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Chairs removed to make more room?


johnatsis
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If Florida doesnt need a chair, thats good. Sometimes on long cruises, not in the Carribean, there are long sea days when some might like to be in their cabins. Especially true on world cruises.

 

Some might not want to be at the bar or by the pool ordering drinks when the seas are rough. 

 

But I understand your point of view. Problem is on longer cruises the demographics do not show the preponderance of younger cruisers. 

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36 minutes ago, Beave8920 said:

 

Floridalover, I would like to respectfully disagree.  I'm old school and as a business man, you learn in business 101 that the bread and butter of your successful business is your repeat and loyal returning customer.  You go out of your way to make that customer happy.  Because if they are happy, they tell their friends and that produces new customers, etc.  Marketing can't buy that kind of publicity.  How many friends have you encouraged to take a Princess Cruise?  I know I have many.

 

On the flip side of that comment is the unhappy customer who tells 5x as many people that's he's/she's unhappy.  Remember the old commercial, you tell 2 friends, and they tell 2 friends and so on and so on!  And with bad advertising / reviews, regardless if true or not, that information remains longer in the memory and is harder to repatriate that customer.

 

Now I have no idea if the powers to be at Princess are business educated, but I can't imagine that they would purposely attempt to alienate it's loyal base. I'm sure this was a miscalculation on their behalf.

 

I'm sure whatever it is it's a bottom line issue, and loyal and unhappy customers contribute to that bottom line many times over.  They can't afford to lose even some of that base. 

 

And remember, Ms. Swartz answers to stockholders and a Board of Directors!

 

 

 

 

 

These same thoughts have swirled through my mind. 

Young families are typical on summer cruises. Shorter cruises. To warm climes during spring and summer breaks. I don’t think you find many families on transatlantic and 21 day cruises. Older cruisers have the time and money for longer cruises and more frequent trips. Younger families are not repeat customers- certainly not the folks taking 3 and 4 and 5 cruises a year. Princess really should be marketing to their repeat client base. Retired folks are still the bread and butter of the cruise industry. 

 

I also agree that an unhappy cruiser will tell more people than a happy cruiser. Many won’t know the chair is missing until they go to sit down. Maybe travel agents will start mentioning it’s demise if they get negative feedback. Only Princess will know if it starts affecting their bottom line.  So silly. The chair was already there. I can’t think of one reason to have removed it. 

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6 hours ago, DRS/NC said:

 

As I said, PLEASE let PCL know why you will NOT be booking 100 people (your group) on a Princess as you'd originally planned.

That is NOT what you said. You said when they cancel, not why they won't be booking again.

READ.

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Beave8920...thanks for sharing your business knowledge which reaffirmed my feelings based solely on a lifetime as a consumer about the types of companies I will patronize.

 

For me it’s not only about some of their recent changes but their standard reasoning that it’s what passengers desire which I question the honesty of such marketing claims.  And when some changes are made that passengers don’t like such as BOGO$ being eliminated, they say it’ll be replaced by something better but they never do it.

 

Truthfullness is an important factor when deciding where to spend my money & that is getting harder for me to find with Princess.  There’s too much deception & even some outright lies which is a big factor to me.  They’re losing my trust...fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me.

 

You mentioned that successful businesses depend upon loyal repeat customers which describes my relationship with Princess but my trust in them is eroding away as a result of actions in recent years.  It’s merely my opinion but removing the chairs was strictly a financial decision because their condition may require replacement or they’re requiring more maintenance to continue to be usable.

 

With about 80%-85% of their cabins having only a desk chair it’s apparent to me that the savings by removing the chair is more important than passenger comfort...particularly for those with health issues or older passengers.

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3 minutes ago, Astro Flyer said:

 

 

  It’s merely my opinion but removing the chairs was strictly a financial decision because their condition may require replacement or they’re requiring more maintenance to continue to be usable.

 

 

My first thought was they eliminate a lot of weight and get better fuel mileage but it may be 2 pronged with your idea and mine. Win -Win for them 

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1 hour ago, Beave8920 said:

 

Floridalover, I would like to respectfully disagree.  I'm old school and as a business man, you learn in business 101 that the bread and butter of your successful business is your repeat and loyal returning customer.  You go out of your way to make that customer happy.  Because if they are happy, they tell their friends and that produces new customers, etc.  Marketing can't buy that kind of publicity.  How many friends have you encouraged to take a Princess Cruise?  I know I have many.

 

On the flip side of that comment is the unhappy customer who tells 5x as many people that's he's/she's unhappy.  Remember the old commercial, you tell 2 friends, and they tell 2 friends and so on and so on!  And with bad advertising / reviews, regardless if true or not, that information remains longer in the memory and is harder to repatriate that customer.

 

Now I have no idea if the powers to be at Princess are business educated, but I can't imagine that they would purposely attempt to alienate it's loyal base. I'm sure this was a miscalculation on their behalf.

 

I'm sure whatever it is it's a bottom line issue, and loyal and unhappy customers contribute to that bottom line many times over.  They can't afford to lose even some of that base. 

 

And remember, Ms. Swartz answers to stockholders and a Board of Directors!

 

 

 

 

 

I agree that keeping the older clientele is important but Princess hasn't done a thing to attract the younger generation similar to the other cruise lines. 

Not that  I'm looking for swimming pool slides or bumper cars but if they continue to stay on the same course it will hurt them big time someday. It's not an easy thing to immediately attract new future sailors & turn them into loyal customers. 

The younger generation tends to look for all the flashy attractions which Princess doesn't seem to have any of, especially if they have kids with them. 

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29 minutes ago, Astro Flyer said:

Beave8920...thanks for sharing your business knowledge which reaffirmed my feelings based solely on a lifetime as a consumer about the types of companies I will patronize.

 

For me it’s not only about some of their recent changes but their standard reasoning that it’s what passengers desire which I question the honesty of such marketing claims.  And when some changes are made that passengers don’t like such as BOGO$ being eliminated, they say it’ll be replaced by something better but they never do it.

 

Truthfullness is an important factor when deciding where to spend my money & that is getting harder for me to find with Princess.  There’s too much deception & even some outright lies which is a big factor to me.  They’re losing my trust...fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me.

 

You mentioned that successful businesses depend upon loyal repeat customers which describes my relationship with Princess but my trust in them is eroding away as a result of actions in recent years.  It’s merely my opinion but removing the chairs was strictly a financial decision because their condition may require replacement or they’re requiring more maintenance to continue to be usable.

 

With about 80%-85% of their cabins having only a desk chair it’s apparent to me that the savings by removing the chair is more important than passenger comfort...particularly for those with health issues or older passengers.

 

Astro Flyer....your comments are spot on and as a consumer of Princess I feel exactly the same way.  It's all about them making money and of course, they don't want to lose money either.  

 

My point was that if people don't vocalize and provide feedback to Princess they just go on "business as usual".  I'm sure it was a cost cutting idea, but they probably didn't expect the push back from customers.  If they get the idea that maybe people aren't happy, they may reconsider.  But like you, I won't patronize them it if they don't.  Lots of other choices.

Edited by Beave8920
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1 hour ago, cruisingram1 said:

Retired folks are still the bread and butter of the cruise industry. 

Yes they are but did you ever take not of the avg age of Princess cruisers? They won't be cruising much longer so someone has to back fill their spots.

Princess has thee oldest cruisers of all the cruise lines.

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4 hours ago, floridalover5623 said:

It's obvious that they're catering to the newer cruising generation who doesn't spend any time in the cabins. They're out spending money, not sitting there reading or watching TV. 😉:classic_biggrin:

The checkout generation is beginning to dwindle and Princess has to look to the future in order to stay afloat.   

 

The “checkout generation”??? Really?? 🤨

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12 minutes ago, floridalover5623 said:

Yes they are but did you ever take not of the avg age of Princess cruisers? They won't be cruising much longer so someone has to back fill their spots.

 

Sounds like they're gonna have a bunch of new spots to back fill sooner than they expected :classic_rolleyes:

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8 minutes ago, floridalover5623 said:

Yes they are but did you ever take not of the avg age of Princess cruisers? They won't be cruising much longer so someone has to back fill their spots.

Princess has thee oldest cruisers of all the cruise lines.

Yes. The older cruisers of today won’t cruise forever. But new “old” people will take their place. Retired cruisers will always be the highest demographic. Just not the same ones. They take longer and more cruises. They also sit around more than their younger counterparts. On a chair. Bed sitting is hard on “old” backs. 

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42 minutes ago, floridalover5623 said:

I agree that keeping the older clientele is important but Princess hasn't done a thing to attract the younger generation similar to the other cruise lines. 

Not that  I'm looking for swimming pool slides or bumper cars but if they continue to stay on the same course it will hurt them big time someday. It's not an easy thing to immediately attract new future sailors & turn them into loyal customers. 

The younger generation tends to look for all the flashy attractions which Princess doesn't seem to have any of, especially if they have kids with them. 

Princess is attempting to attract younger generations with such things as MedallionClass and the Caribbean’s recently announced changes to attract more families.  The Reef Family Splash Zone is an attempt to attract more families without turning the entire upper deck into an amusement park.

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/2019/02/07/princess-cruises-caribbean-princess-debut-summer-water-attraction/2800264002/

 

I began cruising in my mid-30s and discovered the casual elegance of a Princess cruise as my preferred cruise experience which my kids also enjoyed.  So not every younger person is attracted to a high energy cruise experience & that is probably still valid today.  For those seeking a high energy cruise experience, there’s another CCL cruise line...Carnival...or other lines such as RCCL & NCL.  I think that cruise lines have certain demographics as their core passengers to fill most of their cabins & I think that’s a good thing to have choices to meet passengers desires.

Edited by Astro Flyer
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41 minutes ago, floridalover5623 said:

Yes they are but did you ever take not of the avg age of Princess cruisers? They won't be cruising much longer so someone has to back fill their spots.

Princess has thee oldest cruisers of all the cruise lines.

Without their repeat (older) cruisers, Princess and every other mainsteam line without rock climbling walls and water slides, would go out of business.

As another poster said, as we older cruisers die, there will be others that just age in to take our place.

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I also believe that this was done for profit, not for the passengers’ benefit.  It seems a shame that something so petty and mean spirited would be done.  But Princess campaign against cabin and balcony furniture has been going on for years.    If this is the best plan management has to increase profits, Princess is no longer the innovator they once were.

 

Of course Princess is not the only corporation trying to manipulate behavior, and thus spending, through furniture...or lack of furniture.  Someone already noted how Disney has removed so many benches.  Fast food restaurants are notorious for hard furniture and fast, loud music to make people east faster and leave.  

 

Some people will leave their cabins, thinking it was their own idea, and go forth and spend money in the public areas of the ship.  Others will just leave.  And maybe this suits Princess just fine.  

 

But it might have been wiser to wait until the medalions were fully deployed, so Princess would have data showing that those who spend more time in their cabins really do spend less onboard, and thus are undesirable and should be targeted for this unfavorable treatment.  Or maybe they already have enough data from the early medalion rollout to make this call.  Does anyone really believe the medallions are primarily  for the passengers’ benefit and convenience, rather than for data mining.

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Currently on day 36 of a 49 day trip around south america. I am comfortably lying on my bed with 3 pillows propped up, way more comfortable than an old barrel chair. I do miss having it as a clothes holder! Way more room in the cabin, IT'S a CHAIR! Too many people with way too much time on their hands. Really, 36 pages of comments on an old chair? Surely people can find something more important to criticize. Btw, the new interactive tv full of programs on demand works great even without the chair and I'm an old guy with a bad back, prob from all the time (over 250 days on princess) I used to spend sitting in those old uncomfortable chairs.

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1 minute ago, Loreni said:

I think I remember someone posting that their travel agent tried to request a chair for them for medical reasons and it was denied.  I do understand people canceling on principle.  It does not feel good to do business with someone who you either believe is heartless or you believe is being dishonest with you.  Those who have built up loyalty, may have gotten the feeling that their relationship with Princess is more than transactional.  I met an accountant on a Princess world cruise who had started with nothing and retired in his 50s.  He told me he has no loyalty to any line.  He looks at the cost/benefit ratio and nothing else.  I would not live my life by this rule, but maybe it’s a good idea for cruising.

Kinda hard to request a chair that they don't have.

 

As stated numerous times in this thread talk is cheap there are so many choices.

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2 minutes ago, echoshipmate said:

Currently on day 36 of a 49 day trip around south america. I am comfortably lying on my bed with 3 pillows propped up, way more comfortable than an old barrel chair. I do miss having it as a clothes holder! Way more room in the cabin, IT'S a CHAIR! Too many people with way too much time on their hands. Really, 36 pages of comments on an old chair? Surely people can find something more important to criticize. Btw, the new interactive tv full of programs on demand works great even without the chair and I'm an old guy with a bad back, prob from all the time (over 250 days on princess) I used to spend sitting in those old uncomfortable chairs.

Are you on the Royal?

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56 minutes ago, echoshipmate said:

Currently on day 36 of a 49 day trip around south america. I am comfortably lying on my bed with 3 pillows propped up, way more comfortable than an old barrel chair. I do miss having it as a clothes holder! Way more room in the cabin, IT'S a CHAIR! Too many people with way too much time on their hands. Really, 36 pages of comments on an old chair? Surely people can find something more important to criticize. Btw, the new interactive tv full of programs on demand works great even without the chair and I'm an old guy with a bad back, prob from all the time (over 250 days on princess) I used to spend sitting in those old uncomfortable chairs.

It's great for you that you and your bad back are able to be comfortable without the chair. I dare say, though, that most of those that have posted here that they can't sit on the bed for any length of time and need a good chair won't be so lucky.

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My wife and I just returned yesterday from seven days on Caribbean Princess, when we arrived at the ship 3/2 we could see a large pile of the chairs that had taken off the ship.  We were in C622 a little more room in cabin but only a desk chair to sit on.  I am 63 in good shape but miss the chair.  If my wife and I have a drink before going out someone has to sit on the bed the other on a desk chair.  We had a large deck but many times deck furniture dirty or salty.  I think we should be given an option.  This was our 11th Princess cruise I think they want you out of the room and spending money on the ship.  We spend plenty just don’t like being manipulated.

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23 hours ago, cruisingram1 said:

These same thoughts have swirled through my mind. 

Young families are typical on summer cruises. Shorter cruises. To warm climes during spring and summer breaks. I don’t think you find many families on transatlantic and 21 day cruises. Older cruisers have the time and money for longer cruises and more frequent trips. Younger families are not repeat customers- certainly not the folks taking 3 and 4 and 5 cruises a year. Princess really should be marketing to their repeat client base. Retired folks are still the bread and butter of the cruise industry. 

 

I also agree that an unhappy cruiser will tell more people than a happy cruiser. Many won’t know the chair is missing until they go to sit down. Maybe travel agents will start mentioning it’s demise if they get negative feedback. Only Princess will know if it starts affecting their bottom line.  So silly. The chair was already there. I can’t think of one reason to have removed it. 

You nailed it!  This is far off you wouldn’t think they would even discuss removing the chair much less actually doing it!

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16 minutes ago, RJAM3 said:

You nailed it!  This is far off you wouldn’t think they would even discuss removing the chair much less actually doing it!

More than a month after this thread started, I find it very telling, and not in a good way, that Princess has not had one word to say on this subject.  Especially after all the calls and emails they have received about it.  

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2 hours ago, echoshipmate said:

Currently on day 36 of a 49 day trip around south america. I am comfortably lying on my bed with 3 pillows propped up, way more comfortable than an old barrel chair. I do miss having it as a clothes holder! Way more room in the cabin, IT'S a CHAIR! Too many people with way too much time on their hands. Really, 36 pages of comments on an old chair? Surely people can find something more important to criticize. Btw, the new interactive tv full of programs on demand works great even without the chair and I'm an old guy with a bad back, prob from all the time (over 250 days on princess) I used to spend sitting in those old uncomfortable chairs.

Happy t hear that sitting on a bed works for you.  It would not work for my bad back.

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2 hours ago, echoshipmate said:

Currently on day 36 of a 49 day trip around south america. I am comfortably lying on my bed with 3 pillows propped up, way more comfortable than an old barrel chair. I do miss having it as a clothes holder! Way more room in the cabin, IT'S a CHAIR! Too many people with way too much time on their hands. Really, 36 pages of comments on an old chair? Surely people can find something more important to criticize. Btw, the new interactive tv full of programs on demand works great even without the chair and I'm an old guy with a bad back, prob from all the time (over 250 days on princess) I used to spend sitting in those old uncomfortable chairs.

I do not want to sit propped up in a bed. I am not in hospital. I want a decent chair. 

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