notamermaid

To the present day. With the change in weather we have had snow return even to Rhineland-Palatinate. In Bavaria snow is still falling above 500m altitude. The temperatures will rise again soon. The rain has made Pfelling gauge rise to 411cm. That is a good buffer for spring days without rain. notamermaid

Hmm, looking at the list of ports in the thread "Beyond the standard ports" I notice Neuwied again. They are still no further with their plans from what I have heard as there are legal hurdles I did not know about. Those have been explained to me recently by a local. The details had not made it into the newspapers. So back to the statistics. Autumn is the most likely time to have low water on the Rhine, but it can happen from July onwards. For commercial traffic low water is declared when the level on Kaub gauge reaches 150cm. You may see articles in business papers reporting on it. That has no impact on sailing for river cruise ships as regards draft, which means other than perhaps going a bit more slowly and carefully and having the odd difficulty at a low landing stage things will be fine. Kaub gauge goes down further basically every year, sometimes a lot. I do not want to go into details but just in case someone says to you "I went on a river cruise in 2018, it was awful" I would like to explain this most abysmal year for river cruising (whoever says to you "awful" is right). 2018 has been the worst year ever in river cruising and commercial traffic had an awful year, too. Apart from the curiosity factor (no consolation) the year was bad for locals, too. We had the driest and hottest weather for a long, long time and in that autumn Kaub got a new historical record for low water. River cruising came almost to a standstill. No ship of 110m(!) length made it through the Rhine Gorge for days and the 135m ships, well, I do not remember details, but they did not sail for some time. No chance. The river being so low the shallow section extended further than Mainz. This is the year at Kaub, the second half of 2018 the figures were in double digits only for a long time: Just to explain again, these figures are the gauge, a marker at the side of the river. To get the depth of the navigation channel, captains "translate" this into the real figures. The record was declared by the authorities on 22 October 2018 to be 25cm. notamermaid

That's right, just ignore advice! Seriously, most of the time things go well and the comfort of the ships and the delight of seeing the Rhine Gorge is worth the risk. An adventure that will most likely be an amazing trip without interruption, especially as you are going in July. I hardly ever spotted the Crystal ships on the river so I guess it will not look too weird to see the ex-Crystal Bach on my river with her slightly changed livery. Luxury in store for you in July. If anyone is interested in the takeover: https://www.travelweekly.com/River-Cruising/Uniworld-charter-two-former-Crystal-river-ships The stop in Karlsruhe is unusual on your itinerary, one of those places I called "beyond the standard": https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2516698-rhine-beyond-the-standard-ports/ notamermaid

Pontac, you posted several wines of differing origin that you had with your meals. Were they part of your drinks package or the standard fare? Were you happy with them either way? notamermaid

To the length of the problem on the Rhine. The shallowest section is around Kaub so that there is in effect only a stretch of about 30km that needs bridging in a coach and with a ship swap. That is in the Rhine Gorge. But the nature of the river and it logistics makes it difficult just to do 30km. So you can use a landing stage at Rüdesheim and at Braubach or Lahnstein, which extends the process to something like 45km. You can look up the exact distances by looking at the Rhine kilometres. With so many ships needing docking locations that scenario will only work for a few ships at any one time. Next solution is Mainz to Koblenz when Rüdesheim is full or too shallow. The shallow part extends upstream first, then downstream. So most of the time Rüdesheim, Speyer, Mainz, etc. and then at the other end Koblenz will be your ports of call. It gets more complicated to organize with longer distances, so depending on excursion and company, the ship swap is not just 90 minutes by coach (the driving time through the Gorge) but up to six hours or a real day trip. How long can the situation last? The river being too shallow can be a time frame of 12 hours to one week (and more, like in 2018). It happens every year for commercial shipping, that means barges and tankers adjust their load. The impact on river cruising differs every year, there have been a few years when the level was good enough for all ships to sail through the Rhine Gorge. River cruise ships with a length of 105m or less can almost always sail without problems. notamermaid

To the OP. You will be on the Rhine but you have not actually stated from where to where I think, i.e. your itinerary with Avalon. I assume you will be sailing through the Rhine Gorge at one end of which Rüdesheim is situated. All in all I would say most cruisers that have reported back were happy with the excursions they took. Specifically as regards the option of either going into the Black Forest or going to Alsace (that is Colmar, etc.) I would say the Alsace one is coming across as being better/more enjoyable. In case you need to make choice. Of course, it will also depend on where your interests lie. notamermaid

@pontac You are perfectly right about my perspective. But added to that is my inclination to steer away from wine towns as such when they are crowded. For me Rüdesheim is just a small town with two streets to look at. I prefer the slightly less crowded Bernkastel-Kues and Eltville and Bacharach, etc. Just a different vibe. For view, the Niederwalddenkmal above Rüdesheim is great, I enjoyed it many years ago. notamermaid

Have had the problem with coffee in England in recent years. Me "I would like a coffee, please". Attendant "Americano?" Etc, etc. Me: " A normal coffee, please." (with impatient puzzled expression). I mean, when I go to a café I order coffee. What else?? Okay, could be a hot chocolate in winter. As regards the Rüdesheimer Kaffee. It is the same principle as Irish Coffee. Basically alcohol, sugar, coffee and cream. Not my cup of tea [pun intended]. I do not really like Rüdesheim. But the mechanical music machines museum does look interesting with the right person doing the explanation. From what I have read over the years and seen on land tours, other excursions are superior and other places more culturally interesting than Rüdesheim. Edit: For me, Bingen on the other side of the river at Rüdesheim is a more interesting place for various reasons. Rüdesheim is touristy old world charm with wine and merriment. With the Viking Rhine Getaway it seems that the long Black Forest excursion is the least favourite. End edit. notamermaid

In the Rhine thread https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2984992-rhine-water-levels-2024-and-similar-topics/page/9/#comments @euro. asked a question. I answered partly with statistics on the Danube. I am posting this again here with more explanation in figures. Here goes, the Bavarian Danube (Pfelling gauge) water levels in the first half of August (1st to 15th): 2018 - no sailing of 135m ships possible in the shallow parts of Germany, bad in Hungary as well. Figure range at Pfelling was 227cm to 259cm. 2019 - not too bad, sailing restricted, Hungary was okay as far as I know. Figure range at Pfelling was 274cm to 458cm. 2020 - bad start, fine from 5 August Figure range at Pfelling was 247cm to 557cm. 2021 - perfect Figure range at Pfelling was 344cm to 497cm. 2022 - see 2018 Figure range at Pfelling was 217cm to 266cm. 2023 - perfect Figure range at Pfelling was 322cm to 486cm. Note the huge range in 2020, it brought the river to a high level that impacted sailing under the bridge at Passau. This made the graph look like this: That is not considered bad flooding, it is a regular occurrence, it is just that one bridge at Passau does not have enough headroom for ships with a high superstructure. The surge took the river less than 24 hours to get from "fine" to "not sailing under the bridge". So how did the month of August progress in those years, was the second half different? 2018 - no, just as bad 2019 - fluctuating and minimally better 2020 - after the surge the river went down maddeningly fast to a too low level for many ships but recovered at the end of the month 2021 - levels continued to be stable and perfect for sailing 2022 - the level recovered fast and after a surge was "wobbly" as regards the ability to sail but okay for some ships 2023 - went high and at the end of the month a river traffic ban was issued. So, basically, errrr, no way of knowing what the river at Pfelling will do from one week to the next... notamermaid

A German cruise blog also talks of a deviation for the person's cruise with Viva Cruises and their stop at Nijmegen do to construction work at Arnhem. notamermaid

Going back all the way to the Celts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhenus_Pater Rhenus bicornis of the Romans, a sculptured head: https://www.rheinische-geschichte.lvr.de/Epochen-und-Themen/Themen/der-rhein-im-denken-der-roemer/DE-2086/lido/5d63a243246c37.82044604 The two horns are said to represent the fact that the Rhine has two branches in the Netherlands. notamermaid

Indeed. The abysmal year of 2018 seems to have brought in more awareness with companies that people prefer to be informed prior to sailing and from what I have gathered there have been more notifications and e-mails sent to passengers. Also, passengers are generally more aware of what may be in store. However, it is not a given that you will be informed or that the company can inform you. Say you leave on 10 August to a cruise starting in Amsterdam and all river levels are fine. You sail the Rhine and by the time you are on the Main river the weather is really dry and the level in the Danube drops. A hydrologist may have been able to tell you of the risk on 9 August but neither he nor the company can tell you for sure on 11 August that you cannot sail on 14 August. It really depends on what level the river is at when you leave on 10 August and then you can still not be certain either way. Likewise it is the same coming from Budapest and then finding the Rhine is too low. We have had passengers report that the captain announced in the morning that they would not be able to sail the Danube (at Pfelling) the same evening. Lots of scenarios... It is not an exact science but usually both rivers are low in a similar time frame as we share weather patterns overall. However, the "cut-off point" for sailing or not sailing on the German Danube is often reached before the corresponding level on the German Rhine (in the Rhine Gorge that is). An important difference between the two rivers is that on the Rhine the shallow area just extends in length as the river level drops whereas on the Danube you get two shallow sections, first one in Germany and then one in Hungary around Budapest (scenarios further down from Hungary I am not familiar with, low water happens there as well though). Major ways of avoiding both Rhine and Danube shallows: 1. Choose a route that does not include Pfelling (mentioned before and explained in the Danube thread). 2. Do not choose a "Grand European" itinerary. 3. Choose a route that does not include the Rhine Gorge (which you may prefer to keep in the itinerary because it is the most scenic part (tough luck!)). 4. Choose a 110m ship over a 135m ship. As a rule of thumb that gives you a tiny advantage of lower draft and could be the difference between sailing and not sailing. Finally, my "disclaimer". I cannot and will not give figures of when ships cannot sail. That is a range of figures depending on each individual ship and its captain and may even vary going upstream or downstream. However, from past years' experiences and authorities commenting in the news I will give hints and tips about it when the rivers get low. Flooding is different so there are figures declared by authorities to be the maximum when ships are allowed to sail. Just before that level for a specific section of river is reached captains know a river traffic ban will be issued. Another problem if you want to call it that is, by the way, the fact that as the river level drops on the Rhine, so do the landing stages and the available water for the ship hull at the embankments. You may have to dock away from the prime spots. @euro. I am taking the liberty of using your question to put a bit more statistics in the Danube thread. notamermaid

The Rhine as regards water levels is the "easier" of the two rivers to sail in August, but there can certainly be low water. So let us have a look at the Danube. Track record of first half of the month in: 2018 - no sailing of 135m ships possible in the shallow parts of Germany, bad in Hungary as well. 2019 - not too bad, sailing restricted, Hungary was okay as far as I know. 2020 - bad start, fine from 5 August 2021 - perfect 2022 - see 2018 2023 - perfect For further info on how to almost avoid this see here: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2984995-danube-water-levels-2024-and-similar-topics-plus-tips-and-info/page/2/ post #48 and #49. notamermaid

Hello and welcome to Cruisecritic. I will start with this. Last year's Rhine thread, perhaps start on page 10 and work your way forward: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2910181-rhine-water-levels-2023-and-similar-topics/page/10/ As you are also interested in the Danube, here is the thread, I have given you page 13 as a start: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2910185-danube-water-levels-2023-and-similar-topics-plus-tips-and-info/page/13/ Both give you an idea of the conversations we have had. For logistics of ship swaps the roll calls of last year, mainly the Viking Rhine Getaway and the Grand European, tell you how the ship swaps work and how people felt about it. The Viking roll calls are the most active. Many people prefer just to post there, not on the main river cruising board (i.e. this one you are on now reading this thread). You are right about unpredictability but we can look at statistics that help a little to narrow it down and put into perspective. More on that in another post. notamermaid

I must admit that I am in two minds about the updated infrastructure and the increase in the size of the ships. Well, they showed the Viking landing stage... But it is not just Viking. It used to be only 110m ships that were allowed on the river, then some years back they said 135m ships are okay, now most of them are the 135m maximum length. It is not that many more people per ship of course. So on the one hand I would say "what are they moaning about?", but on the other hand I can see where they are coming from, i.e. the passengers come in a bulk, have a guided tour, an ice-cream, and disappear. I do not fully agree with that assessment, though. It is a mixed thing. As a day tripper in Bernkastel-Kues I strolled along, had a quick lunch in a café and disappeared. And a pittance in parking fees. Almost any river cruise passenger leaves more money directly and indirectly in town. But I also do not fully agree with the mayor saying that people that have been on a river cruise very often become a repeat visitor on land (with more money they will leave in town). Again a mixed thing. Depending on the individual, the country of origin, the budget. I doubt a person from (insert US State of our choice) will tell ten friends how great Bernkastel-Kues is and five of them turn up at a café in Bernkastel-Kues a month later... Anyway, I hope they find the right balance, and do not turn the place into "Rüdesheim-on-the-Moselle". 😉 As for Traben-Trarbach: when I went I found it a bit quiet and so far I have not seen that many ships dock there. I understand the townspeople trying to keep a bit more of that "sophisticated" approach to tourism which is well becoming to this once famous wine centre, but a bit more should not do harm. But as always, just a bit more may turn into a lot more and better complain now than when it is "too late". I can understand the citizens looking at other places, we know Passau is struggling, and saying that they do not want this. Traben-Trarbach is too small for hordes. By the way, on this topic. Beilstein. The village is quaint and popular and if a Viking river cruise ship docked there the passengers would more than double the head count in town. Beilstein only has 149 inhabitants but a landing stage for ships. The place is no hidden gem. notamermaid notamermaid