Elevator usage by ADA persons

[lifes-a-beach]

This conversation reminds me of the South Park episode Raising the Bar where Cartman decides he is no longer “big boned” but is, as he has been repeatedly told by Kyle, just fat, and acquires a mobility scooter.  Here’s a Wikipedia link for a G rated explanation:

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_the_Bar_(South_Park)

 

But if you don’t mind profanity and want a good laugh google the clip when he shows up at Kyle’s house.  I forgot how funny that episode was.  Thanks to whoever posted this entitlement garbage for the reminder.  

[fsjosh]

2 hours ago, DirtyDawg said:

This thread caught my eye because my mom's Senior's residence has Elevator Rules for its residents. A maximum of three walkers are allowed per elevator loading and there are diagrams describing how the walkers are to be positioned in the elevator to maximize the numbers that can be accommodated per load. 

 

This system is actually working fairly well; the residents with walkers load first, position themselves and them the people without walkers’ load.  At each floor, the ambulatory people step out to allow a person with a walker to exit and then re-enter to continue. 

 

Could this type of Elevator Etiquettte work on a cruise ship? Probably not it might be worth a try.

As a senior residence, I'm guessing they have a much higher percentage of people with mobility issues and assistive devices. They probably have less elevators too. So its more natural to think they'd need to make rules concerning them. On a cruise ship, out of thousands of passengers, how many are really in wheelchairs or scooters? 1% if that? This whole thread is much ado about nothing.

[Mr. Candyman]

11 hours ago, davekathy said:

Like everything else it would be abused the phonies. 

Not if they used your seapass like key card which only allows its usage at specific times.   Would just be like any other passkey that gets you to certain restricted floors in an office building

[DirtyDawg]

30 minutes ago, fsjosh said:

As a senior residence, I'm guessing they have a much higher percentage of people with mobility issues and assistive devices. They probably have less elevators too. So its more natural to think they'd need to make rules concerning them. On a cruise ship, out of thousands of passengers, how many are really in wheelchairs or scooters? 1% if that? This whole thread is much ado about nothing.

 

So, you're saying that this thread is just your typical CC thread?😉

Edited April 30, 2019 by DirtyDawg

[Mr. Candyman]

11 hours ago, matj2000 said:

 

If I with someone or share a cabin with someone in a scooter do I get to ride in the elevator also??

If not, who will tell me I can't??

 I don't believe the OP is looking for a quick fix that is going to solve every scenario. I think she is looking for some type of plan to make it a little more accommodating for those that have ADA and not have to wait as long as they are. We can sit her all day and debate why it's not going work instead of focusing on what they can do to help the situation.

[molsonschooner]

11 hours ago, Cyn874 said:

I'm a little confused. I just got off a 15 day cruise and from what I witnessed, all the people who were using scooters and wheelchairs had the same access and wait times as anyone else. It was first come/first serve, and people got on when it was their turn. In 15 days I never saw people in walkers or wheelchairs being denied boarding or being forced to wait longer. If anything, I usually saw them get on first and the people who were not using any sort of assistance would get on last. I myself got off of elevators to allow people in a scooter or wheelchair to take my place when it was crowded, and I saw others doing the same. I never witnessed anyone on a wheelchair or scooter having to wait additional time.

we were on Harmony a few weeks back. This was the first time DW used a scooter. I would say about 99% of the time my wife had no issues getting on/off the elevators. Young people(teens and maybe even pre teens) as well as older people offered assistance in some way, either holding the doors open, guiding her into or out of the elevator, moving a little bit one way or the other. I will say that we used some common sense as well. Many times if an elevator stopped at our deck and it was close to capacity, no way we tried to cram ourselves into the elevator.

[emeraldcity]

Can we at least agree that we should look for ways to "pay it forward" and hold the elevator door for someone who needs a bit of extra time to get to the elevator … or a bit of extra space for the scooter? Someday, it may be us. If we all commit to doing it once, I suspect the issue will resolve itself.

[Mr. Candyman]

6 minutes ago, emeraldcity said:

Can we at least agree that we should look for ways to "pay it forward" and hold the elevator door for someone who needs a bit of extra time to get to the elevator … or a bit of extra space for the scooter? Someday, it may be us. If we all commit to doing it once, I suspect the issue will resolve itself.

I don't have a disability and don't currently have anyone with one but I'm pretty sure most of the people arguing against it will have a different outlook if it were happening to them or their family member.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Mr. Candyman

[SRF]

13 hours ago, 6theagle said:

In my experience 8 years in a chair,  a Mobility issue is probably the most obvious one, as we usually require a device or some other obvious tools in order to walk. We all register with the assistance desk, so it would be another service. 

 

And there are those of us with back problems.  I don't use a device.  But some days, I cannot do the stairs.  Other days I can.

[leisuretraveler223]

1 hour ago, Mr. Candyman said:

Not if they used your seapass like key card which only allows its usage at specific times.   Would just be like any other passkey that gets you to certain restricted floors in an office building

 

Totally asinine. So they are going to technically revamp the whole system to manage lift use by keycard, therefore only allowing it for those with predetermined issues.  So if I tweak my ankle playing basketball and need to get back to my stateroom on deck 3, I'm going to be SOL.

 

Give me a break!  This whole idea is so stupid.  If it takes another three minutes to get a lift, no one is going to cry you a river.  

 

Why do we need to live in such a desperately managed nanny state?  Not everything is perfect and spoon fed.

[ShillyShally]

I liken it to the handicap stall in the bathroom - if there is a line, every stall is up for grabs and when someone comes in that needs that stall only, they get next dibs when it's open, but I don't think it should just remain empty in case someone comes in who needs it while the restroom is full.  I have heard retorts otherwise when coming out of said stall to a waiting person who needed it, but politely and respectfully did not give in to their claims it should never be used except...

 

I love always taking the stairs on a cruise, until my last one, when I couldn't.  When crowds were crazy I slowly took to the stairs, that was to avoid the crowds, not so much anything else.  But when I needed the elevator, I went by who was there before me and if someone in a scooter/chair also was waiting, even if they arrived after me, I ensured they could get on before I took any space.  

 

I don't think they can or should dedicate one elevator for specific use, heck you can't even stop the ones who try and get on before you can get off.  I figure it is what it is about cruising, but I've also dealt with it in hotels when a big group is checking out or it's the standard turn-around day for that area.  

[Cru1s1ng2009]

i agree with most people that this idea will not work.

 

My mom now uses a scooter on cruises (big rental one that @brilloheadbrought up. they are huge and a pain in the butt to maneuver on the elevator. I find that the first few days everyone is very accommodating but as the days go on they get less and less so. During peak times we wait like everyone else (as we should) but people always cut 'in front' of the line when gathered around an elevator bank with 5 lifts. it gets frustrating at times but I am on vacation so try to blow it off.

[Mr. Candyman]

34 minutes ago, leisuretraveler223 said:

 

Totally asinine. So they are going to technically revamp the whole system to manage lift use by keycard, therefore only allowing it for those with predetermined issues.  So if I tweak my ankle playing basketball and need to get back to my stateroom on deck 3, I'm going to be SOL.

 

Give me a break!  This whole idea is so stupid.  If it takes another three minutes to get a lift, no one is going to cry you a river.  

 

Why do we need to live in such a desperately managed nanny state?  Not everything is perfect and spoon fed.

And why can't this be done when they refurbished a ship?  I don't work for an elevator company so I can't tell what it takes to mount an access pad and reprogram the computer that is already controlling the elevator.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Mr. Candyman

[mets123]

My wife had a stroke four years ago, and has been using a scooter since then when we go on a cruise. Does she have one at home, no. But on a cruise, it is Nice to have. I push her in a wheelchair at home, but the size of today's ships make it almost impossible. We did use a wheelchair for the first two post stroke cruises, but at the end of the day, I was physically and emotionally exhausted. It was no vacation for me. The scooter makes it more enjoyable and gives me a break.

 

using elevators, we rely on the kindness of others. We don't expect special treatment because we realized others paid for their vacation s just as we have. We appreciate it when others have allowed us to go in before them, even if they were there first, and they now have to wait for another elevator.

 

what we do not appreciate is the ignorant people who try to sneak around us while my wife tries to get it. Or those who just push their way in. Or better yet, those who close the door when they see us coming, and there are only two people inside.

 

don't flame me. It happens more than once on every cruise.

 

Bless those that help us. Pray for the others that they are never in my wife's situation. Payback is a b...... Just my two cents.

[davekathy]

9 minutes ago, Cru1s1ng2009 said:

i agree with most people that this idea will not work.

 

My mom now uses a scooter on cruises (big rental one that @brilloheadbrought up. they are huge and a pain in the butt to maneuver on the elevator. I find that the first few days everyone is very accommodating but as the days go on they get less and less so. During peak times we wait like everyone else (as we should) but people always cut 'in front' of the line when gathered around an elevator bank with 5 lifts. it gets frustrating at times but I am on vacation so try to blow it off.

Happens even if you're not in a wheelchair or scooter. And not just at the elevator banks. 

Edited April 30, 2019 by davekathy

[kruzerci]

34 minutes ago, leisuretraveler223 said:

 

Totally asinine. So they are going to technically revamp the whole system to manage lift use by keycard, therefore only allowing it for those with predetermined issues.  So if I tweak my ankle playing basketball and need to get back to my stateroom on deck 3, I'm going to be SOL.

 

Give me a break!  This whole idea is so stupid.  If it takes another three minutes to get a lift, no one is going to cry you a river.  

 

Why do we need to live in such a desperately managed nanny state?  Not everything is perfect and spoon fed.

 

Exactly. 

 

I realize that not all have the same level of respect, but when I see an elderly person or somebody with mobility issues, I generally let them go ahead of me or take my spot since I am fully capable of taking the stairs from the bottom of the ship to the top. 

 

That said I think the idea of a revamped elevator system catering to those with mobility issues is asinine and unnecessary. Half of the people who would qualify for this would be abusing the system. The ever growing group of individuals who scooter themselves to the Windjammer to eat themselves into a coma every time the door is open don't need to be further enticed! 

[leisuretraveler223]

17 minutes ago, Mr. Candyman said:

And why can't this be done when they refurbished a ship?  I don't work for an elevator company so I can't tell what it takes to mount an access pad and reprogram the computer that is already controlling the elevator.

 

Who cares if it can be done. It is a completely stupid idea that won't appropriately serve those in need.  Some people have varied abilities and need to elevator at times, but not others.  Some people make the mistake of getting fall over drunk and can't safely use the stairs, but you're coming up with a system to block them from using the lifts. Those are just thoughts off the top of my head.  If I were actually putting some effort into it, I'm sure there are countless other arguments against this.

 

Is life REALLY that hard that this even merits a solution??? No!

[Joseph2017China]

14 hours ago, 6theagle said:

Recently, while travelling with a couple of friends who I am privileged  to be friends with for over 40 years, we encountered a cruise problem that I am seeking opinions on.  I can be a bit of a grump sometimes, but I was wondering if anyone else thinks that we with mobility issues, those traveling with children in strollers or anyone else who requires the elevator to get safely to and from our cabins to every where else on the ship, have encountered long waits at the elevators at peak times. Notably the fact that there are so many ambulatory people using those elevators. 

Rather than shaming my fellow travelers I want to address that it is fact the accessible desk or officer who SHOULD monitor how long it takes to get an elevator during embarkation, days at sea, and debarkation dates and times. How about dedicating an elevator? This would not be a full time dedication but at specific hours, for specific purposes. Let me know what you think, I am trying this again in August to Cuba. 

 

I think you worded this incorrectly.  My wife is disabled, and so I have some first hand knowledge.  During peak times, which is unfortunate, people "dash" to the open door, which will at times, leave the not so slow (elderly, walkers, scooters) to be unable to get to the door.  This is often overcome by the proper positioned of one's scooter in a central location between the doors and monitoring the numbers as they come closer.  (just like everyone else). 

 

So you can also, if you have a set of wheels, such as a scooter, or a stroller, just go to the other bank of elevators away from the crowds. 

 

By the way, during Peak times, everyone has a long wait.  Plus elevators are for everyone, so we wait like everyone.  It's not a problem. 

[PelicanBill]

I have also observed the issue of those with walkers or even canes having trouble reaching the elevators when they arrive as the more mobile people flood quickly in to each elevator. People need to be kinder and help the mobility challenge get to an elevators.  Otherwise all they can do is sit between two and wait for one of those to be the arriving elevator and then push their way at the risk of bumping people.

 

On NCL Breakaway, the elevator system has two that can be placed in "Priority" status and one of the buttons is dedicated to that one. This is done during port or call disembarkation and all the other elevators are restricted from the gangway deck and ONLY those needing assistance can use this elevator while everyone else must use the stairs from deck 4 down to deck 2.  

[klfrodo]

My mother would have kicked your butt if you tried to give her special treatment just because she was handicapped.

She waited in line just like everyone else.

[cruisegirl1]

16 hours ago, Cyn874 said:

I'm a little confused. I just got off a 15 day cruise and from what I witnessed, all the people who were using scooters and wheelchairs had the same access and wait times as anyone else. It was first come/first serve, and people got on when it was their turn. In 15 days I never saw people in walkers or wheelchairs being denied boarding or being forced to wait longer. If anything, I usually saw them get on first and the people who were not using any sort of assistance would get on last. I myself got off of elevators to allow people in a scooter or wheelchair to take my place when it was crowded, and I saw others doing the same. I never witnessed anyone on a wheelchair or scooter having to wait additional time.

What you described has always been my experience.    I've NEVER seen anyone ( except maybe kids who for some reason don't  know any better) run to an elevator and push  aside those who have mobility issues. 

 

M

 

 

  

[d9704011]

In my view, the proposal the OP made was a ‘solution’ to a ‘problem’ that doesn’t much exist.  The last cruise I was on, I had a problem with plantar fasciitis and had a heck of a time walking up and down stairs; the very notion that an elevator (or elevators) would be occasionally set aside for use for a specific cohort of the passenger population (which I most likely would not be permitted to join!) strikes me as unworkable.

[vacationlover_mn]

16 hours ago, 6theagle said:

Yet, I have waited and watched others older and more ill than I wait and wait while people who CAN take the stairs consume the space.  When I could walk I took the stairs, it was faster and far less frustrating, but I cannot now, and there are lots more like me. We like cruising because it is a little more independent than most travel. 

How fair is this current policy? From my view it isn't 

So, I have Morton’s Neuroma.  Much of the time, I can walk around just fine.  But, if it flares up, I can barely walk without intense pain.  I might be fine one not, and barely able to walk the next.  I’m in my early 40’s.  How can you tell if I’m able to take the stairs or not?  

Edited April 30, 2019 by vacationlover_mn

[ZoeyVictoria]

14 hours ago, twangster said:

 

I have observed what appears to an sense of entitlement that people in assisted devices should have priority for the next elevator.   I have observed more than once while waiting 3-5 minutes for an elevator only to have someone in a scooter appear and expect to be granted priority access to the next elevator that arrives even though I have waited much longer.   An assistive device should not grant priority access - wait like everyone else.

 

I once waited for several minutes with 10-12 other people for an elevator.  Just before one arrived, we heard “Coming through, coming through!” being shouted from around the corner of the elevator lobby.  As we all watched, a woman in a scooter rolled through the middle of our group and directly into the just-arrived elevator.  I don’t believe she should have to wait as people arriving after her push their way in front of her, but I don’t understand why she thought she should go directly to the front of the line.

[katiel53]

No one would know I have medical problems just by looking at me.  I have a restrictive lung problem and cannot walk more than a few feet without running out of breath.  I can not do stairs.

 

I have learned in my many cruises that if I need to be somewhere at a specific time on a cruise, I need to leave earlier just in case I can't get an elevator when I want/need it.  No one is going to be responsible for me except me.

 

I know there are some on elevators who feel they should get on before everyone else and don't care about people in scooters etc.  That, from my experience, is not the norm.  More times than not, people are helpful by holding the doors, making room etc to allow the handicapped to board.  My husband used a scooter for several cruises and never had a problem.  He did not feel "entitled" to any special treatment and the majority of times people allowed him to enter the elevator before them.

 

I don't think a special elevator for those in wheel chairs or scooters would work because there are those who wouldn't wait for that elevator if it didn't appear as soon as the cruiser felt it should  as well as others who felt they should be able to ride the handicapped elevator just because.