The CEO Has Spoken

[patval]

I know this thread will be moved or deleted soon but I wanted everyone on HAl board to hear this amazing story on Oceania board.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=363011

Read the first thread and then go to post # 124. On post 124 the CEO of Oceania gives his apolgials for the problem and refunds them the cruise fare for the Rotterdam at the end of June even if HAL does not refund it and 500 per person onboard credit. :eek::eek::eek::eek:


Amazing thread Amazing!:eek:


Paul

[Druke I]

There were some major communications problems leading up to OP initially posting, and although it did take awhile, Frank DelRio did comment, took charge, and cleaned up a mess.

If only more top executives would be "hands-on"! He often posts on the Oceania Forum, and is a very positive CEO.

I personally thought his resolution very very generous!

[bepsf]

Wow - I'm so glad that these folks have been looked after.

This certainly will make me consider Oceania in the future!

[SDHALFAN]

Wow Paul,

That was an amazing thread - thanks for posting the link. I am very impressed with Mr. del Rio and his hands-on approach.

In 19 cruises with HAL (I am currently booked for my 20th, 21st and 22nd), I have never encountered anything like this but if the situation should ever rear its ugly head then I know now to check out Oceania cruises as an alternative.

Valerie:D

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Definitely very interesting and great that all worked out. :) You can tell that I am having a slow day at work when I actually had time to read thru the whole thread:D

[lougee1043]

is oceania owned by another cruise company like hal to carnival or are they independant

[gizmo]

I read the entire thread. WOW !!

[RedmondCruiser]

I agree with Gizmo --- WOW --- Thats the kind of customer service that convinces a customer to come back. Rather than a brush off they bit the bullit and not only appoligized ( which is rare in todays corporate atmosphere ) but they gave very generous compensations. Its refreshing.

[MMastell]

is Oceania owned by another cruise company like HAL to carnival or are they independent

Oceania is independent. Frank Del Rio is the former head of Renaissance Cruises. He and Joe Watters started Oceania with two of the Renaissance ships and have now added a third.

It's rare that you can actually get a response from the CEO of a company. I don't think I've seen Mickey Arison respond to an issue on this board or any other. :)

Take care,
Mike

[sail7seas]

Oceania is independent. Frank Del Rio is the former head of Renaissance Cruises. He and Joe Watters started Oceania with two of the Renaissance ships and have now added a third.

It's rare that you can actually get a response from the CEO of a company. I don't think I've seen Mickey Arison respond to an issue on this board or any other. :)

Take care,
Mike

I sincerely doubt Mr. Arison has lots of spare time to sit and read message boards. :)

I, also, found what I read of the thread to be very interesting and commend Mr. DelRio for 'owning the problem' and doing something about it.

I think his solution fair and reasonable.

Thanks for the link to it.........But, one question, if you don't mind???

Why did you say you think this thread would be removed? I don't see that it breaks any of CC's rules. I can't imagine why the Hosts would find it unsuitable.

[bepsf]

Oceania is independent. Frank Del Rio is the former head of Renaissance Cruises. He and Joe Watters started Oceania with two of the Renaissance ships and have now added a third.

Mike

...and Joe Watters is former CEO of Crystal
These guys know about good customer service.
:)

The difference is that Rennaisance and Crystal didn't/dont make money.
I really hope Oceania is - seems like a latter-day RVL.

[patval]

I sincerely doubt Mr. Arison has lots of spare time to sit and read message boards. :)

I, also, found what I read of the thread to be very interesting and commend Mr. DelRio for 'owning the problem' and doing something about it.

I think his solution fair and reasonable.

Thanks for the link to it.........But, one question, if you don't mind???

Why did you say you think this thread would be removed? I don't see that it breaks any of CC's rules. I can't imagine why the Hosts would find it unsuitable.

The reason I said this S7S is because on the Crystal board the link was posted andthe thread was moved.

Paul

[seadrifter]

DH and I considered an Oceania cruise for July of 2007. Given the smaller ship, we would have visited wonderful ports that the larger ships cannot visit. Oceania offered a 2 for 1 deal and free airfare. We talked to our TA and were all set to go through with it. Problem was we would have had to fly into Rome, sail for seven days without a sea day (lots of wonderful ports that begged to be visited), and fly home from Barcelona. We love cruising and visiting new places but this itinerary (when we gave it more thought) seemed very tiring. Even with the 2 for 1 deal the price was not cheap. When I looked at the itineraries for most of the Oceania cruises, they are very port-intensive. Some day I hope we will try Oceania but right now that kind of cruise without a day of relaxation is not attractive to us.

Happy cruising,
Virginia

[sail7seas]

The reason I said this S7S is because on the Crystal board the link was posted andthe thread was moved.

Paul
\
Thanks, Paul.

[OCruisers]

Thanks, Paul, for posting this thread!

Happy Sailing! OCruisers :)

[mick70]

It took a lot of reading! HAL take take a look, and do not take us for granted.

[kryos]

Wow - I'm so glad that these folks have been looked after.

This certainly will make me consider Oceania in the future!
I too am glad that Oceania has a CEO who steps up to the plate and rights the wrongs of his organization. Says a lot about the organization and about his personal ethics.

I've actually heard a lot of good things about Oceania. The only reason I will likely never sail them is because of their somewhat restrictive smoking policies. Of course, at some point in time all the lines may have similar policies in place, so who knows? I may very well wind up on an Oceania sailing one day.

I'm just glad these poor folks got their vacations salvaged, and I feel sorry for the Oceania employees who screwed this one up. This CEO sounds like the type of person who runs a tight ship and it's not gonna be a good day for them ... and rightfully so.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[dougnewmanatsea]

This CEO sounds like the type of person who runs a tight ship
From his reputation in the industry, I'd say that's probably an understatement!

I can't say I feel too sorry for the people who screwed up though. They should know better than to involuntarily bump people off cruises, if that's not company policy.

I must say that I am continually impressed with Oceania. It's actions like this that have earned them my utmost respect even though I've never sailed with them.

Oceania is the first and only cruise line I have followed literally since its inception. I was mightily impressed them, and I still am impressed now.

For a few years before Oceania started up, many of us were complaining that HAL and X were no longer really "premium" (this is before Signature of Excellence and before that, X's "re-branding") and that a new line needed to fill that niche, above the mass-market lines but below the luxury ones. Oceania set out to fill that very niche, so that got them off to a good start.

But the thing that impressed me most was that FDR and other senior Oceania management went online to web sites like this one to ask potential future customers what we wanted - and they listened.

I remember when they first set out their corporate policies, there was one policy - on bringing alcohol on board (and we know how sensitive a topic that is) - that a lot of people didn't like. Oceania management listened, and they changed it right away. From that time on I have been very, very impressed by the attention they pay to their customers, right up to the highest levels of management.

I have intended to sail on Oceania ever since I first learned of its existence (before it was publicly announced or even had a name) but unfortunately I haven't had the opportunity yet. That said, I most certainly hope to try them in the near future. They seem like the kind of company I would really feel good about doing business with.

[kryos]

I can't say I feel too sorry for the people who screwed up though. They should know better than to involuntarily bump people off cruises, if that's not company policy.

After reading some of the things you mention in your post, now I'm even more impressed with Oceania. Unfortunately, top level management rarely "solicits" opinions of the public via public message boards prior to making major management policy decisions ... and even more rare when they act upon those opinions. Oceania sounds like a breath of fresh air to me ... and I guess their smoking policies also reflect the wishes of the majority of their customer base ... so I guess I can't fault the line for them.

Yeah, I guess I have to admit ... while I may feel sorry for the employees who screwed up ... I'm not too sorry for them. Bumping people involuntarily was an act of supreme stupidity ... specifically because it is totally unnecessary. Make an offer ... make it a good one ... and believe me, you'll have people lining up to take it. I mentioned on the Oceania Board about my experience with HAL ... on my Hawaii/South Pacific cruise this past January. They did the same thing ... overbooked ... and about three weeks before sailing they were in a pickle about it. I was away on a short cruise aboard the Celebrity Zenith at the time ... and got a frantic call from my TA. HAL was offering me 90 days of the 2006 World Cruise for the exact same price I paid for the 30-day Hawaii/South Pacific one ... similar accommodations. Man, if only I could have taken it!!!! Sadly, I couldn't though ... I still work for a living and I would have been unemployed had I taken a 90-day cruise ... but believe me, plenty of others were lined up begging for the deal. These folks were mostly retirees with the flexibility to change their plans at practically a moment's notice ... and the ability to take a cruise of 90 days in length.

That's the proper way to do business. When the Amsterdam sailed for that Hawaii/South Pacific itinerary, everyone had a stateroom and no one was upset because they were treated shabbily.

Keep the customer happy ... and the customer will always keep coming back.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[gizmo]

This isn't the first time "bumping" has happened. I don't mean a cruise being cancelled or chartered but just plain old bumping.

Anyone remember Carnival's Miracle fiasco in Baltimore in 2004 ?

It was overbooked, big time ! People who booked a year in advance got bumped. This was not a handful of people but hundreds.

The software used, expected x amount of cancellations. (Jim Gallop mentioned this in another thread). That didn't happen, so the Miracle was overbooked.

People got refunded, offered deals on other cruises, but in the long run many vacations were ruined.

[mike35]

Oceania sounds like a breath of fresh air to me ... and I guess their smoking policies also reflect the wishes of the majority of their customer base ... so I guess I can't fault the line for them.

...

--rita

I'm an avid fan of Oceania for many reasons, which I won't go into here, since this is ostensibly a Holland America board. I would, however, like to comment on Oceania's smoking policy. Oceania's policy parallels that of many cities and countries (can you believe Ireland outlawing smoking in all of its pubs and restaurants??). While O's ships are not "non-smoking" per se', smoking is restricted to just a few areas on board - namely a corner of the Horizon's lounge (indoors) and an area on deck 10. Smoking is stricly prohibited in cabins, balconies, suites, the casino, dining rooms, bars, the computer lab; in other words, where one's second-hand smoke can impinge on the desire for smoke-free air by those passengers sensitive to smoke.

We've made several friends on our 3 Oceania cruises who are smokers. Apparently the many plusses of "O" outweigh the somewhat restrictive smoking policies, as they, too, have become enamored with what "O" has to offer, and they continue to book future cruises with them.

Mike

[patval]

I want to say thanks to everyone who was happy with me posting this link and espically the moderator for not deleting the thread or moving it. Thank you, Paul

[sail7seas]

:) :) Our Hosts on the HAL Board are Host Walt and Host Doug.

Actually, Doug posted to this thread.

Thanks again for providing the link.

[K&RCurt]

WOW That was a long read!

I am very impressed that the CEO posted a public response and "Did the right thing". I am so glad that the affected people had their vacations salvaged. It seems to me someone decided they had overbooked several cabins and someone was told "Make Room" and decided on their own to use drastic measures instead of doing more work and identifying some folks willing to accept an incentive to switch. I surly would not want to have participated in the "bumping" I suspect they may be looking for new employment about now!

One thing that was disturbing was the amount of bashing and name calling against the OP and the other affected CCer. A healthy does of scepticism is ONE thing, but they were accused of being trolls or members of an "Organized anti-cruising group". Even AFTER the post by the CEO very few of the bashers came back to appologize. Reactions like that are a big reason people post just a few times and disappear. I hope we do a better job here on the HAL forum of maintaining a civil environment.

[BigDoug]

This isn't the first time "bumping" has happened. I don't mean a cruise being cancelled or chartered but just plain old bumping.

Anyone remember Carnival's Miracle fiasco in Baltimore in 2004 ?

It was overbooked, big time ! People who booked a year in advance got bumped. This was not a handful of people but hundreds.

The software used, expected x amount of cancellations. (Jim Gallop mentioned this in another thread). That didn't happen, so the Miracle was overbooked.

People got refunded, offered deals on other cruises, but in the long run many vacations were ruined.

Yes, many people were upset about the bumping but Carnival did not wait until 7 days days before a foreign cruise to notify the TA's/pax. IIRC, the notifications were sent out about 50 days before the overbooked cruise. This was just after the final cancellation period. At least the affected pax would have a chance to reschedule. I think Carnival also offered free transportation to NYC for all the local pax that accepted the cruise from NYC.

As Mr. DelRio stated, bumping a passenger 7 days before a cruise should never have happened.

[serendipity1499]

Paul..Thanks for posting the thread..That open letter will go a long way & is the cheapest advertising he could get..

I too am very impressed with Mr. Del Rio...Perhaps someday we will get to cruise on Oceania..Thanks again..Betty:)

[sailorbill]

Having once sailed on Renaissance in 2000 and loved the experience, I have followed the demise of Renaissance and the emergence of Oceania with much interest. If I am not mistaken, Frank Del Rio became head of Renaissance when it was already heading on its way to bankruptcy. Renaissance failed because of a too ambitious and rapid ship building program and a bad marketing strategy. Then 9/11 happened and Renaissance went belly up very quickly. The Renaissance ships went back to the bankers and financiers and have slowly been bought or chartered by various cruise lines. Oceania was started with two of the Renaissance ships and now has three. Many of the features of Renaissance have been continued with Oceania such as open dining, no children facilities, no formal dress, no smoking (well, almost no smoking) and very port intensive itineraries. To this Oceania added upscale features like better beds, linens and toiletries and higher quality food and service. In pricing and quality Oceania is positioned as a premium cruise line between the mainstream lines and the luxury lines. (HAL provides a mainstream cruise line experience despite all the blather and puffed up pretense that it is a premium line.) I would love to do an Oceania cruise but just cannot bring my bargain oriented miserliness(?) to pay the extra tariff required for sailing as a single. I can get a fine cruise experience on HAL for about half the per diem fare of Oceania, and I don't mean the phony Oceania brochure fare. Oceania's standard fare is two for one with free air, but it has a 100% single supplement.

Having been head of a failing cruise line, Frank Del Rio must be enjoying himself as the head of an apparently successful, if smaller, cruise line. His hands on involvement is not too surprising when one considers that Oceania has only three small ships carrying approximately 2050 passengers when full. By contrast the president of HAL oversees 13 ships carrying approximately 20,000 passengers when full and the CEO of Carnival Corp. oversees several cruise lines with around 80 ships carrying over 150,000 passengers. A bit of bad publicity makes a bigger impact on Oceania than it does on HAL or Carnival.

[matterless]

What kind of company do you work in? Do you think the "employees" have decided on the bumping policy!!!!!!! No - that comes right from the top. Also if the CEO has decided to apply a bumping policy to the company, it is up to him to have a training policy that ensures the staff can do it with the least amount of impact on the customer.

[Tricia724]

I agree that Mr. DelRio's action on behalf of our CC posters certainly was impressive, but I find myself wondering how many other cruisers there are out there who do not have access to a public forum such as this who were bounced from this cruise and left without other options. What I would like to know is whether Oceania reviewed all of the cuts that were made and attempted to rectify the situation. I think it's highly unlikely that our two CC people were the only ones affected in this case.

Just a thought.

[lizf]

There are probably two sides there. Were all of the passengers so affected taken care of so gallantly? We don't know. If the folks who brought up the situation hadn't stayed and put up with the terrible name calling, would the same outcome have happened? I do know that DH and I took one of those wonderful Oceania cruises and looked forward with great anticipation for all of their luxury. To make a long story real short........We didn't find any of it. It was the worst cruise we ever had. The gourmet food was a joke and we rated it below any of our experiences on NCL.
It was through that experience that we came running back to try HAL again, after 10 years. Thank goodness we did. We just did the 25 day Amazon Explorer on the Prinsendam and from there we booked the 46 day Taste of Two Continents. We luxuriated in every day aboard the Prinsendam and still shudder to remember that other terrible trip.
I won't go into detail because there isn't any point in bringing it up now, and I still fear the attacks that come for doing so. Those things do not happen on this board, but as you could see, other boards aren't so nice. I've seen times when posters over on that board got flamed if they said the slightest negative. We didn't write to the CEO, we put all our complaints in our comment sheet and complained while still on board, as did other passengers. We were never contacted by anyone about it after we got off the ship. We didn't pursue it further because there was nothing we wanted from them. If we got a free cruise we wouldn't have taken it. Cruise board credit, not going back for any reason. You don't take a chance when its that bad to start. We met many passengers on that trip that were upset by their experience there. So as Dr. Phil says.......no matter how flat you make the pancake, there are still two sides to it.

[HeatherInFlorida]

I'm not sure I've ever read a thread that long all at once before. Thank you so much for the link, Paul, because it was a real eye opener for me in many ways.

As somewhat of a cynic myself on these boards, I can understand why some initially questioned the OP, but couldn't believe how long it continued even after verification of the incident was so clear!

Hope everyone saw Carolyn's (Editor-in-Chief of CC) article on this. If you're not up to reading the entire thread, ths is a great synopsis: Cruise Critic News: Can Cruise Lines Bump Passengers ... at Will? (http://www.cruisecritic.com/news/news.cfm?ID=1692)

I'm just so glad it worked out for Donna and Margo in the end ... and good for Mr. Del Rio for going "on the record" on CC. My hat's off to him for sure:)