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geoffrywillhardt

If you were Carnival what ships would you order next?

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6 minutes ago, eroller said:

 

 

It's a lot of people that is for sure.  I'm holding out hope.  So much depends on the design.  If it's designed well and disperses people well in different areas, then the crowds can be tolerable.  The Oasis Class with Royal Caribbean does this extraordinarily well.  The ships rarely feel crowded and far less crowded than Carnival's Dream/Vista class even though they are larger with more people.  Royal introduced the neighborhood concept on these ships and it works well.  Carnival has copied that idea for the Mardi Gras.  I hope it's executed just as effectively.  Time will tell.  Royal also built up the infrastructure in various ports (and home ports) to accommodate these monster ships.  They knew if crowds became overwhelming they would be a failure.  Thankfully they feel less crowded than ships half their size.  My embarkation on HARMONY OF THE SEAS was 12 minutes drop off to walking on the ship.  Impressive.  I'm really looking forward to Mardi Gras for a variety of reasons.  I hope it's not a one-hit wonder for me and perhaps will reignite the love for CCL I once had.  

We never went on a mega ship till the Royals Harmony and I totally agree. Sometimes it almost seamed like very few on the ship. It WAS one of our favorite cruises. We like smaller ships because of the crowds. It was an eye opener. The choice of food was unbelievable probably because of the vast number of different nationalities.

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1 minute ago, twodaywonder said:

We never went on a mega ship till the Royals Harmony and I totally agree. Sometimes it almost seamed like very few on the ship. It WAS one of our favorite cruises. We like smaller ships because of the crowds. It was an eye opener. The choice of food was unbelievable probably because of the vast number of different nationalities.

 

I really learned with those ships that bigger and more people doesn't automatically equate to more crowded and more lines.  It can mean just the opposite, if the ship is designed well.  Again it's a balance between making money and providing a great customer experience.  Some are better at the balance than others.  

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2 hours ago, LandlockedCruiser01 said:

I'm suprised how much hate Fantasy class ships get.  I had nothing but great experiences on them.  And even now, they're the unsung workhorses of Carnival, making up in atmosphere for what they lack in glamour.  Not to mention, having a manageable passenger size, dating back from the times when cramming cabins into every nook and cranny wasn't the norm.  So I were Carnival, I'd order a NeoFantasy class ship: eliminate the Farcus decor, add a wraparound outside deck, put in a shortcut between MDR's on deck 8 (Atlantic), convert a handful of interiors into NCL-style Studios, but keep the small size and the basic layout. And OK, fine, add about 100 cabins to help pay for all those improvements.

 

Couldn't agree more. Complete with tiny studio cabins whose occupants only use them for showering and sleeping. Like me ! Using NCL's model (100 ft2) compared with Carnival standard 185 ft2 for 2, almost the same occupancy could be reached in the same space and dump that singles get-together meeting place in the center of the NCL attempt. I love the ole Fantasy Class ships on the West Coast. Walking the decks with all that Joe Farcus glitz and glamour is memorable. These 8 ships put Carnival on the map and allowed them to dominate the cruise business, pay cash for their ships and buy up other cruise lines like it was a hobby. I've cruised on several of these gems and love this size. A newer version with up to date design and style would be a moneymaker IMHO.

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1 hour ago, glrounds said:

 

Couldn't agree more. Complete with tiny studio cabins whose occupants only use them for showering and sleeping. Like me ! Using NCL's model (100 ft2) compared with Carnival standard 185 ft2 for 2, almost the same occupancy could be reached in the same space and dump that singles get-together meeting place in the center of the NCL attempt. I love the ole Fantasy Class ships on the West Coast. Walking the decks with all that Joe Farcus glitz and glamour is memorable. These 8 ships put Carnival on the map and allowed them to dominate the cruise business, pay cash for their ships and buy up other cruise lines like it was a hobby. I've cruised on several of these gems and love this size. A newer version with up to date design and style would be a moneymaker IMHO.

Very true.  In fact, if the 185-ft^2 are split into two 90-ft^2 studios, you still keep the same occupancy and revenue level.  (Well, a few cabins will need to be cannibalized to make room for the solo lounge, but prices can be raised slightly to compensate for it.)  We'd be catering to the Millennial and the Post-Millennial market.  After all, these demographics like their living spaces small and communal, like the micro-apartments in New York and San Francisco.  The older crowd can stay there too, if they wish.

 

Edited by LandlockedCruiser01

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4 hours ago, LandlockedCruiser01 said:

 .  So I were Carnival, I'd order a NeoFantasy class ship: eliminate the Farcus decor, add a wraparound outside deck, put in a shortcut between MDR's on deck 8 (Atlantic), convert a handful of interiors into NCL-style Studios, but keep the small size and the basic layout. And OK, fine, add about 100 cabins to help pay for all those improvements.   

 

 

 

Don't forget balconies.  That is the primary reason the Fantasy Class are not that competitive and I think why Carnival spends a limited amount of $$ on them.  They have attempted to add balconies and I think the result is mixed.  They can only get so much yield even for a balcony on these ships.  Plus the ship design doesn't lend itself well to balconies.  The lifeboats are high up and must be lowered along the side the of the ship.  There can't be any balconies added in the path of the lifeboats.  Having the balconies in patches sure doesn't aid in the appearance of these ships.  The design of the lifeboats and having them positioned high up is no longer permitted by SOLAS.  QM2 received a special exception to place her boats high up, but that was due to her scheduled transatlantic crossings and increased possibilities of rough weather.    

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A new class similar in size as the Spirit class.  We love sailing out of Tampa and Jacksonville but those ports cannot accept the taller ships.  Would like to see some new ships in that size.  I don't see anything resembling new in Jacksonville but Tampa could support it. 

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We love the Conquest Class ships and thoroughly enjoyed the Spirit Class ships. We sailed the Zuiderdam on HAL and loved that as well. I personally like the smaller ships. Someone else mentioned a walk around promenade deck. We used that every day on the Zuiderdam. Mega or XL doesn't interest me. One of these days I wouldn't mind a Dream Class cruise to try it out, but I foresee booking Conquest or smaller as long as they still sail.

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15 hours ago, Joebucks said:

Seeing that Royal just ordered a ship smaller than Oasis class, and Oasis can't go to many ports, it looks at the moment that there is somewhat of a cap on how big and how many big ships you can have.

Royal also has two more Oasis on order each will when completed be the "Largest Cruise ship ever"

12 hours ago, LandlockedCruiser01 said:

I'm suprised how much hate Fantasy class ships get.

Pretty sure for everyone there is no in between, its either love or hate. 

11 hours ago, twodaywonder said:

Wish they would build some newer Fantasy class ships. We like the smaller ships. 

This is one thing I was thinking. Eventually the Fantasy will get so expensive to maintain they will have to get rid of them, why not have a smaller class to replace them that has the great things but fixes the things that are not great, such as the number of balcony rooms. 

10 hours ago, vicky3vicky said:

I would also, quietly, behind the scenes, be making plans for a 420 friendly ship. Most  likely, sometime in the not so distant future, marijuana will be legal on the federal level.

I don't know what the laws are for most ports and also what the laws are for where the ships are registered, these are all things that must be taken into consideration when considering this. And as much as its becoming "main stream" there are a lot of families and older people that would absolutely refuse to sail on these ships. I think they are more likely to get rid of smoking and vaping all together.   

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19 hours ago, RWolver672 said:

 

Let RCI have their mega ships.  For us, the Conquest Class had the right amount of passenger/space ratio.  When they make bigger ships, they just pack way too many passengers on them.

 

I agree.  So far the Conquest Class is the biggest ship I've been on & I loved it.  I do want to try the Dream Class. They can keep the Mardi Gras.  Bigger isn't always better.

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3 hours ago, CoolOne56 said:

 

I agree.  So far the Conquest Class is the biggest ship I've been on & I loved it.  I do want to try the Dream Class. They can keep the Mardi Gras.  Bigger isn't always better.

 

It's interesting that when we sailed on the Dream, with 3646 passengers, it seemed crowded.  On the Horizon with 3960 passengers, it didn't seem as crowded.  They seemed to have spread out the areas a little better on the Horizon.  

 

Our next cruise is on the Mardi Gras with 5282 passengers so that should be interesting to see how the  flow is.

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On 9/23/2019 at 6:27 AM, RWolver672 said:

 

Let RCI have their mega ships.  For us, the Conquest Class had the right amount of passenger/space ratio.  When they make bigger ships, they just pack way too many passengers on them.

We like the Dream Class first, but now with the Conquest Class getting the Italian Rest. in the BBQ area, and Guys BBQ moving outside that deck, we might just agree with you!

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On 9/24/2019 at 12:49 AM, geoffrywillhardt said:

Pretty sure for everyone there is no in between, its either love or hate.

 

I'm in-between on Fantasy. I will almost always choose a different class unless it is exclusive to the itinerary. I'll have a good time regardless

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On 9/23/2019 at 6:27 AM, RWolver672 said:

 

Let RCI have their mega ships.  For us, the Conquest Class had the right amount of passenger/space ratio.  When they make bigger ships, they just pack way too many passengers on them.

 

Since you mentioned the passenger space ratio.

 

The Conquest has a PSR of 31 while the RCI mega ships (Oasis Class) has a PSR of 36.

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On 9/23/2019 at 9:37 AM, rwilk1129 said:

Smaller, non-smoking, without bells and whistles to attract kids out of anywhere in Florida.

 

Have you considered HAL 🙂

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On 9/23/2019 at 6:27 AM, RWolver672 said:

For us, the Conquest Class had the right amount of passenger/space ratio.

Yes, I agree. My recent cruise on the Valor was perfect in terms of spacing! Never had to wait more than 30 seconds for an elevator, despite one not being working the duration of the cruise. Many times, the elevator was there waiting for me, even on sea days. 

1 hour ago, Illbcruzn4life said:

The Conquest has a PSR of 31 while the RCI mega ships (Oasis Class) has a PSR of 36.

I heard that Carnival's Spirit class has an even better PSR.

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2 hours ago, Illbcruzn4life said:

 

Since you mentioned the passenger space ratio.

 

The Conquest has a PSR of 31 while the RCI mega ships (Oasis Class) has a PSR of 36.

 

Seabourn probably has an even better one than RCI.  

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2 hours ago, jbethel11 said:

Yes, I agree. My recent cruise on the Valor was perfect in terms of spacing! Never had to wait more than 30 seconds for an elevator, despite one not being working the duration of the cruise. Many times, the elevator was there waiting for me, even on sea days. 

I heard that Carnival's Spirit class has an even better PSR.

 

yes the Carnival Spirit does have a higher PSR than the Conquest 33.7 but still not as much as the Oasis.🙂

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1 hour ago, RWolver672 said:

 

Seabourn probably has an even better one than RCI.  

 

Oh I thought in your earliest post I quoted you were comparing Conquest to Oasis.

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On 9/23/2019 at 7:18 PM, boomhower said:

A new class similar in size as the Spirit class.  We love sailing out of Tampa and Jacksonville but those ports cannot accept the taller ships.  Would like to see some new ships in that size.  I don't see anything resembling new in Jacksonville but Tampa could support it. 

 

I LOVE the idea of having an XL Spirit class ship! I have often thought this as they have one of the best layouts around ❤️

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I would order a Vista class out of Seattle or Vancouver (or wherever) to do Alaska cruises.

 

I would also order a ship that could sail the Norwegian Fjords (there are special restrictions), but that is only because I want to sail there.

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On 9/25/2019 at 8:57 AM, Illbcruzn4life said:

 

Since you mentioned the passenger space ratio.

 

The Conquest has a PSR of 31 while the RCI mega ships (Oasis Class) has a PSR of 36.

It isn't the passenger space ratio, but more about the design of the ship and the flow of the passengers.  Lots of comments about "let RCI have those Mega ships" etc, but I venture to say most of those pax have probably not been on those Mega ships.  They may hold 6000+ passengers, but are far, far less crowded, for the most part, than any CCL ship. There are many more large and wide open venues for all those passengers to go - separate from each other on different decks etc. You have to learn how to 'time' what you do and where you go on all ships to avoid the masses in the lido etc, but the Vista class on CCL was the most jam packed ship we have ever sailed, and it's ratio was less than RCI's mega ships.....but the design was awful, the venues and placement of them was awful, the atrium was minute was WAY too small for its use and passenger count.  There are many variables other than "passenger to space ratio" numbers to consider (and design of the ship is paramount).

Edited by buddylover

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Bigger is not necessarily better....We like the Spirit Class ships. Great layout and by far, the easiest ones to navigate.  Enlarge the Class a bit, but keep the same basic design. 

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Another vote to replace Fantasy class with a new class of ship. Carnival doesn’t have to come up with anything fancy, just something that is the right size for smaller ports of embarkation like Mobile, and Jacksonville. And if a newbuild isn’t feasible, then do something besides the current cheap patchwork to barely keep these old ships going. Invest some real money to update the current Fantasy class and make them look and feel brand new.

 

I do love Fantasy class ships, but I hate the state of neglect they are in. After our last cruise aboard the Fantasy out of Mobile, my wife and I swore that we would never sail from Mobile until Carnival replaces the Fantasy with a newer ship, or another cruise line comes to town. 

Edited by Tapi

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Another vote in favor is smaller ships.  Since they older, they also keep more of the classic look reminiscent of old ocean liners they were modeled after.  Big ships just don't look inviting, and even a bit intimidating from some angles.  Don't know if it's the bulky size, the lack of a classic look, or the overly utilitarian design, like the missing aft end on RCI's Oasis class ships.  But my opinion still stands.

 

I'd say Destiny was big enough to be "big" while still having an inviting look.  Spirit class ships are nearly perfect, although I'd make them with a classic funnel instead of a flattened one.  Conquest class is on the borderline.  Any bigger, and you lose out on the inviting appearance.

Edited by LandlockedCruiser01

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1 hour ago, LandlockedCruiser01 said:

Another vote in favor is smaller ships.  Since they older, they also keep more of the classic look reminiscent of old ocean liners they were modeled after.  Big ships just don't look inviting, and even a bit intimidating from some angles.  Don't know if it's the bulky size, the lack of a classic look, or the overly utilitarian design, like the missing aft end on RCI's Oasis class ships.  But my opinion still stands.

 

I'd say Destiny was big enough to be "big" while still having an inviting look.  Spirit class ships are nearly perfect, although I'd make them with a classic funnel instead of a flattened one.  Conquest class is on the borderline.  Any bigger, and you lose out on the inviting appearance.

Agreed. So many say they are gawky. I totally disagree. I love getting a cruise ship that is completely nautical. Here are a few pictures of a Royal ship we were on and loved it totally. All our cabin furniture had white piping. Every where on the ship was totally nautical. You felt like you were on a sailing ship. Not a them park excursion.

ship 14.jpg

ship 7 - Copy.jpg

ship 3 - Copy.jpg

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