Royal Princess Misses April 30 Disembarkation in LeHavre

Good luck OP. You seem so cool and rational in a very stressful situation.

 

I can kind of understand Princess not going out of their way to help a passenger who independently chose to disembark a stop early (we are doing a British Isles cruise Southampton round trip and I’m sure some are disembarking a day early in LeHavre).

 

But not helping or compensating those who Booked a cruise to end in LeHavre and then being taken elsewhere. Unbelievable. I hope your TA is able to get this resolved and you are able to submit receipts for out of pocket expenses to Princess and have them be reimbursed. This is the right thing for Princess to do.

 

 

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A very sweet message. Thank you for your support!

I was booked on the may 12 british isles cruise departing from Le Havre, and NO it is NOT a "deviation" : the cruise was sold from Le Havre to Le Havre, Le Havre is an "official" embarking/disembarking port for British Isles during the whole 2018 season and, in France, Princess made a lot of publicity about it.

I was very sad because, a few days ago, I had to cancel my cruise for a very serious health problem. This cruise should have been my first with Princess, but reading this, it will be my last booking with them too : I'm horrified by the way they handled the problem. I was on the QEII when she had an accident in Bar Harbour : Cunard immediately organized everything for passengers (complimentary hotel nights, complimentary plane return to London and future cruise vouchers). What a lack of class and respect toward passengers from Princess! All my sympathy to passengers who should disembark/embark in Le Havre.

 

 

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Of course keep in mind that the Cunard incident was not weather but an accident that could be considered to be the fault of the cruise line. In those case the cruise line must provide assistance. if Princess had missed La Havre due to a mechanical issue, instead of weather they would have had to provide for the passengers.

So here's our story: We bought the Princess Royal cruise as a crossing that would allow us to disembark in LeHavre. We had independent plans to travel to Paris, stay in Paris for a month, and then move on to Amsterdam with an eventual return to the States on HAL's Rotterdam.

 

The Captain announced at 9:30 the night before arrival in LeHavre that LeHavre would be missed due to severe weather and that passengers scheduled to disembark would receive a letter offering options. We received our letter that offered us a free shuttle to Heathrow Airport, 30 minutes of internet time, and codes that would allow us to use the ship's phones to make international calls. In the chaos that ensued, we struggled to buy air tickets for the 30th to fly Heathrow to Paris. The internet didn't work, probably because of too many users. The phones didn't work. The concierge was not on duty. So I joined the chaos at Passenger Services and was told that since I had not booked return air on Princess Air, I was on my own. Finally a staff person hooked me up to a house phone in the lobby where I was able to call British Air to buy 2 tickets to fly to Paris CDG. Because we have luggage, a low-cost option was not possible. The cost was $1,053. We did make it to Paris, but totally exhausted and stressed out. Hardly the "Return New" that the Princess motto promises.

 

I started this thread to ask what happened to the others. On the shuttle to Heathrow we heard a few bizarre tales of the Princess Air arrangements, of folks offered flights to Paris with stopovers in Zurich, Milan, and Moscow. One disabled couple was to arrive in Milan very late and told to sit in the airport overnight for a connecting flight early on the morning of May 1.

 

I plan to file an insurance claim. Not sure what the result will be. Right now I am not happy with Princess, but maybe my attitude will change if I get some insurance money.

I'm just curious. Who was your Captain?

Sorry, I just found the answer:(

Regardless of the fine print, that Princess thinks it is acceptable to disembark passengers in a different country with no obligation to get them to their destination seems immoral.

I have just been reading the passage contract that Princess issues here in the UK and it seems to be different to the US. Princess are legally required to comply with the Package Tour Regulations 1992 which has provision for the obligations of the provider when a significant change occurs - even if that change is as a result of force majeure. In such circumstances, ‘the provider will provide equivalent transport back to the place of departure or to another place to which the passenger has agreed......’

Obviously, the passenger must be reasonable in their demands but to ask to be taken to the contracted port of disembarkation seems to me to be perfectly reasonable. As usual, what is reasonable is determined by the courts.

 

You need to take that paragraph in full, though:

38. After departure, Princess does not guarantee that the ship will call at every port on the itinerary or follow every part of the advertised route or schedule or that every part of the Package will be provided. Princess reserves the absolute right to decide whether or not to omit any such port(s) and/or to call at additional ports and/or to change the advertised route, schedule or Package. If Princess is unable to provide a significant proportion of the Package, it will make suitable alternative arrangements, at no extra cost to the Passenger, for the continuation of the Package. If the Passenger does not accept them, for good reasons, or, if it is impossible to make suitable alternative arrangements Princess will, where appropriate, provide the Passenger with transport back to the place of departure or to another place to which Princess and the Passenger have agreed. In both cases Princess will, where appropriate, compensate the Passenger. Please note that compensation will not be payable if an alteration is minor or if Princess is not able to provide a significant proportion of the Package due to force majeure.

Since weather is considered a force majeure, Princess didn't have a legal obligation to compensate. Whether they had a MORAL obligation is a whole other question....

You need to take that paragraph in full, though:

 

38. After departure, Princess does not guarantee that the ship will call at every port on the itinerary or follow every part of the advertised route or schedule or that every part of the Package will be provided. Princess reserves the absolute right to decide whether or not to omit any such port(s) and/or to call at additional ports and/or to change the advertised route, schedule or Package. If Princess is unable to provide a significant proportion of the Package, it will make suitable alternative arrangements, at no extra cost to the Passenger, for the continuation of the Package. If the Passenger does not accept them, for good reasons, or, if it is impossible to make suitable alternative arrangements Princess will, where appropriate, provide the Passenger with transport back to the place of departure or to another place to which Princess and the Passenger have agreed. In both cases Princess will, where appropriate, compensate the Passenger. Please note that compensation will not be payable if an alteration is minor or if Princess is not able to provide a significant proportion of the Package due to force majeure.

 

 

Since weather is considered a force majeure, Princess didn't have a legal obligation to compensate. Whether they had a MORAL obligation is a whole other question....

Yes and no. Force Majeure is open to interpretation. While PTR 1992 does provide some protection to the provider in case of the claim of a Force Majeure, the end point of the trip is considered to be an essential term under 1992. Also the protection of Force Majeure is only for the duration of the event. It would be rather interesting if someone was to make a claim under PTR1992 if the cruise line claim of Force Majeure for a relatively short term wind event, that did not restrict all shipping would hold up.

One could make the argument that the event did not really rise to the level of force Majeure and that sufficient alternatives did exist for the passengers to be able to be delivered to their end point.

It really comes down to Maritime law and how the courts have ruled in the past if a Captain's decision that a condition is unsafe can be considered to be Force Majeure or if it must also meet other conditions.

It is probably an academic issue, because I doubt anyone that purchased under UK terms planned to end the cruise in La Havre instead of Southampton. The EU is moving to similar protections someone might make a claim under another EU countries terms.

Now one good thing is that it is fairly standard for travel insurance to pay for weather related situations based upon the individual policy and coverage limits. If it had been mechanical then such policies general consider the provider to be responsible and the insurance would not cover.

Take the example of Force Majeure with the air line industry. It provides protection to them from having to pay compensation for claims when weather conditions delay or cancels a flight so they do not have to pay for hotels, meals etc. They are still required to honor delivery to the travelers destination as soon as possible after the weather conditions return to normal. The airline cannot just claim force majeure and say that the passenger is stuck where ever they were when the weather occured and lose any right to future travel. So it really raises the question if getting a cruise line passenger to their final destination is really compensation or if it is a requirement after the conditions resolve. Again this is strictly within the confines the the UK regulations. Under US law the cruise line can pretty much do what it wants.

In such circumstances, ‘the provider will provide equivalent transport back to the place of departure or to another place to which the passenger has agreed......’

Obviously, the passenger must be reasonable in their demands but to ask to be taken to the contracted port of disembarkation seems to me to be perfectly reasonable. As usual, what is reasonable is determined by the courts.

 

Interesting it says "place of departure" and not port of disembarkation. So if you booked a cruise from Fort Lauderdale to Le Havre and had to skip Le Havre, the obligation is to get you back to Fort Lauderdale.

 

But not helping or compensating those who Booked a cruise to end in LeHavre and then being taken elsewhere. Unbelievable.

I have seen this with an airline.

Booked from City A to City C via a connection in City B.

City B (the connecting city) was a number of miles further north than destination City C. The plane basically flew over City C on the way to the connecting city. Flight arrived at connecting City B after last flight of day to City C, so rented a car to get from B to C that night.

When asked for a partial refund for not getting to the booked destination City C, the airline said there would be no refund. The reason was that by flying miles further than the destination city, the passenger received more value from his ticket than had been purchased.

Here is TV24, hopefully the OP. We purchased a 14-day crossing from Ft. Lauderdale to LeHavre. Southampton was definitely not on our official itinerary. Hope this helps with a clarification.

 

We are still waiting to hear anything from AON, the insurance carrier, but that will take a while. Also waiting to hear if ou TA receives any response from Princess. I promise to let you know.

Thank you for that.

Posters keeping on about deviation were confusing me (Bear with small brain !!!)

I cannot believe Princess would put you in this position.

I hope your travel agent is able to negotiate some adequate compensation and recover all your costs. Maybe the Insurance company will come back with an offer.

Good Luck.

A similar situation happened to us in the late 90’s. The return flight of our package holiday to Cyprus was due to land in Machester - which was fog bound. We landed at Birmingham and in accordance with PTR1992 we were bussed back to Manchester. Clearly, force majeure would prevent us from claiming compensation for not flying us to Manchester but as RDC1 states the destination is an essential element of the contract not a minor variation.

Totally agree with you.

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Having recently gotten a "deviation" here is the actual process and language. You should make the request (pre cruise) from Princess which can be done directly or through a cruise agent. If Princess agrees to your deviation (early disembarkation) they will send you a completed form which is titled "REQUEST FOR DEVIATION FROM SCHEDULED CRUISE ITINERARY." And the first item on this form says the following: "Princess Cruises is not responsible for missed cruises or any expenses incurred getting to or from the next port of call if the ship does not arrive at the requested port of embarkation or disembarkation, or if the ship is delayed for any reason."

 

Enough said :).

 

Hank

Again and again it was NOT a deviation but a cruise itinerary booked from or/and to Le Havre, so nobody had to ask for any "deviation" because passengers had booked a perfectly "official" cruise itinerary, with a reference number different from the Southampton/Southampton cruise, advertised, published and sold by Princess in those terms from/to Le Havre : so, sorry, but no "deviation rule" applies, neither for this cruise nor for the next ones. Every British Isles cruise, during the 2018, season was advertised, published and sold either from Le Havre to Le Havre or from Southampton to Southampton, so Princess didn't "simply" miss a port of call, but an embarking/disembarking port, and the only "rules" that should apply should be those concerning the fact that Princess didn't assume responsibility for taking passengers to the embarking/disembarking port they have "officially" booked and paid for. I perfectly understand that the captain was obliged to change itinerary, for safety, but Princess had the duty to book any transport to bring passengers to/from Le Havre.

"Enough said" (whatever it means!)

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If Princess decided one day to end a Fort Lauderdale cruise in Nassau and turfed every one off how would you like it. Essentially that they have done to the Le Harve passengers. Route deviation here is irrelevant

Sorry for folks difficulty. Reading this, still think booking air on your own is a better option than thru Princess. I also think passengers should pay attention to time of year weather conditions in booking cruises. We have gotten of in La havre a few times but never this early in the year. Late spring or early fall are better weather wise...

Interesting. We hit a problem on our first Princess cruise. Weather prevented the ship from docking; we were held at the terminal for the entire day and about 6:30pm were loaded onto buses for transportation to a hotel.

Princess took the approach that if your had booked "the entire package" with Princess, they provided a hotel along with transportation from terminal to hotel and again back to the terminal the next morning. They defined the "entire package" as air, transfers, and the cruise.

Yes, it was a long, stressful day. We tried to order food, but found that the police were stopping all incoming traffic as the terminal was deemed to be over-crowded. The bathrooms in the terminal ran out of all supplies. (really, there wasn't a storage room somewhere in the terminal????) Despite all the difficulties, we felt that Princess did the best they could FOR US.

If you booked less than the entire package, you were totally on your own as to your overnight arrangements. In fact, if you came by car you were not allowed into the terminal and were kept in your vehicle in the parking lot with access to a port-a potty. Yeah, those people had serious reason to complain.

Sorry for folks difficulty. Reading this, still think booking air on your own is a better option than thru Princess. I also think passengers should pay attention to time of year weather conditions in booking cruises. We have gotten of in La havre a few times but never this early in the year. Late spring or early fall are better weather wise...

Regarding EZAIR, we would disagree.. There are times (especially with International flights) where Princess has deals almost too good to be true. We recently booked Business Class from JFK to Singapore through EZAIR and saved about $1500 per person over the lowest publicly available fares. Our flight was on a China Air 777....and was one of the best flights we have ever taken (and we have been traveling for over fifty years). When it comes to air we do prefer to book our own air, but always check the cruise line's fares just in case its worth our while.

Hank

I have seen this with an airline.

 

Booked from City A to City C via a connection in City B.

 

 

City B (the connecting city) was a number of miles further north than destination City C. The plane basically flew over City C on the way to the connecting city. Flight arrived at connecting City B after last flight of day to City C, so rented a car to get from B to C that night.

 

When asked for a partial refund for not getting to the booked destination City C, the airline said there would be no refund. The reason was that by flying miles further than the destination city, the passenger received more value from his ticket than had been purchased.

If the change is known before departure you have the right to refuse that flight and wait (might be a couple of days) for a flight to the destination city.

Now having flown a lot (over a million miles on each of 3 different airlines), I have had a number of times planes have been diverted due to weather or where the airline has offered an alternative airport. When the flight has been to the same metropolitan area such as Baltimore instead of Washington National then you are correct that you are on your own to get to the correct airport or home. On those cases where the plane diverted to another city entirely (Philadelphia for example instead of Washington) and where I did not have the chance to refuse the flight (deviation happened mid flight) I was always given the option of a flight to my destination (whenever that could be arranged, depending upon conditions it might mean staying there for a couple of days). Once we were put on buses (LA to San Diego) and once given a voucher for train tickets (Philadelphia to DC).

If the problem is caused by weather there the airline would not give compensation (no partial refund, no hotel, no meals), but they are responsible to get you to your destination city eventually.

A similar situation happened to us in the late 90’s. The return flight of our package holiday to Cyprus was due to land in Machester - which was fog bound. We landed at Birmingham and in accordance with PTR1992 we were bussed back to Manchester. Clearly, force majeure would prevent us from claiming compensation for not flying us to Manchester but as RDC1 states the destination is an essential element of the contract not a minor variation.

What surprised me is that Princess did not bus people to Plymouth and put them on the Southampton to La Havre ferry. (I have taken that ferry, more comfortable than an overnight plane flight) It would have cost them $60 per passenger plus the bus cost. Many would have probably refused the overnight in a reclining seat, but they would have met their obligation to get people to the port of disembarkation, instead of just telling people you are on your own.

Sorry for folks difficulty. Reading this, still think booking air on your own is a better option than thru Princess. I also think passengers should pay attention to time of year weather conditions in booking cruises. We have gotten of in La havre a few times but never this early in the year. Late spring or early fall are better weather wise...

It would have to be quite a good deal for me to give up direct control of my flight arrangements. Even though Princess apparently tried to take care of folks that had flight arrangements with them, it also appears that they made a real mess of the arrangements with flights that could not be made, very long flights with very strange routes. So it depends how one considers handling things. I would much rather have direct control to resolve such issues with insurance backup, instead of being handed tickets with no ability to control the when, where and how.

Even though the cruise ship could not make port, the ferry to Plymouth still ran that evening and would have been my first choice getting one into Plymouth at 7 in the morning with a relatively short card ride to Southampton, instead of flights to who knows where and who knows what time and connection times.

What surprised me is that Princess did not bus people to Plymouth and put them on the Southampton to La Havre ferry. (I have taken that ferry, more comfortable than an overnight plane flight) It would have cost them $60 per passenger plus the bus cost. Many would have probably refused the overnight in a reclining seat, but they would have met their obligation to get people to the port of disembarkation, instead of just telling people you are on your own.

Oops meant to say Plymouth to La Havre ferry

What surprised me is that Princess did not bus people to Plymouth and put them on the Southampton to La Havre ferry. (I have taken that ferry, more comfortable than an overnight plane flight) It would have cost them $60 per passenger plus the bus cost. Many would have probably refused the overnight in a reclining seat, but they would have met their obligation to get people to the port of disembarkation, instead of just telling people you are on your own.

I thought the ferry would have been an option - do you mean Portsmouth instead of Plymouth? It’s about 150 miles from Southampton to Plymouth!

I thought the ferry would have been an option - do you mean Portsmouth instead of Plymouth? It’s about 150 miles from Southampton to Plymouth!

Yep you are correct I did mean to say Portsmouth, Not Plymouth. I correctly identified it early then for some reason when I posted again I mistakenly types Plymouth. Operated by Brittany ferry I believe.

....Operated by Brittany ferry I believe.

That’s the one. I’ve taken my car over to France several times on that route. Happy cruising!

Interesting. We hit a problem on our first Princess cruise. Weather prevented the ship from docking; we were held at the terminal for the entire day and about 6:30pm were loaded onto buses for transportation to a hotel.

 

Princess took the approach that if your had booked "the entire package" with Princess' date=' they provided a hotel along with transportation from terminal to hotel and again back to the terminal the next morning. They defined the "entire package" as air, transfers, and the cruise.

 

Yes, it was a long, stressful day. We tried to order food, but found that the police were stopping all incoming traffic as the terminal was deemed to be over-crowded. The bathrooms in the terminal ran out of all supplies. (really, there wasn't a storage room somewhere in the terminal????) Despite all the difficulties, we felt that Princess did the best they could FOR US.

 

If you booked less than the entire package, you were totally on your own as to your overnight arrangements. In fact, if you came by car you were not allowed into the terminal and were kept in your vehicle in the parking lot with access to a port-a potty. Yeah, those people had serious reason to complain.[/quote']

 

Sounds like Houston:eek:

I was on this cruise and I am aware of one Portuguese couple who were to disembark in Le Harve. She reported to me that Princess had rebooked their air flight return to their home in Madeira at no cost to them. She had no complaints about the service extended to them, in fact was quite complimentary about how it was handled.

I did not ask, but infer that they had booked thru ez air. Our conversation occurred within a couple of hours of the Captain’s announcement.

Obviously others did not experience the same service. I was not affected, however, in the future I will ask more questions and read contracts more carefully. I agree with prior posters that I no longer have the ability to drag luggage on and off trains, etc.

So sorry that many were stranded by Princess.

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