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Federal Judge considers sanctions affecting Carnival that could affect cruises

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35 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

We have some cruise itineraries here that are best suited to winter but of course all the international cruise ships head to the Northern hemisphere.

It was an attempt at humor...

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1 hour ago, jimbo5544 said:

I half remember reading about their "plans" after the last time at the rodeo, they brought in a retired admiral (from the Navy or Coast Guard...not sure which) and the plan for each issue including an officer on each ship to ensure compliance (I think)...  If true, and I were one of these guys, I would be really worried....

 

 

As would I.  More than one person dropped this ball.  And it is a big ball.

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17 minutes ago, broberts said:

 

True, the company has not been accused of directly lying to the judge. But don't you think falsifying documents that court appointed auditors may have relied on is essentially lying to the judge?

Well they certainly under achieved on the promise.  I was not there (nor any of us here) when they committed to fixing the problem.  I do not know what was said, but saw some of the documentation they published (high level look).  All hypothetical, but they could have totally intended to comply (why would they have done anything else) and then thru failures to either disseminate to appropriate levels within the entire organization or not fully grasping the complexity failed to do what they needed to (obviously).  At any rate, under my hypothetical, they did not lie to the judge, just failed to accomplish the mandate.  In regards to falsifying records, someone sure screwed up. Not sure who or where or when, but probably someone afraid to lose their job (and probably will and maybe more). I do not know the significance of what would happen (penalty wise) id they  self reported (as they should have). Perhaps our local expert can chide in....

Edited by jimbo5544

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10 minutes ago, bury me at sea said:

 

As would I.  More than one person dropped this ball.  And it is a big ball.

We all heard the thump

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22 minutes ago, broberts said:

True, the company has not been accused of directly lying to the judge. But don't you think falsifying documents that court appointed auditors may have relied on is essentially lying to the judge?

 

It most certainly is a slap in the face to the judge who ordered the audits/inspections. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say they lied. They agreed to get their act together, then continued the illegal activities and, at least, the violations. They've shown little respect for the orders put in place, so my guess is, that's why the judge is threatening to take even more serious actions. I don't see how anyone can deny Carnival Corp. screwed up bigtime, and that's an understatement. There's no defending their actions during all of this. It's time to buck up, take their licks, learn from it, and move on to be a better corporation.

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2 minutes ago, Organized Chaos said:

 

It most certainly is a slap in the face to the judge who ordered the audits/inspections. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say they lied. They agreed to get their act together, then continued the illegal activities and, at least, the violations. They've shown little respect for the orders put in place, so my guess is, that's why the judge is threatening to take even more serious actions. I don't see how anyone can deny Carnival Corp. screwed up bigtime, and that's an understatement. There's no defending their actions during all of this. It's time to buck up, take their licks, learn from it, and move on to be a better corporation.

Did anyone deny it?

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Some posters further back thought the criminal violations, actions or non-actions of Carnival weren't serious, and many, many posters main concern was if their cruise would be affected.  Only a few posters actually stressed the environmental damage done,  but the majority were like "so what?"

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14 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

We all heard the thump

 

Indeed.

 

I was cruising last week on the delightful Freedom so it has taken me awhile to catch up on this subject.

 

We aren't discussing the complaints of first time posters, or cutbacks, or once a day cabin service, or charging for room service.

 

This goes far beyond customer dissatisfaction.  I repeat the entire board and some upper management should be replaced.  This cannot be blamed on lower level personnel who followed orders given with a wink and a nod.

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2 minutes ago, bury me at sea said:

 

Indeed.

 

I was cruising last week on the delightful Freedom so it has taken me awhile to catch up on this subject.

 

We aren't discussing the complaints of first time posters, or cutbacks, or once a day cabin service, or charging for room service.

 

This goes far beyond customer dissatisfaction.  I repeat the entire board and some upper management should be replaced.  This cannot be blamed on lower level personnel who followed orders given with a wink and a nod.

Clearly done across multiples of their lines.  Corp has to take the blame, but I would be more than shocked if we saw a CEO step on the sword, corporate officer maybe.  Micky, Donald...do not see it, ind CEO's would be surprising, possibly after a huge fine and stock hit....

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Can actually see this be written up after the fact like a Harvard business school study....(depending what happens).....

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19 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

Clearly done across multiples of their lines.  Corp has to take the blame, but I would be more than shocked if we saw a CEO step on the sword, corporate officer maybe.  Micky, Donald...do not see it, ind CEO's would be surprising, possibly after a huge fine and stock hit....

 

If unwilling to fall on his/her sword, certainly unfit to continue in current position.

 

Do we really need a Brutus to get rid of the people ultimately responsible?

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13 minutes ago, MicCanberra said:

Yes, but I am partly serious.

OK, fair enough. I really doubt it will come to a ban, but if it did, I guess you could've some new ships available,  whether they could get different port times for sailings from Australia to available ports might be an issue, but not a huge one. Getting fuel together there without stopping in a US port (from wherever they would be when the ban occurred to other than a US port).All speed bumps but not road blocks.

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19 minutes ago, bury me at sea said:

 

If unwilling to fall on his/her sword, certainly unfit to continue in current position.

 

Do we really need a Brutus to get rid of the people ultimately responsible?

Only the Board knows..... guess it could be the Ides of June....Et Tu Brute

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4 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

Only the Board knows..... guess it could be the Ides of June....Et Tu Brute

 

The Ides of June made me laugh out loud.

 

Touche jimbo!

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7 minutes ago, bury me at sea said:

 

The Ides of June made me laugh out loud.

 

Touche jimbo!

1

Funny how Shakespeare's Julius Caesar could perhaps be premonitory to what happens to Carnival Corp. 

Edited by jbethel11

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18 minutes ago, jbethel11 said:

Funny how Shakespeare's Julius Caesar could perhaps be premonitory to what happens to Carnival Corp. 

Bet they are not laughing.... certainly a tragedy...

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19 minutes ago, Micah's Grandad said:

More like a disgrace.

Yeah....but it did not fit the Shakespeare reference...

Edited by jimbo5544

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3 hours ago, evandbob said:

Some posters further back thought the criminal violations, actions or non-actions of Carnival weren't serious, and many, many posters main concern was if their cruise would be affected.  Only a few posters actually stressed the environmental damage done,  but the majority were like "so what?"

Yes indeed, the last thing I am worried about are my two booked cruises for June and December. Would it be an inconvenience if my cruises were cancelled? Yes. What was done to our planet and wildlife (those poor whales, dolphins and seals) Carnival was deliberate and inexcusable. I hope they get the book thrown at them. If they can’t dock in US ports good! I’ll survive! God please forgive us of these sins. 

I hope the judge demands a sea steward on every Carnival held ship for all sailings for the next 5 years & to pay all salaries PLUS full benefits of Sea Stewards. That’s just a wish I had this morning thinking about this. 

Edited by bdever
Addition

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6 hours ago, bury me at sea said:

 

I believe you are correct.  A much lower bar would be applicable at this point.

Thank you for confirming what I thought was true.

6 hours ago, bury me at sea said:

This is levels and more levels beyond serious.  I can't help but believe the entire board of directors should be replaced, and a lot of heads in top management should roll.

 

Shareholder value of the moment cannot continue to be the top priority.  We are talking about survival.

And I agree with the rest of your post which is why I earlier posted that I wish I had not voted my proxy before I knew this information.

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2 hours ago, jimbo5544 said:

Yeah....but it did not fit the Shakespeare reference...

But Shakespeare was more into Theatre than Carnival.

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2 hours ago, bdever said:

Yes indeed, the last thing I am worried about are my two booked cruises for June and December. Would it be an inconvenience if my cruises were cancelled? Yes. What was done to our planet and wildlife (those poor whales, dolphins and seals) Carnival was deliberate and inexcusable. I hope they get the book thrown at them. If they can’t dock in US ports good! I’ll survive! God please forgive us of these sins. 

I hope the judge demands a sea steward on every Carnival held ship for all sailings for the next 5 years & to pay all salaries PLUS full benefits of Sea Stewards. That’s just a wish I had this morning thinking about this. 

I feel really bad for all of the marine life that goes on. If my Carnival cruise gets canceled, I will just find an MSC, NCL or Norwegian cruise to go on. Not a HUGE deal. 

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And yet their stock is doing fine.  The market disagrees with the majority of people posting on this forum.  I am surprised how quick to slam CCL many cc posters are.  

Edited by Cafedumonde

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34 minutes ago, Cafedumonde said:

And yet their stock is doing fine.  The market disagrees with the majority of people posting on this forum.  I am surprised how quick to slam CCL many cc posters are.  

The stock has recovered slightly but I wouldn't call and 11% drop in stocks fine. Whatever the decision in June, the stocks will take another hit.

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1 hour ago, MicCanberra said:

The stock has recovered slightly but I wouldn't call and 11% drop in stocks fine. Whatever the decision in June, the stocks will take another hit.

The stock has not gone down since this news came out.  It dipped a bit a week or so ago because CCL revised earnings downward for the year.

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