Is HAL jumping the Gun on Jeanne

[Searanger]

I found it interesting today when checking the HAL website that they have already posted the possibility that Port Everglades might be closed today and or tomorrow.

None of the other cruise lines have posted this fact on their websites yet. I know HAL was criticised during FRANCES about being slow to repond.

Looks like they don't want to be last this time....Question: Does their post scare people into cancelling now rather then taking a look a see approach.

[hdawson]

Darned if they do and darned if they don't.

[jcike1980]

Good For Hal!! My Grandfather Told Me Years Ago To Keep Others First And Foremost And You'll Always Be Taken Care Of. Good Move On Hal's Part. Jcike

[taszmom]

A lot of cruise guests fly in the day prior. I think they are doing the best they can under the circumstances to say "Standby". We have no idea who Jeanne will impact.

[sail7seas]

Exactly, hdawson. There's no way they can win!!! Someone is ready to pounce on them for responding too quickly; someone else for responding too slowly.


HAL has managed to run their company for over 130 years. I think they have a fair idea how to safely run a cruiseline.

Let's let the professionals make those sort of operating decisions until such time as any of us have the training/education/experience to do it better????

If a passenger 'makes a hasty decision' to cancel, well........they have that right.

[RedmondCruiser]

With Hurricanes I hope they er on the side of caution. Remember the Fantome was lost due to misscalculating where a Hurricane would go. Also in 2001 the Sun Princess got beat up trying to skirt too close to a storm in the Pacific. I think HAL is doing the right thing.

[Travel Angel]

Just for the record.... Disney Cruiseline has postponed their Sept. 26, 2004 sailing aboard the "Wonder" and will depart on the 27th for a 3 night cruise in lieu of what could occur with Hurrican Jeannes landfall.

So it isn't just HAL that is concerned..... Just heard from a client that the Mariner of the Seas will be delayed getting back to port until Monday as well.

My opinion for what it is worth.... cruiselines are doing everything possible to keep clients informed and are concerned for the passengers safety as well.

Let them do their job in the best way they see fit... they are just trying to cover all the possibilities given when and where landfall will occur. I dont believe we could do a better job than the cruiselines have done in this hurricane season..... My Kudos to ALL Cruiselines (and TA's) during this busy hurricane season...... we have all had our hands full thats fer sure !

[gizmo]

Jumping the gun? No way. At least this time it appears they are doing thing right.
This may be a result of "A Lesson Learned" !

[nhrich]

HAL is definitely not jumping the gun. From www.portcanaveral.org -
Port Canaveral will close at noon, Saturday, September 25, to all land and waterside movement. The evacuation of the Canaveral Harbor must be completed and all vessels out of the harbor no later than 10:00 a.m. Please click here for details of the evacuation order issued for small vessels under 500 gross tons.

The Port Authority administration office is scheduled to re-open on Monday, September 27, subject to the severity of the storm.

For the most current information on Port operations, please call the public advisory information line at (321) 783-7831 and choose option #3. All information is subject to change.

Information regarding cruise itineraries should be directed to the cruise lines.

[Golfgrl1911]

We are taking the 9:30a.m. flight out of Cleveland to Ft. Lauderdale tomorrow morning, could have taken a flight this afternoon but figured that IF the "Z" can't make it into port we would just be holed up in a hotel room for a few days.......with rain, wind, etc.....well the weather here in Akron is beautiful so might as well enjoy that for another day!! Just spoke with a fellow cruiser 1/2 an hour ago and she said that it's gorgeous there in FLL!! Go figure!! NO ONE is making any definites about this storm......port, cruise lines, airports........it is literally a wait and see............absolutely maddening!! Chef Nancy

[hdawson]

Why are so many anxious to question the wisdom of the cruiseline with all their experience and technology? These storms are costing the cruiselines pretty big bucks. They haven't lost a guest or a ship.

[Searanger]

Gizmo you said it best. There reaction might be that of lesson learned from 3 weeks ago. I think it's great that they are taking a proactive approach this time. Go back in the posts ...Sept 3rd to 6th...as you will see Seattle was slow in keeping their guests apprised of the situation. This time they seem to be taking the lead.

[sail7seas]

The only caution about folks proceeding to travel to FLL and planning to spend their pre-planned pre-cruise stays in various hotels. When Frances was approaching South Florida and Port Everglades was closed, a mandatory evacuation was ordered.


That meant that hotels had to be emptied. Guests had to leave their hotels and go where???? Shelters??? Careful evaluation by each traveler is warranted and proper. Only you know your own risk tolerance and level of discomfort and inconvenience you are will to endure.

[Searanger]

Oh no...Looks like Port Everglades will be closed tonight at 6pm according to the Port Everglades website.

[HeatherInFlorida]

Keep in mind that the closing of the port probably doesn't totally ride on Jeanne's path, but also on the fact that at the very least she is producing extremely high seas and rip tides. This will be experienced along the entire Florida coast.

And unfortunately we are not going to know until the very last minute ... sometime late tomorrow afternoon or evening ... whether she is going to "make the turn" or not.

I think HAL is the one to be congratulated for being cautious while perhaps other cruiselines will wait until the last minute and the passengers be damned.

[Krazy Kruizers]

I just checked the Port Everglades cite and besides it saying that the port will close at 6 PM for all incoming ships, it also said that cruise passengers should contact their cruise lines.

I think the time this was posted was around 12:40 this afternoon.

[Searanger]

The Carnival Triumph has already had it itinerary changed out of Miami from a Saturday departure to a Monday departure. And the compensation...(30 discount and a $100.00 shipboard credit and a $100.00 credit to change your air) They didn't even mention a full refund in their press release.

[LittleBit0522]

At least, HAL is on top of it this time.

[KAKcruiser]

I just talked to HAL and they said that an official statement would be issued in a few hours. But, unofficially, they are thinking that the ship will not come in until Monday. They are working on a compensation package now.

[taszmom]

CCL has already changed the Triumph out of Miami to depart on Monday instead of tomorrow...most likely others will follow.

[onboard]

First, let me say I am extremely impressed with the information on this board. I wish I found this site earlier. Second, let me say that I am extremely unimpressed with the way HAL is handling this situation. This is our first cruise with HAL but our 4th cruise overall. We have family coming in to take care of our kids and a red-eye flight out tonight for this cruise. We need this information in a timely manner and I think their lack of response is rude and unprofessional. The people I have spoken to on the phone simply tell me to "check the website" and when I point out that their website is well past the time of update I am told they simply have no further information. I find this unacceptable.

We decided to book another cruise this morning on Royal to the Riviera for 9/26. Of course, we would rather be in the Caribbean but it doesn't look like that was meant to be. Thank goodness for trip insurance :) HAL's lack of decisiveness may very well end up ruining the week for many people who may have had the opportunity to make other arrangements. I know that I personally will never book a cruise with them again because of the way their customer service department has handled this and I would assume that people who get stuck in FLL because HAL decided to push the limits when Disney, Royal Caribbean and a few others have already delayed until Monday and given cruisers warnings not to come will have ill feelings towards HAL. Not good marketing no matter how good the compensation package is :(

[hdawson]

onboard. I don't think your travel insurance will cover you other than expenses for travel delay, as long as your cruise sails. I assume you have third pary insurance and in most cases a change of mind at the last minute is not a covered reason. Of course I can't say for sure. Even the meteoroligist can't say for certain what Jeane will do and when. As I said early in the thread, darned if the do and darned if they don't.
Some will say they jumped the gun to make decisions and some will say they waited too long. Either way, these darned storms cost the lines big bucks.

[sail7seas]

First, let me say I am extremely impressed with the information on this board. I wish I found this site earlier. Second, let me say that I am extremely unimpressed with the way HAL is handling this situation. This is our first cruise with HAL but our 4th cruise overall. We have family coming in to take care of our kids and a red-eye flight out tonight for this cruise. We need this information in a timely manner and I think their lack of response is rude and unprofessional. The people I have spoken to on the phone simply tell me to "check the website" and when I point out that their website is well past the time of update I am told they simply have no further information. I find this unacceptable.

We decided to book another cruise this morning on Royal to the Riviera for 9/26. Of course, we would rather be in the Caribbean but it doesn't look like that was meant to be. Thank goodness for trip insurance :) HAL's lack of decisiveness may very well end up ruining the week for many people who may have had the opportunity to make other arrangements. I know that I personally will never book a cruise with them again because of the way their customer service department has handled this and I would assume that people who get stuck in FLL because HAL decided to push the limits when Disney, Royal Caribbean and a few others have already delayed until Monday and given cruisers warnings not to come will have ill feelings towards HAL. Not good marketing no matter how good the compensation package is :(


The National Hurricane Center does not know exactly when or where the hurricane will make land. All meteorologists all over the local and national news do not know where or when Jeanne will make landfall.

But you expect that Mother Nature somehow contacted HAL and gave them this information.

Get Real!!! IMO

What do you expect?
While I agree it is nerve-wracking and you have personal decisions to make. That's life!!!

Good luck!

I agree it is questionable if regular travel insurance will cover your voluntarily cancelling your cruise. If you wrote HAL insurance, you will get most of your money back as their coverage allows you to cancel for any reason.

[Bill S]

Hal has posted its plans for the Zuiderdam-it will arrive in Port Everglades on Monday, and all information is now available on the HAL website under the box with Hurricane Update.

[HeatherInFlorida]

When I read Onboard's post earlier I was going to be silent. But if Sail7 dares to go there, why not I:o ?

I am astounded at this reaction from Onboard. If you were sitting here in West Palm watching how hard they are trying to pinpoint Jeanne's arrival, watching all the different weather highs, lows, etc., moving and changing every hour, you might not be so quick to judge HAL or anyone else. This is Mother Nature!!! Nobody knows what's going to happen. And you demand answers "in a timely manner"!! Unbelievable!!!

Try sitting here as you know what's about to happen, try sitting here being told that now it looks like it will hit dead on with 110 mph or higher winds at the exact same hour on the exact same day as 3 weeks ago, try envisioning the next several days, weeks probably, without power and phone (not even cell because the towers go too). Try all that and mull it over as you lounge comfortably on the Royal to the Riviera and feel badly that it wasn't the Caribbean. Poor, poor you.

There's a tiny, evil part of me that secretly hopes you don't get your bloody money back. So go ahead, everyone, flame me!!! I really don't care. Chances are I won't be on here to read it for awhile anyway unless we get very very lucky. So why even waste your breath or tire your fingers. I have to go hardboil eggs and make sure I have enough peanut butter.

[hdawson]

Heather. All you good folks are in our thoughts. Again.

[Cruiseoften]

Get Real!!! IMO


onboard - I agree with S7S - in the meantime, have you read the following -

Breaking news

Hurricane Update
September 24, 2004, - 1:00 pm, PDT

The safety of our passengers and crew is our hightest priority. Guests aboard the cruise that departed on September 18th will enjoy Saturday, September 25th, and Sunday, September 26th, at sea away from the impact of Jeanne. The ship was scheduled to arrive in Port Everglades (Fort Lauderdale) at the conclusion of its cruise on Saturday, September 25th. As noted above, this will now be delayed until Monday morning, September 27th.

ms Zuiderdam cruise that was to depart on Saturday, September 25th

The Saturday, September 25th sailing of the ms Zuiderdam will now depart on Monday, September 27th at 8:00 pm. The cruise itinerary has been changed with calls in Key West and Cozumel and Costa Maya, Mexico. The revised itinerary is as follows:
Date
Location
Arrive
Depart
Monday, Sept 27 Fort Lauderdale
8 pm
Tuesday, Sept 28 Key West, FL
8 am
3 pm
Wednesday, Sept 29 Cozumel, Mexico
11 am
11 pm
Thursday, Sept 30 Costa Maya, Mexico
8 am
6 pm
Friday, Oct 1 at sea

Saturday, Oct 2 Fort Lauderdale
8 am

Guests booked on the Saturday, September 25th sailing of the ms Zuiderdam have the following options:
* Sail the revised 5-day itinerary and receive a Holland America Line future travel discount in the amount of 25 percent of the cruise fare paid in addition to a per person ship board credit*. Amount based on cabin category purchased as follows:
* Inside saterooms (categories NN-I): $200 per-person
* Outside staterooms (categories H-C): $225 per-person
* Deluxe verandah staterooms (categories BC-A): $250 per-person
* Superior verandah suites (category SS): $325 per-person
* Deluxe verandah suites (category S): $425 per-person
* Penthouse verandah suites (category PS): $600 per-person
* 3rd/4th guests sharing stateroom: $100 per-person

* Guests opting not to sail will receive a full cash refund. Please contact the Holland America Line reservations center at 800-577-1728 by 3:00 pm PDT Sunday, September 26th to receive this refund.

[justhere]

no need for me to address what onboard said as I, too, totally agree with s7s and heather. i just have to add that it's too bad that HAL didn't tell onboard that the Z isn't sailing until Monday and then let her sail on-time. i know that's a mean thing to say but it would serve him/her right for expecting HAL to know more than Mother Nature.

The only good thing is that people like onboard always have unrealistic expectations and are doomed to be disappointed, frustrated and angry when things don't go as expected. And fortunately there will often be times when things don't go as expected so onboard will often be disappointed, frustrated and angry....oh well...too bad!!!

[JDee]

CruiseOften:

Thanks for the HAL update. Certainly a very generous compensation option for both those who choose to sail and also for those who choose to cancel.

My thoughts and prayers for those who will wind up in Jeanne's path. The worst that we can expect in the Tampa Bay area are just some moderate winds and more rain, at least for now.

[the2ofus]

How often does it need to be said that when you book a cruise in Hurricane season you are gambling that the weather will cooperate. You need to assess your own tolerance for uncertainty. If you can't handle it, don't book it!!

[onboard]

The only good thing is that people like onboard always have unrealistic expectations and are doomed to be disappointed, frustrated and angry when things don't go as expected. And fortunately there will often be times when things don't go as expected so onboard will often be disappointed, frustrated and angry....oh well...too bad!!!



Actually, I think that I am one of the few people that was booked on this cruise that won't be left disappointed, frustrated or angry. Their final statement made me very happy as it made the difference in me getting 90% minus my insurance or 100% plus my insurance and I am still on the way to the Riviera because I was wise enough to look back at what happened three weeks ago. IF I was one of those people who waited until the very last minute when they posted the statement I would be furious because obviously my week wouldn't be half as nice as it will be now. HAL could have been much more responsible IMO and given its cruisers, at least, the courtesy of updating their website when they said they would.



And as for "poor, poor, me", and truly I am a nice person, and I mean this in the best possible way--we all make choices in life. I choose to live in a state that is affected very little by weather: no snow, no tornados, no hurricanes, hardly any rain. So, while I sympathize with those that keep getting hit by hurricanes, you do make the choice to live there.



I made a VERY poor decision to book a Caribbean cruise this time of year and also to book on HAL. Lesson learned. I will rebook the Caribbean on a different line sometime next year.

Off to pack for Mexico. Happy Cruising to all and good luck to those in FL.

[DaddyBob]

Heather,

YOU GO GIRL!!!! I feel exactly as you do!

Daddy Bob

[imsulin]

RCI has also posted warnings about the possible closure of Port Everglades and the revised itineraries for their ships leaving from Pt. Canaveral and Pt. Everglades.

[HeatherInFlorida]

I choose to live in a state that is affected very little by weather: no snow, no tornados, no hurricanes, hardly any rain. So, while I sympathize with those that keep getting hit by hurricanes, you do make the choice to live there.

Truly, I mean no disrespect, but there is no town, no state, no country that is safe from everything. I hope you never in your lifetime find that out.

And also, just as a point of information, I wasn't complaining. I was merely astounded by your statement. I was fully aware when we moved here 4 years ago that hurricanes would threaten. But I think it's important to point out that in all the years that history has been written, there is no year that 4 hurricanes have hit Florida. There are no more hurricanes than usual this year; they're just all hitting us because of an unusually stubborn Bermuda High.

This summer will be written about for years to come. I do think that even if we're "stupid" enough to live in the Sunshine State we lovingly call Paradise, getting hit by 2-3 hurricanes within weeks of each other is a little too much by anyone's standards.

And not to belabor the point, but I'd rather live here with the threat of hurricanes than live where it hardly ever rains, never snows, and basically has no weather. But that is, as you say, a personal choice.

[justhere]

Actually, I think that I am one of the few people that was booked on this cruise that won't be left disappointed, frustrated or angry.
You missed the point. You already stated in your first post how upset you were. My point is that you will be again. Maybe not now or next week but whenever you blame a company for something out of their control, you will again experience the same headaches. I'm sure HAL held off as long as they could to try and inconvenience the least number of people possible. They had 3 choices:
1. do nothing - you would have been upset as they did nothing
2. state that cruise would leave on time - you would be upset when they eventually changed the sail date
3. state that the cruise would leave on Monday - you would be upset if the port wasn't closed and they could have left on time.
They really couldn't do anything until the Port Everglades port authority acted.


I made a VERY poor decision to book a Caribbean cruise this time of year and also to book on HAL. Lesson learned. I will rebook the Caribbean on a different line sometime next year.

Doesn't sound like you made a poor decision at all. Look at the number of Caribbean cruises that sail each and every hurricane season with no problem. The number affected is relatively small. Additionally, you hedged your bets by getting insurance so all-in-all, not a bad deal on your part. What makes no sense though is to blame HAL. Any cruise line sailing out of Port Everglades is affected the same way. HAL had info on their website early stating that changes may be possible depending on the storms track.

If I was CEO at HAL, I would be concerned that I lost a customer and my question to you would be: "What could I have reasonably done differently that would have made you a satisfied customer?"

As it seems that HAL did what they reasonably could do to minimize incovenience and still keep everyone safe, I'd hazard a guess that you couldn't reasonably answer that question. And whenever you answer that with an unreasonable response, there isn't a company out there that could have satisfied your needs. So I stand by my statement that you will again be disappointed, frustrated and angry.

I don't work for HAL and I mean no disrespect. Just want you to file this in the back of your mind and think about it next time a situation occurs that is beyond anyone's control.

[Golfgrl1911]

Some of you regulars are a real trip! :rolleyes:

[Golfgrl1911]

Go ahead flame ME because I have an opinion. I don't really care. I'm going on my cruise. I have met some wonderful people on this website that I will probably have for a long time. And have read some posts from some that I would definately avoid.

[CanSail]

Dear S7S & Heather,
Respectively we beg don't start again! Everyones emotions are frayed at times like this, sometimes we must just look at someones anger or upset during posting and realize that it is just that...emotions, and sometimes fears.
Not one persons suffering during trying times is more terrible then the next person, but how we view it to ourselves is how we must accept the situation.
Please just be polite.
Prayers to all.

[onboard]

I always purchase cruise insurance for health reasons. I am never able to guarantee that I will be able to sail on an expected date. I certainly understand situations beyond my, or a companies control. However, that does not excuse their responsibilty to the passengers here. I still maintain that HAL did not take the earlier warnings serious enough and held out to the last possible moment in hopes of getting passengers aboard for their own fiscal benefit instead of the cruisers best interest.

IMO, HAL could have and should have kept to their stated promise on their website and kept cruisers better informed of their situation as it developed. If a website update is promised at 1 pm psd, it should not take until 3 pm psd for the information to be updated, especially this close to sail time. When a cruiser calls and asks for information, they should not be re-directed to a stale website. The CSR's at HAL should have had more information than "oh, the website said there would be an update when?".

So to answer your question on what I would have wanted HAL to do better:
1)communicate as promised
2) offer options further in advance to cruisers who were becoming increasingly uncomfortable with the port authority warnings of impending closure.

If #1 and 2 had been accomplished perhaps HAL would have left me, and I am sure others, with a much more professional image of them.

In discussing all of this, aren't we forgetting that Disney and Royal Caribbean were much quicker than HAL to delay some of the FL sailings they have for this weekend? One has to wonder if HAL was not privy to the same information they were?

[gizmo]

I think some people missed Onboards point totally. I didn't read her original post as she was blaming Hal for the hurricane nor this last one. I don't think she expected Mother Nature to contact Hal.

It appears other cruise lines were faster to respond. Hal did respond much faster this time, for which I gave them credit for earlier, but there appears to be room for much improvement with customer service and promised times for web updates.

I watched the weather LAST Sunday morning. There was a 60% chance that Jeanne would do exactly what she did. The weather guy went through the entire thing about the 360 degree turn, and having it come in and hit Florida. All cruise lines should have been totally aware of this prediction.

I realize cruise lines cannot make decisions from weather reports a week out, but plans should be in place so they can react in a timely manner. Hal did it better this time, but like I said earlier there is a lot of room for improvement with customer service.

[cusyl]

The Caribbean Princess is having a repeat of my recent cruise during Frances. I got an email offering 5 days for $299. and they arent coming into FLL until Monday. I am afraid this hurricane season is going to be very costly for all the cruiselines.

[doone]

My TA is booked on the Zuiderdam for today, sounds like she isn't going to be sailing on her til Monday. Just her luck, well I am sure she'll have some stories to tell me when she returns, if she didn't cancel it all together. Stay tuned...my TA's name is Jeanne, spelled just like the hurricane!!!!!!!! A bit ironic.

[superstein61]

I think some people missed Onboards point totally. I didn't read her original post as she was blaming Hal for the hurricane nor this last one. I don't think she expected Mother Nature to contact Hal.

It appears other cruise lines were faster to respond. Hal did respond much faster this time, for which I gave them credit for earlier, but there appears to be room for much improvement with customer service and promised times for web updates.

I watched the weather LAST Sunday morning. There was a 60% chance that Jeanne would do exactly what she did. The weather guy went through the entire thing about the 360 degree turn, and having it come in and hit Florida. All cruise lines should have been totally aware of this prediction.

I realize cruise lines cannot make decisions from weather reports a week out, but plans should be in place so they can react in a timely manner. Hal did it better this time, but like I said earlier there is a lot of room for improvement with customer service.I agree Gizmo - I read Onboard's post the same way you did - and saw nothing wrong with it.

And while I sympathize with and feel sorry for anyone affected by poor weather - quite frankly all this crying from Floridians about being hit a 4th time is getting quite tiresome.

Everyone make's choices in life including where to live - and they must learn to live with the consequences of those choices. Furthermore - Florida is a BIG state. Some parts of the state may have taken multiple hits - but most were hit once. So people - quit the oooh boo hoo crap - its unfair we are going to be hit for the 4th time.

Hell - Western PA has been hit by more of these hurricanes than some of you in FLA.

[localady]

I agree Gizmo - I read Onboard's post the same way you did - and saw nothing wrong with it.

And while I sympathize with and feel sorry for anyone affected by poor weather - quite frankly all this crying from Floridians about being hit a 4th time is getting quite tiresome.

Everyone make's choices in life including where to live - and they must learn to live with the consequences of those choices. Furthermore - Florida is a BIG state. Some parts of the state may have taken multiple hits - but most were hit once. So people - quit the oooh boo hoo crap - its unfair we are going to be hit for the 4th time.

Hell - Western PA has been hit by more of these hurricanes than some of you in FLA.
As usual, this statement shows the incredible tact you show in most of your postings.:eek:

I believe the last time one state had 4 hurricanes come ashore in one year was in the late 1800's in Texas. :( Peoples lives and livelhoods have been destroyed, it seems to me that it is a time for ALL to show compassion for those affected!!!!

[HeatherInFlorida]

I agree Gizmo - I read Onboard's post the same way you did - and saw nothing wrong with it.

And while I sympathize with and feel sorry for anyone affected by poor weather - quite frankly all this crying from Floridians about being hit a 4th time is getting quite tiresome.

Everyone make's choices in life including where to live - and they must learn to live with the consequences of those choices. Furthermore - Florida is a BIG state. Some parts of the state may have taken multiple hits - but most were hit once. So people - quit the oooh boo hoo crap - its unfair we are going to be hit for the 4th time.

Hell - Western PA has been hit by more of these hurricanes than some of you in FLA.Again, Superstein, I'm up to here with your nasty posts. I have to question my stupidity in answering, but this is the very last time. Why don't you at least get your facts straight before posting such drivel.

As it happens there is not one single particle of this state that has not been affected by all these hurricanes and associated flooding. Some areas have been hit 2 and 3 times and for some folks a possible 4th.

Western PA does not even know the meaning of being "hit" by a hurricane. By the time it gets to you it's a wound down, heavy rain hitter with a little tropical breeze. Puleeeez.

I really think it's time you let up or everyone here will hit the "ignore" button and be done with you. Before I shut down and get ready for the disaster about to hit, I will most certainly make that a priority. So no point in responding, because I'm done here with you forever.

Localady, you are ever so much more informed than SS61. He obviously is too busy thinking up hurtful things to say than to watch the news or read a paper. The hurricanes this year have broken all records. Thanks, Localady, for your post.

[Roadguy]

:rolleyes: Hell - Western PA has been hit by more of these hurricanes than some of you in FLA.
Please tell Me when it was still a Hurricane when it got to western Pa?...:rolleyes:

Bein here in Ga, been thru the leftovers of Frances and Ivan and neither was a hurricane when it headed your way.

Onboard,
Have a great time in Mexico!!
I guess Hal's loss is RCL's gain.:rolleyes:

[hdawson]

Heather I agree with you. The last time there was any significant presence of a hurricane in Pa I think was Hugo. Of course for them it certainly wasn't a hurricane by the time the system arrived. A major rain event but that was it. Gee. That must have been 15 yrs ago. My thoughts are with all the folks in Florida this very unusual season.

[boards]

I already have him on ignore

[HeatherInFlorida]

Roadguy, I knew I loved you:) ! And thanks, hdawson, ... so nice of you. Boards, you sure knew what you were doing. I gave him the benefit of the doubt, but now I'm done. Sometimes it takes a heavy bat;) .

[nealberk]

People, please calm down and remember that we all have options. If you want a perfect experience with no surprises just plan your trips when
1) It is not hurricane season
2) Airlines do not have major employee contracts unresolved
3) There are no potential catestrophic problems with family and friends.

The amount of stress you are willing to experience dictates the amount of freedom you have with those parameters.

Other options that inluence the amount of stress you might experience include
1) Booking the trip with an experienced travel agent
2) Booking airfare through the cruise line
3) Getting insurance.

Of course these options will affect the price of your cruise. To some people they are worth it, to others they are not.

It is all a matter of tradeoffs, price, convenience, responsibility. Make your choices and live with them.

[justhere]

I really don't mean to drag this thing out and I certainly don't mean to get into a you-know-what contest, so, onboard, I would just ask that you think about the following:

I still maintain that HAL did not take the earlier warnings serious enough and held out to the last possible moment in hopes of getting passengers aboard for their own fiscal benefit instead of the cruisers best interest.
let's look at that statement. HAL benefits fiscally when a customer is happy, satisfied and perceives a benefit greater than the amount of money they had to pay for that benefit (i.e. value for their dollar). Obviously this is true of any company. Additionally, HAL has a fudiciary responsibility to its stockholders, employees and customers.

While holding out may benefit HAL in the long term, at least by waiting and trying NOT to change itineraries, they are in fact looking out for the cruisers best interest because it's in the cruisers best interest if nothing changes and everyone sails as planned. Yes, it is also in HAL's best interest but the two go hand in hand.

Keep in mind that this storm has taken an unusual track and that makes the whole decision making process a little tough. Additionally, disseminating the info to their employees does take a little time, especially when things keep changing. When you spoke to a CSR that seemed to be less than helpful, did you ask to speak with a supervisor? Did you give HAL a chance to show you that their care about your business and value you as a customer?

My point is that if you dismiss a company as not worthy of your business because one employee was less than helpful on the phone, that's your perogative. However, you can bet that at some point the company that you switch to is going to have a less than stellar employee and you are going to dismiss that company too. You end up in a revolving door situation and guess what? You become frustrated and angry because there isn't a company out there that is going to give the right answer 100% of the time. If you give a company a chance to address a problem you have had, then you will see whether or not that company is worthy of your dollar. Jumping ship (no pun intended) at the drop of a hat doesn't really solve your problem.


So to answer your question on what I would have wanted HAL to do better:
1)communicate as promised
2) offer options further in advance to cruisers who were becoming increasingly uncomfortable with the port authority warnings of impending closure.

If #1 and 2 had been accomplished perhaps HAL would have left me, and I am sure others, with a much more professional image of them.
#1, like I said, if you're not comfortable with the info, ask for a supervisor and state your case.
#2 you simply cannot expect a company to know the comfort level of each and every customer. Until such time as the port was closed, the plan was to sail as scheduled. Why would they offer any type of option just because some people might have butterflies in their stomach not knowing what was going to happen?

[Roadwork]

Keep in mind that this storm has taken an unusual track and that makes the whole decision making process a little tough. Additionally, disseminating the info to their employees does take a little time, especially when things keep changing.

I can't agree with this. The possibility of the unusual track has been known for a week. I saw it on NOAA earlier this week. As Gizmo said, a plan should have been in place.
In this day and age getting information to employees takes 1 email. Updating a web site does not take very long. It appears that the people making the decisions just can't make up their minds !!!

[superstein61]

And while I sympathize with and feel sorry for anyone affected by poor weather - quite frankly all this crying from Floridians about being hit a 4th time is getting quite tiresome.

Everyone make's choices in life including where to live - and they must learn to live with the consequences of those choices. Furthermore - Florida is a BIG state. Some parts of the state may have taken multiple hits - but most were hit once. So people - quit the oooh boo hoo crap - its unfair we are going to be hit for the 4th time.

Hell - Western PA has been hit by more of these hurricanes than some of you in FLA.
As usual, this statement shows the incredible tact you show in most of your postings.:eek:

I believe the last time one state had 4 hurricanes come ashore in one year was in the late 1800's in Texas. :( Peoples lives and livelhoods have been destroyed, it seems to me that it is a time for ALL to show compassion for those affected!!!!Sometimes the truth hurts LocalLady. you may not like my "tact" - but its the truth. I do sympathize with all those who have been affected. hell - I have been working for the past week helping flood victims in Western PA - more than half of the whiners on the board are doing.

the fact is - Not all of Florida has been hit 4 times. And there are other places that have been hit as bad or worse. So all this crying over Florida is getting quite tiresome. Sorry - but thats the hard truth.

[superstein61]

Again, Superstein, I'm up to here with your nasty posts. I have to question my stupidity in answering, but this is the very last time. Why don't you at least get your facts straight before posting such drivel.

As it happens there is not one single particle of this state that has not been affected by all these hurricanes and associated flooding. Some areas have been hit 2 and 3 times and for some folks a possible 4th.

Western PA does not even know the meaning of being "hit" by a hurricane. By the time it gets to you it's a wound down, heavy rain hitter with a little tropical breeze. Puleeeez.[quote/]

to say this just shows how little you truly know Heather. I feel sorry for you. tell the thousands of folks who have lost everything in Western PA its just a little tropical breeze. tell the 100's of business wiped out completly. tell the 3 towns so devastated its hard to even describe.

tell the people who spent the nights on roof waiting to be rescued because flood waters were up to their 2nd floor.

tell the families of those who had people die in the floods in Western PA

And I could go on - but it won't help because you have this myopic view of the world that focuses on you and you alone.


[quote]Localady, you are ever so much more informed than SS61. He obviously is too busy thinking up hurtful things to say than to watch the news or read a paper. .Actually I am too busy helping people dig out from the destruction than to be on here constantly boo hooing about oooh - stay away from Florida - we don't deserve it.

[superstein61]

:rolleyes:
Please tell Me when it was still a Hurricane when it got to western Pa?...:rolleyes:

The remnants of Ivan caused much of pennsylvania to be declared a federal disaster area. pittsburgh and its surrounding communities were one of the worst areas hit.

Wake up and read before making comments like you have

[superstein61]

Heather I agree with you. The last time there was any significant presence of a hurricane in Pa I think was Hugo. Of course for them it certainly wasn't a hurricane by the time the system arrived. A major rain event but that was it. Gee. That must have been 15 yrs ago. My thoughts are with all the folks in Florida this very unusual season.
Another person who has no clue what has happened elsewhere in the country the past few weeks

[Roadwork]

I also sympathize with all that have been effected by the storms.

Superstein has a point. There has been a considerable amount of whining about Florida on this board. Look at Haiti, 1100 people have been killed and no one even mentions this and many people have had damage and devastation here in the states outside of Florida.

I don't see Superstein's post as nasty, I think of it as blunt.
On the other hand there are nasty and rude posts to the original poster. I think Golfgrl is right. :)

[superstein61]

I also sympathize with all that have been effected by the storms.

Superstein has a point. There has been a considerable amount of whining about Florida on this board. Look at Haiti, 1100 people have been killed and no one even mentions this and many people have had damage and devastation here in the states outside of Florida.

I don't see Superstein's post as nasty, I think of it as blunt.
On the other hand there are nasty and rude posts to the original poster. I think Golfgrl is right. :)
thank you Roadwork - and let me clarify something - I wish no ill will upon anyone. And my sensitivity to other areas may be higher given the time I have spent the past week helping many unfortunate others here in PA (luckily I was not impacted). But these hurricanes have impacted people all over the place. keep that in mind

[Host Walt]

OK, folks. Many people in many places have been devastated by this incredibly bad hurricane season, and it looks like it won't be over, even after Jeanne.

Let's not dwell on the comparative devastation of these disasters; rather let's all be sensitive to the fact that almost everyone has been negatively affected in some manner and nerves are understandably raw.

Thanks.

[justhere]

I can't agree with this. The possibility of the unusual track has been known for a week. I saw it on NOAA earlier this week. As Gizmo said, a plan should have been in place.
In this day and age getting information to employees takes 1 email. Updating a web site does not take very long. It appears that the people making the decisions just can't make up their minds !!!
Ok, so for a week they knew that they didn't know where the storm was heading...:rolleyes: so actually you did agree with me that the storm took an unusual track. And a plan was in place. The plan was to see which way Jeanne headed and adjust from there. HAL even stated on their site something to the effect that they would have to adjust as the storm adjusted. Short of a crystal ball, what would you have them do? Change/cancel the cruise when it may not be necessary....i'm sure that would make a lot of people happy.

While it may only take 1 email to let the employees know, management has to have something to put in that email. If they are waiting for the port authority to act, then there was no more to say. Additionally, if all the CSR's stop to read their email, who's going to answer the phone? That may sound strange but unless you've worked in/managed a call center environment it may not make sense. That's why I suggested asking for a supervisor as they would have the info prior to the CSR's.

[Roadwork]

Ok, so for a week they knew that they didn't know where the storm was heading...:rolleyes: so actually you did agree with me that the storm took an unusual track. And a plan was in place. The plan was to see which way Jeanne headed and adjust from there. HAL even stated on their site something to the effect that they would have to adjust as the storm adjusted. Short of a crystal ball, what would you have them do? Change/cancel the cruise when it may not be necessary....i'm sure that would make a lot of people happy.No, I do not agree they didn't know where the storm was heading. Of course no one really knows what these storms are going to do, but there are tools used to predict the possibilities. There was a strong possibility of the hurricane turning west and hitting Florida.

Other cruise lines made decisions earlier. Hal appeared to have waited a little longer and this was the original complaint. They did make a good attempt by posting on their web site. Where they failed was saying there would be an update and they didn't do it. Now, there is a possibility of time zone misunderstandings. I do not know what time zone Hal referred to on their site.

While it may only take 1 email to let the employees know, management has to have something to put in that email. If they are waiting for the port authority to act, then there was no more to say. Additionally, if all the CSR's stop to read their email, who's going to answer the phone? That may sound strange but unless you've worked in/managed a call center environment it may not make sense. That's why I suggested asking for a supervisor as they would have the info prior to the CSR's.I have worked in a call center. I am fully aware of what takes place. Suggesting a person talk to a supervisor is ususally the correct thing to do but in this case would you really want 1000 or more people calling and asking for a supervisor? The web site should have been updated. This would have stopped some of the calls from coming in. The CSR's should be informed of what is going on and not give out answers that make them appear to be brain dead. An email should be set to all employees instructing them what to tell people who are calling about their cruise. It does not take that long to read an email.
I agree management needs something to put in the emails, and this should have been handled earlier in the week. I would assume there was a plan, but they were a little late going with it.

[Roadguy]

If I write in BIG LETTERS and add color, does that make my opinion MORE valid?:confused:

[justhere]

If I write in BIG LETTERS and add color, does that make my opinion MORE valid?:confused: how do you make an opinion more valid? it's an opinion, you're entitled to it no matter what it is.

HAL did wait a little longer as the port authority hadn't made their decision yet so HAL was simply trying to stick to the original itineraries and keep everyone happy...nothing wrong with that.

They said an update would be posted at 1300 PDT but I believe it wasn't posted until around 1500 PDT. Yes, they should have updated at 1300 saying "no news yet, check back at 1500".

1000 people wouldn't have called asking for a supervisor, only those chomping at the bit when the 1300 update didn't occur. And of the 1000 people that might have called, most of them probably got a better answer from the CSR and didn't need to speak with a supervisor.


I agree management needs something to put in the emails, and this should have been handled earlier in the week. I would assume there was a plan, but they were a little late going with it.
As I said, how do you put something in email earlier in the week when you don't know exactly where and when the storm will hit and whether or not the port will be closed. I'm sure HAL had contingencies but had to wait for the port authority to act. If HAL had diverted/delayed the ship and the port stayed open just think how many upset customers there would be then.

Anyway, my whole point was that onboard posted that they wouldn't use HAL ever again. It boiled down to one bad phone call and if that's all it takes to upset that person and vow never to use a company again, then they are no doubt going to be switching companies a lot and getting frustrated each and every time.

Well, I think they've actually cooked and served the horse by now.....;)

[specialthing1]

I to was going to stay out of this but after 12 hrs of hearing youre ruining my trip i need answers now to make my plans and apologising over and over im sorry ive told you all we know, well fly again when air trafic control says its safe. Hats off to thoes of you who understand HAL and the airlines dont control the weather or we'd put all the storms in the middle of nowhere at the same time not spread them out and head them for land. We do feel bad that plans are having to change as most of us plan our cruises for months but we also know the challenges of cruiseing during huricane season. We in the travel industry will try our best to send these next storms up the middle of the atlantic well away from the cruise areas, we promise.

[stillfrantic]

Good for them! I was on the 9/4 trip and was so inconvenienced and upset at their too slow approach to making decisions. I'm glad they made a decision early and made it a decision that would fit the potential scenarios. The slow to acknowledge, the slow to update, and the mid term changes were incredibely frustrating and made plans very difficult. They did the right thing in the opinion of a person who has BTDT.

[Roadwork]

Well, I think they've actually cooked and served the horse by now.....;)
Touche.......... the horse is history;)