Threads like this one make me want to SCREAM!!!

[mcfam5]

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showt...1#post33646774

UGH!!!

[Gatrcruzer]

One poster reported never having seen kids younger than teenagers in the dining room?? What cruise lines does this person sail?? That actually made me laugh!!! It's frustrating, but ignorance runs rampant.

[6rugrats]

This thread really isn't that bad; I've read much, much worse.

I particularly like this comment:

I'm not excluding your child from the MDR!
In fact your well-behaved child is more than welcome to join us.

Apparently, this poster thinks they are in charge or who may or may not be seated in the MDR.

The worst behavior I've ever seen on a cruise was from older adults who should have known better on HAL. Bad behavior is not confined to one age group.

[crusinmama06]

And it's the Carnival board - my favorite board

Yeah I stay away from them - it's better that way.

[Fireflymkz76]

Originally Posted by 6rugrats

This thread really isn't that bad; I've read much, much worse.

I particularly like this comment:

I'm not excluding your child from the MDR!
In fact your well-behaved child is more than welcome to join us.

Apparently, this poster thinks they are in charge or who may or may not be seated in the MDR.

The worst behavior I've ever seen on a cruise was from older adults who should have known better on HAL. Bad behavior is not confined to one age group.

seriously! that person just sounds like an unpleasant person to be around in general.

[Onessa]

Your child can accompany the rest of their family to the MDR for dinner - it is not a case of whether the child should be made to feel "welcome" -- the child has every right to be there as anyone else. So we should not really allow the Aplmacs and Fishtacos of this world to feel like they are somehow granting us this HUGE favor by blessing the presence of our children IF they somehow feel that our children are behaving themselves.

Yes, every diner in the MDR should behave by some minimally prescribed set of standards (using their "inside voice", remaining seated on their bottom, using appropriate silverware, dressing appropriately, etc.). But boorish behavior is not limited to the uner 20YO set, so we cannot demand higher standards for our kids than we do for the older pax.

I discovered that when all the diners at a table interact the time that my DD "behaved" without needing to let her play with toys or read a book. Similarly when we've included the 6YO and 8YO little girls from the family that was dining with us on a cruise a few years back, they got engaged in the dinner conversations and were less restless and less likely to color or read or whatever.

But when the other diners really go out of their way to exclude a group of diners, that other group is going to get restless. It doesn't matter if one of the diners is "older", or a child, or speaks limited English or whatever.

When you are all travelling and visiting ports there are ways to involve little ones in the dinner time conversations and when the little ones grow weary of the conversations, there is no good reason why they cannot remain and read, or color, or whatever.

This is how my 6YO dd who was extremely shy can become a very posed 16YO who can now really hold her own in a conversation among adults and enjoy herself. When she was 13YO we were seated at a table with three other middle-aged couples (two from Great Britain, one from Central America) One of the British women took me aside last night and confessed that she and her DH had considered requesting a table switch when they found a "child" seated at their table, but were really glad that they did not because they found that they "really enjoyed" the company of our DD.

[#1TravelMom]

Wow, I'm just shocked at some of the comments. We've been on 30+ cruises(all except one with our DDs). I would think with all of this cruise experience it would have occurred to me to exclude our girls from the MDR - NOT! These are Family vacations and great opportunities for our girls to experience formal meals and practice proper etiquette. I've never allowed them to be disruptive. They are seated with us, their meals brought promptly and then excused and taken to kids club. After my older daughter was more independent, we allowed her to stay or go to the teen club.

I've definately read plenty of comments regarding hand-held games, ipods, etc - but this is the first I've read that has suggested children should be totally banned from the MDR.

[crusinmama06]

#1 Travel Mom - I am telling you - it's the CCL board and not reality. I have come to accept it. I have read more garbage on that board than I care to. There seems to be a complete disconnect between what actually happens on a CCL ship and what they *say* happens on a CCL ship. Like the person who *said* they have never seen a child under a teen in a MDR. HA! It's laughable!

With a CCL ship you could have upwards of 1,000 children onboard - yet they CLAIM none in the MDR???ummm yeahhh, right!

I have to question whether some have actually stepped foot onboard a ship. The CCL MDRs are the most casual of ANY I have ever been on. People in shorts and tees and families everywhere! The "silver service 4 course dining" they are referring to is laughable.

I love CCL food but to say it is "silver service" and children aren't welcome because of the formality - absurd!

[circuitrider]

It's sad, seems the majority of older people (I'm not picking on elderly...I mean older as in adult-age) don't want kids around them.

I would probably post more often, but the few times I've tried to get engaged in a roll-call, I seem to get snubbed because I have the audacity to bring kids along. So I've learned to just keep to myself.

But how are these obnoxious kids supposed to learn how to interact in the "real world" when the "real world" snubs them for being kids?

I'd love to ask for a table for 8-10, and get to enjoy some adult conversation. But as soon as our tablemates saw our kids, they'd probably run off and demand to be switched to another table. So we just ask for a table for four, and keep to ourselves.

Wish I had an answer that'd make everyone happy, but I don't. Ah well.

[Libra1975]

Don't be disheartened! I posted this thread
http://cruiseforums.cruisecritic.com...d.php?t=161220
on the RCI boards and 99% of the replies were fantastic (it did go off on a slightly tangent about children and electronic devices at the MDR table but it still remained polite!)

We sail in 10 days and look forward to meeting our table mates!

[alise007]

I'll be interested to see how we are treated on our NE Canada cruise in gasp Oct when I bet most of the cruisers are expecting No Kids since they sholdmbe in school! Our roll call def no other kids so far.

But I am sure they will be charmed by the end!

And yes my 4&6 yr olds will be in the MDR on more than one occasion! Oh well let them judge. I am planning to have a great time and will keep my kids out of the bar and casino. So the haters can hang there and be safe!

I look forward to my kids having the chance to dress up and practice their manners.

[Geldhart]

My kids will be going on their first cruise in August, and dining in the MDR (and one night in Chops) is not optional for us. DD11 bought a dress for the occasion, and as a result, I'm planning on how I'm going to bring my Louisville Slugger on board - she went from young kid to THAT almost overnight.

We are practicing dining room manners with my DS8 - that is taking some work, but we still have a little over 100 days. They do know what the punishments are for misbehaviour, and they know they don't want to go there -- so I'm not to worried about that. They are good kids and won't be a problem.

[chipmaster]

So sad to see old people who have no "kid" left in them, what a misrable existence...

[Karysa]

We fretted over this after reading similar threads when our girls were young. We had no issues though when we cruised. Then they hit their teens and we read all the threads about parents letting their teens (gasp) hang out in gangs! So I worried about that. We used the same rules as at home and again no problems when we cruised. They were taught how to behave and I should have realized from the beginning that regular behaving kids were not going to ruin someone's cruise.

[cantw8togo]

Originally Posted by circuitrider

I'd love to ask for a table for 8-10, and get to enjoy some adult conversation. But as soon as our tablemates saw our kids, they'd probably run off and demand to be switched to another table. So we just ask for a table for four, and keep to ourselves.

Wish I had an answer that'd make everyone happy, but I don't. Ah well.

If you request a table for 8-10, you will likely be seated with another family. If there isn't one available, then you would likely be seated by yourselves. On one trip that we took, even though we were seated at a table to ourselves, we often struck up a conversation with the table of older adults next to us.

[lrowe70]

Originally Posted by crusinmama06

And it's the Carnival board - my favorite board

Yeah I stay away from them - it's better that way.

Carnival board turned me off of Carnival cruise line.

[beachchick]

Originally Posted by circuitrider

It's sad, seems the majority of older people (I'm not picking on elderly...I mean older as in adult-age) don't want kids around them.

I would probably post more often, but the few times I've tried to get engaged in a roll-call, I seem to get snubbed because I have the audacity to bring kids along. So I've learned to just keep to myself.

But how are these obnoxious kids supposed to learn how to interact in the "real world" when the "real world" snubs them for being kids?

I'd love to ask for a table for 8-10, and get to enjoy some adult conversation. But as soon as our tablemates saw our kids, they'd probably run off and demand to be switched to another table. So we just ask for a table for four, and keep to ourselves.

Wish I had an answer that'd make everyone happy, but I don't. Ah well.

I have to disagree that the majority of adults don't want children around them in general. What you see on cruises is the result of a number of things. First is that until recently most cruises really were seen and marketed as a vacation geared for adults. Children's facilities and programs are a reasonably new thing for most cruise lines. Second is that many, if not most, adults who you see on cruises who prefer not to be seated at dinner or spend time with children onboard are in fact parents/grandparents. Just because they prefer to cruise when fewer children are onboard doesn't mean they dislike children. In many cases, couples are taking a cruise without their children as a way to strengthen their bond and remember that they are not just parents, but also adults with adult lives and an adult relationship. In other cases (such as ours), they have already raised their children and prefer adult company (except for their own adorable grandchildren). We have an exceptional granddaughter (not that I'm biased); we love spending time with her and perhaps a couple of her friends. We don't enjoy cruising during times when there are likely to be 40%+ of the passengers younger than 18. Still others work in fields where they are around children all day. You can hardly blame a teacher or pediatrician for not wanting to spend time or dine with children while on vacation.

As for wanting to be seated with adults, rather than another family with children. Whenever children are present, including at a table in the MDR, the adults at the table will almost certainly refrain from discussing a variety of topics that are not child appropriate. "Adult" conversation, by which I do not mean talking about sex or using swear words, is by nature not necessarily kid friendly. You might want adult conversation, but consider what subjects and words you might censor if your children are at the table. Strangers are even more likely to censor themselves because they do not know your children. We would prefer to dine with other adults, but we do not dislike children--We raised one and have that wonderful granddaughter to play with, love, and spoil (at least a little bit).

Originally Posted by Geldhart

My kids will be going on their first cruise in August, and dining in the MDR (and one night in Chops) is not optional for us. DD11 bought a dress for the occasion, and as a result, I'm planning on how I'm going to bring my Louisville Slugger on board - she went from young kid to THAT almost overnight.

We are practicing dining room manners with my DS8 - that is taking some work, but we still have a little over 100 days. They do know what the punishments are for misbehaviour, and they know they don't want to go there -- so I'm not to worried about that. They are good kids and won't be a problem.

Oh yes, the "What the heck happened to my baby?" moment. For my hubby it was a picture I took of our then 12 year old daughter in a talent show. With the costume (not too revealing, just theatrical and a bit "grown up" in style), a bit of stage makeup (we're a theater family, but I kept it to a minimum for her at that age), and just the right lighting and pose, all of a sudden, in that moment he saw his little girl looking like a grown woman. Of course, she looked like her 12-y/o self as soon as the show was over, the makeup washed off, and the costume put away. But boy, his eyes when he saw the photo. It was a combination of pride in how beautiful she looked and "Get the bat, I'm going to have to beat the boys off with a stick" and "Where's my baby?" all in one.

Originally Posted by Karysa

We fretted over this after reading similar threads when our girls were young. We had no issues though when we cruised. Then they hit their teens and we read all the threads about parents letting their teens (gasp) hang out in gangs! So I worried about that. We used the same rules as at home and again no problems when we cruised. They were taught how to behave and I should have realized from the beginning that regular behaving kids were not going to ruin someone's cruise.

Yep, normal and generally well behaved children/teens are not the one ruining another passenger's cruise. It's the small percentage of the other type who cause the "Oh no, kids/teens!" knee jerk reaction for some. It's the parents who seem to believe that a cruise ship is a fantasy world, that cruising equals a vacation from parenting, that taking care of their children is the job of the crew and the other passengers, and that anyone who has a problem with their poorly behaved children is a "child hater" who make things harder for the majority of parents and children. All you can do is what you're doing: Be a responsible parent who is raising regular kids (which is to say, generally well behaved, enjoyable to see, and sometimes imperfect).

beachchick

[Sammycupcaker]

We just got back last week from a cruise on the glory last week. We took our 5 & 7 year old to the mdr every night. There wasn't a ton of other children in there but there was others. We were never made to feel as though our girls didn't belong. Our girls are very well behaved and know how to use manners in restaurants. There was a menu with a pencil waiting for them every night sov could play tic tac toe while waiting for a meal.
We were on a family vacation and eating dinner together was very inportant to me.

[circuitrider]

Originally Posted by beachchick

Just because they prefer to cruise when fewer children are onboard doesn't mean they dislike children.

I didn't mean that they DISLIKE children...just that they don't want kids around them. Post that you're taking kids on someone's cruise, they'll start to freak out. Saying things like kids shouldn't be in the MDR, or say that kids have no place on a Transatlantic cruise and we should consider a Disney vacation instead (our son had a blast on the Transatlantic cruise btw).

Originally Posted by beachchick

As for wanting to be seated with adults, rather than another family with children. Whenever children are present, including at a table in the MDR, the adults at the table will almost certainly refrain from discussing a variety of topics that are not child appropriate. "Adult" conversation, by which I do not mean talking about sex or using swear words, is by nature not necessarily kid friendly. You might want adult conversation, but consider what subjects and words you might censor if your children are at the table.

Well, I didn't actually say I wanted to sit with other adults rather than a family with children; just that I would like to sit with some other adults and have some adult conversation. And I would not mind "adult" conversation around our kids (and I would define adult conversation the same way...I don't like talking to people who swear every other word, even if there aren't any kids around).

[scarlett81]

Bottom line, these people are morons. Sorry, but thats just the way it is.

I had a very interesting conversation with staff aboard the Crystal Symphony, which I just brought my 2 little ones aboard for the Grand Mediterranean tour. Staff members hate that idiots on boards like this ruin their reputation as far as children cruising are concerned. To them, it creates a negative image of luxury cruising, and drives away high paying customers.

I was very nervous about bringing a 5 yr old and 1 yr old aboard a high end luxe line, but it was my parents 50th anniversary wish, so we did it.

My children were welcomed, doted on, catered to and loved. I actually had a staff member hug my daughter and cry when we left.

There were just a couple moments where the kids were restless and we walked them outside the dining room, or stayed in the room to relax instead of going out. All in all, however, the kids were fine and our reception was incredibly WARM from staff and 99% of fellow cruisers. I had total strangers come up to me, who had heard of my baby's name already and wanted to hold him and say hi. I was shocked. From the crap I read on this site, I expected to be treated like we had the plague and it was the total opposite.

Once I posted on a thread regarding using the ship's group tours with the family and the logistics of it. People said that wouldn't be right bc we'd hold up the whole bus and tour, making people wait while we fold and unfolded the stroller....so I didn't book any group tours.
Do you know how many people there were in wheelchairs? Or that needed assistance getting in and out of the buses, or tenders? NO ONE would EVER tell someone in a wheelchair, 'don't go on a group tour, you'll hold up the bus!'....?!?!?! (btw, folding our stroller and boarding the bus takes a total of 45 seconds more than anyone else)

My point is, what I thought would be an issue was no issue whatsoever. And between you and me (hahahaha) my hubby and I think that fellow cruisers read some of the internet garbage regarding family cruisers, and went out of their way even more to be nice.

Other than the couple informed writers on certain ship boards, don't listen to anyone over there. Its a bunch of nonsense. These people need to get a life. Go watch some CNN and learn what real problems are.