Viking China (Part 2)

I agree with those of you who recommend test driving and thinking long and hard about cameras before buying one. I also agree that many people, actually probably most people, don't need a million mega pixels.

 

One thing I used quite a bit in China that I loved was the "Cotton Carrier" - and no, I have no association with them! It's basically a holster that you wear on your chest and slide the camera into. It keeps the camera out for use all the time, and you can pull it up quite quickly if need be. There's also a tether in case something happens. The holster keeps the camera from bobbing around, which was especially helpful in China when we did a lot of walking. It looks a little funny, especially for a woman, but I love it. I think there's a picture of me in Tiananmen Square wearing it in my gallery. The thing wasn't cheap, but it wasn't outrageous, either, and it's really well made and lightweight, too. You can also attach a second body if you want, and maybe a second lens. I just carried my second lens separately, though.

Thank you thank you thank you!!! Mike uses a big Nikon 80 and he gets headaches from lugging it around on our trips especially if we are walking a good bit. I noticed the holster but wasn't sure if it was for the camera of if for a medical problem so was afraid to ask. Mike is getting a newer camera and I am inheriting his old one so we will get a holster for both of us. Thanks again Ruth!

Mike & Bushy

I have been putting off writing this for the last few weeks as we had many negative comments of our China Cultural Delights trip to China. There were also many positives so I'll start there:

1. Hotel accommodations: all outstanding' date=' we stayed in Westin Bund in Shanghai, Westin in Beijing, Shangri la in all other locations. Everyone we talked to from the other hotels were equally satisfied.

 

2. major sites visited were also wonderful ie; Great Wall, Forbidden City, Bell Museum (outstanding), Terra Cotta Warriors (outstanding)

 

3. Chinese people were charming and as interested in us as we were in them. Small children trying out their "hello" on us.

 

4. Inter China airports and planes were very modern and efficient. The planes had larger seats than most of ours.

 

5. Viking's logistical efforts were outstanding. Everything was planned and executed with fine precision.

 

6. The guide you are appointed from Viking is knowledgeable about eastern and western cultures and will answer any question intelligently and philosophically. Our guide was Simon and he was the best guide I've ever experienced but everyone said the same thing of their guide.

 

7. Hotel buffet breakfasts were extremely good with great variety. If you don't like your breakfast it's your own fault.

 

And now for the negatives:

1. China is horribly polluted. They will call it fog but the US embassy has it's own monitoring equipment and on a day Beijing reported the air particulate level as "fair" the US embassy monitored "hazardous"

 

2. We went in cooler November when the temperature is a lot more moderate and the humidity is a killer. We didn't have a problem with the boat but hotels in China can't cool and heat at the same time so if your hotel has the heat on you can't effectively aircondition your room. It wasn't too crazy hot in November but the rooms in 2 hotels were uncomfortable (82 which we attempted to reduce to 65) and when we called the concierge the best they could manage was about 72.

 

3. Filth everywhere except the main attractions.

 

4. food on the boat (except the buffet breakfast) was only just passable, and for many meals just edible. Food in local restaurants with the exception of a very good dim sum in the silk carpet factory was not good. Two meals offered, my husband and I chose not to eat and instead ate some granola bars I had in my purse. One lunch was in a restaurant/hotel where the carpets were so filthy you could barely make out the design on it.[/quote']

Kodi's Mom,

Thank you for your imput. I like to hear both angles of places. I can be mentally prepared if the place isn't pristine.

 

For example while in Morocco we were supposed to go to a "mall" type shopping center on this excursion which happen to be closed that day so the guide took us (without asking) way out of town to this really nasty scary market. The roof was a patchwork of ripped plastic material dripping filthy water on our heads, the walkway was a worn uneven dirt surface with rotting veg & fruit and donkey waste. I would not of complained except we were not allowed to stop and shop, the people had very hostile behavior, and I wore those sandles with openings in the soles for using on the beach. Yes I felt all that lovely stuff oozing up onto my feet...gross. Not to mention the cows head stuck on a stick with a pile of goat heads piled up at the bottom of it. Glad we didn't have our granddaughter with us thinking we were going to stores and ended up here.

 

With your input I know to bring allergy meds if the air quality affects me so you may of saved my vacation from ruin. I have already determined when I see such a wide range of like/dislike of food to take some protein bars.

 

I have been to Egypt and other countries that might be offensive to many tourist. I can handle traveling thru the areas if secure so China should be quite enjoyable and we are looking forward to going.

 

Is there not one other person going on the Imperial Jewels trip on 18 Sep 2012 starting in Shanghai? I am hope to find a few adventurous souls who would not mind going out at night possibly with a guide to get night shots. It would be nice to find at least six so if someone it too tired from the days travels and does not wish to go there is no pressure. We did this in Moscow with a couple from Canada and saw so many more sights than just in the daytime with the guide who knocked off at 4:00 pm each day due to their laws.

 

Thanks again Kodi's Mom.

I went to the travel clinic and received a vacine for polio, flu vacine, Hep A, and typhoid. I also received a prescription for the anti-malaria drug Malarone. We are traveling through areas where malaria is possible, but the doctor recommended calling Viking and asking them what they think. Also, avoidance by wearing long sleeves and repellant with DEED is recommended. I also received a prescription for cipro and doxicyclene. The flu vacine is because of the bird flu. The malaria drugs are started right before the trip, so you wouldn't take them now anyway.

We were traveling in May. I had DEET with me and never used it. We were not bothered by bugs--not flies, not mosquitos.

Kodi's Mom,

 

 

With your input I know to bring allergy meds if the air quality affects me so you may of saved my vacation from ruin.

 

Here's a topic that hasn't come up in a while and I was afraid that it would get buried in Bushy's long message.

Yes, air quality is an issue and if you have a sensitive respiratory system (especially asthma), you should be prepared for it to react negatively. One woman on our trip did have an asthma attack and she was not well for the entire rest of the journey.

We were traveling in May. I had DEET with me and never used it. We were not bothered by bugs--not flies, not mosquitos.

We did the Imperial Jewels in August. Also had DEET with us and never had to use it. We also did not encounter any bugs.

We also had the masks to use in case of pollution, but never had to use those either.

Yes, the air quality was not the highest in Shanghai and Beijing, but on the days we were there, it was good enough. Photos below show what the air looked like. Beijing had more pollution than Shanghai.

Shanghai - Huangpu River seen from Shangri-La Hotel

Beijing - Zhengyang Gate, Tiananmen Square

We were on Imperial Jewels last May. We did bring DEET with us but never used it; never saw a single mosquito along the river or anywhere else.

We were also lucky in Beijing and Shanghai with blue skies. (Xi'an was another story -- so polluted you couldn't even see the sky.)

(photos by Turtles06)

At Caribill

Thanks, that is helpful. The pictures are awesome.

(Xi'an was another story -- so polluted you couldn't even see the sky.)

 

 

The skies were not clear for us in Xi'an either, but we felt no discomfort from it.

Xi'an street scene

Terra Cotta Warriors building with chariots on display inside

We were on Imperial Jewels last May. We did bring DEET with us but never used it; never saw a single mosquito along the river or anywhere else.

 

We were also lucky in Beijing and Shanghai with blue skies. (Xi'an was another story -- so polluted you couldn't even see the sky.)

 

 

 

(photos by Turtles06)

You were lucky!! May, 2010 was smoggy and I don't remember seeing blue skies. Just goes to show that past results are not a predictor of future performance!

As for the pollution in Xi'an, that is where the lady from our cruise had her first asthma attack; luckily, it was the end of the cruise.

Kohola, thanks for the great review.

Your trip sounds fantastically immersive. I have been to China before, but my husband hasn't and I was worried that it might be too "tour-y" and prevent him from being able to experience the authentic elements of China that are so engaging. Your post reassured me that the opportunities are there, we just have to make them happen.

Welcome home, and I can't wait to go!

Thanks...we travel in the hopes of fostering friendships which will lead to future visits.

Here is a message we received the last night of the cruise from someone we met in 2009 and visited with this time...it almost brought us to tears!

"Bob and Deb,

Have a good sleep. Sad to say goodbye. Maybe this is the last time we stay together. If there is one more chance you come to China, I would like to invite you to my home as a relative and bring you to visit our old soil house and live together for several days. It's still like I was dreaming that I could see you again this time. Thank you! Love,xxx"

The Chinese do not use the word "love" in their correspondence so when it was expressed in the message we felt so honored. You can complain that China is too crowded, polluted, dirty, and the food is not fit to eat or you can go with the attitude that you are going to make one person in China out of 1.4 billion feel special;-) The opportunities are there you just have look for them.

The rewards of embracing their culture are tremendous. China has a social networking site which combines all the elements of our various social sites into one...the Chinese refer to it as Cuckoo...QQ.com. We communicate with friends in China through it almost daily.

I posted photos of the various public areas of the ship at:

During our cruise there was a steady stream of passengers going to the doctor for various travel related discomforts. I doubt if they were eating in the local dives or brushing their teeth with tap water so do be aware that there is a good possibility that something will disagree with you despite taking all the precautions.

Another lesson learned...the luggage tags provided by Viking have a tendency to work themselves loose during all the transfers. We lost both of ours during the ship to Xian transfer and later found another passenger's laying on the ground during the transfer from the last hotel in Beijing to the airport. A little duct tape over the buckle will prevent this.

I posted photos on Facebook of our China trip... https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.329113913810820.80331.100001366410145&type=3&l=64fd28952f

Oh my, it took my breath away. I can't wait till July. Someone told me that it would be addictive, I believe it. I might have to quit my job and just be a traveler.

Kohola, thanks for the photo links. You are truly getting me excited. This will be our first tour-group vacation and I'm sort of nervous. Never thought myself to be the "group" type. We like to eat with the locals. We have been to Europe, Hong Kong and Tokyo by oursleves. Even visited Tunis, Tunisia by ourselves during a Med cruise. (Crusie director wanted our name and cabin number because he said "no one ever does that".) You have given me hope that we can make this trip work.

Thanks Kohola for the exercise room info and photo. It looks perfectly adequate for our needs. (now I just need to see how adequate my good intentions are haha)

It sounds like you made some lasting relationships. Memories of my experiences with people in China are more vivid than my best photos. It truly is a special place (once you get past the pollution, the crowding, and the sometimes weird sounding food)

We just returned from the Mar 27-Apr 13 China Cultural Delights cruise. We don’t cruise a lot so I registered with CC and gained some wonderful insight from all the postings on this thread. I didn’t want to give a detailed day to day experience but thought a general summary of our experience might be beneficial and a means of returning the favor to other future cruisers. I apologize for the length in advance but hopefully a lot of information in one place will be helpful.

1. This was the trip and experience of a lifetime. You’ll see the great, good and not so good. The Chinese and their culture are fascinating. We Americans could learn a lot from them and vice versa. This will be something I’ll remember forever.

2. We started our cruise in Shanghai. There's a lot of debate as to whether Shanghai or Beijing is the better starting point. At the end, most of us would have dreaded starting from Beijing. Some specifics:

a. The Yangtze River is incredibly polluted. If you’ve cruised in Europe you’ll be shocked. The lower Yangtze is nothing more than thousands of smoke belching ships running on a cargo shipping highway. West of the Three Gorges Dam it all changed to beautiful scenery and the water was a nice emerald green.

b. Everyone was suffering from serious jet lag and the three days in Beijing are the by far the most physically demanding. The Great Wall is a strenuous climb. As tired as we were the first couple of days I would have hated to start in Beijing.

c. For most of us the highlights of the trip are in Xian and Beijing so the scenery and experiences gradually got better each day and it was good to end the trip on a high.

3. To say Viking is organized is an incredible understatement. After going through Chinese customs (quick and easy) it was the last time we would have to physically move our luggage. Viking collected our luggage and it was waiting for us at the hotel. Viking pre-checks you in at each hotel and gives you your room key while on the bus from the airport. When flying from city to city, they pick up your luggage from your room, take it to the airport, and put it through security. They take it off the carousel once we land and transport it to the next hotel. It was incredible.

4. On the bus from the Shanghai airport we were given our guide assignments. This person will be your “mother” for the entire trip and they are wonderful. Consider yourself VERY lucky if you get Larry.

5. The excursion to the school was touching. Don’t miss it.

6. Take a small bottle of hand sanitizer everywhere you go and wash your hands frequently.

7. Take some toilet paper with you every time you leave the ship. There’s not a Western sit down toilet everywhere you go and toilet paper is a luxury. Also be prepared for no paper towels at sink and the hand blowers are useless. It was comical to see everyone leaving the toilet shaking their hands or wiping them on their jeans.

8. We went to the both the Tang Dynasty Dinner in Xian and the Peking Opera and were glad we did. It was a beautiful experience.

9. I used Google Translator on my iPhone and it came in very handy. Type it in and show them the Chinese translation.

10. Ignore the Viking instructions about the 44 lb luggage limit and 11 lb carryon limit. It’s not enforced. They stated they can’t change their literature as these limits are China law but it’s never enforced. While on the planes we saw Chinese passengers bringing on carryon luggage so big it would have never been allowed in the States.

11. Leave the converters and adapters at home. The hotels and the ship have plenty of them and most outlets now are “adapters” and accept multiple types of plugs. The bathroom on the ship and every hotel has a 110v plug.

12. The ship and all hotels have umbrellas. We should have left ours home. We were VERY lucky as it only rained one day. My poncho came in very handy as I didn’t have to hold an umbrella and take pictures.

13. The air pollution is staggering. I had expected it but never anticipated it would be as bad as it is. If you have any type of breathing issues be sure to bring your meds. Visine is also a must.

14. Bring every type of over the counter medication you can think of…heartburn, nausea, diarrhea (bring an entire bottle of Imodium), constipation, allergies etc. We had Cipro which I would encourage you to do. On our 4th day on the cruise about 20 guests, including myself, came down with diarrhea. Nothing real serious for anyone. My wife was fine but I spent the day in the room. 36 hrs later most of us were about 75% and getting better.

15. Unlike in Europe, Viking doesn’t own the ship rather they lease it from New Century. The “Officer” level staff and Tour Escorts work for Viking but the food servers, room attendants etc are employed by New Century. From the outside, the ship is not overly exciting but the inside is beautiful and the crew keeps it spotless.

16. The food on the ship is good but not great. We did the Viking Grand European Tour two years ago and the food was significantly better. You’ll eat several meals in Chinese restaurants and again, some were good, but most were ok…just like in the U.S. Real Chinese food is not like what you get at your local place. It’s new dishes, flavors and textures we’re not used. Go with an open mind and try it. The ship wait staff is an entirely different story. They are the hardest working people on the ship and they will do anything to help you. Again, consider yourself lucky if you get Maggie or May as your server. They are sweet hearts.

17. The street food is beautiful. Photograph it but don’t eat it…ever. I read that some posters have but Larry strongly advised against it.

18. A number of the excursions are nothing more than getting you into a sales room (silk, jade or pottery and rugs to buy something. You’ll go on a 10-15 min tour of the factor then spend the next 30-45 min in the showroom. While some liked to shop I thought the tour portion was interesting but the shopping was a huge waste of time and would have preferred to go walking and exploring. We skipped the ceramic tour not wanting to endure a 4 hour round trip bus ride.

19. Pick pockets are everywhere. It won’t take you long to recognize the likely culprits. Leave your wallet and documents in the safe. I put money in my front pocket. I carried a fanny pack and kept it in front of me. If you wear it in the back it’s too easy for them to unzip it and take something.

20. The internet is hit or miss but MUCH better than the European cruise. A number of people complained about no or slow access but it wasn’t a big inconvenience.

21. Our time in Xian was just too short. Viking, if you read this, many of the passengers would have gladly given up one of the other days (especially one of the shopping excursions) to have an extra time in Xian. It’s a fascinating city and we didn’t have much time to go explore.

22. The hotels were a surprise. We stayed at the Ritz Carlton in Shanghai. It’s quite a way from the Bund and we would have preferred to stay in the Shangri-La with another group right in the middle of the city. In Xian we stayed at the Hilton and in Beijing the Westin. The last two were new 5 star hotels. You will not be disappointed.

23. The Chinese people are so friendly. When we skipped the ceramic tour a group of us took off to explore the local city. I would strongly encourage you to do this. Be brave and adventurous. My iPhone GPS worked like a charm but you really don’t need it. Chinese stopped to stare at us and wanted their picture taken with us. We learned later that very few Viking guests do this so we were likely the first live Westerners they had ever seen. It was one of the most memorable experiences of the cruise. The Chinese are very proud of their children. We took hard candy from the ship and gave it out which was a huge it. Always “ask” if it’s ok to take their picture. Just point to your camera. They get it. I would suggest getting a short set of phrases like “May I take your picture”. Also on your first or second day learn to say “Please”, “Thank You” and “You’re welcome” in Chinese. (The ship has a basic Chinese class but it’s not till about a week into the cruise.) The Chinese are really surprised and appreciative when you extend these basic courtesies in their language. They are taught English starting in the first grade so don’t be surprised to run across some that speak very good English.

24. Dress on the ship and daily excursions is informal. You did see a couple of sports coats but it was the exception. Jeans were the norm and many wore shorts daily. Don’t try to pack for all 17 days. We used the ship laundry several times and it’s reasonable.

25. You’ll be provided an unlimited supply of bottled drinking water every day. On the ship, they serve water from pitchers but it’s from bottles. We had no concerns about the ice on the ship or in the hotels and were assured it was very safe and we had it every day with our water and drinks. The bus has plenty of bottled water for the excursions. In the local restaurants you are provided bottled water but stay away from the ice.

26. My debit card worked fine everywhere. Just be sure to use the ATM in the hotels or the big international banks like Bank of China. Bank of China ATMs have an English option. The ATMs in smaller local banks won’t work and you may not get your card out of the machine. The money is all RMD. On the ship they can't exchange money but can give your change for larger RMB bills.

27. Money. We read several posts about taking $150 in $1.00 bills for tips. I think $100 is more than enough. On our excursions we gave the local guide $3.00 and the bus driver $2.00.

28. Local venders. You love them or hate them. Some just won’t leave you alone. If you’re going to return to the same place after an excursion NEVER say “later” because they have a great memory and when you get back they will just not leave you alone. We were advised not to make eye contact with them. If you start talking to them saying you’re not interested then they don’t understand a lot of English so they think you’re bartering with them and they persist. Some of you may not agree with what I’m about to say here but so be it. It was fun bartering. It’s amazing how far they will come down in price. It’s a game and always smile. But don’t take it to an extreme. These people are poor beyond your imagination. Sure I could have worked them even more to get the price even lower but I might only save $1-$2 more. We’ll spend $6-$10 on a glass a wine and not give it a second thought. These people are trying to scrape out a meager living and if I give them a couple of dollars more then I was ok.

In closing be prepared for the experience of a lifetime. Be flexible and and you’ll be warmly welcomed by the Chinese. We are hooked on Viking and hope to go back to Europe next year.

We just returned from the Mar 27-Apr 13 China Cultural Delights cruise. We don’t cruise a lot so I registered with CC and gained some wonderful insight from all the postings on this thread. I didn’t want to give a detailed day to day experience but thought a general summary of our experience might be beneficial and a means of returning the favor to other future cruisers. I apologize for the length in advance but hopefully a lot of information in one place will be helpful.

 

What a great report. Thanks for posting it.

ditto!! Please keep posting and answering questions.

We just returned from the Mar 27-Apr 13 China Cultural Delights cruise. We don’t cruise a lot so I registered with CC and gained some wonderful insight from all the postings on this thread. I didn’t want to give a detailed day to day experience but thought a general summary of our experience might be beneficial and a means of returning the favor to other future cruisers. I apologize for the length in advance but hopefully a lot of information in one place will be helpful.

 

Welcome to CC; glad you had such a great time in China (as did we), and thanks for taking the time to put up such a detailed report! I'm sure future travelers will really appreciate it.

We just returned from the Mar 27-Apr 13 China Cultural Delights cruise.

Thank you so much for such an excellent trip report. We don't go until 10/19 but it is very exciting to anticipate and read about other's experiences.

Karl

Mtlycew1: Thanks so much for the information....lots of tips. We are getting excited about our Roof of the World trip on October 8. We are going a couple of days early to Beijing. Thanks again. Ruthlynn

Kohola: Beautiful pictures of your lovely trip....you two travel with such eagerness and such pleasant smiles.....that makes for a great time! Thanks. Ruthlynn

Kohola: Beautiful pictures of your lovely trip....you two travel with such eagerness and such pleasant smiles.....that makes for a great time! Thanks. Ruthlynn

Thanks Ruthlynn...we embrace China warts and all. It's easy to smile in a place where the people treat you like a celebrity if you just take the time to say NiHao. I am so looking forward to traveling as a relative and living in a "soil" house with an actual Chinese family...the ultimate honor in my opinion to create a relationship where you're considered family and not another tourist...now I just have to convince my wife it will be just like camping;-).

Hey Mtlycrew1 enjoyed reading your report...we traveled with Jin and sat with Candy and Jacky at the forward stbd table for most meals. Nice to see you explored JinJiang, that place was amazing! Hope you ventured over to the lake and mingled with the locals.

A lot of the Chinese will say MeiGuo which is Chinese for the USA when they try to talk to you...pronounced like May then like Guave minus the "ave" and add an "o." Or ChangJiang which is the Chinese name for the river the English speaking people call the Yangtze because they want to know if you're traveling on the river and where you're going.

We also think Larry is an incredible guide...he is one of those guides that is always available when you have a question even if he isn't your tour escort.

The vendors will not bother you if make it clear it's a waste of their time...no eye contact and a verbal, but polite BuYao...boo yow, rhymes with how, then a little sterner if required and normally you won't see another one. BuYao translates as "don't want or don't need." There are more than enough tourists that will smile and make eye contact for them to pounce on.

Another change for those who have traveled before...Lesser 3 Gorges boat tour has been shortened, they now turn around at the hanging coffin.

We also had Francis as our guide during our China trip back in 2009. He was such a wonderful person and we felt we really got to know him. He was very open about sharing information on his family, his life, etc. VRC does an excellent job in China.

We just booked our second cruise with VRC to the Mekong for 2013. Can't wait!

Another change for those who have traveled before...Lesser 3 Gorges boat tour has been shortened, they now turn around at the hanging coffin.

That is disappointing.

That is disappointing.

It was for us;-) We used the more Chinese looking tourist boats this time vice a regular vessel...a lot more room on deck.

In 2009, we stayed at the Shangri La in Xian and thought the Xian was just another industrialized polluted city, but this time we were inside the city wall at the Hyatt. The city center is a beautiful place especially at night. We never had an opportunity to walk around and see the city with the hectic schedule, but those staying at the Hyatt are within a few blocks of the wall and there is a Chinese Muslim community just across the street that comes alive at night for some great photo ops.

Our guide told us the Chinese eat garlic shoots to help kill bacteria to prevent issues with eating some foods. We were served garlic shoot dishes during most of the hotel meals...don't know if this was a preventative measure or just a change in cuisine. Last time we had sweet and sour fish at most Chinese meals served with a complete fish, but only once this time...