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CretaMed88

Viking Jupiter [VIDEO]

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Thanks for posting the film. Very interesting to see tugs secured Fwd & Aft.

 

About 4m30s noted one of the aft tug lines go bar tight & part, recoiling back to the ship. Not a fun experience for the aft mooring crew. Fortunately it looks like it bounced off the shell plate.

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Heidi

We had tugs handle us in Cadiz last year as we were undocking.  One at the bow and one at the stern with very long lines.  They ended up turning us in the channel so we left bow first.  The channel was certainly not the narrowest I've ever experienced.  Do Viking ships not have bow and stern thrusters that enable them to make turns such as this on their own?  It wasn't overly windy though I guess the tide could have been impacting us.

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27 minutes ago, Clay Clayton said:

Heidi

We had tugs handle us in Cadiz last year as we were undocking.  One at the bow and one at the stern with very long lines.    Do Viking ships not have bow and stern thrusters that enable them to make turns such as this on their own?  It wasn't overly windy though I guess the tide could have been impacting us.

 

No tugs at Aalborg and the thrusters do the job.

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35 minutes ago, Clay Clayton said:

Heidi

We had tugs handle us in Cadiz last year as we were undocking.  One at the bow and one at the stern with very long lines.  They ended up turning us in the channel so we left bow first.  The channel was certainly not the narrowest I've ever experienced.  Do Viking ships not have bow and stern thrusters that enable them to make turns such as this on their own?  It wasn't overly windy though I guess the tide could have been impacting us.

Not 100% certain, but believe they have 2 B/T and 2 fixed pitch prop/rudder systems from Rolls Royce at the stern. Believe they may have a stern thruster. 

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8 hours ago, CretaMed88 said:

VIKING OCEAN ' VIKING JUPITER arriving for maiden time at Piraeus during her maiden trip


 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuyrvQDEQY0

 

Thank you for posting this video!  We are going on two cruises in 2019 on the Jupiter so we are keenly interested in how it goes!  (Mediterranean and South America)   And of course, any minor differences that may exist from its predecessors. :)

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We had tugs both fore and aft when in the lagoon at Venice for our arrival and departure aboard the Viking Star in 2015.  Similarly, in 2016 in approaching London on the Thames, the Viking Sea was "teathered" to tugs.  It seemed especially appropriate when passing through the Thames Barrier and then making a 180 turn near the Tower Bridge before mooring at the floating barge.  It was my guess that it was the port's call to determine if tugs were mandatory for arrival and departure of ships. Otherwise it would be up to the captain (and perhaps the cruise lines policies) as to whether or not to call for assistance from one or more tugs. Comments and insight from our mariners are welcome.

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25 minutes ago, Senior Gators said:

We had tugs both fore and aft when in the lagoon at Venice for our arrival and departure aboard the Viking Star in 2015.  Similarly, in 2016 in approaching London on the Thames, the Viking Sea was "teathered" to tugs.  It seemed especially appropriate when passing through the Thames Barrier and then making a 180 turn near the Tower Bridge before mooring at the floating barge.  It was my guess that it was the port's call to determine if tugs were mandatory for arrival and departure of ships. Otherwise it would be up to the captain (and perhaps the cruise lines policies) as to whether or not to call for assistance from one or more tugs. Comments and insight from our mariners are welcome.

Totally correct.

 

Some ports will require tugs for all ships, especially when tight manoeuvring, other ports require tugs for specific type of ships (tankers) and also when wind is above a specific speed and/or direction. The other determining factor is how well ships can manoeuvre, with passengers ships normally meeting these requirements, as they frequently dock daily.

 

If memory is correct, Greenwich is mandatory tugs, while Tilbury is optional, subject to tide and wind. I believe Venice is mandatory, as we also had tugs F&A during our last transit in 2015.

 

When not required by the port, it becomes the Captain's decision, based on any mechanical deficiencies, tide/current, wind, etc.

 

When working, I only required tugs going to a shipyard/drydock, or when mechanically challenged. Our local tugs would not secure to us with any line until I shut down the main engines and bow thrusters. They would push, if directed, but never secure. We had so much power we could part lines in a heartbeat, similar to the short film in the OP. Worst case, if the tug was out of position, we could even pull it over. In many cases my bow thrusters had as much, or more power than each of the tugs.

 

 

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Great to see her!  We board next month.  I noticed a dome above the Explorer’s Lounge so I assume they added the planetarium on this one too.  

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46 minutes ago, Heidi13 said:

Totally correct.

 

Some ports will require tugs for all ships, especially when tight manoeuvring, other ports require tugs for specific type of ships (tankers) and also when wind is above a specific speed and/or direction. The other determining factor is how well ships can manoeuvre, with passengers ships normally meeting these requirements, as they frequently dock daily.

 

If memory is correct, Greenwich is mandatory tugs, while Tilbury is optional, subject to tide and wind. I believe Venice is mandatory, as we also had tugs F&A during our last transit in 2015.

 

When not required by the port, it becomes the Captain's decision, based on any mechanical deficiencies, tide/current, wind, etc.

 

When working, I only required tugs going to a shipyard/drydock, or when mechanically challenged. Our local tugs would not secure to us with any line until I shut down the main engines and bow thrusters. They would push, if directed, but never secure. We had so much power we could part lines in a heartbeat, similar to the short film in the OP. Worst case, if the tug was out of position, we could even pull it over. In many cases my bow thrusters had as much, or more power than each of the tugs.

 

 

Thanks Heidi 13.. I appreciate your confirmation. I wondered what that splash in the water between the Jupiter and the tug behind her,  Makes perfect sense once you explained it. Your expert opinion and those of several other long experienced mariners, provides some interesting insights to our Viking boards It is most welcome!!

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Watching it full screen, I couldn't see the tug with line attached, but about 4m20s I started seeing something dragging along the wavelets - subsequently saw it was a tug line. The ship then appeared to swing the stern away from the tug.

 

The line went from no weight to bar tight, vibrated briefly then parts. Parted at the tug, so the recoil was back towards the ship. If the weight is taken gradually, they start signing, but in my experience, in these situations, the line goes tight, emits a huge bang as it parts and then recoils at horrendous speed.

 

All the crew can do is hit the deck and hope it hits the shell plate or goes over the top of you.

 

Once the ship is tied up, a small libation is a pleasant relief. Although it is highly unlikely any crew were hit by the line, my hope is that they are all OK, as it is a frightening experience.

 

BTW - great lesson also for passengers, as the line recoiled up to about the Prom Deck. This is why you will never see me standing at the ship's side in the potential recoil zone of a mooring/tug line. 

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Heidi,  I went back and viewed that sequence full screen a number of times . It appears that the following tug was having trouble maintaining a steady position behind the Jupiter.  It was alternating between allowing too much slack and dragging the tow line in the water and then suddenly backing off and jerking the line so tight that it parted and recoiled towards the stern of the Jupiter.  Assuming that this was a high strength steel towing line, it would take a lot of sudden tension to make it part so violently. From all appearances, the Jupiter was maintaining a steady speed. Wouldn't it have been the responsibility of the tug's skipper to also maintain the appropriate distance and tension on the line?

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14 hours ago, Senior Gators said:

Heidi,  I went back and viewed that sequence full screen a number of times . It appears that the following tug was having trouble maintaining a steady position behind the Jupiter.  It was alternating between allowing too much slack and dragging the tow line in the water and then suddenly backing off and jerking the line so tight that it parted and recoiled towards the stern of the Jupiter.  Assuming that this was a high strength steel towing line, it would take a lot of sudden tension to make it part so violently. From all appearances, the Jupiter was maintaining a steady speed. Wouldn't it have been the responsibility of the tug's skipper to also maintain the appropriate distance and tension on the line?

Affirmative, the tug Master should follow the directions provided by the Captain/Pilot.

 

Not sure what they use in Piraeus, but these days we rarely use steel wire, as the synthetic lines are stronger and also float, which puts less risk on fouling the wheels when lines part, or are let go. When making mooring lines we often incorporated a wire snotter at the end, as a weak link. Therefore, in the event of the line parting, the expensive line was saved and we replaced the short wire snotter.

 

The lines have great strength when the weight is taken up gradually, but do not handle dynamic loads that are applied quickly very well. This is the 2nd similar experience with a tug line I have witnessed. Unfortunately the first time I was on the mooring deck when it recoiled above us, a couple feet off the deck.

 

Recoil we witnesses is normal for most lines. Every line I have seen part, recoils with amazing speed. Before the days of pre-formed wires, if a wire broke, it not only recoiled, it also unravelled. Only saw this once on my first trip to sea.

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On 2/14/2019 at 12:01 PM, Heidi13 said:

Not 100% certain, but believe they have 2 B/T and 2 fixed pitch prop/rudder systems from Rolls Royce at the stern. Believe they may have a stern thruster. 

All correct except, according to Captain Knutsen on WC1, no stern thruster.  We had tug escorts at some ports but I never saw a line passed over.  But then I slept through a few docking/undockings.  😎

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1 hour ago, Heidi13 said:

Affirmative, the tug Master should follow the directions provided by the Captain/Pilot.

 

Not sure what they use in Piraeus, but these days we rarely use steel wire, as the synthetic lines are stronger and also float, which puts less risk on fouling the wheels when lines part, or are let go. When making mooring lines we often incorporated a wire snotter at the end, as a weak link. Therefore, in the event of the line parting, the expensive line was saved and we replaced the short wire snotter.

 

The lines have great strength when the weight is taken up gradually, but do not handle dynamic loads that are applied quickly very well. This is the 2nd similar experience with a tug line I have witnessed. Unfortunately the first time I was on the mooring deck when it recoiled above us, a couple feet off the deck.

 

Recoil we witnesses is normal for most lines. Every line I have seen part, recoils with amazing speed. Before the days of pre-formed wires, if a wire broke, it not only recoiled, it also unravelled. Only saw this once on my first trip to sea.

Had a friend from home when I lived in Florida killed by a parting line.  Not on my ship but it emphasizes the danger of being anywhere near a line under load.  

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Thanks Jim - wasn't certain about stern thruster, but with high lift rudders, it isn't required.

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1 minute ago, Heidi13 said:

Thanks Jim - wasn't certain about stern thruster, but with high lift rudders, it isn't required.

And as we know, some Captains are better ship handlers than others.  Some are almost as good as you and I.....😎

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Just now, Jim Avery said:

And as we know, some Captains are better ship handlers than others.  Some are almost as good as you and I.....😎

HaHa, recall one of our Captains at his retirement received a presentation from our local dock rebuilding contractor. It was a wooden board with twisted metal embeded. Fortunately it was taken in the good humour intended.

 

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There's a story saying Viking Jupiter crashed into the pier at Piraeus and sustained some damage while being assisted by 3 tugs?

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1 hour ago, stretchcruz said:

There's a story saying Viking Jupiter crashed into the pier at Piraeus and sustained some damage while being assisted by 3 tugs?

 

Check the discussion topics which go into detail.

 

 

 

 

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I did, thanks, and I saw video from another angle. I guess the "splash" that they were referring to earlier in this thread was actually the ship hitting the pier. I posted because I was surprised that none of them had weighed in, then I did more research and saw the impact. Sad.

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5 hours ago, stretchcruz said:

I did, thanks, and I saw video from another angle. I guess the "splash" that they were referring to earlier in this thread was actually the ship hitting the pier. I posted because I was surprised that none of them had weighed in, then I did more research and saw the impact. Sad.

Negative, the splash astern of the ship I referred to earlier, was a parted line hitting the ship then the water.

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11 hours ago, Heidi13 said:

Negative, the splash astern of the ship I referred to earlier, was a parted line hitting the ship then the water.

Any word as to cause?  Operator error (Pilot or Captain) or some glitch in the controls of a new ship?

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Jim - checked World Maritime News, gCaptain & Massmond this morning and no articles on Jupiter.

 

Watching the film, from about 3m 25s, when you first see the vessel's stern, the line to the stern tug is visible. However, the tension is frequently changing from slack to moderate weight. Then about 4m 30 sec the line goes bar tight, vibrates a few times, then parts.

 

At that time it appears the stern swings towards the dock.

 

From what I watched, the stern tug at no time actually had any control. The fwd tug maintained tension on the line continuously, so if ordered to pull hard, the tug Master just had to punch the throttles. With no weight on the line, the aft tug would have to take up the tension gradually before punching the throttles.

 

Other possibility could be the tug performing an emergency release.

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