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MSC "BID UP" program launch

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18 minutes ago, sverigecruiser said:

 

It doesn't make sense for a customer who wants a specific kind of cabin.

 

I will not book Aurea and hope to upgrade to Yacht Club because I'm only interested in the Yacht Club.

 

With NCLs bidding system I loose a lots of money. If they have two cabins and want $10000 for them they can either sell them for $5000 each or price them $7000 each and hope to get $14000. With the bidding system they can sell one for $7000 and if the other cabin isn't sold someone can bid and get it for $3000 and NCL get $10000 for both cabins.

 

I'm the loser because I'm only interested in the Haven and have to pay $7000 instead of $5000.

 

If you're interested in the Haven (or the YC), you simply book it at full price and pick whichever cabin you want.

 

If you mean that you'r the 'loser' in the bidding process because someone is willing to pay more than you for this product, then I suppose that's accurate. In the scenario above, if you simply bid $3500, not only would you get the second cabin, but you would get it at a $1500 discount off of what yo describe as a fair rate. That sounds like a good deal to me. 

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2 hours ago, jcathers1 said:

 

If you're interested in the Haven (or the YC), you simply book it at full price and pick whichever cabin you want.

 

If you mean that you'r the 'loser' in the bidding process because someone is willing to pay more than you for this product, then I suppose that's accurate. In the scenario above, if you simply bid $3500, not only would you get the second cabin, but you would get it at a $1500 discount off of what yo describe as a fair rate. That sounds like a good deal to me. 

 

I'm the loser because without the bidding system I will get the cabin for $5000. With the bidding system I will have to pay $7000 for it and someone else might get it for $3000.

 

I'm not the loser because someone else is prepared to pay more, I'm the loser because I'm only interested in the Haven and can't hope to win a bid.

 

I could bid $3500 but what if I don't win? I don't mind to pay $5000 för Haven but I will not book a minisuite and hope to win a bid because I'm not interested in the minisuite.  

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We recently lost a bid on RCCL's Royalup program. We booked a balcony and tried to upgrade to Junior Suite. We were happy in our balcony and happy that we didn't spend the extra $700.

 

I guess the key is to book the cabin that you are happy with and if you find a reasonably priced upgrade, go for it.

 

We are booked to YC interior and would bid on balcony if the price is reasonable, but no worries either way.

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Agree completely with many. I stopped sailing NCL because I only want the Haven, I won’t pay the artificially high ‘rack rate’, and I won’t book with the hope that I may get a decent price in a bid. And I insist on picking out my own Cabin, so that pretty much rules out MSC now as well. Fortunately I have 4 YC cruises booked.  After that, we will likely look at the luxury lines as someone else posted. 

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On 5/26/2019 at 5:51 PM, TrinaLC said:

Agree completely with many. I stopped sailing NCL because I only want the Haven, I won’t pay the artificially high ‘rack rate’, and I won’t book with the hope that I may get a decent price in a bid. And I insist on picking out my own Cabin, so that pretty much rules out MSC now as well. Fortunately I have 4 YC cruises booked.  After that, we will likely look at the luxury lines as someone else posted. 

We'll have to see how this plays out, but checked 2020 and beyond YC rates a month ago and they are way up.

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On ‎5‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 4:51 PM, gadaboutgal said:

Just got an email from MSC :"MSC Cruises is excited to announce the launch of our new program, BID UP with MSC, designed to offer your clients the unique opportunity to upgrade their stateroom category. Through this program, MSC Cruises will offer guests the opportunity to bid for a higher stateroom category after their booking is paid in full. MSC Cruises will review the upgrade bid and decide whether to accept it."  

This is following in the footsteps of NCL's and Royal Caribbean's programs.  Will be interested to see how this works out for them.

I haven't hear anything about this lately.  Is it really a thing or a rumor? Couldn't find anything on their website. When is it supposed to happen?  I am paid in full for September and I'm hoping to get the opportunity to bid.

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On ‎5‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 4:51 PM, gadaboutgal said:

Just got an email from MSC :"MSC Cruises is excited to announce the launch of our new program, BID UP with MSC, designed to offer your clients the unique opportunity to upgrade their stateroom category. Through this program, MSC Cruises will offer guests the opportunity to bid for a higher stateroom category after their booking is paid in full. MSC Cruises will review the upgrade bid and decide whether to accept it."  

This is following in the footsteps of NCL's and Royal Caribbean's programs.  Will be interested to see how this works out for them.

I haven't hear anything about this lately.  Is it really a thing or a rumor? Couldn't find anything on their website. When is it supposed to happen?  I am paid in full for September and I'm hoping to get the opportunity to bid.

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On ‎5‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 6:42 PM, sidari said:

So MSC have taken the decision to become just another US, cruise line! In all but name.

I laughed out loud at this. I have read many a thread from passengers (not you, I hasten to add) saying they wish MSC were more American, and this is the result. Oh, well. 😄

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On ‎5‎/‎24‎/‎2019 at 12:00 PM, jcathers1 said:

 

You keep using terms like "artificially inflated prices" and claim that the cabins are not at "fair market value". Again, that's not how the free market works.  If the Haven or YC sails fully booked, then an argument can be made that the prices are actually not high enough.

 

No one gets screwed in a voluntary exchange of good/services/money. You may argue that the cruise lines have a bit more power in the relationship (because they have more information), but as long as people keep paying these prices, the prices will continue to rise. There isn't a monopoly on cruising. No one is forcing anyone to book a cabin or bid on a cabin. If enough people are offput by this, they will stop sailing, and MSC will have to change course. I cannot imagine that happening. Are people leaving NCL in droves because of this bidding process? It doesn't seem so. As someone who has sailed in both the Haven and the YC, I also cannot fathom why someone would pay literally twice as much for the Haven as for the YC (for virtually identical experiences). And yet, plenty do. 

 

It's easy to blame the terrible no-good greedy capitalists for the prices on these ships, but again, people are paying them. That means they are priced appropriately.

 

You sound like a libertarian, and I mean that in a good way. I agree with this post 100%. ☺️

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There would be no reason to implement a bidding system if cabin prices were set according to demand.  If cruise lines priced the cabins based on what consumers were willing to pay they would not have a bunch of cabins, usually the higher level ones, left empty at sail date.  Overselling a bunch of extra low level guarantees at low ball prices then relying on upgrade bids is just a trashy way to fill a ship.  It's loved by the bargain hunters who don't care what cabin they get and hated by those who are willing to purchase a higher level experience and won't settle for a mystery cabin location.

Edited by Até

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2 hours ago, mvh said:

I haven't hear anything about this lately.  Is it really a thing or a rumor? Couldn't find anything on their website. When is it supposed to happen?  I am paid in full for September and I'm hoping to get the opportunity to bid.

mvh, it was not a rumor.  I quoted directly from the email that MSC sent to me and other agents; however, you are right-there has been absolutely no follow up from MSC.  Nothing mentioned on the Travel Agent only website at all.  So I have no further information.  I will post if and when we hear more about this from the cruiseline.

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18 hours ago, Até said:

There would be no reason to implement a bidding system if cabin prices were set according to demand.  If cruise lines priced the cabins based on what consumers were willing to pay they would not have a bunch of cabins, usually the higher level ones, left empty at sail date.  Overselling a bunch of extra low level guarantees at low ball prices then relying on upgrade bids is just a trashy way to fill a ship.  It's loved by the bargain hunters who don't care what cabin they get and hated by those who are willing to purchase a higher level experience and won't settle for a mystery cabin location.

 

Well said. 

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I know many people who have gotten the offer to bid up, including myself.   All of them were for this July and August.

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On ‎6‎/‎14‎/‎2019 at 4:45 PM, Até said:

There would be no reason to implement a bidding system if cabin prices were set according to demand.  If cruise lines priced the cabins based on what consumers were willing to pay they would not have a bunch of cabins, usually the higher level ones, left empty at sail date.  Overselling a bunch of extra low level guarantees at low ball prices then relying on upgrade bids is just a trashy way to fill a ship.  It's loved by the bargain hunters who don't care what cabin they get and hated by those who are willing to purchase a higher level experience and won't settle for a mystery cabin location.

I think the point of the bidding system is that it IS according to demand. The bidding system, at least as I see it, is exactly to determine WHAT consumers are willing to pay. I see this as a total win/win, the cruise line gets the ship full and bargain hunters get to sail for less. There are no losers here, unless your definition of losing depends on someone else's good fortune, but that just strikes me as envy. Personally I couldn't care less whether my fellow passengers paid more than I did, or less. I've never even brought it up as a topic of conversation. Just my opinion, of course. 

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On 6/15/2019 at 12:50 PM, faze41 said:

I know many people who have gotten the offer to bid up, including myself.   All of them were for this July and August.

 

Faze41 could you elaborate a bit more?  Both Celebrity and RCL have bid up programs that are fairly identical to each others, both using the same 3rd party to send out email offers, but they also offer a specific link to bid up without receiving an email offer.   Did you receive the bid up via email?  And were the offers similar to the other 2 lines that use a minimum and maximum bid for the offers?  

Thank you

Spoilt 

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5 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

I think the point of the bidding system is that it IS according to demand. The bidding system, at least as I see it, is exactly to determine WHAT consumers are willing to pay. I see this as a total win/win, the cruise line gets the ship full and bargain hunters get to sail for less. There are no losers here, unless your definition of losing depends on someone else's good fortune, but that just strikes me as envy. Personally I couldn't care less whether my fellow passengers paid more than I did, or less. I've never even brought it up as a topic of conversation. Just my opinion, of course. 

 

There are defenitely losers if they do it the same way NCL does it.

 

NCL raised the prices a lot and hope that people will pay for it. What they can't sell at full price someone will get with a winning bid. The loser on NCL is everyone who wants Haven or nothing and have to pay the full price.

 

So far I haven't seen that MSC has raised the prices as much as NCL has.

 

( Read post nr 52.)

Edited by sverigecruiser

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19 minutes ago, sverigecruiser said:

 

There are defenitely losers if they do it the same way NCL does it.

 

NCL raised the prices a lot and hope that people will pay for it. What they can't sell at full price someone will get with a winning bid. The loser on NCL is everyone who wants Haven or nothing and have to pay the full price.

 

So far I haven't seen that MSC has raised the prices as much as NCL has.

 

( Read post nr 52.)

Hi, sverigecruiser. (I love your screen name, BTW). 😊 I read post #52 when you first posted it and again now. I'm sorry, but I just do not agree. The scenario you outlined is one in which say you'd be the loser because you 'have' to pay $7000 for a room in the Haven that another passenger got for only $3000. But there's no guarantee that that other passenger even exists. NCL is taking a chance that someone will pay the $3000 but maybe no one will. Also, unless you happen to bump into that person, there's almost no chance you'll find out whether your shipmates in the Haven paid more or less than you. And you stated at the outset that you're 'only' interested in the Haven. OK, well then you'll be subject to market forces. And as others have stated, those who book early in order to guarantee the category of cabin they want are, at least potentially, taking a risk that they'll overpay relative to those who book later. I'm more and more convinced that no one ever pays "too much" for anything. People pay what they're willing to pay, no more and no less. All of economics ultimately rests on the idea of a voluntary exchange. An exchange takes place when a willing buyer pays what a willing seller will sell something for. Otherwise, there's no deal. 

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Has anyone ever asked the person next to them on a flight what they paid? If you actually were bold enough to ask, was it anywhere close to what you paid? I highly doubt it.  It is all timing.  Don't feel cheated because someone paid less than you.  Everyone has a choice to lock it in early or wait and gamble.  Remember, this is a business.  The cruise line are in it to make money and who can fault that? This is a good debate and I do see both sides, this is just mine. 

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18 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

Hi, sverigecruiser. (I love your screen name, BTW). 😊 I read post #52 when you first posted it and again now. I'm sorry, but I just do not agree. The scenario you outlined is one in which say you'd be the loser because you 'have' to pay $7000 for a room in the Haven that another passenger got for only $3000. But there's no guarantee that that other passenger even exists. NCL is taking a chance that someone will pay the $3000 but maybe no one will. Also, unless you happen to bump into that person, there's almost no chance you'll find out whether your shipmates in the Haven paid more or less than you. And you stated at the outset that you're 'only' interested in the Haven. OK, well then you'll be subject to market forces. And as others have stated, those who book early in order to guarantee the category of cabin they want are, at least potentially, taking a risk that they'll overpay relative to those who book later. I'm more and more convinced that no one ever pays "too much" for anything. People pay what they're willing to pay, no more and no less. All of economics ultimately rests on the idea of a voluntary exchange. An exchange takes place when a willing buyer pays what a willing seller will sell something for. Otherwise, there's no deal. 

 

Don't you agree with me that I'm a loser on the bidding system if I now have to pay $7000 instead of $5000 for the cabin?

 

I understand the market forces and I also understand why NCL does it. but can't I still be a loser if I have to pay $7000 instead of $5000?

 

Market forces say that without the bidding system NCL can sell two cabins for $5000 each and with the bidding system they can hope to get $7000 each but if they only sell one for that price they can sell the other for $3000 and still get $10000.

 

I don't say that I am the loser because I have to pay $7000 and someone else might get a  cabin in the same category for only $3000. I am the loser because $7000 is $2000 more than $5000! It's not about how much someone else pay for their cabin, only what I pay.

 

The bidding system really hasn't costed me anything because I haven't cruised on NCL since they started with it. I don't pay more than I'm willing to pay! If MSC does the same as NCL, I am out! 

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6 minutes ago, mvh said:

Has anyone ever asked the person next to them on a flight what they paid? If you actually were bold enough to ask, was it anywhere close to what you paid? I highly doubt it.  It is all timing.  Don't feel cheated because someone paid less than you.  Everyone has a choice to lock it in early or wait and gamble.  Remember, this is a business.  The cruise line are in it to make money and who can fault that? This is a good debate and I do see both sides, this is just mine. 

 

For me it's not about if someone else pay less, only if I have to pay more!

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15 minutes ago, sverigecruiser said:

 

For me it's not about if someone else pay less, only if I have to pay more!

Sure, but unless someone tells you, how would you know? Anyway, I don't like the feeling that I overpaid, but if I ever feel that way, I just cancel. That's what I did today, in fact, I canceled one cruise and booked another. (through my TA)

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6 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

Sure, but unless someone tells you, how would you know?

You don't have to ask and it really doesn't matter.  If someone pays pre final payment asking price for a suite on NCL they overpay, period.  Forced minimum bid amounts are tightly controlled so the people who think they got a deal on an upgrade bid usually pay about what the suites used to sell for before the bidding process was implemented.  And yes, the system is designed for one purpose and that is not to help the consumers it is to increase sales revenue for the same cabins.  A bidding system basically would lose money if they really let people have the cabins for less than they were selling for before the bid system.  So far I've seen that they just raise the cabin prices to catch a few unwary people with outright sales then bid off the remaining ones back near the original price, they control the system and the minimum bids, and anyone who booked outright just lined the corporate pockets with some extra cash.  And don't think this same thing isn't happening, to a lesser dollar value, to balcony and ocean view cabins.  Since several cruise lines have implemented systems and don't seem like they are getting rid of them it evidently is a money maker that basically relies on consumers not knowing what the cabins would normally sell for and getting caught up in the bidding frenzy.

 

What the cruise lines either don't realize or don't care about is that it does also hurt people who usually book the higher cabins and don't want to book a balcony and take a chance on winning a bid to an unknown cabin location.  NCL lost piles of us, and I recognize many now here on the MSC forum.  If they implement a bidding system MSC will see an initial significant decrease in people outright booking YC and Aurea cabins, just like what happened on NCL.  What will be interesting is the reaction of the cruise line, in NCL's case it was to actually increase the prices which served to drive higher minimum bids from unsavvy people.  Hopefully MSC doesn't use that same tactic.

 

I still read the NCL forums and have seen some interesting discussion about how NCL is becoming more and more like Carnival, even the Haven has been having troubles with unruly passengers being kicked off the ship.  I can't help but feel NCL's new orientation towards the bargain hunter, first time, uneducated cruiser is in part fueled by the bidding hoax.

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Trouble is MSC have employed Ex NCL people so no surprise to see them trying out NCL ideas which hopefully will fail.

On Divina over last Xmas and New Year our cabin steward who has been with MSC for many years and knows the job inside out was telling us that they had just got a new Housekeeping manager from NCL who was trying to change the way MSC work, meanwhile alienating the staff in the process.

Edited by sidari

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6 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

Sure, but unless someone tells you, how would you know? Anyway, I don't like the feeling that I overpaid, but if I ever feel that way, I just cancel. That's what I did today, in fact, I canceled one cruise and booked another. (through my TA)

 

I don't understand what you mean, who do I need to ask? I know that $7000 is more than $5000. The bidding system made the prices go up and I will have to pay more for the cabin I want.

 

It's not that I care how much anyone else pay and it's not that I don't understand the market forces. It's not a win win situation for me because I have to pay more!

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