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notamermaid

The river Moselle infos and river cruising experiences

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Hello everone,

 

I would like to start this thread on the Moselle, a tributary to the Rhine and a beautiful river to cruise along. Some of you already have, so I would like to invite you all to share your experiences and any tips you might have for future cruisers.

 

I will try to add some facts and trivia and tips of my own.

 

The Moselle has its source in the Vosges mountains in France, forms the border between Luxembourg and Germany and then flows through Germany, meeting the Rhine in Koblenz at the famous Deutsches Eck.

 

In folklore the Rhine is often referred to and depicted as "Father Rhine" and the Moselle as "Mother Moselle". The Moselle is often called "lovely" or "gentle" as opposed to the "wilder and stronger" Rhine.

 

Most cruisers go as far upstream as Trier, for example on the Viking Cities of Light itinerary; there are some companies that turn, i.e. let the passengers disembark, at Remich, a small town further upstream. It is possible to go further into France and barges do so on a regular basis serving the industrial areas of Lorraine, the region in France bordering on Luxembourg and Germany.

 

The Moselle meanders a lot and that explains some of its appeal in my opinion. The towns are not as industrial and large as on the Rhine, making the cruising less spectacular but giving plenty of "small town charm" to travellers' experiences.

 

Trier, of course, is the exception being a large university town and the oldest town in Germany. In the hills overlooking Trier there was a Celtic settlement and the Romans founded the town giving it the name that evolved into present-day Trier.

 

notamermaid

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Hello everone,

 

I would like to start this thread on the Moselle, a tributary to the Rhine and a beautiful river to cruise along. Some of you already have, so I would like to invite you all to share your experiences and any tips you might have for future cruisers.

 

I will try to add some facts and trivia and tips of my own.

 

The Moselle has its source in the Vosges mountains in France, forms the border between Luxembourg and Germany and then flows through Germany, meeting the Rhine in Koblenz at the famous Deutsches Eck.

 

In folklore the Rhine is often referred to and depicted as "Father Rhine" and the Moselle as "Mother Moselle". The Moselle is often called "lovely" or "gentle" as opposed to the "wilder and stronger" Rhine.

 

Most cruisers go as far upstream as Trier, for example on the Viking Cities of Light itinerary; there are some companies that turn, i.e. let the passengers disembark, at Remich, a small town further upstream. It is possible to go further into France and barges do so on a regular basis serving the industrial areas of Lorraine, the region in France bordering on Luxembourg and Germany.

 

The Moselle meanders a lot and that explains some of its appeal in my opinion. The towns are not as industrial and large as on the Rhine, making the cruising less spectacular but giving plenty of "small town charm" to travellers' experiences.

 

Trier, of course, is the exception being a large university town and the oldest town in Germany. In the hills overlooking Trier there was a Celtic settlement and the Romans founded the town giving it the name that evolved into present-day Trier.

 

notamermaid

 

Happy Mother's Day, my friend! As you know we did this trip with Vantage last year and it's one of my favorites. We started in Amsterdam and stopped in Cologne, Cochem, with it's wonderful Reichsburg Castle. Our next stop was Luxembourg and I will never forget the outstanding tour and history lesson our guide gave us, nor the wreath laying by all the veterans on the trip. Taking a photo of my husband with this group of men was one of my proudest moments and it still brings tears to my eyes! And the macarons I had for lunch (yes a whole box of them IS a meal) were divine. I would have liked to have sent more time in Trier because there is SO much to see and do there. The underground tour of the Coliseum were amazing, as was the Cathedral and of course the famous viaduct. One of my favorite things we did was in Boppard where we took the ski lift to the top from which the river looked like several great lakes. We had done the Rhine Gorge before but this time we did it with a teaspoonful of water instead of a river! It was still beautiful and one advantage to going single file through the gorge was we had plenty of time to take pictures and really enjoy the spectacular scenary. (I know Boppard and the castles aren't on the Moselle but they are worth mentioning!) This is a must see trip for everyone. :D

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Thank You NotAMermaid!

 

I think that the Moselle has the most beautiful scenery of any river I've sailed in Europe. Our first river cruise with Viking started in Trier and sailed to Nuremberg. The vineyards and the picturesque towns are unforgettable. On our most recent cruise, we did the Moselle again. My only regret is that I haven't been able to get to Burg Eltz. I tried to see if I could somehow schedule a quick train to Moselkern while the ship was in Cochem, but the timing didn't work out.

 

Also, the Roman history of Trier is a big attraction. I'm surprised that most cruises don't include the Landesmuseum there. For someone interested in the Roman history, it has a remarkable collection of Roman statuary, mosaics and artefacts.

 

Several lines have cruises that include the Moselle. In addition to the Trier-Nuremberg itinerary, cruises go to Basel and Amsterdam. Don't know if I've seen a Trier to Budapest trip, but that would be great as well. The Amsterdam-Budapest route is the most popular 15 day cruise, but in my opinion, there's not a lot to see between Amsterdam and Koblenz--the exception being Cologne. I'd pick a couple of days on the Moselle any day over the lower Rhine.

 

FuelScience

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Hello Hydrokitty,

 

Thank you for the greetings. I remember thinking when you reported about your trip that Vantage had got a great itinerary together. Luxembourg must have been a very special experience for you and your husband.

 

In Trier, with "viaduct" do you mean the Porta Nigra town gate? Or the Roman bridge? I do not remember a Roman viaduct.

 

By the way, I did not know that Patton was buried in Luxembourg until a couple of years ago. It is not the sort of thing we automatically learn around here unless someone is interested. Ehh, being on the other side of WWII memories we do not celebrate the 8th of May really and I had to learn looots of WWII history, more the gruesome than the heroic side of things. When I was 19 I had had enough of that part of my country's history for many years.

 

Schengen if you are into more recent history and current political affairs is just a few kilometres from Remich. Admittedly, the place does not look like much but that is were the Schengen agreement gets its name from.

 

I love the train ride from Trier to Luxembourg, quite spectacular in parts, I find.

 

A box of macaroons, now that is certainly a meal. :D

 

I have done the chairlift ride in Boppard to the Vierseenblick (four lakes view) and enoyed it greatly.

 

notamermaid

Edited by notamermaid

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I visited Luxembourg and Trier when living in Germany. Visited Patton's grave in a cemetery east of Lux city. Also, loved Vianden, Luxembourg and its old castle and beautiful town.

 

Always wanted to do a Battle of Bulge Tour.

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Hello 4774Papa,

 

I agree, Luxembourg is a beautiful town. Battle of the Bulge is another term I had to look up some years ago when I came across it. One of those "aah, I see" moments in translating. The German is "Wacht am Rhein" or "Ardennen-Offensive" which describes that it took place in the Ardennes hilly region of Belgium, France and Luxembourg. A travel company in the UK offers the "Battle of the Bulge" history tour as one of their specialities. Land-based and I believe five days long. Although this might be more from a UK point of view I am sure it is a great way to learn about that piece of military history in-depth. I think this is something I would find interesting as well. What connects me emotionally to the area is the fact that a grand uncle of mine died in the Ardennes in WWI and was buried in France, but I do not know where.

 

I must admit I have not been to Vianden yet. My teenage years took me on errants with my family to Luxembourg sometimes to stock up on coffee, cigarettes and petrol. All those are (were) cheaper at the time then they were in Germany. Lots of people did that, shopping daytripping to Luxembourg. :D

 

notamermaid

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Hello Hydrokitty,

 

Thank you for the greetings. I remember thinking when you reported about your trip that Vantage had got a great itinerary together. Luxembourg must have been a very special experience for you and your husband.

 

In Trier, with "viaduct" do you mean the Porta Nigra town gate? Or the Roman bridge? I do not remember a Roman viaduct.

 

By the way, I did not know that Patton was buried in Luxembourg until a couple of years ago. It is not the sort of thing we automatically learn around here unless someone is interested. Ehh, being on the other side of WWII memories we do not celebrate the 8th of May really and I had to learn looots of WWII history, more the gruesome than the heroic side of things. When I was 19 I had had enough of that part of my country's history for many years.

 

Schengen if you are into more recent history and current political affairs is just a few kilometres from Remich. Admittedly, the place does not look like much but that is were the Schengen agreement gets its name from.

 

I love the train ride from Trier to Luxembourg, quite spectacular in parts, I find.

 

A box of macaroons, now that is certainly a meal. :D

 

I have done the chairlift ride in Boppard to the Vierseenblick (four lakes view) and enoyed it greatly.a

 

notamermaid

 

Yes I do mean the Porta Nigra...I thought it was a viaduct because it looks like a viaduct and the Romans were big on building them. But you would know so I will now refer to it as a town gate! (That will teach me to stop taking pictures and looking for macaroons and listen to the guide every now and then!! ) :D

 

Interesting about Schengen, I didn't realize that connection.

 

War is terrible no matter which side you're on. It's the people who have nothing to do with the politics that suffer the most and then the governments make up.....but the suffering goes on. I am a pacifist.....who comes from a military family.

Edited by Hydrokitty

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SNIP

 

War is terrible no matter which side you're on. It's the people who have nothing to do with the politics that suffer the most and then the governments make up.....but the suffering goes on. I am a pacifist.....who comes from a military family.

 

There is a German Cemetery not far from the US Cemetery. It is worth the visit, if only to experience the stark contrast. I recommend people ask whether it is included when touring Luxembourg, it doesn't add much time.

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Yes I do mean the Porta Nigra...I thought it was a viaduct because it looks like a viaduct and the Romans were big on building them. But you would know so I will now refer to it as a town gate! (That will teach me to stop taking pictures and looking for macaroons and listen to the guide every now and then!! ) :D

 

No, don't stop taking pictures, and definitely don't stop looking for local food delicacies when you're traveling! Most things that the guide tells you can be looked up later on, using Wikipedia or any number of other online sources, if you need to refresh your memory. You can't find fresh macaroons on Google, though, so don't let that opportunity pass you by!

 

BTW, you can climb inside the Porta Nigra if you'd like. :D

 

**

 

notamermaid, thanks for starting another very interesting thread. We only had one day to drive along the Mosel last year, and it was beautiful despite the rain and dark skies. So many places to visit, so little time!

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BTW, you can climb inside the Porta Nigra if you'd like. :D

 

Easy for you to say!!! :D

**

 

notamermaid, thanks for starting another very interesting thread. We only had one day to drive along the Mosel last year, and it was beautiful despite the rain and dark skies. So many places to visit, so little time!

 

I forgot to mention one of my favorite pictures is the statue of the cat who picked out the barrel of wine and saved the town. I forget where it was, but the statue is wonderful...of course, I'm a cat lover.

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I forgot to mention one of my favorite pictures is the statue of the cat who picked out the barrel of wine and saved the town. I forget where it was, but the statue is wonderful...of course, I'm a cat lover.

 

What is Zell. The cat was black. Hence the wine.

 

Sadly, Krov has no similar statue. :p

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Hello 4774Papa,

 

What connects me emotionally to the area is the fact that a grand uncle of mine died in the Ardennes in WWI and was buried in France, but I do not know where.

 

notamermaid

 

There are so many unknowns....one of the things we learned at the cemetery is that they are currently identifying remains fairly often. Because they have extensive records of each units whereabouts, now due to computer technology, they are able to cross-check soldiers missing from each unit with information about the units near where the remains were found and then contact surviving family members for DNA samples. It was interesting to find that many of the unknown soldiers aren't really unknown...the Army has an idea of who they might be but until DNA they had no definitive proof. The remains are not being repatriated but the headstones are being replaced. Perhaps your grand uncle could be identified in the same way.

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Hello FuelScience,

 

Thank You NotAMermaid!

 

I think that the Moselle has the most beautiful scenery of any river I've sailed in Europe. Our first river cruise with Viking started in Trier and sailed to Nuremberg. The vineyards and the picturesque towns are unforgettable. On our most recent cruise, we did the Moselle again. My only regret is that I haven't been able to get to Burg Eltz. I tried to see if I could somehow schedule a quick train to Moselkern while the ship was in Cochem, but the timing didn't work out.

 

Also, the Roman history of Trier is a big attraction. I'm surprised that most cruises don't include the Landesmuseum there. For someone interested in the Roman history, it has a remarkable collection of Roman statuary, mosaics and artefacts.

 

Several lines have cruises that include the Moselle. In addition to the Trier-Nuremberg itinerary, cruises go to Basel and Amsterdam. Don't know if I've seen a Trier to Budapest trip, but that would be great as well. The Amsterdam-Budapest route is the most popular 15 day cruise, but in my opinion, there's not a lot to see between Amsterdam and Koblenz--the exception being Cologne. I'd pick a couple of days on the Moselle any day over the lower Rhine.

 

FuelScience

 

I am happy to hear you enjoyed the Moselle so much. Burg Eltz is a great place to visit and from a river cruise very difficult to get to. One could take a taxi from Cochem, but that would cost a fair bit. From Moselkern it is only ten minutes by car. I walked from Moselkern through the valley of the Eltz which takes a bit more than an hour, uphill and very picturesque.

 

http://burg-eltz.de/en/

 

Talking of castles: one of my favourites is Bürresheim castle in the Eifel region which is North of the Moselle. It is in a small place called Sankt Johann in the Nette valley. The castle is not well known outside of Germany but has one claim to fame: it models as the Schloss Brunwald where Professor Henry Jones senior was held captive in the film "Indiana Jones and the last crusade".

 

I agree, the Landesmuseum Trier is very interesting. Their latest exhibition is on Emperor Nero and runs from 14 May to 16 October 2016.

 

An itinerary Trier to Budapest is an interesting notion. I have not been to the lower Rhine much and not to Amsterdam, but from what I have read and heard it is somewhat flat and not so appealing. I tend to think that there should be an itinerary starting in Amsterdam with a coach tour to Arnhem or Nijmegen or even Krefeld and start the river cruise from there. After all, if you want to do Amsterdam and the Netherlands you can do this as a tulip cruise.

 

Did you know that the "original" travel and sightseeing tour, i.e. from when the British started mass tourism 200 years ago, was Rotterdam to Switzerland? Amsterdam must have taken over as a favourite port much later.

 

A British travel operator even offers a river cruise from Alken to Andernach, that being therefore mainly on the Moselle and stopping just an hour's cruising distance North of Koblenz on the Rhine, so four days on the Moselle and one hour on the Rhine. Very different but very appealing for a short trip and for discovering new nice white wines. :)

 

notamermaid

Edited by notamermaid

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Hello Hydrokitty,

 

Quote: "Yes I do mean the Porta Nigra...I thought it was a viaduct because it looks like a viaduct and the Romans were big on building them. But you would know so I will now refer to it as a town gate! (That will teach me to stop taking pictures and looking for macaroons and listen to the guide every now and then!! )"

 

yes, the Romans were great builders of viaducts and aquaeducts. There are not many viaducts left in Germany and nearby, more in France and other countries. Aquaeduct remains are a little more common. My favourite is - not surprisingly - the fabulous Pont du Gard. It was originally only used for transporting water but from the Middle Ages onwards used as a bridge, hence the name.

 

Keep on eating hunting for macaroons and the like, as jpalbny quite rightly has said. It is no use having macaroons on paper but town descriptions on paper are fine. :D

 

notamermaid

Edited by notamermaid

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Hello Hydrokitty,

 

Quote: "Yes I do mean the Porta Nigra...I thought it was a viaduct because it looks like a viaduct and the Romans were big on building them. But you would know so I will now refer to it as a town gate! (That will teach me to stop taking pictures and looking for macaroons and listen to the guide every now and then!! )"

 

yes, the Romans were great builders of viaducts and aquaeducts. There are not many viaducts left in Germany and nearby, more in France and other countries. Aquaeduct remains are a little more common. My favourite is - not surprisingly - the fabulous Pont du Gard. It was originally only used for transporting water but from the Middle Ages onwards used as a bridge, hence the name.

 

Keep on eating hunting for macaroons and the like, as jpalbny quite rightly has said. It is no use having macaroons on paper but town descriptions on paper are fine. :D

 

notamermaid

 

We have seen Pont du Gard and the aqueduct in Segovia, Spain as well. The one in Segovia was in use until 1round 1980. Roman roads were so good that it was not until the 19th Century in Europe that roads were built that were better. Footnote, Pont du Gard is featured on the 5 Euro note.

 

Also, in Trier, there is a basilica built in the 4th Century by Emperor Constantine, who once had his headquarters there.

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Hello 4774Papa,

 

yes, Roman roads where fantastic. In the film "Sense and Sensibility" the girl Margaret is told to "restrict her remarks to the weather or the state of the roads". Most important topics in light coversation. The roads in England were baad, just like in almost all places in Europe. At least in rainy weather or the winter. In Britain the A2 in Kent for most of its course from Dover to London is the old Roman road, in some parts built right on it.

 

Emperor Constantine resided in Trier. Thank you for reminding me about him. He was instrumental in paving the way for Christianity in Europe by making it the state religion. In the year 300 Augusta Treverorum hat several ten thousand inhabitants thus classifying the town officially as a world city.

 

notamermaid

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Hello 4774Papa,

 

yes, Roman roads where fantastic. In the film "Sense and Sensibility" the girl Margaret is told to "restrict her remarks to the weather or the state of the roads". Most important topics in light coversation. The roads in England were baad, just like in almost all places in Europe. At least in rainy weather or the winter. In Britain the A2 in Kent for most of its course from Dover to London is the old Roman road, in some parts built right on it.

 

Emperor Constantine resided in Trier. Thank you for reminding me about him. He was instrumental in paving the way for Christianity in Europe by making it the state religion. In the year 300 Augusta Treverorum hat several ten thousand inhabitants thus classifying the town officially as a world city.

 

notamermaid

Emperor Constantine's mother was Helena, a Christian, that probably is the main reason the Emperor became a Christian (although not officially baptized until on his deathbed). Helena went to Jerusalem and identified the site of the Church of the Holy Sepulcher; on the site of Jesus' crucificition and tomb. Constantine then was famous for moving the capitol of the empire from Rome to Constantinope (Istanbul).

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Hello FuelScience,

 

Thank you for checking this, would love to travel the itinerary. Perhaps Budapest to Paris, though, not as far to get home from Paris. Might even cut short at Metz because I like the town. Oh oh, I am already planning. :D

 

notamermaid

Edited by notamermaid

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Hello jpalbny,

 

...

**

 

notamermaid, thanks for starting another very interesting thread. We only had one day to drive along the Mosel last year, and it was beautiful despite the rain and dark skies. So many places to visit, so little time!

 

Thank you. I am happy to see the thread is proving popular. :)

 

Good to hear you enjoyed the Moselle so much. Did you know, one of the towns on the Moselle - Traben-Trarbach - around 1900, was the second most important wine trading place in the world after Bordeaux? The place is a bit sleepier now but still has a fabulous art nouveau luxury hotel and several fine local wines produced on the steep vineyards.

 

notamermaid

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I think Traben-Trarbach is one of the nicest towns on the Moselle River. My nephew taught collage classes at Hahn Air Force Base back in 1980 (which I understand is now Frankfurt- Hahn Airport) and lived in Traben-Trarbach so I got a chance to go over and visit him. I also stayed there for the last night of some of my trips as I was using Icelandic Air from New York to Luxembourg.

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Hello happy taveler,

 

Icelandic Air from New York to Luxembourg sounds very unusual. But flying into Luxembourg for a river cruise or land travel along the Moselle would be very convenient, come to think of it.

 

The Air Force base is indeed now Frankfurt-Hahn Airport. Many international flights are available, it all started with an Irish entrepreneur who owns ( I don't not know if that is the correct term here for that business structure) Ryan Air. At least it was his business "baby".

 

From Hahn Airport you can take a rental car or a coach line to Koblenz and explore the area very conveniently. Friends of mine used Hahn to get from the UK to come and visit us.

 

notamermaid

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Iceland Air can be a good choice for people who don't mind changing planes and want to save money....I flew them to Iceland from NY and had no complaints...daughter flew them to Brussels and again to Oslo....business class for 1/2 what it costs on the "big" guys....only caveat is that no matter where you're going, you have to stop in Reykjavik. On the up side, if you're interested in visiting Iceland, and it is worth the visit, they have a package where you can stop over for 1-7 nights, free! Their US departure cities are: Boston, Chicago, Denver, NYC, Orlando, Portland, Seattle and D.C....may be others.

Edited by Hydrokitty

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I am talking of a time frame 1971-1972 then in the late 80's. They had the cheapest airfare that I could find around $400.00 round trip. I took the 24 hour stop over in Reykjavik one time which was nice then caught the middle of the night plane the next day. It was so nice as the airport in Luxembourg was small back then and it was a very short walk to the rental car offices. The location was nice as you could head right over to Germany. I remember one time I then took the train down to Switzerland for a week and used the Swiss Rail Pass. After a week I took the train back to Luxembourg to pick up a rental car and to my surprise at 5:00pm the offices were all closed. I managed to find a room for the night and picked up the car the next morning and headed for Brugge Belgium then up to Delft in Holland. It was a different world back then where there were no GPS and you had to read a map to get around.

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Hello Hydrokitty,

 

 

There are so many unknowns....one of the things we learned at the cemetery is that they are currently identifying remains fairly often. Because they have extensive records of each units whereabouts, now due to computer technology, they are able to cross-check soldiers missing from each unit with information about the units near where the remains were found and then contact surviving family members for DNA samples. It was interesting to find that many of the unknown soldiers aren't really unknown...the Army has an idea of who they might be but until DNA they had no definitive proof. The remains are not being repatriated but the headstones are being replaced. Perhaps your grand uncle could be identified in the same way.

 

That is highly interesting. What the modern world can do! I know that people in Germany are still looking for the resting place of their ancestors, it is an on-going search and there is a very dedicated instituation in Germany at the forefront of it. Traditionally, November is the time for asking for donations for the upkeep of German war graves spread all over the world (mostly Europe of course).

 

In the case of my grand uncle it might be not as diffcult as his death certificate is in the family archives and cross-referencing with records of war cemeteries will help I reckon. The solution might just be a letter away and I would certainly like to go there.

 

notamermaid

Edited by notamermaid

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