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SargassoPirate

Pre-set Tables in World Cafe Is Creeping Me Out

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39 minutes ago, Cyber Kat said:

FWIW, I just got off an Azamara cruise and they do the same thing. 

 

 

8344E633-4CEE-495D-936D-B3A65AF51B2D.jpeg

You know, I guess we are at risk either way. If placed upside down, we risk a glass that had touched the exact spot on a placemat with a germ. If placed upright, we risk someone walking by the table and coughing or sneezing and airborne germs falling into the glass. Maybe I will drink my wine directly from the bottle!!

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1 hour ago, lackcreativity said:

You know, I guess we are at risk either way. If placed upside down, we risk a glass that had touched the exact spot on a placemat with a germ. If placed upright, we risk someone walking by the table and coughing or sneezing and airborne germs falling into the glass. Maybe I will drink my wine directly from the bottle!!

 

Best idea/solution I’ve heard yet! 🤣🤣🤣

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1 hour ago, lackcreativity said:

You know, I guess we are at risk either way. If placed upside down, we risk a glass that had touched the exact spot on a placemat with a germ. If placed upright, we risk someone walking by the table and coughing or sneezing and airborne germs falling into the glass. Maybe I will drink my wine directly from the bottle!!

 

You know they make wine by stomping on the grapes with their bare feet?  I've seen it in movies so it must be true!

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7 hours ago, Cyber Kat said:

FWIW, I just got off an Azamara cruise and they do the same thing. 

 

 

8344E633-4CEE-495D-936D-B3A65AF51B2D.jpeg

I wish nobody would do that. It's easy enough to tell whether the table is occupied or not without the glasses being upside down (if that is the excuse they use to turn the glasses).

Do they at least use clean placemats after each client or just "brush off" the old ones?

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1 hour ago, Paulchili said:

I wish nobody would do that. It's easy enough to tell whether the table is occupied or not without the glasses being upside down (if that is the excuse they use to turn the glasses).

Do they at least use clean placemats after each client or just "brush off" the old ones?

I agree. As we were told as children, just because "everybody else is doing it" doesn't make it right.

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I would love to be able to take some cultures off one of those mats that only gets brushed off with a used napkin.

 

No, we do not live in a germ free world and one should do everything possible to protect yourself through good hygiene practices, but failure for a food establishment to sanitize contact  surfaces between patrons is inexcusable. 

 

If it doesn't bother you to eat at a dirty table after sneezy has been there after he skirted the handwashing station after a good healthy number two on the way to dinner, more power to you.

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I refuse to live in a bubble, constant fears, and always scrutinizing.  Lived all these years without fears.  Pretty sure I will be fine for a few more.

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2 minutes ago, jiminyC_fan said:

I refuse to live in a bubble, constant fears, and always scrutinizing.  Lived all these years without fears.  Pretty sure I will be fine for a few more.

 

Thank you.  Some of this over analysis is annoying.

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I did not really want to involve myself with this particular thread because everyone is different, and have experienced varying issues with food, virus, illness  etc.   

 

Whilst we are very attentive to sanitation issues (on a cruise or in life generally), we don’t overly stress out over these things.   We take appropriate precautions and then “it will be what it will be” - on a cruise, long haul flight, restaurant or packed fairground etc.     

 

As I have been following this thread since post #1, I thought perhaps I could add my up to date perceptions of the issue on Viking Orion.   We are now in day 5 of our 36 night cruise Hong Kong to Vancouver.  

 

Whilst I likely may not have paid a lot a attention to this issue when onboard, the thread piqued my interest.     Day 1 in World Cafe was certainly a mix with some fresh tables having glasses face down, some face up.    Place mats were generally wiped, some not.     Over the next few days a change seems to have materialised.    Glasses are now face up, place mats are removed and replaced as tables are vacated.    

 

Perhaps Viking have addressed the concerns outlined in earlier posts.  

 

To my overall observation, Viking (our first cruise with them) seem to take sanitation seriously and on a par or better than our previous 16 cruises. 

 

Just my observations.

 

Rod

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2 hours ago, jiminyC_fan said:

I refuse to live in a bubble, constant fears, and always scrutinizing.  Lived all these years without fears.  Pretty sure I will be fine for a few more.

 

Much ado about nothing IMO. I read recently that most cellphones have more germs than a public bathroom toilet seat. And my mother always said, “You have to eat a pound of dirt before you die.”  🤣

 

Frankly, I’d rather deal with a few germs transferred to a glass from a place mat, than to have it face up and liable to have who knows what fly into it! 😳

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10 hours ago, SargassoPirate said:

 

If it doesn't bother you to eat at a dirty table after sneezy has been there after he skirted the handwashing station after a good healthy number two on the way to dinner, more power to you.

 

It doesn't bother me at all but maybe it should.

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I did a little research with the FDA's Food Service Sanitation Manual.  Preset tables with glasses inverted would be okay IF all of the tableware is removed between patrons - and that would include the placemats.  Leaving the placemat on the table, flipping the big chunks off with a used napkin and then resetting the table with clean tableware with contact surfaces touching the mat is NOT okay.

 

4-904.12 Soiled and Clean Tableware.

Soiled TABLEWARE shall be removed from CONSUMER eating and drinking areas and handled so that clean TABLEWARE is not contaminated.

4-904.13 Preset Tableware.

(A) Except as specified in ¶ (B) of this section, TABLEWARE that is preset shall be protected from contamination by being wrapped, covered, or inverted.

(B) Preset TABLEWARE may be exposed if: (1) Unused settings are removed when a CONSUMER is seated; or

(2) Settings not removed when a CONSUMER is seated are cleaned and SANITIZED before further use.

 

Allowing the same person to bus the table and then reset the table with clean tableware without washing their hands is NOT okay, according to the FDA's Food Service Sanitation Manual, which specifies when food service employees are to wash their hands.  I'll delete some of this section that is not applicable to this discussion.

 

2-301.14 When to Wash.

FOOD EMPLOYEES shall clean their hands and exposed portions of their arms as specified under § 2-301.12 immediately before engaging in FOOD preparation including working with exposed FOOD, clean EQUIPMENT and UTENSILS, and unwrapped SINGLESERVICE and SINGLE-USE ARTICLESP and:

 

(E) After handling soiled EQUIPMENT or UTENSILS; P

 

Much ado about nothing?  Only until you contract a food-borne illness or the norovirus.  You can find out more here, but it's pretty slow reading - much like the SOLAS regulations.

 

 

https://www.fda.gov/downloads/food/guidanceregulation/retailfoodprotection/foodcode/ucm374510.pdf

 

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This is a very sad thread that makes me realize tat even Viking atracts the kind of guests I have spent my life trying to get away from.  

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33 minutes ago, TruJeffie said:

This is a very sad thread that makes me realize tat even Viking atracts the kind of guests I have spent my life trying to get away from.  

 

That's rather rude, don't you think?

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4 hours ago, TruJeffie said:

This is a very sad thread that makes me realize tat even Viking atracts the kind of guests I have spent my life trying to get away from.  

Please explain.

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11 hours ago, Choose Something Fun said:

 

It doesn't bother me at all but maybe it should.

 It should, because if they are this lax in the so-called front of the house, what's going on in the back where we can't observe?

 

 

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35 minutes ago, SargassoPirate said:

 It should, because if they are this lax in the so-called front of the house, what's going on in the back where we can't observe?

 

 

 

Hey let's not go there.  Ignorance is bliss.

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1 hour ago, SargassoPirate said:

 It should, because if they are this lax in the so-called front of the house, what's going on in the back where we can't observe?

 

 

There is no reason for rumor, innuendo, or baseless speculation. I've done two galley tours on VO ships. They are immaculate.

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We were on the 3/14 Sky sailing (so by the afternoon of the 23rd the use of those placemats was the LEAST of our problems); however, we talked about this during the early part of the cruise. Using those mats surely can't be as sanitary a situation as NOT using them. I think that is a reasonable statement and perhaps simplifies the issue?? The thing is, unless I'm mistaken, the mats appeared to be some sort of woven material, or at least of a construction that does not lend itself as easily to being effectively sanitized by simply wiping it off.  Looks nice, but why use any sort of table setup that might be more susceptible to accumulating germs. Bare table=more easily cleaned and sanitized between servings (?)

Edited by gretschwhtfalcon

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10 hours ago, TruJeffie said:

This is a very sad thread that makes me realize tat even Viking atracts the kind of guests I have spent my life trying to get away from.  

Easy to say but perhaps doesn't hold much merit for folks who wind up confined to their room with a norovirus. 

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10 hours ago, Richard2 said:

There is no reason for rumor, innuendo, or baseless speculation. I've done two galley tours on VO ships. They are immaculate.

 

I've done a couple of those announced and prepared-for tours as well.  Everything looks nice and is scrubbed clean, just like those placemats wiped off with a used napkin.  They look immaculate.  It's the food and utensil handling practices and cross-contamination that one has to be concerned about.  That's why I lingered at lunch to see how the tables in the World Cafe were turned over between uses.

 

We are at the mercy of food preparation establishments, and when we see indicators of sub-standard practices in the front of the house, it gives pause to wonder what goes on at the back of the house.

 

Reminds me of the time I observed a food service worker on a ship wearing plastic gloves.  I found a comfy spot and watched.  He never changed the gloves while he handled dirty dishes, set the tables with clean utensils, grabbed a mop to clean up a spill, wiped off some counters, and then came around to serve coffee and juices.  The only purpose those gloves were serving was to keep his hands clean and give patrons a false sense of security.

 

 

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I’m usually pretty easy going when cruising, wash my hands often, use the sanitizer when walking around the ship etc. The thing that really worries me is when the cleaning person wipes the table then the chairs with the same cloth and then moves on to clean the next table. The chairs are filthy and the same cloth should never be used.

 

cheers

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