New Dress Code Designations?

Cunard Line

Read hundreds of Cunard Cruise Reviews from cruisers like you.

See posts about:
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
All times are GMT -4.
The time now is 07:19 AM.
BH13 - England
3,080 Posts
Joined Jan 2009
Originally posted by wripro
I think it's the current customers who will die and the new ones who will keep Cunard afloat.
Your assertion bears no financial support. However, as our stateroom spend is North of £30,000.00 every year with Cunard, plus onboard spend, grats and envelopes, then one thinks Cunard will need about 45 new ($1000.00) once a year high spending people, returning every year, to replace my Wife and me.
Been given to understand, that the Red Top to Silver take up is not that great.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
There are those who have, and those who have Yachts.
New Jersey
349 Posts
Joined Oct 2017
Originally posted by jkadventures
We have been following this thread from the beginning and have the same question a few others have raised namely- for those of you who have cancelled or are cancelling your Cunard voyages because of a language change to the dress code, which line(s) are you going to switch to that require a dark suit or sport jacket for men, every night in every venue? A quick sampling: Oceana-no, Regent-no, Azamara-no, Silversea-no, all river cruise lines-no. After 50 plus cruises on ships of all sizes and types, we will be "test driving" Cunard for the first time next year. One of the deciding factors was that I can & will wear some of the beautiful clothes I own which spend most of their time in my closet. We fully intend to comply with the dress code as written, but I don't imagine our voyage experience will be decided by what someone may wear in the pub or casino. So for those apparently giving up Cunard voyages (and cruising in general) it will be interesting where they find the always formal atmosphere they are looking for.
I am not quite sure I understand the statement. You can always wear what you want. You could wear a tuxedo each night at diner on Oceania, Regent, Azamara, Carnival, etc. I have not sailed them (yet) however I doubt anyone would stop you. For me, I would not give up cruising, just that the price on Cunard would have to be price competitive with other cruise lines
(all else being equal)
and they will not be able to charge ANY premium based on dress code.

Personally, having a cruise booked for July I hope not too many people wear bathing suits, baseball caps and sleeveless t-shirts to afternoon tea. Dressing like that for the dining rooms or Verandah for lunch wouldn't bother me that much but not tea.
493 Posts
Joined Nov 2006
Originally posted by PORT ROYAL
Your assertion bears no financial support. However, as our stateroom spend is North of £30,000.00 every year with Cunard, plus onboard spend, grats and envelopes, then one thinks Cunard will need about 45 new ($1000.00) once a year high spending people, returning every year, to replace my Wife and me.

Been given to understand, that the Red Top to Silver take up is not that great.


I think the proof lies in the luxury lines that are a step or two above Cunard. Carnival owns one and has first hand knowledge of that space and itís demographic. Wealthy people as a whole travel more casually these days than they ever have. Seabourn embraced this with a generally casual dress code. If they required tuxedos every other night those ships would sail at significantly reduce capacity. Every single one of those passengers spends what you spend per cruise on Cunard and some significantly more. Look at the others- Silversea, Regent, all the same when it comes to dress.

Someone had said it before- Carnival Corp is like General Motors. They have many different brands for different buyers but in the end they usually get your money. Cunard can easily fill Grills berths with already loyal Seabourn folk who will respond to a changed dress code and frankly spend more money. Is it a fluke that while this is happening the Grill suites now receive free booze to mimic Seabournís model? Not likely.

The two things Iíve noticed throughout this thread is that thereís such a narrow focus that people donít realize how much more casual the world is today in business and travel and the die hards take it so personally. Cunard isnít doing this to upset you- theyíre making changes and responding to market conditions so they can continue to be successful. As a traveler Iím a little disappointed but as a shareholder Iím quite pleased.
Pennsylvania
6,581 Posts
Joined Jul 2010
Originally posted by PORT ROYAL
Your assertion bears no financial support. However, as our stateroom spend is North of £30,000.00 every year with Cunard, plus onboard spend, grats and envelopes, then one thinks Cunard will need about 45 new ($1000.00) once a year high spending people, returning every year, to replace my Wife and me.
Been given to understand, that the Red Top to Silver take up is not that great.
There are already more than 45 once a year passengers for every Cunard £30,000/year passenger, and I suspect as many new passengers annually.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature


Past:
Queen Mary 2: 8 cruises
Queen Victoria: 2 cruises

ms Amsterdam: 1 cruise
ms Eurodam: 1 cruise
Caribbean Princess: 1 cruise
Carnival Pride: 1 cruise
New Jersey
349 Posts
Joined Oct 2017
Originally posted by princeton12321
I think the proof lies in the luxury lines that are a step or two above Cunard. Carnival owns one and has first hand knowledge of that space and itís demographic. Wealthy people as a whole travel more casually these days than they ever have. Seabourn embraced this with a generally casual dress code. If they required tuxedos every other night those ships would sail at significantly reduce capacity. Every single one of those passengers spends what you spend per cruise on Cunard and some significantly more. Look at the others- Silversea, Regent, all the same when it comes to dress.

Someone had said it before- Carnival Corp is like General Motors. They have many different brands for different buyers but in the end they usually get your money. Cunard can easily fill Grills berths with already loyal Seabourn folk who will respond to a changed dress code and frankly spend more money. Is it a fluke that while this is happening the Grill suites now receive free booze to mimic Seabournís model? Not likely.

The two things Iíve noticed throughout this thread is that thereís such a narrow focus that people donít realize how much more casual the world is today in business and travel and the die hards take it so personally. Cunard isnít doing this to upset you- theyíre making changes and responding to market conditions so they can continue to be successful. As a traveler Iím a little disappointed but as a shareholder Iím quite pleased.

I have a question. I don't have the experience to make a comparison. Why would a Seabourn customer travel on Cunard even with a change of dress code? Except for the change of dress code, is the experience identical? The Seabourn ships seem to have much less capacity.
493 Posts
Joined Nov 2006
Originally posted by LB_NJ
I have a question. I don't have the experience to make a comparison. Why would a Seabourn customer travel on Cunard even with a change of dress code? Except for the change of dress code, is the experience identical? The Seabourn ships seem to have much less capacity.


The differentiator between the two is obviously the size of ship. But from a product standpoint a Queens Grill passenger and Seabourn passenger would find things very much similar from quality of food, service, and accommodations.

And itís not a coincidence- Cunard used to run Seabourn and the Grills product we see today was developed under the same management that ran Seabourn.
Gloucestershire
362 Posts
Joined Aug 2006
Originally posted by PORT ROYAL
Your assertion bears no financial support. However, as our stateroom spend is North of £30,000.00 every year with Cunard, plus onboard spend, grats and envelopes, then one thinks Cunard will need about 45 new ($1000.00) once a year high spending people, returning every year, to replace my Wife and me.
Been given to understand, that the Red Top to Silver take up is not that great.
And why do you make the assumption that the people who will be replacing won't also be spending £30000+ every year on their cruise. For every person who throws their toys out the pram and cancels their booking there will be another person willing to book, now that they donít have to dress up so formally on board.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature


Oriana 2018
Queen Mary 2 2018
Queen Mary 2 2018
Oriana 2017
Queen Victoria 2017
Rhapsody of the seas 2016
Niuew Amsterdam 2015
Oceana 2014
Queen Elizabeth 2014
Costa Atlantica 2012
Costa Deliziosa 2011
Arcadia 2010
Oriana 2009
Century 2008
Aurora 2008
Navigator of seas 2007
Golden Princess 2006
Aurora 2005
Oriana 2004
Oriana 2003
New Port Richey FL
560 Posts
Joined Jan 2003
I so agree with all who assert that Cunard is a BUSINESS and they would NOT be making changes unless their market research indicates that the changes are necessary for the business to prosper. Face it, those of us who are 60 or 70+ years old will not be around forever! And I do realize that there are younger folk who like to dress formally, but I think they are in the minority. To me, Cunard is so much more than the dress code.
Cambridgeshire, UK
945 Posts
Joined Feb 2009
Originally posted by LDVinNC
I so agree with all who assert that Cunard is a BUSINESS and they would NOT be making changes unless their market research indicates that the changes are necessary for the business to prosper. Face it, those of us who are 60 or 70+ years old will not be around forever! And I do realize that there are younger folk who like to dress formally, but I think they are in the minority. To me, Cunard is so much more than the dress code.
I agree. But surely the point is that Cunard is in the minority as a formal line. It is the only line that can continue to attract that minority that still want to dress up. We are in our 50's and love dressing up. I would like to think Cunard would be getting another 20 years out of us. Also my son (who is 30) recently (before the change) booked his first cruise. They could get 50 plus years of bookings from him. I am certain there are enough people in the minority who want to keep dressing up, to keep filling Cunard ships for many years to come if they kept the formal dress codes.
New Jersey
349 Posts
Joined Oct 2017
Originally posted by Camgirl
I agree. But surely the point is that Cunard is in the minority as a formal line. It is the only line that can continue to attract that minority that still want to dress up. We are in our 50's and love dressing up. I would like to think Cunard would be getting another 20 years out of us. Also my son (who is 30) recently (before the change) booked his first cruise. They could get 50 plus years of bookings from him. I am certain there are enough people in the minority who want to keep dressing up, to keep filling Cunard ships for many years to come if they kept the formal dress codes.

I think they are making a marketing mistake. Many large companies completely screw up. I have yet to hear a clear explanation of why people would cruise on Cunard instead of another line once the dress code changes. If you travel Britannia there are other lines that would provide the same experience at lower rates. If you travel Grills there are other luxury lines where the WHOLE ship is a luxury class.

There is a building in Manhattan that I still happen call the Pan Am building because that is what it was called when I was young.

We will have to see.
493 Posts
Joined Nov 2006
Originally posted by LB_NJ
I think they are making a marketing mistake. Many large companies completely screw up. I have yet to hear a clear explanation of why people would cruise on Cunard instead of another line once the dress code changes. If you travel Britannia there are other lines that would provide the same experience at lower rates. If you travel Grills there are other luxury lines where the WHOLE ship is a luxury class.



There is a building in Manhattan that I still happen call the Pan Am building because that is what it was called when I was young.



We will have to see.


Regular transatlantic crossings on a purpose built ship for one. Extensive long voyages and world cruises for another. They donít want Cunard to be radically different.

Britannia has always been in the same class as Celebrity/HAL and the Grills have always been about par with a Seabourn/Regent/Silversea. The unique part was that they are on one ship.

Cunard was sort of done for me when Caronia and then QE2 withdrawn. They were traditional ships that todayís just canít match. The QM2 is unique and I enjoy her on a transatlantic trip every once and a while. The Elizabeth and Victoria are just tarted up Caribbean cruise ships in my opinion masquerading as transatlantic ocean liners.

So I donít think itís the dress code so much as Cunard used to operate authentic tonnage that they donít anymore. You would feel out of place on QE2 without a tux- she had a sense of occasion about her. What we are left with today is this odd game of make believe on modern cruise ships. Cunard needs to evolve and it looks like theyíre taking the steps they need to.
Kansas City
522 Posts
Joined Nov 2012
Some have indicated that they think that Cunard is behind the times and needs to change to meet the norms of today. There is an interview on Youtube where Micky Arison talks about why Carnival bought Cunard and why they built the Queen Mary 2. It adds perspective to why Cunard is (or was) what it is. It seems that the current management is not of a similar thought to Mister Arison regarding satisfying passengers nastalgia for the grandeur of the ocean liners of the past. Formal dress is certainly a part of this (and no, I don't mean steerage).

I worry that the dress code may only be the beginning of changes. Very few ships today have real, large, dedicated ballrooms for dancing like those on Cunard. Even though it is very popular with current passengers, will it survive long term or will it be scaled down like the QM2 casino to pack in even more revenue generating rooms for todays casual life style.
CA, USA
14,540 Posts
Joined Apr 2004
Originally posted by Underwatr
There are already more than 45 once a year passengers for every Cunard £30,000/year passenger, and I suspect as many new passengers annually.
And to which cruise line with a sore suitable dress code will you take your 30K GBP per year?

And not every one else spends only 1K GBP. Some, like myself, travel only in QG and will continue to do so. But the points they have a lot of berths to fill, especially with a new ship coming, and they have concluded it will be easier to do that with a more relaxed dress code.
US
536 Posts
Joined Nov 2009
Originally posted by Windsurfboy
It should be the staff who police dress code, I'm not on vacation to tell others what to do.

Every set of boarding documents should stress how important the elegant ambience is to all the people who cruise with Cunard and that dress code will be enforsed

However it goes back to young marketing departments who are out of touch with the basic economic fact that Our generation, 60+ are the ones with the disposable income. Instead they design policies based on what their generation want. The fault lies with the board of Cunard, who must fight for their brand and it's USP, the reason people pay more. If it becomes a mass cruise ship, it will hit bottom line in the end, can't management understand this
You are right - the marketing hipsters are putting forth policies they like. I am way below 60 though! But, I feel like they are making a mistake and I answered the poll on the other thread as such:

"I answered I will never sail again, though I did not say that on the other thread. I was ready to give it a chance until my husband showed me the new pics of what Cunard considers "Smart" and "Gala". No.

I don't sail Cunard to go on a "cruise" and I don't sail the QM2 as transport. I sail them to step back in time. If that is gone, I am gone. I just want to be on the ship. If I happen to like the itinerary, all the better. The ambience and dress code were a huge part of the ship. Anyway I guess Cunard does not mind losing us. My Grills cabin to Alaska next year was a small fortune but I was completely okay with the hard work it takes to afford Cunard. Since we are still fairly young, we both still work, and heck most of the reason I work is just to go on vacation. Since my voyage is next summer I don't have to do anything yet, but if this is the future, Alaska is being cancelled, and I will just use my OBC and my future cruise which I was using for that voyage, to take a short hop on July 4th instead, and thereafter end my dalliance with Cunard. It just won't be worth it to me anymore. It's too bad, since we probably would have had another 3 decades of sailing. When I visited the original Queen Mary a few years back, the saddest thing for me was the loss of the ambience which must have made her spectacular in her day."
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
QUEEN MARY 2 - Oct 2004, Dec 2005, Dec 2006, May 2006, Dec 2007, July 2008, Dec 2008, Dec 2009, Dec 2010, Sept 2011, Sept 2013, Oct 2014, Oct 2015
Queen Mary Hotel in Long Beach, CA - Dec 2013

Disney Magic - Jan 2014, Disney Dream - Dec 2015, Sept 2016, Feb 2017

Eurodam Alaksa Sept 2017 - mistake


US
536 Posts
Joined Nov 2009
Originally posted by Margana





Iím also interested to know which Cunard cruise you havebeen on which includes free alcoholic drinks in the fare? On board creditperhaps, but that is something different.

My Grills fare includes drinks
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
QUEEN MARY 2 - Oct 2004, Dec 2005, Dec 2006, May 2006, Dec 2007, July 2008, Dec 2008, Dec 2009, Dec 2010, Sept 2011, Sept 2013, Oct 2014, Oct 2015
Queen Mary Hotel in Long Beach, CA - Dec 2013

Disney Magic - Jan 2014, Disney Dream - Dec 2015, Sept 2016, Feb 2017

Eurodam Alaksa Sept 2017 - mistake


Vale of Glamorgan
4,789 Posts
Joined Aug 2007
Originally posted by axelskater
You are right - the marketing hipsters are putting forth policies they like. I am way below 60 though! But, I feel like they are making a mistake and I answered the poll on the other thread as such:

"I answered I will never sail again, though I did not say that on the other thread. I was ready to give it a chance until my husband showed me the new pics of what Cunard considers "Smart" and "Gala". No.

I don't sail Cunard to go on a "cruise" and I don't sail the QM2 as transport. I sail them to step back in time. If that is gone, I am gone. I just want to be on the ship. If I happen to like the itinerary, all the better. The ambience and dress code were a huge part of the ship. Anyway I guess Cunard does not mind losing us. My Grills cabin to Alaska next year was a small fortune but I was completely okay with the hard work it takes to afford Cunard. Since we are still fairly young, we both still work, and heck most of the reason I work is just to go on vacation. Since my voyage is next summer I don't have to do anything yet, but if this is the future, Alaska is being cancelled, and I will just use my OBC and my future cruise which I was using for that voyage, to take a short hop on July 4th instead, and thereafter end my dalliance with Cunard. It just won't be worth it to me anymore. It's too bad, since we probably would have had another 3 decades of sailing. When I visited the original Queen Mary a few years back, the saddest thing for me was the loss of the ambience which must have made her spectacular in her day."
That's a shame, which of the pictures changed your mind ?
I wouldn't wear most of them but I didn't find them that offensive, the Ladies Gala dresses were lovely.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
Email - [email protected]

If contacting me via email, please include your Cruise Critic user name and be patient, I do not have full time access to this mailbox and I am in a different time zone to many of you !
New Hamsphire
561 Posts
Joined Feb 2015
Originally posted by axelskater
You are right - the marketing hipsters are putting forth policies they like. I am way below 60 though! But, I feel like they are making a mistake and I answered the poll on the other thread as such:


"I answered I will never sail again, though I did not say that on the other thread. I was ready to give it a chance until my husband showed me the new pics of what Cunard considers "Smart" and "Gala". No.

I don't sail Cunard to go on a "cruise" and I don't sail the QM2 as transport. I sail them to step back in time. If that is gone, I am gone. I just want to be on the ship. If I happen to like the itinerary, all the better. The ambience and dress code were a huge part of the ship. Anyway I guess Cunard does not mind losing us. My Grills cabin to Alaska next year was a small fortune but I was completely okay with the hard work it takes to afford Cunard. Since we are still fairly young, we both still work, and heck most of the reason I work is just to go on vacation. Since my voyage is next summer I don't have to do anything yet, but if this is the future, Alaska is being cancelled, and I will just use my OBC and my future cruise which I was using for that voyage, to take a short hop on July 4th instead, and thereafter end my dalliance with Cunard. It just won't be worth it to me anymore. It's too bad, since we probably would have had another 3 decades of sailing. When I visited the original Queen Mary a few years back, the saddest thing for me was the loss of the ambience which must have made her spectacular in her day."

Well said. Sadly the vandals are at the gate and we have no defense other than to flee.
Florida
240 Posts
Joined Sep 2010
Originally posted by LB_NJ
I am not quite sure I understand the statement. You can always wear what you want. You could wear a tuxedo each night at diner on Oceania, Regent, Azamara, Carnival, etc. I have not sailed them (yet) however I doubt anyone would stop you. For me, I would not give up cruising, just that the price on Cunard would have to be price competitive with other cruise lines
(all else being equal)
and they will not be able to charge ANY premium based on dress code.



Personally, having a cruise booked for July I hope not too many people wear bathing suits, baseball caps and sleeveless t-shirts to afternoon tea. Dressing like that for the dining rooms or Verandah for lunch wouldn't bother me that much but not tea.


Not sure what you donít understand. If you walked into the Azamara or Avalon dining room in a tux, you certainly would feel a bit out of place. That being said, we have never seen anyone dressed sloppily (unlike on HAL) and found their dress code was universally adhered to. Many (including me) chose to wear a jacket on several evenings. On Cunard, I look forward to wearing attire that would be somewhat out of place on most ships. By the way, the per diem on Cunard is generally less than equivalent on the lines I mentioned.


Sent from my iPad using Forums
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
50 plus cruises: Moore McCormack, Home Lines, Windjammer Barefoot, Carnival, NCL, HAL, Princess, Celebrity, Avalon, Azamara
US
536 Posts
Joined Nov 2009
Originally posted by onehappystudio
I'm one of the "new class of Cunard cruiser" - this will be my first cruise on any ship. I have purchased the cheapest stateroom for my first TA crossing in August, so, yes, I'll be traveling in "steerage".

Having said that, I don't believe the travel class you select is indicative of your level of class, or an indicator of how you will dress.

I chose "steerage" because I'm not a lady of leisure - I work hard for my money; I have a son who is about to go off to college, and college isn't cheap here in the US.

I'm saving for retirement, so Queens Grill accommodation isn't in my budget at the moment.

I suppose I could have waited until I retired to be able to afford Queens Grill, but our future is not guaranteed - I had a colleague drop dead of a heart attack last week at the age of 58; I'm going to get this item checked off my bucket list while I'm still healthy, and can enjoy the leisure time.

Look for me in the evening gown on "gala" nights, and dressed appropriately for the remainder of the cruise. You'll also be able to pick me out from the crowd, because I won't have my nose in the air, thinking that traveling in "steerage" is beneath me.
Our 1st 6 or 7 voyages were Britannia then Cunard upgraded us to PG. We liked so much that we booked Grills - either one or the other from there on out. But we also just keep to ourselves for the most part and like to sit alone just the 2 of us. We both work and for us it is just our 7-15 day "date". I wear ball gowns every formal night, and cocktail dresses every other night. I bring lots of shoes and bags. That is perhaps why I need a larger cabin But I wear cocktail dresses on Disney too at night and you cannot get much more casual than that. That said - I have loved Cunard so much since I discovered the line on the Queen Mary 2's inaugural year. But I sail it for the ambience and if it is downgraded I will just travel another way.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
QUEEN MARY 2 - Oct 2004, Dec 2005, Dec 2006, May 2006, Dec 2007, July 2008, Dec 2008, Dec 2009, Dec 2010, Sept 2011, Sept 2013, Oct 2014, Oct 2015
Queen Mary Hotel in Long Beach, CA - Dec 2013

Disney Magic - Jan 2014, Disney Dream - Dec 2015, Sept 2016, Feb 2017

Eurodam Alaksa Sept 2017 - mistake


US
536 Posts
Joined Nov 2009
Originally posted by Host Hattie
That's a shame, which of the pictures changed your mind ?
I wouldn't wear most of them but I didn't find them that offensive, the Ladies Gala dresses were lovely.
I just thought the use of millennial looking hipsters - millennial guys who look like they normally wear skinny jeans with their week-old razor stubble wearing skinny suits or T Shirts with a "blazer" covering them; women wearing "smart" outfits that look like they are going to work at a law office instead of traditional Cunard formal evening. That is just not what my experience has been on Cunard in the past. The "gala" pantsuits & cocktail dresses used to be what I saw on informal nights. That is indeed a major change. The shorts and sneakers I can see anywhere. Cunard was one of the last bastions of formality. I really enjoyed every minute of it, including the ambience created by the formality. As I said previously, I was paying to step back in time for a bit, and if they don't offer that feel anymore, I will skip it. The pictures on their page are portraying something much different than what I have seen in the past.

But the pictures were in my mind also a change in the perception of to WHOM they are marketing rather than WHAT they are marketing. And if you change to whom you are marketing, then eventually you also change what you are marketing. How long before the lectures, the gentleman hosts, the tea dances - are few and far between or relegated to WC only. The marketing department is changing the target or I don't think they would have put up all the models with the outfits. I firmly believe this is a departure from the previous formality - though somewhat of a stealth one. I think it is changing and I will always be grateful we had the QM2 just as she was for the time we had her. I have no desire to sail Cunard-Lite.
Expand Signature
Collapse Signature
QUEEN MARY 2 - Oct 2004, Dec 2005, Dec 2006, May 2006, Dec 2007, July 2008, Dec 2008, Dec 2009, Dec 2010, Sept 2011, Sept 2013, Oct 2014, Oct 2015
Queen Mary Hotel in Long Beach, CA - Dec 2013

Disney Magic - Jan 2014, Disney Dream - Dec 2015, Sept 2016, Feb 2017

Eurodam Alaksa Sept 2017 - mistake