so exactly WHAT does the Harbor Master do while on board?

Is anyone privy to what ACTUALLY goes on in the pilot house during disembarkment (or approach)?

Can I assume the captain has full control over the ship's movement, with

the Harbor Master looking over his shoulder, giving hints or advice for

each specific entry/departure route, depending on harbor conditions?

Given the specialized computer-driven piloting systems driving the boat,

I can't see the Harbor Master being trained to actually hands-on operate every boat he is monitoring...

Sorry, I'm an engineer (computer, not railroad), and am always curious as to how things work.

I think the person you are referring to is the Pilot. While many ports do have a Harbor Master, they generally direct the over all port operations from shore side, it would be unusual for a harbor master to be aboard.

When the pilot is on board they are in an advisory capacity almost everywhere. They provide local knowledge, coordination with the port in vessel movement, docking etc. In larger ports they will usually "con" the ship, in other words give engine and steering commands.

The pilot normally will not take physical control of ship, they will let the ship's crew do that but they provide the heading or ask for varying degrees of rudder angle, use of the bow/stern thruster as well as the speed of the ship.

Agree. The "Harbor Master" doesn't come on board, the pilot does.

The Pilot is an expert on the harbor involved, it's currents, traffic patterns and any hazards. A Captain on a ship can't possibly have the knowledge the Pilot brings with them. Remember, a ship's Captain might sail in and dock in a given port once a week. A Pilot might dock several ships in that harbor per day.

Yes, all the trick electronics on board help. But they can't overcome every issue. Yes, the Captain knows the way his/her ship handles, but can't possibly know all the issues in a given port.

As Bill says, the Pilot (often required by the ship's insurance company and the port) is on the Bridge in an advisory capacity. The Captain is still responsible for his/her ship and makes the final decisions. Two Captain's have told us that in most cases they are very reliant on competent pilots, but sometimes (not often) they might get a pilot for which they have little confidence...in which case they might tactfully ignore some advice or certainly question the wisdom of the advice. The standards for Pilots are very high in most major ports of the world so most of the time there is a little give and take and everyone is happy. By the way, the one exception to the rule is the Panama Canal where the Canal Pilot has full command authority while a ship is transiting the canal. The Pilots often come aboard with some additional "rope handler" personnel to work with the ship's normal crew.

Hank

Even the best sometimes make mistakes. In 1983 the USS Enterprise, the aircraft carrier, not the starship, ran aground on a sandbar in San Francisco Bay. It was stuck about 1/2 mile from NAS Alameda for about 6 hours.

An official of the civilian San Francisco Bar Pilots Association said a civilian pilot had been in charge of steering the ship as it sailed under the Golden Gate Bridge but had turned over command to a Navy pilot before the Enterprise went aground.

Coincidentally, George Tekai, who plays Mr. Sulu in the 'Star Trek' series flew aboard the ship at 7 a.m. on a helicopter. He later quipped, 'Our vessel is the starship Enterprise and this is the USS Enterprise. We've got a new drink -- Enterprise on the Rocks.'

:cool:

Do you mean Pilot?.rather than harbormasterr?

Very informative. Thanks!

As others have said, it is the harbor pilot, not the harbor master.

The harbor pilot has passed an exam to be granted pilotage privileges in the specific port he/she is working. This normally includes drawing, by hand, the harbor and its approaches, with all navigational aids correctly placed and identified, and all hazards (shallow water, wrecks, etc) properly identified. The pilot then starts training on small ships under the guidance of a senior pilot, and then works his/her way up the scale of ships.

The Captain is in command of the ship, but after a "Master/Pilot Exchange" where they discuss the weather, the ship's capabilities, and any changes in harbor conditions, the Captain will give "the conn" to the pilot, meaning that the pilot gives commands for the use of the steering, propulsion, and thrusters to the ship's bridge crew. The pilot will never touch a control, even to the point of asking permission to have the range scale changed on the radars.

While coming into port, there is a helmsman who steers the ship (even ships with azipods, where he just controls the direction of the pods), a bridge officer at the engine telegraph (which on today's ships actually controls the ahead and astern speed of the propulsion. The full bridge team on a cruise ship during arrival/departure is the Captain, Staff Captain, Senior Officer of the Watch, Junior Officer of the Watch, the helmsman and a lookout.

When the ship gets close to the dock, the Captain will shift control of steering, thrusters, and propulsion to a control stand on the bridge wing on the dock side of the ship. He and the pilot will go out on that wing to get a better view of the docking. The Captain will at this time be operating the controls, under the pilots orders. As others have said, the Captain has the right to "interpret" the pilot's orders, and perhaps not give so much thrust or as much propulsion power as the pilot requests, and this is pretty common.

In legal terms, the pilot is an adviser to the Captain on local conditions.

Normally, the only time the ship will not have a pilot onboard is if the Captain or Staff Captain have obtained pilotage for that port, by passing the same examination as the local pilots.

To add to what Hank said, in addition to the pilot having command during the Panama Canal transit, when a ship enters or leaves a drydock, the pilot has command as well, if any part of the ship is over or in the dock.

The NCL Captains and Staff Captains in Hawaii all have pilotage for all the ports the ship visits, so no pilots taken. They train using an onboard simulator, which has electronic charts of all the ports.

Wow, great, detailed info about stuff we don't normally get to think about.

Thanks all around.

Given the all "Harbor Master" corrections I've received, I'll quote

Elton John-

"Take me to the pilot"

DH and I are generally early risers so we try to be out on deck as we come in to port. It's fun to watch the pilot come on board - especially if it's a bit rough. Not a job for the faint-hearted.

Two added notes here: As ideal a maritime job as this may seem to some (i.e., regular work hours where you get to go home at the end of your work day), what can be terrific pay in certain locations (e.g., San Francisco), transferring between a pilot boat and a ship is often a situation where any misstep can be fatal.

Secondly, to OP and other interested folks: If you want to learn more about bridge and or engine room operations (perhaps even taking control during a docking procedure), a little research on your part regarding regional US maritime academies may identify opportunities to visit/tour their simulator centers.

Of particular interest is the main deck simulator at the California State University's California Maritime Academy in Vallejo. Within its custom built silo, it provides a 360 degree, multi-story depiction of ports, weather, conditions, ship types, etc. that is state-of-the-art. Likewise, the CMA engine room simulators demonstrate every eventuality.

Google CMA (or any of the other approx 100+ worldwide, including 7 in the US). Best first contact would be their Office of Development.

And the pilots don't usually go home every night. They tend to work a week at a time, and when they are through bringing a ship into port, they go to the association's headquarters (bunk rooms, kitchen, TV, etc) and wait for the next outbound ship. When they get off outside the port, in some locations there is a pilot station boat that sleeps 10-20 pilots while waiting for inbound ships. And there are not "regular working hours" in most ports, since ship traffic goes in and out 24/7, so the pilots work night and day.

And yes, a harbor pilot is recognized as one of the most dangerous and stressful jobs out there.

some more PILOT tid bits

- in many ports there are more than one pilot involved. In San Fran which has been mentioned there is one group for the bay, another if continuing up river to Sacramento and special groups called docking pilots for some of the individual port areas around the bay. Pilots are "employed" by the State in the US, so if a ship in transit crosses state boundaries, the pilot changes . . . coming from sea and heading to Baltimore? Pick up a Virginia pilot off Norfolk but change to Maryland when you get up north a bit.

- you don't have to be in a 'harbor' to need a pilot. If you've taken an Alaskan cruise: the entire time cruising the 'inland passage' a pilot is on board and depending on where the ship is the pilot may be American or Canadian

- pilotage is mandatory by the laws of most countries and not free .... I've had just about every possible form of pilot board my ship from highly qualified to falling down drunk. In some cases the pilot speaks only their native tongue and was unable to communicate with anyone on the ship. I had 'em come to the bridge and immediately start issuing commands to the helm and engines and others who simply asked for coffee and their fee and never said another word . . . MOST introduce himself to the Captain/Master and begin a discussion of the ship characteristics and how the relationship between the two will happen during their time together.

- the relationship between the pilot and the master is a delicate tap dance not taught in seamanship school!

- Some of the most significant ship 'incidents' in US ports have turned out to a result of the pilot's action for which the Master holds the bag ... but the pilot TOO can loose their license and be fined . . . on the other hand the pilots all tend to know each other so if you see another ship approaching the pilot probably knows the pilot over there and they tend to have a shorthand to talk to one another ... and if tugs will be involved the pilots work with the local tugs every day. As a 'government vessel' of the US I was generally exempt from pilot requirements in the US, but in some ports would take a pilot anyway just because it was smart to do so . . .

As Bill says, the Pilot (often required by the ship's insurance company and the port) is on the Bridge in an advisory capacity. The Captain is still responsible for his/her ship and makes the final decisions. Two Captain's have told us that in most cases they are very reliant on competent pilots, but sometimes (not often) they might get a pilot for which they have little confidence...in which case they might tactfully ignore some advice or certainly question the wisdom of the advice. The standards for Pilots are very high in most major ports of the world so most of the time there is a little give and take and everyone is happy. By the way, the one exception to the rule is the Panama Canal where the Canal Pilot has full command authority while a ship is transiting the canal. The Pilots often come aboard with some additional "rope handler" personnel to work with the ship's normal crew.

 

Hank

Good summary - there is one other (admittedly rare) exception : the instant the bow of the ship crosses the sill of a dry dock, the pilot has full authority and responsibility.

There are times when the captain needs to ignore the pilot's recommendations: as my ship entered Ponce harbor on the south coast of Puerto Rico, the pilot put his finger down on the pilot house chart saying "we anchor here" -- touching a spot with approximately four foot depth vs. our 16 foot draft. As Officer of The Deck I followed my captain's suggestion that I not mention the incident in the log - nor the strong aroma of Bacardi which had accompanied the pilot on board.

I believe the captain did mention the incident to our squadron commodore.

Celebrity have documentaries about this. Not sure if you can find it online, but they have it onboard the ships tv.

As our cruise ship was sailing south down the English Channel, we seemed to be surrounded by the fast ferries to and from Calais, France/ Dover UK. A crew member told us that all the captains on these ferries have passed their pilot's exam, so they can negotiate the two ports quickly and safely without having to wait for a pilot slot.

One cruise captain said that he did wait for people if they were late- for a short while, but it could mean missing his tides and his pilot slot.

The pilots job can be interesting (we once spent time with a New York Harbor Pilot). For the very busy port of New York they have the Sandy Hooks Pilots Association and their pilots are very well trained over a period of many years. Because the traffic scheme for NY is so vast, they actually have too pilot ships (Pilot 1 and Pilot 2) that stay out in the ocean many miles from the harbor. When a Pilot take a ship out, they are then transferred to the Pilot ship (via the smaller pilot boats we have all seen) where they have a mandatory rest/sleep period. They will eventually be taken out to another ship that needs piloted into the harbor. This is a pretty neat scheme and avoids the pilots having to be hauled a long distance to and from ships. Our Pilot friend has told us some interesting stories about the bad part of the job such as trying to board a large container ship in a blizzard when the ladder was totally coated with thick ice. ARgh!

Hank

As our cruise ship was sailing south down the English Channel, we seemed to be surrounded by the fast ferries to and from Calais, France/ Dover UK. A crew member told us that all the captains on these ferries have passed their pilot's exam, so they can negotiate the two ports quickly and safely without having to wait for a pilot slot.

One cruise captain said that he did wait for people if they were late- for a short while, but it could mean missing his tides and his pilot slot.

I'm pretty sure that it's the same for the cruiseferries between Sweden and Finland/Estonia/Latvia. I have never seen a pilot onboard those.

Researching Astoria, OR I found the Columbia River Bar Pilots Assoc. interesting stuff.

http://columbiariverbarpilots.com

Sent from my iPhone using Forums mobile app

DH and I are generally early risers so we try to be out on deck as we come in to port. It's fun to watch the pilot come on board - especially if it's a bit rough. Not a job for the faint-hearted.

Yep and get from the ship to the pilot boat as you leave.

In the great harbor of New York City, the Sandy Hook Pilots actually live on board a large boat during their shift days. This is much more convenient than being on land. They then take a smaller pilot boat to meet the ship.

Also, you might be surprised to learn that most pilots earn more than the ship's captain- much more!

Here's some reading:

http://njmonthly.com/articles/jersey-living/leading-giants-by-the-helm/

http://www.npr.org/2012/03/21/149091141/harbor-pilots-reap-high-rewards-for-dangerous-job

http://www.sandyhookpilots.com/

 

When the pilot is on board they are in an advisory capacity almost everywhere. They provide local knowledge, coordination with the port in vessel movement, docking etc. In larger ports they will usually "con" the ship, in other words give engine and steering commands.

 

.

Not exactly 100% true. During a Panama Canal transit, the Captain turns over complete control of the ship to the pilot who has 100% responsibility for getting the ship through the canal.

DON

One of my uncles is a retired harbor pilot and one of my cousins (his son) is a harbor pilot. They work in Hampton Roads in Virginia. Heard some interesting stories from them! One included a mishap with a bridge...

Not exactly 100% true. During a Panama Canal transit, the Captain turns over complete control of the ship to the pilot who has 100% responsibility for getting the ship through the canal.

 

DON

Please note Bill's "almost everywhere". He grew up in the Canal zone (family employed there), and would know this. And as I mentioned, another place is when the ship crosses the "sill" of the drydock, the shipyard's pilot takes complete responsibility for the ship.

I seem to remember there is one other place where the pilot takes command, but it is so esoteric that I forget what it is 90% of the time.

some more PILOT tid bits

 

- in many ports there are more than one pilot involved. In San Fran which has been mentioned there is one group for the bay, another if continuing up river to Sacramento and special groups called docking pilots for some of the individual port areas around the bay. Pilots are "employed" by the State in the US, so if a ship in transit crosses state boundaries, the pilot changes . . . coming from sea and heading to Baltimore? Pick up a Virginia pilot off Norfolk but change to Maryland when you get up north a bit.

 

- you don't have to be in a 'harbor' to need a pilot. If you've taken an Alaskan cruise: the entire time cruising the 'inland passage' a pilot is on board and depending on where the ship is the pilot may be American or Canadian

 

- pilotage is mandatory by the laws of most countries and not free .... I've had just about every possible form of pilot board my ship from highly qualified to falling down drunk. In some cases the pilot speaks only their native tongue and was unable to communicate with anyone on the ship. I had 'em come to the bridge and immediately start issuing commands to the helm and engines and others who simply asked for coffee and their fee and never said another word . . . MOST introduce himself to the Captain/Master and begin a discussion of the ship characteristics and how the relationship between the two will happen during their time together.

 

- the relationship between the pilot and the master is a delicate tap dance not taught in seamanship school!

 

- Some of the most significant ship 'incidents' in US ports have turned out to a result of the pilot's action for which the Master holds the bag ... but the pilot TOO can loose their license and be fined . . . on the other hand the pilots all tend to know each other so if you see another ship approaching the pilot probably knows the pilot over there and they tend to have a shorthand to talk to one another ... and if tugs will be involved the pilots work with the local tugs every day. As a 'government vessel' of the US I was generally exempt from pilot requirements in the US, but in some ports would take a pilot anyway just because it was smart to do so . . .

Further to your excellent comments and insight, here is a link to a paper by a member of the International Maritime Pilots Association, where he describes the Captain/Pilot relationship in these terms:

"On the bridge of a ship the master/ pilot relationship might best be understood if

we make a distinction between Power and Authority. Power can be defined as the

ability to act without regard to the right to act, while Authority can be described

as the right to act without regard to the means or ability to complete the act. At

sea the master has both the power and the authority over the ship and its crew,

but on entering pilotage waters the authority to direct and control the movement

of the ship shifts by operation of our laws to the pilot. What binds their

relationship together is that the pilots authority can only be exercised in cooperation

with the masters power to command the crew, and the master's power to

have the ship moved can only be lawfully exercised in co-operation with the pilots

authority to direct and control the movement of that ship. "

A bit confusing, but I would expect that Capt B_J would agree that it hits the nail right on the head.

Here is the complete article for those interested:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=13&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiz6sftiuTMAhWDMz4KHdtgBgc4ChAWCCgwAg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.impahq.org%2Fadmin%2Fresources%2Farticle1228231036.pdf&usg=AFQjCNGUfsl6UlB2OB6WqJP3981uAo7dkg