Overrated Reviews Affect Quality

[Giorgi-one]

I will proably get flamed on this one, but what the heck. I have been on 14 cruises in the last 8 years. I am not pretending to be an expert, just pointing out some level of experience. Based on these cruises and reading these boards for a few years, I have made the following observations.

1. The quality of food/services/entertainment/etc on most cruise lines has decreased over the last 8 years.

2. Most people who cruise tend to overrate their experience and are not objective in rating the individual aspects of their cruise.

I believe that the above two observations are interconnected. Cruise lines are in business to make money. Price competitioin is very intense. Cruise lines continually look for ways to save money (i.e. reduce services) to improve their bottom line. As long as most people are satisfied with the product they provide, they will continue to reduce services until it begins to have a negative effect on the bottom line.

It appears that most people who cruise are so happy to be on vacation they are willing to accept an inferior product. I agree that we are very lucky to be able to cruise one or more times a year. Most people in the world will probably never have this opportunity. However, that does not mean that we should accept reductions in quality.

Please note that this does not mean that everyone should take a negative approach and complain about everything on the cruise. Every cruise line knows what they do well and where they have been cutting. HAL knows that the quality/selection of food/service in the Vista dining room on the Zuiderdam does not compare with what they served 8 years ago. They know that the service is more like a diner than a nice restaurant. They also know that the Pinnacle Grill is one of the best alternative restaurants at sea. On my first cruise in 1996 on RCCL Sovereign of the Seas, our waiter spent about half of his time talking to the guests, telling jokes, etc. Our waiter on the Z did not have two minutes to talk to anyone. I always judge the dining experience by asking myself "Would I come back to this restaurant if it were located where I live". The answer on the Zuiderdam is a resounding NO!

So, if you are going to provide a review of your cruise, just be objective. If something is not right point it out. It could affect someone else's decision to book this cruise and, most importantly, it will send a message to the cruise line that they are not fooling us.

[fb0075]

WELL NOW, BRAVE ARENT WE!!
Since you have stepped out , let me get my feet wet as this isnt the PRINCESS BOARD I might not get HURT toooooo bad!

What amazes me is that some people- no matter what happens --no matter who is at FAULT--no matter the CUTBACKS---just NO MATTER---they argue for the cruise line (not just HAL) and that we are just PRIVILGIED to be there!!!
Im Sorry--I am a businessman and when I sell you a product, it had better be everything you expect and MORE or LOOK OUT!! We need to remember, yes they have to make $$, the cruiselines (again ALL LINES) advertise a product and when we pay them this constitutes a CONTRACT and everything should be as advertised--Of Course, things happen and we have to flow but as CUTBACKS are made===food, food,food,food,freebies are taken away--things that were once free,i.e.ice cream--coffee, are now being charged,etc.

[fb0075]

We have a right too complain--thru civil complaints (comment card,etc) they understand how we feel and may change things , BUT by not stating our OPINION and feelings,they just continue to cut,cut cut!!
Remember the furors--over ice cream,coffee,etc--
ALSO,for old timers===the PAY restaurants--the extra charge was for the excellent service==it started as $5 and now just keeps rising until they reach resistance--and now we are EXPECTED to slip CASH as a tip!!

I still love cruising---this is just an observation and I leave for my 44 th cruise on the WESTERDAM in 2 weeks!!
FRANK

[Lois R]

Hi, I haven't cruised as much as you have...Sept will be my 5th (not counting 2 from 85 and 92)...so that would make 7;) . Anyhow, this coming cruise will be my 5th in 18 months.
Now, this will be my first on HAL...

I have a comment about one thing you said...and I am not flaming you...but when you say "most people are willing to accept an inferior product"....isn't that kind of a general statement?
We are all individuals, and as such, we all have different expectations. What you may think inferior others may think superior. Or vice-versa.

I do agree, reviews are better when they are objective...to post the positives and negatives are helpful to all of us.

I hope my first cruise on HAL will be a fun experience:).

[elmorejj]

I tend to agree with the above comments. Cruising is such a subjective thing, like most things and I would never take a cruise or not take a cruise based on someone elses observations. I don`t write comprehensive reviews as they are usually just my observations, especially re food service etc. What is five star to someone may only be 3 star to me, and so on. When I feel I am not getting a good product based on what I pay, then I will move on. As always, JMHO.....jean

[grannynurse]

Everything written above is true but we vote with our feet. If the experience has been unacceptable, don't go back! We all have the choice where to spend our money but we all have our personal reasons for choosing a cruise line and/or an itinerary/ship.
For some it's a comfort level, for some it's traveling companions, for some it's another attachment.
I can enjoy an experience without it being perfect. I have a comment card and I know to whom to report when I am dissatisfied.
Cruising is a business, and like all businesses it serves needs of different categories of clientele.
Just like the price that is being charged at the Olympics for rooms on the Rotterdam, evidently the market will bare those prices, people and organizations are paying $2500 per night.
My opinion doesn't matter, i won't pay that price, but it won't deter people who will.

This is not intended for the poster, just a general comment on criticism.
I only ask that people don't rain on my parade and fudge my present experience with their negativity. If I goof and buy an inferior product, it's my mistake and I'll live with it. Don't throw it in my face and imply that I'm a fool.
I can make my own decisions, right or wrong.
Off the soap box,
GN

[fb0075]

I have a comment about one thing you said...and I am not flaming you...but when you say "most people are willing to accept an inferior product"....isn't that kind of a general statement?


I dont know who that was to but I said SOME PEOPLE in my observation!!
I ,also,agree with GN---let them know you are unhappy and then if it still is not what YOU want --dont go--
I.E. I wll not sail on the Island and Coral Princess again unless there is nothing else avaliable---we just didnt enjoy the food etc. (AGAIN OUR OPINION) FRANK

[gwilli]

What my husband & I found is that people will sit there and complain about the food, service, shows and other problems with the ship - but then say HAL is the best and they wouldn't try another cruise line! When we would compare our HAL cruise to other cruises we have taken on other lines, people got upset with us. We don't get it! This is why HAL doesn't have to make anything any better!

Happy sailing........

[fb0075]

Thats what I said ---only BETTER!!

[lknick]

I'm someone who calls them as I see them [both the good and bad]...and has been roasted for being negative, ignorant, having a personality defect, etc. on both the Cunard regarding QM2 and Carnival board regarding the Carnival Legend to the point of being sent nasty emails.

There is a 'right of ownership' position taken by many. In that they chose a cruise, they feel they must justify their choice. As such they say everything is just hunky-dory and anyone who does not agree with them must be deficient in judgement and personality.

Anyone who has been on more than a few cruises knows quality and staffing has declined steadily. Anyone who has worked in industry...any industry...knows that cost containment is an ongoing effort. These simply are the facts, but some just think that everyone is out to question their personal judgement and must defend it.

Whether over-blown reviews imply acceptance of reduced quality, I don't know. However, most industries respond to critiques as long as critiques are not nutty.

Back in the good ol' day, when food and service was superior, all entertainment on board was provided by the passengers.

[Lois R]

fb...I wasn't picking on anyone...sorry...I was just making my own observation. And my comment was for the original poster....an observation from my own thoughts.

So, when I reply with my own opinions on here I get yelled at too?:(

I will just read from now on...and hope my HAL experience is a good one....

[fb0075]

Excuse me, LORI---
but I dont believe my response was hostile or yelling at you--
if so I APOLOGIZE
FRANK

[FlorenceItaly]

Lois - This board tends to "banter" but don't let it bother you, it's the personality of the board, lol. With that said, it is still my favorite board, and what I consider my home board. There are wonderful people here. Please don't just read the board here. You are a sweet, loving, person and a wonderful addition to the board...it needs the balance ;).

I am confident your HAL cruise is going to be a good experience. Look at me, my first cruise on HAL last month, and I came home and booked another for next month because I enjoyed it so much.

Marie

[Lois R]

Frank...its Lois. Ok...If I misunderstood, sorry. I thought you thought my previous post was directed at you...it wasn't.

Hi Marie:)

[Seems_to_me]

Everything posted here is reasonable, and then comes:I only ask that people don't rain on my parade and fudge my present experience with their negativity. Therefore, I must conclude that your position is if it isn't grand, it must be a personal deficiency, ie negativity.

[sail7seas]

I agree with most of what has been written but feel it necessary to add that each person experiences the same cruise, the same ship in a different way.


I may have a fabulous cabin steward and am well pleased with the service. Perhaps someone else has a very tired steward who is ready to leave for his vacation and has provided only the bare minimum of service. That pax is not as happy as I am.

I got a less friendly, less competent dining steward but you got a great one.

Each cruises comment sheets will be so divergent and when the Hotel Managers and Guest Relations Managers and F & B's etc read them, they will read raves and they will read about how horrible the cruise was.

Only a very experienced staff IMO can sort through it all and get to the reality of what is going on aboard the ship between crew and pax.

[Krazy Kruizers]

:)

When we return from a cruise, we try to be as objective as we can be. But remember that it is still OUR opinion.

We try to point out the good things, the bad things, and any new changes that have taken place since our last cruise. If enough people have the same negative comments, the cruise lines tend to listen.

For example, when the Zuiderdam first came out, complaints were voiced about the lack of public restrooms, the choice of colors for interior decorating, and a few other things. When the Oosterdam came out, HAL listened and changed a few things. The colors were toned down and more public rest rooms were added. Not all items were addressed but HAL did make an honest effort to respond.

:)

[jhannah]

Cruising is such a subjective thing, like most things and I would never take a cruise or not take a cruise based on someone elses observations ... What is five star to someone may only be 3 star to me, and so on.This is an important thing to remember. Thanks, Jean. A cruise is like food, restaurants, or political candidates. Everybody brings a different set of expectations to the table. Some are unreasonable, IMO. But, at any rate, reading others' perspectives helps me paint the overall picture. I never cruised during the twenties, thirties and fourties ... so I can't compare with the level of service rendered during those times. But I don't expect to experience that today -- at least not at the price I'm willing to pay. I don't want an inferior product, but shoot, I'm one of those who's just happy to be on a cruise ship being waited on hand and foot.

[Orcrone]

I don't want an inferior product, but shoot, I'm one of those who's just happy to be on a cruise ship being waited on hand and foot.I don't want this to become a back-patting thread, but good point. I'm on a cruise, having good weather, relaxing by the pool and enjoying the shore excursions. So if my room is not made up until late morning or the dining room service is a little slower than it could be, I may not even notice it. On the other hand if the weather's rough, you're stuck indoors and half the people are seasick, then these minor things are going to seem more important.

I've been on two cruises, haven't had one minute of rain. Guess what I thought of the cruises.

[Giorgi-one]

Filling out cruise comment sheets is a good thing, but I believe that comments on the internet like this board are more likely to get results because they get to a much larger audience particulary people planning future cruises. Be objective, but if you don't like something tell us all about it. Don't say say your cruise was great. Of course, almost all cruises are great. How bad can it be compared to work?

[iluvcruzin]

It appears that most people who cruise are so happy to be on vacation they are willing to accept an inferior product.
If they are so happy to be on vacation they don't realize it's an inferior product or they don't care. We should all be so happy on every cruise.

As far as the request to post objectively on a review.. they fall under subjective anyhow. If you are talking about a review that would have any effect it would be the one you fill out on the questionare - not any comments you leave on a message board that is viewed by a small percentage of the cruise population and NOT by the cruiseline. I don't think there will be any noticable impact if a person reads a review and decides not to cruise.

As someone who's sailed for 15 years and have seen the changes in the quality of some areas, I've seen improvements in others. I'm not trying to flame here, but I think there are much better ways to improve quality and be heard than what is being suggested. (ie.. snail mail to the cruiseline).

[lknick]

I read these boards primarily for a giggle and from time to time, to get information.

I know full well that when the waiter put his elbow into my soup on the QM2 that such was not company policy. But, by the same token, it certainly did not enhance my experience. Was this being negative or simply a giggle to pass along?

I know from repeated cruises on the same ship, I have had different experiences, and that my experiences were also different from others.

To steal someone elses's line: 'seems to me' we just take ourselves too seriously.

[Orcrone]

I know full well that when the waiter put his elbow into my soup on the QM2 that such was not company policy. It may not be company policy, but I hope he at least brought you another soup.:D

[uncialman]

I believe that I have already stated this on a previous thread but the kind of comments that rub me the wrong way (please don’t take offense) are the “who cares if my steak tastes like a Nike Running Shoe, I’m on vacation” or the standard “who cares if there were some major downgrades, I was pampered.” The issue at hand is that the consumer has choices as to where they can spend their travel dollar. If cruiseline A is doing more for the customer than cruiseline B, then cruiseline A will eventually start losing discriminating customers. This also is a problem for those who read these boards and think that they will be sitting down at a gourmet meal in the dining room: it just isn't the case anymore. If HAL continues to let the product slip as much in the next 4 years as they have in the 4 years that I have frequently cruised them, we might not be back. The experience, food, service etc. that we first experienced on the Rotterdam just three and a half years ago was so far above in quality what we experienced on the Zuiderdam that the Vista Class ship left us with a terrible taste in our mouth.

I have cruised Celebrity twice and HAL 5 times now. Before our experience on the Zuiderdam, we had noticed that the product (especially in the dining room food and service) was slipping. Although we really enjoyed the Celebrity product (Incredible food and service/sophisticated atmosphere), we still would have spent our money on HAL before Celebrity as the HAL ships cabins and ambiance just seemed a bit more comfortable. This is no longer the case. At this point, HAL is going to have to give me a really good reason to cruise their ships instead of Celebrity or even one of the other contemporary brands. HAL’s food quality is lacking, the service has slowed down, the cabins are smaller, there are more people on the ships, they are charging for coffee, they are automatically adding tips, they now charge for sauna services while leaving a piddly tiny sauna room for their non-extra charge customers, and (my pet peeve) they have begun blasting pop music (ala carnival) at the pools. Was any of this addressed in the “Signature of Excellence” campaign? No.

[divinggirl]

Can I ask what may be an obvious question to you more seasoned posters? Do reps from the various cruiselines go to these boards and read them?

[RevNeal]

... the cabins are smaller...

Have they recently shrunk the S and R class ship cabins? :D
My friend, I know what you mean. I don't like it either. Nevertheless, applying to the entire Fleet the changes found on the one HAL ship most noted or being unlike the others (in terms of market) is really not kosher. That's illustrated by the comment quoted above. :)

[sail7seas]

Yes, they do.

HAL employees in Seattle reads this (and other) boards. Some of the folks on the ships read this (and other) boards.

[RevNeal]

Do reps from the various cruiselines go to these boards and read them?

In a word: yes. Officials of the line read these board for insight into what we think. Also, employees of the line post here as members of the community.

[lknick]

Officials of the line read these board for insight into what we think. I wish I knew why you're so sure of this as it contradicts other information I have.

[jhannah]

While I can't give specifics regarding HAL, I have "chatted" online with a Princess cruise director whom I later met on a cruise. He joined our CC group when we met for sailaway. He indicated that management is very interested in opinions reflected on the board. Since Princess is owned by the same company as HAL, I don't think it's a stretch to assume HAL management monitors this board, too.

[iluvcruzin]

I wish I knew why you're so sure of this as it contradicts other information I have.
I agree. I highly doubt they use this forum for research. Never in the almost 4 years I've been on this board have I seen a representative of a cruiseline post on the cruisecritic boards. However, maybe the old-timer HAL board members have a different experience. If so.. it's a unique thing for this board and definately not the norm.

[fb0075]

Oh yes indeedy ----

Apx 3 months ago, I had a problem with HAL that I posted about here and within 45 min had recieved e-mail from low level supervisor--recieved aplogies and $100 shipboard credit!
FRANK

[RevNeal]

I wish I knew why you're so sure of this as it contradicts other information I have.

Firstly, on past cruises I've been identified by HAL staff as "the RevNeal, who posts on a cruise discussion board." By staff I mean several different kinds of people, from Seattle officials, officers on the ship, future cruise consultants, etc. For example, once I was just walking down a corridor and a middle-aged fellow stopped me to ask me if I was me. When I replied that I was and asked what his handle was, his reply was that he was "with the Line" and, while he didn't post, but did frequently read it. When I asked him how he knew it was me, he said that I look like my picture.

Secondly, about 17 or so months ago I applied to serve as a chaplain with HAL. I sent off my letter of interest and a copy of my vita to the agency with which HAL has contracted to do the vetting and coordination of Protestant chaplains for the Line. Within a few weeks I received a letter from them stating that, while they would be happy to keep my letter and vita on file, normally they prefer to contract with "more senior" clergy. In other words -- and this was worded very carefully -- I'm not considered to be old enough for their purposes. Having chatted with several chaplains about this, I know that HAL does prefer to contract with protestant clergy over the age of 55, though they never actually state it. Anyway, I posted the rejection here on CC and expressed my disappointment with having been "put off." Some of you may remember that.

Within a week (actually, within just a couple of days) of making that post on the old CC board I received a very apologetic phone call from someone at the agency, asking me if I was still interested in serving as a chaplain for Holland America. I told them "yes," and they put me on the schedule. I was curious about the speed of their reversal, and the irony that the reversal came so quickly after I had posted what had happened on the CC board, but sometimes coincidences do occur.

Within a couple of days of that phone call, however, I received an email from a Holland America Vice President (whom I shall not name here) asking me if my "issue relative to my application for chaplain service with the Line" had been resolved. I responded that it had, and I thanked this person for asking and for any help they may have given in getting me onto the list. The email response -- almost immediate -- was that they were happy to have my help as a volunteer Protestant Chaplain for the line.

Now ... I may not be the sharpest knife in the drawer, but it doesn't take much to realize that this wasn't a coincidence. Someone high up at HAL (a Vice President is pretty high up) read my remark on CC about being rejected from chaplain service due to my youth and contacted the agency to tell them to fix it. THEN, this person emailed me to make sure that it had been fixed.

For me, that's enough to know that at least some people at HALHQ pay at least some kind of attention to what's posted on this board, that they do so regularly, and that they sometimes take action based upon what they see.

As for HAL employees posting here ... some of them haven't even made it a secret.

[FlorenceItaly]

Last month, on the Maasdam, I had an occasion to speak to a front desk person(by the way, their front dest staff is WONDERFUL). I was given the distinct impression that they were VERY aware of these boards, and what is being discussed. I see that as a very positive thing.

Marie

[Tvisitor]

I haven’t been on any ship in over 6 years, so I will concede in advance that I could be in for a new awakening when I go on the Oosterdam in January. However, I have chosen to go back on HAL, instead of going back on Celebrity, because when I cruised on Celebrity in 1998 (after having cruised on HAL in 1987, 1994 and 1997), I found that even though the two cruise lines were comparable in many ways, I preferred HAL ships and the way HAL did things. In January, if I find that HAL has declined too far for my tastes, I’ll probably just not go on another cruise. I won’t go back over to Celebrity –- been there, did that. And, unless I am mistreated, I won’t be angry at HAL.

Up to now, HAL has been the best I can afford in the type of cruise experience I want. I am confident that if there has been a decline in food quality and service on HAL, it is part of an industry trend. If I find that the type of cruise experience I can afford has become unsatisfying, I simply won’t be inclined to cruise. When it comes to me the equation is simple. If HAL were to double its price in order to provide an experience worth twice the price, then chances are, I would go on HAL as many times as I have gone on the so-called "luxury lines", which is never. And, if the quality of the HAL experience were to decline to a cut-rate level, I would be totally uninterested in going back.

Cruises in HAL’s class sell based on the perception that the quality provided for the price charged represents good value. If the price goes too high, or the quality goes too low, that perception will be destroyed, and sales will plummet and not come back. The folks at HAL don’t have to read the posts on this board to know that.

[uncialman]

Revster stated:

Have they recently shrunk the S and R class ship cabins?
My friend, I know what you mean. I don't like it either. Nevertheless, applying to the entire Fleet the changes found on the one HAL ship most noted or being unlike the others (in terms of market) is really not kosher. That's illustrated by the comment quoted above.

Uncialman replies:

You are correct; I should have qualified my statements about cabin size in reference to Vista class ships. My bad - I was on a roll. The other items, however, such as the food quality and service had dropped on our two cruises on the Zaandam in '03. We hoped that they first downward trend was an abberration, but it ended up being the status quo.

I am thinking of starting a "save the Java Cafe" thread.

[sail7seas]

I wish I knew why you're so sure of this as it contradicts other information I have.

I am so sure of it because HAL friends of ours have told us they read it. They have commented to me about a particular thread that they would only have known if they had read it here.

I have received e-mails from friends about things I have written. I have sent copies of some threads I thought they might be interested in reading.

Is there something wrong with them reading/posting here?

That is how I know it to be true.

[FlorenceItaly]

IMO, I think it is wonderful that HAL reads these threads. I think it benefits us as the consumer.

Marie

[Tvisitor]

Hello,


They haven’t shrunk any cabins at all. Only the names have been changed. For the Vista Class, they dropped the promenade deck down, which allowed them to add balconies to cabins that would have been C’s and D’s on an S or an R class ship. It seems to me that all the folks who talk about shrinking cabins forget about the SS cabins on the Vista Class ships. The SS cabins of the Vista Class replace the A and B cabins of the S and R class ships. SS cabins are much bigger than the A’s and B’s that are in the same locations on the S and R class ships.

[gizmo]

But they have made cabins smaller. The S cabins are smaller on the Vista Class ships!

I don't look at the SS that way at all. I see the SS as being an additional category between the S and the A/B. The Vista's still have A/B and they are smaller.

[Tvisitor]

But they have made cabins smaller. The S cabins are smaller on the Vista Class ships!
Caught me.

[superstein61]

2. Most people who cruise tend to overrate their experience and are not objective in rating the individual aspects of their cruise.

I believe that the above two observations are interconnected. Cruise lines are in business to make money. Price competitioin is very intense. Cruise lines continually look for ways to save money (i.e. reduce services) to improve their bottom line. As long as most people are satisfied with the product they provide, they will continue to reduce services until it begins to have a negative effect on the bottom line.

It appears that most people who cruise are so happy to be on vacation they are willing to accept an inferior product. .

Agreed Giorgi, agreed. I have said this many times on this board - I want to read the good and the bad. I want to read objectivity. I dislike when someone posts some critical comments and somebody else feels this may chime in with "well my cruise was fine" implying the original person was wrong or worse yet, those who say "You are on a vaction, why complain" , etc, etc.

But the ones that used to really gall me were the specific cruise line defenders - where no one could utter a bad word about "their" line without being told how wrong they were. A few years ago, the HAL board was teeeming with these folks. And as a result - I think we have seen things go down hill from HAL. So now there are not as many pure defenders around. Oh, there are a few - and they may try and make a little criticism now and then to appear objective - but they always aren't

[superstein61]

I believe that I have already stated this on a previous thread but the kind of comments that rub me the wrong way (please don’t take offense) are the “who cares if my steak tastes like a Nike Running Shoe, I’m on vacation” or the standard “who cares if there were some major downgrades, I was pampered.”


i recall the thread and agree with you once again Uncialman.

[superstein61]

I agree. I highly doubt they use this forum for research. Never in the almost 4 years I've been on this board have I seen a representative of a cruiseline post on the cruisecritic boards. However, maybe the old-timer HAL board members have a different experience. If so.. it's a unique thing for this board and definately not the norm.

While I can't speak for HAL - I know there have been instances where officials from NCL have posted on the NCL board (typically thru Laura - so these were verified as directly from NCL mgmt). I believe all lines read comments here

[HeatherInFlorida]

I'll be interested to see how we feel the Oosterdam this November compares with our Maasdam cruise in November 2002.

I agree with most of the premise of this thread. And I believe we should be realistic in our praise (as well as our criticism) of any cruiseline. But I still believe that you get what you pay for. IMO, cruising in this category (i.e. HAL, Celebrity as opposed to Luxury Lines) is still one of the best values around for a vacation.

Many of you are travelling in the upper suite categories where it is more expensive, but the fact remains that I can get a really nice cabin with a balcony (something I never dreamed of 10 years ago:p ) for about $1500 for a week for 2 people.

I don't know anywhere we can go for that price where we're treated so well with all the food we can eat thrown in to boot. The cheapest motel room along I-95 is close to $100. Throw in 3 meals at Shoney's (heaven forfend:cool: ), the gas to get where we're going, and you're close to what we're paying for our cruise.

HAL has to deteriorate an awfully long way to get down to that level of entertainment.

[Tvisitor]

You say:

I don't look at the SS that way at all. I see the SS as being an additional category between the S and the A/B. The Vista's still have A/B and they are smaller.
I think if you look at the location and pricing of A's and B's on S and R class ships, and compare it to the location and pricing of the SS and A/B cabins on Vista Class ships, you may see where I was coming from on this one. The SS cabins are where I suggested they are, and they are at a price point more consistent with my explanation than yours. However, for other reasons, I do agree that the SS cabin is an innovation in the industry as a whole, and I think HAL was correct to give it a new designation. That does not invalidate my explanation.

[gizmo]

Hi Tvisitor,

I see your point and agree it is valid. I always equated an A with an A, so to me the cabin is smaller. If a person always booked an A/B they would expect the cabin to be the same size but find it smaller on the Vistas.

Perhaps Hal should have dropped the A/B naming convention and called them something else. This would have eliminated people thinking they reduced the size of the cabins.

[ekerr19]

[QUOTE=Giorgi-one]I will proably get flamed on this one, but what the heck.


It appears that most people who cruise are so happy to be on vacation they are willing to accept an inferior product.[QUOTE]

First of all, you should not be flamed for this posting - if you are, well, to me that speaks volumes about the posters on this board. It's easy to point the finger at someone and say "well, my cruise on the Zui was great, so you must be lying about yours" - I absolutely detest this type of attitude, 100%. We are ALL individuals with different likes & dislikes. To say someone else is wrong or to post "oh, don't listen to the negative" is not helpful in the least, also a bit disrespectful, IMO.

This second point, well... I would like to add something as food for thought. There are many things that are completely out of one's control - to me, getting all caught up in a tizzy about it isn't always worth the effort. I do not think HAL's product to be inferior - but I do believe it is no longer what it used to be & definitely has room for improvement. When I am on vacation, it's just that - I've spent a good amount of very hard earned money for this, and my goal is to relax & try to enjoy myself. When I find myself getting upset or dismayed about something - I do try and remind myself that I am on vacation - nothing is worth ruining it, especially things I can not control.

[HeatherInFlorida]

I just realized my post was a little off topic. What I meant to add was that when I review a cruise, I base my critique on what I paid for the cruise and what I should expect having paid that. So I might rave about a cruise on HAL that cost me $1500. But I'm sure if I were to go on one of the luxury cruiseships that is over double the cost and then tried to compare it to my HAL cruise, HAL might pale in comparison.

So I think we have to be fair about making judgements. I might go to a restaurant that I say is good value for the money. But if I go to a top notch restaurant, I expect more. It's my belief that Holland America used to be in the luxury category. Over time, and in an effort to attract more customers, they have lowered their standards along with their fares. So anyone who has been cruising with HAL for many years will be more critical than those cruising her for the first time.

[lipoppop]

We were not given questionaires on our June 12th Westerdam cruise. Was this an oversight or a new HAL change?

[FlorenceItaly]

It must have been an oversight, possibly by your steward?

I was on the Maasdam, June 19-26 sailing, and questionaires were given.

Marie