Diamond Princess not easy for mobility impaired

We just returned from 20 nights on the Diamond Princess with my adult daughter who uses a walker and/or leg braces. She found the ship difficult for several reasons.

First, on all but the final disembarkation day, the Diamond Princess entrance and exit had steps. These were a part of the ship and could be set to have a standard rise or a rise of only 2-3 inches (or none), but as noted, the only time they were set up as a ramp was the last morning. We were quite shocked to see that the ability to climb stairs was required to board the ship. The promised wheelchair with a human "pusher" did not show up. She navigated it with the walker with difficulty.

Next, there are metal pieces over uneven areas of the carpet in the halls--"joints" sort of. All ships have this, but on the Diamond they are more square than what we've encountered on other ships. The wheels of the walker did not roll over these--it hit them and the wheels stopped. On other ships (Princess as well as other lines) they have either been rounded or the edges were more gradually sloped allowing the wheels to roll over them. As it was, each time she came to one of these it was necessary to stop and lift the walker over it. She found it much easier to go to deck 7 to walk from one place to another as these structures did not exist there. This way, she only had to cross one of them between our cabin and the elevator.

The third "problem" was a combination of a Princess problem and rude guests. After the muster drill, the HA seating area was released first, but only about 10 seconds before the general population (on previous cruises it has been more like 2 minutes early). Since Princess allows all guests to use elevators after the drill while some other lines do not, this release timing resulted in her literally being run over by other guests in their rush for an elevator. She finally got into an elevator with another guest using a walker and a woman proceeded to scream at her because when she got on with the walker, there was not enough room for the woman's friend to get on. The woman literally held the door open and tried to insist that my daughter get off! Really, people? No, my daughter didn't barge up to the front of the line--she waited her turn. But she was not going to give up the next available spot to an able bodied person who was farther back in the waiting crowd. We later found that the gentleman with the walker and his wife were on our roll call and had quite a conversation about what each of them "almost" did/said to this screamer.

I do realize that Princess can't be responsible for the behavior of passengers on the ship, but the situation could be handled by either releasing those needing the elevators a few minutes earlier than the masses OR by having a crew member man the elevators and restrict them to those who need them for the first few minutes as is done on some other cruise lines. They do use this "elevator control" technique during the boarding process when certain elevators are for boarding guests only; why not after the drill?

Yes, I realize that the ship is British flagged and was cruising around Japan so ADA regulations do not apply. However, the steps to disembark and reboard at each port were quite a shock. On our previous cruises (Princess as well as other lines) there have always been ramps!

Sorry to hear of your difficulties. DW is wheelchair dependant and always been grateful that their are usually 2 special needs assistances at the ships gangways to help her . Perhaps on board life for your daughter would be easier if she had her own wheelchair, this would overcome the bumps and lumps. The Princess wheelchairs carried on board are for emergency use. I realise that this is advice after your disappointment. The valid point you raise about the mad rush to get to the elevators, is the me me me factor of life. We overcome this by just staying in the muster lounge for 1/2 an hour and chill out.

She currently does not use a wheelchair on the ship. She uses the walker and her braces. We are aware that Princess does not supply wheelchairs for guest use other than at embarkation/disembarkation. The issue with a wheelchair is that she loses all her independence as her shoulders dislocate if she tries to propel a manual chair and she HATES to have me push the chair. While her future will include a motorized chair, she's not that bad yet.

The big problem was the difficulty in using the walker on THIS ship. She had no problem with it on the Caribbean Princess.

Thanks for the suggestion of just chilling out at the muster station. That would take care of the elevator issue.

We just returned from 20 nights on the Diamond Princess with my adult daughter who uses a walker and/or leg braces. She found the ship difficult for several reasons.

 

First' date=' on all but the final disembarkation day, the Diamond Princess entrance and exit had steps. These were a part of the ship and could be set to have a standard rise or a rise of only 2-3 inches (or none), but as noted, the only time they were set up as a ramp was the last morning. We were quite shocked to see that the ability to climb stairs was required to board the ship. The promised wheelchair with a human "pusher" did not show up. She navigated it with the walker with difficulty.[/quote']

 

This sounds more of a "port issue" and not a ship issue if I understand correctly. I have been on the Sapphire Princess (sister) several times with a mobility challenged individual and did not have these issues.

 

It sounds like more the equipment they used at the port to get to the ship? Maybe they use stairs from the ship but I have seen both stairs and ramps used on the Sapphire before (one entrance had a ramp, another had stairs).

 

Was everything you referred to "outside of the ship"?

 

Was everything you referred to "outside of the ship"?

The stairs were outside the ship. Initially we thought they came from the port, but learned they were part of the ship's equipment. Their exact configuration was dependent on the port, the distance from the door to the sidewalk, etc. They were never set up as a ramp during our 20 night cruise until the final disembarkation day. On at least 2 occasions we bypassed the line at the nearest gangway and walked to the second one. I can't swear that the bypassed one wasn't a ramp, but I sure didn't notice it. The times we used the nearest entrance it was always stairs. There were crew members manipulating wheelchairs up the stairs on one occasion. That made us glad that she "only" had a walker!

The metal things across the carpet junctions are in the hallways with passenger cabins. She was able to largely avoid these by going to the public areas like deck 7 which are tile rather than carpet and walking there. There was only one between our cabin and the elevators.

The stairs were outside the ship. Initially we thought they came from the port' date=' but learned they were part of the ship's equipment. Their exact configuration was dependent on the port, the distance from the door to the sidewalk, etc. They were never set up as a ramp during our 20 night cruise until the final disembarkation day. On at least 2 occasions we bypassed the line at the nearest gangway and walked to the second one. I can't swear that the bypassed one wasn't a ramp, but I sure didn't notice it. The times we used the nearest entrance it was always stairs. There were crew members manipulating wheelchairs up the stairs on one occasion. That made us glad that she "only" had a walker!

 

The metal things across the carpet junctions are in the hallways with passenger cabins. She was able to largely avoid these by going to the public areas like deck 7 which are tile rather than carpet and walking there. There was only one between our cabin and the elevators.[/quote']

 

Got it! So the ship overall is still accessible - it is just how they set things up outside. I have no doubt what they decide to do depends on water levels and the port itself.

 

I have seen where the steps are made into what looks like a ramp and other times a step. Yes - I can see why this would be completely unpredictable and am really surprised that staff did not assist as I have seen this many times.

 

Unfortunately - this can probably happen in many ports, not just in Japan. This is when one really has to work with the ship for assistance. It may take awhile to get to the right person who can arrange this.

moki'smommy

My husband uses a scooter and we have experienced this elevator problem also mostly after the muster drill and after the evening show.

When I made the same suggestion that you made above, I received many replies that since "we" didn't want to be treated differently, we should just wait our turn to get on the elevator. I tried to explain that we would be happy to "wait our turn" except that the able bodied push in ahead of us while we are waiting.

moki'smommy

 

My husband uses a scooter and we have experienced this elevator problem also mostly after the muster drill and after the evening show.

 

When I made the same suggestion that you made above, I received many replies that since "we" didn't want to be treated differently, we should just wait our turn to get on the elevator. I tried to explain that we would be happy to "wait our turn" except that the able bodied push in ahead of us while we are waiting.

Thank you for your kind words. We also do not have an issue with waiting our turn. As you know, that's not the problem. And it is true that at least as often as someone jumps in front of her to board an elevator, there is a time that someone holds the door to assure her safety. I think the muster drill issue could be resolved by releasing those in the HA area 1-2 minutes before the group rather than 10 seconds before the crowd. In fact, that's what we planned to do on our second leg--just leave without waiting to be dismissed. When we arrived for the second drill, we were advised that we didn't have to attend at all, so we left immediately.

As far as the muster conglomeration exodus...as an abled bodied senior, I too wait about 30 minutes for the crowd to go ahead of me.

I have issues myself with being pushed and shoved. I try to walk the stairs after muster but it is a challenge and I get a good work out. Even then, people are somewhat rude.:(

I try very hard to be polite and courteous to those that are more physically challenged than I. But when I get my feet ran over...I am not happy at all! This is why I stay away from the crowds that are trying to go from one show to the other. I feel like they are herding cattle when this is going on.:rolleyes:

So sorry to hear of your daughter's difficulty. That can really ruin a cruise experience. The uncertainty of managing a new ship always gives me an anxiety attack. I bring a cane, rollator Walker and a scooter with me when I cruise. I never know what my strength and endurance will be on any day.

I hate having to use the elevators when a lot of people are trying to catch a ride. I have run into some really rude people, but fortunately most people I've encountered are pleasant, kind and considerate. To keep myself calm and relaxed, my husband and I have learned to chill while the mass of people exit the muster drill. We take the time to explore the deck we're on, or have a coke or fancy drink if a bar is near. We also try to get to a location long before most people, to avoid the crowding that bothers me. This strategy works for us.

Thank you! Yes, we always get to the muster drill (or theatre) early, but I never thought of hanging around that area for a while after the drill. That sounds silly, but it never crossed my mind. We always left when they released us. But giving her new soda card a workout is a very good idea.

And most people are very kind most of the time. This incident basically involved one rude individual. I was quite surprised, but not about to let it ruin my cruise.

Like you, my daughter brings a variety of equipment and has learned that some days just need to be a "day off" when she does little other than hang out in the room and go to dinner. Fortunately, it has been a couple years since she needed a chair full time. We don't know what caused that exacerbation, but consider it wonderful that PT got her back to "baseline" and the braces have greatly improved her ability to walk...for now. Room service on the Diamond Princess was awesome--took 20 minutes or less and was great quality. That became her "go to" on those days that she just needed to rest.

Thank you! Yes' date=' we always get to the muster drill (or theatre) early, but I never thought of hanging around that area for a while after the drill. That sounds silly, but it never crossed my mind. I always left when they released us. But giving my new soda card a workout is a very good idea.

 

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We had a Service dog with us and we would get in an elevator and everyone would crowd and step on the dog and we would then have to leave. We frequently waited about 30 minutes after Muster to go back to our cabin. There was one cruise on the Crown Princess that we were 30 minutes late to dinner almost every night as we couldn't get an elevator with out the dog being stepped on. I completely understand what you went through. We had dealt with it for years.

The post muster time is my most hated time on a cruise. I can understand how awful it would be for someone with any kind of disability, the aged, and a child. I think the idea of waiting back is sound for anyone in these groups. Its an awful scrum and people using elevators can be very selfish. On the other hand using the stairs in the midst of a mob is also awful.

I would not behave myself if I saw anyone being rude to a disabled person in a lift and if I thought they were harming a service dog I might end up in the brig for assaulting them! How dare they!

The best "post muster" situation we've had is on DCL. They release people with special situations about 5 minutes early. At the elevators, there are CMs who have the elevators "locked out" and available for use only by their key, meaning that only people with mobility issues get on one. As soon as those people are gone, they unlock the elevators. Most of the time, that means one trip for each elevator and the crowds are not released till after we have boarded one.

Yes, I well remember those days of the mob scene on DCL before my daughter needed assistance. That exit was no fun either. Guess there's no good way to move 2500 or more people all at the same time.

In all fairness, we encountered far more good than bad on the Diamond. There were just a few very frustrating points. I think the ship issues could be easily fixed; I just found them surprising as this was the first ship on any line where we encountered structural difficulties.

Hi MM- and welcome back!

I am sorry you had these challenges. I cared for my mom who had mobility issues- we found our way, but it was not without issues. I would divide these in three categories:

1. Physical barriers

2. Nature

3. People problems.

I worked to decrease the barriers that would take-away from my mother's experience. Sometimes it was pretty frustrating. In honour of my my mother- I never ride the elevator. This leaves at least one space for someone who really needs it.

I am traveling on the Diamond for 10 days in January. I would love to hear about your adventures. Will you be writing a review?

Thank you- Tracie-Lynn

Hi Tracie Lynn--I don't know about a review, especially after the response to this post. I am happy to answer any questions you have. Right now, I'm trying to recover from massive jet lag. It was my longest flight ever and the 13 hour time difference has my system rather messed up.

Not sure where the Diamond is in January, but if you have a long flight, do go at least an extra day early. We did. The extra night in a hotel enabled us to enjoy the ship from the beginning.

There was one interesting comment on the ship. When I confirmed with a crew member that there is no International Cafe on the ship, she replied "Not yet." I don't know if that means there is a planned addition or not. The Lobby Bar was a very poor substitute. They did put out 2 trays of pastries in the morning, sandwiches at noon, and cookies in the afternoon. But this was in no way comparable to what is available at the International Cafe.

And I agree with your analysis of "barriers."

Ozkiwi--your comment about the fire barriers being different due to the Japan manufacturer makes sense and might be the explanation. Thanks. I do know that they are different than on any other ship we've cruised and that I would never have noticed this had they not proven to be a barrier.

Hi Tracie Lynn--I don't know about a review' date=' especially after the response to this post. I am happy to answer any questions you have. Right now, I'm trying to recover from massive jet lag. It was my longest flight ever and the 13 hour time difference has my system rather messed up.

 

Not sure where the Diamond is in January, but if you have a long flight, do go at least an extra day early. We did. The extra night in a hotel enabled us to enjoy the ship from the beginning.

 

There was one interesting comment on the ship. When I confirmed with a crew member that there is no International Cafe on the ship, she replied "Not yet." I don't know if that means there is a planned addition or not. The Lobby Bar was a very poor substitute. They did put out 2 trays of pastries in the morning, sandwiches at noon, and cookies in the afternoon. But this was in no way comparable to what is available at the International Cafe.

 

And I agree with your analysis of "barriers."[/quote']

 

The Diamond is cruising SE Asia during January - I'll be on board until Jan 17th. Fortunately, this is the shortest international flight I've had to take (I don't really count my flights to New Zealand as international).

 

The problems you initially relayed are ones that certainly can be fixed. The muster drill conclusion always results in a stampede of guests heading for the lifts. It's actually embarrassing to watch perfectly able guests fight each other for a spot (like peak hour on public transport). It wouldn't be hard for Princess to allow mobility issue passengers an extra few minutes to get ahead, with Princess staff waiting by the lifts to manage the flow of people.

 

Likewise, the flooring situation could be resolved. I concur with an earlier poster that it is likely the fact that Diamond was built in a different country that resulted in this. I wonder if Sapphire has the same flooring issue.

 

As for the lengthy response by my Northern Territory compatriot, while he makes many valid points about SOLAS regulations, there is a way of expressing such views and a way one should not express such views. Granted, it is hard to truly know a person's tone just from their writing, but being mindful of how words can come across when bundled together is something any poster should bear in mind.

 

Ultimately, I don't think he was suggesting mobility issue passengers shouldn't sail, but was putting forward a different - and valid - point of view about the realities of being aboard a ship. But as i suggested before, it comes down to how it is communicated, determining whether the point is then perceived as an attack or as a discussion.

 

This is something some passengers need to also think carefully about before opening their mouths during dinner conversations (based on a couple of previous cruises).

MM - don't let the negative responses put you off. I have total empathy for yours/your daughter's situation.

Anyone cruising (or travelling at all) with a disability knows that we're going to come up against different challenges and barriers - and I've read enough of your posts in the disabled cruising section of the forum to think you're not unrealistic with your expectations. I can understand there being situations - related to tidal conditions perhaps - where a ramp may not be able to be used - but I also found myself transported up and down some horrendously steep ramps in my chair at some ports - steep enough that I wasn't allowed to get myself on/off the ship and was gritting my teeth and hoping against hope that the guys moving me had a bloody good grip on my chair.

@ Brisbane41 - I sincerely hope that you are fortunate enough to remain fit and able-bodied til the end of your days. I don't think MM was suggesting anywhere that safety features anywhere ought to be removed, merely commenting on the difference between what she and her daughter had encountered on Diamond vs other ships (and surely - I would have thought a raised sharp/square as against rounded edge protruding above floor level poses a trip hazard to both crew and able bodied passengers as well?)

"We let you on the ship! Now show some damned gratitude!" Geez. :eek:

Sounds that way to me too...:eek:

I'm really surprised to hear about the Diamond not being handicapped friendly. The Diamond Princess was the very first Princess ship DH and I cruised on. We were really shocked at all the wheelchairs, walkers and motorized scooters on board. They were every where parked in the Atrium. DH and I did not sail on Princess for a long time after that. Everyone got around just fine as far as we could see. I can't understand your frustration with the elevators, too many impatient people with the "me first" attitude.

The whole muster drill/elevator crowding happens on all cruises regardless of line. I don't know why the cruise line can't hold 2 of them. Have one for those with special needs and families with small kids. I find the crowding and people rushing to get an elevator or backups going up the stairs unsafe for some. I get that everyone needs to know where their muster station is. But it is really more about the safety instruction.

Some cruises I have been on hold a late muster drill for those who missed the first. This wouldn't be much different. I think it would benefit those with mobile restrictions and the able bodied.

And I don't care what Brisbane41 has to say about it. None of what he is saying is of any value to anyone here. I agree with the use of the term troll.

Moki's Mommy--

How was the cabin?!

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

I use a walker on a cruise ship most of the time. I recently got a leg brace so I may be able to just use my cane part of the time on my next cruise. The problem is not going to the drill, or assembling for an emergency, it is after the drill when everyone is trying to use the elevators to hurry to their rooms.

Some of the people using the elevators could easily walk a flight or two. I have had to walk my walker up a flight or two at times, but it is a little scary on a moving ship.

What would help is having crew manning the elevators after the drill, like they do at embarkation, and only allowing a person with a mobility device and a companion on two of the elevators. One for going down, one for going up.

We usually just go outside or find an area to sit and wait for 30- 45 minutes.

Having two drills would allow those who have no choice but to use the elevator access to them. I think this idea would work.

Hi Sadie:

The cabin was fine and met all of her needs. There was a built in shower seat (folded down for use), a walk in shower surrounded by drains, normal height toilet with plenty of grab bars near the toilet and in the shower. We had the beds separated and placed into the corners which provided the bigger space between the beds to do PT exercises.

We did have the dreaded "awful smell" from the drains and had to call for treatment twice. Both times someone was sent promptly and handled the situation. Whatever he did differently the second time took care of it for the remaining 2 weeks of the cruise. We were B2B for a total of 20 nights.

Got it! So the ship overall is still accessible - it is just how they set things up outside. I have no doubt what they decide to do depends on water levels and the port itself.

......

No, the ship was accessible only because the OP's daughter did a work around. She had to go to one of the public decks if she wanted to move from one end of the ship to the other. On their own deck the metal strips covering the carpet joins/holding carpet in place were of a particular style not seen on the other ships they have been on. If I understand correctly they were very square and sat well above the carpet with the result that the walker wheels could not roll over them. This is something well within Princess' capabilities to fix.

There are some posters who seem to gain pleasure from stirring up others. Best thing I have found is not to reward them by entering a dialogue. :)

I will be on Golden Princess in December MM and will take careful note of the style of the metal strips although I am not impacted by them. Will report back and maybe it might be of use to those who need to know.