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InGearX

things stolen - what would you do?

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hi my dear Cruise Critic family ... happy holidays. 🙂

 

we need your help - please be so kind to advise: my mother and her friend are on board of NCL ship sailed out of NYC

 

upon boarding they made a mistake and put their coats into cabin next to theirs as theirs was locked

they went to eat

upon return they found their expensive coats ~$2000 each to be missing 😕

 

new people inside the cabin said they do not know anything

 

and were not permitted to check ... security was called ... and tried to mediate ... mediate

 

my mom asked to review the CCTV but security said it is not that simple as it in US ... they sail and are governed under Bahama flag ... so somethibg prevents them from doing that ... they made a formal request in writing and are awaiting for a formal reply

 

security / personnel sympathized with them and are trying to comfort them by saying do not worry, mayne they will turn up...

 

but said that they are not able to search a cabin, but even if they did and found it they are not able to do anything under the law ... regulations .. restrictions ... legal aspect ... 

 

what would you do?

 

what could be done?

 

please be so kind to advise ... thank you  ...

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10 minutes ago, InGearX said:

hi my dear Cruise Critic family ... happy holidays. 🙂

 

we need your help - please be so kind to advise: my mother and her friend are on board of NCL ship sailed out of NYC

 

upon boarding they made a mistake and put their coats into cabin next to theirs as theirs was locked

they went to eat

upon return they found their expensive coats ~$2000 each to be missing 😕

 

new people inside the cabin said they do not know anything

 

and were not permitted to check ... security was called ... and tried to mediate ... mediate

 

my mom asked to review the CCTV but security said it is not that simple as it in US ... they sail and are governed under Bahama flag ... so somethibg prevents them from doing that ... they made a formal request in writing and are awaiting for a formal reply

 

security / personnel sympathized with them and are trying to comfort them by saying do not worry, mayne they will turn up...

 

but said that they are not able to search a cabin, but even if they did and found it they are not able to do anything under the law ... regulations .. restrictions ... legal aspect ... 

 

what would you do?

 

what could be done?

 

please be so kind to advise ... thank you  ...

 

I do not believe you when you say that security can NOT view their OWN security footage.  That is #1 where this falls apart. 

 

Secondly, WHY would someone/anyone put their personal belongings in a cabin that was NOT their own cabin!  That doesn't compute ... on any level. This is a coat check room!  If I am wearing a $2000+ fur coat ... I am NOT leaving it in a cabin that doesn't belong to ME/MY reservation!  

 

Thirdly, ALL cabins are locked.  NONE are unlocked ... how did they get INTO the cabin?  

 

This doesn't fly ... on a lot of levels. 

Edited by CruiseGal999

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35 minutes ago, InGearX said:

hi my dear Cruise Critic family ... happy holidays. 🙂

 

we need your help - please be so kind to advise: my mother and her friend are on board of NCL ship sailed out of NYC

 

upon boarding they made a mistake and put their coats into cabin next to theirs as theirs was locked

they went to eat

upon return they found their expensive coats ~$2000 each to be missing 😕

 

new people inside the cabin said they do not know anything

 

and were not permitted to check ... security was called ... and tried to mediate ... mediate

 

my mom asked to review the CCTV but security said it is not that simple as it in US ... they sail and are governed under Bahama flag ... so somethibg prevents them from doing that ... they made a formal request in writing and are awaiting for a formal reply

 

security / personnel sympathized with them and are trying to comfort them by saying do not worry, mayne they will turn up...

 

but said that they are not able to search a cabin, but even if they did and found it they are not able to do anything under the law ... regulations .. restrictions ... legal aspect ... 

 

what would you do?

 

what could be done?

 

please be so kind to advise ... thank you  ...

Two(!) $2000 coats and they're on an NCL cruise? 👀

As mentioned by the previous poster, the entire story sounds bogus. 

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I agree with the first two responses. Something doesn't add up. If they had a paid for the first cabin, they would have had key cards to get into them, so why do they say their cabin was locked? And why would anyone put anything in a cabin that isn't theirs? They shouldn't be putting anything in someone else's cabin, much less $2000 coats! That makes absolutely no sense at all. I wouldn't leave a cheap sweater unattended, much less two very expensive coats. And the entire situation with security is very dubious.

 

This is sounding very fishy to me. 

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1 minute ago, sloopsailor said:

I agree with the first two responses. Something doesn't add up. If they had a paid for the first cabin, they would have had key cards to get into them, so why do they say their cabin was locked? And why would anyone put anything in a cabin that isn't theirs? They shouldn't be putting anything in someone else's cabin, much less $2000 coats! That makes absolutely no sense at all. I wouldn't leave a cheap sweater unattended, much less two very expensive coats. And the entire situation with security is very dubious.

 

This is sounding very fishy to me. 

 

Your right ... I completely looked past the fact that they would HAVE the keycard to the cabin.  

 

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Hmmm - are the previous posters guilty of shooting first & asking questions after?

 

Yes it all sounds very strange, but perhaps that's in part down to the second-hand telling.

 

There are certainly times on embarkation day when folk don't have access to their cabin.

And cabins most certainly aren't always locked, especially but not solely on embarkation day.  I've walked past dozens of cabins with the doors wide open as stewards are going about their duties. Hellfire, how many times have you been as nosey as me to glance in to see what other cabins look like?

 

And on the matter of "we're not permitted to view our CCTV", altho that argument sounds ridiculous - especially on the high seas - we need a professional like Cheng or Heidi  to give their informed opinion.

But in all walks of life  I've come across misguided and officious jobsworths who don't employ common sense in their replies. Classic case in point - just last week when I phoned to arrange delivery of goods from a store I was asked for my phone number - I gave it and asked for it to be read back to me, as I always do to ensure that it wasn't mis-heard. "I'm sorry, I can't do that, by law I'm not permitted to give out information". Not permitted to confirm the phone number I'd just given??? 

 

Or mebbe it's as simple as the crew-member not wanting to admit that their CCTV wasn't in working order.

 

Yes, there are  few things that don't make sense.

For instance....

Leaving coats in the adjoining cabin. Did they do that to avoid the bother of carrying them back to the public areas? Or did the OP misunderstand, & in fact they'd put the coats in the adjoining cabin mistaking it for their own?

And did the OP's mum ask that security check that cabin? Or did she ask that she be allowed to do it?

 

The OP has enough posts under their belt to be taken seriously, without accusations of "bogus".

So how about asking, rather than accusing?

 

JB :classic_smile: 

Edited by John Bull

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1 hour ago, John Bull said:

Hmmm - are the previous posters guilty of shooting first & asking questions after?

 

Yes it all sounds very strange, but perhaps that's in part down to the second-hand telling.

 

There are certainly times on embarkation day when folk don't have access to their cabin.

And cabins most certainly aren't always locked, especially but not solely on embarkation day.  I've walked past dozens of cabins with the doors wide open as stewards are going about their duties. Hellfire, how many times have you been as nosey as me to glance in to see what other cabins look like?

 

And on the matter of "we're not permitted to view our CCTV", altho that argument sounds ridiculous - especially on the high seas - we need a professional like Cheng or Heidi  to give their informed opinion.

But in all walks of life  I've come across misguided and officious jobsworths who don't employ common sense in their replies. Classic case in point - just last week when I phoned to arrange delivery of goods from a store I was asked for my phone number - I gave it and asked for it to be read back to me, as I always do to ensure that it wasn't mis-heard. "I'm sorry, I can't do that, by law I'm not permitted to give out information". Not permitted to confirm the phone number I'd just given??? 

 

Or mebbe it's as simple as the crew-member not wanting to admit that their CCTV wasn't in working order.

 

Yes, there are  few things that don't make sense.

For instance....

Leaving coats in the adjoining cabin. Did they do that to avoid the bother of carrying them back to the public areas? Or did the OP misunderstand, & in fact they'd put the coats in the adjoining cabin mistaking it for their own?

And did the OP's mum ask that security check that cabin? Or did she ask that she be allowed to do it?

 

The OP has enough posts under their belt to be taken seriously, without accusations of "bogus".

So how about asking, rather than accusing?

 

JB :classic_smile: 

 

No, I have to say ... the previous posters are NOT guilty of firing first and asking questions 2nd.  Nothing in the OPs post makes any sense.  

 

You can try to rationalize it all you want ... do you honestly think people just toss $4000 worth of coats into a stranger's cabin?  Puhlease ... 

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6 hours ago, InGearX said:

hi my dear Cruise Critic family ... happy holidays. 🙂

 

we need your help - please be so kind to advise: my mother and her friend are on board of NCL ship sailed out of NYC

 

upon boarding they made a mistake and put their coats into cabin next to theirs as theirs was locked

they went to eat

upon return they found their expensive coats ~$2000 each to be missing 😕

Who in their right minds leave expensive coats in someone else's hotel room, and then expects it to be there when they return?

new people inside the cabin said they do not know anything

 

and were not permitted to check ... security was called ... and tried to mediate ... mediate

Of course the mother and friend were not allowed to search someone else's cabin.

my mom asked to review the CCTV but security said it is not that simple as it in US ... they sail and are governed under Bahama flag ... so somethibg prevents them from doing that ... they made a formal request in writing and are awaiting for a formal reply

Did the woman ask to review the CCTV footage herself, or for Security to review the footage.  Even in the US, without a court order or subpoena, commercial entities are not required to show CCTV footage to anyone outside the company.  Bahamas flag and law, or US flag and law, its that simple. 

security / personnel sympathized with them and are trying to comfort them by saying do not worry, mayne they will turn up...

 

but said that they are not able to search a cabin, but even if they did and found it they are not able to do anything under the law ... regulations .. restrictions ... legal aspect ... 

This is truly where the story doesn't hold water.  Not only Bahamian law, but international maritime law, and even the cruise line ticket contract, gives the cruise line the right to search any cabin at any time, with or without the passenger's consent or knowledge.  Also, theft is a crime in the Bahamas, so Security, operating under the Captain's "Overriding Authority", granted him by international law, can enforce Bahamian law.  Finally, crimes against US citizens, while on a foreign flag cruise ship, while the ship is in US waters or in international waters, must be reported to the FBI, and the US has claimed extra-territorial jurisdiction over these crimes.

what would you do?

 

what could be done?

 

please be so kind to advise ... thank you  ...

Sorry, John, this rings false on so many levels that I can't help but feel it is either a troll or a hoax.  Having worked for NCL, I know what Security can and can't do, and what the have to do in cases reported like this.

 

To the OP, if this is in fact a genuine incident, then the only recourse you have is to retain legal representation as this is the only way to determine if this crime was reported to the FBI (since this happened either while still docked in NYC or within a couple of hours, so still within US waters), and to obtain the evidence and incident file that the ship has.

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I don't know why they would do what they did but the only possible recourse I see is an insurance claim (travel and or homeowners). Whether they recoup any money depends on if the policy covers their own negligence.

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5 hours ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

Two(!) $2000 coats and they're on an NCL cruise? 👀

As mentioned by the previous poster, the entire story sounds bogus. 

People with money don't sail NCL?:classic_laugh: 

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1 hour ago, CruiseGal999 said:

 

No, I have to say ... the previous posters are NOT guilty of firing first and asking questions 2nd.  Nothing in the OPs post makes any sense.  

 

You can try to rationalize it all you want ... do you honestly think people just toss $4000 worth of coats into a stranger's cabin?  Puhlease ... 

 

No, they didn't shoot & ask questions after - they didn't ask questions at all.

 

You don't believe  "when you say that security can NOT view their OWN security footage.  That is #1 where this falls apart."

I too can't believe that security can't view their own CCTV footage, but I can certainly believe that is what they were told

Or, as Cheng's post, did they ask to see the footage themselves?

Same as I wondered whether they wanted to search the neighbouring cabin?

 

Yes, it all sounds very fishy to me too.

But also rather dis-jointed, and perhaps posted in haste. 

But the OP isn't a one-post wonder, so not a troll  & no reason to believe it's a hoax.

So it's ignorant to simply accuse the OP of a bogus story rather than seeking clarification..

 

The OP mebbe needs to get more precise info & clear up any misunderstanding of what her mom has told her, but acting as judge & jury by jumping to conclusions ain't the way to respond.

 

And yes, if it was simply a case of deliberately leaving their coats in a neighbouring cabin then clearly that's truly dumb. Hellfire, I wouldn't do that even if I didn't care about the coats, cos leaving them in the care of a stranger is rude & presumptuous. But did the OP get a confused message from mom?  Is that actually what happened? 

 

JB :classic_smile:  

Edited by John Bull

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I dunno.. 60 posts over decade  doesn't exactly sound like a ringing endorsement of solid respectability.  Account may have been hacked.  

 

but that aside.. the entire tale is fishy.  nothing about it makes any sense whatsoever.  

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53 minutes ago, spookwife said:

I dunno.. 60 posts over decade  doesn't exactly sound like a ringing endorsement of solid respectability.  Account may have been hacked.  

 

but that aside.. the entire tale is fishy.  nothing about it makes any sense whatsoever.  

 

If you look at her profile, she has actually only had 4 posts, so I tend to agree with you.

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2 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

People with money don't sail NCL?:classic_laugh: 

 

Valid question - but NCL is more directed towards the bargain cruiser - who seems to believe the marketing blather like “FREE” drinks, specialty restaurants, etc.

 

But, on point, leaving valuable coats in an adjoining stateroom is still an excessively stupid - and UNLIKELY - act, and the reported response by the line is similarly unlikely.  If OP is not a troll, he certainly seems to be the sort of gullible pigeon who feeds on troll tripe.

 

Briefly:   BS!!!!!!

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13 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

 

Valid question - but NCL is more directed towards the bargain cruiser - who seems to believe the marketing blather like “FREE” drinks, specialty restaurants, etc.

 

But, on point, leaving valuable coats in an adjoining stateroom is still an excessively stupid - and UNLIKELY - act, and the reported response by the line is similarly unlikely.  If OP is not a troll, he certainly seems to be the sort of gullible pigeon who feeds on troll tripe.

 

Briefly:   BS!!!!!!

Of course, my earlier remark about NCL was a bit sarcastic because picking out someone wearing a multi-thousand dollar coat in a crowd on a large mass narket cruise ship would be like "finding Waldo." But, everyone does have to admit that even the "well-to-do" probably wouldn't have/take a $2k coat on a cruise ship mostly populated by very very budget-conscious folks.

I'll stick with my initial assessment of "bogus.". And, I'm betting this may be an insurance scam in the making (again, TWO $2k coats).   

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40 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

 

Valid question - but NCL is more directed towards the bargain cruiser - who seems to believe the marketing blather like “FREE” drinks, specialty restaurants, etc.

 

But, on point, leaving valuable coats in an adjoining stateroom is still an excessively stupid - and UNLIKELY - act, and the reported response by the line is similarly unlikely.  If OP is not a troll, he certainly seems to be the sort of gullible pigeon who feeds on troll tripe.

 

Briefly:   BS!!!!!!

Price one of their suites and tell me that all NCL cruisers are budget minded😉 (and if you actually price any of their offerings "budget minded" doesn't seem to apply, either, although at one point I believe it did apply). I agree that the story sounds fishy though.

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12 minutes ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

Of course, my earlier remark about NCL was a bit sarcastic because picking out someone wearing a multi-thousand dollar coat in a crowd on a large mass narket cruise ship would be like "finding Waldo." But, everyone does have to admit that even the "well-to-do" probably wouldn't have/take a $2k coat on a cruise ship mostly populated by very very budget-conscious folks.

 

Wow, I am used to your condescending comments about mass market cruise lines, but can you get any more insulting by implying that 'very budget-conscious' folks are more likely to steal from their fellow passengers? Or maybe you are saying the 'well-to-do' wouldn't want to make the rest of the passengers feel bad?  Either case is a new low.

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18 minutes ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

Of course, my earlier remark about NCL was a bit sarcastic because picking out someone wearing a multi-thousand dollar coat in a crowd on a large mass narket cruise ship would be like "finding Waldo." But, everyone does have to admit that even the "well-to-do" probably wouldn't have/take a $2k coat on a cruise ship mostly populated by very very budget-conscious folks.

I'll stick with my initial assessment of "bogus.". And, I'm betting this may be an insurance scam in the making (again, TWO $2k coats).   

 

There are certainly things in the story that are suspect but NCL isn't the budget minded cruise line that it used to be, not since Del Rio took over.

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We have done over 60 cruises only time something was stolen/missing was ncl, ring I had was missing from room reported this to front desk officer looked said they thourly searched cabin and that’s all they could do. We then went though cabin again found a high school ring and other jewelry left by a previous passenger , turned it over to front desk, we no longer cruise ncl. 

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35 minutes ago, capriccio said:

Wow, I am used to your condescending comments about mass market cruise lines, but can you get any more insulting by implying that 'very budget-conscious' folks are more likely to steal from their fellow passengers? Or maybe you are saying the 'well-to-do' wouldn't want to make the rest of the passengers feel bad?  Either case is a new low.

No intended implication whatsoever that "budget conscious" folks steal. He'll, I'm as budget conscious as anyone I know. Born in Brooklyn, the first words out of my mouth were "never pay retail." 

 

TWO stolen $2k coats on embarkation day would be an anomaly on any cruise line. In fact, they'd be an anomaly in the closets of most Americans including those who sail on more "expensive" (though IMO far more value laden) cruise lines.

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This sounds like a real comedy of errors.  A number of things run through my mind.  First time cruisers?  Didn't understand that the card given at boarding was their cabin key, or didn't understand how to use it?  Therefore thought cabin was 'locked'?  Were not at the correct cabin in the first place, maybe even different deck, so no wonder the 'people in the next cabin' had no knowledge of the items?  Nor the cabin steward?   Swiss cheese here.  EM

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3 hours ago, champagne123 said:

 

If you look at her profile, she has actually only had 4 posts, so I tend to agree with you.

 

 

Errrr, nope.

60 posts, as on the avatar.

But in this awful CC re-vamp I can understand your thinking it's only four.

 

Click on the OP's screen name.

On that page, click on "see their activity".

On that page, click on "posts".

If that doesn't work (on my PC I just get the dreaded endless spiral ), click on "topics" instead. 

That brings up all the topics in which the the OP posted, going back to Dec 2007.

(Navigating that was so much easier on the old CC format :classic_rolleyes:)

 

OK, not Cruise Critic's most prolific poster. But enough posts, and over a more than long-enough period, for it to be obvious that they're neither a troll nor a hoaxer.

 

I'd been hoping that the OP would come back with a little more detail & a little more clarity.

But I guess the first few responses have put them off.

Possibly for life.:classic_sad:

 

JB :classic_smile:

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20 minutes ago, John Bull said:

 

 

Errrr, nope.

60 posts, as on the avatar.

But in this awful CC re-vamp I can understand your thinking it's only four.

 

Click on the OP's screen name.

On that page, click on "see their activity".

On that page, click on "posts".

If that doesn't work (on my PC I just get the dreaded endless spiral ), click on "topics" instead. 

That brings up all the topics in which the the OP posted, going back to Dec 2007.

(Navigating that was so much easier on the old CC format :classic_rolleyes:)

 

OK, not Cruise Critic's most prolific poster. But enough posts, and over a more than long-enough period, for it to be obvious that they're neither a troll nor a hoaxer.

 

I'd been hoping that the OP would come back with a little more detail & a little more clarity.

But I guess the first few responses have put them off.

Possibly for life.:classic_sad:

 

JB :classic_smile:

 

Ok...I originally clicked the "see their activity" and only the same four posts showed when clicking on the Avatar...but then followed your continued instructions.  You were correct and I apologize.  I find it strange though, that when I click on my profile, I don't have to do all of that.  They automatically come up and I just tried yours....they also automatically popped up.  Very strange.

Edited by champagne123

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I would think the ops family must have put their coats in the cabin next door thinking it was thiers? I really cant see any other way that the post would make any sense at all. If that is the case and they approached their neighbors. Maybe the coats will magically reappear at some point. After all IF their neighbors have the coats it is not like they can go walking around the ship with them on.

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20 minutes ago, champagne123 said:

 

Ok...I originally clicked the "see their activity" and only the same four posts showed when clicking on the Avatar...but then followed your continued instructions.  You were correct and I apologize.  I find it strange though, that when I click on my profile, I don't have to do all of that.  They automatically come up and I just tried yours....they also automatically popped up.  Very strange.

 

 

 Hi champagne,

 

I just did the same for yours.

Yep, direct to the full McCoy, same as mine.

But not the OP's.

Strange indeed, one of the wonders of technology .:classic_huh:

 

JB :classic_smile:

 

 

Edited by John Bull

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2 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Price one of their suites and tell me that all NCL cruisers are budget minded😉 (and if you actually price any of their offerings "budget minded" doesn't seem to apply, either, although at one point I believe it did apply). I agree that the story sounds fishy though.

 

NCL accommodations may not be “cheap” in absolute terms - but certainly among cruise lines they are lower end.  Their marketing clearly is aimed at the “budget minded” — emphasizing “FREE” drinks, specialty restaurants packages, or tips — when the customer is clearly paying for such things when buying the package.

 

That sort of cheesy marketing is precisely aimed at the “budget minded” end of the market.

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IF this post is for real and I doubt it and if they really brought 2 fur coats which I also doubt, what they did was so off the wall stupid that they deserve to lose them.  Do I see an fake insurance claim being set up here?

 

DON

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9 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

 

NCL accommodations may not be “cheap” in absolute terms - but certainly among cruise lines they are lower end.  Their marketing clearly is aimed at the “budget minded” — emphasizing “FREE” drinks, specialty restaurants packages, or tips — when the customer is clearly paying for such things when buying the package.

 

That sort of cheesy marketing is precisely aimed at the “budget minded” end of the market.

Shine a bright enough light in someone's eyes and you'll blind them, that's my opinion of NCL's marketing. They haven't been the most affordable option in many years (for us, anyway).

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1 hour ago, John Bull said:

 

 

 Hi champagne,

 

I just did the same for yours.

Yep, direct to the full McCoy, same as mine.

But not the OP's.

Strange indeed, one of the wonders of technology .:classic_huh:

 

JB :classic_smile:

 

 

And, interestingly, OP was on the site 26 minutes ago, but has not returned to post further on this thread.

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14 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

And, interestingly, OP was on the site 26 minutes ago, but has not returned to post further on this thread.

Mmmmm.......interesting.....to say the least.

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>But also rather dis-jointed, and perhaps posted in haste.

yes it is true

i am traveling on business ... now i have only my ipad ... posting this and replies from it ...

mom is on the ship

and posted a doze facebook messenger 1 minute recording on this asking for advice ...

it is best nfo i could put together ...

==================

at dear @CruiseGal999

>"I do not believe you when you say that security can NOT view their OWN security footage.  That is #1 where this falls apart. "

i never wrote that

it was a misunderstanding / loss in what i meant / What you interpreted .... likely my mistake as i should have explained something like this in as much detail as i could

what i meant was that my mom requested to see CCTV with them!
but the declined this request

the security watched this on their own

my mother then made a formal request in writing
and requested a formal reply in writing as to why not

I am not sure i guess back home in much of US a victim can not just request to see CCTV

a police officer / detective must ...?

anyone knows the details

do citizens have this right? i guess it must go though legal process..

well here is the thing CCTV would make it clear
and clean

#1 if my mom walked into a room with a coat
#2 walked out with nothing
#3 new guests come
#4 my mom shows up - and the guests claim they do not know anything

it would implicate them
it would cause drama
NCL or anyone wouldn't want drama
they just want everything to be dandy on the sail ...

or possibility B
it shows a stewart walking out with the coats
what then
also drama

so NCL quietly keeps this CCTV to them selves

and no NYPD will likely not be allowed to see it
will they?

do citizens lose their rights on a cruise?

==================
addressing 2nd and 3rd point:

>Secondly, WHY would someone/anyone put their personal belongings in a cabin that was NOT their own cabin!  That doesn't compute ... on any level."

again i should have went into delicate details on this
my mom and her friend waited on a pier
were both hungry ...
wanted to eat ASAP
they found their cabin to be locked

so they found ANY cabin that was not
and made a BIG mistake - i guess  thinking they were at a merry house party where everyone is your good neighbor

==================
==================
@Flatbush Flyer

>Two(!) $2000 coats and they're on an NCL cruise? 👀

As mentioned by the previous poster, the entire story sounds bogus. 

i didn't get the exact exact prices of each coat and prices
yes i guess i should have somehow looked up the exact price for coat A
and B
all i know that it was ball park range

so all people who are NCL can not afford a coat?

==================
================== 

 

@sloopsailor

i wasn't there

but i worked for many banks and we made errors in millions and millions of dollars
all the time

just like say a self driven car can make a mistake ...

humans make errors
humans who program machines make errors
machines make errors
exceptions can happen all the time...

i wish i knew why their door was locked or what the exact reason was ..

i wasn't there ...

==================
==================


@John Bull

thank you 
thank you dear John Bull

yes i wasn't there

but then none of us were ..

i am missing exact details ..

but i was just curious of general advice

what can be done
what should be done

legally
morally
ethically

>And on the matter of "we're not permitted to view our CCTV", 

again i didn't write that

i wrote that

>mom asked to review the CCTV (with them) but security said it is not that simple as it is in US

meaning they have their own rules
a passenger is not allowed to see CCTV

or you might be right
that section was off / full / cam broken / on hold / in port / HD maintenance ... etc ... a dozen or two other reasons
when you are running hundreds or thousand+ cameras ... i wouldn't be surprised

==================
==================

 

@CruiseGal999

my mother sailed many times and never had a problem
and was under the impression i guess that it is one good house party

on top of that a secure house party
with CCTV - apparently worthless

with security - who are also apparently worthless - who in a long talk confessed that even if they did find the perpetrator law would forbid them from taking direct action ... lawsuit might arise ...

==================
she would not leave say her phone or rings or other valuables

but a huge huge coat

==================

i feel so bullied
and bad needing to defend on here

i didn't expect to be accused

i shouldn't have posed

i guess if it is not about merry good times... then it is not welcome on here

OMG psychologically that is probably what it is

it is like i would tell a patient that eating that cake full of sugar is bad for them while they were eating it ... and its their favorite cake ... which cruising is for many of us ... a blessed safe .. sacred experience ..... it should be

i wanted to ask advice

now i even though it might of have been good to share to give other heads up on any cruise .. anywhere ...

but i wish i never did
i will likely ask legally for CC to remove this

==================
==================
@chengkp75

>This is truly where the story doesn't hold water.  Not only Bahamian law, but international maritime law, and even the cruise line ticket contract, gives the cruise line the right to search any cabin at any time, with or without the passenger's consent or knowledge.  

yes exactly
a captains decision is final
so if it is not of greater convenience of the ship (and i understand it and respect that), the crew, the passengers

a loss for one is acceptable over a loss for many

so say they show my mom that other guests took the coat on CCTV
my mom would request that they follow international law or us law

and perhaps just perhaps it would require by law to put that guest behind bars for theft of (again approximately) $2000 + $2000 items

how does that make NCL look

maybe just maybe that even opens them up to a lawsuit - because as you know there are dime a dozen (no wait for free) trigger happy lawyers ready to find a cause and take the case... to settle outside the courtroom...

(they even said: sure if it was a missing child for instance it would be another case)

again i wasn't there
i wish i heard and could post an audio recording of what exactly they told my mom

if she even had it

and it would be illegal probably for her to record
or for me to post

so by trying to explain this ..m i am begining to see and understand how complex this is ...

it is better not to take any action
because any action
could make the situation worse
much worse

==================

but thank you for the info on
>Finally, crimes against US citizens, while on a foreign flag cruise ship, while the ship is in US waters or in international waters, must be reported to the FBI, and the US has claimed extra-territorial jurisdiction over these crimes.

==================

@ Flatbush Flyer
>But, everyone does have to admit that even the "well-to-do" probably wouldn't have/take a $2k coat on a cruise ship mostly populated by very very budget-conscious folks.

friend was visiting NYC from Europe - it is cold - yes with a good coat
and cruise is just part of it

so sorry that they picked a cheap cruise on which they can not go on with best coats they had

==================
@capriccio

>Wow, I am used to your condescending comments about mass market cruise lines, but can you get any more insulting by implying that 'very budget-conscious' folks are more likely to steal from their fellow passengers? Or maybe you are saying the 'well-to-do' wouldn't want to make the rest of the passengers feel bad?  Either case is a new low.

thank you 
thank you 

==================

@George C

thank you 

==================

>But I guess the first few responses have put them off.

Possibly for life.:classic_sad:

yes yes

thank you 

==================
@clskinsfan
>Maybe the coats will magically reappear at some point. After all IF their neighbors have the coats it is not like they can go walking around the ship with them on.

but apparently nothing prevents those folks from walking out with them in their cases

no on can or will search them

==================

Edited by InGearX

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49 minutes ago, sparks1093 said:

Shine a bright enough light in someone's eyes and you'll blind them, that's my opinion of NCL's marketing. They haven't been the most affordable option in many years (for us, anyway).

 

I did not say that NCL were the “most affordable” - only that NCL markets towards the “budget minded” — which they clearly do.  

 

Very often the “budget minded” - especially those who wind up paying more than the minimum - are not the brightest bulbs in the chandelier.  Which might explain the thinking (more precisely the lack thereof) involved in leaving expensive coats in someone else’s stateroom (that is, of course, if there is any truth whatsoever in OP’s tale). 

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34 minutes ago, champagne123 said:

Mmmmm.......interesting.....to say the least.

i was shocked reading replies like this

and trying to stay collected 

replying

 

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1 hour ago, donaldsc said:

IF this post is for real and I doubt it and if they really brought 2 fur coats which I also doubt, what they did was so off the wall stupid that they deserve to lose them.  Do I see an fake insurance claim being set up here?

 

DON

 

so sad to hear this 

 

from what i thought w.....

 

they know - and so does anyone that thinks that there is CCTV on there

 

why would anyone do it on CCTV on a ship 

on a secure ship

 

on the first day!

 

what you suggesting - i can not imagine but best is to just say they were mugged on a street of NYC without a CCTV!

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41 minutes ago, champagne123 said:

Mmmmm.......interesting.....to say the least.

also keep in mind somone might come back

 

start reading replies 

 

and be pulled away for work

for an hour or two or 6 

and then fall asleep from exhaustion ...

 

but do not think i can sleep well after replies like this

 

shocking and sad

 

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was trying to fix the readability of my post

 

and i got: This comment can no longer be edited. It may have been moved or deleted, or too much time may have passed since it was posted for it to be edited.

 

😕

 

and can no longer be edited 😕

 

so here here it is...

 

PS: I wanted to say my last post on here ...

 

 


>But also rather dis-jointed, and perhaps posted in haste.

yes it is true

i am traveling on business ... now i have only my ipad ... posting this and replies from it ... sorry for formatting ...

mom is on the ship

and sent half a doze facebook messenger 1 minute recordings on this asking for advice ... as you might know WiFi is limited...

it is best info i could put together ...

 

yes a person can afford to get one good item/coat ...

 

i shouldn't have ever mentioned the exact price ... as that put people on a hostile ...

================== 

 

my most important replies

 

 

 

#1 i feel so bullied

and bad needing to defend on here

 

i didn't expect to be accused

 

i shouldn't have posed

 

i guess if it is not about merry good times... then it is not welcome on here

 

OMG psychologically that is probably what it is

 

it is like i would tell a patient that eating that cake full of sugar is bad for them while they were eating it ... and its their favorite cake ... which cruising is for many of us ... a blessed safe .. sacred experience ..... it should be

 

i wanted to ask advice

 

now i even though it might of have been good to share to give other heads up on any cruise .. anywhere ...

 

but i wish i never did

 

 

================== 

 

#2 

 

>gives the cruise line the right to search any cabin at any time...

 

exactly give a right ... but does not mandate for a search ... nor or mandate for any protocol to be followed

 

and that is right - a captains decision is final

so if it is not of greater convenience of the ship (and i understand it and respect that), the crew, the passengers

 

a loss for one is acceptable over a loss for many

 

so say they show my mom that other guests took the coat on CCTV

my mom would request that they follow international law or US law

 

and perhaps just perhaps it would require by law to put that guest behind bars on the ship for theft of (again approximately) $2000 + $2000 items

 

how does that make NCL look? maybe even some newspaper would love to make a joke out of it ... or say tonight show...

 

maybe just maybe that even opens them up to a lawsuit - because as you know there are dime a dozen (no wait for free) trigger happy lawyers ready to find a cause and take the case... to settle outside the courtroom... i am referring to seek compensation for a thief if are "mistreated"

 

this reminds me of a story where a father stabbed a thief in his own house at night .... and was sentenced ...

 

(they even said: sure if it was a missing child for instance it would be another case ... but this theft is best to just hope things turn up )

 

again i wasn't there

i wish i heard and could post an audio recording of what exactly they told my mom

 

if she even had it

 

and it would be illegal probably for her to record

or for me to post

 

which makes me even wonder about this post ...

 

so by trying to explain this ... i am begining to see and understand how complex this is ...

 

it is better for NCL not to take any action

because any action

could make drama ... and the situation worse

much worse for NCL ... hence what has happened ...

 

 

my replies chronologically 

================== 

================== 

==================

at dear @CruiseGal999

>"I do not believe you when you say that security can NOT view their OWN security footage.  That is #1 where this falls apart. "

i never wrote that

it was a misunderstanding / loss in what i meant / What you interpreted .... likely my mistake as i should have explained something like this in as much detail as i could

what i meant was that my mom requested to see CCTV with them!
but the declined this request

the security watched this on their own

my mother then made a formal request in writing
and requested a formal reply in writing as to why not

I am not sure i guess back home in much of US a victim can not just request to see CCTV

a police officer / detective must ...?

anyone knows the details

do citizens have this right? i guess it must go though legal process..

well here is the thing CCTV would make it clear
and clean

#1 if my mom walked into a room with a coat
#2 walked out with nothing
#3 new guests come
#4 my mom shows up - and the guests claim they do not know anything

it would implicate them
it would cause drama
NCL or anyone wouldn't want drama
they just want everything to be dandy on the sail ...

or possibility B
it shows a stewart walking out with the coats
what then
also drama

so NCL quietly keeps this CCTV to them selves

and no NYPD will likely not be allowed to see it
will they?

do citizens lose their rights on a cruise?

==================

 


addressing 2nd and 3rd point:

>Secondly, WHY would someone/anyone put their personal belongings in a cabin that was NOT their own cabin!  That doesn't compute ... on any level."

again i should have went into delicate details on this
my mom and her friend waited on a pier
were both hungry ...
wanted to eat ASAP
they found their cabin to be locked

so they found ANY cabin that was not
and made a BIG mistake - i guess  thinking they were at a merry house party where everyone is your good neighbor

==================
==================


@Flatbush Flyer

>Two(!) $2000 coats and they're on an NCL cruise? 👀

As mentioned by the previous poster, the entire story sounds bogus. 

i didn't get the exact exact prices of each coat and prices
yes i guess i should have somehow looked up the exact price for coat A
and B
all i know that it was ball park range

so all people who are NCL can not afford a coat?

==================
================== 

 

@sloopsailor

i wasn't there

but i worked for many banks and we made errors in millions and millions of dollars
all the time

just like say a self driven car can make a mistake ...

humans make errors
humans who program machines make errors
machines make errors
exceptions can happen all the time...

i wish i knew why their door was locked or what the exact reason was ..

i wasn't there ...

==================
==================


@John Bull

thank you 
thank you dear John Bull

yes i wasn't there

but then none of us were ..

i am missing exact details ..

but i was just curious of general advice

what can be done
what should be done

legally
morally
ethically

>And on the matter of "we're not permitted to view our CCTV", 

again i didn't write that

i wrote that

>mom asked to review the CCTV (with them) but security said it is not that simple as it is in US

meaning they have their own rules
a passenger is not allowed to see CCTV

or you might be right
that section was off / full / cam broken / on hold / in port / HD maintenance ... etc ... a dozen or two other reasons
when you are running hundreds or thousand+ cameras ... i wouldn't be surprised

==================
==================

 

@CruiseGal999

my mother sailed many times and never had a problem
and was under the impression i guess that it is one good house party

on top of that a secure house party
with CCTV - apparently worthless

with security - who are also apparently worthless - who in a long talk confessed that even if they did find the perpetrator law would forbid them from taking direct action ... lawsuit might arise ...

==================
she would not leave say her phone or rings or other valuables

but a huge huge coat

==================

i feel so bullied
and bad needing to defend on here

i didn't expect to be accused

i shouldn't have posed

i guess if it is not about merry good times... then it is not welcome on here

OMG psychologically that is probably what it is

it is like i would tell a patient that eating that cake full of sugar is bad for them while they were eating it ... and its their favorite cake ... which cruising is for many of us ... a blessed safe .. sacred experience ..... it should be

i wanted to ask advice

now i even though it might of have been good to share to give other heads up on any cruise .. anywhere ...

but i wish i never did
 

==================
==================
@chengkp75

>This is truly where the story doesn't hold water.  Not only Bahamian law, but international maritime law, and even the cruise line ticket contract, gives the cruise line the right to search any cabin at any time, with or without the passenger's consent or knowledge.  

 

================== 

My reply:

yes exactly
a captains decision is final
so if it is not of greater convenience of the ship (and i understand it and respect that), the crew, the passengers

a loss for one is acceptable over a loss for many

so say they show my mom that other guests took the coat on CCTV
my mom would request that they follow international law or us law

and perhaps just perhaps it would require by law to put that guest behind bars for theft of (again approximately) $2000 + $2000 items

how does that make NCL look

maybe just maybe that even opens them up to a lawsuit - because as you know there are dime a dozen (no wait for free) trigger happy lawyers ready to find a cause and take the case... to settle outside the courtroom...

(they even said: sure if it was a missing child for instance it would be another case)

again i wasn't there
i wish i heard and could post an audio recording of what exactly they told my mom

if she even had it

and it would be illegal probably for her to record
or for me to post

so by trying to explain this ..m i am begining to see and understand how complex this is ...

it is better not to take any action
because any action
could make the situation worse
much worse for NCL

==================

but thank you for the info on
>Finally, crimes against US citizens, while on a foreign flag cruise ship, while the ship is in US waters or in international waters, must be reported to the FBI, and the US has claimed extra-territorial jurisdiction over these crimes.

==================

@ Flatbush Flyer
>But, everyone does have to admit that even the "well-to-do" probably wouldn't have/take a $2k coat on a cruise ship mostly populated by very very budget-conscious folks.

friend was visiting NYC from Europe - it is cold - yes with a good coat
and cruise is just part of it

so sorry that they picked a cheap cruise on which they can not go on with best coats they had

==================
@capriccio

>Wow, I am used to your condescending comments about mass market cruise lines, but can you get any more insulting by implying that 'very budget-conscious' folks are more likely to steal from their fellow passengers? Or maybe you are saying the 'well-to-do' wouldn't want to make the rest of the passengers feel bad?  Either case is a new low.

thank you 
thank you 

==================

@George C

thank you 

==================

>But I guess the first few responses have put them off.

Possibly for life.:classic_sad:

yes yes

thank you 

==================
@clskinsfan
>Maybe the coats will magically reappear at some point. After all IF their neighbors have the coats it is not like they can go walking around the ship with them on.

but apparently nothing prevents those folks from walking out with them in their cases

no on can or will search them

==================

Edited by InGearX

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A Captain's decision is not final, any more than a police officer's decision about a crime is final, or a lawyer's decision about a crime is final.  The Captain has to uphold Bahamian law, whether he likes it, or the company likes it, or not, or he can lose his license (earned over many years) and be held financially responsible for any mistakes.

 

Sorry, still don't understand how if your mother had cruised "many times" she believed that it was a "merry house party", any more than you would consider a hotel to be a "merry house party".  This is patently ridiculous.

 

Yes, ship's security can, and will search passenger's luggage, if there is probable cause.

 

And, as I've said, since this cruise is still ongoing, you need to seek legal representation as soon as possible, if you really think this case has merit, and the lawyer will be able to contact the FBI for any filings with them, and to obtain any evidence or documentation that is available.  Since you have not commented on my recommendation to seek legal representation, it appears that you don't want to possibly front money for resolution of this incident, but only to get money from the cruise line, and so from my experience working on cruise ships, this leads me to believe this case has many holes in its claims.

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36 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

 

I did not say that NCL were the “most affordable” - only that NCL markets towards the “budget minded” — which they clearly do.  

 

Very often the “budget minded” - especially those who wind up paying more than the minimum - are not the brightest bulbs in the chandelier.  Which might explain the thinking (more precisely the lack thereof) involved in leaving expensive coats in someone else’s stateroom (that is, of course, if there is any truth whatsoever in OP’s tale). 

I equate "budget minded" with "affordability" and as I said I don't think NCL has met that definition for a number of years (and yes, I would agree that they try to market themselves that way). 

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12 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

A Captain's decision is not final, any more than a police officer's decision about a crime is final, or a lawyer's decision about a crime is final.  The Captain has to uphold Bahamian law, whether he likes it, or the company likes it, or not, or he can lose his license (earned over many years) and be held financially responsible for any mistakes.

 

Sorry, still don't understand how if your mother had cruised "many times" she believed that it was a "merry house party", any more than you would consider a hotel to be a "merry house party".  This is patently ridiculous.

 

Yes, ship's security can, and will search passenger's luggage, if there is probable cause.

 

And, as I've said, since this cruise is still ongoing, you need to seek legal representation as soon as possible, if you really think this case has merit, and the lawyer will be able to contact the FBI for any filings with them, and to obtain any evidence or documentation that is available.  Since you have not commented on my recommendation to seek legal representation, it appears that you don't want to possibly front money for resolution of this incident, but only to get money from the cruise line, and so from my experience working on cruise ships, this leads me to believe this case has many holes in its claims.

 

a captains decision is final at that point in the water

 

what ever happens later ... happens later

 

if he says they are searching a cabin they are ... if he says they are not ... they are not...

 

they did approach the captain at the meet and greet about this and he said do not worry we will handle this ... thks was on day 4 or so

 

so head of security again apologized and said they will do their best

 

at this point a formal request to see CCTV is made

awaiting for a formal decline

 

all possible info is collected...

have no idea to whom the claim can be made ... if ever ...

 

you are right about the FBI ... will call them up ... seek their help .. i imagine they have other things ... much like NYPD if you call about theft ... eventually someone will question and cause more stress and make some report ...

 

thank you everyone ...

 

 

 

Edited by InGearX

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