Pinnacle $30 Ahhhhhh!!!!

[fb0075]

Just recieved email from persons on our tour--they had called to arrange Pinnacle reservations and were told that the price would be going to $30 in apx 3 weeks--(ROTTERDAM)

OH ME----IM NOT GOING TO START!!!!!!
FRANK

[jhannah]

Yikes! The Pinnacle Grill is an outstanding dining experience; but if this is true then I'm out! $20 extra per person is pushing the envelope, IMO. Adding another ten is just more than the experience is worth to me.

[sail7seas]

With all respect, I'm going to wait to have this confirmed before I comment too much. But $30 per person plus the tips we leave does make it so that we will think about it a little more closely before we make multiple bookings on a given cruise. I'm sure we'll still go once but maybe not a number of times. We'll see.

In the meantime, I'm waiting to have it confirmed.

[SummerfieldCruiser]

Just talked to Ships Services, $30.00 effective 10/1/06

[AZjohn]

Hummmm, let’s see if my brain is working correctly this morning….
$30 for wife + $30 for myself + $20 tip = $80 for dinner at Pinnacle, or…… Dinner at Main Dinning room with new friends at no additional cost….
OK, think I got it figured out..

[cruisin240]

That stinks.....I wonder if you prepay now if you can get it for 20.00 p/p

[sail7seas]

People who sail other cruise lines and dine in their alternative restaurants......... What are the charges for them? Any of them $30 per person.

[BruceMuzz]

Todd English Restaurant on QM2:
$30 per person for lunch abd $40 per person for dinner

Sabatini Italian Restaurant on RCCL:
$40 per person for dinner

[ASue]

Does anyone know if this is for all HAL ships????

[sail7seas]

Todd English Restaurant on QM2:
$30 per person for lunch abd $40 per person for dinner

Sabatini Italian Restaurant on RCCL:
$40 per person for dinner

Thank you, Bruce.
There's the answer!

[sail7seas]

Does anyone know if this is for all HAL ships????

I would think so. It would be very odd for the charge to not be uniform on all the ships. If that is what HAL thinks dinner at Pinnacle is worth, that is what they would charge on all the ships, presumably.

[caviargal]

Todd English Restaurant on QM2:
$30 per person for lunch abd $40 per person for dinner

Sabatini Italian Restaurant on RCCL:
$40 per person for dinner

Sabatini is on Princess, not RCI and is 20-25, not 40.

RCI has Portofino and Chops at 20pp, both quite good IME.

Murano on Celebrity is 30 pp.

I enjoyed PG on ZUI, 6 of 7 nights actually. This next trip I was planning to do the same but now will have to reconsider.

[mountainmare]

We're sailing Celebrity for the first time in 24 days--they also charge $30--and you are limited to a three course meal--appetizer or soup or salad, entree, dessert. There was a discussion over at Celeb about ordering two appetizers and the answer seemed to be no. The five course meal with wine pairings is much more expensive.
At $20 pp it was a push--now the $10 first night bargain was great whle it lasted!!!

[fb0075]

SAIL,
That might be the answer but the WRONG ONE as far as I am concerned!!
You know that I am "TIGHT" but this is just ridiculous--again IMHO---
I have never been that impressed but it was a nice nite--and the food last month on the NOORDAM was very good--but not $60---
Remember--and I dont want to rehash all this as we have many many times---The service charge when these restaurants first came out was to "TIP" the staff as they wouldnt participate in the dining room tips--it has now involved into a charge that I am sure that all lines keep.
And as many times as the line says that "no tip" required --us Americans feel obligated to do so--and the circle continues until they find a ressistance level--Which they just have for me!!
Hope all is well FRANK

[SanDiego Single]

It might just be that the people who tipped the extra will not do that anymore so it will hurt the employees more than HAL

[fcorey]

wow, I haveto say that is a bit high, not on its own but when you include a tip as AZJohn pointed out. I'll still go on our upcoming trip, but maybe only one night, our aniversary. I hope that this increased price also doesnt hurt the servers there. The increased cost may make people a little less generous with a tip which would be unfortunate.

[sail7seas]

Hmmmm..... I just had a thought.

HAL and AmEx Platinum have not yet renewed their contract. Among the benefits AmEx Plat. Members receive if they use that card to charge their cruises, is a free dinner in Pinnacle.

Seeing as until last year, the contract was usually renewed by August 30.
I'm wondering if one of the things they are trying to work out is about continuing free Pinnacle dinner seeing as HAL knew they were going to raise the price?

Perhaps that is one of the hangup about getting that contract signed??? Don't know; just speculating.

[doone]

WOW, I enjoy the Pinnacle Grill and don't mind the $20 per person charge, plus the gratuity, but I am not going to pay $30 per person plus a tip. I am sure if people don't book the Pinnacle, it will go back to the $20 per person, but if everyone keeps going, it probably will stay at the $30 for a while and then you will see it to be $40!!!!!! When will it end. Remember in the beginning it was free!!!!!!!!

[localady]

I guess that 3 days into our 9/28 cruise the price will change.:o I too think we will be avoiding the Pinnacle also. We find that the quality varies so by ship, that it's a gamble at best to eat there.

Think we will stay with the main dining room and try restaurants on land for lunch if we want a change!

[elmorejj]

Well as I see it, if they are upping the price, they really need to up or change the menu. Paying $30 for dinner, over and above what you have already paid for dinner in the main DR, is in my opinion, a little much. Add to that the tip we always leave, drinks and/or wine, and it makes for an expensive evening. Now if the menu was really good, with new items, then I would probably try it again. Not with the current menu..........jean:cool:

[cruzin girl]

Count me out.

[RedmondCruiser]

Sail -- I think we were just talking about erroding the product and here we go again. HAL will find that newbes will pay the higher price but the ancient Mariners will balk. (only my opinion)

On a Zaandam 20 day Panama Canal Cruise the Pinnacle was empty - and I mean empty. Then they announced that the price had been reduced to $15. Suddenly the place filled up and was frequented the rest of the cruise.

HAL would have been wise to have kept the increase to $25. At $25 PP I think they would receive a more favorable reception. I hope the bean counters stop before they decide to have a cafeteria style check out line in the Lido.

[DesertDogs]

On Tuesday, we pre-paid for two nights for an October sailing and were charged the $20 pp. No mention of the price increase by ship services. Hope we don't have to pay more when we get on the ship :(

[mafig]

I was going to try it on our upcoming Volendam cruise, even though the reviews were mixed. Undecided now.

Just to reiterate what a previous poster said, Sabatini's is on Princess and is not $40. Celebrity's specialty restaurants are $30 and they almost always get rave reviews.

[ASue]

I'll be going on the Zaandam next month and was looking forward to dinner one night in the PG. Hmmmmm but $30.00 ????? Don't think so. The food is great but not worth that IMO

[RustaRoo]

...and so the nickle and diming continues:( The food has only been mediocre for me anyway, so I won't miss it.

[ASue]

On Tuesday, we pre-paid for two nights for an October sailing and were charged the $20 pp. No mention of the price increase by ship services. Hope we don't have to pay more when we get on the ship :(



We tried to pre-pay and were told by Ship Services we couldn't do that.

[ASue]

...and so the nickle and diming continues:( The food has only been mediocre for me anyway, so I won't miss it.


I wouldn't call a extra $20.00 per couple nickle and diming

[patval]

Hey at least its not as bad as Silver Seas and Seabourn that charge over 100.00 per person. :eek::eek::eek:


I wonder if they are now going to offer different menus or add itesm to the menu so customers wont complain much.


Also Princess two paid restraurants charge between 15-20 per person.


Paul

[SanDiego Single]

Its amazing how inconsistant that ship services is.

[sail7seas]

;) I hear you, fboo75.


fcorey: I agree that many (most) people who used to tip additional, no longer will.

[ASue]

Its amazing how inconsistant that ship services is.

LOL no kidding, Think I'll call them and tell them I read on the CC boards that people are pre-paying for the PG I want to too !!!!! hahahahahahaha

[sail7seas]

Sail -- I think we were just talking about erroding the product and here we go again. HAL will find that newbes will pay the higher price but the ancient Mariners will balk. (only my opinion)

On a Zaandam 20 day Panama Canal Cruise the Pinnacle was empty - and I mean empty. Then they announced that the price had been reduced to $15. Suddenly the place filled up and was frequented the rest of the cruise.

HAL would have been wise to have kept the increase to $25. At $25 PP I think they would receive a more favorable reception. I hope the bean counters stop before they decide to have a cafeteria style check out line in the Lido.


Guess we'll have to wait and see if Pinnacle remains empty night after night.

We've been on some cruises when it was packed every night and others where there were empty tables.

[crystal808]

Hey at least its not as bad as Silver Seas and Seabourn that charge over 100.00 per person. :eek::eek::eek:

Just to clarify: Seabourn does not charge $100 per person for dinner. Perhaps the poster was referring to the per diem charge difference, and that obviously varies per person, and per cruise....

(All-inclusive) Seabourn is more per diem than HAL, without a doubt. There is not an additional charge for dinner. Nor the champagne (nor the caviar!)

Paul

[Sueseb]

We have always found the food in the dining room very good and will continue to have our dinners there. Although, the food in the Pinnacle was excellent, we were underwhelmed by the service and felt very rushed.

[AirGorilla]

People who sail other cruise lines and dine in their alternative restaurants......... What are the charges for them? Any of them $30 per person.


The Crystal Symphony has two specialty restaurants: Prego (Italian) and Jade Garden (Asian).

Reservations are required (and limited), but there is NO surcharge, other than a suggested gratuity of $6.00 per diner.

BTW, Prego is fantastic!!

[Krazy Kruizers]

Looks as though we will not be dining as much in the Pinnacle as we used to.

[newmexicoNita]

Todd English Restaurant on QM2:
$30 per person for lunch abd $40 per person for dinner

Sabatini Italian Restaurant on RCCL:
$40 per person for dinnerQE2 isn't HAL and when were you on RCCI and charged $40 for dinner? that certainly isn't the normal price. Most all mass marketed lines charge $10-$25 with Celebrity being $30 for a 3 course dinner. We normally try eating in specialty dining rooms 1 or 2 times, depending on the length of the cruise: I think we will choose, this time to eat in the main dining and use the extra money for something else. $30 is pushing it a little. Hopefully there will be a 1/2 price offer a couple of nights or something like that NMNita

[Krazy Kruizers]

If HAL is going to raise the price, HAL better start to change the menu more oftern - at least have 3 different menus per cruise.

[Krazy Kruizers]

Wonder if HAL will honor prepaid Pinnacle reservations that some of us have already made?

[happy cruzer]

Well, some of us won't have to worry about how much to tip. We just will skip it entirely.

I think it is still worth it but I just don't want to pay it when I can have a great dinner in the dining room that is already paid for.

[Krazy Kruizers]

I bet that AMEX Plat will drop that perk. I can't see AMEX Plate giving HAL $30 per person.

[walnut99]

If this is true, and apparently it is, I can find a better use for the sixty dollars plus tip. I will have my "free" meal in the dining room and spend the money someplace else or use it at home for dinner in a land based restaurant. The Pinnacle was nice but not that much nicer than the dining room.

[vpoopsy]

I just verified that is going up to $30 as of 10/1/06!!!! I've got a "coupon" for a free dinner for two or we wouldn't be going.

[Margarita Jane]

When we dined in the specialty dining room on Celebrity, the fee included the tip. Is it possible that HAL is increasing from $20 to $30 to include the tip?

We will be doing our first HAL in October.

[sail7seas]

I doubt there will be any statement of tip included. I think it will remain as always on HAL......tipping over and above the automatically amount charged to your shipboard account is at your discretion.

[patval]

sSprry I got Seabourn and Silverseas mixed up but Silverseas restaurant is 100.00 per person and I think more if you ask for the wine tasting menu.

paul

[sail7seas]

If HAL is going to raise the price, HAL better start to change the menu more oftern - at least have 3 different menus per cruise.


KK:

I've heard there will be menu changes and daily specials. Some other changes.
The new price will be effective October 1.

I'd be very surprised if any prepaid reservations already made won't be honored.

[dakrewser]

Rather than moaning here, I'd suggest that everyone vote with their feet. After all, it's not as if you'll go hungry if you don't go to the PG.

Still, I don't understand the motivation - it's not as if it's difficult to get a PG reservation, the place seems to be half empty every night.

And the menu is getting tiresome. Even MacDonald's changes their menu more often!

On our recent 16-day Prinsendam cruise, the dining room was so good that we didn't go to the PG even once (although I did use their wine list most nights). We probably won't again until there's something fresh and new...

[kakalina]

Guess I will stick to the dining room and use the savings elsewhere. Regardless the money will probably end up in HAL's pockets anyway. Since our cruise consultant always arranges at least one free dinner in the PG per cruise we will at least go once.

[lb0103]

I REALLY hated to read this post as we leave on 10/21. I was going to make reservations at PG before we left, but I think I will wait and see. Is anyone SURE the $30 does not include the tip? Maybe the servers were not getting a fair tip and, like the daily auto tip, maybe this is a way to ensure they do?
If it included the tip I could live with that as we would have spent $60 for the night. But if it doesn't then we will pass and enjoy the dining room as we always do.

I'm sure until this gets around people will go and then be shocked by the price, but that would only happen once for me.

[esther e]

[quote=margauret]When we dined in the specialty dining room on Celebrity, the fee included the tip. Is it possible that HAL is increasing from $20 to $30 to include the tip?

It will for us.

[Darspurs]

My upcoming cruise will be my first on HAL so I have no first hand experience of how good or bad the Pinnacle Grill is.

On my last cruise on the Constellation we ate in Oceanliners and if I recall correctly it was $30 per head. Worth it? This was one of the finest meals we have ever had in our lives. We have been to many fine restaurants in and around London where we live and around the world whilst on holiday.

I can say that the meal in Oceanliners that we had was at least as good as any restaurant costing $300-500 a couple in the UK.

As I say having not experienced the Pinnacle but only reviews it would appear to me that I will be more likely to opt for the dining room, than, as it seems, the Pinnacle is not worth $60 more a couple than the dining room.

Anyway you never know if I see a menu one evening that doesn't particularly appeal to us we may try it out - if there are any tables free and by looks of things @ $30 a head it shouldn't be too much of a problem to get a reservation.

[JunPOA]

Oh Wow, what a bummer if they impose the additional 10/pp.:(
I already pre-purchased ours for our Saguenay River day at sea on October 5th.:confused:

[Sage]

This news is really going to make me appreciate our upcoming Crystal cruise where the alternative restaurant is still free.

[newmexicoNita]

My upcoming cruise will be my first on HAL so I have no first hand experience of how good or bad the Pinnacle Grill is.

On my last cruise on the Constellation we ate in Oceanliners and if I recall correctly it was $30 per head. Worth it? This was one of the finest meals we have ever had in our lives. We have been to many fine restaurants in and around London where we live and around the world whilst on holiday.

I can say that the meal in Oceanliners that we had was at least as good as any restaurant costing $300-500 a couple in the UK.

As I say having not experienced the Pinnacle but only reviews it would appear to me that I will be more likely to opt for the dining room, than, as it seems, the Pinnacle is not worth $60 more a couple than the dining room.

Anyway you never know if I see a menu one evening that doesn't particularly appeal to us we may try it out - if there are any tables free and by looks of things @ $30 a head it shouldn't be too much of a problem to get a reservation.
WE ate twice on the Connie in Oceanliners, but I certainly wouldn't rate it anywhere near what you did. Of course food is subjective: the service was outstanding but the food wasn't as good as we have had on some land vacations. Would we do it again for $30 plus tip no< $30 including tip, probably once per cruise. I too have heard praises for Oceanliners, but don't think I have ever heard anyone rate it in the same class as $500. Of course UK prices are a bit high compared to what we are accustom to paying, mostly because of the exchange rate. NMNita

[AirGorilla]

Rather than moaning here, I'd suggest that everyone vote with their feet. After all, it's not as if you'll go hungry if you don't go to the PG.

Still, I don't understand the motivation - it's not as if it's difficult to get a PG reservation, the place seems to be half empty every night.

And the menu is getting tiresome. Even MacDonald's changes their menu more often!

On our recent 16-day Prinsendam cruise, the dining room was so good that we didn't go to the PG even once (although I did use their wine list most nights). We probably won't again until there's something fresh and new...
dakrewser --
Ordering wine off the Pinnacle wine list when dining in the main dining room sounds like an excellent idea.

Did you pre-order your wine? Or did you order from the regular dining room wine steward? If the latter, does he carry the Pinnacle list around with him?

Thanks for your help.

[Darspurs]

[QUOTE=newmexicoNita]WE ate twice on the Connie in Oceanliners, but I certainly wouldn't rate it anywhere near what you did.

Nita - The food in my opinion, certainly when we ate, in Oceanliners was of the quality of Michel Roux's world famous restaurant ' The Waterside Inn' at Bray a few miles outside London. The Waterside Inn is rated as not only one of the finest restaurants in the UK but in the world and the food in Oceanliners was of similar quality and presentation by his own trained chefs, a comparable meal with no alcohol for two at the Waterside Inn would cost $350-400 for two.

As you quite rightly state food is subjective, which is fortunate as otherwise restaurants would be very boring if we all liked the same.

[skywalkervadar]

We too ate at Ocean Liners on Celebrity Constellation, a few years back. It remains the best dining experience either of us has ever had. The food was amazing (salad and then Goat Cheese Soufflé to start, a steak finished, spiced and sauced to perfection right in front of you and then Chocolate Soufflé for dessert that was to die for). The service, presentation and quality were amazing. It was like theatre instead of just dining.

Our experience in the Pinnacle on the Zuiderdam though was what I'd call pretty standard (Keg-like) for a finer restaurant so definately nothing special and didn't come anywhere close to Celebrity.

$80 bucks for 2 will price us out of going to the Pinnacle. If we were on a Celebrity ship, I'd be happy to pay it (price was $25 3 years ago) but if I pay for all-inclusive, I'm not willing to pay for just standard dining in a specialty restaurant at $30 a piece + tip.

[sail7seas]

This news is really going to make me appreciate our upcoming Crystal cruise where the alternative restaurant is still free.

Sage.... Please correct me if I am wrong but I imagine you paid a higher fare on Crystal than you would have on HAL. For more money, it is possible to include more

We all know that nothing we get on any ship is free......it's a question of what is included in our fare on one cruise line vs another, isn't it? And how much we paid to begin with?

[crystal808]

I just spoke to Ship's Services and placed an order for my upcoming 10/29 Westerdam sailing, including a couple of Pinnacle reservations. I was informed that, for now, all reservations being accepted are at the $20 rate, up until Oct. 1, when the reservations will change to $30 pp. So, if you have a cruise booked, it might be a good idea to call and pay for a reservation before Oct. 1, if you wish to "beat" the price increase. Of course, we all know that HAL could change its mind and use "cruise date" vs. "order date" at any time (although I wasn't told that!). I seriously doubt that they could increase the fee once it's been paid for in advance....

Hope this helps...
Paul

[Sea King]

"Count me in; count me out"!

about what?

I'm so confused:confused:

this is optional; you do it or you don't

it's either worth the charge or it's not

same thing about a cruise: either you agree with price (going for the best price available is of course sensible) or not

really don't understand the problem:eek:

I've dined at Pinnacle a number of times

compared with home, the price charged was a fraction of what it would be "off the ship" for the same comparable meal (appetizers, entree, sides, dessert and coffee/espresso/capuccino

tipping?

doubt HAL will change its policy

doubt Pax will change either .. :(

also doubt Pinnacle will close

if you're spending "x" for the cruise, is the $20 extra going to change anything?

really don't think so

how bout suggesting HAL go to $25.00?

maybe they'll be less controversy about $10/per couple than $20

sorry

just can't understand why something optional can cause so much discussion:)

[sail7seas]

I'm finding it interesting reading this thread and thinking back to when HAL first introduced Pinnacles (on Zuiderdam) and we learned it would be an additional charge.

Everyone was carrying on about how Odyssey and Marco Polo had been no extra charge and they wouldn't pay extra and, indeed, some people stuck to their word and refused to pay Pinnacle Grill charge of $20.00 per person. BUT, many (a great many) of us have paid the charge.......repeatedly. Some of us were convinced it wouldn't be worth it but we found it was and now for some of us, our cruise is not complete (in our opinion) until we have dined in Pinnacle....at least once. Some of us go more than once.

So, my guess is........Yes, we'll moan and groan and complain..... and then many of us will 'suck it up' and make our reservations.

I am happy to hear there will be menu changes and specials daily. That will make a big difference IMO. I have tired a little of the same menu over and over so they are going to be charging us more but it appears they will be providing us more.

Let's give it a chance. Anyone who doesn't want to pay extra, of course, simply doesn't go to Pinnacle......same as now. No change in that regard.

No one HAS to leave the very fine dining room. Many of us comment regularly on this board that we have consistendly seen an improvement in the dining room and most of us are very satisfied with our dinners there. No need to pay anything extra if you don't want to.

[sail7seas]

:) Sea King...........we were posting at the same time but seem to feel about the same about this subject.

[7x5090g]

IMPORTANT!!

Just got off the phone with Ship Services. You can pre-order your PG dinning with Ship Services prior to Oct 1 they will still honor the $20PP.

You can pre-order as many nights as you want and if you decide to cancel during the cruise, you get the money back on your on-board account. Hope this helps.:D

[hammybee]

[QUOTE=Sea King just can't understand why something optional can cause so much discussion:)[/QUOTE]

I am with you Sea King.

Most people have a financial investment in something. Most people want to see a healthy return on their financial investment. The way this happens is for a company to be profitable. When they are, we usually get a better return on our investment, in said company. Then we can afford to cruise and if we choose, eat in the Pinnacle. This is the circle of life, as we know it.

[LAFFNVEGAS]

WOW, I just got thru reading this thread. A lot was happening here while I was getting ready for work, driving to work and attending meetings:D I really cannot add much more than what has been said other than if they do change the menu, have some different items it may be worth a try. We have been on a few cruises where we just did not even go to the Pinnacle and there were other times when we went two times in the week. Personally I am on the wait and see for this. I can see where the price would bother some frankly it does not bother me if there will be some change in the menu. It was only a matter of time before they raised the price. We talk about the tip in the Pinnacle while we always tip I would venture to guess the majority DO NOT tip in the Pinnacle and that this and along with wanting to vary the menu could be the reason for the cost increase.

[dndcruisers]

Hi all - do I understand correctly? :confused: The price change is effective October 1st??? Please advise..Thanks - only 6 days left till Rotterdam:D

[Krazy Kruizers]

That is correct - new price for Pinnacle takes effect on Oct 1.

[dndcruisers]

Nevermind - I found my answer on an earlier posting. sorry!

[Krazy Kruizers]

AMEX Plat contract is up with HAL at the end of December. I don't see AMEX Plat having the Pinnacle as one of its perks.

In fact I wonder if AMEX Plat will no longer have a contract with HAL???

[crystal808]

In the overall scheme of things, a $10 difference in a meal price vs. what I've paid for my vacation cruise, isn't a lot. I know each person looks at pricing differently, and certainly their reasonings are as valid as mine! :)

If I wish to dine in the Pinnacle Grill, I will. It's my vacation, and if I wish to "treat myself" (as I will undoubtedly do each day in any number of ways :D ), then it's the price I'll pay for my "treat"! ;)

Everyone sees their own financial situation differently; and each chooses their priorities. And I agree with Sail: some will choose not to dine there, and others will continue to. Personally, I'm just glad we have the alternative to choose....

Edit:
By the way, how long has the Pinnacle been available on HAL?

JMO,
Paul

[sail7seas]

Pinnacle first appeared on Zuiderdam when she joined the fleet. That was either the very end of 2002 or very early 2003.

[crystal808]

Pinnacle first appeared on Zuiderdam when she joined the fleet. That was either the very end of 2002 or very early 2003.




Thanks, Sail. I was just curious to see how long the $20 charge has been "current". As suggested, it's not surprising to see an increase (as everything else increases!), after 3 years....

Thanks again!
Paul

[cruisin240]

So, I am guessing for the majority of cruisers the xtra 10.00 p/p isn't going to break us. It is just the whole principal of the matter. It irritates me alot but I am guessing we will still go just because here in small town Iowa the best thing on the menu is the cow we just butchered and the sweet corn we just picked. So, yeah for us it is just the experience of trying someith new. We generally are "resort rats" and do the all-inclusive options and get so sick of the food after about day 4 I am hoping this will be a bit different.

Also, how smart is Hal.....think about what they have done...raised the price enough that maybe not as many people will go thus meaning less employees in the Pinnacle will be need but yet same amount of money coming in due to rate increase. So even if their numbers are down they will still come out ahead...just my 2cents worth..

[7x5090g]

In the overall scheme of things, a $10 difference in a meal price vs. what I've paid for my vacation cruise, isn't a lot. I know each person looks at pricing differently, and certainly their reasonings are as valid as mine! :)

If I wish to dine in the Pinnacle Grill, I will. It's my vacation, and if I wish to "treat myself" (as I will undoubtedly do each day in any number of ways :D ), then it's the price I'll pay for my "treat"! ;)

Everyone sees their own financial situation differently; and each chooses their priorities. And I agree with Sail: some will choose not to dine there, and others will continue to. Personally, I'm just glad we have the alternative to choose....

Edit:
By the way, how long has the Pinnacle been available on HAL?

JMO,
Paul

Couldn't agree more. However, if there is a way to spend less money while still enjoying the same treat, I would find whatever way to pay less. I am going on a HAL cruise with 7 people, that's a $70 more i have to dish out. I am going to pre-order before Oct 1 and save the $70 on something else. Sorry, I am an accountant.

[Capt. & Teach]

I made a reservation a couple of weeks ago and the $20 per charge is already on my credit card. I am assuming that if done before the "date" that amount will hold. However, you know what happens when one "assumes"!!!

[7x5090g]

Also, how smart is Hal.....think about what they have done...raised the price enough that maybe not as many people will go thus meaning less employees in the Pinnacle will be need but yet same amount of money coming in due to rate increase. So even if their numbers are down they will still come out ahead...just my 2cents worth..

Yeah. Also by not announcing it will certainly catch people off guard. Had I not been browsing this forum, I would not even know that they are jacking up the price. I would otherwise find that out in a month's time when I get on board the Noordam. Once you are there, people would likely dish out the $10 anyways.

[kiwichick]

Of interest to people in the UK.... we recently cruised on the Noordam and received from Sea Vacations (HAL's UK agent) two vouchers for a free meal at the Pinnacle. Not sure whether they do this for everyone but we weren't staying in a suite or anything special like that so I suspect so! It was a very nice touch and the meal was fantastic :D

[w770496]

Anyone find out if the first night is still 50% off?

[hmh]

We were on the April 3 Asia cruise and noticed how empty the Grill seemed to be, most of the 14 nights. Friends, who had a comp. meal via Travel Agent, ate there during the cruise and felt the food was not as tasty as most of the DR meals and the service was not great. We ate in the Pinnacle on the AMS several years ago, were almost totally ignored, had sent our wine to the Grill and they had trouble finding it--came 1/2 way through meal--and I was of the opinion that the offerings were not very good or very hot. We have not gone back on 4 cruises since then and at $30 pp, I think the chances are pretty slim that we ever will. hmh

[p.nutgirl]

I am surprised that they are changing the price to $30 pp after Oct 1st...

My surprise is that I just got my documents for an October 7th sailing and in my documents it clearly states that I have the option to dine in the Pinnacle for $20pp... I would expect that they would have to change this in documents that the are sending out...

How can they just "surprise" me and tell me now that they want to charge $30pp.. can they do this??

[Frogs]

December will be our first HAL cruise. Our first cruise as NCL and we visited the specialty restaurants several nights - not even sure if we ate in the dinning room but maybe once. It cost us and we enjoyed it. Unfortunately I don't remember how much they were but I think only one was $20 the others were less. With that said we like fine eating but we don't have to have it to enjoy a good meal. I actually find it hard to pay over $20 per person as it is when I can get something I enjoy somewhere else for less. It's just a change of priorities that's all. We spend our money elsewhere and on different things these days. I was looking forward to the Pinnacle for a special night for the four of us but with the price increase I would have to be convinced it is worth it. I can't fault HAL for the increase. Costs for everything has gone up and they have to find a way make up for it.

Just my thoughts as I was reading this thread. As others have said, once the shock wears off most will still eat there and enjoy their experience and not think twice about it. Hopefull HAL will make changes as have been suggested here to make it a little more 'special' especially for those of you who cruise often - you deserve it!

Blessings!

[jhannah]

Anyone find out if the first night is still 50% off? My understanding is that they have stopped offering this first-night discount.

[7x5090g]

Of interest to people in the UK.... we recently cruised on the Noordam and received from Sea Vacations (HAL's UK agent) two vouchers for a free meal at the Pinnacle. Not sure whether they do this for everyone but we weren't staying in a suite or anything special like that so I suspect so! It was a very nice touch and the meal was fantastic :D


There are 7 of us travelling and we all got our tickets. NO VOUCHERS:mad:

[jhannah]

Hot topic, huh? Less than four hours since OP, and this is post 86!!!

[AAAAmerican]

I'm finding it interesting reading this thread and thinking back to when HAL first introduced Pinnacles (on Zuiderdam) and we learned it would be an additional charge.

Everyone was carrying on about how Odyssey and Marco Polo had been no extra charge and they wouldn't pay extra and, indeed, some people stuck to their word and refused to pay Pinnacle Grill charge of $20.00 per person. BUT, many (a great many) of us have paid the charge.......repeatedly. Some of us were convinced it wouldn't be worth it but we found it was and now for some of us, our cruise is not complete (in our opinion) until we have dined in Pinnacle....at least once. Some of us go more than once.

So, my guess is........Yes, we'll moan and groan and complain..... and then many of us will 'suck it up' and make our reservations.

I am happy to hear there will be menu changes and specials daily. That will make a big difference IMO. I have tired a little of the same menu over and over so they are going to be charging us more but it appears they will be providing us more.

Let's give it a chance. Anyone who doesn't want to pay extra, of course, simply doesn't go to Pinnacle......same as now. No change in that regard.

No one HAS to leave the very fine dining room. Many of us comment regularly on this board that we have consistendly seen an improvement in the dining room and most of us are very satisfied with our dinners there. No need to pay anything extra if you don't want to.





She is so very correct.:D :D

Adding choice does add more cost associated within.

Nobody is able to backwards in time except for memories and Kodak memories on paper not even with silver nitrate now....

Choice is up to the person to pay or not to pay ???...is the question.
The answer again, is a personal/professional choice as worth is as well.:eek:

[cruisin240]

This is really funny, I too was just noticing all of the posts. When I stop and think about it the best food I have ever had is when I have a really, really good bottle of Merlot to go with it.

[Hojo's redbeard]

Wow, I got this far and actually have something new to contribute. Last year we were on the Carnival Miracle where Nick & Nora's was $30/pp. The night that we went there were two other tables with passengers and two tables with employees, amazing how dead it was.

Knowing that HAL is owned by CCL, I was kind of surprised to see the specialty restaurant price lower on their better line.

One reason for the price increase could be that the price of the USDA prime has skyrocketed! Restaurant cost for prime meat is over $30/pound last time I looked. That's a big difference from the $4/pound steaks they serve in the main dining room.

We do plan to do the PG one night on our upcoming cruise, I appreciate the tip about pre-paying. The way I plan to save is to not order the Dom Perignon like last time. (Hopefully DW doesn't spend $200+ getting her hair done like last time :) )

[Sea King]

IMO: Cystal and Sails have it right:)

this is a choice NOT a requirement:eek:

there was less controversy when HAL changed the soda cards:D

[SarahQ]

Just called to pre-pay for our December cruise on the Westerdam...thanks for the tip to all of those who posted that they spoke with Ships Services.

The last time I sailed on HAL, there was no Pinnacle Grill, so I have no experience in whether its worth $20 vs $30; however, for 5 of us dining there for a special occasion, $100 vs $150 is a pretty big difference - especially considering that we could eat for free in the Dining Room.

Sea King certainly made a number of valid points - I can only explain why I am shocked the price is going up so drastically (IMHO 50% is a drastic increase). I certainly do have the choice of not eating in the Pinnacle - but, from a business standpoint, its hard for passengers to justify spending an extra $30 per person (plus tip if you're so inclined) when they already get an excellent meal in the dining room that they've already paid for.

I can understand the reasons for the increase - certainly, the cost of everything is increasing these days and the competition continues to heat up among cruise lines; however, I agree with those who have said that a $5 increase (to $25) would have been much more agreeable.

I am certainly glad that we were able to pre-pay at $20 (and hope HAL honours it!) because we would not have been celebrating my birthday at the Pinnacle if it was $30 p/p.

[crystal808]

Couldn't agree more. However, if there is a way to spend less money while still enjoying the same treat, I would find whatever way to pay less. I am going on a HAL cruise with 7 people, that's a $70 more i have to dish out. I am going to pre-order before Oct 1 and save the $70 on something else. Sorry, I am an accountant.

Andy: No need to apologize! And that's exactly why I went ahead and called today...believe me, I have no qualms at paying $20 instead of $30! :D

Paul

[tjcox9]

First night has not been $10 for a while, but we were able to book for first night at that rate once on board the Noordam in May. I'd read on the boards that could be done and gave it a try - it worked!

Also, I'm unclear from the posts if the menu changes also become effective 10/1. We have B2B in October and a promo Pinnacle dinner on each, so hope so.

[hammybee]

Given the way communication goes, does anyone want to make sure that the $30 does not take effect with all sailings on or after 10/1 as opposed to pre-boarding reservations for the PC, made before 10/1, regardless of sail date.

Hate to see a "cat fight" ensue onboard between PG and passengers who were told......

[sail7seas]

My information is that the price for dining at Pinnacle will be $30 per person beginning October 1.

If Ship Services continues to sell Pinnacles bookings between now and October 1 for $20 (even though the actual reservation is for a date after October 1), it would be expected the ship has to honor it.

I'm surprised Ships Services is doing that.

[Joanandjoe]

On our 11/25 Noordam cruise, we'll arrive in Tortola at 3 p.m., and won't get back from our excursion until after 7--way too late for our early dinner. Now we'll either eat in Road Town, order room service, or eat at the Lido. When eating on shore costs about the same as eating at the PG, one might as well get some local experience.

A note here about us: we were iffy about the PG at $20 a person, because we don't much like steakhouses. For the Italian restaurant on Rotterdam that was replaced by the PG, we gladly would have paid $20 or $30. For a steakhouse, no way!

[sail7seas]

We have four future cruises booked......through to November, 2007.

I wonder if Ships Services would accept a booking for Pinnacle Dinners from us for all those cruises? If so, I should be on the phone instead of here on the Internet. ;)

[serendipity1499]

Has anyone found out if the Lunch Menu will increase? :confused: Called Ships Services to book Dinner Reservations & was not told about the increase.. Therefore I forgot to ask about the Lunch Menu..

[fcorey]

I have two nights booked on the Oosterdam, 10/7/06 cruise and was billed $40 for each to my AMEX. I was under the impression you could reserve when you booked... guess i need to read the posts here a little better :o now i have something to do after we board... hope i can get a table on the first night, its our aniversary. Ship services person stated that the amount I was billed would be all I was paying. So i guess that means reservations/gifts being paid for now will be honored at old price.

[bepsf]

Here's hoping that this coincides w/ a change in menu...

I guess it will be a while before I throw another of my dinner parties in Pinnacle again...
:(

[ger_77]

We're sailing on the Rotterdam on October 10th and I have a question about Pinnacle reservations - do you have to give Guest Relations the exact date of your reservation, or can it be open-ended? We don't know which night we'd like to attend, but don't want it to interfere with formal evenings. I certainly want to take advantage of the $20/couple savings before we board. I'm sure there's somebody on this knowledgeable board who can advise me.

Oh, could you possibly provide me with the 1-800 number for Guest Relations so I can make the phone call from work?:D Thanks!


Smooth Sailing! :) :) :)

[crystal808]

We're sailing on the Rotterdam on October 10th and I have a question about Pinnacle reservations - do you have to give Guest Relations the exact date of your reservation, or can it be open-ended? We don't know which night we'd like to attend, but don't want it to interfere with formal evenings. I certainly want to take advantage of the $20/couple savings before we board. I'm sure there's somebody on this knowledgeable board who can advise me.

Oh, could you possibly provide me with the 1-800 number for Guest Relations so I can make the phone call from work?:D Thanks!

No, you don't have to reserve a specific night, although you may be asked if you have a preference. They won't guarantee it, but will mark your reservation with a "requested" date. I opted for "open-ended" reservations, and will decide once on board.

Ship's Services number is 800-541-1576.

Paul

[AlohaPride]

This is aweful, and I have two main questions:

1) What about those of us who have already paid the $20. Will we be charged an extra $10 pp later?

2) What will this do to the price of the "Wine Tasting" menu that's already $25 above the $20 you spend to make the reservation? hmm

I have an email into ship's services. No promise I will get a response, but I will post it if it does come in. :)

[k8russ8]

I am bookes 11/11 on Oosterdam My booking included free pinnacle. Should I relay this info to my TA? What a rip.....
K8

[crystal808]

This is aweful, and I have two main questions:

1) What about those of us who have already paid the $20. Will we be charged an extra $10 pp later?

I doubt that you will have to pay any extra. Really don't see that happening.

2) What will this do to the price of the "Wine Tasting" menu that's already $25 above the $20 you spend to make the reservation? hmm

I asked if my rep. knew about the tasting menu cost, and she didn't know of any change of its pricing. She said all she knew was that the Pinnacle surcharge was going up to the $30. I would guess that the tasting menu would remain an additional $29 (or whatever it is) over the Pinnacle surcharge, but that's just a guess. If you find out anything definitive, let us know.

Paul

[happy cruzer]

There have been a few people comment that people are moaning and groaning etc. I think everyone is reacting exactly the way people do when they learn about a change.

They evaluate and then decide what they want to do.

This HAL group of CCer's is very even headed. Try some of the other boards when something happens. Don't even go near the RCI thread that has two strikes in the title.

I appreciate everyone sharing their ideas, reactions, and plans. Thanks!

[Sea King]

don't have much more to say other than this

why take out whatever you're feeling on the stewards?

I've read several posts which in effect say if the price goes up, we're not tippping:mad:

can't help but wonder if those people ever tipped at all:rolleyes:

just don't get it

the waiters didn't take a vote to "up the price"

sorry, but it's just not right:(

go, don't go

am quite sure Pinnacle will survive this crisis:)

[esther e]

My thought (and it's only mine, not written anywhere) is that HAL raised the price to meet with Celebrity which states gratuities are included. Therefore, at the current price increase, I see no reason for additional tips. Incidentally, we never saw anyone leave anything extra on Celebrity, HAL or Oceania, where there is no additional charge.

Esther

[RuthC]

My thought (and it's only mine, not written anywhere) is that HAL raised the price to meet with Celebrity which states gratuities are included. Incidentally, we never saw anyone leave anything extra on Celebrity, HAL or Oceania, where there is no additional charge.
I have sailed HAL since 1978, and regularly since 1992. HAL has never---never---included gratuities in any price until the advent of the service charge a little over two years ago.
There is no reason to believe that they have started now with this.

You will never "see" me leave anything extra, either, but that doesn't mean that I don't.

[caviargal]

I guess I am in the minority but I tipped extra for each meal in the PG as I do on X, RCI, etc., in their specialty restaurants. I am not sure what percentage the waitstaff receives, but I prefer to recognize the excellent service with cash.

On RSSC, with no cover charges, open dining and pooled tips, I have never added additional.

We had breakfast in the PG most days this past March and always left a few dollars and we had dinner there 6 nights. We did not use the dining room at all after the first night, just preferred the intimacy and personal service in PG.

[sail7seas]

I have sailed HAL since 1978, and regularly since 1992. HAL has never---never---included gratuities in any price until the advent of the service charge a little over two years ago.
There is no reason to believe that they have started now with this.

You will never "see" me leave anything extra, either, but that doesn't mean that I don't.


Exactly, Ruth.......Just because you did not see my DH tip, does not mean he didn't tip. We have always tipped at Pinnacle and whenever we go to Pinnacle, we will continue to tip.......or we won't go.

[dakrewser]

dakrewser --
Ordering wine off the Pinnacle wine list when dining in the main dining room sounds like an excellent idea.

Did you pre-order your wine? Or did you order from the regular dining room wine steward? If the latter, does he carry the Pinnacle list around with him?

Thanks for your help.

You need to ask him to fetch it. But he'll keep one for you if you want. For best service do this:

Each night when you're signing the beverage check for your wine, ask the wine steward for tomorrow night's menu & the wine list. Look over the menu and decide what you'll have (or, perhaps, skip the DR entirely!) then choose your wine and tell the wine steward. It'll be waiting at your table when you come in the next night.

And be sure to tip him a bit extra at the end of the cruise! :)

[mike35]

People who sail other cruise lines and dine in their alternative restaurants......... What are the charges for them? Any of them $30 per person.



Oceania, our favorite cruise line, charges ZIP, NADA, ZILCH, NIL for their two outstanding alternate dining venues - the Polo Grill (Prime steaks, lobster, veal, etc) and Toscana - an incredible Italian venue that features quality as opposed to quantity (not like Sabatini's on Princess, which features just the opposite).

We'll be experiencing our first HAL cruise in December, and unless the main dining venues are awful, we'll certainly pass on the Pinnacle!

Mike

[7x5090g]

1) What about those of us who have already paid the $20. Will we be charged an extra $10 pp later?


Just reserved through HAL. What you paid for now is a voucher that entitles you to dinner at PG. It's just that this voucher will cost you $10 more if you purchase it after Oct 1.

2)What will this do to the price of the "Wine Tasting" menu that's already $25 above the $20 you spend to make the reservation?


You just have to pay the $25 on top of the voucher.

[7x5090g]

Given the way communication goes, does anyone want to make sure that the $30 does not take effect with all sailings on or after 10/1 as opposed to pre-boarding reservations for the PC, made before 10/1, regardless of sail date.

Hate to see a "cat fight" ensue onboard between PG and passengers who were told......

Yep. Confirmed. I just booked and was told that you'll be getting vouchers to use at the rest. It's just that the vouchers will cost more if you purchase it after Oct 1 (or that you show up at PG without the voucher).

[7x5090g]

I am surprised that they are changing the price to $30 pp after Oct 1st...
...........
How can they just "surprise" me and tell me now that they want to charge $30pp.. can they do this??

I was on the maiden voyage on Voyager of the Sea in 1999. The specialty restaurant cover charge was $5 pp. Just ask how much they want now.

[7x5090g]

We have four future cruises booked......through to November, 2007.

I wonder if Ships Services would accept a booking for Pinnacle Dinners from us for all those cruises? If so, I should be on the phone instead of here on the Internet. ;)



If you already have the booking numbers I don't see why not. Call them.

[kryos]

Hummmm, let’s see if my brain is working correctly this morning….
$30 for wife + $30 for myself + $20 tip = $80 for dinner at Pinnacle, or…… Dinner at Main Dinning room with new friends at no additional cost….
OK, think I got it figured out..
The only way I will pay $30 to eat in the Pinnacle is if it is made very clear that the $30 amount INCLUDES the tip. Otherwise, I won't be making multiple Pinnacle Grill bookings any longer either. On my upcoming cruise next month, a 13-dayer, I will get one complimentary Pinnacle Grill "experience" through my TA. Guess that's the only time I will be eating there on that cruise.

I don't spend $30 per person for most dinners out at home. Of course, I rarely go anywhere really fancy ... usually family-type restaurants; Denny's, Red Lobster, family-style diner type places, maybe Applebee's. So, I'm not about to spend $30 per person for dinner on a cruise ... especially when the food in the dining room is pretty good too.

I think HAL is shooting themselves in the foot with this one ... unless their bookings are well exceeding capacity at the present time and they are looking to thin them out?

Blue skies ...

--rita

[esther e]

Oceania, our favorite cruise line, charges ZIP, NADA, ZILCH, NIL for their two outstanding alternate dining venues - the Polo Grill (Prime steaks, lobster, veal, etc) and Toscana - an incredible Italian venue that features quality as opposed to quantity (not like Sabatini's on Princess, which features just the opposite).

We'll be experiencing our first HAL cruise in December, and unless the main dining venues are awful, we'll certainly pass on the Pinnacle!

Mike


Ah, Mike, as you well know by now you will never experience the same wonderful food on any other ship than O. Of course, we sail on others, but know darn well the food will be good, but not fantastic. ;)

Esther

[crystal808]

The only way I will pay $30 to eat in the Pinnacle is if it is made very clear that the $30 amount INCLUDES the tip.

I'm guessing this is merely a price increase, and nothing will be suggested about tipping, as nothing is stated now....

I don't spend $30 per person for most dinners out at home. Of course, I rarely go anywhere really fancy ...

I don't either, which is one reason I like to have the option to do so while I'm on vacation! :D

Paul :)

[BruceMuzz]

Those of you who will reduce or cancel your patronage of the Pinnacle Grill with the new pricing have proved that the system works.

The "Fee" you pay to get in to the Pinnacle Grill - or any of the extra charge restaurants on any cruise ship - is not a gratuity or a service fee. It is a crowd control measure, plain and simple.

All the Cruise Lines use the same method. They establish a cover charge to keep the Cheap Charlies and Tire Kickers out. They leave the cover charge alone so long as the resataurant is busy - but not too busy. As soon as demand outstrips supply, they raise the cover charge to discourage a few more percentage points. If the restaurant then has manageable numbers, the cover charge remains untouched until the next time the numbers get too high.
Eventually, too many people decide that the cover charge is well worth it. Again the restaurant gets too busy and the cover charge must be raised again.
A few cruise lines have even lowered or eliminated cover charges entirely when certain specialty restaurants were too slow. Although I doubt that HAL will ever have to worry about that at Pinnacle.

On the positive side they have not raised the cover charge for Lunch at Pinnacle. It remains at $10 - one of the greatest bargains on a HAL ship. Why didn't they raise it for lunch? Lunch at Pinnacle is not busy enough to warrant an increase - at least not yet.

[BruceMuzz]

If Carnival - the Wal-Mart of Cruise Lines - charges $30 cover charge to dine at their specialty restaurant, how could anyone expect HAL to charge less?

[ger_77]

I just made our reservations for the Pinnacle and the agent I spoke with said "Wow, there have been a lot of reservations made today - everyone must really like the Pinnacle!" I guess so . . . . . . .;)

Cost is $40 and we will have the voucher for the reservation in our cabin when we board. Sounds good to me! Thank you to the OP (fb0075) for letting us know about the increase, and to everyone else on this thread for your help (phone #, etc).

Smooth Sailing! :) :) :)

[kryos]

Oceania, our favorite cruise line, charges ZIP, NADA, ZILCH, NIL for their two outstanding alternate dining venues - the Polo Grill (Prime steaks, lobster, veal, etc) and Toscana - an incredible Italian venue that features quality as opposed to quantity (not like Sabatini's on Princess, which features just the opposite).

I don't believe you can fairly compare HAL and Oceania, though. Isn't Oceania one of the premium lines? If so, it is pretty much all-inclusive. Yes, there are no separate charges for the specialty restaurants, but the base cruise fare is much higher on that line than on HAL. I don't think there are any specialty restaurant charges on lines like Regeant or Crystal either ... and there shouldn't be, considering what you are paying for the cruise itself. But I think on the mass market type lines, of which HAL is one, you will always find extra charges for the specialty restaurants. The question arises, though, just how much it is worth it to you to eat in one of them. To me, $20 was acceptable. $30 is a bit much ... especially if that $30 does not include gratuities. Now, I am being asked to pay around $40 for a meal onboard ship ... albet a good meal ... when I could eat in other venues for free. Since my lifestyle is such that I ordinarily don't spend a lot on dining out, my personal evaluation is that $30 is just not worth it to me ... at least not worth it for multiple visits to the Pinnacle as I enjoyed on my 30-day cruise this past January. If the charge had been $30 then, I probably would have eaten at most twice there ... whereas at $20, I found it worth it to eat there on four separate occasions (one of which was compliments of my TA).

Blue skies ...

--rita

[ger_77]

Darn stupid dreaded WHITE SCREEN ! ! ! !

Double post, sorry.

[airlink diva]

People who sail other cruise lines and dine in their alternative restaurants......... What are the charges for them? Any of them $30 per person.


Nick & Nora's on the Miracle was $30. But I still consider it a good price due to the food and service. You try going to a land based resturant and ordering the same menu.

[kryos]

Those of you who will reduce or cancel your patronage of the Pinnacle Grill with the new pricing have proved that the system works.

I have to say that I pretty much agree with you. Just like the price of cabins ... the cost for any given cruise will eventually be whatever the market will bear. If it's a popular cruise, forget any kind of a discount or price reduction. Why should HAL provide one? They can easily sail that ship full at the going price. But let the voyage be selling slowly and you will find all kinds of flash specials and price breaks. I guess the Pinnacle works the same way. They have no trouble filling that restaurant every night, so why not make some additional money on the ammenity? And, maybe that kind of thinking is smart. Surely there are lots of folks who will have no problem paying the additional $10. But lots of others, too, will simply say it's not worth it. If the bottom line is that there are still enough people willing to pay that the restaurant stays full every night, then the price will remain $30 ... until demand exceeds supply once more ... and then it will be raised again.

The Pinnacle is a first class dining venue and personally I don't think this $10 increase is gonna impact bookings that much. It's just that I've eaten there many times and won't feel it that much of a loss if I can only dine there once during a cruise in the future ... hopefully as a paid guest of my TA. :)

Blue skies ...

--rita

[AirGorilla]

You need to ask him to fetch it. But he'll keep one for you if you want. For best service do this:

Each night when you're signing the beverage check for your wine, ask the wine steward for tomorrow night's menu & the wine list. Look over the menu and decide what you'll have (or, perhaps, skip the DR entirely!) then choose your wine and tell the wine steward. It'll be waiting at your table when you come in the next night.

And be sure to tip him a bit extra at the end of the cruise! :)

Thanks very much, Dave. That sounds like a great idea, and I appreciate your help!! I will do this on my next HAL cruise.

[esther e]

I don't believe you can fairly compare HAL and Oceania, though. Isn't Oceania one of the premium lines? If so, it is pretty much all-inclusive. Yes, there are no separate charges for the specialty restaurants, but the base cruise fare is much higher on that line than on HAL. I don't think there are any specialty restaurant charges on lines like Regeant or Crystal either ... and there shouldn't be, considering what you are paying for the cruise itself. But I think on the mass market type lines, of which HAL is one, you will always find extra charges for the specialty restaurants. The question arises, though, just how much it is worth it to you to eat in one of them. To me, $20 was acceptable. $30 is a bit much ... especially if that $30 does not include gratuities. Now, I am being asked to pay around $40 for a meal onboard ship ... albet a good meal ... when I could eat in other venues for free. Since my lifestyle is such that I ordinarily don't spend a lot on dining out, my personal evaluation is that $30 is just not worth it to me ... at least not worth it for multiple visits to the Pinnacle as I enjoyed on my 30-day cruise this past January. If the charge had been $30 then, I probably would have eaten at most twice there ... whereas at $20, I found it worth it to eat there on four separate occasions (one of which was compliments of my TA).

Blue skies ...

--rita


No, Rita, O is not all-inclusive. There are gratuities, charges for bottled water and soda, and excessive internet charges. It's a great cruise line, but not in the same league (yet) with Regent, in my opinion. It does have, with no question, the best food on the seas and the most beautiful interiors of any ship. Very upscale and English manor house type of furnishings. My gosh, there are fireplaces in several lounges and rooms!!!!

[sail7seas]

I'm guessing this is merely a price increase, and nothing will be suggested about tipping, as nothing is stated now....



I don't either, which is one reason I like to have the option to do so while I'm on vacation! :D

Paul :)

I so like the way you think, Paul.

Hope we get to meet aboard a 'dam' ship someday.

[hammybee]

My gosh, there are fireplaces in several lounges and rooms!!!!

Fireplaces ! Are they decorative?

[HeatherInFlorida]

................They establish a cover charge to keep the Cheap Charlies and Tire Kickers out. ..................

Such a lovely sentiment:o .

We won't pay $60 to dine in the Pinnacle. It's just not that important to us.

On the other hand, I neither think of us a "cheap Charlies" or "Tire Kickers". We just have better ways to spend our money and have the utmost confidence that HAL will feed us perfectly well in the dining room.

[esther e]

Good question. I'm not sure because on both our O cruises we were in the Caribbean and Amazon, and little use for a fire there!!!!:eek: I honestly don't know. Maybe Mike knows. Mike???? Mike?????

Esther

[sail7seas]

If Carnival - the Wal-Mart of Cruise Lines - charges $30 cover charge to dine at their specialty restaurant, how could anyone expect HAL to charge less?


That is why I asked the question. ;)

[Brad1185]

$20 or $30 at least it includes the tip.

[Aussie Gal]

We also won't be dining in the Pinnicle. We always enjoy the food in the dining room and are not big steak eaters, so a huge steak would be wasted on us.

If we are to pay $80 including a tip which equates to over $105Aud, then I would rather keep the money for a good eating out experience here at home.

To us it is not worth paying out that amount of money when we can eat well on board and it is included in our fare.

Jennie

[newmexicoNita]

I was on the maiden voyage on Voyager of the Sea in 1999. The specialty restaurant cover charge was $5 pp. Just ask how much they want now.Interesting you would mention that: I was telling my neighbor about the charges today and relating a similar story to her. The first time we did alternative dining was on NCL: Le Bistro about 10 years ago. the charge $5.00. Tipping was not expected, however I think we did leave a little something. I can't recall. I know we have for years. Then we saw the price go to $10 which still was easy on the billfold and worth it. Even when the prices jumped from $10 to $15 and $20 we always enjoyed specialty dining. Now, the increase is so out of line with inflation we just will not do it. I am not going to dine without leaving an extra gratuity and I will not spend $60 for a meal plus $10-$20 for a tip. NO WAY. I would be willing to bet it won't take long before either the rate is dropped to $25 or there are several night with 1/2 price offers. You know NCL is still at $20 or $25 for a whole Lobster; some of their specialty restaurants are as little as $12.50 to $15.00. Even for those of you who are not NCL fans, it would be hard to find a place to eat, especially on a ship with better food or service: These prices we live with and indulge 2 or 3 times per cruise. NMnita

[sail7seas]

;) You've haven't been on HAL yet....

Maybe you'll find the food to be better on HAL? :) Maybe not.

[newmexicoNita]

Those of you who will reduce or cancel your patronage of the Pinnacle Grill with the new pricing have proved that the system works.

The "Fee" you pay to get in to the Pinnacle Grill - or any of the extra charge restaurants on any cruise ship - is not a gratuity or a service fee. It is a crowd control measure, plain and simple.

All the Cruise Lines use the same method. They establish a cover charge to keep the Cheap Charlies and Tire Kickers out. They leave the cover charge alone so long as the resataurant is busy - but not too busy. As soon as demand outstrips supply, they raise the cover charge to discourage a few more percentage points. If the restaurant then has manageable numbers, the cover charge remains untouched until the next time the numbers get too high.
Eventually, too many people decide that the cover charge is well worth it. Again the restaurant gets too busy and the cover charge must be raised again.
A few cruise lines have even lowered or eliminated cover charges entirely when certain specialty restaurants were too slow. Although I doubt that HAL will ever have to worry about that at Pinnacle.

On the positive side they have not raised the cover charge for Lunch at Pinnacle. It remains at $10 - one of the greatest bargains on a HAL ship. Why didn't they raise it for lunch? Lunch at Pinnacle is not busy enough to warrant an increase - at least not yet.
Bruce, first you tell us about the cost of other lines even though your facts are not actuate and now you want us to beleive they are so overbooked that this is a way of controlling crowds. You know they normally are controlled by simply saying : sorry, we have nothing available. Number one, there is no correlation between being a Cheap Charlie as you put it and objecting to a raise in price that is out of line. I am wondering, from reading all the boards you post on, where you are getting these ideas? even reading some of the postings here; past passengers mention the Grill is normally not full, so what is the point in raising the prices?Your postings are interesting if nothing else. NMnita

[7x5090g]

$20 or $30 at least it includes the tip.

Tipping is still at the discretion of the pax on top of the cover charge. HAL Ship Services confirmed that the increase in price has nothing to do with including the tip.

[AAAAmerican]

What they have in essence is, a rather high percentage now, Price FixE menu.

So price increases here may not be the best questions...

Lets look at the reasons and the answers that may be coming ... --- ... what a great series of Gratis Press Releases.... Every Home Port's Periodical can have a human interest story of Culinary Commerce on the Seas

Hopefully additions of more quality items as well other preparations will finally be added. :D The Grill is a nice place also with fairly well trained people staffing it.

Breakfast was always nice. Lunch we never have done in there, dinner was yes sometimes empty on many seatings.. so raising the Price that is fixed is a measure in policy which may be from Carnival Corp. Marketing..

With the Culinary Arts Center aboard now are the Guest Chefs creations now going to be on the Grills menu as well other new ones?

Food & Wine sponsors the C A C do they have creations coming now also there ?

I doubt guests aboard the ships will have to bring there own soon either :eek:

[7x5090g]

I know this must have been the hottest topic of the year. In retrospect, just think about what you are getting for paying the $30. When was the last time to go to a decent restaurant anywhere in the US where you can walk out of the restaurant after a 7 course meal having only to pay $30 (let's say even $40 if you want to include the tip).

It's still consider cheap especially you are on vacation. Hey after spending $3000+ on the cruise, what's another $30?

I think it's the principle that is in question. While everyone is expected to pay $20 and all of a sudden the price went up 50% everyone starts to scream. Imagine if I hadn't come across this OP (thanks again fb0075), and I found out about this increase after I got on the ship, will I still pay it? I've never cruised with HAL before so I am almost 99% sure I would pay the $30. However, since I found out about this ahead of time, I took the opportunity to pre-book so I save some dough (fb0075 - can you imagine if everyone that pre-book will give you 5% of what they save, you'd be rich). There are 7 of us going so it's $70 I could have used elsewhere.

After all, it's a vacation. It'd be so funny if HAL did this on purpose to see how well informed their guests are. With the technologies (www chat room,etc) News travel fast. The Ship Services agents must be thinking what'd happen today as reservation keeps coming in since 9 this morning.:D

[AAAAmerican]

A good example of a quandry.. my DW was at the local A&P which has a Buy One Get One FREE so called sale.. even though usually there prices are marked up over 33% higher than most other supermarkets here... we have one of the most competitive areas in the world here, even some Bank Lobbies and Drive up are open on Sunday.

She then asked the woman what was the price of an item... the woman curtly replied.. Dont you know its buy one get one free.. my DW answered well what is the price then..the impatient woman said ...I dont know... ...

Sometimes what is seen is not of value but a mere perception.:eek:

[hunzabunz]

AAAAmerican,

I like that!!!!!!

[Lvteks]

There will be a long pause before I consider the increase to be worth it. Some of the steaks are quite large. Combines with the other menu items, it is a very large meal. I do myself no good to "eat it because it's there and I paid extra for it." While the PG fiasco on our last Volendam cruise had already induced hesitation, the increase nailed the decision. I'll opt for an excursion and fuel the soul.

Blessings,

Gail

[kryos]

When was the last time to go to a decent restaurant anywhere in the US where you can walk out of the restaurant after a 7 course meal having only to pay $30 (let's say even $40 if you want to include the tip).

True ... but at least on land if I pay $40 for a meal, I am usually actually getting two meals, because I leave the restaurant with a doggy bag containing tomorrow night's dinner. At the Pinnacle, however, I cannot do that. So, that $40 is actually pretty darned expensive ... at least for me. I just cannot possibly eat all that food in one sitting. I can barely finish the petite fillet, let alone some of those larger portioned menu items.

So, for that reason, while I MAY be willing to pay $40 for a meal shoreside, depending upon the occasion ... I would NOT be willing to pay that ... at least not more than once a cruise now ... on a HAL ship.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[jagmanss1]

Tipping is still at the discretion of the pax on top of the cover charge. HAL Ship Services confirmed that the increase in price has nothing to do with including the tip.

Sorry, I disagree... HAL By uping the charge has now made it A tip IMHO... Those who say it is not the wait staff fault, Tuff luck for them sorry... they are getting part of it now from me if I choose to go that is.....

[happy cruzer]

I know this must have been the hottest topic of the year. In retrospect, just think about what you are getting for paying the $30. When was the last time to go to a decent restaurant anywhere in the US where you can walk out of the restaurant after a 7 course meal having only to pay $30 (let's say even $40 if you want to include the tip).

Some of us can't really enjoy 7 courses and really want only 3/4, many fine restaurents in my area offer mid week multi course specials with wine for $35/40.
It's still consider cheap especially you are on vacation. Hey after spending $3000+ on the cruise, what's another $30?

I have never paid $3000 for a cruise. and I always look at each expenditure independently.
I think it's the principle that is in question. While everyone is expected to pay $20 and all of a sudden the price went up 50% everyone starts to scream.

I own a business and would be through if I raised my prices 50%. I had to do a price increase this year and was able to do 6% in a competitive market.

Imagine if I hadn't come across this OP (thanks again fb0075), and I found out about this increase after I got on the ship, will I still pay it? I've never cruised with HAL before so I am almost 99% sure I would pay the $30.

That's what HAL is counting on.

However, since I found out about this ahead of time, I took the opportunity to pre-book so I save some dough (fb0075 - can you imagine if everyone that pre-book will give you 5% of what they save, you'd be rich). There are 7 of us going so it's $70 I could have used elsewhere.

Very good and if you have a good experience you'll maybe pay the $30 next time.

After all, it's a vacation. It'd be so funny if HAL did this on purpose to see how well informed their guests are. With the technologies (www chat room,etc) News travel fast. The Ship Services agents must be thinking what'd happen today as reservation keeps coming in since 9 this morning.:D


HAL and every other business always has to decide what is their business model. But first they have to make sure they show a profit. Too much profit and out of line with the competition is a bad thing. As I posted earlier, I think the PG experience is worth $30. But not to me. And at $30 for someone from my area of the US, it's not a big value. Remember if you do a pure cost analysis the PG does not have alot of overhead that a landbased restaurent has. Overhead considerations like rent, advertising, labor cost, material costs, parking, insurance, taxes, etc are totally different. They have run a small risk of alienating a few "old" clients but time should heal that. As you say, the new ones will not even notice. It probably will turn out to be a good thing from their point of view.

[BruceMuzz]

nmNita,

Sorry about the errors, I have either worked on, travelled on, or visited many of the mass market ships, but unfortunately I am not a Mass market kind of guy. They all seem the same to me. I just cannot justify buying that type of product. Where do I get this information and ideas? I have been on over 1200 cruises. That's one thousand, two hundred +.

In any case, we have a quandry here. It would seem that HAL is raising their cover charges to try to control crowds in their Pinnacle Restaurant. Yet a few posters here (who are undoubtedly experts in the cruise line restaurant business) claim that HAL's Pinnacle Grills are half empty.

So one must assume that:
1. HAL is lying.
2. HAL doesn't know what they are doing.
3. Some of the posters here don't really know what they are talking about.

There is however a 4th possibility that most everyone here has never considered. The special Galleys that service the Pinnacle Grill on HAL ships were unfortunately not designed to handle a restaurant the size of the Pinnacle Grill. That is, more people can be accommodated at the tables than can be fed in a timely manner. So one will very rarely see a Pinnacle Grill fully occupied, although they are operating at full capacity. Disappointed diners who cannot get in find it bizarre that there are empty tables when they were told that the restaurant is fully booked. They naturally assume that the Restaurant Manager is insane or stupid, rather than thinking that there might be other more rational circumstances that prevent them from dining there.

A 5th possibility. It seems to be the fashion in America to book several different restaurants for the same time, and then choose just one at the very last minute. Unfortunately, many people who do that are not considerate enough to inform the restaurants they have decided not to go to that they are not coming. The restaurant holds their table, even though others are waiting and hoping to get in. By the time the restaurant manager realizes that the inconsiderate diners are not coming, it is too late to give the unused table to someone else, because that same table is promised to later diners who will be arriving soon. There is no longer ample time to serve an earlier seating, so the table remains unused and hopeful diners are disappointed. The disappointed diners walk away thinking that the restaurant manager is either crazy or a complete idiot because he turns them away when he has empty tables - rather than assuming that perhaps a more positive reason prevents them from dining there.

[jjb415]

don't have much more to say other than this

why take out whatever you're feeling on the stewards?

I've read several posts which in effect say if the price goes up, we're not tippping:mad:

can't help but wonder if those people ever tipped at all:rolleyes:

just don't get it

the waiters didn't take a vote to "up the price"

sorry, but it's just not right:(

go, don't go

am quite sure Pinnacle will survive this crisis:)

In agreement here Sea King. You expressed my feelings very well. Thanks.

Thanks also to those who did the footwork in contacting Ship Services to find out about payment in advance for trips after October 1, 2006. Your efforts in research and posting the results are appreciated!

[Sea King]

[quote=BruceMuzz]nmNita,
A 5th possibility. It seems to be the fashion in America to book several different restaurants for the same time, and then choose just one at the very last minute.

Where's this headed to?

Really curious about the quote from Bruce

what does being American have to do with anything on this thread?:confused:

the last HAL cruise I was on had a significant number of Canadiens, British and Dutch

even saw some at Pinnacle:eek:

sorry, can't accept what's contained in the quote :(

everyone is entitled to his/her opinion BUT isn't this stretching a point?

I suggest ignorance, bad taste and insulting manners aren't limited by geography

[Krazy Kruizers]

AHHHHH---- but you can take doggy bags from the Pinnacle.

I reported this when we got back from one of our cruises - don't remember which one.

We actually watched a woman take a bag (foil wrapped) of food from the Pinnacle. In the main dining room her table was not too far from ours. The next night she came into the dining room and asked her waiter to reheat her leftovers!!!!!

[kryos]

There will be a long pause before I consider the increase to be worth it. Some of the steaks are quite large. Combines with the other menu items, it is a very large meal. I do myself no good to "eat it because it's there and I paid extra for it." While the PG fiasco on our last Volendam cruise had already induced hesitation, the increase nailed the decision. I'll opt for an excursion and fuel the soul.

I like how you put that! Yeah, feeding the soul ... much better use of the dollars ... especially when you consider that even in the dining room you can enjoy all the food you want. Sure, the steaks are smaller, but you can order three if need be and leave the table just as full as you would at the Pinnacle.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[SF49erfan]

We ate at the PG for the first time on our last cruise. IMHO, while the food was very good and there was a lot of it, The steak that my DH had was HUGE. My lamb chops were delicious, but so were the lamb chops in the dinning room. The only difference was that in the DR they gave you 3 chops and in the PG there were 4. It was good but,I would not be anxious to go back. I like the dinning room better. And we get the company of our tablemates:) .

[crystal808]

I so like the way you think, Paul.

Hope we get to meet aboard a 'dam' ship someday.

Thank you, Sail...and it would be my pleasure! :)

Paul

[Frandick]

Crystal doesn't charge anything extra for their 2 speciality restaurants. All that is asked is that you leave $6 per person for a gratuity.
Cryatal also doesn't charge for ice tea, soda, bottled water, coffee or ice cream throughout the day.

[fb0075]

Good Morning,

Since we have started to dwell more on the tip side--
Remember,per HAL, "There is no tip required or expected" in the Pinnacle--also, the wait staff shares in the tip pool just like the DR staff---so your tip is also pooled ---
If you feel better about leaving a tip--sobeit--
If not
FRANK

[BruceMuzz]

Sea King,

My comments about no-shows in cruise ship restaurants have everything to do with being American. No slur intended, so please don't take offense; the vast majority (over 90% according to ICCL, CLIA, and many market researchers) of people who take a 7-day Mass Market Cruise are Americans.
Almost everything we do on a cruise ship is tailored to the rather unique tastes, wants, needs, desires, dislikes, and quirks of Americans.

The same problem we encounter in my family's restaurants in San Francisco (people making reservations and not honoring them), where the clientele is also almost exclusively American, hardly surprise me when we see them on ships where the clientele is predominantly American.

Restaurants in Europe and Asia also encounter this issue, but it is relatively rare. It would appear that it is an essentially American behaviour.

[jhannah]

Where do I get this information and ideas? I have been on over 1200 cruises. That's one thousand, two hundred +. Wow! Please share how you have amassed this many cruises. That would be 20 cruises per year for 60 years.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Wow! Please share how you have amassed this many cruises. That would be 20 cruises per year for 60 years.

Working on the ships, Jim. How else could he form such a low opinion of so many of us?:o

NMNita, so very well said.

[GarySuzy]

First I have not dined in the Pinnacle, but will be in Nov. as it was part of a HAL promotion - book by a certain date and get two dinners in PG and 2 bottles of wine. (This promotion is still going on for some cruises)

My question is could it possibly be that they realized that they had overbooked the PG with such a promotion and now have to figure away to decrease the number of people dining there?

Just a thought.

[jhannah]

Working on the ships, Jim. How else could he form such a low opinion of so many of us?:o That would take a 23-year career of one-week cruises. Still doesn't compute to me. Maybe I'm just slow.

[sail7seas]

Crystal doesn't charge anything extra for their 2 speciality restaurants. All that is asked is that you leave $6 per person for a gratuity.
Cryatal also doesn't charge for ice tea, soda, bottled water, coffee or ice cream throughout the day.

Crystal isn't giving anything that HAL is not. Pay up front or pay as you go, but we are paying for it whichever cruise line we are traveling with.

The price of a Crystal cruise includes such things as soda and specialty restaurants but you certainly pay a higher fare.

By the Way......... iced tea, coffee and ice cream throughout the day are no extra charge on HAL. ;) And their ice cream is Wonderful. A selection of flavors and they change the choices daily.

[HeatherInFlorida]

..........................
There is however a 4th possibility that most everyone here has never considered. The special Galleys that service the Pinnacle Grill on HAL ships were unfortunately not designed to handle a restaurant the size of the Pinnacle Grill. That is, more people can be accommodated at the tables than can be fed in a timely manner. So one will very rarely see a Pinnacle Grill fully occupied, although they are operating at full capacity. Disappointed diners who cannot get in find it bizarre that there are empty tables when they were told that the restaurant is fully booked. They naturally assume that the Restaurant Manager is insane or stupid, rather than thinking that there might be other more rational circumstances that prevent them from dining there.



I had hoped I would leave my comments to my last post, but this just begs a response. I cannot even conceive such a possibility if we are to believe that HAL has any sense whatsoever (which I believe they do). Why on earth would they make a DR large enough to seat more people than its kitchen can feed? And if they did, why not leave out the extra tables. There is no worse look in a restaurant than several empty tables.


A 5th possibility. It seems to be the fashion in America to book several different restaurants for the same time, and then choose just one at the very last minute. Unfortunately, many people who do that are not considerate enough to inform the restaurants they have decided not to go to that they are not coming. The restaurant holds their table, even though others are waiting and hoping to get in. By the time the restaurant manager realizes that the inconsiderate diners are not coming, it is too late to give the unused table to someone else, because that same table is promised to later diners who will be arriving soon. There is no longer ample time to serve an earlier seating, so the table remains unused and hopeful diners are disappointed. The disappointed diners walk away thinking that the restaurant manager is either crazy or a complete idiot because he turns them away when he has empty tables - rather than assuming that perhaps a more positive reason prevents them from dining there


Perhaps you have not kept up with recent advancements in the restaurant industry in the U.S. While this was the case at one time, the restaurants woke up one day and smelled the coffee. They now always get your phone number at the very least and your credit card to lock in the reservation. If you don't show, you pay the piper.

Even worse, fewer and fewer restaurants even take reservations for this very reason and so we have to walk around with flashing, pulsating beepers.

[Hojo's redbeard]

The same problem we encounter in my family's restaurants in San Francisco

Bruce, I was wondering how you could afford to go on 1200+ cruises. Sounds like you would be in a perfect position to reflect on the food cost aspect of the PG versus the dining room.

Sounds like some people are mistaking quantity and quality. Cost of steak is kind of like the cost of champagne. A lower grade, more common steak compared to a USDA Prime is kind of like comparing Moet with Cristal. The extra quality costs not just a little more, but, several times as much for the same amount.

Someone else earlier mentioned operating margins. Absolutely, every decision made by the cruise lines involves the bottom line and keeping Wall Street happy! The decision to start adding charges to the formerly all-inclusiveness of cruising is a marketing decision. People wouldn't be as inclined to cruise in ever increasing record numbers if the prices were adjusted to keep them all inclusive. Look at the cost comparison between HAL and an All-inclusive cruise, BIG difference.

[Hojo's redbeard]

What a thread! Type in a response and have ten pop up while you're typing!

[newmexicoNita]

AHHHHH---- but you can take doggy bags from the Pinnacle.

I reported this when we got back from one of our cruises - don't remember which one.

We actually watched a woman take a bag (foil wrapped) of food from the Pinnacle. In the main dining room her table was not too far from ours. The next night she came into the dining room and asked her waiter to reheat her leftovers!!!!!
Too funny, did she then order a meal or just eat her left overs: I certainly hope she had a way to keep the food fresh for 24 hours. I thought my step mom did some strange things when it came to left overs, this takes the cake. thanks for sharing,

NMNita

[Schplinky]

This is a huge thread so I apologise if i am repeating anything.

Celebrity's specialty is a three course for $30 but the table can agree on a 5 course if everyone does it. It's the same price; the portions are smaller.

We made a reservation for Pinnacle for January about a month ago and were required to pre-pay. We paid $20 each and would consider it poor customer service if they made us pay more once we boarded.

[BruceMuzz]

Heather,

I appreciate your input, but it does demonstrate how naive the cruising and dining public can be.

It does seem bizarre and quite unvelievable that HAL would build a ship with a restaurant that is too large for the galley that services it. Would you agree that it is equally bizarre to build a cruise ship with no public toilets or public telephones? It happened. When the Zuiderdam was delivered to HAL, they quickly discovered that they had forgotten a few things..........

When the first 4 Renaissance Cruise ships were delivered in the early 90's, they quickly discovered that if you pulled the chairs out from the dining tables to allow the Guests to sit down, nobody - including the waiters - could pass between any of the dining room tables.

Did you ever notice that the location of the ceiling lights in ship's dining rooms do not match up with the table locations? Two different companies are responsible for these projects. They install them at different times and never speak to each other. Nearly every cruise ship in the world has this problem.

On HAL Vista Ships, the crew elevators are so small that only 2 crewmembers can fit into one. Not a single trolley, table, handtruck, room service table, or service equipment of any kind willl fit into these elevators. So the staff is forced to comandeer the passenger elevators and inconvenience the passengers instead. Do you think they planned that? On 4 consecutive ships???
Ship happens.

And while I appreciate your views on charging credit cards for missed reservations, it is one of those great ideas that rarely works. In fact it usually works against the restaurant. Not only does the charging upset inconsiderate diners who do not show (They will never patronize your establishment again and urge all their friends to do the same), they then dispute the charge with their credit card companies. Then the Restaurant either loses the dispute and refunds the money, or they have to hire a lawyer to handle it in court. Would you pay a lawyer several hunderd dollars to recover a $25 charge for a no-show reservation? How about 200 times a week? In quite a few states, this no-show charge is even illegal. Yes, the restaurants did wake up and smell the coffee, but not in the way you think.
It gets even worse on a ship. A few cruise lines tried charging a no-show penalty to inconsiderate cruisers in their restaurants. Not only did many cruisers dispute the no-show charge, they disputed their charges for the entire cruise!! It took the cruise lines many months and many lawyer fees to get it straightened out. One particular Cruise Line Vice President lost his job for coming up with such an idiotic and costly idea.

[Sea King]

Thanks Bruce: never realized not showing up at a restaurant was most an American trait:)

then again, I haven't been on 12 cruises

tend to agree with Heather and Jim; the math doesn't compute

even assuming Bruce has cruised for 40 years, that would mean 30 cruises a year:confused: sorry, don't think very man HAL employees on a full contract complete 30 cruises a year:rolleyes:

in any event, yell, scream, kick your heels, boycott, jump up and down, cash in your tickets, move to Crystal, skip jackpot snowball Bingo, the fact is what's done is done:eek:

HAL isn't about to change what it apparently has already approved

right Bruce;)

[Sea King]

I should edit

meant to say I haven't been on 1,200 cruises :o

sorry:)

[esther e]

I should edit

meant to say I haven't been on 1,200 cruises :o

sorry:)


Well, if I were you, I'd start booking....FAST.....:D :D Maybe 120, with an extra 0 accidentally added?

Esther

[cruisin240]

This is sooo funny. I really have to smirk at the Mr. Know-it-all...HE is the type of person that I would opt to go to the Pinnacle and spend the extra money instead of dining with him.

[BruceMuzz]

Sea King,

You need to think outside the box a bit more and re-work your numbers.
I work 40 weeks a year for a cruise line company that offers 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 7 day cruises.

[BruceMuzz]

cruisin240,
You shouldn't suggest things like that. If people follow your advice, the Pinnacle will get too crowded again and they will raise the cover charge even higher to get it back under control.

[PRINSENDAM]

This news is really going to make me appreciate our upcoming Crystal cruise where the alternative restaurant is still free.


I have not sailed Crystal since 2000. The alternative restaurant certainly wasn't free then...... it was $6 per person!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:eek:

But you are right. The charge was strictly for the tip.

Stephen

[sail7seas]

Sea King,

You need to think outside the box a bit more and re-work your numbers.
I work 40 weeks a year for a cruise line company that offers 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 7 day cruises.

MR. Muzz....... If credibility matters, let's be frank here.

In your contracts with your current employer (the above quote uses present tense), are you really telling us you work more than a scant, tiny number of 1, 2, 3, 4, or 5 day cruises? And 40 Weeks a year????

Many of us on this board know that isn't exactly accurate.

[Sea King]

Sea King,

You need to think outside the box a bit more and re-work your numbers.
I work 40 weeks a year for a cruise line company that offers 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 7 day cruises.

ok Bruce: you opened the door:)

which company is it?

does its ships have blue hulls?:D

suspect if you know how many people fit into an elevator, you aren't part of the "tender crew";)

want to tell us all?:cool:

your comments are too factual to be from anyone other than "crew" or maybe even the Big Office:eek:

[HeatherInFlorida]

http://cdn-cf.aol.com/se/smi/0201e05b9a/15 Did I dream it?http://cdn-cf.aol.com/se/smi/0201e05b9a/01 ... Is this "Dallas"???

Back on topic. Life, like cruising, can all be so very interesting. But no matter what I'm still not paying $30 pp for dinner in the Pinnacle even if they knock it down to only 4 tables so the kitchen can accommodate ushttp://cdn-cf.aol.com/se/smi/0201e05b9a/08.

[amusea]

I know this must have been the hottest topic of the year. In retrospect, just think about what you are getting for paying the $30. When was the last time to go to a decent restaurant anywhere in the US where you can walk out of the restaurant after a 7 course meal having only to pay $30 (let's say even $40 if you want to include the tip).

It's still consider cheap especially you are on vacation. Hey after spending $3000+ on the cruise, what's another $30?

I think it's the principle that is in question. While everyone is expected to pay $20 and all of a sudden the price went up 50% everyone starts to scream. Imagine if I hadn't come across this OP (thanks again fb0075), and I found out about this increase after I got on the ship, will I still pay it? I've never cruised with HAL before so I am almost 99% sure I would pay the $30. However, since I found out about this ahead of time, I took the opportunity to pre-book so I save some dough (fb0075 - can you imagine if everyone that pre-book will give you 5% of what they save, you'd be rich). There are 7 of us going so it's $70 I could have used elsewhere.

After all, it's a vacation. It'd be so funny if HAL did this on purpose to see how well informed their guests are. With the technologies (www chat room,etc) News travel fast. The Ship Services agents must be thinking what'd happen today as reservation keeps coming in since 9 this morning.:D

When you compare the cost of fine dining off the ship with the Pinnacle please remember that the total cost of the PG at the new price is not $30.00 plus tip. In the every day cost of the cruise a good portion of the money you are paying is for food. Therefore, if you are going to do comparisons on and off ship you should add the money you are paying to HAL for food every day. In that context the Pinnacle Grill is not as big a bargain.
My first experience in the optional restaurant was on the Zaandam about six or seven years ago. I am not sure but I think the cost was either minimal or it was free. Can someone help me here??
In any case, that meal was by far the best I have had on an HAL ship. The more recent meals in the Pinnacle and and service do not compare. So the increase in cost leaves one wondering if the food and service will be elevated to former levels with the increase in cost.

[Brad1185]

The Celebrity 5 course meal is $59 pp but does include wine

[zaandam_2]

i didn't read all 9 pages of this so forgive me if its been stated previously.

carnival charges $30 pp for their specialty restaurants also.

[Copper10-8]

Hey guys; just a hot tip and in his defense: Mr. Muzz does work in the cruise line industry for a cruise line and prior to his present employer, worked for two other lines. Please give him the credit he is due as far as his expertese!

As far this this very hot topic; it all still comes down to personal choice. We all have the choice to visit the PG or not. S7S is right on again (and this is really getting old;) ). When HAL changed from the Marco Polo (really liked that Italian menu there) to the Pinnacle, a lot of us (yours truly included) said we would never dine at the place, not for $20pp. But guess what, we did and, speaking for ourselves, we liked it. If you think $30pp is over the top, you still have that choice; don't patronize the PG. All I can say is that if HAL is adding to the menu in the PG and is giving us more choices, we will more than likely pay them a visit to try them out. If it turns out to be a disappointing visit, then it could very well be our last one! Peace out!:)

[Schplinky]

The Celebrity 5 course meal is $59 pp but does include wine

The five course is the same as the three ($30) but wine is an add-on. One person in our party who does not drink was served the five course for $30. Tis was true on Constellation in January, at least. Those of us who had 5 courses and wine paid $59. Our friend had five courses with no wine and paid $30.

[Bramcruiser]

Well said Copper 10-8. I can't believe this topic got so heated as whether someone pays anything for specialty dining is really a personal choice. Some don't want to pay the extra and some always will. I've done the Pinnacle at $20pp and loved the experience but I do know it has had a spotty record from many of the reviews I read. Still, I believe the upgrade to $30 is in line with what the other lines are doing with their specialty restaurants so the move is purely an economical one. We all have the main dining room so if one doesn't want to pay extra they have the choice to continue to eat all the fine food offered in the main room. The food in HAL's dining room is still well worth not going to the specialty restaurant. And yes, I likely, would pay $30pp! Again my choice.

David

[Margarita Jane]

Sorry - but I am confused. Does the $30 include the tip or not?

Per Frank, fb0075, "Remember,per HAL, "There is no tip required or expected" in the Pinnacle--also, the wait staff shares in the tip pool just like the DR staff---so your tip is also pooled ---"

This sounds to me like the tip is included in the fee?

[LAFFNVEGAS]

Thank you John:)

[jhannah]

Sorry - but I am confused. Does the $30 include the tip or not? To my knowledge the ONLY time a tip is included is when you order a drink from a bar. A 15% gratuity is added.

[fb0075]

Hi Jim,
If you will check with HAL--it is like I stated--no tip required or expected!!
FRANK

[newmexicoNita]

Sorry - but I am confused. Does the $30 include the tip or not?

Per Frank, fb0075, "Remember,per HAL, "There is no tip required or expected" in the Pinnacle--also, the wait staff shares in the tip pool just like the DR staff---so your tip is also pooled ---"

This sounds to me like the tip is included in the fee?
My feelings on this: just like most other lines, the basic $10 per day is pooled, if you put an extra $5, $10 or so in cash in the little folder when you give it back to your wait person in a specialty restaurant it is not pooled. Is it supposed to be? Maybe, but I am sure the wait people keep it and they should. The $30 does not include the tip and do you or are you expected to add to the check in form of a tip? I don't know the answer for certain, but we always do. Is it expected? Probably, is it required? Of course not. NMnita

[lawyerrose]

I never liked the idea of having restaurants on a cruise where you had to pay extra in the first place, although I've visited them on my Carnival and Costa cruises. I remember when the fine food included in the price of your cruise ticket was one of the major things one looked forward to when cruising, and a big part of which cruise line one chose. The fact that a cruise was fairly "all inclusive" was a major selling point "back in the days." Now it's extra charges for this, extra for that. Used to be the only "extras" were gambling and shore excursions (and tipping). Even the drinks used to be cheap. Well, guess that was a long time ago. I hate the way the cruise lines are nickeling and diming people so that your choices are (if you have the bucks) to go with one of the truly luxury cruises or don't bother at all (or keep reaching into your pocket).
Is it really necessary for the cruise lines to start charging for things they used to include in the price of the cruise? Is it just greed? Is their profit margin so small that they have to do this? Is there an end to how far they'll go?
So, no, I won't be visiting the extra charge "specialty" restaurants anymore. Hopefully, the dining room will offer the quality meals one expects of a better-than-average cruise line. They certainly should. Maybe if their specialty restaurants sit empty, the cruise lines will get the message.

Rose

[kryos]

Sorry, I disagree... HAL By uping the charge has now made it A tip IMHO... Those who say it is not the wait staff fault, Tuff luck for them sorry... they are getting part of it now from me if I choose to go that is.....
I think many, many people are gonna have the same take on it as you. Whether it is fair or not, the wait staff in the Pinnacle will be getting far less in tips now. That's why I have no doubt ... the Pinnacle wait staff was always getting some of that $20 per person ... and will get even more now with the increase. If not that, then I guarantee that they get a regular share of the auto-tips that the dining room waitstaff get. Otherwise, think about it ... who in their right mind would be willing to work in the Pinnacle? A lot of people don't tip in there ... they naturally assume the $20 per person charge includes the tip. So, if Pinnacle staff weren't guaranteed anything, then you'd wind up with only the new and inexperienced people working there because all the senior, more experienced staff would demand to be assigned to the dining room, where their tips are reasonably assured.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[serendipity1499]

Hey guys; just a hot tip and in his defense: Mr. Muzz does work in the cruise line industry for a cruise line and prior to his present employer, worked for two other lines. Please give him the credit he is due as far as his expertese!

As far this this very hot topic; it all still comes down to personal choice. We all have the choice to visit the PG or not. S7S is right on again (and this is really getting old;) ). When HAL changed from the Marco Polo (really liked that Italian menu there) to the Pinnacle, a lot of us (yours truly included) said we would never dine at the place, not for $20pp. But guess what, we did and, speaking for ourselves, we liked it. If you think $30pp is over the top, you still have that choice; don't patronize the PG. All I can say is that if HAL is adding to the menu in the PG and is giving us more choices, we will more than likely pay them a visit to try them out. If it turns out to be a disappointing visit, then it could very well be our last
one! Peace out!:)

Wow you all are Fast..While I was looking up & composing you all slipped in there with your posts..

True but because we've had both Good & Poor service & food in the Pinnacle, our personal choice is not to try it more than once on a cruise, if at all..

But I would go back to the Marco Polo any Number of times! And pay whatever they want! My Dutch/German Mother never could make spaghetti like my first Mother-in-law could..I was hooked then & am still hooked on Pasta..The Pasta bar on the Westerdam, just about did me in! Going on my diet now as heading for lunch in the Lido in 9 weeks..:) Betty

[kryos]

Mr Muzz or Mr Gallup (whoever you are) you are absolutely correct..Many of us will not pay $60 plus tip, unless it's a special occasion, as opposed to $40 plus for the Pinnacle, when we can get just as wonderful a Dinner in the Main DR...We're not "Cheap Charlies" or "Tire Kickers"..We watch our $$$, so we can still cruise at 90 & not be a financial burden on our children!

We also like to control what we spend our dollars on. If I can get a pretty decent meal in the dining room at no extra cost, why should I pay a $30 plus tip surcharge in the Pinnacle (per person) especially when I am really not a "foodie?" I'm not saying the Pinnacle isn't a fine meal, but maybe a fine meal is just not worth that price to me. I'd rather take that extra $40 and put it toward something else ... maybe an extra shore excursion I've had my eye on, or maybe something I wanted to buy in the onboard shops.

I don't feel that choosing not to eat in the Pinnacle makes me a "cheap Charlie" or a "tire kicker." The increased service charge just forces me to evaluate how important a meal in the Pinnacle is to me ... as opposed to some other way I could put that money to use.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[kryos]

AHHHHH---- but you can take doggy bags from the Pinnacle.

I reported this when we got back from one of our cruises - don't remember which one.

We actually watched a woman take a bag (foil wrapped) of food from the Pinnacle. In the main dining room her table was not too far from ours. The next night she came into the dining room and asked her waiter to reheat her leftovers!!!!!
That's interesting. When I asked about that in the Pinnacle on my January cruise, I was told you couldn't have the dining room staff reheat leftovers from the Pinnacle. The Lido wouldn't do it either. I specifically asked this question because one of the nights we ate in the Pinnacle was while we were in the Hawaiian Islands. The following night, I was going to be dining alone because my companions were staying on shore for a luau I did not care to go to. I figured it would be neat if I could order the big Porterhouse in the Pinnacle and then have them send the leftover portion over to the dining room for me, to be enjoyed the following night. They said "no go." I then asked about having it wrapped to take to the Lido the following night, figuring maybe they could pop it in the microwave for me there. Again, I was told no. Their reasoning, I believe, was that it wouldn't be "sanitary" to have a piece of meat sitting in my cabin without refrigeration overnight, and the ship's staff didn't want to take the responsibility of sending it to the dining room for me either.

So, I just ordered my normal petite filet and let the thought of a doggy bag go.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[esther e]

I'm ready for everybody to attack me, but what the heck....here goes: How about if there is an extra $100 p/p built into the cruise ticket (nobody would ever know) and everything is all inclusive...tips, water, Cokes, etc.

And this is going back a few years, but I definitely remember the staff in Pinacles was the same that worked for Neptune. Never anyone from the dining room. Has that changed? Sounds like it might have. I just assumed that the staff from Neptune would make more than a dining room waiter.

Esther

[wwinfl91]

I hope that HAL is looking at this thread and will decide that an increased charge is NOT going to work and will result in fewer people booking dinner in the Pinnacle dining room.

Have a great next cruise but don't do the alternative dining on HAL until the price goes back to $20.

[crystal808]

As fond as I am of the Pinnacle, I'd like to offer this summation:

1st: If you wish to dine in the Pinnacle Grill, it is your choice. The Dining Room offers a wonderful menu, and variety of foods from which to choose, with no additional charge to the cruiser.

2nd: If you think that the Pinnacle Staff will be awarded a higher percentage of the $30 (new) fee than they did the older surcharge ($20), then don't tip any additional. In fact, no one suggests that you "must" tip additionally at all. It is pretty widely accepted that the Pinnacle Staff is not given a portion of the $20 surcharge (only a small percentage of the $10/day gratuity), and I've seen nothing to think they will be awarded a portion of the $30 surcharge.

3rd: HAL suggests that no tips are "required" (taking into consideration the $10/day/pp gratuity added to your shipboard account); that certainly doesn't mean to me that an additional gratuity isn't warranted by exemplary service. Can I remove my auto-tip? Certainly. Do I ever expect the service on HAL to warrant doing so? I certainly hope not. At that point, I will seek other cruiselines to fulfill my cruising desires!

I look forward to my upcoming Westerdam cruise, and I also look forward to trying the Pinnacle Grill on my 3rd HAL ship. If the menu and service are less than satisfactory, then I won't repeat my visit. From prior experience, I expect it to be a wonderful evening.

Please come join me in the Pinnacle, or see me in the Dining Room! I'll always be smiling, and enjoying myself, regardless of the venue! :) And, yes, assuming my HAL service will be as exemplary as always, I will continue to give a small appreciation to those who serve me, on top of the auto tip HAL adds to my shipboard account.

Smooth sailing, and calm seas to all....
Paul

[RuthC]

Sorry - but I am confused. Does the $30 include the tip or not?
As far as anyone knows, none of the $30 surcharge will include a tip, as the $20 present surcharge does not.
A portion of the $10/day service charge that is added to your bill does go to the staff of the Pinnacle as a tip.

That's why I have no doubt ... the Pinnacle wait staff was always getting some of that $20 per person ... and will get even more now with the increase.
On what evidence you you base this? I have never seen any evidence presented on this board. Nor have I heard of any such thing on any of my cruises.
Your opinion appears to be based on speculation.

[happy cruzer]

Hi, Something just kicked in my little brain. If you ask if the tip is included in the corkage fee, anyone at HAL will tell you yes and most will tell you that it is $5.00 of the fee.

But folks don't seem to get that responce at the PG, therefore I think they may truely only get part of the tip pool plus their tips from people who leave the auto tip in place.

[KAYEF]

We've tried the Pinnacle many times, different ships.............as far as I'm concerned, the only thing (other than my husband's porterhouse) worth extra money in the P is the triple creme brulee and it's definitely worth extra money...........amazing.
Planked halubut, dry and tough.............even when done over............same with planked "scampi" which I heard about on this chat...................dry, hard and very small............
We'd already decided to not go to the Pinnacle any more; they need a new menu and new quality control.
The last time our waiter forgot several things...........and THAT was the time we were invited back because of poor service and poor food on our first night (noticed by the head waiter).
No more Pinnacle for us.

[elmorejj]

I agree on the seafood items. The first time I had the planked halibut, they must have removed it right out of the freezer, it was still frozen inside! The next time I ordered it, it was way overdone and tough. The shrimp scampi as they call it was dry and almost inedible. When they improve the menu for non meat eating guests, I may try again.........jean:cool:

[Hojo's redbeard]

I never liked the idea of having restaurants on a cruise where you had to pay extra in the first place, although I've visited them on my Carnival and Costa cruises. I remember when the fine food included in the price of your cruise ticket was one of the major things one looked forward to when cruising, and a big part of which cruise line one chose. The fact that a cruise was fairly "all inclusive" was a major selling point "back in the days." Now it's extra charges for this, extra for that. Used to be the only "extras" were gambling and shore excursions (and tipping). Even the drinks used to be cheap. Well, guess that was a long time ago. I hate the way the cruise lines are nickeling and diming people so that your choices are (if you have the bucks) to go with one of the truly luxury cruises or don't bother at all (or keep reaching into your pocket).
Is it really necessary for the cruise lines to start charging for things they used to include in the price of the cruise? Is it just greed? Is their profit margin so small that they have to do this? Is there an end to how far they'll go?
So, no, I won't be visiting the extra charge "specialty" restaurants anymore. Hopefully, the dining room will offer the quality meals one expects of a better-than-average cruise line. They certainly should. Maybe if their specialty restaurants sit empty, the cruise lines will get the message.

Rose

It's all about Marketing and competition. The first things that people look at when they are booking cruises tend to be when it's leaving, where it's going, and PRICE. If HAL for example were to go back to the good old days when pretty much everything was included and drinks were cheap, their cost to get on board would be MUCH higher than their main competition (RCCL, Celebrity, Princess from what I've been reading here). The mass majority of people buying cruises aren't as well informed as the frequenters of this board, so they wouldn't know why HAL was so much more expensive and totally toss them from the equation. It's a lot easier to fill these mega liners and then have you upgrade as you go to the experience that you choose. So to really have a chance of making it in the world of cruising offering the all-inclusive style experience is to be a truly luxury line where people are willing to shell out more than most people could ever afford.

PG, I'll go once. I spend a lot of time working on the best deal to get on the ship with full knowledge that when I'm on it, I generally don't watch what I'm spending. $20 or $30, I'll go once for the experience. The extra charges are one of the reasons I won't go on NCL though. If I wanted to pay for dinner every night, I'd stay on land.

[RevNeal]

How did I miss this thread?
I know I've been busy since Friday, but ... yeesh!

People ... lay off Bruce. He knows what he is talking about. And, by the by, he's been working in this business for MORE than 23 years. Perhaps his choice of referents for some passengers was a bit ... well ... harsh. But he was, nevertheless, accurate.

As for the Pinnacle being "busy" or "empty." I've seen it both. However, for the most part it seems to do a good amount of business ... at least from my observations. And ... YES ... the Galley for the Pinnacle is under-sized, especially on the S-class ships, where the Pinnacle was entirely retro-fitted. I'm a little surprised about that being the case on the Vistas, but as Bruce says nautical engineering sometimes leaves a little bit to be desired. And those crew elevators ARE tiny. I once road in one while on an emergency chaplain call. It was CLAUSTROPHOBIC for a guy my size.

And as for the $30 charge. Tonight I had dinner with a friend at a VERY FINE Steakhouse here in Dallas, and I paid CONSIDERABLY MORE than $30. My portion of the bill, excluding wine but including appetizer, salad, entree, and dessert, was closer to $80. So ... $30 for the Pinnacle isn't really out of line. And the atmosphere and the "break from the main dining room routine" is certainly welcome. Would I rather pay only $20? SURE. But an extra $10 per person isn't about to break my bank. Not after paying a thousand, or much more, for the cruise.

Oh, and Bruce, THANK YOU for the info on the lunch prices remaining the same. As I was reading the thread through I was wondering about that. The Pinnacle Lunch IS one of the best secrets aboard ship. I'm glad it's staying $10 per person.

[Hojo's redbeard]

How did I miss this thread?
I know I've been busy since Friday, but ... yeesh!

Oh, and Bruce, THANK YOU for the info on the lunch prices remaining the same. As I was reading the thread through I was wondering about that. The Pinnacle Lunch IS one of the best secrets aboard ship. I'm glad it's staying $10 per person.

Rev,

You didn't miss the thread, this thread started Today. This is by far the hottest thread I've seen on the HAL board yet. There were even a lot of posts...moderated...

I'm very happy to learn that the Pinnacle serves lunch for $10/pp. I'll do that a couple of times I'm sure, as I don't think that I've ever made it to the dining room for lunch on any cruise, PG sounds perfect. I knew they did breakfast and lunch for the suites, which I couldn't convince DW this trip as she'd rather have the extra $2000 to spend.

[Hojo's redbeard]

oops, I meant it just got started yesterday. Wow have the days started to blend.

[newmexicoNita]

I agree on the seafood items. The first time I had the planked halibut, they must have removed it right out of the freezer, it was still frozen inside! The next time I ordered it, it was way overdone and tough. The shrimp scampi as they call it was dry and almost inedible. When they improve the menu for non meat eating guests, I may try again.........jean:cool:
I do love fish, but am not a non meat eater. Even then, I am wondering if maybe we should just skip the PG altogether. We were going to splurge and pay for both our friends and us, but I don't think I feel like spending even $20 a person for food that isn't any better than what you get in the dining room. I think I need to hear more about it before I order a Bon Voyage gift for our friends and ourselves. NMNita

[esther e]

I am a meat eater, and love, love, love rare, rare, rare steak. and the PG had the BEST steak I've ever had! It is definitely on our list of "to do", even at whatever cost. That beef was memorable!!!!

[cruisin240]

I wonder if HAl would let us bring our own meat on? I know the alcohol thing is a big taboo but hey what about my own cow?:confused:

Also, Rev Neal...we were curious about you and ended up listening to one of your homilies "what not to wear" very good. You are an awesome speaker:D my daughter thinks this should count for Sunday Church.,:p

[dougnewmanatsea]

I'm ready for everybody to attack me, but what the heck....here goes: How about if there is an extra $100 p/p built into the cruise ticket (nobody would ever know) and everything is all inclusive...tips, water, Cokes, etc.
There are several problems with this.

First, people would notice. Most people are much more likely to spend $1,000 on a cruise and another $1,000 on "extras" than they are to spend $1,500 on a cruise that includes all the "extras". Never mind that the "cheaper" cruise costs more; it still looks cheaper and a lot of people are not going to spend $500 more up-front in order to save $500 in the long term. It's just the way the mind works (or a lot of people's minds, anyway).

Now, this may not be true for longer cruises or for passengers who are booking expensive cabins but for the majority of passengers on the average 7-day Caribbean or Alaska cruise, it is true. Mass-market cruises are quite price-sensitive.

HAL's fares are already what the market can bear. If they could raise their fares and not lose passengers, they would (and they wouldn't include anything extra, either).

Secondly, your $100 figure is too low. Just tips alone come out to $70pp on a 7-day cruise. That leaves all of $30 for everything else! Maybe they could raise the fare by $500 or $700 for a 7-day cruise and include soft drinks and alternative dining - and then lose passengers in droves.

They're not stupid. They do whatever it is that will be most profitable for them. For cruise lines, what's most profitable is to keep fares low and then make huge profits on on-board revenue. And yes, if you don't like this formula, you can go to a luxury line like Crystal and pay a higher fare and not have to deal with all the extra charges. It's not like the option isn't there!

[Hojo's redbeard]

There are several problems with this.

First, people would notice. Most people are much more likely to spend $1,000 on a cruise and another $1,000 on "extras" than they are to spend $1,500 on a cruise that includes all the "extras". Never mind that the "cheaper" cruise costs more; it still looks cheaper and a lot of people are not going to spend $500 more up-front in order to save $500 in the long term. It's just the way the mind works (or a lot of people's minds, anyway).

Now, this may not be true for longer cruises or for passengers who are booking expensive cabins but for the majority of passengers on the average 7-day Caribbean or Alaska cruise, it is true. Mass-market cruises are quite price-sensitive.

HAL's fares are already what the market can bear. If they could raise their fares and not lose passengers, they would (and they wouldn't include anything extra, either).

Secondly, your $100 figure is too low. Just tips alone come out to $70pp on a 7-day cruise. That leaves all of $30 for everything else! Maybe they could raise the fare by $500 or $700 for a 7-day cruise and include soft drinks and alternative dining - and then lose passengers in droves.

They're not stupid. They do whatever it is that will be most profitable for them. For cruise lines, what's most profitable is to keep fares low and then make huge profits on on-board revenue. And yes, if you don't like this formula, you can go to a luxury line like Crystal and pay a higher fare and not have to deal with all the extra charges. It's not like the option isn't there!

Doug, That was much more eloquent than my description of the marketing of fares. Right on the money.

[AAAAmerican]

This being number Two Hundred and Twelve (212) is the same as the NYC Manhatten Area Code the second in our nation. the 201 in NJ was/is first.:D
CHOICE is the FINAL ANSWER! :D

NCL the now Star owned firm as of 2000 AD really are the ones which started NYC Cruises back besides Cunard with the Queen Ships.. Now thank GOD HAL is finally back to the NYC market place and in Manhattan at the Mid Town Piers, yes New York Passenger Cruise Ship Terminal http://www.nypst.com

Februrary 22nd, 2006 we all saw her (hms Noordam IV) leave here and return and so many have been aboard her already including and not limited to my families.

Competition is what sets all apart then service is what makes a firm great , price, location, assets of the trip and ship etc.. are all desired/wanted qualities .

NCL you have seen now is having THREE (3) LArge MEGA Liners Built each for One Billion $USD too.. yikes .. how they pay for them is yes revenues generated both from the voayges in tickets as well aboard in adding everything imagineable.. even one of my friends downtown near the courthouse is a TA and has been aboard they wanted to charge him for apple juice and did.

* YIKES *

But again choice is at hand to pay or not to pay is the question.

HAL as many have known and done did include tippage and other additions which now are paid for individually..

HAL may change its policies back if enough guests suggest that to them... having a higher initial cost fare is a lot less than finding what you spent in a multiple of what the initail fare was .. the bottom line is what really matters in comparison of costs.

Service from HAL's staff aboard does still set the line many steps ahead of the others and should be used as training for the other lines ...

Advertising the Best Qualities in the most competitive marketplace in the World here would benefit HAL immensely and even leaving from NJ, in addition of NYC, at the old NAVY MOTBY Piers at a much lower cost will be another addition of savings too.:D

[thomasale]

I am amazed at this thread...I didn't know that 10 dollars could get such a rise???

[Sea King]

Imagine if this brouha had been over $10.99 pp?:eek:

Last I promise LAST COMMENT at least from me:)

Like it or not, criticize it or not, defend it or not, smile at it or not, lecture about it or not, HAL intends to implement the new charge. How it will go over is anyone's guess or IMO "opinion"

the proof will be if attendance goes up or down AND the comment cards and CC posts once the new system becomes effective (including possible changes to the menu)

have a strong feeling Seattle will be keeping an eye on this one;)

I certainly intend to try it once and look at the service, quality of the food, selection, and ambience (love that one:))

if satisfied, I'm on the way back

if not, well: let's cross that bridge at that time:cool:

[Copper10-8]

Wise words Sea King!

[ger_77]

I have to agree with what RevNeal said - we, too went out for dinner with friends last night and our tab as a couple came to $200 without the tip. As a result, an increase of $10 in the Pinnacle Grill charge doesn't really mean a whole lot in the big scheme of things. You're still getting good value for $30 per person. (Although I will think twice about ordering the seafood, after what I've read here.)

DH has already said that we're going to spend an evening in the Pinnacle on the Maasdam in February to celebrate our 30th anniversary, whatever the cost. He says I'm worth it. I think I might just keep him.:rolleyes:

By the way, RevNeal, you look awesome - your latest pic shows a very svelte Reverend! Way to go.

Smooth Sailing! :) :) :)

[jagmanss1]

I am amazed at this thread...I didn't know that 10 dollars could get such a rise???

You must be single..... It may only be $10 for you but as A couple it is now going to be an extra $20 plus if I were to leave A tip that comes to way more than Just 10 dollars so your comment is not valid... At the current price of $20pp it would be A Total of $40 for us plus I would leave lets just say $10 tip that would be A Total of $50......

Now that same PG meal is now going to cost us $30pp total for 2 $60, Why would I leave A tip now that it would cost more than the $50 it would have cost?

For those who insist on comparing the cost of what this meal would cost at A land based resturant... I say this.... It is not land based....It is on A ship... So this is not A valid argument either... Think about it... Who in their right mind would pay what it would cost for A land based meal on A cruise ship....Again It is not land based....The food that is served at the PG is brought onboard in mass Quantities along with the food that is served in the main dining room... The cost increase does not justify it IMHO anyway....

[jagmanss1]

Just as A side note to my last post... We have A group of 10 of us that are sailing on Hal in November and all are in agreement that the new $30 charge would not be worth it as we have sailed on other lines and paid the $20pp at their specialty restaurant.... We plan on calling ahead before oct.1 and making an open ended reservation....Put it on A CC and each of us will send A check to that person... Problem solved for our group.... Then if we sail Hal again just simply won't go.... The cost for A group of 10 of us is not A mear $10

[7x5090g]

Just as A side note to my last post... We have A group of 10 of us that are sailing on Hal in November and all are in agreement that the new $30 charge would not be worth it as we have sailed on other lines and paid the $20pp at their specialty restaurant.... We plan on calling ahead before oct.1 and making an open ended reservation....Put it on A CC and each of us will send A check to that person... Problem solved for our group.... Then if we sail Hal again just simply won't go.... The cost for A group of 10 of us is not A mear $10

I wonder how many have phoned HAL to pre-order PG? The author of the OP should get a cut of that savings. Again, many thanks to fb0075.:D I'll keep searching roll call boards for any future cruise I'm booking. The least I can do is to buy you a couple of drinks.

Have a nice day all.

[Stevesan]

I wonder if HAl would let us bring our own meat on? I know the alcohol thing is a big taboo but hey what about my own cow?:confused:



Exactly what Abigail Adams did en route to join her hubby John in Gay Paree.

She did have trouble with the cabin, deck and kitchen staff until she appointed herself Hotel Manager and proceeded to get that ship cleaned up!

[HeatherInFlorida]

Jagman, I agree with you. Comparing this cost to a land based dinner makes no sense.

BTW, DH and I went our for a delicious dinner last night. We had an amazing time with friends and the entire dinner including tip was $30. So you don't necessarily have to pay a fortune to have a good dinner.

I'm not critical at all of either $20 pp or $30 pp. Everyone has the line they choose to draw for how much is too much. But since we've already paid for all our meals in the cost of our cruise, comparing it to restaurant costs just makes no sense.

[newmexicoNita]

My sentiments exactly. Yes, we do usually eat in the specialty restaurants but it is a matter of personal preference. I am still debating if I want to go ahead and make reservations ahead of time before the price goes to $30.00 or just forget it. When someone thinks it is just a $10 difference, as has been said, that is per person, not to mention it is a pretty hefty increase. $5.00 would have been a better bet and probably wouldn't have caused so much controvery. You are so right about comparing to a land restaurant. part of our cruise price includes all meals. NMnita

[hammybee]

Exactly what Abigail Adams did en route to join her hubby John in Gay Paree.

She did have trouble with the cabin, deck and kitchen staff until she appointed herself Hotel Manager and proceeded to get that ship cleaned up!

She also established the first KIDS CLub for her sons, John Quincy and Charles:)

[HeatherInFlorida]

.............. We had an amazing time with friends and the entire dinner including tip was $30. ................

Whoops!!! Too late to edit:o .... by "entire" I meant for the 2 of us. For the 4 of us it was $60. Didn't want to misrepresent that we had dinner for $30 for 4:D .

[amusea]

For those who are inclined to tip $10. per person for fine service in the PG, I am wondering how that translates to the waiter in the dining room. Waiters in the dining room, on the whole, give exceptional service in a much more hectic atmosphere. If the same formula was to apply, would those folks tip an extra $10. per person per day to the waiter? On a 7 day cruise that would be an extra $70. per person after the auto tip was charged.

[crystal808]

[I]Mr Muzz you are absolutely correct..Many of us will not pay $60 plus tip, unless it's a special occasion, as opposed to $40 plus for the Pinnacle, when we can get just as wonderful a Dinner in the Main DR...

My feelings, exactly! :D To me, dinner in the Pinnacle Grill IS a special occasion, which is why I will decide to spend some of my vacation $$ there....

JMO,
Paul

[sail7seas]

For those who are inclined to tip $10. per person for fine service in the PG, I am wondering how that translates to the waiter in the dining room. Waiters in the dining room, on the whole, give exceptional service in a much more hectic atmosphere. If the same formula was to apply, would those folks tip an extra $10. per person per day to the waiter? On a 7 day cruise that would be an extra $70. per person after the auto tip was charged.


Your theory does not equate for the following reason.

The dining room team that serves us receives $3.50 per person per day from the automatic tip. The stewards in Pinnacle get a tiny percentage of that.

[RevNeal]

For those who insist on comparing the cost of what this meal would cost at A land based resturant... I say this.... It is not land based....It is on A ship... So this is not A valid argument either... Think about it... Who in their right mind would pay what it would cost for A land based meal on A cruise ship....Again It is not land based....The food that is served at the PG is brought onboard in mass Quantities along with the food that is served in the main dining room... The cost increase does not justify it IMHO anyway....

You are, indeed, correct. It is not a land-based meal but a meal served on a ship out in the middle of the ocean hundreds or thousands of miles away from provisioning and, hence, with a chain of re-supply that is amazing to behold. So ... I'll agree ... it is not proper to compare the cost of a ship-board meal with a land based meal. The ship-board meal should cost WAY more than it does. :D

That being said, my comparison was really in terms of value and ease and as a break to the ship-board routine, not so-much in terms of expense. And, here as well, the comparison is not fair. On land to have cocktails before dinner, a meal in a high-dollar steak house, and drink and entertainment after dinner, I have to make the reservation, get dressed, get in a car, drive through insane traffic to get to a lounge where I sit and drink and chat, then get back in the car and drive through more traffic to get to the restaurant, eat the meal, pay the bill (immediately), then leave and through even more insane traffic to get to a concert hall or playhouse or piano bar or some such for some after dinner entertainment, before getting back in my car and driving back through still more insane traffic (now filled with drunk drivers) to get home. By comparison, aboard ship I have to make the reservation, get dressed, walk -- not drive, walk -- through lovely corridors to a lovely lounge, sit and enjoy lovely music, nice drinks, and excellent conversation with good friends, then get up and walk -- not drive, walk -- into the Pinnacle, where I sit and have an excellent meal. Then, putting a tip down on the table and my bill on my ship's account (for which all I have to do is sign), I get up and LEAVE, walk -- not drive -- to another lounge, sit back down and have after dinner drinks, watch a show, listen to music, and enjoy a walk out on the promenade, looking at the lovely ocean passing me by in the moonlight. I then walk -- not drive through drunk-driver infested streets -- back to my cabin where I turn in, nice and relaxed.

In truth, the two experiences are incomparable: the overall evening's experience, with or without the Pinnacle, beats the price and experience of dinner on land HANDS DOWN.

[RevNeal]

I wonder if HAl would let us bring our own meat on? I know the alcohol thing is a big taboo but hey what about my own cow?:confused:

LOL ... that cow would be a tad bit difficult to put in the overhead compartment on an airplane, don't you think? Ol' bossy won't even fit under the seat in front of you!!! :D LOL ... still ... funny mental image!

Also, Rev Neal...we were curious about you and ended up listening to one of your homilies "what not to wear" very good. You are an awesome speaker:D my daughter thinks this should count for Sunday Church.,:p

I'm greatly honored, and you are very kind! Thank you!

[RevNeal]

By the way, RevNeal, you look awesome - your latest pic shows a very svelte Reverend! Way to go.

Oh, thank you so much! I appreciate that! I'm FAR from svelte! Perhaps, someday, I'll make it to that level of condition, but today I'm feeling especially "thick." :(

[newmexicoNita]

You are, indeed, correct. It is not a land-based meal but a meal served on a ship out in the middle of the ocean hundreds or thousands of miles away from provisioning and, hence, with a chain of re-supply that is amazing to behold. So ... I'll agree ... it is not proper to compare the cost of a ship-board meal with a land based meal. The ship-board meal should cost WAY more than it does. :D

That being said, my comparison was really in terms of value and ease and as a break to the ship-board routine, not so-much in terms of expense. And, here as well, the comparison is not fair. On land to have cocktails before dinner, a meal in a high-dollar steak house, and drink and entertainment after dinner, I have to make the reservation, get dressed, get in a car, drive through insane traffic to get to a lounge where I sit and drink and chat, then get back in the car and drive through more traffic to get to the restaurant, eat the meal, pay the bill (immediately), then leave and through even more insane traffic to get to a concert hall or playhouse or piano bar or some such for some after dinner entertainment, before getting back in my car and driving back through still more insane traffic (now filled with drunk drivers) to get home. By comparison, aboard ship I have to make the reservation, get dressed, walk -- not drive, walk -- through lovely corridors to a lovely lounge, sit and enjoy lovely music, nice drinks, and excellent conversation with good friends, then get up and walk -- not drive, walk -- into the Pinnacle, where I sit and have an excellent meal. Then, putting a tip down on the table and my bill on my ship's account (for which all I have to do is sign), I get up and LEAVE, walk -- not drive -- to another lounge, sit back down and have after dinner drinks, watch a show, listen to music, and enjoy a walk out on the promenade, looking at the lovely ocean passing me by in the moonlight. I then walk -- not drive through drunk-driver infested streets -- back to my cabin where I turn in, nice and relaxed.

In truth, the two experiences are incomparable: the overall evening's experience, with or without the Pinnacle, beats the price and experience of dinner on land HANDS DOWN.My thoughts here: you are missing the point of whether it is worth the extra money to eat in PG when we have meals included in our cruise rate. You are right about the experience on ship versus most of our neighborhoods.

[RevNeal]

BTW, DH and I went our for a delicious dinner last night. We had an amazing time with friends and the entire dinner including tip was $30. So you don't necessarily have to pay a fortune to have a good dinner.

Oh, I agree. And, once can pay a GREAT DEAL of money and not get a good meal at all. I've had that happen too.

I'm not critical at all of either $20 pp or $30 pp. Everyone has the line they choose to draw for how much is too much. But since we've already paid for all our meals in the cost of our cruise, comparing it to restaurant costs just makes no sense.

Granted.
As I said in response to someone else, the meal eaten at a land-based restaurant cannot compare to the amazing feat of the ship serving meals hundreds or thousands of miles away from re-supply out in the middle of an ocean. Be it Pinnacle or main dining room or room service ... I find it an amazing feat, and hence incomparable to land-based meals and service.

[RevNeal]

My thoughts here: you are missing the point of whether it is worth the extra money to eat in PG when we have meals included in our cruise rate. You are right about the experience on ship versus most of our neighborhoods.

Yes, meals are included in our cruise rate. And if one doesn't want to eat in the Pinnacle, one certainly won't go hungry! The Pinnacle is NOT a mandatory dining experience ... it's something EXTRA. And it can be operated so cheaply ($30 pp in a quality steakhouse with quality atmosphere IS cheap) precisely because it is underwritten by ship operations and one's cruise fare.

So ... I'm not missing the point at all. I have considered the point, factored it into my observations, and find it more than bolsters my whole POV. Given the setting, the circumstances, and the quality of the atmosphere and meal to be had there, the PG is an excellent value. Can one have an excellent meal in the Main Dining room for no extra charge? Absolutely. I eat nearly all of my dinners in the Main Dining room. But I, on occasion, will eat a dinner with family and/or friends in the Pinnacle. It's something a little EXTRA which breaks the routine of the Main Dining Room -- something that is particularly welcome on longer cruises.

[HeatherInFlorida]

.............
The dining room team that serves us receives $3.50 per person per day from the automatic tip. ................

I'm really hoping you are right about this, but I was given to understand that it's not quite so. Somewhere I saw the $10/day breakdown and I thought the stewards ended up with less than that. I know this is OT, but I would really like to know if I'm wrong.

We tipped our Cabin and DR Stewards considerably over and above the automatic tip for this reason. I was told quite a bit of that $10 goes to "behind the scenes" personnel.

Back on topic, I never get bored or find the main dining room "routine". Maybe that's because we only cruise once a year. But we really look forward to going to the dining room every night without even a hint of thinking it mundane. On the contrary, I find entering the dining room an exciting experience ... love the warm welcome and the feeling they're glad we're there and as I've often said we so enjoy our tablemates every time we cruise.

But I certainly would never say it's not worth $20, or even $30. It's just that while the Pinnacle was pleasant and I loved the Chocolate Volcano, I had the feeling after of ...... "okay, been there done that".:)

[RevNeal]

Back on topic, I never get bored or find the main dining room "routine". Maybe that's because we only cruise once a year. But we really look forward to going to the dining room every night without even a hint of thinking it mundane. On the contrary, I find entering the dining room an exciting experience ... love the warm welcome and the feeling they're glad we're there and as I've often said we so enjoy our tablemates every time we cruise.

Oh, I am never bored with it either. However, on -- for example -- a 28 day cruise I DO like to try something different ... from time to time.

But I certainly would never say it's not worth $20, or even $30. It's just that while the Pinnacle was pleasant and I loved the Chocolate Volcano, I had the feeling after of ...... "okay, been there done that".:)

And THAT would be my personal criticism of it, too. Except that I don't always mind doing the "same-ol-same-ol." I would like it if HAL would vary it's PG menu a bit.

[sail7seas]

Heather......EVERY CD on every cruise we have taken since the automatic tip went into effect has stated that $3.50 went directly to dining teams....to the steward, assistant steward etc.

I am very sure we have been told this over and over and over.
We still tip additional as prior to automatic tip, we tipped more than $3.50 so we still do.

[Liz1973]

I have to admit ... disappointment when I learned of the increase. I would like to experience the PG as a first time HAL cruiser but am not inclined to go but more that once.

On a 12+ day cruise I would prefer the option to NOT be charged an additional $20+ per visit. But to factor in the actual cost vs no additional cost...hmmmm

Per Couple
Let's see: $40+tip - $60+tip vs $0 x 2-3 nights per sailing = :eek::eek:


I am looking forward to my 1st PG experience. I don't know when I plan to take the next HAL cruise and just in case there's another price increase:confused:.....

Good to know you can do Lunch as in addition to Dinner http://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon14.gif


Enjoy your cruise!!

[Liz1973]

By the way has anyone found difficulty with Prepay?

[HeatherInFlorida]

Sail, again I really hope you're right. But if that's the case, where is the part that goes to the behind the scenes personnel? $3.50 to the DR Steward, $2.50 to the Asst., $3.50 (I think?) to the Cabin Steward adds up to $9.50. So what about the Housekeeping staff, the kitchen help, etc.? I think right on their website it says some of the auto tip goes to them. I'll look into it and see what I can find.

Greg, if the day ever should come (and it won't) that I can go on a 28-day cruise, I may want a change of scene too. But on my 10-14 day, that's just not going to happen:D .

[sail7seas]

Sail, again I really hope you're right. But if that's the case, where is the part that goes to the behind the scenes personnel? $3.50 to the DR Steward, $2.50 to the Asst., $3.50 (I think?) to the Cabin Steward adds up to $9.50. So what about the Housekeeping staff, the kitchen help, etc.? I think right on their website it says some of the auto tip goes to them. I'll look into it and see what I can find.

Greg, if the day ever should come (and it won't) that I can go on a 28-day cruise, I may want a change of scene too. But on my 10-14 day, that's just not going to happen:D .

Sorry, I phrased it poorly. Of the $10.00 per person per day, $3.50 goes to dining room team......they split that $3.50 among steward, asst. steward and I think the area supervisor. Then $3.50 goes to cabin steward (maybe some piece of that is shared??) and the remaining $3.00 out of the $10.00 goes to 'behind the scenes'.

[I Luv Crusin]

Todd English Restaurant on QM2:
$30 per person for lunch abd $40 per person for dinner

Sabatini Italian Restaurant on RCCL:
$40 per person for dinner

Carnival's Speciality restaurant is also $30.00 per person.

[kryos]

BTW, DH and I went our for a delicious dinner last night. We had an amazing time with friends and the entire dinner including tip was $30. So you don't necessarily have to pay a fortune to have a good dinner.

That's my thinking exactly. My 92 year old dad lives with me, and as a matter of course, I take him out for dinner at least once a week, sometimes twice. Often, we go to a local neighborhood diner that has great food, fast service, and some very reasonable early bird specials. Often dad and I walk out of there with a bill of little more than $20 plus tip between the two of us. We leave satisfied and often with a small doggy bag too.

I guess some people enjoy dining at the more upscale restaurants, and that's great. Me ... I'm not particularly turned on by eating lots of rich food, and I'm not much of a drinker. So, for me, these experiences are just not worth spending a boatload of money.

When I cruise, I feel that one of the major benefits is that my meals are all included. While I love the Pinnacle and have eaten there several times, $20 is about the max I would spend for the experience ... at least it is the max I would spend if I wanted to do it multiple times.

$30 per person plus tip at the Pinnacle is certainly reasonable, if you really like that sort of thing. But, when people try to compare the price of the Pinnacle to a land-based restaurant of equal quality, I think they are leaving out a vital element to the equation. When we go out to eat at home and spend maybe $60 to $80 per person for a meal in a fine restaurant, that's our total cost. We didn't already put down money to eat that evening at the local diner ... money we are going to now lose by going to the more upscale restaurant. And, when we spend $30 on a HAL ship to eat at the Pinnacle, remember that we've already maybe spent $25 additional for the included food that we are not eating in the dining room that evening. So, now ... that $30 per person is actually not quite such a good deal. Personally, I'd rather save the $30 + tip and put it toward another shore excursion. But that's just me. Other's mileage may differ.

Blue skies ...

--rita

[michmike]

I have to wonder how many of those wringing their hands over the $10 increase routinely stop by Starbucks 2-3 times a week and pay $3.00 for a cup of coffee.

C'mon.. it's $20 a couple. (maybe a bit more if you increase whatever tip you leave accordingly). Plenty of folks drop that and much more for a bottle of wine every nite in the dining room.

We have been underwhelmed by the Pinnacle, esp on our most recent trip on Volendam in January. Our wive's filets were tough and service was slow and rather impersonal. I've seen numerous reports about the seafood entrees being dry and unappetizing, so beef is largely your only option.

I just think they need to vary the menu and do something more unique or ambitious than grilling a steak, no matter how good the quality supposedly is. This is an area where the chef should be able to shine, to show what he or she is capable of. That just isn't happening.

After our last experience we made the decision to spend the money we would normally spend on the Pinnacle (and perhaps more) for a nice lunch ashore. For us it isn't a matter of the cost, it's a matter of whether we feel it is unique or memorable. We just don't feel the Pinnacle is.

For those who make the argument that the cost is even more when you factor in the cost of the meal in the dining room that you forego, do you ever eat onshore for lunch or dinner? Seems like a specious argument.

We just found out yesterday that we'll be taking a 4 day Disney cruise next Sept as our friends' son is getting married onboard. It will be interesting to try their Pinnacle equivalent, Palo, which incidentally, is only $10, and compare.

My final thought is that you either feel the Pinnacle is an important and valuable part of your trip or you don't. If you are in the first category, then pay the extra $20-30 (depending on tip), go enjoy yourself, and skip a few caramel macchiatos when you get back.

Now you want outrage......... raise the price of a Bahama Mama by 50% *wink*

[peterv]

The cruise lines price all of their items at what the market will bear. If they increase a price and the drop off in business is more than what the increase provides, then it will lower the price until they have their profilt margin back.

If you wish the cruise lines to stop this endless nickel and diming and extra cost items simply stop buying them.

I've also loved their marketing these items as a "nominal" or modest charge. I think they use a different dictionary then I do.

Cheers,
Peter

[HeatherInFlorida]

Sorry, I phrased it poorly. Of the $10.00 per person per day, $3.50 goes to dining room team......they split that $3.50 among steward, asst. steward and I think the area supervisor. Then $3.50 goes to cabin steward (maybe some piece of that is shared??) and the remaining $3.00 out of the $10.00 goes to 'behind the scenes'.

Okay, that makes more sense. When we tip, we always figure in the fact that instead of the Steward and his Assistant getting the $6 (between them) that had been "suggested" in the past to all passengers, they were now only getting $3.50 split between them. So that's quite a cut if you assume everyone tipped before (which is an erroneous assumption, I know).

Anyway, since many do not pay above the auto-tip, we try to balance that a little for them:) . (But this isn't a tipping thread, is it? .... my bad ... sorry).

[dougnewmanatsea]

When we tip, we always figure in the fact that instead of the Steward and his Assistant getting the $6 (between them) that had been "suggested" in the past to all passengers
HAL never suggested anything to anyone before the current policy came into effect.

[HeatherInFlorida]

HAL never suggested anything to anyone before the current policy came into effect.

Doug, of course I know that. I'm referring to the amount that is suggested in all travel brochures, cruise materials, online travel sites and other cruise lines. People used these figures as the norm for all cruises ... at least I certainly did.

Even when HAL said "no tipping required" we knew we were expected to tip so we used the guidelines available to us.

[lizf]

We've never eaten in the Pinnacle because the dining room is so good, but since this thread started I thought, just maybe we should. So today I called ship's services. 35 minutes on hold. I even fell asleep waiting (it was 3PM and warm in the room;) ). The young lady couldn't have been nicer and she too sounded shocked at $30.00. Not really shocked, but she made me feel we were getting a good deal for $20.00pp. I paid for 2 nights reservations. We will get two cards with our cruise documents which we will take to the PG when we reserve our nights. I forgot to ask if they were changing the menu and having dinner specials each day.
Since we are going on a quite long cruise, we will have lots of time to pick the nights to celebrate our birthdays and anniversary, but I will come back and let you all know how the food was and if it has really changed at all. I've already told DH to order the beef and not the salmon since it might be partially frozen. We'll see. Thanks all for your heads up on this event.

[AAAAmerican]

Looking back at past journals I saw now we had a charge of THIRTY DOLLARS 30.00 $USD in March and April 2006 on the hms Noordam IV already..

I wonder why now they are doing it again if it was recended or expunged...

The Pinnacle Grill has a service staff of 12 on the wait staff, One Pinnacle Manager and One Pinnacle Grill Chef.

The Lido location is called : LATE NIGHT SNACK
11:00pm - 12:00mn

The Cover Charges for Lunch/DINNER are stated just (cover charge applies)

But I saw something else I forgot about... and this must raise a lot of revenues and not much cost associated either: In US Waters it was done as well International Waters..

Verbatim::
:
WIN A CRUISE LOTTERY
Purchase a Win A Cruise Lottery ticket for your chance to win a 7 - Day Carrribean Cruise for two! Tickets are on sale at the Front Office, any bingo session or at any of the bars or lounges durring sea days! Tickets are $10 each or 3 for $20.


they have the expensive bingo cards too...

Yes it is again to the PERSONAL CHOICE .To BUY or Not to Buy|??/ is the question... (\:eek:/)

Why doesnt H A L and CCL sell Ships food in the Grocery Stores yet? A cruise meal in a box.. Flash Frozen for freshness.....

CCK:NYSE Crown Holding..the Old Crown Cork and Seal! They would make/design packages ...

Wouldnt you buy Holland American Tuna or Salmon too?

[kryos]

For those who make the argument that the cost is even more when you factor in the cost of the meal in the dining room that you forego, do you ever eat onshore for lunch or dinner?
Actually, no ... not unless the meal is an included part of the all-day excursion I may be doing. :)

See ... I *am* cheap. :)

Blue skies ...

--rita