Silversea v. Seabourn comparison from 1st timer on SS

[ravenclaw]

POol/deck bar (importance 5)

 

QUOTE:

''''''" Silversea had the premium-brand liquors out of sight in a cabinet underneath the bar, although available if requested. A cost-cutting move I’m sure. Seabourn on the other hand presented all options to its guests within view "'''''''

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

If SS cruise line policy for all ships, indeed a cost-cutting move and a red flag of service decline that seeps to other areas. Hiding premium-brand liquors to deny choice on availability, is a common strategy in the mass hospitality industry, a low-end barkeeps tactic and tacky for Silversea.

[secoma4]

Thanks to Stines for the information. We have sailed with Seabourn twice (Med and Asia) and are booked for St Petersburg later this year, but also sailing with Silversea in a few weeks ex Vancouver.

 

Everything said about Seabourn tallies with our experiences so we will be interested in seeing how Silver Shadow lines up.

 

On the question of balcony I have to say that with the large windows and layout of the Seabourn suites this wasn't an issue. We were in deck 6 (there are only 3 accommodation levels and this is the top on the smaller ships) and found it easy to wander out onto the deck.

 

The overall Seabourn experience has been great on each occasion and the comments re the staff, food and bar service etc all correspond with our experiences.

[TLCOhio]

On the question of balcony I have to say that with the large windows and layout of the Seabourn suites this wasn't an issue. We were in deck 6 (there are only 3 accommodation levels and this is the top on the smaller ships) and found it easy to wander out onto the deck. The overall Seabourn experience has been great on each occasion and the comments re the staff, food and bar service etc all correspond with our experiences.

 

Great summary point on the balconies on the smaller Seabourn ships not being as important compared to being on the much larger ships. Looking forward to our first cruise on Silversea in order to make these comparisons.

 

THANKS! Enjoy! Terry in Ohio

[conchyjoe]

Stines-thanks for the detailed review. Other SS veterans-we are taking our first SS cruise on 12/11/10 Barbados-FLL on Spirit and getting a little nervous after reading some recent reviews and need a little reassurance. We have taken quite a few cruises (Princess, RCCL, NCL, etc.) and wanted to move up from the lines, noisy kids, rude people, mediocre food, etc. We realize that two people on the same ship at the same time will probably have different views of the ship, but recent posts at first glance seem to indicate a decline in service, food, etc. Are we just paranoid and reading too much into this? Actually, one of our least impressive cruises we've been on was Celebrity (primarily because of the people and food). Also, I like the methodology stines used to compare SS -vs- SB. As with each of you, I'm sure your scale of importance would differ. We personally would avoid any cruise, no matter how wonderful, without a balcony. And, we have great concerns about the smoking issue since we are both allergic to smoke.

 

The comments on Silversea v. Seabourn are of course all subjective however this post was an excellent and very informative one.

 

There are three cruise lines in this category that are (IMHO) comparable, namely Seabourn, Silverseas and Regent but this is like comparing a Rolls Royce and Bentley. All are excellent and have their individual cruise personalities, some good and some bad. Frequent cruisers in this category love some stuff and dislike other aspects and then make their choice. It's all about what is important to you.

 

If you are upgrading from Celebrity, RCCL, HAL or Princess then you hopefully have no worries since all three are in a different league to those mass market lines who all offer great service and facilities, but not to the standard offered by SB, SS and Regent.

 

That said, it's really all up to individual taste. I'm sure some people prefer and feel more comfortable with the Royal Suite at the Motel 8 than they would with a Royal Suite on Silversea.

 

The world is truly your oyster. :-)

[Marylebone37]

I find in fascinating to see all the not-so-nice comments about mass market lines, and Celebrity in particluar (which is what I'm most familiar with). Other than the frequent crowds and lots of kids at times... if you're an active person who likes the buzz, on-board excitement, lots of options for eating, drinking, shopping, casino etc. generally very good food and service, then IMHO Celebrity is a much better value than SS or Seabourn. And I can afford any option pout there at this point in my life. Yes, SS was great and I truly had a wonderful time, but in the end... I can't say it was worth 12K+ for 10 nights. Again, it was good, but not great. Celebrity is good, but not great as well... but we're not talking 12K+ on Celebrity. I still say SS needs to up their game to be a viable long-term contender in the high-end marketplace.

[CatServants]

Stines,

 

Having cruised both Celebrity and SS, we would agree that Celebrity is good, but disagree that SS is not great. To us, SS was well worth the extra expense (not as much as you might think, if you are booking a suite on Celebrity versus a standard veranda cabin on SS and you factor in tips, drinks, etc.) for what we are looking for in a cruise. But, that opinion is based on what we are looking for in a cruise, not you. That's why it's great to live in a world where there are choices available, and do be able to afford them! We look forward to being able to try Seabourn cruise as well some day.

 

Thanks for your thorough review,

 

Randy

[conchyjoe]

I find in fascinating to see all the not-so-nice comments about mass market lines, and Celebrity in particluar (which is what I'm most familiar with). Other than the frequent crowds and lots of kids at times... if you're an active person who likes the buzz, on-board excitement, lots of options for eating, drinking, shopping, casino etc. generally very good food and service, then IMHO Celebrity is a much better value than SS or Seabourn. And I can afford any option pout there at this point in my life. Yes, SS was great and I truly had a wonderful time, but in the end... I can't say it was worth 12K+ for 10 nights. Again, it was good, but not great. Celebrity is good, but not great as well... but we're not talking 12K+ on Celebrity. I still say SS needs to up their game to be a viable long-term contender in the high-end marketplace.

 

Please don't think that I was comparing Celebrity to Motel 8 - that was not what I intended.

 

The most important thing with a vacation (in some cases a cruise) is that you feel comfortable and have whatever you consider fun and for the record I really don't believe that money = fun. That said, when considering fun I have never considered the value for money either ! Just have fun.

 

And if you get it wrong (for you), there is always the next month and another vacation.

[Wellseasoned]

Just a few notes on this thread. By background, our very first cruise was Seabourn Pride in 1992. After that, MANY Silversea cruises. Seabourn was great, that was when they were an independent line, wonderful service, food, etc.

 

Next opportunity was Silver Wind, and we loved it so much that we never left Silversea. We've sailed all the ships except Albert, but favorite is the Whisper. We began in our 40's and are now in our mid+ 60's and have always enjoyed shipmates of all (adult) ages.

 

Everything does depend on your individual preferences. If you do want the buzz, on-board excitement, shopping, certainly go mass market like Celebrity.

 

Regarding "hiding the premium liquors", I've never noticed that. On Silversea, you ASK for what you want, and it's provided. They're not trying to hide it. Just ask. You can have the premiums in your suite, if you ask. I've never seen an ulterior motive.

 

On balconies: This was the major reason we didn't return to Seabourn. We loved Seabourn on our first cruise, but were blown away by Silversea on the next because of an equivalent experience plus the balconies. Being able to dash up on deck is not the same as breakfasting or dining on your own private balcony, or watching the Seine and its villages go slowly by, or seeing the glories of Istanbul pass you at night from your own balcony. Or watching the stars with your supplied binoculars. And I won't even stress the magnificent sunsets. And watching the Americas Cup races in New Zealand from your balcony with a cold beer and commentary heard from your TV is amazing. Now that Seabourn has new ships with balconies we may try them again sometime, but Silversea is a very tough act to follow.

 

And, like most luxury cruisers, we are fairly sophisticated foodwise and winewise and Silversea does not disappoint. To each, His own.

[Marylebone37]

Wellseasoned,

I know you can ASK for what you want (as we did for example in the alternative restaurant by asking the chef to prepare something off the menu) - but when a bartender goes below the bar into a cabinet to fetch the grey goose or bombay sapphire... believe me, it raised a few eyebrows and not just with me. I wonder where the super-premium stuff is stored. :) I heard other passengers comment about it as well. But like you said, if you ASKed they always delivered with a smile and great service. The bar staff on board were for the most part really superb.

 

You bring up another interesting point about Silversea guests that I observed in many converstations. They have an enormously loyal customer base for passengers in their 60's-80's. There were so many people talking about getting to their next "milestone" in terms of # of days sailed. I think the perks kick in at 100 days with free laundry and go up from there with discounts and other things. I bring this up because on Seabourn I recall many guests talking about their experiences on Crystal, SeaDream, SS, and Regent. Yes, there were those extremely loyal to Seabourn, but many many more who seemed to regularly explore other lines because of itinerary and pricing. Not so on SS. Not sure what it all means, if anything, but an interesting observation I wanted to share.

 

And one final comment about SS's new guest reception/cocktail party they hold on board in comparison to SB's. On Seabourn, it was held in the bar where they served tea, cocktails, finger food etc. After the CD said his words of welcome and thanks, the captain made a few comments and mingled among the guests in a very informal manner while we sipped drinks and ate some munchies. Most people were standing up talking with one another. On SS, it was held in the show lounge. We were greeted by bar staff with champagne upon entering (there were a few munchies served by roaming wait staff as well), took a seat, faced forward, and then out came the CD on stage. He did his welcomes and then invited the Hotel Manager to say a few words (no captain like SB). Then came the cruise sales lady who proceeded to sell the benefits of booking SS and more importantly on board you debarked for the 5% discount, the perks available as you accumulate days sailed, and stressing the importance of booking early before the prices increase. It was a riot (well not really, but many people were mumbling amongst themselves, almost laughing)! No kidding... it could have been taped for later broadcast on QVC. It was nothing more than a hard sell with booze in a venue that was in no way suitable for new guests to meet and mingle in a cocktail party-like setting. I thought for a moment about half-way into her sell that art pieces were coming out next for sale. I'm giggling to myself as I write this as it was really THAT BAD! And I know for a fact that many others in attendance felt the same way. I didn't rate this in my review, as such a short one-time event did not warrant a separate category. But it does show, yet again, just how much Seabourn has it all over SS IMHO when it comes to some of the finer details of luxury cruising.

[lord of the seas]

Stines,a good point you make about Seabourn guests sailing with other lines.

I have tried most and with over 420 days on Silversea alone,I still come back to Seabourn,who's level is unsurpassed.

Anyone know what's happening about another new build for Silversea?

[sloopjohnb]

I’ve often found myself describing to non-cruising friends the similarities between the two lines rather than the differences. If you were beamed down from the transporter room of the Starship Enterprise onto one of the ships, it would take a while to work out which line you were on. The suites are nearly identical. If it is San Pellegrino then you are on Silversea. If you find yourself eating those breadsticks then it’s Seabourn.

 

I am a little surprised that neither stines’ review nor any subsequent posts have referred to what is, for me, one major difference in style between Silversea and Seabourn. On Seabourn, the officers and entertainment staff host tables at dinner in the main restaurant. Over the course of a fourteen day cruise, passengers might expect to receive several invitations to dinner. On Silversea, on the other hand, the officers keep themselves to themselves, including dining together. I think this has a significant effect on the atmosphere on the ships, in two ways; It helps Seabourn achieve the objective of making the customer feel that he or she is on his/her own yacht. It also results in lots of passengers getting to know lots of others very quickly. That, in turn, leads to people letting their hair down and being ready to have a good time sooner than they otherwise might. I wonder if this contributes to the “overall feel” on which stines rated Seabourn highly.

 

The exception, for Silversea, is Prince Albert II, on which the expedition staff really engage closely with the guests and create an admirable sense of togetherness.

 

I agree with stines about the similarity in actual age range and the difference in perception of age range between the two lines. Again, I wonder if this is a consequence of a difference in approach between the two. Silversea appears to me to target a much older demographic than their customers actually represent. In my mid-fifties, I suppose I am nearing the middle of Silverseas’ customers in age. When it comes to entertainment, however, I’ve still had the sense of being neglected in favour of a considerably older, and less numerous, age group.

 

sloopjohnb

[Jaffa]

I am not quite getting your comparisons.

Seabourn has always been more laid back and informal than Silversea.

Thats always been one of the main differences between the 2. Especially now that Seabourn has downgraded the dress code to casual and cut the staff to passenger ratio. There has been quiet a few move over to SS because they want a more formal experience. Regent has gone the same way.

SS is one of the only Luxury products where dressing up is still standard on all cruises (except PAII) and maintaining the staff to passenger ratio.

 

So whilst Seabourn is downgrading dress standards to fill ships, SS is staying traditional.

As regent is already experiencing, this is changing the passenger demographic much to many's dismay. There are also numerous threads on the Seabourn board saying the same thing.

Seabourns future direction and changes have many loyalists worried. And perhaps for good reason.

As has been reported many times in the reviews and on the SB board, service standards are slipping with the huge number of new berths to fill and lack of quality staff joing the company. SS has experienced similar to a lesser degree on the Spirit, but it is only one ship.

Only time will tell.

 

With over 230 days on SS my experience is the captain has always attended both the welcome aboard and venetian parties unless something else became a priority.

Perhaps in your case the Capt was held up with a prob or a bridge issue.

 

His primary job is to look after the saftey and wellbeing of the ship, its crew and the passengers, with socialising where he is able. The ship should come first, always.

 

If SS are wrong to brief the new passengers as a group at the welcome aboard how else do you propose that they do this.

by a lecture or something?

Mixing it with the crew and staff introductions in a social enviroment is the most logical way to do this. Its gets it all done at one time and gives the passengers an uninterupted remainder of the cruise.

I always attend the welcome aboard/new passenger party as do many of the return venetians. Like many, l have always found it highly enjoyable, and a great way to meet SS newbies.

 

SS has always looked after its venetian members very well, l put it to you, that is the reason SS has one of the highest client retention rates in the luxury market. I am in my mid 40's (started cruising SS in my early 30's) and SS had announced in Feb this year at the Seatrade luxury forum that their average cruise age was 55 down from 58 over the last 3 years. They also said it was 64 10 years ago. So times are a changing.

If you are right and most people didn't like it, why do they keep coming back. Every new passenger does this party at least once, if they really hated it like you, then the ships would be empty.

But they are not.

 

Like most venetian members & Wellseasoned, I to don't need SS to rub or flash the money/prestige in my face.

I know all l have to do is ask for anything l want or need and they make it happen, quietly and without fuss.

Thats the European way, and what l like most of all about SS.

 

Seabourn is more of an anglo/American foundation and so is a bit more splashy/showy when it comes to the green stuff. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but SS dosen't have to do it to get the same message across.

If you prefer the showy/flashy then maybe SS is not for you.

 

I enjoyed your OP and felt it was a balanced perception from your eyes and fair.

But as you have progressed through this discussion here and your cross post on the SB board I see your position much clearer now.

 

It sounds like Seabourn is just right for you. I wouldn't worry about SS at all, Their demographic is obviously different to what you need.

I'm sure Silversea won't lose any sleep over it.

[Keith1010]

I do not think it is necessary to put down the OP. That to me is not keeping with the CC.

 

I am still not sure why folks can't just accept the OP and the review for what it is, which is one persons view of Silversea. His view is no more or no less valid than anyone elses.

 

My view is very simple. If someone takes the time to post a very thorough review but then gets challenged on some of the points made and then it goes back and forth and the OP gets challenged some more, most people reading this will say to themselves "why bother" and that they are not going to take their time as the OP did to provide a review.

 

We all different and see things differently. As I always say if we all saw the same things the same way and had the same tastes this would be a rather boring world and there certainly would be no sense to have different cruise lines. I just wish folks would be respectful of each others views.

 

No two cruises are precisely the same even on the same ship and even on consecutive cruises. And not two people see the same things for each and every aspect of a cruise or cruise line.

 

Keith

[lord of the seas]

Jaffa,many thanks for your thoughts.

I must ask if you have tried Seabourn as you do not mention it.

[Jaffa]

Firstly, Keith I was not putting anyone down.

If l was, just where did l do that.

Are we all supposed to agree wholehartedly with everything that is written here, l say not.

It is quite reasonable to discuss and comment on some of the points the OP made in their last post which l did.

If you disagree with my opinions, thats fine. What is it about what l wrote that so disturbs you? Is it my writing style?

Other people have opinions and experiences as well, and can and should contribute.

 

I shared my opinion of the difference between the 2 company's. I suggested a reason for the non attenedance of the Captain. I commented on the op's view of the high level of returning guests and gave my impression on the welcome aboard party and its reasoning. I passed on some facts on the age variation direct from a SS speech.

I questioned the op on how else SS could do it and disagreed with the op's opinion that not showing the high priced items is cost cutting or cheap.

Finally l recognised, understood and agreed that the op obviously likes a more anglo/american style of product rather than European and SB is obviously the right choice for them.

 

I see nothing wrong with what l wrote.

 

Lord,

 

I have sailed on all the Lux lines. However it has been 6 years since l was on SB (Legend Med 21 days) and 7 years (Pride Panama 28 days)

I also sent my parents on the Legend 2 years ago for the Christmas holidays, 30 nights Panama/Caribean as a part of a 3 month around the world trip l gave them as a present.

I liked Seabourn, l still do (the small sisters) but l don't like the changes that have been occuring on the new ships, the same as l don't like SS newbuild the Spirit.

In my opinion they are to big and the special-ness of both SS and SB are lost with the bigger size. But most importantly l don't like the drop in dress code. I also don't like SS idea of paid alternative dining or their shore/office/admin service. It does not live up to SS at sea, and lets the product down. I also don't like SS removing the majority of their european hotel and wait staff.

My present planning is for 56 nights on the PAII in the 2nd half of next year. I was going to do the world leaders forum cruise in August but have cancelled for a 3.5 week land trip in Cambodia/Laos & Burma.

[rickroen1]

Thanks to all for the encouragement regarding SS. I first must clarify that I was not trying to put down Celebrity, but merely to point out that the Celebrity cruise we took was not that great; probably if we took another, we would have a different opinion. I know we will have a great time (hey it's a cruise!) on SS in December. I will say, though, since we began cruising in the 1980's, cruising in general has lost much of its appeal in terms of service, food and the other guests. That, is essentially why we are looking to upgrade.

[Keith1010]

Jaffa, I was speaking in general about some of the posts, not one in particular.

 

I do see where when someone takes the time to post a review about the ship which I thought was well balanced (I didn't say whether I agree or not because that is not relevant) I don't think there is a need to tell the OP that they are wrong on this or that and forth. Like I said, if someone can't do a writeup with fear that others are going to push back then many will just not post what they think.

 

Sure, everyone is entitled to their opinion. My recommendation is for those who see it differntly to take the time and write their own review when they get back from a cruise.

 

Anyway, that's my opinion.

 

Like I said from the beginning. I think the layout of this review and the way the OP ranked the items based on his own experience was quite good.

 

And I do truly believe that cruises can vary from time to time. And that includes items such as the food on any ship. I have taken very long cruises as some people know and I could probably tell you when various chefs go on holiday from the head chef to the pastry chef or I could tell you when the Maitre d' goes on vacation because things do change. There are so many factors that come into play.

 

Anyway, to me the only opinion that matters is the OP's. Yes, most will say that a cruise on Silversea is much better than Celebrity but if the OP thinks differently then that is his opinion and I don't see a need for others to convince him that he is wrong. Because for him he is right if that is what he thinks.

 

Keith

[wripro]

Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on one's view) the world is changing very rapidly and along with it cruise lines are trying to adapt in order to attract different demographics. Seabourn has not done away with formal nights, only eliminated them on shorter cruises. Silversea still keeps them on all cruises but no one knows for how long. It's pointless to pick on one line because one prefers the other. They are both great lines so let's just accept their differences and we can all choose the one we prefer.

[Marylebone37]

Keith1010... wow, you are right on the money again. Brilliant post! Hopefully Jaffa's comments are just a matter of our differences in interpreting the written word vs. talking about things face to face. That's the problem sometimes, especially with email and the like. Upon the first read, it certainly did come across as batting down my comments point by point. But that's ok, I don't take offense. There's always two sides to every story and I enjoy hearing different people's views and reactions.

 

The only thing I need to re-iterate... (again, I'm chuckling)... is how absolutely PATHETIC that new guest reception was on SS. There was zero passenger interaction as we were all facing the stage for the sales pitch. It turned so many people off that I'm sure they got less on-board bookings than normal. And get this... I'm not kidding here... I did express an interest in their Baltics cruise this August (in order to take advantage of the on-board booking discount that I had already known about). I sat with the sales lady on day 2 of the voyage (before the new member reception), got some pricing, but told her I needed to think about it before making a deposit - especially since we were within 60-70 days of that possible next sailing. Well after the hard sell presentation, needless to say I didn't put down the deposit required to hold the space. About 2 days after I arrived home on June 8th, I got an email from my travel agent that I will cut and paste here, leaving out some of the details:

 

''Welcome Home! I was going to ask you how was the sailing but then I received email confirmation from Silversea for another sailing for August on the Whisper. I guessed from that response that it was good. I received a call from Silversea regarding your reservation for the Silver Whisper for August 16 - 23, 2010, Copenhagen to Stockholm. They explained that you booked this while on-board the Silver Cloud. Cruise only balance due: $X ($Y per person). Guestcare Travel Insurance can be purchased at a rate of 8.5% of total cost. Approx. $Y. Payment is due to Silversea by Friday, June 11, 2010.''

 

OMG! That lady could make a fortunate selling used cars. All right, I'll stop now with any more about the on-board sales consultant and the new member reception. But man, it is amazing what a turnoff if was for me and at least a couple dozen or so others that discussed it during the remainder of the cruise. Like I said, it was so bad... most were laughing about it. That's all... promise.

[rafinmd]

Stines, thank you for an awesome, very well presented, review. I think you have strengthened my courage. I have sailed Silversea and have been looking at Seabourne but was concerned by the perception that Seabourne and Silversea are very similar. My views of Silversea did not exactly match yours but there were many similarities. I'm a bit more committed now to working Seabourn into my plans when a good opportunity arises.

 

Roy

[Keith1010]

Stines, thank you for an awesome, very well presented, review. I think you have strengthened my courage. I have sailed Silversea and have been looking at Seabourne but was concerned by the perception that Seabourne and Silversea are very similar. My views of Silversea did not exactly match yours but there were many similarities. I'm a bit more committed now to working Seabourn into my plans when a good opportunity arises.

 

Roy

 

 

Roy, I think its great that you try Seabourn. That is not a reflection about Silversea. If this was reverse I would recommend that someone who has sailed on Seabourn often and had not tried Silversea to try Silversea.

 

Yes, there are many similarities but there are differences.

 

But remember there are also differences within the cruise line between the ships and what they can offer based on the respective sizes of the ships.

 

Keith

[rafinmd]

Stines, thank you for an awesome, very well presented, review. I think you have strengthened my courage. I have sailed Silversea and have been looking at Seabourne but was concerned by the perception that Seabourne and Silversea are very similar. My views of Silversea did not exactly match yours but there were many similarities. I'm a bit more committed now to working Seabourn into my plans when a good opportunity arises.

 

Roy

 

My apologies. I thought I was posting this on the Seabourn Board, where it is more relevant and less inflammatory.

[Cubuff1]

I thought this review was one of the best I have read. The facts presented finally gave me some idea about the difference in feel between the two lines. Regardless of the conclusions drawn, there is much factual information presented to help me choose my next cruise.

[donjavier]

we are about to board our first seabourn cruise today (June 26th) Rome-to Rome

 

A couple of years ago we did a silversea cruise and were really dissapointed considering the price we paid-I dont consider myself a whinger and rarely complain or indeed write reviews but if anyone is interested I will expound on my experience with silversea.We are hoping for a better experience with seabourn

 

We did a sea dream cruise the year before the silversea and it beats silversea by a country mile, on every level-service/food/ambience/cleanliness

 

Although I try to be objective I suppose this can be difficult because what suits one person does not suit another and we are all different

[CanadianKate]

I really appreciated this review.

 

Amusingly, it is the bathroom that we find most important on SilverSea (not really, but it is awfully important to us, especially since we have a small bathroom at home) and so we are staying on the Whisper/Shadow because of the double sinks. To read your comment on the Spirit's bathroom reinforced my decision not to try out the Spirit until there is an amazing itinerary I can't pass up.

 

It sounds like our priorities are similar so I may bite the bullet some day and try Seabourn. But there will have to be something special to entice me to try it, either pricing or itinerary.