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The decline of “traditional” dining


johnmpcny

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http://www.cntraveler.com/daily-traveler/2012/11/cruise-line-improvements-2013

 

"Norwegian Cruise Line, home of the “freestyle” concept in which ships feature numerous dining options, most of which levy extra fees, has also earned brickbats from Cruise Critic readers for letting quality lapse in the main restaurants."

 

I thought I would post this for your reaction. I know I used to look at cruising and think what a great culinary experience it would be. Not so much.

 

Now I know I have to pay for that, yes I just add it in. I have long described the MDR as Applebee's on a good day and Bob's Big Boy or Ponderosa on most days.

 

After reading the post here today about the head chef and his comments ending pretty much in "it is business decision", I now understand this is not lack of information that NCL does have but NCL has clearly chosen this food quality status and path as right for them. A price vs profit in that, you want better food pay for it in the pay dinning options.

 

What say you all is food quality lacking in the free choices? is it getting worse? and if not then why is it the number one cruising complaint?

 

From CC themselves this quote.

 

"the biggest complaint we get at Cruise Critic these days is the disintegration of the main dining room venue. Once the pinnacle of cruise dining—and an option that is always fee-free—the main restaurant typically was your table-away-from-home. Fabulous features included adventurous menus and intimate service by waiters who remembered your name, drink, and favorite grandchild’s middle name. But with more emphasis being placed on additional-fee specialty eateries, quality in these venues, by many reports, has sunk to new lows."

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I like Applebees, Bob's Big Boy, and Ponderosa. I have not had an issue with the overall food quality on either of the lines that I have sailed with, but of course I don't have an "old days" point of reference either;). I don't expect 5 star quality at a 3 star price.

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As Sparks noted, I as well don't have the "good old days" to compare to. I also have no issue with the included dining on the cruises I took.

 

If cruiseline food has gone down since the "good old days" then something else that has to be taken into consideration is, that so has the cost. I can remember a time when cruising was not even on my radar, the cost was far too high to even consider it as a vacation choice.

 

I guess people have to make up their minds, higher cruise costs and limited people that can afford it or more affordable cruising with add ons like specialty restaurants to tailor your vacation to what you wish it to be.

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I do have the "old times" to reference and my comment is this. We paid a substantial amount more for our "old" cruising on NCL than we do today. We paid far more in those dollars back in the 80's for an inside than we do for a balcony today. People demand more and more for less. All you have to do is price out a cruise on one of the "high end" cruise lines to see what the food and service cost. There is no free lunch!!! All the cruise lines sail in the same ocean and mostly the same ports. The only "real" difference is the food and service. You can get the quality you want if your willing to pay, but who is???

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Personally , i don't think the food is that bad, some people are never happy, they will complain about anything, even fish that have a fishy smell, huh?

 

Well 100% of the time when your fish "smells fishy" it's not fresh. In fact, it's probably closer to the rotten side of the scale than the fresh side. If you get smelly fish @ a restaurant, send it back, get up and leave !!

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As Sparks noted, I as well don't have the "good old days" to compare to. I also have no issue with the included dining on the cruises I took.

 

If cruiseline food has gone down since the "good old days" then something else that has to be taken into consideration is, that so has the cost. I can remember a time when cruising was not even on my radar, the cost was far too high to even consider it as a vacation choice.

 

I guess people have to make up their minds, higher cruise costs and limited people that can afford it or more affordable cruising with add ons like specialty restaurants to tailor your vacation to what you wish it to be.

 

I do have the "old times" to reference and my comment is this. We paid a substantial amount more for our "old" cruising on NCL than we do today. We paid far more in those dollars back in the 80's for an inside than we do for a balcony today. People demand more and more for less. All you have to do is price out a cruise on one of the "high end" cruise lines to see what the food and service cost. There is no free lunch!!! All the cruise lines sail in the same ocean and mostly the same ports. The only "real" difference is the food and service. You can get the quality you want if your willing to pay, but who is???

 

If there was a like button............ you both would get a hit.

 

cheers...the Ump...:D

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One thing that concerns me is reading the recent reviews of many NCL ships (coming from many that loved their cruise) is the wait for freestyle dining. So many state they wait 30 - 45 minutes for a table and then miss the show. It is also very common to hear how the service in the MDR is suffering. With the wave of all the specialty restaurants I too wonder if the service and quality is suffering in the MDR.

We usually always eat in specialty restaurants. The service and food are excellent. But our last cruise we did eat at the MDR on Sky. The service was horrible. Once the food came, no one checked in to see how things were, no one came for re-fills, and they could not even handle a coffee order right. This is another reason we tend to stay away from the MDR.

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I like Applebees, Bob's Big Boy, and Ponderosa. I have not had an issue with the overall food quality on either of the lines that I have sailed with, but of course I don't have an "old days" point of reference either;). I don't expect 5 star quality at a 3 star price.

 

Ditto this. I've only been to the fancy 5-star type restaurants very few times in my life. I spend the rest of my life going to places like Applebees, Olive Garden, Chili's, the local mexican place, the local Thai place, etc. Always found the food to be this level or better. Never has a bad meal.

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The MDR on NCL ships is not as good as what we found on Celebrity. However, we thought the Epic MDR was better than the Jade and Gem.

The MDR on NCL can be good or can be so so, depending on what you eat. We found most of the fish dishes overcooked.

 

Yes, some days it is like Applebees, some like Bob's, but some like Ruby Tuesday's, which we like a lot.

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I for one would not go back to the ' Old Days '.

NO cellular @sea

No internet

No flat-screens

No recycling

High prices

Less dining options

 

Did you like film cameras .

Remember when $100 was a weeks pay .

Walking to school in the snow uphill both ways .

 

I don't care if a waiter does not know my name .

 

I'm happy when I can find a 7 day cruise for $299 pp :):)

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One thing that concerns me is reading the recent reviews of many NCL ships (coming from many that loved their cruise) is the wait for freestyle dining. So many state they wait 30 - 45 minutes for a table and then miss the show. It is also very common to hear how the service in the MDR is suffering. With the wave of all the specialty restaurants I too wonder if the service and quality is suffering in the MDR.

We usually always eat in specialty restaurants. The service and food are excellent. But our last cruise we did eat at the MDR on Sky. The service was horrible. Once the food came, no one checked in to see how things were, no one came for re-fills, and they could not even handle a coffee order right. This is another reason we tend to stay away from the MDR.

 

Well I'm sure NCL like all other companies have a few employees that do not meet standards. But from most posts I have seen relating to poor service, when asked if they told upper management the answer was usually no. Unless management can handle this issue individually, to weed out those that are not performing well, the people following on future cruises that get that employee will continue to have poor service.

 

A while back NCL was changing from the old "style" cards to a new system. I personally have seen no more posts regarding service issues than I did when I first joined CC back in 2009, but if this problem is getting more predominate, I wonder if there is a new system in place that is not doing as good a job at incentives for the employees to keep up standards.

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Does part of this come from how NCl promotes and sells the dinning experience?

 

"Every cruise fare includes beautifully crafted menus in our two main dining rooms, a help-yourself buffet and a variety of casual cafés, grills and on-the-go choices. From fresh-baked breads, desserts and pastries to our chefs' original dishes made with the freshest ingredients, your dining can be as fine or fun as you want.

 

Main Dining Rooms-Every ship has two complimentary Main Dining Rooms serving fresh, delicious cuisine.

 

Beyond Buffets- Our Chefs cook your food just the way you like it at endless buffets included in your cruise fare."

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http://www.cntraveler.com/daily-traveler/2012/11/cruise-line-improvements-2013

 

"Norwegian Cruise Line, home of the “freestyle” concept in which ships feature numerous dining options, most of which levy extra fees, has also earned brickbats from Cruise Critic readers for letting quality lapse in the main restaurants."

 

I thought I would post this for your reaction. I know I used to look at cruising and think what a great culinary experience it would be. Not so much.

 

Now I know I have to pay for that, yes I just add it in. I have long described the MDR as Applebee's on a good day and Bob's Big Boy or Ponderosa on most days.

 

After reading the post here today about the head chef and his comments ending pretty much in "it is business decision", I now understand this is not lack of information that NCL does have but NCL has clearly chosen this food quality status and path as right for them. A price vs profit in that, you want better food pay for it in the pay dinning options.

 

What say you all is food quality lacking in the free choices? is it getting worse? and if not then why is it the number one cruising complaint?

 

From CC themselves this quote.

 

"the biggest complaint we get at Cruise Critic these days is the disintegration of the main dining room venue. Once the pinnacle of cruise dining—and an option that is always fee-free—the main restaurant typically was your table-away-from-home. Fabulous features included adventurous menus and intimate service by waiters who remembered your name, drink, and favorite grandchild’s middle name. But with more emphasis being placed on additional-fee specialty eateries, quality in these venues, by many reports, has sunk to new lows."

 

 

Applebees sell Escargot, Lobster and Filet Steak ?

 

WOW !

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I will be able to compare the food from when I used to cruise a lot over 15 years ago and in a couple of weeks when I am on the pearl. Years ago not only was all of the food included, but all of the activities in the gym including workout classes. The only extras were drinks, tips, bingo , shore excursions and spa services. It is a bit disheartening to see so many added extra fees. I will be traveling with 3 first timers who I expect will really love the food as they have nothing to compare it to. I am also a non gourmet and visit Applebee's, Denny's and other regular restaurants so I am sure that the food will be wonderful for me as well. Would I love to visit the asian venue with my daughter who is currently teaching english in S. Korea? absolutely! But I will not because I feel that the MDRs will be more than adequate for us. At some point, some cruise ships will have so many fee added food venues that many will be forced to eat in them because they may be serving unappetizing "free food" in the MDRs and cruising will have lost the "almost all inclusive" brand that they made famous and competes against AI land vacations that do include everything in their prices.

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But our last cruise we did eat at the MDR on Sky. The service was horrible. Once the food came, no one checked in to see how things were, no one came for re-fills, and they could not even handle a coffee order right. This is another reason we tend to stay away from the MDR.

This describes my main complaint about the freestyle dining concept. I will choose NCL only if there is some compelling reason to do so (our retiree group cruises are usually on NCL). My first choice is always where I at least have the option for traditional dining, which I love. I have no problem with the quality of the food.

Kathy

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I will be able to compare the food from when I used to cruise a lot over 15 years ago and in a couple of weeks when I am on the pearl. Years ago not only was all of the food included, but all of the activities in the gym including workout classes. The only extras were drinks, tips, bingo , shore excursions and spa services. It is a bit disheartening to see so many added extra fees. I will be traveling with 3 first timers who I expect will really love the food as they have nothing to compare it to. I am also a non gourmet and visit Applebee's, Denny's and other regular restaurants so I am sure that the food will be wonderful for me as well. Would I love to visit the asian venue with my daughter who is currently teaching english in S. Korea? absolutely! But I will not because I feel that the MDRs will be more than adequate for us. At some point, some cruise ships will have so many fee added food venues that many will be forced to eat in them because they may be serving unappetizing "free food" in the MDRs and cruising will have lost the "almost all inclusive" brand that they made famous and competes against AI land vacations that do include everything in their prices.

 

Have you already compared the cost of cruising 15 years ago to now?

 

As I said before I consider the additional fee dining venues as a way for people to tailor their vacation their way. I don't believe they will ever go to "unappetizing free food":rolleyes:.

 

And AI land vacations cannot compete with the one thing that cruiseships do have an AI in...moving from one location to another. There was a poll done not that long ago on this board asking what criteria people used and the majority chose their cruise vacation based on itinerary not on food or what was included. And land vacations cannot offer that, therefore they are actually not competing but give an alternative vacation.

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One thing that concerns me is reading the recent reviews of many NCL ships (coming from many that loved their cruise) is the wait for freestyle dining. So many state they wait 30 - 45 minutes for a table and then miss the show. It is also very common to hear how the service in the MDR is suffering. With the wave of all the specialty restaurants I too wonder if the service and quality is suffering in the MDR.

 

I've only waited 30 minutes + is when we go anytime between 6:30-8:00, and that's when the majority of folks seem to want to get din din. If you really want to see a show, plan to go when the MDR is opening. I saw/heard so many people on our last cruise whine and complain cause they had to wait. Deal with it, or plan better. Early bird always gets a table!:D

 

I had no complaints about the quality of food in the MDR, but I'm not one whom complains about much unless its truly messed up.

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This describes my main complaint about the freestyle dining concept. I will choose NCL only if there is some compelling reason to do so (our retiree group cruises are usually on NCL). My first choice is always where I at least have the option for traditional dining, which I love. I have no problem with the quality of the food.

 

Kathy

 

How exactly does the "freestyle dining concept" have anything to do with "horrible service"? The "freestyle dining concept" is used every day on land for every restaurant that I have ever entered. I've had good service and bad service on land. There are crappy employees everywhere. At least with freestyle I have a good chance of not getting that same crappy employee the next night. With traditional dining, as I understand it, if you by chance got a crappy employee for your table, you get to have that same crappy employee all week. :(

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The ticket for a cruise is lower than fifteen years ago. Everything else has increased with inflation. The only place left for cost-saving was the menu. It has obviously declined. Dinner on a cruise really needs to better that a boil-in-bag 'meal' from TGI McChilbee's Garden. Or what's the point?

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I for one would not go back to the ' Old Days '.

NO cellular @sea

No internet

No flat-screens

No recycling

High prices

Less dining options

 

Did you like film cameras .

Remember when $100 was a weeks pay .

Walking to school in the snow uphill both ways .

 

I don't care if a waiter does not know my name .

 

I'm happy when I can find a 7 day cruise for $299 pp :):)

Cokes were a nickel and a movie was 15 cents. We had no snow where I grew up.

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I've only waited 30 minutes + is when we go anytime between 6:30-8:00, and that's when the majority of folks seem to want to get din din. If you really want to see a show, plan to go when the MDR is opening. I saw/heard so many people on our last cruise whine and complain cause they had to wait. Deal with it, or plan better. Early bird always gets a table!:D

 

I had no complaints about the quality of food in the MDR, but I'm not one whom complains about much unless its truly messed up.

 

This is what I was going to say. You see the lines at peak times, on embarkation day because they all want the lobster or like in the most recent reviews, they went on Thanksgiving Day! Have never had a problem with MDR dining on any of the NCL ships we have sailed on.

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The real key here, and it's been mentioned already is the price. My first cruise was four to an inside and we paid $750 each for a week in the Caribbean. The food was gourmet, and the service was fantastic.

 

The other issue is quite frankly, the logistics of a waiter knowing what you drink in Freestyle is impossible, as they've likely never served you before, so not a service issue.

 

The food I've had in Applebee's has not been good, which is why I won't go back there, so not a fair comparison in my opinion. I eat some of my meals in the specialties because I have favourites that they serve there. On my last cruise we had some excellent meals in the main dining rooms, and some that we're good. I did see people complain about some of the dishes that others raved about, which brings back subjectivity.

 

At first I didnt like the idea of one side fixed menu, but now I do. I am a creature of habit, and if I find something I like to eat, it's nice to be able to get it again. In the old days of only one restaurant and BTW it was only open at certain times, you were out of luck for food otherwise, if you had a dish you liked, you couldn't ever have it again...but your waiter had lime in your water and knew you had a cat at home.

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How exactly does the "freestyle dining concept" have anything to do with "horrible service"? The "freestyle dining concept" is used every day on land for every restaurant that I have ever entered. I've had good service and bad service on land. There are crappy employees everywhere. At least with freestyle I have a good chance of not getting that same crappy employee the next night. With traditional dining, as I understand it, if you by chance got a crappy employee for your table, you get to have that same crappy employee all week. :(

 

Thank you. You saved me so much typing. :D

 

OP it seems like you might happier taking the higher end higher priced lines. As for me, I don't care how good food might be if I have to eat it among forced company it's not a culinary experience I'm interested in.

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