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Everything posted by charmed1959

  1. I believe the idea is, if all unvaccinated folks are limited to RCL excursions and later someone on the excursion tests positive the folks in port can track down the driver/tour guide and test or quarantine them. If the unvaccinated folks are wandering around the town or are on independent tours RCL has no idea who they came in contact with, so they can’t do any contract tracing. RCL’s biggest profits come from being able to return to these ports, rather than be banned due to spreading the virus.
  2. It might be pretty simple. Vaccinated people have different colored room cards/wrist bands. All public areas of the ship you need to wear a mask, but the cruise line would change some number of venues, in line with the number of vaccinated guests and safety protocols, to be vaccinated only. You want to eat at the buffet, show your wristband. Want to lounge at the vaccinated (adult) pool without a mask, show your wristband. Want to enter the comedy club/show on a vaccinated night so you don’t need to wear a mask, show your wrist band.
  3. I’d guess the special wristbands would be for those who are fully vaccinated, and proud to show it to anyone.
  4. We booked our first ocean cruise for summer 2020. When it was cancelled rather than getting a refund we asked to be rebooked on the same cruise a year later. Now that cruise is cancelled and they said they will only get us a voucher that cannot be refunded for 2 more years. does this sound right?
  5. I would guess you would have needed to be vaccinated at least two weeks before your cruise. When the doctors talk about those fully vaccinated they always mention two weeks after receiving the last shot.
  6. I’ve ended up sick on vacation twice in the last 10 years. Both times I was thankful I was in a room I was comfortable to spend some time in. When cruising that is my criteria. Pick a room I’d be happy to spend the entire cruise in. Just in case.
  7. I’m guessing commercial flights. If it’s not safe enough to fly commercial it’s not safe enough to sail. These ships are too big to be able to get enough passengers for a revenue positive sailing without any of the passengers flying to the embarkation.
  8. That would be a great suggestion, that when someone is infected everyone onboard would be tested. But that did not happen on any of the ships that docked in the US, either California or Florida. For the Grand Princess the Vice President and the cruise line said they would all be tested before leaving quarantine, but that did not happen.
  9. The change in transportation rules did throw them for a loop, but there are a few things they could have done. They could communicate. They could send twice daily updates of what passengers left and how many healthy passengers are waiting for planes, just so people still on board know they are not alone. They could explain the ambulances, if there are ill passengers or crew it would be nice to hear from the captain rather than find out on the internet. If there are really only 287 left on board they could set the front desk with help to call every party and make sure they are sending them to the right place. They may find people are flexible, and will fly into different airport than they flew out of, and that would help consolidate charters. They may find some people left a car at the airport, or have friends that will drop their car at the airport, so they don’t need chauffeured rides to their homes. And best of all, everyone left on board know they were not forgotten. They could return their luggage. Give them a few hours to repack. Yep, that means they need to spray down the luggage again, but at least people are leaving with clean clothes. Won’t get them home faster, but won’t take anymore time, and won’t cost much money to make people feel like they care.
  10. Self isolation, as suggested by our local health services, is having 14 days of provisions dropped off outside the door, and having those in isolation disinfect the package of supplies, and cook and clean for themselves for 14 days. No outside interaction. Reading exhibit B from Holland America in their package to the port commission there were 14 sick people taken to hospitals; 10 passengers from the Zaandam, 3 from the Rotterdam, one crew unspecified which ship. There were an additional 13 passengers on each ship showing symptoms for a total of 26 passengers. Those passengers were not allowed to disembark until they recover, and are still either on both ships, or perhaps 13 from the Rotterdam were moved to the Zaandam. In addition, 50 crew members were showing symptoms. It did not specify the ship the sick crew members were on.
  11. Even if those people have quarantined in their cabin for 14 days, if any of the people who made their food, plated their food, delivered their food, folded the extra sheets and towels, etc became infected from being around infected crew or picking up dishes or linens from infected cabins then everyone’s 14 days needs to start over. When the Hal ships docked there were 13 passengers on the well ship, the Rotterdam, that were sick. Another 3 passengers from the Rotterdam were taken in ambulances to hospitals in Florida. Again, that’s the non-sick ship. Hal said 50 crew in addition to the one sent to the hospital are actively showing symptoms. It did not say which ship they were on. It’s not a stretch to assume all the people on those flights were exposed. As for the lady without the mask, she looked winded, like she was having respiratory issues. From that small snippet of film she looked like she could be infected. Florida track cases pretty well. In my small elderly county 12 of the first 26 cases were travelers from cruises. I was thinking there could not possibly be cruisers still coming off of ships, but there are.
  12. We have learned a few things during this crises that have less to do specifically with Covid19 and more to do with the way the cruise industry is able to deal with virulent diseases. 1) the crew is not immune Though it is probable a crew member originally caught the corona virus, and in the past a norovirus, from a passenger, it is clear to me once the crew is possibly infected there is no plan in place to ensure they won’t infect others. Crew quarters are close, and there is not a system set up to quarantine possibly infected crew. From my perspective, it looks like the crew spread the disease to passengers while they were quarantined on the Diamond Princess. Considering there were more crew with respiratory disease on the Zaandam than passengers it would not surprise me to find passengers were infected by those that cooked their food, plated their trays, or delivered their food. 2) medical facilities on board is not sufficient for a large outbreak of infectious disease The shortage amount of supplies and number of personnel meant getting to port was an emergency. To make me feel safe on a cruise ship, I’d like to believe if there was an outbreak the ship’s medical team would be able to handle it. Right now I’m not convinced that is true. 3) love that cabin you pick, you may be spending weeks there. In the past I kept hearing the size of a cabin didn’t matter, you only sleep there. Yeah, no. 4) the cruise line may not know what they are talking about when they say it’s safe to travel. There were many people that didn’t cancel cruises because they didn’t want to lose money. The cruise line said it was safe. In hindsight, everyone lost money, and no it wasn’t safe. 5)Countries will prioritize the safety of their citizens over the safety of those coming in off their shores. This seems to be a surprise to the entire cruise industry. To get people like me, the occasional cruiser, back on ships, they need to find a way to make it safer. Change policy to ensure any crew that is possibly sick is not working and not in contact with other crew members or passengers. Like Viking, quarantine crew members for two weeks before they get on the ship and in between assignments. Those inside and port hole cabins are going to be a hard sell anyway, convert them to hospital/quarantine/crew quarters to be able to divide out the infected or possibly infected crew. Quarantining crew might mean they actually need more crew, as backup. Here is your additional crew quarters. They could also convert some of the crew quarters to increase the size of the onboard medical center. Have more room for testing facilities, ICU beds, and common drug storage. Ease up on the cancellation policies. If passengers could get a full refund, I’m guessing there would have been very few passengers would have gotten on a cruise ship the first week of March. By then they knew the Grand had problems stemming from a trip to Mexico, Northern Italy and Iran had huge outbreaks, and cruise ships were already being denied stops in the Caribbean. Airfare is a huge issue, and the Airlines should also ease up on cancellation policies. Give sick people full refunds before and cruise credits after they get on the ship. The present cancellation policies encourage people to coverup flu symptoms before they embark, so they don’t lose all that money. They lie about symptoms when on the ship because they paid for it and they don’t want to be stuck in their room. Give up on the huge ships. I’m not getting on anything that has more than 1000 passengers. When it comes to smaller countries or economies, the difference between helping 800 people and helping 3000 is a big deal. Those ships with close to 7000 passengers, I’ve been on them, they are cool. However, in case of an outbreak I can’t see any country offering to take in 1000 sick people at once. I wouldn’t touch one of those again. Bigger changes in the cruise industry as a whole that would make me feel safer is having the flagged country mean something. If a ship is flagged to a country that country guarantees them a safe port and medical services to their crew and passengers. Cruise lines may then chose to flag their ships in countries with a more robust infrastructure. And there would be somewhere they are sure they can port in a pandemic storm.
  13. Not over for the Rotterdam either. According to exhibit B, as of April 1st there were 10 passengers on the Zaandam and 3 on the Rotterdam that needed on shore medical treatment. In addition, there were 13 passengers on each of the ships showing symptoms for a total of 26. There was one crew member needing shoreside medical attention and another 50 showing symptoms. It did not say which ship the affected crew were on.
  14. Considering the four south Florida Counties have more Coronavirus cases than all of Georgia your brother is much less likely to catch the Coronavirus in Atlanta than in FLL.
  15. They must have triaged. Broward health is close. Hialeah is 25 miles away. Are they by chance helicoptering them?
  16. If this does become a movie I very much hope this will be the end and not the beginning.
  17. Given the number of Covid19 cases in South Florida, I’d suspect the healthy looking cruise passengers are no more likely to have the virus than the rest of the people at the Fort Lauderdale or Miami airports.
  18. For the not visibly sick people, Port Everglades would work, in they could get the 49 Floridians into cars, the 250 other American’s onto commercial flights, and the thousand foreign passengers on charters home. It’s the sick I worry about the most coming into south Florida. Maybe they could air ambulance the very sick to other areas of the state with available capacity? With all but essential services shut down in that part of the state I’m not sure there is a commercial option for those that just need a place to lay low and get over this. Unlike the Grand Princess, it sounds like they are discussing putting them at a cruise terminal, rather than disembarking them into a parking lot. After the disembarkation are they going to shutter that terminal until they disinfect it? I guess they don’t need it for awhile.
  19. What I would have liked to seen in his statement would be them taking some responsibility. The Diamond Princess fiasco was in Feb. As was the HAL Maasdam having trouble finding a place to disembark. The first passenger on the Grand Princess died March 4th, meaning they knew there was a ship in Mexico with the virus spreading in Feb. There were more than a handful of ships that were denied docking around the world before March 7th. In retrospect it’s pretty obvious they should have been cancelling all cruises out of an abundance of caution. But hindsight is 20/20. And yes, the crew are the folks stuck out there and they did nothing wrong. What would make everyone feel better is to put out a plan in the statement. Perhaps say, HAL will charter planes to take passengers back to their home states and countries. Those living in Florida will have rental cars waiting for them at the port and they are expected to drive home and self quarantine for 14 days. Ambulance planes will be ready to fly very sick passengers and crew to somewhere that has the capacity to give them wonderful health care, and HAL will foot the part of the bill not covered by insurance.
  20. I hope if the mayor does allow the ship to dock he makes sure he has the facilities to take on the sick passengers. Bringing them into port without having enough hospitals beds would be cruel.
  21. I think the hesitancy the governor of Florida has about taking in these passengers in South Florida is they would be disembarking people INTO a very live pandemic. Over half of Florida’s 5400 cases (and growing) are in Dade and Broward counties. There are already close to 300 people hospitalized in those two counties alone. It would be unfair to everyone, passengers and locals alike, to have to chose who gets the very limited supplies to save their lives. Other parts of Florida are no where near as hard hit. Port Canaveral, Tampa, Jacksonville are all better off in terms of available medical help.
  22. For those in Canada and Nevada that are doing home isolation, what are the logistics? How do they get from the the airport to their home? If they are being transported on public transit from the plane to their homes, are they tested first? Or only if they show symptoms?
  23. Given the quarantined river cruise in Luxor, Egypt, I’d guess yes.
  24. I run a few short term rentals. Right now, the big booking companies are letting guests cancel accommodations with even strict cancellation policies. Some host are upset they are losing money, but I’m thinking I cannot afford to have guests quarantined in my houses. If a guest is a little sick, but traveling because they already spent the money they are more likely to infect their accommodations and those around them. I’ll take the short term hit on slow business over a disaster. I think some cruise lines are thinking like the other hosts, that they will have half empty ships if they allow cancellations. And other cruise lines like Seaborne and Viking are thinking more like myself, that a full ship with folks that shouldn’t have been cruising will require them to refund everyone on that quarantined ship, offer them another free cruise, and refund all on the cruises that have to be cancelled to clean up the ship. And that would cost more than a few less than full cruises. Also, those with the easy to cancel policies will continue to get bookings as this crisis goes on, and once it’s under control those cruisers will all show up. While those with the strict cancellation policies will have less people booking, as they are afraid to sign up for a trip that three months from now they think is unsafe. The final piece of the puzzle is PR. Unfortunately, it will be awhile before the Princess Cruise name is not associated with quarantined ships. The high end cruise lines don’t want that type of PR.
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