Hope this doesn't start wwiii - hal's confirmation of the smoking policy

[startwin]

Just off the phone again with HAL in Seattle. Two different answers yesterday, now told today "for sure" how smoking in the cabins will be handled. (And thanks to Joanie for the head's up on this one, as per info she got recently on the Zuiderdam).

The $250 fine for smoking in the cabin is one-time per cruise only and is added to the passenger's onboard account at the end of the cruise. Translate that how you like, but it would appear nothing has changed other than to collect extra revenue from the smokers who choose to break that particular rule... and they can continue to break it throughout their cruise at no further cost. The "fine" is actually called a cleaning fee.

I will be re-thinking my future cruise plans. This is not intended to start the smoking war again, but is just to confirm how the policy is going to be applied after January 2012. Some CC members had assumed it was $250 fine each time the pax smoked in the cabin. No. The HAL rep said the fine is a "huge deterrent" to smokers and they expect most to comply.

[3rdGenCunarder]

Just off the phone again with HAL in Seattle. Two different answers yesterday, now told today "for sure" how smoking in the cabins will be handled. (And thanks to Joanie for the head's up on this one, as per info she got recently on the Zuiderdam).

The $250 fine for smoking in the cabin is one-time per cruise only and is added to the passenger's onboard account at the end of the cruise. Translate that how you like, but it would appear nothing has changed other than to collect extra revenue from the smokers who choose to break that particular rule... and they can continue to break it throughout their cruise at no further cost. The "fine" is actually called a cleaning fee.

I will be re-thinking my future cruise plans. This is not intended to start the smoking war again, but is just to confirm how the policy is going to be applied after January 2012. Some CC members had assumed it was $250 fine each time the pax smoked in the cabin. No. The HAL rep said the fine is a "huge deterrent" to smokers and they expect most to comply.

Thanks for posting this. I was curious about how they'd handle it. I'm not a smoker, just very curious. After a few months, it will be interesting to find out if HAL has to deep-clean fewer cabins because of the fee.

Did they say when the fee would be assessed? Is it an adjustment to your onboard account at some point? Separate charge to your credit card? Do they tell you when they "catch" you? Again, just me being curious.

[RuthC]

Call me a cynic, but I have to wonder how long it will be before there are "mistakes" made in making charges to those who did not smoke in their cabins---kind of like the "mistakes" in mini-bar charges we hear so much about.

[LoveMyBoxer]

So it's basically like all non-smoking hotels. You get a one time fine when you check out. Not sure how this is extra revenue???? It just requires extra cleaning by the staff.

[lorekauf]

Call me a cynic, but I have to wonder how long it will be before there are "mistakes" made in making charges to those who did not smoke in their cabins---kind of like the "mistakes" in mini-bar charges we hear so much about.
Yeah, no kidding. After getting stung with a $60 mini bar error that I'm still waiting for the credit on I can see that happening. HAL needs to make sure their ducks are in a row before they start that up.

[catl331]

Call me a cynic, but I have to wonder how long it will be before there are "mistakes" made in making charges to those who did not smoke in their cabins---kind of like the "mistakes" in mini-bar charges we hear so much about. I can see Front Desk arguments over whether smoking was done in the cabin or not, with HAL often retracting the charge.

[adrift@sea]

Call me a cynic, but I have to wonder how long it will be before there are "mistakes" made in making charges to those who did not smoke in their cabins---kind of like the "mistakes" in mini-bar charges we hear so much about.

This was exactly what my first thought was. And who reports it? The cabin steward? Are you officially notified if the charges are placed against your account? What happens if the charge appears after you leave the ship? How do you dispute it? I think this is another HAL policy that has not been well thought out....Stay tuned....

[startwin]

Thanks for posting this. I was curious about how they'd handle it. I'm not a smoker, just very curious. After a few months, it will be interesting to find out if HAL has to deep-clean fewer cabins because of the fee.

Did they say when the fee would be assessed? Is it an adjustment to your onboard account at some point? Separate charge to your credit card? Do they tell you when they "catch" you? Again, just me being curious.

They said it is added to the onboard account at the end of the cruise. No idea about how or when they catch the smoker or how it's reported.

[startwin]

So it's basically like all non-smoking hotels. You get a one time fine when you check out. Not sure how this is extra revenue???? It just requires extra cleaning by the staff.

Isn't it extra revenue if they collect an extra $250 from some passengers? No doubt some will happily pay this to continue smoking in the cabin.

[Mar56]

Full disclosure I am a smoker I have my first cruise ever booked with Hal for February. And I will not be smoking in the cabin I am actually on my front porch at home typing this while I have a smoke no one smokes in my house. This idea of a clean up fee is ludicrous -either u allow smoking in the cabins or u don't it's coming very close to the line re false advertising it is right in line with the rules re the chair hogs on the decks something I have seen countless comments about apparently there is a rule not to do it and yet its not enforced not a sound business model if u ask me

Mar56

[vbmom87]

Celebrity has the same policy in place for cabin smoking. I guess you could go over to their forum and find out how it is working with the fine assessment.

http://www.celebritycruises.com/beforeyourcruise/faq/home.do?faqSubjectName=Ship+and+Stateroom+Details&faqId=572&pagename=faq_answers

[startwin]

Celebrity has the same policy in place for cabin smoking. I guess you could go over to their forum and find out how it is working with the fine assessment.

http://www.celebritycruises.com/beforeyourcruise/faq/home.do?faqSubjectName=Ship+and+Stateroom+Details&faqId=572&pagename=faq_answers


Celebrity doesn't allow smoking on the balcony as well as cabins. Big difference.

[CRUZBUDS]

I've gotten the impression that the charge was per violation on Celbrity and continued disregard of the policy would lead to being put off the ship.

We encountered no smoke on our recent Celibrity cruise except for the few areas designated for the smokers. We're crossing our fingers we'll have good luck on our upcoming Zuiderdamn cruise. I wish HAL had taken Princesses route and we wouldn't have to rely so much on luck. We have no great medical excuse, we just find cigarette smoke repulsive. We don't have to encounter it in our regular lives and prefer not to on vacation.

The Zuiderdam itineray is awesome.

[sail7seas]

It is always Captain's perogative to order someone off the ship if they have total disregard for rules and defy obeying those rules..... especially after being alerted to their failure to obey.

I would not assume a Captain might not enforce the stated rules.
Quite a big risk IMO

[vbmom87]

I've gotten the impression that the charge was per violation on Celbrity and continued disregard of the policy would lead to being put off the ship.


The Celebrity link above implies a one time fee. At least that is how I read it.

I really think most smokers will comply. Smoking is being banned in more and more places and smokers are adapting.

[Richie2pies]

If HAL has a one time fee, a smoker would just add $250 to the price of their cruise. When you rent a deluxe veranda, $250 is not that much to enjoy a smoke anytime you want.

[peaches from georgia]

There's no way that a $250 fine could or would be levied on every violation.

One foreseeable problem is that smoking is allowed on the balcony and, with the door being opened and closed to the cabin, smoke or the smell of smoke possibly might drift into the cabin, leading the steward to believe the pax smoked in the cabin. The pax may never have smoked in the cabin yet would be given a fine. As a smoker, yes, I would argue the point that I had not broken any rule.

And it is a revenue-generating fine. It does not cost $250 to deep clean a cabin. Some here have reported it takes no time at all to do.

[bigeagle12]

It is always Captain's perogative to order someone off the ship if they have total disregard for rules and defy obeying those rules..... especially after being alerted to their failure to obey.

I would not assume a Captain might not enforce the stated rules.
Quite a big risk IMO



I agree.

And there have been several removed from RCI cruises for a second violation.

[Mar56]

There's no way that a $250 fine could or would be levied on every violation.

One foreseeable problem is that smoking is allowed on the balcony and, with the door being opened and closed to the cabin, smoke or the smell of smoke possibly might drift into the cabin, leading the steward to believe the pax smoked in the cabin. The pax may never have smoked in the cabin yet would be given a fine. As a smoker, yes, I would argue the point that I had not broken any rule.

And it is a revenue-generating fine. It does not cost $250 to deep clean a cabin. Some here have reported it takes no time at all to do.

And the above is my concern as well

[startwin]

I've gotten the impression that the charge was per violation on Celbrity and continued disregard of the policy would lead to being put off the ship.

We encountered no smoke on our recent Celibrity cruise except for the few areas designated for the smokers. We're crossing our fingers we'll have good luck on our upcoming Zuiderdamn cruise. I wish HAL had taken Princesses route and we wouldn't have to rely so much on luck. We have no great medical excuse, we just find cigarette smoke repulsive. We don't have to encounter it in our regular lives and prefer not to on vacation.

The Zuiderdam itineray is awesome.

The Zuiderdam repositioning itinerary is the only reason we will stay with that booking. After that cruise we'll be looking at other cruise lines.

[eh2zed]

I am sure HAL will monitor how the cleaning fee is assessed and what to do with repeat offenders. The vast majority will comply.

[Krazy Kruizers]

Just off the phone again with HAL in Seattle. Two different answers yesterday, now told today "for sure" how smoking in the cabins will be handled. (And thanks to Joanie for the head's up on this one, as per info she got recently on the Zuiderdam).

The $250 fine for smoking in the cabin is one-time per cruise only and is added to the passenger's onboard account at the end of the cruise. Translate that how you like, but it would appear nothing has changed other than to collect extra revenue from the smokers who choose to break that particular rule... and they can continue to break it throughout their cruise at no further cost. The "fine" is actually called a cleaning fee.

I will be re-thinking my future cruise plans. This is not intended to start the smoking war again, but is just to confirm how the policy is going to be applied after January 2012. Some CC members had assumed it was $250 fine each time the pax smoked in the cabin. No. The HAL rep said the fine is a "huge deterrent" to smokers and they expect most to comply.

Thank you for the information.

I doubt if there will be any fewer smokers in the cabins.

[Globaliser]

The HAL rep said the fine is a "huge deterrent" to smokers and they expect most to comply.That's because most smokers (and non-smokers) have enough respect and self-respect to adhere to a stated policy, even if they would personally prefer it to be different.

That, after all, is what being grown-up is all about.

The stated policy is perfectly clear: "no smoking in the cabins". The existence of a fine for a breach of the policy doesn't make the policy any less unambiguous. Anyone who thinks that a fine suddenly turns the policy into "actually, we're allowing you to smoke in the cabin for a $250 fee" is just being wishfully self-indulgent.

And as for the supposed difficulty in enforcing this, it's not as if land-based hotels have had insuperable difficulties with similar policies.

[kazu]

There's no way that a $250 fine could or would be levied on every violation.

One foreseeable problem is that smoking is allowed on the balcony and, with the door being opened and closed to the cabin, smoke or the smell of smoke possibly might drift into the cabin, leading the steward to believe the pax smoked in the cabin. The pax may never have smoked in the cabin yet would be given a fine. As a smoker, yes, I would argue the point that I had not broken any rule.

And it is a revenue-generating fine. It does not cost $250 to deep clean a cabin. Some here have reported it takes no time at all to do.

Good point Peaches - I never thought of the smell of smoke drifting into the cabin

[Himself]

just off the phone again with hal in seattle. Two different answers yesterday, now told today "for sure" how smoking in the cabins will be handled. (and thanks to joanie for the head's up on this one, as per info she got recently on the zuiderdam).

The $250 fine for smoking in the cabin is one-time per cruise only and is added to the passenger's onboard account at the end of the cruise. Translate that how you like, but it would appear nothing has changed other than to collect extra revenue from the smokers who choose to break that particular rule... And they can continue to break it throughout their cruise at no further cost. The "fine" is actually called a cleaning fee.

I will be re-thinking my future cruise plans. This is not intended to start the smoking war again, but is just to confirm how the policy is going to be applied after january 2012. Some cc members had assumed it was $250 fine each time the pax smoked in the cabin. No. The hal rep said the fine is a "huge deterrent" to smokers and they expect most to comply.

holy smoke!

[jtl513]

Good point Peaches - I never thought of the smell of smoke drifting into the cabinOr ash trays with butts being left inside (after smoking outside), or dumped in the trash can. A steward could easily think that the smoking had been done inside.

[eh2zed]

If HAL has a one time fee, a smoker would just add $250 to the price of their cruise. When you rent a deluxe veranda, $250 is not that much to enjoy a smoke anytime you want.
Not a bad point and maybe some would see it that way. However, most people are "law" abiding. I am sure HAL will monitor the matter and if there are individuals who simply flaunt the rules they will find a way to deal with it.

[3rdGenCunarder]

holy smoke!

Wouldn't that be incense? :cool:

I wouldn't think smoke smell blowing in from the balcony would make the room smell strongly enough to cause someone to be accused of smoking in the room. But emptying the ashtray is a problem. You don't want to leave it on the balcony where wind might overturn it, spreading ashes around. But if you empty it inside the room, it will look like you're smoking in the room.

[ansjefitnes]

The ashtray is the kind which will make your sigaret and ashes disappear with a push on the button so the wind can't blow it away and the stewards will empty it. You can leave it on the verandah.

[3rdGenCunarder]

The ashtray is the kind which will make your sigaret and ashes disappear with a push on the button so the wind can't blow it away and the stewards will empty it. You can leave it on the verandah.

That makes sense. I don't smoke, so I don't particularly notice ashtrays. Then it should be fairly easy to smoke outside and not get penalized unfairly.

[gelo7]

That's because most smokers (and non-smokers) have enough respect and self-respect to adhere to a stated policy, even if they would personally prefer it to be different.

That, after all, is what being grown-up is all about.

The stated policy is perfectly clear: "no smoking in the cabins". The existence of a fine for a breach of the policy doesn't make the policy any less unambiguous. Anyone who thinks that a fine suddenly turns the policy into "actually, we're allowing you to smoke in the cabin for a $250 fee" is just being wishfully self-indulgent.

And as for the supposed difficulty in enforcing this, it's not as if land-based hotels have had insuperable difficulties with similar policies.Very well said...

[meterman2]

Full disclosure I am a smoker I have my first cruise ever booked with Hal for February. And I will not be smoking in the cabin I am actually on my front porch at home typing this while I have a smoke no one smokes in my house. This idea of a clean up fee is ludicrous -either u allow smoking in the cabins or u don't it's coming very close to the line re false advertising it is right in line with the rules re the chair hogs on the decks something I have seen countless comments about apparently there is a rule not to do it and yet its not enforced not a sound business model if u ask me

Mar56

Come January 2012 you will be fined $250 if you're caught smoking while posting on Cruise Critic :D

[m steve]

There are balconies for many and smoking areas on the ship. My partner won't smoke in our house or in the cars. Will they have a smoke sniffer to visit the cabins. They don't send anyone to look for liquor in the cabins and it's usually out on the bar area. Will it be a post cruise charge so that the cabin stewards are not stiffed?

[peaches from georgia]

There are balconies for many and smoking areas on the ship. My partner won't smoke in our house or in the cars. Will they have a smoke sniffer to visit the cabins. They don't send anyone to look for liquor in the cabins and it's usually out on the bar area. Will it be a post cruise charge so that the cabin stewards are not stiffed?
I think you're right- the charge will be added to your final bill after you are off the ship.

[Candy]

So, it's a stinky issue rather than a safety issue?

[sail7seas]

What will they do about the guest who paid cash and they don't have record of a credit card number if they plan to bill for smoking violations after guests have left the ship?

[sail7seas]

So, it's a stinky issue rather than a safety issue?


Candy,
I think it might be both.

[mountainmare]

I think the red flag came from the answer that Joanie got from a very specific question. If you go back and read Joanie's blog she was extremely clear about what she was asking.

Is it a one time fee that I can pay and be allowed to smoke whenever during my cruise?
Answer: It will be a one time fee...one time only and yes you will be able to pay it in advance by calling HAL.

She also asked if the fee would be waved if outside decks are closed. I am sure she will report back when she hears from HAL.

We prefer HAL and are booked on a cruise in January. We know going in what the policies are, and understand that for the future there may be smokers next to us on the balcony and that is their right. I respect Joanie and am happy that she asked the question in a straightforward way, even if the answers and implications are not what I wanted to hear.

[chrispb]

Most smokers will be unlikely to travel with HAL in the new year, unless they have a balcony so I can't see that it's going to be much of an issue.

If a smoker has a balcony and some smell does enter the room, then I would think the staff would err on the side of caution before making accusations.

[RDC1]

If HAL has a one time fee, a smoker would just add $250 to the price of their cruise. When you rent a deluxe veranda, $250 is not that much to enjoy a smoke anytime you want.

In which case the rules will probably change to become more restrictive.

With this policy in place it firmly establishes the expectation that your cabin is and has been non-smoking. If one gets a cabin today that was previously smoked in they have little recourse. Once the policy goes into effect if that happens then the consumer has far more leverage (both if their is a smell or residue from the previous occupant, as well if their is smoke infiltration from a nearby room) because of the expectation set by the policy. The company can be at fault because of a failure to enforce their published policy.

[jkrislc]

Doesn't Disney have essentially the same policy without drawing attention to a fine/cleaning fee? Perhaps HAL should have imposed the new smoking policy first and implemented the fee only after it was determined that a majority were not abiding by the new policy.

[3rdGenCunarder]

In which case the rules will probably change to become more restrictive.

With this policy in place it firmly establishes the expectation that your cabin is and has been non-smoking. If one gets a cabin today that was previously smoked in they have little recourse. Once the policy goes into effect if that happens then the consumer has far more leverage (both if their is a smell or residue from the previous occupant, as well if their is smoke infiltration from a nearby room) because of the expectation set by the policy. The company can be at fault because of a failure to enforce their published policy.

I'm not sure. If someone smokes and the cleaning fee is assessed, HAL will have enforced its policy.

[sail7seas]

If a neighboring cabin has smoke coming in their vents during the cruise and HAL does not stop it, will HAL have enforced it policy?

[taxmantoo]

If a neighboring cabin has smoke coming in their vents during the cruise and HAL does not stop it, will HAL have enforced it policy?


There is a huge fundemental difference between the official policy itself and the policy's intent... These types of differences have kept judges and lawyers and cruise critic members debating for years ;)

[sail7seas]

Yes.....

I suppose that means we shall have to 'wait and see'. :)

[startwin]

I think the red flag came from the answer that Joanie got from a very specific question. If you go back and read Joanie's blog she was extremely clear about what she was asking.

Is it a one time fee that I can pay and be allowed to smoke whenever during my cruise?
Answer: It will be a one time fee...one time only and yes you will be able to pay it in advance by calling HAL.

She also asked if the fee would be waved if outside decks are closed. I am sure she will report back when she hears from HAL.

<snip>

Indeed. And hopefully the staff member emails Joanie as promised when he gets the answer to that question, and I'm sure she'll let us know.

[hypercafe]

HAL is trying to be all things for all people, putting a policy in place that will make the non smokers and smokers happy. I don't think they will have smoking police or be putting people off the ship at a distant port for lighting up. As long as HAL wants to strattle the issue the people who are so against smoking should find a different line.

[IRL_Joanie]

The ashtray is the kind which will make your sigaret and ashes disappear with a push on the button so the wind can't blow it away and the stewards will empty it. You can leave it on the verandah.

Photo of the ash tray which is provided by asking the Room Steward (Click on the photo to see full sized photo)

http://joanjett2000.topcities.com/HAL/Oosterdam/sm-6177_verandah_Joanie-2.jpg (http://joanjett2000.topcities.com/HAL/Oosterdam/6177_verandah_Joanie-2.jpg)

As soon as I hear back from Kees, I will let everyone know!!

And I believe I mentioned it already in my Semi Live Blog, but as of January 15the 2012 the Sports Bar will also be non smoking, which makes no sense since it is right there by the Casion where the smoke is extremely heavy?????

Joanie

[Opinions]

After reading all the posts on this board from smokers who state that they would never, never smoke in a area where smoking wasn't allowed I expect there will be almost 100% compliance with the new rules...Are am I being naive?

[startwin]

After reading all the posts on this board from smokers who state that they would never, never smoke in a area where smoking wasn't allowed I expect there will be almost 100% compliance with the new rules...Are am I being naive?

Yes.

[mountainmare]

yes

[IRL_Joanie]

After reading all the posts on this board from smokers who state that they would never, never smoke in a area where smoking wasn't allowed I expect there will be almost 100% compliance with the new rules...Are am I being naive?

I do not think you are being that Naive, which is why I said no. But... Let me explain

I will be in 100% compliance as long as the Captain does not close all outside decks, which includes all verandahs. If there is no smoking anywhere in the Interior of the ship except for the Casino and it is then either overcrowded with smokers or is deemed, for whatever reasons to be non smoking (I believe there is usually 1 night that it is non smoking), then I will inform the Concierge and Front Desk to add the $250.00 fee to my On Board account as I will be smoking in my stateroom.

I do not plan on smoking in my stateroom in any other situations. Just as I do not normally smoke in it now (except when outside decks are closed.)

Joanie

[startwin]

I do not think you are being that Naive, which is why I said no. But... Let me explain

I will be in 100% compliance as long as the Captain does not close all outside decks, which includes all verandahs. If there is no smoking anywhere in the Interior of the ship except for the Casino and it is then either overcrowded with smokers or is deemed, for whatever reasons to be non smoking (I believe there is usually 1 night that it is non smoking), then I will inform the Concierge and Front Desk to add the $250.00 fee to my On Board account as I will be smoking in my stateroom.

I do not plan on smoking in my stateroom in any other situations. Just as I do not normally smoke in it now (except when outside decks are closed.)

Joanie

Trying to stay fair here Joanie as we have an agreement no to "get into it about smoking" but I have a problem with this part as the outside would be off-limits to all passengers - doors closed etc. So - and this is just my opinion - to have smoking inside would also impact on all passengers. The kind of stateroom you book probably wouldn't affect your neighbours, but, say on main deck, it could be a real problem. And it would appear that you are planning on simply breaking the rules laid down by the cruiseline, regardless. The rule doesn't say that smoking is allowed in cabins in inclement weather when decks are closed. I guess we have to wait for Kees to clarify that.

[IRL_Joanie]

Trying to stay fair here Joanie as we have an agreement no to "get into it about smoking" but I have a problem with this part as the outside would be off-limits to all passengers - doors closed etc. So - and this is just my opinion - to have smoking inside would also impact on all passengers. The kind of stateroom you book probably wouldn't affect your neighbours, but, say on main deck, it could be a real problem. And it would appear that you are planning on simply breaking the rules laid down by the cruiseline, regardless. The rule doesn't say that smoking is allowed in cabins in inclement weather when decks are closed. I guess we have to wait for Kees to clarify that.

I agree with you!! It would be totally unfair to all in the case that the outside decks are closed. My point is that with HAL limiting even more the inside areas for smoking it is going to cause such situations to happen:(

I am not positive, but think Kees mentioned he was going on 2 month vacation soon (not sure exactly when) so his reply might be a couple of months in coming:(

I wish there was some way that HAL could somehow create a retractable PlexiGlass type of enclosure around the Aft Lido area that could be utilized during inclement weather/outside deck closures. And put in one or two of those smoke eating machines. If they could do something like that then that might be the best solution....

Joanie

[Randyk47]

I do not think you are being that Naive, which is why I said no. But... Let me explain

I will be in 100% compliance as long as the Captain does not close all outside decks, which includes all verandahs. If there is no smoking anywhere in the Interior of the ship except for the Casino and it is then either overcrowded with smokers or is deemed, for whatever reasons to be non smoking (I believe there is usually 1 night that it is non smoking), then I will inform the Concierge and Front Desk to add the $250.00 fee to my On Board account as I will be smoking in my stateroom.

I do not plan on smoking in my stateroom in any other situations. Just as I do not normally smoke in it now (except when outside decks are closed.)

Joanie

Using Joanie's post as a foundation guess I'll make my comments:

1. Mrs. K and I are smokers. Yep, probably shouldn't and know that but we are and have no plans to quit anytime soon.

2. We never knowingly or deliberately smoke anyplace we ought not to on a ship or out in the community at home.

3. With HAL's policy change we most probably will not be cruising with HAL anytime soon if at all. Being allowed to smoke on the veranda does not compensate for not being able to smoke in our cabin. In fact, we typically don't smoke on our veranda and have, in the past, even gone as far as to check to see if our adjoining neighbors were out so as not to impact their cruise.

4. If HAL were to change their policy, and what we perceive as a "fine" for smoking in a cabin, to a upfront cleaning fee then we'd consider HAL. We have no intention or plans to book with HAL and then deliberately smoking in our cabin.

We're not going to go out and eat worms and broken glass over HAL's decision and policy.:rolleyes: :eek: It is what it is. If it means we don't cruise with HAL or any other cruise line then so be it. We'll find some other vacation option. That's our choice. :)

[3rdGenCunarder]

I have a question for smokers who want to smoke in their cabins. What about e-cigs? Not as a permanent replacement for real cigarettes, but to tide you over when you can't get outdoors. I think that some will deliver nicotine. Would that be a short-term substitute for the real thing?

I don't want to start WW IV with a discussion of e-cigs vs real cigs and what's safe and what isn't. But from what little I know, they produce less smoke/smell, can't burn holes in carpets, and seem to be satisfying for people trying to stop smoking. Yes, no smoking at all in the cabin is ideal. But I think I'd rather follow an e-cig user than a smoker into a cabin.

[IRL_Joanie]

I have a question for smokers who want to smoke in their cabins. What about e-cigs? Not as a permanent replacement for real cigarettes, but to tide you over when you can't get outdoors. I think that some will deliver nicotine. Would that be a short-term substitute for the real thing?

I don't want to start WW IV with a discussion of e-cigs vs real cigs and what's safe and what isn't. But from what little I know, they produce less smoke/smell, can't burn holes in carpets, and seem to be satisfying for people trying to stop smoking. Yes, no smoking at all in the cabin is ideal. But I think I'd rather follow an e-cig user than a smoker into a cabin.

For myself it is the cost of an e-cig as opposed to the cost of a real cigarette. Prices for a Starter kit begin at $29.99 and refills start at around $30.00 for 5 e-cigs as opposed to a carton of cigarettes (200 real cigarettes) being only $27.00 for me.

Besides the fact that I enjoy my smoking and have no wish to substitute.

Are the e-cigs any healthier than real cigarettes? No one can say.

QUOTE "Are ecigarettes healthier ? No one can say, because there are no long-term clinical trials or any other research that could verify or disprove such a statement. They were invented in 1995 and have only been widely used for a few years. This is one of those things on which you have to make your own decision. However, many people regard the decision to inhale a cool mist with half a dozen ingredients, none of which are known to be toxic or carcinogenic, or alternatively inhale a bonfire, as what is popularly termed a no-brainer - which is why ecigarettes are taking the world by storm." UNQUOTE

In my opinion, whether I smoke real cigarettes or e-cigs, the option of irritating others is still going to happen. No one will be happy no matter what the rules are.

It is a matter of personal choice. I choose to smoke, others choose not to smoke.

This is my last comment on this thread regarding smoking as I have promised to behave myself and will keep that promise:)

Joanie

[3rdGenCunarder]

For myself it is the cost of an e-cig as opposed to the cost of a real cigarette. Prices for a Starter kit begin at $29.99 and refills start at around $30.00 for 5 e-cigs as opposed to a carton of cigarettes (200 real cigarettes) being only $27.00 for me.

Besides the fact that I enjoy my smoking and have no wish to substitute.

Are the e-cigs any healthier than real cigarettes? No one can say.

QUOTE "Are ecigarettes healthier ? No one can say, because there are no long-term clinical trials or any other research that could verify or disprove such a statement. They were invented in 1995 and have only been widely used for a few years. This is one of those things on which you have to make your own decision. However, many people regard the decision to inhale a cool mist with half a dozen ingredients, none of which are known to be toxic or carcinogenic, or alternatively inhale a bonfire, as what is popularly termed a no-brainer - which is why ecigarettes are taking the world by storm." UNQUOTE

In my opinion, whether I smoke real cigarettes or e-cigs, the option of irritating others is still going to happen. No one will be happy no matter what the rules are.

It is a matter of personal choice. I choose to smoke, others choose not to smoke.

This is my last comment on this thread regarding smoking as I have promised to behave myself and will keep that promise:)

Joanie

Sorry if I wasn't clear, Joanie. I was asking if an e-cig was an acceptable back-up plan in case of inclement weather and not wanting/being able to go outdoors to smoke. I wasn't advocating people make a permanent change.

[mightycruisequeen]

I will be in 100% compliance as long as the Captain does not close all outside decks, which includes all verandahs. If there is no smoking anywhere in the Interior of the ship except for the Casino and it is then either overcrowded with smokers or is deemed, for whatever reasons to be non smoking (I believe there is usually 1 night that it is non smoking), then I will inform the Concierge and Front Desk to add the $250.00 fee to my On Board account as I will be smoking in my stateroom.

I do not plan on smoking in my stateroom in any other situations. Just as I do not normally smoke in it now (except when outside decks are closed.)

Joanie
Interesting. Didn't you used to advise nonsmokers to cruise on a different line if they didn't like HAL's smoking policy?

[startwin]

" then I will inform the Concierge and Front Desk to add the $250.00 fee to my On Board account as I will be smoking in my stateroom."

Might be a good idea not to approach it quite like that at the Front desk. I believe if you tell them you are wilfully about to break their rules they can invite you to get off at the next port, LOL.

As to the e-cigs, I agree they are way too expensive, I had no idea they cost that much so now I understand why they are not more popular.

[IRL_Joanie]

Interesting. Didn't you used to advise nonsmokers to cruise on a different line if they didn't like HAL's smoking policy?

Whether I did or not Jay, I cannot remember.

Let's keep to startwin's request and not make this WWIII please:)

Joanie

[startwin]

Whether I did or not Jay, I cannot remember.

Let's keep to startwin's request and not make this WWIII please:)

Joanie

Agreed, it is not intended to attack the smokers, but to highlight HAL's half-assed way of bringing in a new policy.... yet again they have not thought it through.

BTW - is it my computer or are these boards acting up again today? I've lost postings, and it's taking forever to load the page.

[kazu]

After reading all the posts on this board from smokers who state that they would never, never smoke in a area where smoking wasn't allowed I expect there will be almost 100% compliance with the new rules...Are am I being naive?

I don't think so. Most people follow the rules. :D

Whether it be a non smoking hotel, non smoking cabin on HAL, whatever, I respect the rules and follow them at home and when I travel and I think many others do too.

[happy cruzer]

I think the policy will be more like 3 offenses and you are off the ship especially if you have a neighbor complaining that your smoke is affecting their cabin. But I would imagine that HAL does not want discuss all the consequences because of PR. We will know next year how it is enforced.

[jimmy2x]

As to the e-cigs, I agree they are way too expensive, I had no idea they cost that much so now I understand why they are not more popular.

A carton of smokes cost about $60 in PA and I know that they are even more in Jersey. I've been on e-cigarettes for over a year and actual cost is less than $60/month or about 1/4 the cost for a pack and a half/day smoker.

The question about using them in your stateroom is actually pretty funny. No one would ever know as there is no residual odor, burning, or ashes.

(http://boards.cruisecritic.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=30878407)

[sail7seas]

As to the e-cigs, I agree they are way too expensive, I had no idea they cost that much so now I understand why they are not more popular.

A carton of smokes cost about $60 in PA and I know that they are even more in Jersey. I've been on e-cigarettes for over a year and actual cost is less than $60/month or about 1/4 the cost for a pack and a half/day smoker.

The question about using them in your stateroom is actually pretty funny. No one would ever know as there is no residual odor, burning, or ashes.



(http://boards.cruisecritic.com/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=30878407)



Does anyone know for sure if there are chemicals left behind the cabin steward has to breathe or the next guests in the cabin will be exposed to? Have enough studies for a long enough time been done?

[jimmy2x]

Does anyone know for sure if there are chemicals left behind the cabin steward has to breathe or the next guests in the cabin will be exposed to? Have enough studies for a long enough time been done?

Sail - I know that you take this very seriously so I will try to give you the best answer that I can.

An e-cig is a nicotine delivery system. The nicotine is mixed in with a base that is generally a 50/50 mix of Propylene Glycol ( used in food flavorings, cosmetics and often in rock concerts) and Vegetable Glycerin along with a small amount of food flavoring.

The e-cig has a device inside of it known as an atomizer which is used to vaporize the liquid above. When inhaled the nicotine (which is a stimulant similar to caffeine and is not known to cause cancer) is absorbed quickly into the bloodstream of the user.

So far as any secondary "smoke" issue quantities of anything exhaled have been shown to be negligible with no short or long term issues to other persons. Boston University as conducted an extensive study with is easily found thru Google. Another study has been conducted in New Zealand.

http://www.healthnz.co.nz/ECigsExhaledSmoke.htm

So far as the user goes, very little in life is 100% without risk. Nicotine, like caffeine has been shown to be a vaso constrictor(sp?). It has become apparent to many of us that whatever the risk to the user, it is FAR less than the continued regular use of burning tobacco. The vapor contains no tars (the actual stuff that coats surfaces with sticky crud), benzene, carbon monoxide, or about 4000 other chemicals found in burning tobacco.

Hope this helps.

[sail7seas]

A very thought out response.
Thank you, Jimmy.

With my health history, I go out of my way to avoid any irritants of any sort that I am able to bypass. Of course, we are exposed to everything and anything daily and most of it is out of our control. I try to avoid that which I can.

[jimmy2x]

Sail - you are quite welcome and I really do understand your concerns.

FWIW, several years ago I FINALLY quit smoking in our home as it had gotten to the point where it really bothered my wife. In retrospect, I don't know how she put up with it all these years. When I switched to the e-cig, she was absolutely thrilled and it does not bother her (or anyone else that I have spoken to about it) one bit.

It truly has been a "win-win" situation for both of us.

[Opinions]

I do not plan on smoking in my stateroom in any other situations. Just as I do not normally smoke in it now (except when outside decks are closed.)

Joanie

In the past you have posted "I will not sail if I cannot smoke in my cabin"...Is this still true?

[Robin7]

We will know next year how it is enforced.

Which is the ONLY reason I am glad we are unable to use our Future Cruise Credit in the near future. We have been next door (Volendam, outside cabin) to a chain smoker for ten days in the past. I do not want to do that again! So if HAL does not actually enforce their new rule, then I guess we'll be booking with a different cruiseline and eating our FCC.

Robin

[taxmantoo]

In the past you have posted "I will not sail if I cannot smoke in my cabin"...Is this still true?

Probably is... now she is just willing to pay the $250 up front to be absolved of all sins!

[jayteeaitch]

Sail - you are quite welcome and I really do understand your concerns.

FWIW, several years ago I FINALLY quit smoking in our home as it had gotten to the point where it really bothered my wife. In retrospect, I don't know how she put up with it all these years. When I switched to the e-cig, she was absolutely thrilled and it does not bother her (or anyone else that I have spoken to about it) one bit.

It truly has been a "win-win" situation for both of us.

Thanks for this - although not heavy smokers -DW and I do enjoy a puff now and then - and we never smoke in our home.

Your comments and a url from an earlier CC'r led me to this latest finding on E-Cigs - which also might be of interest to non smokers who see someone chewing on one of these. :eek::eek:

Now I need to find them here in OZ.:D

"8-11 September 2011 13th Conference Society for Research on Nicotine and Tobacco, Antalya, Turkey

A panel session on e-cigarettes chaired by Prof J-F Etter was very well attended, and showcased considerable new research as well as previous research by Health New Zealand Ltd.. These devices cannot be tested by the same machine modes used for tobacco cigarettes. E-cigarettes are smoked differently, by continuous puffing for say 15 puffs. Conclusion: Light regulation that permits sale obtains greatest benefits and minimizes harm. E-cigarettes are here to stay.
Since this conference, the UK cabinet’s unit on behavioural insights in its first annual report has recommended adoption of e-cigarettes. - ML "

[m steve]

If HAL allowed smoking on the balconies of the aft 25% of the cabins on each side including the stern that would solve the problem for most passengers who don't want to smell smoke. If they insist on booking one of those cabins they will just have to hope that their neighbor is not a chain smoker. That's still 1500 cabins smoke free inside and out on the bigger ships. If there are 500 smokers, which I doubt, there could even be less than that number of cabins for smokers.
And I think if someone who smokes in their cabin wants a refund on future cruise credits, HAL should allow it or let the credit and deposit be transferred. They would be snapped up on this thread.

[startwin]

I am really impressed that this thread stayed so civil. I was actually very worried about posting it... hence the "please don't start WWIII comment" (and not sure why the title of the thread was all in small case, I couldn't even edit it 5 secs after posting:().

So it looks like we will have to sit back and wait and see exactly how HAL handles the policy, and pax who break the rules, and I have a feeling it will differ from ship to ship.

On my next cruise I managed to snag one of the 2 cabins with an extra-long balcony... so I will position myself in the middle if I have smokers on both sides:D. As it's a 22-day cruise, this could make a huge difference.

[fann1sh]

My Eurodam cruise will be the second on that vessel after implementation of the new policy.

I will not have a balcony.

However, I will definitely be reporting back on smoke odour (or its absence) in the passageways, and any other details I can glean.

[kazu]

I will be on the Maadam in March and will let everyone know. I WILL not smoke in the cabin whether the decks or open or not. hopefully by then I will have quit, but if not, I will follow the rules as I do elsewhere.

I am fairly sure most smokers will do the same (i hope);)

[Mary Ellen]

I will be on the Maadam in March and will let everyone know. I WILL not smoke in the cabin whether the decks or open or not. hopefully by then I will have quit, but if not, I will follow the rules as I do elsewhere.

I am fairly sure most smokers will do the same (i hope);)Kazu I share your hope and wish you well on quiting smoking! Good luck. :)

[CRUZBUDS]

On my next cruise I managed to snag one of the 2 cabins with an extra-long balcony... so I will position myself in the middle if I have smokers on both sides:D. As it's a 22-day cruise, this could make a huge difference.

Hi Starwin, You're good for the first 18 day on one side. We have the other one!

[startwin]

Hi Starwin, You're good for the first 18 day on one side. We have the other one!

Oh wow Alison, that's great news!!

[MichelleinOC]

Just off the phone again with HAL in Seattle. Two different answers yesterday, now told today "for sure" how smoking in the cabins will be handled. (And thanks to Joanie for the head's up on this one, as per info she got recently on the Zuiderdam).

The $250 fine for smoking in the cabin is one-time per cruise only and is added to the passenger's onboard account at the end of the cruise. Translate that how you like, but it would appear nothing has changed other than to collect extra revenue from the smokers who choose to break that particular rule... and they can continue to break it throughout their cruise at no further cost. The "fine" is actually called a cleaning fee.

I will be re-thinking my future cruise plans. This is not intended to start the smoking war again, but is just to confirm how the policy is going to be applied after January 2012. Some CC members had assumed it was $250 fine each time the pax smoked in the cabin. No. The HAL rep said the fine is a "huge deterrent" to smokers and they expect most to comply.

It might deter some but I think if it's a one time fee many will hope they won't get caught or not care and think that's not a bad price to pay to smoke in their cabins. Doesn't really seem like a great way to enforce their smoking policy.

[HoneyGV]

The Celebrity link above implies a one time fee. At least that is how I read it.

I really think most smokers will comply. Smoking is being banned in more and more places and smokers are adapting.

I will comply. I smoke and I've smoked in my cabin most of the time just so I wouldn't annoy anyone out on the verandah. Looks like I'll be out on the verandah having a smoke now and again after Jan.

Since I'm sailing in a couple weeks, I'll start "practicing" on this cruise.

Usually when I'm out on the verandah smoking, my neighbors are too, and I've always asked them if I see them if it bothers them. I've never had anyone tell me it bothers them...so far.

[HoneyGV]

Or ash trays with butts being left inside (after smoking outside), or dumped in the trash can. A steward could easily think that the smoking had been done inside.

Might be a good time to slip the steward an extra $20...to keep quiet! :eek::D
(JK folks)

[HoneyGV]

What will they do about the guest who paid cash and they don't have record of a credit card number if they plan to bill for smoking violations after guests have left the ship?


We'll probably be hearing more announcements on disembarkation day, "Will Mr. Smith, Cabin 5229 please come to the front office".

...and none of us will be able to get off the ship until "Mr. Smith" pays his cleaning bill! :eek::D

[HoneyGV]

HAL is trying to be all things for all people, putting a policy in place that will make the non smokers and smokers happy. I don't think they will have smoking police or be putting people off the ship at a distant port for lighting up. As long as HAL wants to strattle the issue the people who are so against smoking should find a different line.

Why doesn't HAL do what most hotels do...have smoking and nonsmoking cabins?

[HoneyGV]

I do not think you are being that Naive, which is why I said no. But... Let me explain

I will be in 100% compliance as long as the Captain does not close all outside decks, which includes all verandahs. If there is no smoking anywhere in the Interior of the ship except for the Casino and it is then either overcrowded with smokers or is deemed, for whatever reasons to be non smoking (I believe there is usually 1 night that it is non smoking), then I will inform the Concierge and Front Desk to add the $250.00 fee to my On Board account as I will be smoking in my stateroom.

I do not plan on smoking in my stateroom in any other situations. Just as I do not normally smoke in it now (except when outside decks are closed.)

Joanie

Good for you Joanie! I'm with ya on this!

[HoneyGV]

I have a question for smokers who want to smoke in their cabins. What about e-cigs? Not as a permanent replacement for real cigarettes, but to tide you over when you can't get outdoors. I think that some will deliver nicotine. Would that be a short-term substitute for the real thing?

I don't want to start WW IV with a discussion of e-cigs vs real cigs and what's safe and what isn't. But from what little I know, they produce less smoke/smell, can't burn holes in carpets, and seem to be satisfying for people trying to stop smoking. Yes, no smoking at all in the cabin is ideal. But I think I'd rather follow an e-cig user than a smoker into a cabin.

This came up on another thread not long ago, and someone said even E-cigs will be "against the law". That baffles me because all E-cigs are is vapor...not smoke and not tar or carbon monoxide.

[HoneyGV]

Does anyone know for sure if there are chemicals left behind the cabin steward has to breathe or the next guests in the cabin will be exposed to? Have enough studies for a long enough time been done?

E-cigs operate the same way that "mist" machines do when you go to a theatre or concert where they have mist or "fog" coming up from the stage or around it.

The "cigarette" part is the battery, and there is an "atomizer" attached that heats the liquid that's in the "filter" of the E-cig. When the atomizer heats the liquid, a vapor is emitted...just like at the theatre when they "fake" mist or fog or smoke.

[peaches from georgia]

This came up on another thread not long ago, and someone said even E-cigs will be "against the law". That baffles me because all E-cigs are is vapor...not smoke and not tar or carbon monoxide.
On a previous thread awhile back it was said HAL's reasoning for treating e-cigs under the same restrictions on board as real cigarettes was because non-smokers would see someone "smoking" an e-cig, think it was real, and there could be "problems" explaining it to them.

There is no way e-cigs could be a problem in the privacy of one's cabin because it is just water vapor with no odor or residue.

[3rdGenCunarder]

On a previous thread awhile back it was said HAL's reasoning for treating e-cigs under the same restrictions on board as real cigarettes was because non-smokers would see someone "smoking" an e-cig, think it was real, and there could be "problems" explaining it to them.

There is no way e-cigs could be a problem in the privacy of one's cabin because it is just water vapor with no odor or residue.

I remember that thread.

Another line (I think maybe Cunard) has classified e-cigs with real cigs for the purpose of where you can use them, probably to avoid confusion and confrontation. I wouldn't be surprised if HAL did the same.

But since e-cigs don't smell, I don't see how anyone would get "caught"using one in a cabin.

I saw one used a few months ago and might not have realized what it was if not for that earlier thread on this board. It was in a play. The woman entered with her cigarette already "lit," but it didn't make much smoke when she smoked it, just a little cloud. And I couldn't smell anything, even from the second row (small suburban theater). If it had been a real cigarette or one of those vile clove things a lot of actors use, I'd have been able to smell it even farther back in the theater.

[GeriatricNurse]

Why doesn't HAL do what most hotels do...have smoking and nonsmoking cabins?

Well, Sheraton and Marriott would not be included as these hotels are ALL non smoking! ;):)

[Cayoooga]

All Cruise ships should be smoke free and do everyone a favour,
smokers and non-smokers alike :D

[3rdGenCunarder]

Well, Sheraton and Marriott would not be included as these hotels are ALL non smoking! ;):)

Not just those chains. More and more hotels have gone to all nonsmoking rooms. It makes cleaning easier, makes "soft goods" last longer, and probably gets them a break on insurance.

[sail7seas]

Hyatt Pier 66 Hotel in FLL is smoke free.

[Beebob1]

shaking head :( courtroom drama, why do people care what someone else is fined - it is not their money. Another smoking thread that is your truth here. Joanie enjoy your cruises darling - why turn on her - she was honest. Goes to show what the real truth is smoking.

[sail7seas]

shaking head :( courtroom drama, why do people care what someone else is fined - it is not their money. Another smoking thread that is your truth here. Joanie enjoy your cruises darling - why turn on her - she was honest. Goes to show what the real truth is smoking.


:confused:

Goes to show what the real truth is smoking.

What does that mean?

[startwin]

shaking head :( courtroom drama, why do people care what someone else is fined - it is not their money. Another smoking thread that is your truth here. Joanie enjoy your cruises darling - why turn on her - she was honest. Goes to show what the real truth is smoking.

Can you please explain that posting? I don't think anyone has turned on Joanie other than to state the obvious about her intention to break the rule under certain circumstances - there was none of the vitriol we've seen from both sides in smoking threads. It's been - as I said before - a very civil thread. And I cannot understand your last sentence at all.

[kjw869]

Can you please explain that posting? I don't think anyone has turned on Joanie other than to state the obvious about her intention to break the rule under certain circumstances - there was none of the vitriol we've seen from both sides in smoking threads. It's been - as I said before - a very civil thread. And I cannot understand your last sentence at all.

I also would like to hear that explanation. I don't think anyone cares about the fine, maybe they don't want to be the neighbor when the odor comes through the ventilation system.

My understanding on the new HAL policy is there will be no more smoking in the cabins after a certain date. I didn't read where it was "optional" if you paid a $250 cleaning fee.

Maybe if the captain invited you to stay at the first port and find your way home, it would send a message. It has worked for other lines. It also seems to work for airlines as anyone who is caught smoking onboard has a reception committee upon landing--wearing badges.

I also didn't get the impression that this thread was a smoking-no smoking thread.

[taxmantoo]

My understanding on the new HAL policy is there will be no more smoking in the cabins after a certain date. I didn't read where it was "optional" if you paid a $250 cleaning fee.


You read it right.

The "optional" fee is the way some people like to twist reality so that it conforms to the way they wished things worked. ;) By following that logic, I should be able to just give the cops a couple of hundred dollars when I'm in a hurry to get somewhere and drive as fast as I want. Seems it would be OK as long as I let them know beforehand of my intentions. ;)

[Bakincakes]

On a previous thread awhile back it was said HAL's reasoning for treating e-cigs under the same restrictions on board as real cigarettes was because non-smokers would see someone "smoking" an e-cig, think it was real, and there could be "problems" explaining it to them.

There is no way e-cigs could be a problem in the privacy of one's cabin because it is just water vapor with no odor or residue.


So because some non-smokers, who are ignorant of e-cigs and who might complain, HAL will treat them like cigarettes?:rolleyes:

Talk about taking the easy way out.

[dcikon2]

We are thinking of taking a cruise on HAL over Christmas. We have not sailed with HAL in the past, but like the itinerary. Both of us smoke; however, we never smoke in our house and never have smoked in our cabin on cruises. We always get a balcony cabin and do go out on the balcony to have a cigarette. We are always concerned about offending other peole while on our balcony at night.

How does smoking on HAL compare to Royal Caribbean, Norwegian, and Carnival? Do you think we will have a problem having a couple cigarettes on the balcony at night?

Thanks,
Gary

[Bakincakes]

We are thinking of taking a cruise on HAL over Christmas. We have not sailed with HAL in the past, but like the itinerary. Both of us smoke; however, we never smoke in our house and never have smoked in our cabin on cruises. We always get a balcony cabin and do go out on the balcony to have a cigarette. We are always concerned about offending other peole while on our balcony at night.

How does smoking on HAL compare to Royal Caribbean, Norwegian, and Carnival? Do you think we will have a problem having a couple cigarettes on the balcony at night?

Thanks,
Gary


We have sailed HAL and have had smoking neighbors. We have never had an issue with smelling smoke on our balcony.

It depends upon who your neighbors are. Some will swear they can smell smoke, even if you aren't smoking.:rolleyes: Others will accept that you smoke and will compromise with you so that you can all enjoy your balconies.:)

[Beebob1]

I also would like to hear that explanation. I don't think anyone cares about the fine, ........

You just said it yourself and still :confused: that is just what I said it is Not about the fine. Door opens and someone smells smoke from outside........it is about smoking.

Star & Sail if you don't understand and I don't mean to be rude but start over at post 1. How many times does a person need to post/repost to add an extra thought about "policy/fine"? I don't mean to point either of you two out but my statement was defined about what this thread is Not about.

I wish everyone the best cruise ever. My the nonsmokers not smell it and my the smokers enjoy their cruise without all the complaining

[3rdGenCunarder]

You just said it yourself and still :confused: that is just what I said it is Not about the fine. Door opens and someone smells smoke from outside........it is about smoking.

Star & Sail if you don't understand and I don't mean to be rude but start over at post 1. How many times does a person need to post/repost to add an extra thought about "policy/fine"? I don't mean to point either of you two out but my statement was defined about what this thread is Not about.

I wish everyone the best cruise ever. My the nonsmokers not smell it and my the smokers enjoy their cruise without all the complaining

Well, I'm every bit as thick as Star and Sail because I still don't get your point. You say that your statement "was definied about what this thread is Not about." I just typed that and I still have no idea what it means. You don't like this thread? You don't like the posts on it? If you aren't happy with this thead, don't read it.

[IRL_Joanie]

Well, I'm every bit as thick as Star and Sail because I still don't get your point. You say that your statement "was definied about what this thread is Not about." I just typed that and I still have no idea what it means. You don't like this thread? You don't like the posts on it? If you aren't happy with this thead, don't read it.

I said I was not going to post on this thread again, but I have to break that promise.

I ask that you all respect startwin's original request and keep this as a polite thread please???

It is starting to take a nasty turn and she did not want that.

So please, let's go back to being nice. And please respect startwin, the OP. PLEASE??

Joanie

[ASIWISH]

There is nothing I hate more than sitting on the verandah as ashes fall from above...:mad:

[ASIWISH]

There is nothing I hate more than sitting on the verandah as ashes fall from above...:mad:
And I mean cigarette ashes, not soot from the engines...

[startwin]

We are thinking of taking a cruise on HAL over Christmas. We have not sailed with HAL in the past, but like the itinerary. Both of us smoke; however, we never smoke in our house and never have smoked in our cabin on cruises. We always get a balcony cabin and do go out on the balcony to have a cigarette. We are always concerned about offending other peole while on our balcony at night.

How does smoking on HAL compare to Royal Caribbean, Norwegian, and Carnival? Do you think we will have a problem having a couple cigarettes on the balcony at night?

Thanks,
Gary

I also cruise Royal Caribbean, and I think with the new rule about not smoking in the cabins, it'll be pretty much the same on HAL as it is on RCI. I don't smoke and as long as my neighbour isn't out on the balcony 24/7 puffing away, I don't see any problem!

But this thread is about how HAL is planning to enforce the new rules after Jan/12, and only time will tell.

[startwin]

You just said it yourself and still :confused: that is just what I said it is Not about the fine. Door opens and someone smells smoke from outside........it is about smoking.

Star & Sail if you don't understand and I don't mean to be rude but start over at post 1. How many times does a person need to post/repost to add an extra thought about "policy/fine"? I don't mean to point either of you two out but my statement was defined about what this thread is Not about.

I wish everyone the best cruise ever. My the nonsmokers not smell it and my the smokers enjoy their cruise without all the complaining

Sorry, but your post made no sense! Especially the last sentence which I'm still waiting for an explanation on. Forget the insults and just explain it please.

[startwin]

I said I was not going to post on this thread again, but I have to break that promise.

I ask that you all respect startwin's original request and keep this as a polite thread please???

It is starting to take a nasty turn and she did not want that.

So please, let's go back to being nice. And please respect startwin, the OP. PLEASE??

Joanie

Joanie, I don't think anyone is getting nasty.... just confused:confused: That particular poster made no sense, and even his/her explanation made no sense. I'm not taking offence at it, it's just plain silly.