MSC Seaside nasty odor

[chengkp75]

I really like the answer regarding grey water traps, floor drains etc. The question I have is surely there would be a trap primer system installed? I'm an electrician not a plumber, but we regularly supply power to run trap primer systems for floor drains etc, in food prep areas of grocery stores, basically anywhere there's a floor drain has a trap primer feed to it.

 

Given that every cabin (passenger and crew) have at least 3 traps, hence thousands of trap primers just for cabins, and then there will be hundreds of deck drain traps around galleys, laundries, pantries, and technical spaces. Electronic trap primers would be prohibitive. Mechanical types like "pressure drop" types would result in excessive water usage because the vessel rolling would create the type of pressure drop in the trap that reduced water would, even if the rolling did not actually flow water from the trap. A further problem is that any connection between the potable water system and any other system be equipped with a backflow preventer, so that if the water pressure is shut off, the drain water (in this case) could not flow back into the potable water piping. Since the ships already have these on every shower onboard, and every toilet onboard, as well as hundreds of other locations (washing machines, dishwashers, hose bibbs, etc), and these backflow preventers must be tested every year, it again becomes very expensive to think of installing trap primers. Also, if the trap primer fails, and continues to add water to the trap, this excessive water usage would be almost impossible to detect, and given the ship's limited water storage and water making capacity, this could be "fatal" to a cruise.

[ssmea03]

Given that every cabin (passenger and crew) have at least 3 traps, hence thousands of trap primers just for cabins, and then there will be hundreds of deck drain traps around galleys, laundries, pantries, and technical spaces. Electronic trap primers would be prohibitive. Mechanical types like "pressure drop" types would result in excessive water usage because the vessel rolling would create the type of pressure drop in the trap that reduced water would, even if the rolling did not actually flow water from the trap. A further problem is that any connection between the potable water system and any other system be equipped with a backflow preventer, so that if the water pressure is shut off, the drain water (in this case) could not flow back into the potable water piping. Since the ships already have these on every shower onboard, and every toilet onboard, as well as hundreds of other locations (washing machines, dishwashers, hose bibbs, etc), and these backflow preventers must be tested every year, it again becomes very expensive to think of installing trap primers. Also, if the trap primer fails, and continues to add water to the trap, this excessive water usage would be almost impossible to detect, and given the ship's limited water storage and water making capacity, this could be "fatal" to a cruise.

 

Sounds fair, thanks.

[jcathers1]

I'm just going to put this out there. For many years I was the person who cleared up all of the gross messes. For a time I worked in a nursery and was completely unfazed by changing diapers. I was not bothered by the smell. I figured I had just completely burned out the ability to notice back when I worked in the nursery.

 

 

 

Eventually went to the doctor for a very minor health complaint. Or so I thought at the time as my symptom was quite mild just annoying. After I got put on medication suddenly found I could not handle the bad smell clean ups. I babysat my grandchild and had to use the old clothespin trick to change a diaper. I mentioned this to the nurse at my doctor's office who laughed. Apparently there is a lot of inflammation associated with my health issue which the medication would have relieved. I had noticed a lot of other signs of this but had not thought of it affecting my sinuses in that way.

 

 

 

Because of this I think people who say they didn't smell it probably didn't. Does not mean it wasn't there. Just means it was below their sensitivity threshold. This doesn't mean I think they're ill or anything like that because they don't smell it. My example did teach me something about sensitivity levels though. I realized everyone is different in terms of sensitivity for whatever reason because of what happened to me. My husband doesn't have my health problem and just cleared his physical with flying colors. I often smell odors and he smells nothing.

 

 

 

Perhaps if all future cruisers could find a way to contract some type of nose inflammation, the problem would be solved.... Or WOULD it?

 

 

P.S. This might be the most amazing thread I’ve ever seen, and that includes NCL raising gratuities and charging for water. Keep up the good work.

 

 

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[ERLEC]

I'm sorry to have started this thread. I just wanted to see if the problem as resolved or not. I didn't know it was going to create that kind of activity and comments.

[canter168]

Hi: This is a question for MSC Seaside cruisers just off the ship.

MSC Seaside is our first cruise with MSC. Therefore, I would appreciate if some Seaside Cruisers can give me some help on the following questions:

1. Do I have to purchase the MSC Laundry Package before embarkation or can I get them once on board.

2. Does MSC have laundry bag specials for small items? For example most cruise line have say $ 12 per bag of laundry (only wash and fold) etc.

 

We are traveling with 2 toddlers and therefore laundry is a big issue since there are no self service laundry on board.

 

I did try to call MSC and waited over an hour but no one answers. I also tried for the “Call Back” at least 5 to 6 time on MSC website, but of course, no one calls back.

Thanks

Steve

[pinkie60]

Maybe someone added Mercaptan to the sewer line as a joke and totally destroyed the enjoyment of this ship. By the way, mercaptan is the odor they add to natural gas lines so you can smell a gas leak. It’s very concentrated and it smells of rotten eggs (sulfur odor).

[ssmea03]

Maybe someone added Mercaptan to the sewer line as a joke and totally destroyed the enjoyment of this ship. By the way, mercaptan is the odor they add to natural gas lines so you can smell a gas leak. It’s very concentrated and it smells of rotten eggs (sulfur odor).

 

Maybe the same loyal to royal who said it was going to cost over $300 to watch the super bowl?

[TravelinGert]

Just saw this posted to a Seaside group on Facebook:

 

just received this from MSC:

MSC Cruises We’ve unfortunately experienced a ventilation issue with one of the air conditioning units due to an erroneous installation during the ship's construction. Its location has resulted in some occasional uptake of undesirable odors from other systems on the ship which were becoming more frequent under some specific wind conditions. A technical solution has already been identified and implemented. It has considerably reduced the bad odors and will progressively eliminate the issue entirely in the next few days.

Says it posted six hours ago.

[chengkp75]

Just saw this posted to a Seaside group on Facebook:

 

just received this from MSC:

MSC Cruises We’ve unfortunately experienced a ventilation issue with one of the air conditioning units due to an erroneous installation during the ship's construction. Its location has resulted in some occasional uptake of undesirable odors from other systems on the ship which were becoming more frequent under some specific wind conditions. A technical solution has already been identified and implemented. It has considerably reduced the bad odors and will progressively eliminate the issue entirely in the next few days.

Says it posted six hours ago.

 

Thanks. I stand corrected, and find it very unusual that something like this happened, and would love to know what the fix was, but probably never will. Interesting that it was only one AC intake, but the odor was reported all over the ship.

[kerryincork]

Thanks. I stand corrected, and find it very unusual that something like this happened, and would love to know what the fix was, but probably never will. Interesting that it was only one AC intake, but the odor was reported all over the ship.

I would say this could be a problem even once land.

 

I've had experience of this three times. I use to work maintenance in a different factories. I have smelled Al sorts of odours. Most common was smoke. Someone out side the factory would burn something. The air intake units would suck in the smell. A report of smoke would send us out side smelling the air. This was highly influenced by the wind.

 

Another common thing we had was if the wind blew in a certain direction it would blow I water (big air exchangers had a tray at the bottom which would drain the condensate)

 

Wind can have a big impact on the smells being drawn in.

 

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[DCGuy64]

Now I’m thinking about all of the poor people who canceled their cruises prematurely based on this issue. I wonder if any of them will bother to recheck and come back. I have to feel a certain sense of vindication since I pointed out that this was a brand new ship type of issue, which it clearly was. Happy to see MSC are implementing a permanent solution!

 

 

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[sidari]

DC ... I think many were ready to jump or happy to be pushed at the slightest complaint rather than wait to see if there was a resolution.

[DCGuy64]

DC ... I think many were ready to jump or happy to be pushed at the slightest complaint rather than wait to see if there was a resolution.

 

 

 

Veritas!

 

 

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[BestNC Cruiser]

Cool. It is good to hear that they are working on things. Good steps in the positive direction. Makes me feel good about my booking for next year.

[ssmea03]

Thanks. I stand corrected, and find it very unusual that something like this happened, and would love to know what the fix was, but probably never will. Interesting that it was only one AC intake, but the odor was reported all over the ship.

I think your explanation of dry traps covers cabin odors and bad smells here and there. But the faulty AC would cover the strong smell complained of in the Atrium (I think). It's easy to get a 3 phase machine to run backwards and suck instead of blow. Every installation should be tested for rotation at start up, if rotation is wrong you simply swap 2 phases. Further I would have expected every duct to have been flow tested, so two things got missed for this to happen at commissioning. At least that's what happens in a building.

[sidari]

As long as it wasn't something left in there by one of the workforce at the shipyard which would also explain it !

[BermudaBound2014]

This is very good news, and I do feel some sense of vindication in that MSC admitted there was still a problem up until yesterday and in no way was the problem solved last week ;). I hope you can see that comment as friendly ribbing DC- like you, I don’t attack and apologize if you felt that way.

 

Sidari, I can’t speak for the “many” you referenced, but I do not consider this a “slight” complaint. Sewer smell may not bother you, but to reference it as a “slight complaint” trivializes what I believe to be a major issue.

 

Of course, those of us who are concerned need to follow reviews the next few weeks to make sure the problem is actually fixed as I don’t have tremendous amount of blind faith. MSc has told us the website was fixed numerous times over the last few years and it’s still a cluster (at best).

 

Cheng- are you willing to speculate how easy it would be to move an entire air intake system? And can you also shed some light on all the posters who have reported clogged and overflowing?

Edited February 4, 2018 by BermudaBound2014

[sidari]

BB ... A daily constant smell over every cruise would be a matter for serious concern, however what has been described is nowhere near that.

I understand it would be off putting, but to cancel a booked cruise that may be some months off on the say so of a few passengers to me is madness.

[BermudaBound2014]

BB ... A daily constant smell over every cruise would be a matter for serious concern, however what has been described is nowhere near that.

 

I understand it would be off putting, but to cancel a booked cruise that may be some months off on the say so of a few passengers to me is madness.

 

 

At this point it appears MSC has acknowledged sewer smell as a problem. I hope we can just agree to disagree about the level of “off putting” the improper installation would cause. I know that for me, I could not enjoy the infinity pool on the divina due to the septic smell, so unfortunately it seems I’m more sensitive than others.

[chengkp75]

I think your explanation of dry traps covers cabin odors and bad smells here and there. But the faulty AC would cover the strong smell complained of in the Atrium (I think). It's easy to get a 3 phase machine to run backwards and suck instead of blow. Every installation should be tested for rotation at start up, if rotation is wrong you simply swap 2 phases. Further I would have expected every duct to have been flow tested, so two things got missed for this to happen at commissioning. At least that's what happens in a building.

 

I don't for a minute believe this is a case of wrong rotation. First off, the fans for the ventilation are completely separate from the, probably, 4-6 Mw chillers in the engine room. Any wrong rotation of a ventilation fan would have been noted at dock trials.

 

No, an intake vent was placed in a location where it drew in vapors from the sewage tanks or treatment plant, in certain wind conditions, as stated by MSC.

[BestNC Cruiser]

BB ... A daily constant smell over every cruise would be a matter for serious concern, however what has been described is nowhere near that.

 

I understand it would be off putting, but to cancel a booked cruise that may be some months off on the say so of a few passengers to me is madness.

 

 

 

I don’t see anything wrong with the thoughtful rearranging of vacation plans due to unforeseen issues with the ship. I don’t want to get into whether the sewer smell is a big deal or not. To some it is, and to others it’s not. The truth is, they acknowledge it and are working on it. I believe that it is perfectly acceptable to put off your sailing date to a later time while things are worked through.

 

 

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[chengkp75]

 

Cheng- are you willing to speculate how easy it would be to move an entire air intake system? And can you also shed some light on all the posters who have reported clogged and overflowing?

 

They would not move the air intake system, as this would require a complete rework of the air handler room, the area of the ship where the duct work is routed from the outside, and probably many cabins or public spaces as well. What I think would be done would be, at most, some deflectors on the HVAC intakes as needed to direct the air flow into them away from the vents. Likely the major work will be to reroute the sewage tank/plant vents (which are only 6" diameter pipes) with tips up in the funnel to direct the air flow in a given direction, and to probably install exhaust fans in these vents to give the gases more velocity to travel further from the ship before dropping down to the level of the ship.

 

I guess you are asking about clogged and overflowing toilets? This can happen on any ship, I'm wondering what percentage of the current MSC passengers are first time cruisers. With a new vacuum system, the piping should be in good condition, and the Seaside does not present any challenges in size or configuration to existing vacuum toilet system design. Overflowing is most often caused when the water valve to the toilet does not shut off after the flush cycle, and this can be caused by scale in the water pipes clogging the small vents in the valve. It can also be caused by people repeatedly pushing the flush button when there is a problem with the discharge valve (that empties the bowl into the vacuum pipes). If the toilets "brain" thinks both the water valve and the discharge valve have worked properly, but in fact the water valve opens to admit water and the discharge valve does not open to empty the bowl, when the button is pushed again, the "brain" opens the water valve again, and adds more water to the bowl. If the toilet does not flush on the first push of the button, do not push again, call for service.

[sidari]

Cheng ... With the engine room further forward as is the smoke stack, do you believe that this could have contributed to the issues ?

The wind direction at times for me would certainly drive the outflow from the stack down onto deck 16 rather than out to sea.

I remember complaints of soot on the rails of the Aft cabins on Divina a while back.

[eroller]

As far as I’m concerned the issue was already resolved on my cruise last week. The entire 7 days I smelled nothing foul anywhere on the ship.

[ssmea03]

I don't for a minute believe this is a case of wrong rotation. First off, the fans for the ventilation are completely separate from the, probably, 4-6 Mw chillers in the engine room. Any wrong rotation of a ventilation fan would have been noted at dock trials.

 

No, an intake vent was placed in a location where it drew in vapors from the sewage tanks or treatment plant, in certain wind conditions, as stated by MSC.

So is there a giant air handling plant in the engine room that provides for the whole ship? Or a heat and cooling plant that is plumbed to remote air handling units around the ship? And are the air intakes all around the funnel?