Aos doa

Back around page 3 on this thread, someone posted that the vibration was noted a few weeks back, so RCI was probably aware that the bearings needed to be renewed in dock, and had them ordered (5-8' diameter roller or ball bearings are not on the shelf items), so that the repair can be completed. A 7-14 day docking would be sufficient to fix things, if part are available. If they can't finish the repair, they would either have to go without the fixipod for another 2-3 years, or schedule another quickie docking to repair the pod.

 

 

 

And for Trekker, yes most of the cruise ships in the Caribbean use the Grand Bahamas Shipyard in Freeport. Only the Allure/Oasis class and the Breakaway/Getaway class are too large for normal docking, though the Allure fixed her pod using an unconventional cofferdam docking.

Oh I know. We had discussed this on another thread. I would venture a guess that the bearings may have to come from Europe, maybe even from ABB, unless they have a North American distribution network or supplier. Then again, once the seals and bearings are pulled, they may find that the shaft may be worn or scored to where it can't be machined down and shimmed ( if a procedure like that can be done at all, as these parts are massive). With manufacturers there's no telling if ABB used a "standard" (relative in this case) or if they had bearings specifically designed for their size, tolerances, application. Should there be shaft damage that requires replacement, then, as you said, they would be down a pod for quite some time.

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...I think they were overly optimistic about the de-blading timeline.

This is something we referred to in the airline business as "operational optimism." Timelines for repairs, weather clearing, airports reopening, etc., never went as well as hoped. The situation with Adventure sounds familiar in a way.

Do you foresee a MONTH in advance that the water pump on your car is going to give out?

 

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Uhh... I am not going to argue about this. But yes, probably. Also, the fact that this is a bazillion ton ship should have the ability to detect these things as another user pointed out.

Do you foresee a MONTH in advance that the water pump on your car is going to give out?

 

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Exactly. Some times, no matter how diligent you may be, things happen and the situation can spiral downhill pretty quickly. Unfortunately, cruise ships can't carry every potential part they may need, and in a case like this, it's not like they can pull over on the shoulder and change that pesky flat tire.

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Uhh... I am not going to argue about this. But yes, probably. Also, the fact that this is a bazillion ton ship should have the ability to detect these things as another user pointed out.

Just because it is a large ship, it doesn't mean that she was built with a crystal ball or magic wand. So when are you going to have a flat tire?

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Oh I know. We had discussed this on another thread. I would venture a guess that the bearings may have to come from Europe, maybe even from ABB, unless they have a North American distribution network or supplier. Then again, once the seals and bearings are pulled, they may find that the shaft may be worn or scored to where it can't be machined down and shimmed ( if a procedure like that can be done at all, as these parts are massive). With manufacturers there's no telling if ABB used a "standard" (relative in this case) or if they had bearings specifically designed for their size, tolerances, application. Should there be shaft damage that requires replacement, then, as you said, they would be down a pod for quite some time.

 

 

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Nah, ABB does not make roller/ball bearings. There are a very few manufacturers of these around the world. And they are manufactured to standard dimensions, so that bearings from nearly any manufacturer can be used to replace another's. While some manufacturers specify special tolerances, etc, at this size, there isn't a large market, so I don't think there will be a problem there, just that no one wants to keep a $70-80k bearing on a shelf hoping that a customer needs one. If the shaft is damaged, it can be removed from the pod, machined down to remove the damage, and weld it back up to size and remachine. A shaft like this would only take 4-5 days to finish.

ABB does have a North American service network, but like I said, the bearings will need to come from SKF or Torrington or similar supplier, both of which are major US firms.

Did the captain say when and if you will set sail?

 

 

 

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Midnight is what we were told in our letter from the Captain. When we went down to look at the flatbed about an hour and a half ago there was still just one blade there. The Captain said removal of the second blade is progressing about 15 minutes ago.

Nah, ABB does not make roller/ball bearings. There are a very few manufacturers of these around the world. And they are manufactured to standard dimensions, so that bearings from nearly any manufacturer can be used to replace another's. While some manufacturers specify special tolerances, etc, at this size, there isn't a large market, so I don't think there will be a problem there, just that no one wants to keep a $70-80k bearing on a shelf hoping that a customer needs one. If the shaft is damaged, it can be removed from the pod, machined down to remove the damage, and weld it back up to size and remachine. A shaft like this would only take 4-5 days to finish.

 

 

 

ABB does have a North American service network, but like I said, the bearings will need to come from SKF or Torrington or similar supplier, both of which are major US firms.

Aww heck, maybe NAPA has a Timken that will fit!! LOL....

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Aww heck, maybe NAPA has a Timken that will fit!! LOL....

 

 

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My money is on Manny, Moe & Jack!:p

Sometimes some problems can't be foreseen in any amount of time. They thought they had issues under control last week and were making fine speed and their ports of call when something went big time sideways and here we are. Did they know there was some manner of excessive wear or vibration? Yes, probably, but not anything outside of normal or cause for downtime before a dry dock. Well...you get by 99 out of 100 times. This is that 1.

They already knew something was wrong two weeks back, but decided to continue to eek out more profits. The clients are not important, they paid and can't cancel their trip. AOS sailed out of San Juan VERY slowly with plenty of shaking going on. The Carnival Valor departed well after Adventure and was sitting pretty, upon arrival in St. Thomas. Same thing next day to St Kitts, Celebrity Equinox departed well after us form St Thomas, but had arrived well before us. I am pretty sure RCI never intended to take this ship to Aruba and Curacao, but had no problem getting paid for it. Shameful.:(

They already knew something was wrong two weeks back, but decided to continue to eek out more profits. The clients are not important, they paid and can't cancel their trip. AOS sailed out of San Juan VERY slowly with plenty of shaking going on. The Carnival Valor departed well after Adventure and was sitting pretty, upon arrival in St. Thomas. Same thing next day to St Kitts, Celebrity Equinox departed well after us form St Thomas, but had arrived well before us. I am pretty sure RCI never intended to take this ship to Aruba and Curacao, but had no problem getting paid for it. Shameful.:(

Are you saying that the ship left San Juan later than advertised, and then arrived and left St. Thomas later than advertised, and then arrived in St. Kitts late? First anyone has mentioned this. Just because other ships left later and arrived earlier means nothing, if all the ships mentioned met their advertised itineraries. Cruise ships tend to travel at varied speeds to make timed arrivals and departures. And particulary in small ports in the Caribbean, multiple ships cannot maneuver into/out of port at the same time, so depending on when each ship is scheduled to get a pilot, arrival times will be further modified.

If RCI "never intended" to sail to Aruba, they would have known that they would have to refund/credit money for cancelled ports, so your statement makes no sense.

Just because it is a large ship, it doesn't mean that she was built with a crystal ball or magic wand. So when are you going to have a flat tire?

 

 

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Well kind sir, if you want to imply that I am an idiot, at least compare apples to apples. I have had my car for 6 or 7 years and never changed the tires (until recently). Every time I went in for maintenance (aka oil change) I was told that my tires were going to explode at anytime because of the tread being pretty much GONE. So… I knew about this issue AND if my tire had gone flat, who's fault is that? MINE. Also, if it went flat, I can drive to any 10 tire stores in a one mile radius and get it changed with essentially any tire in there, so your argument is invalid.

Can everyone get their panties out of a bunch because MINE are bunching? SHEESH.

Also, if it went flat, I can drive to any 10 tire stores in a one mile radius and get it changed with essentially any tire in there, so your argument is invalid.

No, that's PRECISELY the argument. With a ship there aren't 10 repair shops conveniently located with parts in store that can fix an issue.

Wear and tear can usually be predicted on a curve over time. This breakdown represented more of a catastrophic failure, not something that can be planned for or even, really, practicably worked on outside of a dry dock. It's unfortunate for those on board but it is what it is at this point.

I don't think anyone is trying to pick on you, just highlight exactly how different a situation is with something like this compared to your car. Not every breakdown can be predicted or prevented. And there's a bunch of people with a lot of knowledge here talking about the breakdown and repair, not people with their undies in a twist, and nor should yours be. I'm not sure what you feel would make this situation right for those onboard, but I also feel that whatever you believe it is just isn't something reality would allow at this point in the week.

Are you saying that the ship left San Juan later than advertised, and then arrived and left St. Thomas later than advertised, and then arrived in St. Kitts late? First anyone has mentioned this. Just because other ships left later and arrived earlier means nothing, if all the ships mentioned met their advertised itineraries. Cruise ships tend to travel at varied speeds to make timed arrivals and departures. And particulary in small ports in the Caribbean, multiple ships cannot maneuver into/out of port at the same time, so depending on when each ship is scheduled to get a pilot, arrival times will be further modified.

 

If RCI "never intended" to sail to Aruba, they would have known that they would have to refund/credit money for cancelled ports, so your statement makes no sense.

The ship left on time, but arrived well after the Carnival Valor, which was still in San Juan when we departed. Same with the Equinox. Do you really believe RCI is going to tell us so they would have to refund money? Don't be naive, this is corporate greed, plain and simple.

I have been following this thread from the beginning because we are booked on the AOS in June. After reading all the posts I think the answer is somewhere in the middle between all the vitriol. I am sure they were optimistic that the Ship would hang on for another two weeks. Some will say that they should have cancelled but if it would have held on then you have spoiled a bunch of vacations for no reason. In my opinion what they should have done was when they knew that there was a potential problem they should have let the next boarding group know that there was a potential problem. Then they could let everyone decide for themselves if they were willing to take the gamble. I am sure there have been other cases where potential problems never materialized. I myself have had more problems with Air Travel than I have ever had with Cruising. I think for the most part they do a remarkable job dealing with all the people week after week. That is not to say that they could have and should have done better in this case but most people can't even organize their own family day to day without some bumps in the road and they all know each other intimately.

Well kind sir, if you want to imply that I am an idiot, at least compare apples to apples. I have had my car for 6 or 7 years and never changed the tires (until recently). Every time I went in for maintenance (aka oil change) I was told that my tires were going to explode at anytime because of the tread being pretty much GONE. So… I knew about this issue AND if my tire had gone flat, who's fault is that? MINE. Also, if it went flat, I can drive to any 10 tire stores in a one mile radius and get it changed with essentially any tire in there, so your argument is invalid.

 

 

 

Can everyone get their panties out of a bunch because MINE are bunching? SHEESH.

I wasn't trying to imply that you're an idiot whatsoever. I'm trying to explain that with anything mechanical or electrical, there's also the category of shinola happens. I work with electrical and mechanical components all the time. As much technology as we may have, sometimes things happen. Like I said, when are you having that flat tire? You don't know and I don't know. When it happens it happens. Your new flat screen TV is working done right now. Well in 23 minutes it goes kaput. Why? I don't know...was I supposed to know it was going to happen? That's the point that sometimes things fail unexpectedly. And, as said before, your local tire shop can see your tires and make a prediction on when they're likely to fail. It's kind of hard to pop the screws off a cruise ship and peek at the bearings. The only possible early warning signs they could have had other than possible noise, might be high oil temperatures, if they are in fact monitored. Even then, if there is foreign material or water in the bearings, they're not going to last very long at that point anyway. That being said, without actually pulling the screw to visually inspect (and this is underwater), it would be difficult to determine the extent of the repairs needed, coupled with the fact that it may take weeks to get parts and tools. AutoZone is not going to have parts to fix a cruise ship propulsion system. Those things take time to address. So, there likely isn't much that RCI could have done ahead of time.

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Oops forgot to add that there could possibly be foreign matter or water in the oil as well. Foreign matter if just a bearing failure--water would indicate seal failure.

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I agree with your points and here is my main point as a "neutral" observer regarding could and should have done better.

 

The NOS was "officially" cancelled. Everyone offered a 100% discount plus 25% off next cruise plus they were allowed to stay onboard until the day they were due to get off. This was for a cruise where the port was closed and the sailing was out of their hands. They now have the added bonus that those who chose to stay get a bonus free mini cruise as they will sail tomorrow even if only 1 port.

 

The exact same week (same day to be exact) the AOS does not sail due to a mechanical fault which is technically a RC issue. Yet no cruise cancelled, no 100% refund plus 25% off next cruise etc.

 

Given the AOS people had to fly (I'm sure the vast majority have) it is nowhere near as easy for people to disembark change travel arrangements etc. even if AOS does sail tomorrow their start of the cruise has had the same impact as the NOS not sailing those days and I can't for the life of me understand what appears from the info currently being provided why such a differential in compensation.

 

If anything I would expect RC to do more for their customers in an event that they were responsible for than for something outside their control. ( I get things break but they are responsible for the maintain acne of the ships).

 

Don't get me wrong the NoS pax have had very fair compensation and everyone was treated equally, however if I was on AOS and saw what was going on in Galveston I would be frustrated the compensation is not (as I see it) equally as fair (especially if staying in a more expensive suite)

 

JMHO

Uhh... I am not going to argue about this. But yes, probably. Also, the fact that this is a bazillion ton ship should have the ability to detect these things as another user pointed out.

Yes, probably, huh? Congratulations on your special ability of clairvoyance! :rolleyes:

Exactly. Some times, no matter how diligent you may be, things happen and the situation can spiral downhill pretty quickly. Unfortunately, cruise ships can't carry every potential part they may need, and in a case like this, it's not like they can pull over on the shoulder and change that pesky flat tire.

Yep, pretty well sums it up.

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I think that RCI was trying to be optimistic and thinking they could get the problem repaired somewhat quickly or at least have the ship somewhat serviceable and if nothing else, make a shorter cruise than anticipated. Even if they could sail a 5 day cruise instead of 7, even with the partial refunds and OBC offered, from a financial perspective, they're better off to do this rather than cancel a cruise completely and have a ship laid up with no income whatsoever. They can't get into dry dock any quicker more than likely. Even if they could only break even, it's still better than a total loss week. From a PR perspective, they could have done better, but were probably hoping they could salvage a bit out of this mess and still give the customer something along the lines of a vacation.

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I think that RCI was trying to be optimistic and thinking they could get the problem repaired somewhat quickly or at least have the ship somewhat serviceable and if nothing else, make a shorter cruise than anticipated. Even if they could sail a 5 day cruise instead of 7, even with the partial refunds and OBC offered, from a financial perspective, they're better off to do this rather than cancel a cruise completely and have a ship laid up with no income whatsoever. They can't get into dry dock any quicker more than likely. Even if they could only break even, it's still better than a total loss week. From a PR perspective, they could have done better, but were probably hoping they could salvage a bit out of this mess and still give the customer something along the lines of a vacation.

 

 

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Yep, their communications & PR handling of this was lousy. But from strictly the mechanical side, I think they've done pretty well, with probably some overly optimistic repair timelines the only real mistake.

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last I heard from my Sister is there not leaving until 1am

Yep, their communications & PR handling of this was lousy. But from strictly the mechanical side, I think they've done pretty well, with probably some overly optimistic repair timelines the only real mistake.

 

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And then again, RCI has thousands of people wanting an answer now. I do repair work for a living and people will always ask "how long is it going to take?" So what if I think the parts will be here in a few days, and it turns out they have to come from the manufacturer and take 2 weeks? And then there's the issue if what if we find something else wrong? Now I look like a liar and an idiot because it took longer. Who's the customer going to blame when they're upset that it isn't fixed when I said it would? Me. And giving a customer the "I don't know" answer doesn't fly. So when a customer is upset, the blame will always fall on someone else.

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I don't think many aboard AOS have any idea what is going on in Galveston to be honest. From what little I've read our compensation doesn't appear to be equal on the surface to NOS, BUT at this point we are hopefully only missing out on 1 of our ports. So it is hard to compare the two right now. To me if we sail tonight and everything goes as currently propsed I will be satisfied with the outcome. I don't really want a future cruise discount as Royal left me feeling as though they don't value me as a person with their handling of our cruise from the beginning and I am ready to try different cruiselines now. This was the push I needed.

Last update from the Captain for the night was about 20 minutes ago. The second blade is being lifted out of the water and the third is being unbolted. According to someone on the Captain's staff(not sure his exact position but he was a representative for the Captain and answering our questions), there are only 3 blades. So we are on the last one and we should be sailing by 1am. So if you don't see another update from me in the morning you can assume we're underway hopefully. :)

Well let's hope you get moving soon! I hope you enjoy the remainder of your cruise though.

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