Cancellation Policy

[Flagship1]

Although I have read these boards for years this is my first time posting. My wife and I booked the Nov. 30th Ft. Lauderdale 7 day cruise for a Penthouse A stateroom. We have just heard from our attorney that our lawsuit against our builder has been set for trial by the Court for Dec. 3rd and that the Judge will not consider moving it.

I promptly contacted our agent at Regent (we booked directly with the line) asking if we could transfer our paid-in full payment to a later Regent cruise (even a more expensive one). His response was that was not permitted by Regenthttp://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon8.gif I even offered to send a copy of the Court Order.

I can understand if we called a week before sailing. We are almost 60 days out from the cruise (plenty of time for Regent to resell our cabin). We have no control over what the Court does (anyone ever involved in our legal system understands this). I did read the cancellation policy shown on the brochure we received after booking (but it is totally silent on "transfers".

I do not understand why Regent does not take the same course of action that the airlines do -- credit you for the ticket you can not use for a later flight and if the fare is greater, pay the difference (together with a "penalty" rebooking fee).

With SilverSea and Seabourne building newer ships, I would think that Regent would try to court (sorry for the pun) some goodwill with its clients (after all, this is not some 3 day promo junket to Nassau).

This is our first time with Regent and their response is not one I would expect from a luxury cruise line. I would appreciate receiving any ideas or thoughts from fellow cruisers on this topic and how to proceed. Thanks!

Mike

[cruiseyguy]

Regent's cancellation policies are pretty much the same as most other lines. I'm not sure even travel cancellation insurance would help you in this instance since most only allow cancellation for jury duty (I'm assuming you don't have trip insurance.) Some lines (i.e., Celebrity) have their own policies which do allow future credit and also allow cancellation for any reason. Cruise line cancellation policies are a personal annoyance to me since the penalties often greatly exceed the actual damages incurred by the line. Any line which offered future credit for a cancelled cruise (minus some sort of re-booking fee) would certainly earn my gratitude.

[TRadle]

Can’t your legal team represent you in court that week?

[Flagship1]

I did look into trip insurance but found that the coverages provided did not apply to "legal" matters (including lost or delayed passports). Since we are in excellant health and have substantial medical insurance on our own, these policies would do us little good.

I believe that regent and other cruise lines are doing both themselves and their customers a great disservice in not permitting a transfer to a future cruise when the reason for cancellation is not within the control of the customer.

[Flagship1]

Our legal system requires both parties to a lawsuit (plaintiff and defendant) to be present in court for trial (one having the right to cross-examine witnesses against you).

Unfortunately here in NC the Judge has tremendous discretion and power and when he tells you to jump you reply "how high"?

The sad thing here is that although the Court tells you to be present at a date certain, the Judge can on his own move that date to a later date on the day you show up.

So the gamble is -- do you cut your losses and take a 25% cancellation penalty now or risk going on the trip only to have your attorney call you on the ship to tell you that you lost your case since you were not there?

Regardless -- I fail to see what harm Regent incurrs in this situation with a transfer.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

You rolled the dice and you lost. I.e., you didn't buy cancellation insurance. We're going two weeks later, and I thought about NOT buying insurance this time, but did anyways. It was only a couple of hundred bucks. Of course, I would have looked at the fine print closely to see if it covered this sort of event, if I guess that this might happen.

Sorry for your financial loss--hope you try Regent again.

[Flagship1]

I do not think that I rolled the dice and lost as I have not found any cancellation policy that covers this situation. In looking at the fine print with those policies -- they are quite specific about "pre-existing" conditions - let alone with any provision regarding "legal contingencies". As I referred to in an earlier posting -- an "inadequate" or "deficient" passport does not trigger coverage under a cancellation policy.

One thing that sets apart a "luxury" company (whether it be a cruise line, hotel - ie- Ritz-Carlton, Four Seasons, etc.) - is how they make things right for the client.

Unfortunately service is fast disappearing in this country (just think about how many buttons you have to push on your phone before getting a live voice when you call a company). As my father once told me -- you get a lot more business with honey than with vinegar.

Where is the harm to Regent in all of this?

[Wendy The Wanderer]

Well I agree with you that they could probably fill your cabin. But all the cruiselines have pretty well the same rules, and you probably knew them. So, knowing this contingency could not have been insured, you are financially liable, why blame Regent?

[TRadle]

There are insurance policies that allow you to cancel for any reasons. Granted, they are expensive, but you could have just insured the trip "for any reason" and opted out of the medical insurance.

For most of these policies you have to purchase the insurance within 2 or 3 days of booking the trip.

[Goofyisme]

I do not think that I rolled the dice and lost as I have not found any cancellation policy that covers this situation. In looking at the fine print with those policies -- they are quite specific about "pre-existing" conditions - let alone with any provision regarding "legal contingencies". As I referred to in an earlier posting -- an "inadequate" or "deficient" passport does not trigger coverage under a cancellation policy.

One thing that sets apart a "luxury" company (whether it be a cruise line, hotel - ie- Ritz-Carlton, Four Seasons, etc.) - is how they make things right for the client.

Unfortunately service is fast disappearing in this country (just think about how many buttons you have to push on your phone before getting a live voice when you call a company). As my father once told me -- you get a lot more business with honey than with vinegar.

Where is the harm to Regent in all of this?

Lot's of insurance policies that would cover your situation. You just rolled snake eyes ya gotta live with it. A good TA could find one for you in about 2 minutes. As said before such insurance must be purchased within a few days of original booking.

[Flagship1]

I appreciate the comments from the other members but some of you are missing the point. As one of the members stated there are cruise lines that allow a person to transfer their payment to a subsequent cruise.

There is NO harm done to Regent. On many of the boards that I have read about Regent -- the prevailing theme is that because they are a luxury cruise line and supposedly the "best of the best" -- more is expected from them.

If the airlines can do this (along with some cruise companies) is it unreasonable to ask Regent for the same consideration?

Would you not expect a Ritz-Carlton to treat a guest with more consideration than a Days Inn?

Maybe a tip off should have been the numerous comments about vibration problems on Voyager and Navigator -- but when I asked the representative from Regent about them (as I initially requested a Seven Seas aft suite) I was told that there was no problem and that "minor vibration" is encountered in the aft of all ships.

Well I used to build luxury private yachts for a living and that is just not the case.

But I also realize that one is not too old to learn new lessons -- but I just never expected that of a cruise line like Regent which I was trying for the first time and it looks like for the last time (I have been on other cruises with other lines).

Once again - thank you for all of your comments.

[cruiseluv]

I am sorry that this happened to you but as you said you were aware of the cancelation policies. You took a calculated risk and lost. The non risky position would have been not to book the cruise, as you had a case pending. The fact that you don't have control over the court calendar has no bearing on this. If I book a cruise and the week before my husband has a business emergency and can't go, I also don't have control over that but that isn't the cruise line's problem.

We don't know if the cruise line can or cannot sell your cabin. I don't think that date is necessarily peak season for cruises as it is sandwiched between Thanksgiving and Christmas and a lot of people don't want to travel then. But that is not even relevant. Would I prefer that the cruise lines offered more flexibility? Sure!

[Goofyisme]

Would you not expect a Ritz-Carlton to treat a guest with more consideration than a Days Inn?



I expect either to live up to their published policies that I have read and agreed upon with my booking.

[cruiseluv]

Flagship,

As far as I know the cruise companies that give you a credit for a future cruise do this if you buy the insurance they offer for it. In other words, it's not a given, you have to pay to be covered for cancelling "for any reason". If you don't buy the coverage, you would be in the same position you are today.

You keep repeating "there is NO harm done to Regent", and again I say, you don't know that. It could be there is no othere buyer for that cabin anymore, or that they might have to substantially discount it to attract somebody.

[surfklutz]

I agree with the OP - there is something about a "spirit of cooperation" that I believe is just good business. Regent doesn't have to do a thing for him - but I am surprised they wouldn't WANT to - after all, he sounds like if he were pleased with the product he would book numerous times. I believe that high end cruise lines know the value of a good customer versus aquiring new customers.

Once again - it isn't want the legally can do - it is what they are willing to do that speaks volumes. I say Regent is amiss at not evening throwing him some kind of bone.

[cruiseluv]

I agree with the OP - there is something about a "spirit of cooperation" that I believe is just good business. Regent doesn't have to do a thing for him - but I am surprised they wouldn't WANT to - after all, he sounds like if he were pleased with the product he would book numerous times. I believe that high end cruise lines know the value of a good customer versus aquiring new customers.

Once again - it isn't want the legally can do - it is what they are willing to do that speaks volumes. I say Regent is amiss at not evening throwing him some kind of bone.


Surfklutz,

If they did that for this passenger, they would have to do it for anybody that had to cancel due to a situation outside their control. Unless they are prepared to formally change their cancellation policy ( which I would welcome!) , I don't think that would be a wise move.

[DocDesdin]

It sounds to me like you only spoke with one person at Regent; you have nothing to lose my writing a nice letter to Regent (including a copy of the court date paper) and addressing it to Guest Relations at the Fort Lauderdale office. You have nothing to lose and you may get a different response at this level. Good luck!

[planner8]

I agree cruiseluv

[JLC@SD]

Regardless -- I fail to see what harm Regent incurrs in this situation with a transfer.

.....it seems that if the cruise lines took up a policy to do "transfers".....it would open Pandora's box........what do they allow as a reason for transfers?????

My take is........they want nothing to do with reasons......and they want you to turn over the situations.......to be handled by others......insurance companies....;)

[smeyer418]

Although I have read these boards for years this is my first time posting. My wife and I booked the Nov. 30th Ft. Lauderdale 7 day cruise for a Penthouse A stateroom. We have just heard from our attorney that our lawsuit against our builder has been set for trial by the Court for Dec. 3rd and that the Judge will not consider moving it.

I promptly contacted our agent at Regent (we booked directly with the line) asking if we could transfer our paid-in full payment to a later Regent cruise (even a more expensive one). His response was that was not permitted by Regenthttp://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon8.gif I even offered to send a copy of the Court Order.

I can understand if we called a week before sailing. We are almost 60 days out from the cruise (plenty of time for Regent to resell our cabin). We have no control over what the Court does (anyone ever involved in our legal system understands this). I did read the cancellation policy shown on the brochure we received after booking (but it is totally silent on "transfers".

I do not understand why Regent does not take the same course of action that the airlines do -- credit you for the ticket you can not use for a later flight and if the fare is greater, pay the difference (together with a "penalty" rebooking fee).

With SilverSea and Seabourne building newer ships, I would think that Regent would try to court (sorry for the pun) some goodwill with its clients (after all, this is not some 3 day promo junket to Nassau).

This is our first time with Regent and their response is not one I would expect from a luxury cruise line. I would appreciate receiving any ideas or thoughts from fellow cruisers on this topic and how to proceed. Thanks!

Mike

Most cruise line insurance has an cancel for any reason for a percentage towards the next cruise. Most cruise insurance will also not cover where you are the plaintiff but only when called as a witness ....I have never heard of case(and I am a lawyer) where the plaintiff or defense can show non cancellable arrangements that they can't get a reasonable postponement but then I don't practice in Florida. Perhaps if you get a letter from your lawyer and the court Regent may make an exception...

[AtA]

There are insurance policies that allow you to cancel for any reasons. Granted, they are expensive, but you could have just insured the trip "for any reason" and opted out of the medical insurance.

For most of these policies you have to purchase the insurance within 2 or 3 days of booking the trip. And considering cruises are expensive, this is the reason to ALWAYS carry insurance. My other thought was if you had used an experienced TA you might have had better luck, because then he/she could have gone to bat for you. Especially if the agent placed $$$$$$$$ of business with Regent, like ours does.

They are quite clear though that the tickets are nonrefundable. You took a gamble and you lost.

[surfklutz]

Have you ever considered the number of cruises that are paid in full, then canceled within the penalty period and the client is paid back with insurance funds. The cruise lines keep that money in full. It is a whole source of income that most people do not consider - especially when they often resell the stateroom before the cruise sails.

How much you value your sold and committed customer is manifest in how you treat them. Budget cruise lines depend on getting new clients all the time - their lost leader pricing proves that. Luxury lines generally like to hold on to their high paying clients. I just believe that disregarding the whole situation to his plight is not very good business. I believe that they should in "the spirit of cooperation" at least give him a partial credit to move to another date. And what that does is give them money on the front end - and money on his rescheduled voyage - and probably a customer in the future.

What do they have now? They have all his money - but nothing in the future and not much hope of a future client.

[seahorse]

Everyone has a good and valid opinion on this issue, but my professional opinion is that Regent should work with the client and as a good will gesture transfer the booking. There is nothing better in the travel business then a happy client.

It can be done by Regent on a case by case. It does not have to set a precedent. I suggest going higher up in management.

Good luck:)

[Flagship1]

As with any issue there will be 2 sides of opinions which is healthy.

One suggestion is to contact management at a higher level which I will certainly do.

Another comment was that I should have used an experienced TA with Regent. Unfortunately in the area where I live I have not found such a person -- thus I dealt directly with the cruise line in booking the cruise -- thinking that if a person goes directly to the source you will have developed a better "relationship" with the provider of the service. Obviously a wrong assumption.

In my business -- it is so much easier (and less expensive) to keep and further a business relationship with someone you already have contact with than go out and seek new customers. Too often businesses look at only the short term profit and not the long term picture.

As one reader accurately pointed out that if this matter is unaddressed by Regent then my business will go elsewhere along with that of my friends as there are other high end cruise lines out there with newer ships coming on line.

I picked Regent based upon much of what I have read on these boards -- but now I am not so sure .............

[Iamboatman]

All of the cruise lines take a very hard line on cancellations within the penalty period. It is impossible for a line to say, "OK, this reason is 'good enough'" and that one isn't. Trying to appease one person just opens the floodgates to having more disgruntled ones. Hence the rule, 'er 'um contract provision.

Also, there is "cancel for any reason" insurance offered by some third party insurance companies and even the cruise line's insurance would cover this situation.

Personally, as an attorney and TA, I would think the proper place to be making the argument is to the judge or, if necessary, the assignment judge above him. I do not think I have ever heard of a court ordering someone to loose thousands of dollars for a pre-paid vacation so they can appear for trial...though we don't have all the facts (Is this a first adjournment request? Is there injunctive relief sought? Are there issues which would cause this adjournment to delay the trial for x many more months? etc.)

I am not sure what Regent did when offering the insurance as far as explanation goes, but this seems like a situation where a good TA might have assisted in avoiding this problem.

[lvtotrvl1]

The cancellation penalties are clearly spelled out on your confirmation. I'm not sure why you would think that they now do not apply to your situation? As a TA I see many, many cases of completely unexpected situations arise. This is what insurance is for. I have seen the cruiselines sometime make exceptions, but very rarely.Do I always agree with the policies...no, but they are there for a reason. It doesn't matter whether it is a mass market cruise line or a luxury cruise line.

[Goofyisme]

Hope the OP enjoys whatever cruise line he chooses, but be advised that under similar circumstances I suspect their response will be the same as Regent's.

[cruiseluv]

As stated before, the insurance that covers cancellations "for any reason" is very expensive. I think it runs around 10-15% of the cost of the cruise. In addition , they usually cover only 75% of the nonrefundable portion (ie. of the penalty imposed by the cruise). This poster has said that at this point his penalty, if he cancels, is 25% of the cruise. So, had he taken this insurance he would have been only in a marginally better position that he is now.

If I were him , sure I would try pleading my case with a letter to higher management and would keep my fingers crossed that they agreed. But looking at it from the outside, I still say that in the long run it would be a poor business decision as it could alienate other customers who maybe didn't receive this kind of "breaK" when they had to cancel their cruise within the penalty phase.

[Friscorays]

The Regent cancellation policy is quite clear and I see no reason why it would not apply to this situation.

The poster is of course quite free to take his future business elsewhere. However, I doubt he will find a cruise line in any category which lets you cancel a cruise within 60 days of sailing without some monetary penalty.

I never have understood the mindset of those who seem to feel that rules apply to everyone except themselves. I'm sure others have had to cancel or reschedule trips secondary to a death in the family or personal illness and still been assessed the cancellation fee. A court date pales in comparison. It seems to me that you have learned a life lesson. Time to move on.

[skitravel]

I'm not sure if this applies in this situation, but I just looked at an AIG Travel Guard policy and it covers cancellation if "the insured or a traveling companion is subpoenaed".

[nimbex1970]

....I have never heard of case(and I am a lawyer) where the plaintiff or defense can show non cancellable arrangements that they can't get a reasonable postponement but then I don't practice in Florida. Perhaps if you get a letter from your lawyer and the court Regent may make an exception...[/quote]

Have your lawyers draft a change, I was called as a defendant in a suit from work, had a cruise planned (no insurance) and they rescheduled the (what ever the first date is that you meet with the lawyers and enter a plea), BUT, my cruise was planned before the supena and I had to prove it, they simply rescheduled. You are only talking two weeks, not months, this is a very realistic request, if necessary, have your lawyer play hardball, period.... a jury will act negatively upon your lack of presence and this will affect the outcome of the case.

Second, I was in jury duty last year, the defendant could not appear, having to work, when asked during jury selection if anyone would bear weight upon his absence, many people said yes... he should be here! Jury duty selection was cancelled that day because of all the "yes'es".

I won't take light of your issue and say "you should have, could have", my mom said this to me when our house burnt down (where we were staying for 3 months and didn't get renters insurance and lost EVERYTHING), it's a kick in the face, no kidding you know NOW.....

ugh, some people lack empathy, Honestly, the best way is to politely and as sweet as pecan pie, work your way up the chain of command and try to reach a bargin for a reschedule of dates. Keep trying, go through the channels through corporate, not corporate first and document each name and use it each time you call.

It's my understanding that you'll loose 50% of cost as of now, you've nothing to loose but some time trying to strike a reschedule deal, it seems well worth your time.

Hindsight is 20/20, we had cruise insurance when we canceled for our fire, not renters... how messed up is that? We all learn, but it doesn't have to be through our wallets, keep trying. Good luck, wish you well with both battles! Have your well paid lawyer WORK for you!

[skitravel]

I'm sorry, I should have been clearer. I knew the OP did not have insurance and was responding to his second post: "I did look into trip insurance but found that the coverages provided did not apply to "legal" matters"

This is a very unfortunate and upsetting situation and I hope there can be a favorable resolution.

[egret]

Interesting thread, maybe Flagship ought to add the lost portion of the cost to the remedy of the lawsuit. I always get the trip insurance because of the age of our parents and the problems I seem to frequently have with airlines. Never thought about legal actions.
I don't think comparing Regent to Ritz Carleton is appropriate because the service provided by Ritz doesn't match the service I get from Regent.(imho)
Not using an experienced Regent travel agent because you don't have one local is no excuse, (imho). I use one that is 800 miles away from where I live and get outstanding service every time.
Just had the urge to add my $.02.

[Flagship1]

To answer some of the questions raised by fellow members -- my attorney has already requested that the judge post-pone the trial date (first request) due to our cruise. His response - "No". My attorney has informed me that this is an old time judge who runs his court the way he wants to and that the NC Court of Appeals gives the local trial judges wide discretion in such areas. This judge considers construction lien cases to be simple and readily disposable.

Since we are parties to this lawsuit we are under no subpoena and have to appear.

One fact that may be lost in this thread that we are NOT asking for the return of our 25% penalty -- only that we are ALLOWED to transfer those funds to a future cruise. This was to be a wedding cruise (getting married Nov.23rd).

We are giving Regent almost 60 days notice and I find it hard to believe that our Penthouse A stateroom could not be resold in that time (we were waitlisted for it so obviously there is demand). I fail to see any harm in that to Regent nor are we asking to "open the floodgates." Each case should be considered on its own merits - here Regent is not even giving us the chance to plead our case (sorry again for the pun).

As with the airlines that charge a minimal "service fee" for a rebooking -- I have no problem but a 25% fee (which is what it would be in effect) is totally without merit -- especially in such a service industry (after all -- isn't that why people select a luxury high end cruise line -- for the service?)

As for the comment about using a TA 800 miles away -- that is fine and dandy if one knew such an agent. I would have liked to have known how a person finds such a TA the first time (for any cruise line).

One would think that going right to the source would pass the common sense test but maybe not.

Hey - life is a learning experience and I am smart enough to know that I still have a lot to learn and if I am unsuccessful with Regent, then I will chalk it up (unfortunately) as a hard lesson. Maybe I am a person who sees the glass half full rather than half empty as some others do......

[Dolebludger]

I agree that something more need to be done by Regent for Flagship.

On the legal side, it sounds as if Flagship is "ordered" by the judge to appear in court in conflict with the cruise, which would make his taking the cruise "illegal." If the judge has not signed such an order, I'm sure he would! Such an interventing illegality is grounds to rescend a contract, without penalty, in all jurisdictions I know.

On the business side, I am aware of car companies (especially luxury ones) taking care of problems AFTER the warranty period has expired, on a case-by-case basis. Mercedes owners whose engines blow at 50.050 miles after a 50,000 mile warranty tend to buy BMW the next time if Mercedes does not step up to the plate and fix the problem. I feel that ALL lux cruise lines (not only Regent) need to re-think their "hard and fast" unilateral cancellation policies. Without going into detail, these policies have created problems for me in the past. I don't know about these insurance policies that cover cancellation for "any reason", or by whom they are sold. But the policies that are promoted and sold by the lines themselves leave a lot of gaps, including the one Flagship fell into. It would not have mattered if he had bought travel insurance from Regent, as he wouldn't be covered here. Further, the policies reported by others above for these "any reason" travel policies carry excessive premiums. Purchasing them may not be a good choice. You have to purchase the policy a couple of days after booking. Most of us book well inadvance of the 120 day penalty period. And all travel insurance companies I know of have non-refundable premiums -- even if the cruise is cancelled before the 120 day period.

I can think of no "business reason" for ANY line to deny Flagship's request to cancel for the reasons he states, and have his fare applied to a future cruise. It's one of those rare "win-win" solutions. The line has plenty of time to fill the suite. And the line also get added revenue by getting a pre-sold booking on the second cruise. Between the first and second cruise, the line gets the interest off Flagship's money.

Some of you here also read the Silversea CC board. A rumor got started about a change in SS's smoking policy, and a thread on this resulted. A spokesman from SS posted and cleared the matter. I feel that a Regent spokesman should chime in here, and correct Regent's position, or at least explain why a luxury line should be so inflexible.

[cruiseluv]

One fact that may be lost in this thread that we are NOT asking for the return of our 25% penalty -- only that we are ALLOWED to transfer those funds to a future cruise. This was to be a wedding cruise (getting married Nov.23rd).

We are giving Regent almost 60 days notice and I find it hard to believe that our Penthouse A stateroom could not be resold in that time (we were waitlisted for it so obviously there is demand). I fail to see any harm in that to Regent nor are we asking to "open the floodgates." Each case should be considered on its own merits - here Regent is not even giving us the chance to plead our case (sorry again for the pun).



I don't think your point has been lost. You want a rollover of the monies you have paid the cruise line, in essence a credit for a future cruise. I understand your objective perfectly well. What I don't quite get is why you feel your case is special or has "merits". Didn't you know that you were party to a trial and were subject to be summoned when you booked/ paid for this cruise? If that contingency already existed you booked the cruise knowing that you were taking a risk.

You keep insisting that Regent should be able to do this or that with your cabin. I beg to differ. You don't know this and Regent won't know this until your cabin becomes available again. Your travel date is during slow season.

By all means, I encourage you to go up the chain of command and try to work a deal. If you succeed, congratulations! But I don't see anything special in your case that makes me say Regent should or must do something for you. Your case is no different that when my husband had a business emergency that precluded him for coming on a trip. Had he left for the vacation he would have been without a job by the time he came back! Should Regent also accommodate something like that? That's what is meant by "opening the floodgates". There are many situations out there that are valid reasons for people having to back out of a cruise, however, it doesn't make it "special" . Should all those "force majeure" kind of situations qualify for an exception?

[Friscorays]

[quote=Flagship1;11937637]
One fact that may be lost in this thread that we are NOT asking for the return of our 25% penalty -- only that we are ALLOWED to transfer those funds to a future cruise. quote]

It wouldn't really be a penalty if they allowed that would it?:)

I looked at some other cruise lines to see their policies. Some examples:

Seabourn: 25% at 90 to 46 days.
Crystal: 10% at 75 to 45 days.
Silversea: 20% at 60 to 31 days.
Lindblad: 50% at 59-30 days.

The Regent policy is in line with these. They also specify that the penalty applies whether they cabin is resold or not.

If Regent did make an exception for you, I would consider yourself very lucky. Taking offense when Regent doesn't make an exception for you and then badmouthing them for uniformly applying their own rules is something else entirely.

[Flagship1]

Thank you to Dolebludger http://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon7.gifas he stated my position probably a lot more clearer and logical than I have with my various postings.

Not asking for a free ride here -- but just some logical common sense consideration under these unique circumstances.

[Gail C]

To the OP...

Should all else fail, is it possible to give this trip to your parents or a valued friend. Could it be "sold" by you to someone, either at a discount or full price. Might be better than Regent possibly double dipping and you ending up with nothing. Just a thought...

[cruiseluv]

Thank you to Dolebludger http://boards.cruisecritic.com/images/icons/icon7.gifas he stated my position probably a lot more clearer and logical than I have with my various postings.

Not asking for a free ride here -- but just some logical common sense consideration under these unique circumstances.

I bet everybody that has had the misfortune of having to cancel feel their case qualifies as "unique" and deserving of compassion.

[smeyer418]

....
On the legal side, it sounds as if Flagship is "ordered" by the judge to appear in court in conflict with the cruise, which would make his taking the cruise "illegal." If the judge has not signed such an order, I'm sure he would! Such an interventing illegality is grounds to rescend a contract, without penalty, in all jurisdictions I know. ....


Nonsense. it doesn't make the contract or cruise illegal. It makes his failure to appear illegal, if he was subpoenaed.. It doesn't implicate the contract at all because the contract covered the eventuality of cancellation. Also he can always not appear-he isn't under subpoena he is the plaintiff and all that will happen is he might lose the case. Every Judge controls their own calendar and has discretion to allow postponements. Its when its an abuse of that discretion takes place that an appellate court will intervene. Clearly I view this as an abuse of discretion but I don't have all the facts only what we see here and as every lawyer will tell you appealing an abuse of discretion issue is always uncertain.

[Friscorays]

To the OP...

Should all else fail, is it possible to give this trip to your parents or a valued friend. Could it be "sold" by you to someone, either at a discount or full price. Might be better than Regent possibly double dipping and you ending up with nothing. Just a thought...


Regent Terms and Conditions:

"3. NON- TRANSFERABILITY/BINDING EFFECT:
This Ticket/Contract is valid only for the Passenger or Passengers named herein for the date and Vessel indicated. It may not be sold or transferred. "

I once prurchased a cruise for my father as a surprise gift. He didn't want to go so I lost a $100 changing the passenger name from Sr. to Jr (I went in his place). Lesson learned. I guess I should have started a thread at the time about how heartless Regent (then Radison) is....

[Goofyisme]

[quote=Flagship1;11937637]
One fact that may be lost in this thread that we are NOT asking for the return of our 25% penalty -- only that we are ALLOWED to transfer those funds to a future cruise. quote]

It wouldn't really be a penalty if they allowed that would it?:)

I looked at some other cruise lines to see their policies. Some examples:

Seabourn: 25% at 90 to 46 days.
Crystal: 10% at 75 to 45 days.
Silversea: 20% at 60 to 31 days.
Lindblad: 50% at 59-30 days.

The Regent policy is in line with these. They also specify that the penalty applies whether they cabin is resold or not.

If Regent did make an exception for you, I would consider yourself very lucky. Taking offense when Regent doesn't make an exception for you and then badmouthing them for uniformly applying their own rules is something else entirely.

Very well put.

[Dolebludger]

The thing is, NONE of us know when we are going to receive a summons to be a witness in a civil or criminal case in court. And none of us know when our home is going to sustain damage in something like the ice storm that hit our area right before our '02 PG cruise. We were a National Disaster Area, and trees had fallen on my roof leaving holes therein. My homeowner's carrier told me that the buckets and pans I could place under these holes in the attic would not be sufficient to extend my coverage to secondary damage in the event of more precipitation or melt off. I found that such events were NOT covered by the travel Insurance I bought through RSSC. And I had literally one day to tie the loose ends of this matter together. Fortunately, I knew a general contractor who was willing to take my job, and I called my property insurance company, and this was satisfactory to them.

I haven't checked very recently, but Flagship's cruise has been waitlisted for some time. This indicates that Regent probably wouldn't have much problem filling his suite.

Let there be no mistake. I'm a big advocate of purchasing travel insurance -- even though it leaves some gaps as to unavoilable impossibilities in taking the cruise that could (and do) happen. The cardinal point to me here is that, even if Flagship had purchased the travel insurance Regent offers and promotes, his situation would not have been covered. So the arguement "you should have bought travel insurance" is moot, IMO.

Like many of Regent's "base", I'm in my early 60's. This means I have time to travel. But it also means that I am in the "sandwich generation" which has had responsibilities forced upon it by very aged parents and young adult children (and grandchildren) alike. With this situation, the list of eventualities (not covered by traditional travel insurance) that could legally, physically and/or morally prevent me from going on a booked cruise grows. In this light, the "hard line" position of almost all cruise lines toward making case-by-case exceptions in their cancelation policies has had an effect the lines surely wouldn't like, if they knew of it. I used to cruise three times per year. Now, I cruise once per year or less, and chose my dates very carefully, to avoid any potential problems of this type, which virtually requires a crystal ball!

In summary on Flagship's problem, nobody should be penalized for obeying the law. Regent people read this board. We need an explanation.

[Dolebludger]

smeyer418.

In my state of Oklahoma, it is grounds to rescend a contract (with full return of consideration) if one's enjoyment of the benefits of that contract are barred by law -- including a court order. It does not mean that the cruise contract has become an illegal contract. Merely a rescendable contract on the grounds that its purpose has been totally frustrated and eliminated, by force of law.

What the state of Florida says about these situations, I haven't a clue. What I do know is that travel providers in general get away with a lot in the way of ignoring civil law, because the amounts involved are too small to justify litigation.

But this is not a legal forum. It is a cruise forum. A luxury line should accomodate if the customer has any possibility of grounds for what he/she wants. A business matter, not a legal one. The fact that other lines have similar policies is no excuse. They too, should shape up -- expecially as to the lux lines.

[Iamboatman]

I am a bit perplexed by the whole situation. I see it as the OP claiming the judge is unfair and Regent is unfair and come to a question, "Why?"

A construction lien case is - as noted - usually a pretty standard sort of affair. Is it that the matter really doesn't need the client present (I have no idea what the legal and/or factual issues are)? It is curious that it arose just days after the final payment was made...or was the notice prior and the OP figured the judge would move the date? Etc., etc.

I have people asking for exceptions all the time. Some of them are pretty legitimate and some are questionable in the extreme. Assuming the OP's participation in creating the problem is nil, it still begs the point that it was an avoidable circumstance if insurance was purchased and now the OP wants the risk/cost shifted to Regent knowing that wasn't the deal when he made it.

Regent may do something, but not because it has to or it is good business as the risks of every person can't be shifted away from them.

[TRadle]

Maybe this could be settled out of court. :)

[Flagship1]

Just because other cruise policies are the same does not mean they are right or better. If so, then there would be no room to "build a better mousetrap".

I always found that when in business I tried to set mine aside from the "rest of the pack". Businesses that cater to their customers will survive - those that do not will not.

I find it interesting that some commentators guess as to the facts involved (was the date already set when final payment made with OP hoping that the judge would move it later on...). That is not the case. The date was set Friday - Oct 5th. I promptly contacted my representative at Regent and was promptly told "sorry - out of luck". So much for customer service.

Once again I ask the question -- where is the harm to Regent?

[smeyer418]

This is not something that a CSR can change. As I suggested sit down and write a snail mail letter to Regent and put in the facts and ask nicely for what you want( a transfer) sometimes the powers who can make a decision do. Arguing the LAW or insulting them will get you nothing IMO...

You know something along the lines. ...I love Regent and have been disappointed because of a trial date that can't be moved I have to cancel. I called and asked that it be transferred to another sailing but was told that I couldn't. I do understand the policy but the judge even though it was on for the first time and we have never asked for a postponement has refused to grant an adjournment. I would very much like to travel on regent and can if they will transfer the cancellation fee to the next or whatever cruise...

I think I got the facts straight but you know more than me. I wouldn't say anything about Regents harm or a lawsuit...

[cruiseluv]

[QUOTE=Flagship1;11939401Once again I ask the question -- where is the harm to Regent?[/QUOTE]

Ok, this is the 3rd time. I don't think Regent has to prove that they have been "harmed" but these are two scenarios where they would be: they don't find a buyer for your cabin at this point (less than 60 days out) or have to discount it in order to attract a customer. In both those cases they would be harmed. I have no idea if there is a waitlist for your type of cabin or not, but neither do you. So you cannot say conclusively that "there is no harm". Maybe there is, maybe there isn't.

That's why your best course of action is to follow the advice of smeyer below.

really, it doesn't matter what we think, only what Regent thinks.

Good luck with your wedding.

[Dolebludger]

Flagship:

smeyer is right in his post above. Never mention litigation in your first several negotiation contacts -- especially since none of us know what governing Florida law is on this matter. One suggestion would also be to have the judge execute a written order requiring your attendance in court on the dates in question. Your attorneys should have no problem getting it, and you should send a certified copy of that order to Regent

[cruiseluv]

I haven't checked very recently, but Flagship's cruise has been waitlisted for some time. This indicates that Regent probably wouldn't have much problem filling his suite.




His cruise does not show as being "waitlisted".

[Friscorays]

Once again I ask the question -- where is the harm to Regent?

I assume that Regent, like other cruise lines, makes a considerable amount of money from selling travel insurance. If Regent gives everyone who offers up an excuse along the lines of "my dog ate my passport" their money back, there is no longer a reason to purchase the insurance and Regent loses a lot of money. I do not purchase travel insurance but would be perturbed if I did only to find that others can get the same benefits for free just by asking. To me, it is along the lines of trying to get health insurance once you are aware that you need costly surgery or trying to get car insurance to cover you for an accident that you just had. The dice didn't roll your way this time. Life occasionally has a way of doing that.

If there were no penalty for cancelling reservations, a person could freely make multiple reservations they have little or no intention of honoring just to keep that option available to them. For example, people do this for popular Disney World restaurant reservations: they make multiple reservations months in advance for the same times in different parks and think no harm is done when they cancel 10 minutes before the reservation time or simply don't show up. The reality is, some other family lost the opportunity to make that reservation and actually honor it. Perhaps a couple celebrating their 50th anniversary had their heart set on the cabin you booked but weren't able to get it as it was booked in your name. It is now too late for them to schedule their dream trip. Was harm done to them? Can a business of this type survive if they have no way of reliably knowing who is serious about honoring their commitment and who is not?

No one twisted your arm into making the reservation and the cancellation policy is quite clear. The rules apply to everyone, including me and you.

[Flagship1]

Thank you all for your comments. I totally agree that acting huffy or threatening legal action will never get one anywhere. I hope that my postings did not reflect that attitude -- as I wrote earlier -- you "get more bees with honey than with vinegar."

I do hope that Regent recognizes that some good will will go a long ways in a limited luxury cruise market (I am sure that if I was dealing with one of the "big boys" I would be wasting my breath).

Even though I may not agree with all of the comments posted, I do appreciate all of the members taking the time to put in their $.02 worth:)

[AtA]

Not using an experienced Regent travel agent because you don't have one local is no excuse, (imho). I use one that is 800 miles away from where I live and get outstanding service every time.
Just had the urge to add my $.02. Mine is in TX and I live in NY

[Goofyisme]

At what point do the rules actually apply? Is it 60 days?..or maybe 45 days?..or is it 30?...oh what the heck lets just make it 10 days notice before you incur a penalty.
You knew (or should have known the policy)
There are plenty of available insurance policies which would cover your situation.
If Regent grants your request they will have set an untenable precedent.
No one from Regent needs to come on this board and defend their well published policy.
There is no legal, business or moral obligation for them to change.
I know I might have to cancel a trip at very short notice so when I invest in a cruise I purchase insurance that covers my risks at the same time. Sometimes it pays off sometimes it doesn't but I make an informed decision and accept the outcome, maybe not with a smile but I still don't demand special treatment.
If OP is able to talk Regent into the special treatment he is requesting then more power to him, but as said by someone else then why should anyone ever purchase insurance?

[ronsex]

Regent Terms and Conditions:

"3. NON- TRANSFERABILITY/BINDING EFFECT:
This Ticket/Contract is valid only for the Passenger or Passengers named herein for the date and Vessel indicated. It may not be sold or transferred. "

I once prurchased a cruise for my father as a surprise gift. He didn't want to go so I lost a $100 changing the passenger name from Sr. to Jr (I went in his place). Lesson learned. I guess I should have started a thread at the time about how heartless Regent (then Radison) is....

A couple observations to share...

1) A friend who had booked a cabin single on Voyager took sick 21 days prior to the cruise and Regent gladly changed the booking to another friend who went in his place. No extra fee. They obviously deal with matters such as these with consideration. As a group we sail often on Regent and have never been disappointed..

2) The OP is not going to lose 100% of his money... only 25% which is not far from what he would have spent for the insurance.

3) Pleading his case to Regent might get them to reconsider but I seriously doubt it. I'm sure each person who has to cancel feels that their "reason" is exceptional... but imagine how many people on each and every cruise have to cancel. While I really dislike the policy - I fully understand it and experienced it first hand when I decided to cancel a cruise with Radisson shortly after 9/11. I did not want to fly and Radisson kept 25% of my single supplement booking.

Hopefully the OP can get his court date rescheduled.

Good luck.

[Dolebludger]

ronsex:

I well know how "hard nosed" cruise lines are about cancellation policies and dates. Early in the summer of '06, I booked two Silversea cruises -- one for Sept. '06 and one for Feb. '07. I try to calendar at "135 day out" time to allow me to consider whether there is ANY remote possibility that I may not be able to take the cruise. We really enjoyed our Sept. '06 cruise. But shortly thereafter, my "135 day warning" as to the Feb '07 cruise came up, and we decided that there was a "POTENTIAL POSSIBILITY" of an uninsurable conflict happening that would prevent us from taking that cruise. We would not know for sure until about 100 days out. So, I asked my TA to contact Silversea and ask them if there were any way we could get the "120 day rule" rolled back to 100 days. We fully expected SS to ask for some monetary consideration for this -- sort of like early embarkation. I was admittedly surprised by their response. Not only no, but heck no! We did the conservative thing, and canceled at 130 days out, and got a full refund. Sad thing is, the possibility of a conflict did not happen. I don't know whether SS sold our suite or not, and could care less. I don't know about any of you, but in this day and age, the life I live does not allow me to be certain of anything 120 days out! And many of these contingencies are not covered by traditional travel insurance. The result, again, is we are not booking as many cruises as in the past, because of the "hassle." If the lines want my demographic (fairly young retirees) to book fewer cruises, then they have their wish. If that is not their goal, then they are acting contrary to their goal.

In the event that any cruise line employees or officials are reading this thread, I have no specific recommendations for change in policy to make. I have only a general recommendation in this regard, which is to "lighten up" and "realize the human condition."

[JoAnne B]

I cruise two to three times a year and never buy travel insurance, feeling quite sure that self-insuring is a better way to go. Over the years we've saved a bundle. Sooner or later we'll get caught, and will accept the loss as I understood the terms when I booked.

That's not meant as being callous, just realistic. I've had close calls. Once I was called as a key expert witness on an important case at a time I was within penalty for a pricey cruise. The judge accepted a copy of my original booking and rescheduled the case. On a lengthy trip we received a call at Hotel Sanctuario at Macchu Picchu that my father in law had been taken to the hospital in critical condition. Flying home would have been at our expense with no refund for unused days from A & K. Fortunately, by the time we were actually able to get off the mountain he had stabilized and we were able to continue our trip. Recently my husband was connecting in Europe with the two legs on separate tickets (something that is getting harder and harder to avoid). His outbound was delayed due to "flight crew unavailability" and he missed his ongoing leg even with a 3-hour planned layover. Neither airline was willing to take responsibility (even though he was business class on the first leg) and he was only offered a high priced walk-up ticket. These things happen all the time.

Once my husband had to make a last minute trip to Paris on business and there were no business class seats available. He flew over coach (and I tagged along). When we got to the airport to check in for the return he learned that a business class seat was available. But he had to pay full fare and they wouldn't apply the cost of the existing ticket. And it was a return, so expired on the day of the trip....no way to apply it to another fare. He upgraded at his company's expense (at my urging) and threw away the old ticket. But to rub salt in the wound they gave his "paid for" seat to a very large man who made my economy cabin trip miserable.

Like it or not the cruise lines have overwhelming power in setting the terms of their contracts. They can change itineraries, sailing dates, charter the ship out from under reserved passengers, change your cabin, or even sell the ship and we passengers have no recourse. But the passenger's right to cancel is limited. We know that when we make our reservation. I suppose that shuffling hundreds (or even thousands) of cabins is an enormous challenge even without widespread cancellation/rebookings. Even hotels are moving more and more toward lower noncancellable rates.

Overall, I've found Regent to be responsive to individual client problems. Having said that I've been fortunate to have an excellent travel agent intervening to resolve issues. Perhaps you should approach your travel agent again to try to come to a mutually acceptable resolution. But keep in mind that they're within their rights to hold firm to the terms of their contract.

JoAnne B
Houston

[Dolebludger]

Joanne B:

Your post rings absolutely accurate in all respects. Long distance travel of all sorts has become a major pain. As recently as 1992, another couple traveled with us to Germany with nothing but airline reservations. We rented a car at the Munich airport and started our self-directed tour. We had some problems with hotel in some locations as (then) the Germans hadn't quite come to grips with the concept of "private bathrooms in every room", but we were able to get them in every location, with a little checking out. After two weeks, we returned the car to the Frankfort airport and flew home after a pretty good trip. We didn't even know about travel insurance. Today, we'd never consider such a thing!

The travel industry for such self-directed tours, and even for "mass market" land tours and cruises has just become "heck" (to use a word acceptable to this board -- I have others!). So what do those of us who want to avoid such things do? We book our travel in the "luxury market" hoping to find a more accommodating situation.

OK, so we have to pay more now for the same kind of thing we used to get for less 15 years ago. What else is new? But where do we go, when even the luxury travel market does not provide us the accommodation we want (and sometimes need)? That is the scary spectacle that threads like this raise, for us.

[TRadle]

The main reason we get insurance for our trips is that our medical insurance does not cover us at all outside of the country. It barely covers us in neighboring States! We make certain we have medical and accident insurance for our trips. We book our cruises well in advance so we also add, for a minimal cost, coverage in case we can’t get off work.

We have never purchased insurance through a cruise line. We use Travel Guard for land vacations and Access America for cruises.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

The medical insurance coverage is a trivial part of what you're paying. You could buy that separately. The main cost of the insurance on a cruise is cancellation insurance. (This is what my TA taught me.)

I can't imagine not buying it for a big-ticket item like a lengthy cruise, let alone a World Cruise without insurance. Although here I am about to go on my 7th Regent cruise, and I've never used ANY of my coverage so far.

[AtA]

My SO has used the trip cancellation policy twice and he wouldn't think of booking without it.

[JoAnne B]

I agree that medical coverage is a major concern. Given our constant travel schedule international emergency medical care was a significant factor in choosing a medicare supplement....yep, hubby turns 65 while on our upcoming cruise. It's a problem European travelers are used to dealing with, but we Americans usually assume we have coverage until medicare kicks in.

I should clarify that we do carry blanket coverage for medical emergencies while traveling. I've seen enough medical evacuations to know I don't want to pay for that hovering helicopter. Plus the shock of the bill incurred when my mother had to be life-flighted home after undergoing surgery out-of-state. What we expected to be a routine surgery became a crisis when she had a post-surgical stroke and her kidneys failed. We had to take her home before they started dialysis, or transporting her would not have been an option. Although we had no choice but to transport her home, her insurance said it was "our choice" and wouldn't pay a cent.

This coverage is pretty inexpensive and a good option to trip cancellation insurance for us.

JoAnne B
Houston

[south seas sue]

I had an occasion where baggage was rifled and items stolen. On a trip 4 years ago on the PG to Tahiti with my daughter, her bags were rifled while we were waiting at the hotel post-cruise to be taken to the airport. At that time their policy was to leave your bags outside to be taken to the bus. In between the time the bags were picked up, and we retrieved them at the airport, her cell phone and portable CD player were stolen. Fortunately when I made a claim to our insurance co. (I think it was Travel Guard - that's usually what I get), we did get some money back. Oh, and BTW, the hotel or Regent has changed their policy about leaving your bags outside your room.

I actually looked into what our medical insurance would cover out of the country. Apparently my HMO (Secure Horizons) will cover ONE claim per year for services out of the country. That is something to look into when you are travelling, and evaluating also what the insurance should cover, and whether you want to pay for Primary or Secondary insurance coverage.

As Dolebludger says, we won't travel without it. Many years ago I came down with a cold just prior to taking an arduous flight that ended in Cairo. I didn't cancel (and I probably did not have insurance anyway). By the time we landed in Cairo I had a terrible case of bronchitis, and although I tried to keep up with our tour, I took to my bed on the Nile boat....

Too many things can happen in our world for me to feel safe without insurance coverage. Of course, I'm getting old, so health issues are paramount to us now.....

Glenda

[AtA]

Glenda, you're not getting old. You're becoming even more refined...like a good wine. :) \

[Judith02]

I realize this is Regent not Crystal and this is a court appearance, not illness but I thought I'd relay this information to you.

We always take insurance, but not from the cruise line. This summer my husband was undergoing tests to diagnose a very serious condition. He first saw a doctor and started the tests about six weeks prior to the cruise we were taking. They reimbursed us every cent because it was not a pre-existing condition and it came up after the penalty phase started.

Our travel agent advised us in the future to take Crystal's insurance because now that it is a pre-existing condition, since we didn't pay for the (non-Crystal) insurance when we first booked, the company would not reimburse us if we canceled. BUT with Crystal's insurance, if their insurance carrier does not pay if we cancel after the penalty phase kicks in, then Crystal would roll the amount of payment on to another cruise. We still would not be reimbursed but we would not lose anything.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

That's an interesting and creative compromise on Crystal's part, and one I would be content with for this kind of situation. We haven't entered the "pre-existing sweepstakes" yet, but probably will soon enough.

[smeyer418]

I realize this is Regent not Crystal and this is a court appearance, not illness but I thought I'd relay this information to you.

We always take insurance, but not from the cruise line. This summer my husband was undergoing tests to diagnose a very serious condition. He first saw a doctor and started the tests about six weeks prior to the cruise we were taking. They reimbursed us every cent because it was not a pre-existing condition and it came up after the penalty phase started.

Our travel agent advised us in the future to take Crystal's insurance because now that it is a pre-existing condition, since we didn't pay for the (non-Crystal) insurance when we first booked, the company would not reimburse us if we canceled. BUT with Crystal's insurance, if their insurance carrier does not pay if we cancel after the penalty phase kicks in, then Crystal would roll the amount of payment on to another cruise. We still would not be reimbursed but we would not lose anything.

This last isn't necessarily true. Many non cruise line insurance will cover pre-existing conditions if you buy it within a certain number of days of your first payment to the cruise line. Many travel agents aren't really very good about insurance. Look at www.insuremytrip.com for more complete info.

and most cruise line insurance won't cover your self purchased airline tickets which many non cruise line insurance will....

[cruiseluv]

HTH Worldwide offers coverage for pre-existing conditions if you buy it within 24 hours of FINAL PAYMENT.

[smeyer418]

HTH Worldwide offers coverage for pre-existing conditions if you buy it within 24 hours of FINAL PAYMENT.

and it provides decent coverage at a decent price. The point I made is that TA's really don't have a good grasp on what is available in insurance products.

[Judith02]

I did state that using Crystal's insurance would be the plan if we did not buy the other travel insurance within the specified time for pre-existing conditions.

[seahorse]

and it provides decent coverage at a decent price. The point I made is that TA's really don't have a good grasp on what is available in insurance products.

:eek: I beg your pardon:p You could say some TA`s:rolleyes: I make it a point to get the best insurance for my clients.......a lot of times clients don`t have a good grasp on what they NEED.

I would say that most on-line "agents" (I do say that loosely) do not know or care what insurance clients need.

[smeyer418]

:eek: I beg your pardon:p You could say some TA`s:rolleyes: I make it a point to get the best insurance for my clients.......a lot of times clients don`t have a good grasp on what they NEED.

I would say that most on-line "agents" (I do say that loosely) do not know or care what insurance clients need.
Most would have been a better choice but it still isn't your specialty :)

[TRadle]

Most would have been a better choice but it still isn't your specialty :)


Whose specialty is it? :rolleyes:

My TA has an in-depth understanding of travel insurance and provides excellent advice on the different choices based on our needs and the type of travel we are planning. She sees it as part of her job as a travel agent.

[Iamboatman]

A good TA should have a solid understanding of the policies that are available, but TAs are not lawyers or insurance brokers, so be sure to read the info on the policies yourself. So, let the TA assist you in narrowing down choices and then YOU make the decision.

[smeyer418]

Whose specialty is it? :rolleyes:

My TA has an in-depth understanding of travel insurance and provides excellent advice on the different choices based on our needs and the type of travel we are planning. She sees it as part of her job as a travel agent.

Clearly not the TA who told the client that only the cruise insurance will cover pre-existing conditions.

While it may be part of her job, its not where she makes her money or her training. I would use the websites that specialize in it.

[Dolebludger]

Well just a moment here. Under some circumstances, the cruise line's insurance is the only one that will cover pre-existing conditions. Example. All the independent carriers I could find would cover pre-existing conditions only if the insurance were purchased within 14 or 15 days of deposit. After that, pre-existing conditions would be covered only if the person had not seen a doctor for them, nor had a medication change for them in a designated period before policy purchase -- for 60 to 120 days depending on policy. My wife has a pre-existing condition which is monitored by her doctor more frequently than every 60 days. I don't like to buy the travel insurance too far before final payment date, as if I chose to cancel in the non-penalty period, the premiums are forfeited.

The cruise line's insurance had a different rule. Pre-existing conditions are covered if the policy is purchased by final payment date.

So, while it is untrue to say that only the line's insurance will cover pre-existing conditions, the rules are different for the independent policies compared to the line's policy. It is not uncommon for a person to find himself "caught" in that difference, so that the line's policy IS the only one covering pre-existing conditions. I found myself in that situation just yesterday.

[dfb]

Richard,
Right now, both CSA and HTH waive the pre-existing conditions clause if the policy is purchased with 24-hours of FINAL payment. Policies changes all the time but, this is true for both these insurers today.
Debbie

[cruiseluv]

Well just a moment here. Under some circumstances, the cruise line's insurance is the only one that will cover pre-existing conditions. Example. All the independent carriers I could find would cover pre-existing conditions only if the insurance were purchased within 14 or 15 days of deposit. After that, pre-existing conditions would be covered only if the person had not seen a doctor for them, nor had a medication change for them in a designated period before policy purchase -- for 60 to 120 days depending on policy. My wife has a pre-existing condition which is monitored by her doctor more frequently than every 60 days. I don't like to buy the travel insurance too far before final payment date, as if I chose to cancel in the non-penalty period, the premiums are forfeited.


As Debbie indicates in her post , you are wrong on your comment. Both CSA and HTH offer it within 24 hrs of FINAL payment. I just reserached this a couple of months ago , as as of then it was being offered.

[Wendy The Wanderer]

Hey Debbie, that's good to know for the future!

[Iamboatman]

Be careful as to what is covered...and how it is covered. Also check the performance of the companies. Just a bit of something to think about when the deal is a bit too good.

[smeyer418]

Also remember what is insurance and travel reimbursement. Some companies claim they are travel reimbursement companies and not insurance. The difference is they don't have to be licensed in the State you live and your state insurance commissioner doesn't have licensing control over them....(which includes minimum financial controls responsibility and access to your state's consumer protection rules and financial responsibility fund if any....

[Flagship1]

:) Thank you to all of the CruiseCritic members who have taken the time to both read and reply to my initial thread (especially Dolebludger).

As you can see from my :) Regent stepped up to the plate and promptly addressed my situation after I contacted them by letter. Regent understood the unique situation that we were in and resolved it in a satisfactory manner.

As a result we have rebooked with Regent for a longer and more expensive cruise on the Navigator (2/25/08). Regent's personal service and attention has earned them my business.

By going through this process I have learned much about both the pros and cons of insurance.

If there are any other CruiseCritic members on this February cruise, I would enjoy meeting with you on the ship.

Thanks again!

[Dolebludger]

Flagship:

Very happy to hear this matter has been resolved in a reasonable manner. Regent has always been reasonable with me, and it is good to see that they have been reasonable with you. There really needs to be some revamping in the standard cruise line cancellation policy to take into account situations wherein the booked guest is ordered to appear in court in conflict with the cruise dates. Perhaps somebody from Regent will see this and consider it.

[TedC]

:) Thank you to all of the CruiseCritic members who have taken the time to both read and reply to my initial thread (especially Dolebludger).

As you can see from my :) Regent stepped up to the plate and promptly addressed my situation after I contacted them by letter. Regent understood the unique situation that we were in and resolved it in a satisfactory manner.

As a result we have rebooked with Regent for a longer and more expensive cruise on the Navigator (2/25/08). Regent's personal service and attention has earned them my business.

By going through this process I have learned much about both the pros and cons of insurance.

If there are any other CruiseCritic members on this February cruise, I would enjoy meeting with you on the ship.

Thanks again!

It's reassuring Regent did the right thing, I expected they would.

Now we'll all keep our fingers crossed and hope the court action isn't postponed to late Feb!

[AtA]

I'm glad to hear that Regent did right by you. I have also found they would step up to the plate. For the Navigator, I'd seriously look into insurance and I'd also consider getting a good travel agent. Our agent has always been on top of things. When our fare for our New Years cruise last year dropped, she made sure we got the discount. It's those little things and her knowledge that makes it easier for us.

[canadagal]

HTH Worldwide offers coverage for pre-existing conditions if you buy it within 24 hours of FINAL PAYMENT.

Wendy, and other Canucks take note: HTH Worldwide does not sell to Canadians. I emailed them for a quote and was told that they don't sell to us.
Pat

[Wendy The Wanderer]

Thanks Pat, good to know. So far we're ok on existing conditions, but not for long I suspect. :(

[Jade13]

Holland America Lines policy for Cancel for Any Reason would have paid you back 95% in cash on your credit card from final payment until 31 days. At 30 days until 24 hours before departure you would get back 90% in cash. It is he only cruiseoline policy that I have seen like this. Other 3rd party policys offer 75% back, but it sounds like you would be getting that anyway.

[Jade13]

:) Thank you to all of the CruiseCritic members who have taken the time to both read and reply to my initial thread (especially Dolebludger).

As you can see from my :) Regent stepped up to the plate and promptly addressed my situation after I contacted them by letter. Regent understood the unique situation that we were in and resolved it in a satisfactory manner.

As a result we have rebooked with Regent for a longer and more expensive cruise on the Navigator (2/25/08). Regent's personal service and attention has earned them my business.

By going through this process I have learned much about both the pros and cons of insurance.

If there are any other CruiseCritic members on this February cruise, I would enjoy meeting with you on the ship.

Thanks again!

Great!

[AngieS]

As I write this, my husband and I should be on board the Voyager in the Med celebrating our 20th Wedding anniversary with another couple who are our dearest friends. One week before we were due to fly to Rome, our 17 year old son had to be hospitalized. We had taken out insurance with Access America so we called our friends and all agreed that we would make a decision over the weekend pending his diagnosis. He was diagnosed as bipolar, and had to be in the hospital for 5 days and then had to be in an outpatient program for another 9 days from 8-5 every day. My husband's parents would not have been able to deal with all this, we were very overwhelmed and knew this was where we needed to be. Well guess what? Access America does not cover cancellation for any mental illness!! So we are supposed to leave our minor child in hospital and go on vacation? They told us to file the paperwork, it will be denied and we can appeal! Regent are not obliged to help us in any way as the insurance policy was not through their Regent Care. We even asked them if we could give the cruise to friends and they said no. Our friends had to go on without us and were so sad having to do this as we really wanted to do the cruise together. On top of having to deal with our son's illness, we now stand to lose thousands of dollars. So I wanted to warn everyone out there to read any insurance policy you buy from top to bottom. I think insurance companies have so many clauses that it is almost not worthwhile taking out a policy.

[AtA]

Angie, did you write the president of Regent or did you just go to their customer service? This is a case where I believe it's necessary to go to the top. Do you have a good TA who can go to bat for you? It seems to me if you're willing to move the booking to another cruise, they should allow it same as they did for flagship. You did what you were supposed to do.

Another option? Get a note from the hospital stating that it's a medical disorder, because once you're doing meds, it technically is. You're dealing with a medical doctor, correct?

I feel for you and your family and wish you all the best in dealing with a difficult situation. I'm sure with your love and support your son will begin to deal with his disability.

[AngieS]

Yes we do have a TA and she is going to bat for us with Regent even though it is not their problem as we cancelled within a week of departure. Regent have been very nice and have said if we get absolutely nothing from Access America they may consider doing something for us. They did refund our port charges. My son is doing fantastically well, the doc seems to have hit the nail on the head as regards the meds so in that respect we couldn't be better. He has said every day he could not have gotten through this without our love and support and there was no way we could leave him here in the care of the in-laws! There will be other cruises. It was more throwing the money down the tubes that bothered us.
Thanks for your advice.

[PaulaJK]

I am sorry to learn of your need to cancel as well as your
son's illness, the latter every parent's anxiety.

Do NOT allow your insurance company to claim that this
is an emotional illness............there is much strong evidence
to support that bipolar is a organically based biochemical imbalance.
Hence, it is a physical illness. It is not the same as someone becoming
upset over a broken prom date or the loss of a job promotion. It is
treated w. biochemical agents. I hope that you will push your
insurance company on this. I strongly suspect that they will lose!

[AtA]

Paula said it better than I did. This is not something treatable with just a pat on the back from a weekly session from a therapist (although that will help also), but requires meds like any other medical condition.

[AngieS]

Hi everyone
I am happy to report that Access America paid us out for the cancellation of our cruise! I think the fact that our son was hospitalized and was a minor played a role in it. We initially got refused and then sent in an appeal. It was worth filing all the paperwork and getting the doctor to write something for us!

[dfb]

Angie, That is very good news and thanks for checking back to update us.
Debbie

[cruiseluv]

Angie,

I am so glad that in the end the insurance co responded. And of course, great news that your son responded to treatment! For sure your decision was the correct one.

[basedow]

We put down our deposit in November for an August cruise with the final payment due in April. Our TA urges us to purchase trip insurance immediately because of the "preexisting conditions" clause. We have only controlled chronic conditions at this point and do not feel this would be called a preexisting condition. I believe if we had to cancel for medical reasons, it would not be for these conditions.

Don't you think we can wait to purchase insurance right before final payment in April, as this would cover the 90 day preexisting conditions language?

Thank you. I hope I have described this clearly!

[dfb]

Basedow,
Generally, your window of opportunity choices for qualifying for a "pre-existing conditions clause waiver" is either at first deposit or at final payment. I see no advantage to you to being insurance right now. HTH and CSA are 2 insurers that have had the option to purchase at final payment and waiver the pre-exist clause. The waiver qualification is the only way to rule out any discussion of what/when, etc. if you have to cancel or file a claim. Good luck, Debbie

[basedow]

Thanks Debbie!:)