Rhine water levels 2017 and similar topics

Hello chessy bear,

 

happy to help. But I really do not know how things might go with the Monarch Queen. Sounds as if she should be ok, we sort of established last year here on CC that Viking still sails when the level is at 80cm at Koblenz. I have lost track of how far down it went after that, but Viking narrowly avoided the ship swaps I seem to remember. Have a look at last year's thread from post #390 onwards: http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2308253 to give you an idea of what the situation was like.

 

As regards place: the ships get stuck in or very close to the Rhine gorge with the shallowest navigation channel being there, that is between about Wiesbaden and Koblenz.

 

notamermaid

Thank you Notamermaid for your advice and thread. I have rung Gate1 and as of today they have had no boats impacted yet by the low levels on the Rhine. She said sometimes they will off load people and bus them to meet the boat where it is very shallow to allow the boat to navigate across the shallow areas with out the weight of 100+ people onboard. Of course we are not sailing until mid Autumn so lets hope this area has had some rain by then.

Jackie

chessybear, thank you for getting back to us with the good news from Gate1. It confirms what we have learnt here on cruisecritic from past cruisers' experiences. The extra weight of the passengers gone really has helped cruisers in previous years on 135m boats as well. Good to know that that is all that is needed for the Monarch Queen to sail on and will very likely be the same in such situations for the other 110m ships. By the way, there are a few ships that have a different hull size inbetween the industry standards of 135m and 110m, they are usually older. The one new boat with a custom-built hull to fit well onto the river she is sailing on is the Uniworld Joie de Vivre on the Seine at 125m.

Weather and river level update: A thunderstorm carrying lots of rain has swept over many parts of Germany during the night (it woke me up and it sounded quite severe) bringing the temperature down quite a bit. The skys have not calmed down fully so more rain could fall. This results in swift rises of the water levels albeit short-lived. However it does help to get us better through the coming weeks. Unfortunately not much rain appears to have reached the Elbe region yet as the water level in Dresden is still falling, currently at 67 (!) centimetres. Just to compare that to Kaub in the Rhine gorge, there the level showed 138cm at 12pm local time. The river can still loose around 45cm before we need to start worrying about cruising being impacted in the sense of "will the river level fall further, might my ship of 135m have problems when I leave the day after tomorrow?" See post #150 above.

As mentioned before Viking puts updates on their website and if you are sailing with another company and are getting nervous do contact your cruise line to put your mind at rest.

I am ending this post with a smile on my face thinking about the captain and officer on my river cruise. Very nice people. I have so much respect for all those captains taking us up and down the rivers. They are doing an excellent job, especially with the rivers getting busier and the adverse conditions they have to deal with on a tight river cruise itinerary.

notamermaid

Can you help me find this info on the Viking Web Site? Thanks

Certainly:). Here it is: https://www.vikingrivercruises.com/my-trip/current-sailings/index.html

notamermaid

Thank you Notamermaid for your advice and thread. I have rung Gate1 and as of today they have had no boats impacted yet by the low levels on the Rhine. She said sometimes they will off load people and bus them to meet the boat where it is very shallow to allow the boat to navigate across the shallow areas with out the weight of 100+ people onboard. Of course we are not sailing until mid Autumn so lets hope this area has had some rain by then.

 

Jackie

I really wonder about the effect of moving people off the ship. It does help, but not much. I did the calculation for a 110 meter river ship (11.5 m wide), and if I did the math right, removing 150 passengers weighing 90 kg (200 lbs) each only raises he boat by about 1 cm (0.4 inches). A centimeter can be significant, but it isn't a huge impact.

I really wonder about the effect of moving people off the ship. It does help, but not much. I did the calculation for a 110 meter river ship (11.5 m wide), and if I did the math right, removing 150 passengers weighing 90 kg (200 lbs) each only raises he boat by about 1 cm (0.4 inches). A centimeter can be significant, but it isn't a huge impact.

Yes, but did you factor in the buffet breakfasts and lunches? How about the unlimited wine and beer with meals? ;) After a one-week cruise on Uniworld, I think I felt the boat rise significantly when I dragged myself off...

I really wonder about the effect of moving people off the ship. It does help, but not much. I did the calculation for a 110 meter river ship (11.5 m wide), and if I did the math right, removing 150 passengers weighing 90 kg (200 lbs) each only raises he boat by about 1 cm (0.4 inches). A centimeter can be significant, but it isn't a huge impact.

I wonder if another purpose is to avoid having an audience. The passage may be accompanied by scraping and banging which probably won't harm the ship but might alarm the passengers.

:D:D Drag myself off the ship I did as well. Yet all that food that was there at the beginning of the cruise in kitchen and larder was inside us passengers at the end of the cruise so no change there in weight I guess...

But I did wonder while writing this morning if the 110m boats do get rid of some water from their tanks in addition to having the passengers of the boat.

FuelScience, thank you for doing the maths. Very interesting.

notamermaid

:D:D Drag myself off the ship I did as well. Yet all that food that was there at the beginning of the cruise in kitchen and larder was inside us passengers at the end of the cruise so no change there in weight I guess...

 

But I did wonder while writing this morning if the 110m boats do get rid of some water from their tanks in addition to having the passengers of the boat.

 

FuelScience, thank you for doing the maths. Very interesting.

 

notamermaid

I suspect that they do. On our recent cruise on the Rhone, we had a high water issue getting under a bridge in Lyon. While we were docked for a day the captain had the water tanks filled and ordered that the fuel tanks be topped off. We made it under the bridge with 5 cm to spare!

Hi All Gate 1 does seem to be the only company keeping up with us we are on Scenic Jewel and our brillient maritime crew got us through Regensburg to Passau when others had to ship swap, only two cargo and us. We have only seen us Gate 1 and Avalon moving in two days on the Danube, on our way to Melk now. CA

I wonder if another purpose is to avoid having an audience. The passage may be accompanied by scraping and banging which probably won't harm the ship but might alarm the passengers.

I favor this explanation. Plus if the ship gets stuck, it's better if there aren't a large number of guests to evacuate.

Hi All Gate 1 does seem to be the only company keeping up with us we are on Scenic Jewel and our brillient maritime crew got us through Regensburg to Passau when others had to ship swap, only two cargo and us. We have only seen us Gate 1 and Avalon moving in two days on the Danube, on our way to Melk now. CA

Thanks for the update. Looking at our itinerary there would not be an option to ship swap.

Is late summer late July or late August. We are scheduled for July 27.

Just curious, since we are also sailing on July 27th on Viking. What cruise are you on?

To CoolCruising -

You mentioned sailing on July 27th. What cruise are you on? We are also sailing on that date on the Danube - Budapest to Bucharest.

Strasbourg

lovely city and a place I still have not been to, I seem to have been to many places around it always for some reason avoiding unintentionally this splendid town. Johann Wolfgang von Goethe praised the architect of Strasbourg Minster as a genius in his work "Von Deutscher Baukunst" (On German architecture).

For the modern tourist the British Telegraph online has these tips: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/cruises/articles/cruising-in-france-strasbourg-cruise/

The Rhine by the way has risen due to the substantial rain we have had: Kaub is at 192cm, Koblenz at 165cm.

notamermaid

Just curious, since we are also sailing on July 27th on Viking. What cruise are you on?

We are on Lofn, Rhine Getaway

Hi all...

We are getting ready to reserve our first ever river cruise for October 2018 from Amsterdam to Basel. I realize no one can predict the future but does anyone have information on how often the October sailings have had to be rerouted due to low water levels? Also is there a better choice than this route at that time of year?

Thanks for any help.....very experienced with Ocean cruising but know very little about the river version....:)

Hello Gracie115,

hmm,

it has been low in 2003, 2009, 2011, 2013, 2015 and 2016 anytime between October and December in those years. But it does not automatically mean that river cruise ships could not sail. For that one needs acurate details that I so far could not find in an easily accessible chart. Perhaps I might get some info from an acquaintance but he is a busy man at a local waterboard... some time... For the time being I can only say that the 135m ships will have been more affected than the 110m ships. In 2016 no reroutings on the Rhine were reported here (there might have been a very few), in 2015 it affected ships in October and into November but you would need to read the posts of that time in the thread for the Rhine river of 2015 for details.

As for other routes: October / November is the time at which throughout Europe the Summer heat diminishes the water in the rivers. You could look at Asia. Some cruisers here will know what the situation will be over there, I have not looked into this.

For rivers in Europe the Moselle is a good bet but all cruises longer than three days on the Moselle also sail the Rhine. To be safe with that you would need an itinerary that only does the Moselle and the Rhine downstream from Koblenz.

You could check the Seine, I do not recall having read reroutings there, it depends on the depth of the navigation channel. If the Seine has been dug out deep you should be fine there. Could not find any figures at short notice.

There is no guarantee that you will hit extremely low water levels if you choose October and if you want to have a good chance of not being affected at all choose a 110m ship.

The stretch on the Rhine that is affected first is the section between Rüdesheim and Koblenz, the bottleneck and most scenic part of the river. All river cruise companies have a plan B to make sure the customers see this beautiful part, whether it be on a hired local ship (they can still sail for a bit longer when the river cruise ships cannot sail anymore) or by coach.

Oh, and do read the stickies on top of the river cruise pages, I highly recommend them.

notamermaid

Hello Gracie115,

 

hmm,

 

it has been low in 2003, 2009, 2011, 2013, 2015 and 2016 anytime between October and December in those years. But it does not automatically mean that river cruise ships could not sail. For that one needs acurate details that I so far could not find in an easily accessible chart. Perhaps I might get some info from an acquaintance but he is a busy man at a local waterboard... some time... For the time being I can only say that the 135m ships will have been more affected than the 110m ships. In 2016 no reroutings on the Rhine were reported here (there might have been a very few), in 2015 it affected ships in October and into November but you would need to read the posts of that time in the thread for the Rhine river of 2015 for details.

 

As for other routes: October / November is the time at which throughout Europe the Summer heat diminishes the water in the rivers. You could look at Asia. Some cruisers here will know what the situation will be over there, I have not looked into this.

 

For rivers in Europe the Moselle is a good bet but all cruises longer than three days on the Moselle also sail the Rhine. To be safe with that you would need an itinerary that only does the Moselle and the Rhine downstream from Koblenz.

 

You could check the Seine, I do not recall having read reroutings there, it depends on the depth of the navigation channel. If the Seine has been dug out deep you should be fine there. Could not find any figures at short notice.

 

There is no guarantee that you will hit extremely low water levels if you choose October and if you want to have a good chance of not being affected at all choose a 110m ship.

 

The stretch on the Rhine that is affected first is the section between Rüdesheim and Koblenz, the bottleneck and most scenic part of the river. All river cruise companies have a plan B to make sure the customers see this beautiful part, whether it be on a hired local ship (they can still sail for a bit longer when the river cruise ships cannot sail anymore) or by coach.

 

Oh, and do read the stickies on top of the river cruise pages, I highly recommend them.

 

notamermaid

Thank you so much for all the information ..... I have lots of research to do!!!:D

Notamermaid.... I enjoy your very informative posts. Watching closely the posts on Rhine water levels. We are cruising on the River Queen.... Uniworld leaving August 22 for 13 day Rhine and Moselle. We usually have cruised end of May and beginning of June but this was a special deal with Uniworld. My only concern in addition to water levels is the heat.. Hopefully it won't be too warm...we have cruised the Rhine a few years ago and look forward to cruising Moselle... any recommendations? Any must sees? Thx again for all your info...

Hello Gracie115,

For rivers in Europe the Moselle is a good bet but all cruises longer than three days on the Moselle also sail the Rhine. To be safe with that you would need an itinerary that only does the Moselle and the Rhine downstream from Koblenz.

notamermaid

We did Avalon's Paris to Amsterdam cruise in 2016, and I recommend it. The itinerary does go south from Koblenz to Rudesheim, but then it heads north to Amsterdam. The ships scheduled for this trip in 2018 are both 110 meter ships. Also, you go from Paris to Luxembourg on the TGV train rather than a bus. If you're up for DIY, you can skip Avalon's Paris precruise stay and save money doing the cruise-only, disembarking ship in Remich. There is one southboundcruise scheduled for October 11, 2018.

http://www.avalonwaterways.com/river-cruise/canals-vineyards-paris-southbound/war/?nextyear=true

Hello amd1234,

Notamermaid.... I enjoy your very informative posts. Watching closely the posts on Rhine water levels. We are cruising on the River Queen.... Uniworld leaving August 22 for 13 day Rhine and Moselle. We usually have cruised end of May and beginning of June but this was a special deal with Uniworld. My only concern in addition to water levels is the heat.. Hopefully it won't be too warm...we have cruised the Rhine a few years ago and look forward to cruising Moselle... any recommendations? Any must sees? Thx again for all your info...

calteacher went earlier this year on that cruise, I wonder if a review was posted: http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2468115&highlight=Uniworld+Moselle

I recommend the Landesmuseum in Trier and all the Roman stuff standing around in Trier both in the museum and in the town. There is much more than in Cologne for example, although, the Cologne Roman museum is fabulous. I hope you are able to see Cologne at night, lit up. Best experienced from the railway bridge or the embankment at Deutz (a suburb). Not sure where you are headed as regards ports otherwise. If you do not like the very touristy places Rüdesheim is perhaps a bit too much for you. Hike into the hills or take the offered excursion if they offer one. Outside of Rüdesheim, walking upstream through the park you get to the ruins of the Hindenburg bridge, destroyed in 1945. It was a sister bridge to the Remagen bridge. If that is your thing... But Rüdesheim has a good Käthe Wohlfahrt Christmas shop if that is more your cup of tea. Edit: I have just thought that you have problaby been to Rüdesheim before. You might want to get across to the other side by ferry to Bingen for the informative museum. Just for something different I mean. End edit.

People have reported back from their cruises that they enjoyed a DIY trip with the gondola in Koblenz up to the fortress Ehrenbreitstein. The view is certainly great from there, you can take a photo of your minute-looking river cruise ship. :D

Some local food and drink sampling is in order, as well, I think. I am sure Uniworld will provide you with many opportunities to do so, but if it gets really hot and you feel like "cooling down like the Germans" have sparkling water mixed with apple juice, called Apfelschorle, that is very refreshing. Do not forget to try Flammkoche or in French tarte flambée in Strasbourg. Added: The Moselle has a speciality liqueur called Weinbergspfirsichlikör made from peaches. Very sweet. Nice on its own or for mixing drinks.

notamermaid

FuelScience,

I very much liked the itinerary from your review last year and it being on a 110m ships makes it all the more attractive seeing that getting stuck in the Rhine gorge is unlikely.

Must remark on my post #169: of course, by October the Summer heat is gone, I meant to say that during Summer the heat and the relatively low amount of rain diminishes the water in the river.

notamermaid

We are enjoying a pleasant day here on the Rhine with temperatures in the 20's, the rainy days have gone for a bit. The water level is 168cm at Kaub and 156cm at Koblenz.

The farewell sailing of Helmut Kohl on the Rhine went well (as the rest of the ceremony just a pity it rained some much) and the Tour de France has had its opening ceremony in Düsseldorf. It is now disrupting - hopefully in a happy way - life on the Moselle moving South within France tomorrow. Things on the Rhine - in my area - have gone quiet again now.

I for myself am nervously awaiting the auction of the the Turner masterpiece in London: http://www.reuters.com/video/2017/06/30/turners-late-masterpiece-to-be-auctioned?videoId=372000348, see post #76 here, sincerely hoping that it will go to an institution that can put it on public display.

Happy sailing everyone.

notamermaid

I for myself am nervously awaiting the auction of the the Turner masterpiece in London: http://www.reuters.com/video/2017/06/30/turners-late-masterpiece-to-be-auctioned?videoId=372000348, see post #76 here, sincerely hoping that it will go to an institution that can put it on public display.

 

Happy sailing everyone.

 

notamermaid

You're not planning to bid? :D