stuff back is almost proof that the rule is in place only for their convenience and not because of a safety issue. They cannot control or know who drinks what on board one of their ships or they have an incredible video surveillance system staffed full time by dozens of employees.

Someone wrote sarcastically: So you have never driven 56 in a 55 mile an hour zone. I have hit 56 but only on the way to 62 as I always set the cruise control for 7 miles above the limit. That is the difference between de jure and de facto rules.

To the lady who made the "adopt an Akita" commercial. What happened, did they all get pink slips from the Emporer of Japan? Now if you wanna adopt a needy dog, let's talk Bichons. They have no regular gig guarding anyone's palace.

If anyone took offense to anything I have written, well, I have a rule that says that you can't (you can read it at the beginning of the post).

Anyway, we leave for our Westerdam cruise in 3 hours so I probably won't read this thread again until I come home fat, relaxed and full of legitimately purchased alcohol because, personally, I like Pina Coladas while cruising and did you ever try to smuggle all the stuff aboard for those? They threw my blender overboard the first time I tried.

Lighten up everyone.

[Vic The Parrot]

They threw my blender overboard the first time I tried.





Did you have that insurance??

[tbroido]

They denied my claim because I reported port side but the cruise line said it was starboard. All I know is that it was up near the pointy end.

[Vic The Parrot]

Next time, try Aflac....



:)

[Vic The Parrot]

If you didn't hear me ......


It's called


AAAAAAAAFFFFFLLLLLAAAAAAACCC!!!!!!!!!!





:)

[bluefish]

Wow, I don't know about booze in my luggage but I guess I'm going to have to stop carrying my own milk-duds into the movie theater at home!

Oops, smuggling milk-duds, I mean.

[richcrow]

All right, that I can handle. A few points:

3. I snuck booze on to my first cruise in Feb. Hadn't really discovered this sight and delved into it. Was unaware of a cabin liquor set - up for purchase until the week I left for cruise. The poster listed the procedure to get an in-room and you had to order 3 weeks prior. Now I know, live and learn. Believe me, I would rather pay a bit more and have my bottle in the room then go through hassle of sneaking.



I'm also not familar with a "cabin liquor set-up". Could someone inlighten me. I would like to consider something like this instead of just bring my own wine for inroom consumtion.

[HeatherInFlorida]

For the record, tbroido, and if you read the post, I never said people who smuggle booze cheat on their wives/husbands. Someone on this thread had said 60% of wives cheat on their husbands. I said it's probably the same 60% who smuggle booze onboard. I said a cheat is a cheat and I stand by it.

Theresa, your apology on the other thread was exceedingly nice and I appreciate it. You and I have hardly crossed paths on these boards ... so I don't know what posts you find so offensive. But an awful lot of people know me here and do not think of me as offensive in any way. If something I say offends your particular view, that's kind of the way life is. We can't please all the people all the time.

I try to be helpful and I try to bring laughter into people's days. If I haven't managed to do that for you, I'm sorry. I'm very direct; I feel strongly on some issues and I call it as I see it.

As for yesterday, it was a really fun day with some threads that had me laughing so hard I couldn't stop. I came on this thread by chance only and I can't begin to tell everyone how sorry I am that I did because it absolutely ruined an otherwise perfect day.

[elmorejj]

Thanks Michmike and tbroido for finally having some sane comments on this thread. It had really gotten out of hand...........jean :cool:

[Oceanwench]

:eek:
I hadn't looked at this thread in a while ... can't believe where it went!

I've been on other cruise message boards where the smuggling of alcohol is considered a fine art, and posters share tips on the best ways to do it.
Obviously that is not the case here!

I never realized it was such a contentious topic.

As a person who only drinks dark beer, I am disappointed HAL does not carry Negra Modelo or Beck's Dark. But what the heck ... I'll buy a Corona if I can't get dark. I'm not packing my own.

One of the things I enjoy on the cruises I've taken are the boat drinks -- frozen concoctions with fruit or little umbrellas. I also like the drinks of the day, the fun things like Lemon Drops and Lime Smashes.
Again, I'm not packing my own -- those umbrellas take up a lot of room!

The people who flaunt rules -- regardless of which rules they choose -- do bother me. I guess I just don't like the in-your-face attitude: "It's a HAL rule, I am breaking it, so sue me!"

And Heather, your posts always delight me, and I have never seen you write anything hurtful or nasty. I took your comment on the 60 percent thing as kind of tongue-in-cheek.

[HeatherInFlorida]

:eek:

And Heather, your posts always delight me, and I have never seen you write anything hurtful or nasty. I took your comment on the 60 percent thing as kind of tongue-in-cheek.

And you took it correctly, Oceanwench, .... and I thank you:o

[trubey]

By disallowing byob, I wonder if HAL isn't just practicing a little 'damage control' for their bar sales figures. As proven by this thread, we all have an extraordinary disposition to pay attention to rules -- ANY rules.

HAL isn't dumb. They know a lot of people bring liquor on their boats. If they can make us feel we're 'sneaking' it, we'll keep our little secret in the cabin and still pay their prices when we're in the public rooms. And everybody wins!

JMHO, Lane

[HeatherInFlorida]

Lane, definite possibility and a good point! After all, people sneak food into movie theatres (no, I don't because we're not supposed to;) ), but by prohibiting it they know people won't bring in trays of food. Same concept.

[Host Walt]

The issue about bringing booze aboard at the start is when it's excessive. The rule gives HAL a basis to deny a passenger who is bringing a few cases of beer or vodka from doing so. Further, bringing booze on board at the start or en route creates customs problems for HAL in the various port countries

As everyone knows, there are US customs limits:From US Customs "Know Before You Go"-
Alcohol and Tobacco. Travelers 21 or older may bring back 1 liter of alcohol duty-free, provided the beverage laws of the state through which they reenter the United States allow it. In some Caribbean countries, 2 liters are allowed, and in the case of the U.S. Virgin Islands, 5 liters are allowed. In both cases, one of the liters must be a product of that country. In addition, 100 non-Cuban cigars and 200 cigarettes are allowed, regardless of your age. From the U.S. Virgin Islands, 1,000 cigarettes are allowed, but only 200 of them may have been acquired elsewhere. Antiques and works of art more than 100 years old are duty-free.
One question I never see answered in these threads. Has anyone had any booze confiscated at the time of boarding?

[Vic The Parrot]

One question I never see answered in these threads. Has anyone had any booze confiscated at the time of boarding?


Never tried it on HAL. But on Cunard, I never had a problem.
Had a bottle of champagne, and a liter of scotch in my carry-on, and never was an issue. Always walked on the ship in NY and Southampton without anyone asking me.

[ryansmemom]

The issue about bringing booze aboard at the start is when it's excessive. The rule gives HAL a basis to deny a passenger who is bringing a few cases of beer or vodka from doing so. Further, bringing booze on board at the start or en route creates customs problems for HAL in the various port countries

As everyone knows, there are US customs limits:
One question I never see answered in these threads. Has anyone had any booze confiscated at the time of boarding?


Just a thought. Well maybe more than one.

I spend a lot of time pondering the insignificance of my individual existence in this world. It is interesting in a world of me, me me to look at how insignificant we as individuals can be. It can be very comforting as well. We are a society of individuals who are so focused on ourselves and our own rights that I find it refreshing to remember that the world does not revolve around me. It is very nice to be unimportant to everyone except those people who really matter to me who I have invested in. As far as a huge company like Holland America, I am merely a statistic to them. A statistic who creates income, but a statistic nonetheless. Not significant enough to determine policy on my own.

I believe that the decisions they make are profit driven. They are in business to make a profit. they make a profit by satisfying their customers and generating business. They also have to deal with many regulations and government authorities, as Walt has graciously pointed out.

We have all seen the rules on the books. Rules in the contracts. HAL places them there for various reasons. Some are safety driven, some profit driven, some government or other higher authority driven. Or they may be some combination of the above. The enforcement of the rules is inconsistent. Individual crews are given a lot of leeway and allowed to make these decisions.

HAL does, in my opinion try to treat their guests like adults. They are not heavy handed in enforcing these rules, especially when safety is not the issue. Many municipalities handle laws on the books this way. Remember the blue laws in many states. How strictly does the local constabulary enforce the law in our individual homes?

I do not think HAL really cares about where I purchased the booze I am drinking before dinner in my cabin. On an individual basis, they don't really care and will even help me out as long as I don't force the issue and throw it in their faces. If I walk up the gangway with a case or 5 of beer they will reserve the right to confisgate it.

Do they have the right to make the rules? Yes they do. It is their ship. Just like we all get to make the rules in our homes, they get to make the rules on their ships. Do they have the right to expect that the people on board will adhere to the rules? I think they are correct to have that expectation, just as we all have the expectation that people will adhere to our rules when they are in our homes. Will everyone follow through and adhere to the rules? Probably not. Will there be consequences? For some, yes. For others, no. Would you be upset if someone broke your rules in your house? Probably more than HAL would be if you broke the rules on their ship. For them it's just business and they are getting paid. When someone breaks the rules in your home it's personal.

As far as the ethics of this issue, that is very personal and between each of us and whatever higher power we choose, in my opinion.

What I am trying to say is this is a complex issue. HAL has made these rules for complex reasons. I do not think they are concerned with the behaviors most of us are talking about such as bringing some favorite beverage onboard to enjoy in the privacy of our cabin. I imagine it is something akin to walking a tightrope at times for the front line hotel staff trying to follow the rules set by the corporation that satisfy the needs of the company and also satsify the individual guest for whom they are attempting to provide a "perfect" cruise. Perhaps that is why the rules are enforced so inconsistently.

Please forgive my rambling. I hope I did not confuse anyone. I hope I did not offend anyone. These are just some thoughts I had on a Saturday afternoon while reading this very long thread. This is such a contentious issue. People are very passionate about it.

Linda

[KSCnCA]

Regarding confiscated booze: we saw some sitting to the side of the table where our wine was checked over. We only had wine and champagne so we had absolutely no trouble bringing it on to our Zui cruise 12/04, or our RCI cruise 10/02. But when my girlfriends and I took the Carnival Spirit out of San Diego in 04/03 they pulled us aside, called someone to come look at our champagne, and we waited for 10 to 15 minutes for the woman to come tell us it was fine. Carnival says you can bring wine or champagne if you are celebrating a special occaision. (What cruise is not a special occaision? We were taking our annual bunco weekend getaway and had 2 magnums of Chandon for our group of 12.) It was not a very organized embarkation, it could have been the first Spirit cruise out of San Diego and the shore people were not up to speed. We brought the Champagne to the waiter the first night and asked that it be chilled and served on formal night. They charged us $10 per magnum corkage. He said that had we not been sitting right next to the doorway to the kitchen he wouldn't have had to charge the corkage, but we expected to pay it and was a deal at twice the price.

[notyats]

If you drink clear booze, ie: vodka, gin or rum all you have to do is put it in a water bottle. We carried ours on in plan site. When we ran out on the long trip bought a big bottle of water on the ship getting off and put a liter in it before returning to the ship. SIMPLE!!

[guzikim]

Teresa,

I think your post was fine, my gosh! Anyway, as I'm going on my first cruise on the Maasdam, in like 4 days, what can you tell me about it? Anything would be good. And, if I choose to "sneak" liquor on board and it's in my checked luggage, would they throw me off the ship? I've had friends tell me that they've done it and that their cabin steward knew, didn't care, and even brought them mixers and ice, because they tipped him well?

Kim

[Spender Nui]

Just about all the cruise lines prohibit you from bringing booze aboard today. They all used to sell it to you duty free before you boarded.

The cost of drinks aboard also used to reflect the duty free liquor costs. That too has gone by the wayside.

Anyone who thinks the prohibition of bringing your own on isn't based on $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ is kidding themselves.

[guzikim]

Parrot Cruiser,

Well said!

Kim

[TeresaJenkins]

Teresa,
I think your post was fine, my gosh! Anyway, as I'm going on my first cruise on the Maasdam, in like 4 days, what can you tell me about it? Anything would be good. And, if I choose to "sneak" liquor on board and it's in my checked luggage, would they throw me off the ship? I've had friends tell me that they've done it and that their cabin steward knew, didn't care, and even brought them mixers and ice, because they tipped him well?
Kim

I too will be going on my 1st cruise on the Maasdam next month, so I can't give you any 1st hand knowledge.

As for throwing you off the ship for found booze, the answer is no. As I understand it, they will take it until the end of the cruise. I can't speak for the steward not caring, but I have heard no one say they were turned in by their steward. He/she wants your tip so I would have to say no, he won't turn you in for booze.;)

My official stand on the issue:
I don't care if anyone over 21 takes their own booze aboard, and I don't think it hampers their moral fiber if they break the rule. If that was the case, I guess my moral fiber has long been buried because I have broken about every "fashion rule" I can think of at the moment. :D
I guess coloring outside the lines won't help in resurrecting my moral fiber either. :eek: Well now I know what to say in Confession next week. :rolleyes:

Have a great time, and make sure you give us a detailed recap when you get home.

[tbroido]

Heather:

You wrote, in response to me:
"Someone on this thread had said 60% of wives cheat on their husbands. I said it's probably the same 60% who smuggle booze onboard. I said a cheat is a cheat and I stand by it."

Then you responded to this from Oceanwench:
"I took your comment on the 60 percent thing as kind of tongue-in-cheek."

with "And you took it correctly, Oceanwench, .... and I thank you."

So which was it, Heather? Was it the overly judgemental and preposterously assuming yet serious "I stand by (my opinion)" or was it "kind oftongue-in-cheek" and you really don't believe that everyone who ever smuggled booze onto a HAL ship has been unfaithful to their spouse? Just curious.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Heather:

You wrote, in response to me:
"Someone on this thread had said 60% of wives cheat on their husbands. I said it's probably the same 60% who smuggle booze onboard. I said a cheat is a cheat and I stand by it."

Then you responded to this from Oceanwench:
"I took your comment on the 60 percent thing as kind of tongue-in-cheek."

with "And you took it correctly, Oceanwench, .... and I thank you."

So which was it, Heather? Was it the overly judgemental and preposterously assuming yet serious "I stand by (my opinion)" or was it "kind oftongue-in-cheek" and you really don't believe that everyone who ever smuggled booze onto a HAL ship has been unfaithful to their spouse? Just curious.

Oh, for heaven's sake! Let's bury this poor dead horse!!!! I stand by my statement that "a cheat is a cheat". I also believe that the same 60% who cheat on their wives/husbands would more likely feel comfortable sneaking liquor on board.

And obviously the whole statement ... from start to finish ... was tongue in cheek! Frankly I didn't see any of this as terribly important and I still don't.

I will spell it out for you since you seem to have difficulty with the concept. I said that a person who cheats on his/her spouse is the person more likely to smuggle booze onboard. This is very different from saying that someone who smuggles booze onboard ship will also cheat on his/her spouse. I never said that, never hinted it and never suggested it.

I'm sorry if you can't see the difference between the above 2 statements. They are lightyears apart. And look who's using words like "judgemental and preposterously assuming".

[michmike]

goodness.. the vitriol continues..almost hesitant to post again as my last was zapped due to political incorrectness (my propensity again for rule breaking).. but here's a thought from dame margot fonteyn that may offer some probative value to all those who would impose THEIR ideas of morality on the rest of us..


"The one important thing I have learned over the years is the difference between taking one's work seriously and taking one's self seriously. The first is imperative..... and the second is disastrous"

[CGTNORMANDIE]

I would first suggest that some of you actually read the HAL cruise contract. It should say that "HAL reserves the right to refuse..." You will probably find that booze is left to the discretion of HAL and not forbidden.

OBTW...nothing is smuggled onboard if it can be seen in an open suitcase or on an Xray machine. You folks who are emptying out mouth wash bottles crack me up...just pack the real bottle in your suitcase in a plastic zip lock bag...make sure you buy your liquor in a plastic bottle...not glass...although...come to think of it...I have never had a problem with either and I always leave my suitcase unlocked if they want to inspect it...and they have...never a problem.

Now about the cheating wives etc. I am giving this one a lot of thought...I think I will try and hook up with some of my fellow booze enthusiasts on my next cruise and I will let you folks know how far I get!!! One thing is for certain...it will take at least 3-4 drinks before I get lucky!!! LOL!!!

ROSS

[TeresaJenkins]

Now about the cheating wives etc. I am giving this one a lot of thought...I think I will try and hook up with some of my fellow booze enthusiasts on my next cruise and I will let you folks know how far I get!!! One thing is for certain...it will take at least 3-4 drinks before I get lucky!!! LOL!!!
ROSS

OMG, now that's funny! :D
You are a bad bad boy!:eek:

[TeresaJenkins]

To the lady who made the "adopt an Akita" commercial. What happened, did they all get pink slips from the Emporer of Japan? Now if you wanna adopt a needy dog, let's talk Bichons. They have no regular gig guarding anyone's palace.


LOL I see you know a bit about the breed. :)

My 'commercial" is about the Akitas who are in your local pound or shelter. We got our beauty from the SPCA in Richmond. She is my kind of pooch, she never barks unless something is amiss. She only sheds 2 times a year, but when she does she drops her entire coat.:eek: It is very messy for 2 weeks, but it's great to never have to worry about it at other times during the year.

What is a Bichon like?
I just looked them up, and they look very pretty, but would end up a chew toy for the Akita.:eek: LOL

I hope you have a great cruise, give us details upon your return or while you cruise.

BTW, I loved your post; it was funny.:D

[HeatherInFlorida]

Teresa, you won't believe this:) , but I have a Bichon and she would get along great with your Akita. She has no understanding of size. She loves all dogs, all people, all things. They are happy, playful little dogs who really serve no earthly purpose but to love us. She's also a great little watch dog. In dog shows they compete in the non-sporting group and usually lose to poodles. But they don't care:) . I love every dog who lives on this earth and grew up with a Lab mix, Goldens, and Collies. They're all just amazing. So you and I share something in common after all;) .

[guzikim]

Oh my goodness,
I have been hitting the post reply button at the bottom of the page and tried to figure out how to hit a quick reply one, so, I clicked on something, typed a message to you and hit send, and all of a sudden it said I was reporting a bad post. Oh God, I hope I'm not getting anyone in trouble! All I said was that I would report everything, that I wasn't worried about my moral fiber also:), and that I just bought a digital camera and would take pictures and try to figure out how to get them to you. Oh noooo. . .

Kim

[TeresaJenkins]

Oh my goodness,
I have been hitting the post reply button at the bottom of the page and tried to figure out how to hit a quick reply one, so, I clicked on something, typed a message to you and hit send, and all of a sudden it said I was reporting a bad post. Oh God, I hope I'm not getting anyone in trouble! All I said was that I would report everything, that I wasn't worried about my moral fiber also:), and that I just bought a digital camera and would take pictures and try to figure out how to get them to you. Oh noooo. . .
Kim

Kim, relax. I don't think it is anything to worry about. If I get a warning or anything it's no big deal either. :)
I'm more worried about hurting someones feelings when I write something which is hard to take back, but this is nothing. I wonder how many people have made the same mistake as you. I may have done it too, and not even know.

[theotherone]

Teresa,

I think your post was fine, my gosh! Anyway, as I'm going on my first cruise on the Maasdam, in like 4 days, what can you tell me about it? Anything would be good. And, if I choose to "sneak" liquor on board and it's in my checked luggage, would they throw me off the ship? I've had friends tell me that they've done it and that their cabin steward knew, didn't care, and even brought them mixers and ice, because they tipped him well?

Kim

Our cabin steward iced ours down when we went to dinner. I immediately had him fired!! Who was he to decide which rules of HAL he enforces, after all I'm sure he has to abide be his employer's rules, and as we've all been told over and over a rule is a rule is a rule. :p :D

[Host Walt]

Oh my goodness,
I have been hitting the post reply button at the bottom of the page and tried to figure out how to hit a quick reply one, so, I clicked on something, typed a message to you and hit send, and all of a sudden it said I was reporting a bad post. Oh God, I hope I'm not getting anyone in trouble! All I said was that I would report everything, that I wasn't worried about my moral fiber also:), and that I just bought a digital camera and would take pictures and try to figure out how to get them to you. Oh noooo. . .

KimAha! Now I know why I got that very strange alert.

Here's what you said, guzikim:Teresa,

Hey, I'll be sure to tell you EVERYTHING as a way to thank those kind enough to answer my naive questions. That is, assuming I don't get thrown off:) And, no, I don't feel that my moral fiber is in question either! I just bought a digital camera and you can download pictures to send to people. If I can figure out where to send them to you, I will. I found a site where a guy took pictures of everything on the ship, and it was great fun to look at, so, I'll try to do it also.

Kim And no, all is fine. No one is in trouble.

[Host Walt]

Kim, relax. I don't think it is anything to worry about. Correct.If I get a warning or anything it's no big deal either. :) Correct.
I'm more worried about hurting someones feelings when I write something which is hard to take back, but this is nothing. I wonder how many people have made the same mistake as you. I may have done it too, and not even know.Actually we average about one a day. It's no big deal and we Hosts always try to find a way to post it on the board if we can.

[guzikim]

Teresa and Walt,

Thanks and boy am I glad to know that I'm not the only one!

Kim

[TeresaJenkins]

Teresa, you won't believe this , but I have a Bichon and she would get along great with your Akita. She has no understanding of size. She loves all dogs, all people, all things. They are happy, playful little dogs who really serve no earthly purpose but to love us. She's also a great little watch dog. In dog shows they compete in the non-sporting group and usually lose to poodles. But they don't care . I love every dog who lives on this earth and grew up with a Lab mix, Goldens, and Collies. They're all just amazing. So you and I share something in common after all .

Heather, you baby is so cute!!!

You know I was never a pet person, or didn't think I was until I got a pet of my own. We have 2 cats, and of course ISIS our Akita. My poor hubby has the patients of Job, with 4 teenage daughters, a wife, and 3 pets (all females).:eek:

We walks IsIs most of the time saying "he worries she might hurt another pet while outside because she wants to play with them". I think he may have made that up in order to get out of the house.;) It can get quite lively here in the evenings. LOL

BTW, I love the bow. We tried putting one on ISIS, but she kept eating them. Now my daughters just paint her toenails.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Teresa, actually that's not a bow (though I see it looks like one). I took the picture on the steps to a jacuzzi and that's an azalea flower! Molly's not fond of bows either:D ... though she gets one attached to her collar over the holidays.

[grayesq]

Most cruisers entirely miss the reasoning behind the no alcohol rules that are now in effect on nearly every major cruiseline.
Revenues have nothing to do with it.
My previous employer experimented with confiscating alcohol on one cruise and then allowing it on the next. The Bars had the same revenue in both cases.

But in America we have a rather strange law that holds the server of alcohol legally responsible for the actions of those who get drunk in his establishment.
If I spend a lot of time and money training my Bar Staff on responsible alcohol service, and then you go back to your cabin and drink three or four bottles of tequila that you brought in your suitcase, I am still legally responsible for the conseques of all your actions when you are drunk.
My former employer currently has over $500,000,000 (that's half a BILLION) in pending litigation against the company, brought by guests who got drunk in their cabins, started a fight, fell down and broke something, fell overboard, you name it. Most are frivolous lawsuits that will be thrown out of court. But the company estimates that it will cost them about $50,000,000 in legal costs to fight the lawsuits. $50,000,000 will pay for a great many SS cabins over the course of the next few decades.

If you owned a cruise line and faced the problems of:

1. Alienating a small percentage of your clientele by not allowing them to bring their favorite spirits to drink in their cabins.
or
2. Losing 10s of Millions - or even 100's of millions of dollars to idiots who cannot be responsible for their own behaviour on your ships,

what would you do?

Like many cruise line companies, I would prove to the courts that we are making every possible effort to control the amount of liquor brought onboard and consumed by our guests. I would set up a system where the only alcohol served onboard is served responsibly by crew who are schooled in dealing with drunks and reporting them to the proper managers. I would set up a system where all alcohol consumed is tracked on a Point of Sale System, so that it can be monitored hourly, daily, and weekly.
Then the inevitable happens; some idiot manages to smuggle several bottles of whiskey into his cabin, gets drunk and falls overboard in the middle of the Caribbean, in the middle of the night. He is dead. His family sues the cruise line for a billion dollars for letting him get drunk and kill himself (it happens all the time folks. Remember McDonalds and the hot coffee?).
At that point the cruise line can prove that they acted responsibly, made every reasonable attempt to prevent this from happening, and avoids paying the billion dollars to the idiot's widow.
What does that mean to the average cruiser?
It means that the price of your cruise will not be raised significantly to cover the billion dollar loss that the company's alcohol policy thankfully avoided.

Having a bottle of booze in your cabin is a great delight for most cruisers - myself included. I didn't behave badly and cause all these problems. Neither did you. But enough morons did. The legal eagles at the cruise lines finally said, "Enough is enough". And now we all suffer for the actions of a few.

Your reasoning might make some sense were it not for the fact that HAL is perfectly willing to sell you as much liquor as you want to consume in your room at steeply inflated prices. Once they've sold you one or two liters of liquor for consumption in your room, there are absolutely no controls over how much you drink, or who drinks it. So, nice try, but the argument doesn't work here.

[jtl513]

Your reasoning might make some sense were it not for the fact that HAL is perfectly willing to sell you as much liquor as you want to consume in your room at steeply inflated prices.Are they? I thought liquor bought in the on-board shops was held and delivered to you the night before disembarkation. :confused: I suppose you could take a partial bottle of wine from the dining room once or twice a day.

[jazzsea]

My clients over the last few years have come up with some rather interesting ways to smuggle liquor aboard Holland America Line. The best is still the plastic Listerine bottle. Or for clear liquor many us dental rinse plastic bottles. About half of my clients have gotten to their cabins only to find that the liquor is missing from their luggage. Several have not placed the bottles in plastic zip lock bags and have had to have their clothing dry cleaned because of booze leaking from the bottle.

Think of all the anxiety involved here. "Will they search my luggage?" "Will they take my bottle away?" "Will my clothes be ruined?"

Why not approach this liquor business in an adult manner. Purchase liquor through Ship Services and quit trying to get away with something.

[grayesq]

<sigh>

People have been put off ships (just read thru these boards a tad).

The technology also exists to ticket every speeder and red light runner. But the police don't do that. Does that mean that speeding and running red lights is OK? Is it that they only stop folks when they need the revenue?

Have you ever actually read your cruise contract? You know, the one you agree to when you purchase passage? You do agree to abide by the rules.

As for drunks boarding the ship, the ship has no liability for those who get drunk ashore - the bar they were in does.

I just cannot believe the lengths people will go to in an effort to show that breaking rules, breaking contracts and breaking laws really "isn't bad". Maybe its a maturity thing....

This is a facinating thread, even two years after the fact. I find it interesting that so many posters seem to equate the "rules" that exist by virtue of the cruise contract with laws that have been enacted by elected legislators. If there's a law we don't like, we have the ability to elect legislators who agree with our view and have that law repealed. We have no such right when it comes to the cruise lines. In the vast majority of cases, a "contract" is a negotiated agreement between two or more parties. Each party has an opportunity to have input into the terms of the contract and no party is required to become bound by the contract if it contains terms that the party does not agree to. The same cannot be said of cruise contracts. These are totally one-sided "agreements" drafted by the cruise lines' lawyers to benefit only the cruise lines. The passengers have no opportunity whatsoever to provide any input into these contracts or negotiate any of their terms. Legally, these are referred to as adhesion contracts and, in certain circumstances, if they are too onerous, the courts may refuse to enforce them. So I, for one, have no problem with the concept that if the cruise line arbitrarily and unilaterally imposes "rules" that I feel are unjust, I may do what I need to to circumvent those "rules" as long as I 1) do not violate any laws or 2) interfere the other passengers' enjoyment of their cruise.

[grayesq]

Are they? I thought liquor bought in the on-board shops was held and delivered to you the night before disembarkation. :confused: I suppose you could take a partial bottle of wine from the dining room once or twice a day.

No, if you go to the HAL web site you will see that you can purchase "gift" bottles of liquor that you can consume in your cabin during the trip.

[serendipity1499]

Your reasoning might make some sense were it not for the fact that HAL is perfectly willing to sell you as much liquor as you want to consume in your room at steeply inflated prices. Once they've sold you one or two liters of liquor for consumption in your room, there are absolutely no controls over how much you drink, or who drinks it. So, nice try, but the argument doesn't work here.

My goodness..How did you ever find this thread..The last post on it is more than two years old;) ...

I honestly believe Bruce Muzz was telling it like it is...

I don't believe those who Purchase liquor on board, all Cruise Lines, (not just HAL) at the inflated prices are those who get drunk...

The Drunks are the ones who smuggle many bottles of booze on board...Then if something happens to them they, or their families sue the Cruise Line!:( And many times the Cruise lines settle rather than fight it out in court!

Have you seen the lawsuits lately from people or family's of those who who have been injured, or have either jumped, gone overboard accidental or have been murdered & thrown from Cruise ships! A honeymooners wife was drunk & found on an cruise sleeping it off in a corrider...she just got a nice big settlement from RCCL because her DH who was also drinking & either fell or was pushed overboard....:rolleyes: Give me a break..

JMO...Betty

[serendipity1499]

Are they? I thought liquor bought in the on-board shops was held and delivered to you the night before disembarkation. :confused: I suppose you could take a partial bottle of wine from the dining room once or twice a day.

You are confusing the tax free liquor purchased in the on-board shops with the liquor purchased through HAL for consumption on board..

All passengers can purchase a bottle of liquor with set ups for consumption on board through HAL or any other cruise line at a steep markup...This is delivered to your cabin from the HAL's Bar Service Department..

However, liquor purchased through the on board shops is much less than it would be if purchased from liquor stores in the U.S. & is Tax free... These must be declared on your customs form & will be held until the last night of your cruise..

[ON cruiser]

I can't resist joining in on this topic. On our first HAL cruise in 2001 passengers (we pay for passage; I personally dislike the term "guests" which implies I am there on sufferance) were allowed to bring on board personal liquor for cabin consumption. Also, one could purchase liquor in the duty-free shop on board, at a small premium, for cabin consumption.

About a year later this rule changed--no more hard spirits but only wine, champagne and perhaps beer (while I drink beer, have never brought any on board so have no concrete knowledge if it was or was not allowed) could be brought on board.

Found that out the hard way when was stopped by a deck-hand when boarding a HAL ship in 2002. When I expresssed concern and offered to discuss this new policy, not in place when I booked, with any officer, he let us pass with the two bottles in our carry-on. Ever since then, on our 2 yearly cruises, I have cheerfully been a scofflaw on this issue--taking a bottle of Vodka for my wife and Scotch for me, purchased at duty-free before leaving Canada. These sit out in the open on the liquor cabinet, and I even ask for decent cocktail glasses from the steward. Never has a bottle been taken, or even an eyebrow raised, or anything said by our cabin steward--who clearly knows what we are doing, the mini-bar guy who checks the cabin daily (no business for him other than purchasing bottled water), and any supervisor who must access our cabin, for example to adjust the a/c.

This is only for in-cabin consumption to enjoy on the balcony before dinner, and we still purchase liquor, wine packages for dinner, etc, in the bars on board. I have been told by several guest relations managers that ship staff do not enjoy enforcing this rule imposed upon them by Seattle HQ. Last Spring, when I bought some hard liquor at one of the Islands, fully intending for it to go to storage as we were bringing it on from a port--prices too good to resist--the deckhands, when I asked them to take it from me and put it in storage, told me it was ok to keep in my room (that surprised me but others that day had the same experience--later in the week things tightened up, apparently).

To those who say we should unquestionally obey all the rules, let us look at the context: this was a legitimate activity for many years and the only reason HAL (and the other lines) changed this was to boost bar revenue and get us to pay for the mini-bar. To say that wine and champagne is ok but hard liquor is not--is a distinction without a difference. There was no principled reason to support the change in policy. If rules are ridiculous, of course there will be issues with compliance--people will not respect silly or unjust rules.

My view is that my cabin, like a hotel room, is mine to use for any legal activity. Can anyone imagine Hilton or Westin telling someone that he or she can not have their own bottles in the room but must only consume liquor in the hotel bar?

While we love cruising, and enjoy HAL, and to be fair, they were one of the last lines to succumb to this revenue-boosting activity, all cruise lines should re-consider this rule--I know we are not the only people each cruise who do this to avoid, frankly, inflated prices for liquor...I do not like excessive "nickle and dimeing" when I have paid a fair amount for the cruise, and will spend a fair amount on board on goods and services, without complaint. Yet, this is a rule that screams excess.

Ok, should I say how I really feel about this and stop holding back? :)

[serendipity1499]

The issue about bringing booze aboard at the start is when it's excessive. The rule gives HAL a basis to deny a passenger who is bringing a few cases of beer or vodka from doing so. Further, bringing booze on board at the start or en route creates customs problems for HAL in the various port countries

As everyone knows, there are US customs limits:
One question I never see answered in these threads. Has anyone had any booze confiscated at the time of boarding?

I think it's so funny that I'm responding to a post which is more than two years old!;)

Had booze confiscated when we were on an Eastbound Trans-Atlantic on the Westerdam in Nov. 2004...

We purchased an expensive bottle of Brandy, in one our last ports before the Trans-Atlantic portion..It was a gift for the friends who were caring for our dog...

I re-boarded the ship & put the package on the scanner...The officer asked me if it was alcohol.. Of course I said "yes, it's a gift"...They confiscated it & returned it to me the last night of the cruise..Betty

P.S. Can't imagine how I missed this thread two years ago, but it took me hours to read all the posts..Some of them are/were very funny!

[grayesq]

My goodness..How did you ever find this thread..The last post on it is more than two years old;) ...

I honestly believe Bruce Muzz was telling it like it is...

I don't believe those who Purchase liquor on board, all Cruise Lines, (not just HAL) at the inflated prices are those who get drunk...

The Drunks are the ones who smuggle many bottles of booze on board...Then if something happens to them they, or their families sue the Cruise Line!:( And many times the Cruise lines settle rather than fight it out in court!

Have you seen the lawsuits lately from people or family's of those who who have been injured, or have either jumped, gone overboard accidental or have been murdered & thrown from Cruise ships! A honeymooners wife was drunk & found on an cruise sleeping it off in a corrider...she just got a nice big settlement from RCCL because her DH who was also drinking & either fell or was pushed overboard....:rolleyes: Give me a break..

JMO...Betty

I'm sailing on the Westerdam in a few weeks and was doing a search on the subject when this thread popped up. I must respectfully disagree with your suggestion that the "drunks" are those who carry liquor on board while people who only buy liquor from the cruise line are not. I suspect that if you could conduct an accurate survey, you would not find any correlation between the two. Some people who bring liquor on board get drunk. Some do not. Some people who don't bring liquor on board and drink only the cruise line's liquor get drunk. Some do not. And as far as the lawsuits go, first off, they are few and far between. When you consider the number of passengers who cruise annually, the number who have some sort of incident and end up suing the cruise line as a result is most likely an extremely low percentage. Second, who's to say that there is any correlation between alcohol use and injuries or other incidents that give rise to lawsuits? While I suspect that alcohol might be involved in some of the incidents you mention, I would also suspect that in many others it was not a factor. If cruise lines were really that concerned about alcohol use being a cause of increased lawsuits against the cruise lines, they would ban the consumption of alcohol entirely. But of course we all know they're not going to do that because (a) it would discourage far too many people from cruising and (b) I suspect they make far more money from the sale of alcohol than they pay out in any given year in legal fees, settlements and judgments from the lawsuits you reference.

[serendipity1499]

I'm sailing on the Westerdam in a few weeks and was doing a search on the subject when this thread popped up. I must respectfully disagree with your suggestion that the "drunks" are those who carry liquor on board while people who only buy liquor from the cruise line are not. I suspect that if you could conduct an accurate survey, you would not find any correlation between the two. Some people who bring liquor on board get drunk. Some do not. Some people who don't bring liquor on board and drink only the cruise line's liquor get drunk. Some do not. And as far as the lawsuits go, first off, they are few and far between. When you consider the number of passengers who cruise annually, the number who have some sort of incident and end up suing the cruise line as a result is most likely an extremely low percentage. If cruise lines were really that concerned about alcohol use being a cause of increased lawsuits against the cruise lines, they would ban the consumption of alcohol entirely. But of course we all know they're not going to do that because (a) it would discourage far too many people from cruising and (b) I suspect they make far more money from the sale of alcohol than they pay out in any given year in legal fees, settlements and judgments from the lawsuits you reference.

Please don't Misquote me!....I did not say the drunks are those who carry liquor on board...I purposely highlighted the portion of what I said..

I said: "The Drunks are the ones who smuggle many bottles of booze on board..."

I never said persons who bring one or two bottles on board are drunks...I still stand by what I said about the ones who insist on bringing: " MANY Bottles of Alcohol & wine on board"

They are the people who abused the privilege & caused HAL to change the policy.. When we first started sailing HAL we were permitted to bring a reasonable amount of liquor on board..

We travel with another couple on our cruises..One time we all invited a third couple to join us... The third couple smuggled almost a case of liquor plus wine on board in addition to what was wrapped up among their clothing.....When they ran out of booze, the Gentleman went into port, purchased more liquor & poured it into water bottles in order to get it on board...(This was the same cruise where HAL confiscated our gift bottle of Brandy)

This couple could not function without a drink or two at lunch & then a three hour happy hour in the evening..They were always 10-15 min late for our 8:30 dinner time...After the first week, the four of us decided not to wait dinner for them, which really was awkward.. Our dinner was still delayed so the third couple could catch up with us...We all had to run to get into the show lounge at 10:30 almost every night or would have had to leave the third couple at the table, which is rude..

Needless to say, even though we normally enjoyed being with them at home it became very tedious for 21 days.. Since then , our regular traveling buddies & we have been gun shy about inviting others to join us because of that experience..

And do agree, that HAL is making money on liquor & why not! They have to make the $$$ some how..

Cruises prices have not increased & kept up with inflation..Our invoices for the past 10 years do not show a significant increase in our outside cabin per day.. (Yes have a closet full of stuff from all our trips...Retired from the travel business & travel is still in my veins!)

In 1996 we paid $214.00 per day plus port charges for an outside cabin on NCL...In 1998 we paid $267.00 per day (including port charges) for an outside on the Ryndam...In 2006 our Outside cabin on the Prinsendam was $212.36 plus port charges per day..

HAL needs to make it up somewhere & this is one way to do it..I'm delighted that our cruise prices have not increased & would willingly pay for our drinks in order to keep the prices low..If we can't afford it, then I'll give up having that evening cocktail...

You may not believe there is a correlation between alcohol use and injuries or other incidents that give rise to the lawsuits? But many people in the business will disagree with you...I've read so many of the accounts of those accidents..(not talking about the ones who are deliberately trying to commit suicide)..You would be amazed how many of them are directly caused by abuse of alcohol..

OK I'll get off my soapbox now..Cheers..:) Betty

[RuthC]

Betty, the likely reason for bringing this very old thread forward was to stir things up; it serves no other purpose.
If you don't feed into it the thread will die again.

[serendipity1499]

Betty, the likely reason for bringing this very old thread forward was to stir things up; it serves no other purpose.
If you don't feed into it the thread will die again.

Thanks Ruth...You are so right!:o

And you are one smart lady, who I really admire..:)

[grayesq]

Please don't Misquote me!....I did not say the drunks are those who carry liquor on board...I purposely highlighted the portion of what I said..

I said: "The Drunks are the ones who smuggle many bottles of booze on board..."

I never said persons who bring one or two bottles on board are drunks...I still stand by what I said about the ones who insist on bringing: " MANY Bottles of Alcohol & wine on board"

They are the people who abused the privilege & caused HAL to change the policy.. When we first started sailing HAL we were permitted to bring a reasonable amount of liquor on board..

We travel with another couple on our cruises..One time we all invited a third couple to join us... The third couple smuggled almost a case of liquor plus wine on board in addition to what was wrapped up among their clothing.....When they ran out of booze, the Gentleman went into port, purchased more liquor & poured it into water bottles in order to get it on board...(This was the same cruise where HAL confiscated our gift bottle of Brandy)

This couple could not function without a drink or two at lunch & then a three hour happy hour in the evening..They were always 10-15 min late for our 8:30 dinner time...After the first week, the four of us decided not to wait dinner for them, which really was awkward.. Our dinner was still delayed so the third couple could catch up with us...We all had to run to get into the show lounge at 10:30 almost every night or would have had to leave the third couple at the table, which is rude..

Needless to say, even though we normally enjoyed being with them at home it became very tedious for 21 days.. Since then , our regular traveling buddies & we have been gun shy about inviting others to join us because of that experience..

And do agree, that HAL is making money on liquor & why not! They have to make the $$$ some how..

Cruises prices have not increased & kept up with inflation..Our invoices for the past 10 years do not show a significant increase in our outside cabin per day.. (Yes have a closet full of stuff from all our trips...Retired from the travel business & travel is still in my veins!)

In 1996 we paid $214.00 per day plus port charges for an outside cabin on NCL...In 1998 we paid $267.00 per day (including port charges) for an outside on the Ryndam...In 2006 our Outside cabin on the Prinsendam was $212.36 plus port charges per day..

HAL needs to make it up somewhere & this is one way to do it..I'm delighted that our cruise prices have not increased & would willingly pay for our drinks in order to keep the prices low..If we can't afford it, then I'll give up having that evening cocktail...

You may not believe there is a correlation between alcohol use and injuries or other incidents that give rise to the lawsuits? But many people in the business will disagree with you...I've read so many of the accounts of those accidents..(not talking about the ones who are deliberately trying to commit suicide)..You would be amazed how many of them are directly caused by abuse of alcohol..

OK I'll get off my soapbox now..Cheers..:) Betty

I apologize if I misquoted you. I must have missed the "many" when I read your post. I would agree that passengers who bring many bottles of alcohol on board are more likely to be drunk than those who don't. However, getting back to the original point I was trying to make, which was that HAL and the other cruise lines have banned BYOB for hard liquor for financial reasons rather than for safety or other reasons, it should be noted that HAL and many other cruise lines do not prohibit passengers from bringing on bottles of wine. Again, if the concern were injuries to drunken passengers and potential litigation, then it would make more sense to ban all alcohol from being brought on board, not just hard liquor. And personally, I would rather pay a little bit more for my cruise ticket and be able to purchase cocktails and other beverages for a price at or below what I can buy the same items at home rather than having there be a whole host of "hidden" profit centers pick away at my wallet each day. Hotels do this too with hidden service charges and the like. It drives me crazy. So if I do what I can to avoid paying inflated prices for something that I can buy and bring from home for a more reasonable price, as long as don't inflict myself on anyone else, this should be no one's business but my own.