Rhine water levels 2018 and similar topics

[Mark_T]

On that itinerary, the Rhine is more likely to be your problem than the Danube, unless it doesn’t sail directly towards Amsterdam in which case mentioning Regensburg would be relevant.

Edited November 15, 2018 by Mark_T

[notamermaid]

Sjde,

You are a bit in luck as the Johann Strauss is only 110m long which means she can sail a little better in low water than the 135m ships. How much this helps only captain and company now. If you are in doubt, do contact the river line again closer to the date is my advice.

 

notamermaid

 

[squarepi]

27 minutes ago, notamermaid said:

Sjde,

You are a bit in luck as the Johann Strauss is only 110m long which means she can sail a little better in low water than the 135m ships. How much this helps only captain and company now. If you are in doubt, do contact the river line again closer to the date is my advice.

 

notamermaid

 

We leave on the Viking Mani 11/23 from Basel. Any word on the Viking ships making it all the way? We did receive notification from Viking that we will have to do a "ship swap" -- taking it all in stride...it will still be an adventure.

[notamermaid]

Earlier today, the BAfG (Federal Institute of Hydrology) published its 19th update on the low water situation in Germany. Says it all really, it means that - as they skipped a week - the situation has officially been going on for 21 weeks. Just a couple of details. The title photo shows a dam that is much lower than it normally is. Remains of former farms and houses are visible and have become a tourist attraction. The dam now has so little water that it is not used for feeding the Weser river and a shipping canal any more. Just too hazardous ecologically, i.e. the habitats of flora and fauna at the dam. The short-term outlook for the Danube is not good as is evident in the graph for Hofkirchen gauge (graph in Abb. 4). In Abb. 5 you can see that all the graphs for Germany took a sharp fall in June and since then have not regained any level even close to what we saw on 17 June. On that day the two upper graphs that represent Duisburg on the lower Rhine and Maxau on the upper Rhine tell us there was mild flooding so we do not want to be there again, but the river never recovered from that sharp drop due to lack of rain. The low water "season" started much earlier this year than is normal (the level always goes down in Autumn).

 

English summary at the end: https://www.bafg.de/DE/07_Nachrichten/BfG_Niedrigwasserbericht_181114.pdf?__blob=publicationFile

 

To today. Maxau 331cm, Kaub 44cm, Koblenz 59cm. We are on the down slope again in the Rhine gorge. Forecast tells us 40cm at Kaub is likely, a figure less than that is possible.

 

Pretty bad. Even worse when you have to rely to a great extent on the river with your company. Deutsche Welle has just published a short video showing the logistical nightmare. For transporting commodities nothing is as efficient as a ship. 2000 tons of oil fit into one ship,  that equals 40 rail wagons or 80 trucks.

 

notamermaid

 

[hbr777]

Hi everyone!

 

Is the Rhine gorge the only impassable part of the river right now for a 135m ship? Are there other low areas that prevent passage Basel to Amsterdam?

[notamermaid]

38 minutes ago, squarepi said:

We leave on the Viking Mani 11/23 from Basel. Any word on the Viking ships making it all the way? We did receive notification from Viking that we will have to do a "ship swap" -- taking it all in stride...it will still be an adventure.

Not as of today, no. They ferry between Koblenz and Braubach. Sounds odd, but seriously, currently one ship seems to be either in Koblenz or Braubach constantly. I think they come from Cologne to Koblenz, go to Braubach and then return to Koblenz after the excursion. Then leave for Cologne again. But you would need to follow the movements more closely yourself on marinetraffic, I have not looked into the details much. Easiest way is to look for the Viking ships docked in Cologne. Check where they are 12 hours later. Then check again 12 hours later. Etc. You should see the pattern emerging. Should a ship disappear from radar after Braubach somewhere it has entered the Rhine gorge and the signal is lost for quite some hours. When it reappears upstream from Rüdesheim it has made it. A few go from Cologne to Trier, though, like the Viking Mimir today.

 

I cannot see a passage through the gorge happening for a few days... See my previous post.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

40 minutes ago, notamermaid said:

...

To today. Maxau 331cm, Kaub 44cm, Koblenz 59cm. We are on the down slope again in the Rhine gorge. Forecast tells us 40cm at Kaub is likely, a figure less than that is possible.

 

Pretty bad. Even worse when you have to rely to a great extent on the river with your company. Deutsche Welle has just published a short video showing the logistical nightmare. For transporting commodities nothing is as efficient as a ship. 2000 tons of oil fit into one ship,  that equals 40 rail wagons or 80 trucks.

 

notamermaid

 

 

I found the video I quoted from in its English version: https://www.dw.com/en/is-the-rhine-drying-up/av-46299168

 

notamermaid

 

[sjde]

Thanks notamermaid.

I hadn’t realized that -I thought the ships are all similar capacity.

 

 It does sound like we are going to be getting a revised itinerary within the next day though. 

[squarepi]

1 hour ago, notamermaid said:

Not as of today, no. They ferry between Koblenz and Braubach. Sounds odd, but seriously, currently one ship seems to be either in Koblenz or Braubach constantly. I think they come from Cologne to Koblenz, go to Braubach and then return to Koblenz after the excursion. Then leave for Cologne again. But you would need to follow the movements more closely yourself on marinetraffic, I have not looked into the details much. Easiest way is to look for the Viking ships docked in Cologne. Check where they are 12 hours later. Then check again 12 hours later. Etc. You should see the pattern emerging. Should a ship disappear from radar after Braubach somewhere it has entered the Rhine gorge and the signal is lost for quite some hours. When it reappears upstream from Rüdesheim it has made it. A few go from Cologne to Trier, though, like the Viking Mimir today.

 

I cannot see a passage through the gorge happening for a few days... See my previous post.

 

notamermaid

 

Thanks. Just found marinetraffic.com and signed up. Pretty cool site. Looks like the Mani has been in Koblenz for 3 days.

[squarepi]

22 minutes ago, squarepi said:

Thanks. Just found marinetraffic.com and signed up. Pretty cool site. Looks like the Mani has been in Koblenz for 3 days.

My error...they have been in Strassbourg

Edited November 15, 2018 by squarepi
misspelling

[Jaydub99]

5 hours ago, hbr777 said:

Hi everyone!

 

Is the Rhine gorge the only impassable part of the river right now for a 135m ship? Are there other low areas that prevent passage Basel to Amsterdam?

 

We just got our revised itinerary or option to cancel notice from Avalon for our 110m ship’s cruise. Essentially bussing Amsterdam to Strasbourg to meet our ship with stops in Cologne and Mainz and then bus back to Heidelberg for a tour. The Amsterdam to Cologne portion must also not be passable, or assessed not to be for our 24 Nov departure. 

[hbr777]

47 minutes ago, Jaydub99 said:

 

We just got our revised itinerary or option to cancel notice from Avalon for our 110m ship’s cruise. Essentially bussing Amsterdam to Strasbourg to meet our ship with stops in Cologne and Mainz and then bus back to Heidelberg for a tour. The Amsterdam to Cologne portion must also not be passable, or assessed not to be for our 24 Nov departure. 

Hey, that sounds like a really nutty itinerary.  A bus from Amsterdam to Strasbourg bypasses many areas where larger ships are currently running on either side of the Rhine gorge. I don't think that section is not passable but that Avalon doesn't have ships on either side of the gorge to do a ship swap and your ship is stuck in Strasbourg? Are you canceling or cruising?

[Jaydub99]

Just now, hbr777 said:

Hey, that sounds like a really nutty itinerary.  A bus from Amsterdam to Strasbourg bypasses many areas where larger ships are currently running on either side of the Rhine gorge. I don't think that section is not passable but that Avalon doesn't have ships on either side of the gorge to do a ship swap and your ship is stuck in Strasbourg? Are you canceling or cruising?

 

I’ll say! I don’t quite understand it. Our ship’s sister ship is in Amsterdam and ours is in Strasbourg right now with another 110m near Mainz. If we were to sail to Cologne and bus to Koblenz or Mainz for a ship swap and then sail to Basel it would be a different story - in fact I expected that to be the option we would be given. A bus to Strasbourg with in some cases only a few hours in town for the markets and lunch before being herded back onto the bus to keep going is not what we envisioned when we signed up in January.  Not sure the reasoning for the itinerary they produced. We have a breakfast planning session with the couple we are traveling with in the morning to decide. With only 2 days actually transiting the river, I see a Eurail pass in my immediate future....

[hbr777]

19 minutes ago, Jaydub99 said:

 

I’ll say! I don’t quite understand it. Our ship’s sister ship is in Amsterdam and ours is in Strasbourg right now with another 110m near Mainz. If we were to sail to Cologne and bus to Koblenz or Mainz for a ship swap and then sail to Basel it would be a different story - in fact I expected that to be the option we would be given. A bus to Strasbourg with in some cases only a few hours in town for the markets and lunch before being herded back onto the bus to keep going is not what we envisioned when we signed up in January.  Not sure the reasoning for the itinerary they produced. We have a breakfast planning session with the couple we are traveling with in the morning to decide. With only 2 days actually transiting the river, I see a Eurail pass in my immediate future....

I hope they offered you credit or compensation for that drastic change? I'm sorry you have to make that decision. It just stinks.

[Chili Queen]

To Jaydub99,

 

I have been following this for a week or so now.  I too have an upcoming trip, departing Amsterdam to Basel on December 8th on the Avalon Tranquility II.  I was curious to know what ship you are scheduled to be on and your departure date which I believe you said was November 24th.  So you essentially are supposed to be departing in about a week?  How many days did Avalon give you to make your decision?  This is a once in a lifetime trip for us and I could see us definitely cancelling if this were to happen to us (which it might unfortunately).  We didn't buy trip insurance and bought our airfare directly from Avalon.  I would love to hear more particulars of what Avalon will give to you (full refund, etc.) if you are willing to share.  I fear that we may be in your shoes in another week or so.  Our travel agent spoke to Avalon yesterday and they said they have been doing well for 3 weeks now, but they take it week by week, moment by moment.  Looking forward to hearing back from you.  Chili Queen

[nickbevoz]

1 hour ago, Jaydub99 said:

 

We just got our revised itinerary or option to cancel notice from Avalon for our 110m ship’s cruise. Essentially bussing Amsterdam to Strasbourg to meet our ship with stops in Cologne and Mainz and then bus back to Heidelberg for a tour. The Amsterdam to Cologne portion must also not be passable, or assessed not to be for our 24 Nov departure. 

 

From what you have said that that is not a cruise it is a bus trip.  It is a terrible position to put you in.

 

we are booked on the Amakristina from Basel to Amsterdam on 17 December.  We leave here (Australia) on 10 December and, so far, have not had any info / response from our TA or AMA on likely itinerary changes.  The California fires are messing with AMA.

 

currently, the Amakristina is doing revised itineraries in southern Holland and Belgium and I am not sure what our options would be.

 

friends of ours who were on an AMA cruise in late October / early November had a full credit AND were given a changed itinerary similar to above.  They were happy with the AMA service.

 

we have family in the Netherlands and will be spending Christmas and New Year with them after the cruise. We would likely accept an alternate CRUISE and a credit but not an alternate BUS TOUR and a credit.

 

still praying for rain.....

[Jaydub99]

18 minutes ago, hbr777 said:

I hope they offered you credit or compensation for that drastic change? I'm sorry you have to make that decision. It just stinks.

 

They did but it was complicated. I believe it was something like $600CAD per person to apply to a future cruise if we cancelled and 50% of cruise fare refunded for the nights were in a hotel. I’ll have to rebook at that. No worries, not what we wanted or planned but we love spending time in Europe, particularly around Christmas - I should add that we booked our own air so we are going no matter what! I hope things work out well for you. 

[Jaydub99]

25 minutes ago, Chili Queen said:

To Jaydub99,

 

I have been following this for a week or so now.  I too have an upcoming trip, departing Amsterdam to Basel on December 8th on the Avalon Tranquility II.  I was curious to know what ship you are scheduled to be on and your departure date which I believe you said was November 24th.  So you essentially are supposed to be departing in about a week?  How many days did Avalon give you to make your decision?  This is a once in a lifetime trip for us and I could see us definitely cancelling if this were to happen to us (which it might unfortunately).  We didn't buy trip insurance and bought our airfare directly from Avalon.  I would love to hear more particulars of what Avalon will give to you (full refund, etc.) if you are willing to share.  I fear that we may be in your shoes in another week or so.  Our travel agent spoke to Avalon yesterday and they said they have been doing well for 3 weeks now, but they take it week by week, moment by moment.  Looking forward to hearing back from you.  Chili Queen

 

Oh, I understand your concern completely. We are also booked on the Tranquility II from A to B departing 24 Nov.  I can send you the email I got through our TA this evening to give you an idea of the options. They are a bit more drastic than I figured, but I was not overly surprised having tracked the Rhine situation for the last month fairly closely. How can I get that to you privately?

[Aslangold]

We are sailing on 12/1 - Basil to Amsterdam on Tranquility II.   I would also love to know what options they gave you especially option to cancel completely.   At this late date, I need to have a Plan B.   Anything you can share would be appreciated.

[Chili Queen]

Thank you. 

i already received the email so you can completely delete the whole email address if you would like.

 

Diane

[gadugger]

About 16 hrs. before we drive to the airport to get to Amsterdam for our AMA Rhine river mystery cruise, I break a tooth after dentist office hours. Luckily I got an emergency appt. for a temporary repair before regular office hours tomorrow. Apparently I should have spent less time praying to the rain gods and more praying to the patron saint of travelers (St. Christopher). I will see whether tragedy  plus time  equals comedy when it comes to travel. 18 months ago, my wife broke her toe right before a trip to Amalfi Coast with its hundreds of steps. 

[CILCIANRQTS]

11 hours ago, hbr777 said:

Hi everyone!

 

Is the Rhine gorge the only impassable part of the river right now for a 135m ship? Are there other low areas that prevent passage Basel to Amsterdam?

 

Viking  Idi and Eir  (135m) were able to do all but middle Rhine, with ship swap, of course.

[CILCIANRQTS]

 

P.S. We did cruise middle Rhine on a sightseeing boat.

We had the whole boat, with unlimited beer/wine/cakes.

ALMOST as good as sun deck on river ships.

[Hoyas96]

I'm scheduled to embark AmaKristina on 11/26 in Amsterdam headed to Basel.  I received the attached update from AMA today.  It's not super clear what this will mean for the itinerary / ports of call in between the cities mentioned, especially for scenario B.  Fingers crossed for scenario A.  No matter what happens, I'll be happy to escape the smoky air in CA and breathe some fresh air in Europe!

 

Edited November 16, 2018 by Hoyas96

[nickbevoz]

1 hour ago, Hoyas96 said:

I'm scheduled to embark AmaKristina on 11/26 in Amsterdam headed to Basel.  I received the attached update from AMA today.  It's not super clear what this will mean for the itinerary / ports of call in between the cities mentioned, especially for scenario B.  Fingers crossed for scenario A.  No matter what happens, I'll be happy to escape the smoky air in CA and breathe some fresh air in Europe!

 

Thanks so much for giving this update.  It is really good to get a sense of the detail of the plans and, as well, how effectively the actual process is.

 

The option A does not look too drastic given the low water levels.

 

The Option B is a big change as the distance from Antwerp to Strasbourg is almost 500 km (over 300 miles) and that cuts out a huge chunk of the cruise itself.

 

We are booked on the Amakristina from Basel to Amsterdam on 17 December and, to date, have heard nothing at all of substance from our TA or AMA despite having written to both.  The message has been “nothing to see here”.

 

has there been any reference to allowing you to cancel and get a refund or to transfer a credit to a future cruise?

 

best of luck....

Edited November 16, 2018 by nstarrenburg