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CruncheyFrog

Disappointed with Norwegian

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1 hour ago, Samstress said:

Okay...I did read thru all of the replies & I hope I am right in what I believe.  I am from Ontario Canada and when I purchase travel insurance I am FULLY covered for everything with the exception of a pre-existing condition. And by pre-existing I mean any condition that has not been stable for a year prior to purchasing the insurance policy.  

If I do declare that I have a pre-existing condition I can still buy the insurance.  It's just more expensive.

But, if I buy my travel insurance before I experience any health issues that are not pre-existing then I can cancel and claim a refund from the policy.  And that policy would also include my travelling companions.

I have always dealt with Allianz & I would suggest that the OP have a more in-depth convo with them.

I'm not sure but I think mud is probably clearer than most insurance policies.

 

 

I have looked (again) at my Out of Province Medical coverage with Allianz (through my BMO MasterCard) and the "Coverage Period begins when You depart your province or territory of residence on Your Departure Date".  Maybe it's different with a credit card than purchasing directly from Allianz, but any pre-existing conditions would not be covered.

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, CruncheyFrog said:

I have looked (again) at my Out of Province Medical coverage with Allianz (through my BMO MasterCard) and the "Coverage Period begins when You depart your province or territory of residence on Your Departure Date".  Maybe it's different with a credit card than purchasing directly from Allianz, but any pre-existing conditions would not be covered.

 

OMG another revelation, after 100 posts we are finally getting to the bottom of this, I'm staggered, you were in fact relying on a basic insurance policy provided by your credit card and never had proper insurance.

 

After 100 posts we discover its a credit card (presumably free) insurance that does not cover you on the run up to your cruise, you had inadequate insurance and Norwegian are not at fault, it's a risk you took.

 

You actually had insurance to cover you whenever you left your province in good health, you did not take out travel insurance to cover your trip, I know it's harsh but it should be lesson learnt.

Edited by ziggyuk

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Hey OP - so I think the situation is as follows:  You have to cancel your cruise based on a medical reason, but you don't actually have independent trip cancellation insurance, you have (credit card based) travel insurance, which means you have out of province medical coverage.  Possibly the credit card based insurance includes some trip cancellation/trip interruption, but usually those are pretty limited, and if it exists in your case, likely the effective date is still your departure date.  When you buy independent trip cancellation insurance, the effective date is usually when you buy the insurance, not when you start your trip.  

 

Now in a situation where you are having to cancel (leaving aside whether you really HAVE to or not), without good trip cancellation insurance, you are left in a position of having to ask NCL to do you a favour, which they have declined.  

 

I can understand being frustrated at the situation and maybe even being disappointed that the result wasn't what you desired, but you have to recognize that NCL hasn't done anything wrong.  All NCL has done is abide by the terms of the contract that you agreed to when you purchased the cruise.  It's a crappy situation for sure, but it is not one in which NCL is to be blamed.  That is the risk you take when you purchase a cruise without buying cruise insurance.  Being left with a bitter taste in your mouth vs. NCL is just deflecting fault.

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43 minutes ago, CruncheyFrog said:

I have looked (again) at my Out of Province Medical coverage with Allianz (through my BMO MasterCard) and the "Coverage Period begins when You depart your province or territory of residence on Your Departure Date".  Maybe it's different with a credit card than purchasing directly from Allianz, but any pre-existing conditions would not be covered.

 

... just buy pre-existing condition coverage...

http://tninsurance.ca/travel/preexistingcondtravel.htm

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6 hours ago, CruncheyFrog said:

All travel insurance companies exclude pre-existing conditions, so it doesn't matter which company it is.

NOT true.  Travelex "Travel Select" policy is the one we always purchase.  As long as you purchase your policy within 21 days of making your first trip payment, you ARE covered for pre-existing conditions.  Do your research.

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Posted (edited)

 

For Americans Some insurance policies have pre existing condition waiver if purchased by final payment. April cruise, Nationwide cruise insurance and CSS come to mind. 

 

I know op didn’t purchase a plan but coverage is pretty confusing so I see how one can end up in his situation. 

 

If you miss the purchase at initial deposit waiver window most plans have a look back period of typically 60-120 days from day of purchase.  The waiver is nice to have even if you don’t have any preexisting condition upon purchase.  For example a young healthy adult might think there’s no need.  We take no medication and are healthy.  I didn’t purchase a plan upon initial deposit.  Shortly before final payment my husband messed up his knee and went to the doctor.  I ended up going with April cruise insurance because they had the waiver at final payment.  He was healed and able to travel the day I purchased the plan.  My luck something might happen to his knee on the trip and if it did we wouldn’t be covered with pre existing condition plan.  In any case who wants to mess with proving your health, providing records...for 60-120 days prior should a claim be necessary. 

 

I’ve purchased expensive policies in the past and ended up canceling the cruise prior to final payment.  The insurance company let me take the unused premium and put it towards a replacement cruise but I think you need to request and it’s not guaranteed. 

 

I also recently discovered our primary insurance plans, through work, actually does cover us outside the country - something I assumed it wouldn’t.  Not all plans do but mine has the same coverage outside the us as at home.  No coverage for a med evacuation though and also no reimbursement of expenses should we cancel cruise but something to check into if going on an inexpensive sailing. Med evacuation only insurance can be purchased on an annual basis. 

 

Op- one thing that might be an option - do you have anyone willing to go in your place? Your pcc or ta potentially might let you swap out 2nd passenger and then first passenger.  If someone else willing to go in your place at a big discount you might be able to get a little $ back. If not,  ncl will refund your taxes and port fees, beverage package fees, dsc, specialty dining service charges... they just won’t refund the actual fare. Cancellation penalty schedule is on their website.  It varies depending on initial payment. 

Edited by littlelulu01

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17 hours ago, CruncheyFrog said:

All travel insurance companies exclude pre-existing conditions, so it doesn't matter which company it is.

So, what did your insurance company say when you reported it to them?  Again, your beef is with the insurance company, not NCL.  You need to be in contact with them.

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Canadians can buy travel insurance that covers pre-existing conditions but it is abhorrently expensive and you must be aware of the rules. To the point where many simply don't take the chance. Insurance through the employer sometimes has basic travel insurance but nothing that would cover you 100%. I'm only 40 but I still buy travel insurance, just in case. This is an older article but could help the OP navigate the clear as mud world of travel insurance: 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/how-to-navigate-the-risky-world-of-travel-insurance-1.2840955

 

I've also heard good things about RBC travel insurance as well as Blue Cross. Perhaps getting a broker to help would be the best idea.

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14 hours ago, Kwaj girl said:

NOT true.  Travelex "Travel Select" policy is the one we always purchase.  As long as you purchase your policy within 21 days of making your first trip payment, you ARE covered for pre-existing conditions.  Do your research.

That is in the USA. I live in Canada.

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2 minutes ago, CruncheyFrog said:

That is in the USA. I live in Canada.

 

Again, THIS is another example of the trouble and confusion you caused by refusing several requests *early* (and later) to specify if you had USA or non-USA based insurance.

 

PLUS... you have since claimed that i is NOT the insurance you are concerned about, but it is NCL!

??

 

GC

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https://www.bmo.com/pdf/World_Elite_Cardholder_Agreement.pdf

6 minutes ago, GeezerCouple said:

 

Again, THIS is another example of the trouble and confusion you caused by refusing several requests *early* (and later) to specify if you had USA or non-USA based insurance.

 

PLUS... you have since claimed that i is NOT the insurance you are concerned about, but it is NCL!

??

 

GC

I asked NCL for a favor, and they refused, which left me disappointed. Below is the link for the policy wording of my travel insurance. The coverage is fairly elaborate, but it is clear that I have no coverage for pre-existing conditions on this trip, and no coverage for Trip Cancellation, as I am physically able to travel.  I cancelled my trip because I would rather lose $6500 now than take the chance of losing a much larger amount of money (potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars). That is the long and short of this whole matter. https://www.bmo.com/pdf/World_Elite_Cardholder_Agreement.pdf

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1 hour ago, snirpville said:

Canadians can buy travel insurance that covers pre-existing conditions but it is abhorrently expensive and you must be aware of the rules. To the point where many simply don't take the chance. Insurance through the employer sometimes has basic travel insurance but nothing that would cover you 100%. I'm only 40 but I still buy travel insurance, just in case. This is an older article but could help the OP navigate the clear as mud world of travel insurance: 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/how-to-navigate-the-risky-world-of-travel-insurance-1.2840955

 

I've also heard good things about RBC travel insurance as well as Blue Cross. Perhaps getting a broker to help would be the best idea.

Thank you very much for your positive and helpful post.

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15 hours ago, ziggyuk said:

 

OMG another revelation, after 100 posts we are finally getting to the bottom of this, I'm staggered, you were in fact relying on a basic insurance policy provided by your credit card and never had proper insurance.

 

After 100 posts we discover its a credit card (presumably free) insurance that does not cover you on the run up to your cruise, you had inadequate insurance and Norwegian are not at fault, it's a risk you took.

 

You actually had insurance to cover you whenever you left your province in good health, you did not take out travel insurance to cover your trip, I know it's harsh but it should be lesson learnt.

My credit card is not free, and the insurance provided by it is for Trip Cancellation/Trip Interruption, Out of province medical coverage, and a few other things (lost luggage, etc.). It is quite elaborate, and I would never travel without this. As I have said to a few others, I can't claim for Trip Cancellation, as I am physically able to travel. I have no coverage for my pre-existing condition, as it occurred within 6 months of my trip. My fear is that if my pre-existing condition flares up during my trip, I will be forced to cover all medical costs out of my own pocket, which could be a very large sum of money. The link to my Travel Insurance coverage is https://www.bmo.com/pdf/World_Elite_Cardholder_Agreement.pdf

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I can't believe I read this whole thread.

 

OP, Are you assuming your insurance considers this a pre-existing condition because it occurred prior to the trip?  I think it has been mentioned many times that it would only be pre-existing if it occurred before purchasing the insurance.

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17 hours ago, Diane67B said:

I think that the OP needs to talk to their insurance providers for more information on their policy. It sounds to me like, should they have gotten sick, insurance would have paid. Maybe, they just were afraid of getting sick and ruining a vacation and wanted to postpone? Cancellation coverage would have taken care of that.

The insurance would not have paid if my pre-existing condition reoccurred. I would have been on the hook for all the costs, which could have been substantial, and my Trip Cancellation coverage will not kick in, as I am physically able to travel.

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4 minutes ago, RedwingHockeyFan said:

I can't believe I read this whole thread.

 

OP, Are you assuming your insurance considers this a pre-existing condition because it occurred prior to the trip?  I think it has been mentioned many times that it would only be pre-existing if it occurred before purchasing the insurance.

Here is a copy of my policy wording, which I have read several times. It's pretty clear that the pre-existing condition, as it pertains to out of province medical coverage, is excluded. The section for out of province Medical coverage starts on page 30, to save you some time. Let me know what you think. https://www.bmo.com/pdf/World_Elite_Cardholder_Agreement.pdf

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1 minute ago, CruncheyFrog said:

My credit card is not free, and the insurance provided by it is for Trip Cancellation/Trip Interruption, Out of province medical coverage, and a few other things (lost luggage, etc.). It is quite elaborate, and I would never travel without this. As I have said to a few others, I can't claim for Trip Cancellation, as I am physically able to travel. I have no coverage for my pre-existing condition, as it occurred within 6 months of my trip. My fear is that if my pre-existing condition flares up during my trip, I will be forced to cover all medical costs out of my own pocket, which could be a very large sum of money. The link to my Travel Insurance coverage is https://www.bmo.com/pdf/World_Elite_Cardholder_Agreement.pdf

 

If you had taken out a cheap travel insurance you would be able to take the trip and be fully covered right now as the cover would have commenced on the day you paid for it and this would not be pre existing.

 

You said earlier your insurance was in place when you booked the trip, you did not reveal you were relying on a bundled product that comes with your credit card. The insurance you have is very poor so many thing can go wrong between booking and cover commencing (day of travel), you have sadly learnt this through this experience.

 

The only reason your condition is classed as pre existing is because the cover has NOT started yet, it will start the day you travel and anything before that is pre existing, you may describe it as elaborate, I consider it very poor coverage. Even if you traveled tomorrow out of province and get a flare up you will not be covered as it will again be classed as pre existing.

 

I know it's a hard lesson but your reliance on this cards bundled cover has cost you $6500.

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18 hours ago, ziggyuk said:

Diane67B, the OP has stated the condition was diagnosed AFTER taking out insurance, they say in Canada this is classed as existing even though it did not exist when the policy commenced because it existed before sail date, can you confirm this is your understanding in Canada as the T&C do not bear this out?

Here is a copy of my Travel/Medical insurance. The out of province coverage section starts on page 30, to save you some reading time. Let me know what you think. https://www.bmo.com/pdf/World_Elite_Cardholder_Agreement.pdf

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18 hours ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

I probably would not have made the decision to cancel under the premise that I might (or my spouse) have a recurrence of a medical condition.  Guess I'm more of a risk taker but the thought of having my canceled cruise come and go only to know that I could have gone after all seems agonizing.  I totally understand the OP's point about taking a "small" loss over a bigger one, but jeez...I could book a cruise, have the best travel insurance on the planet, have perfect health, and still get hit by a bus, thus preventing me from taking my cruise.  There are no certainties and living under "what if" conditions sounds very stressful IMO.

OP, I hope both you and your wife remain well despite the disappointment of this situation. 

If I got hit by a bus, my Travel/Medical coverage would take care of me. What I fear is a recurrence of my pre-existing condition costing me a very LARGE sum of money out of my own pocket. Thank you for the good wishes, and safe travels.

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4 minutes ago, CruncheyFrog said:

Here is a copy of my policy wording, which I have read several times. It's pretty clear that the pre-existing condition, as it pertains to out of province medical coverage, is excluded. The section for out of province Medical coverage starts on page 30, to save you some time. Let me know what you think. https://www.bmo.com/pdf/World_Elite_Cardholder_Agreement.pdf

 

Yes, from what I read they consider pre-existing as anything that occurred within the 6 month period prior to when the coverage began which is when you leave the province.  However, that pre-existing exception does not apply to a condition that is being controlled by the consistent use of medication. 

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11 minutes ago, ziggyuk said:

 

If you had taken out a cheap travel insurance you would be able to take the trip and be fully covered right now as the cover would have commenced on the day you paid for it and this would not be pre existing.

 

You said earlier your insurance was in place when you booked the trip, you did not reveal you were relying on a bundled product that comes with your credit card. The insurance you have is very poor so many thing can go wrong between booking and cover commencing (day of travel), you have sadly learnt this through this experience.

 

The only reason your condition is classed as pre existing is because the cover has NOT started yet, it will start the day you travel and anything before that is pre existing, you may describe it as elaborate, I consider it very poor coverage. Even if you traveled tomorrow out of province and get a flare up you will not be covered as it will again be classed as pre existing.

 

I know it's a hard lesson but your reliance on this cards bundled cover has cost you $6500.

The travel agency I deal with uses Manulife, and their medical insurance is worded the same way. They told me that the Manulife product is one of the best on the market. This might be something that exists in Ontario, but might be different in the USA.

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6 minutes ago, RedwingHockeyFan said:

 

Yes, from what I read they consider pre-existing as anything that occurred within the 6 month period prior to when the coverage began which is when you leave the province.  However, that pre-existing exception does not apply to a condition that is being controlled by the consistent use of medication. 

The wording for that is as follows: "This exclusion does not apply to a Medical Condition controlled by the consistent use of medication(s) taken as prescribed by a physician provided that during the six (6) month period before Your Coverage Period began there has been no change in any medication(s) and no other Treatment has been taken or recommended. A new medication or an alteration in usage or dosage of a medication constitutes a change in medication. This exclusion does not apply to the Flight Delay benefit". I interpret that as meaning that you have been taking medication for six months prior to your departure date, and it hasn't changed. My medical issue came up three months before my departure date. Thanks for your feedback.

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4 minutes ago, CruncheyFrog said:

The wording for that is as follows: "This exclusion does not apply to a Medical Condition controlled by the consistent use of medication(s) taken as prescribed by a physician provided that during the six (6) month period before Your Coverage Period began there has been no change in any medication(s) and no other Treatment has been taken or recommended. A new medication or an alteration in usage or dosage of a medication constitutes a change in medication. This exclusion does not apply to the Flight Delay benefit". I interpret that as meaning that you have been taking medication for six months prior to your departure date, and it hasn't changed. My medical issue came up three months before my departure date. Thanks for your feedback.

3 months falls within the 6 months.  You can call and confirm for yourself but I think as long as your condition is controlled that you are ok.  I am not reading that the condition has to be controlled for an entire 6 months prior to sailing.

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Crunchey Frog, I think I understand where you are coming from. It is horrible that you have to miss a trip that I am sure both you and your wife were excited about. I wish you good health in the future and hopefully you can rebook a cruise soon.

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