Grandeur Sold

[SRF]

13 hours ago, goldfish65 said:

Just my $.02, companies must look to the future market, the older demographic who likes "classic cruising" will die off and the younger customers want lots to do and surroundings in the most up-to-date style, generally.

 

Except Lady G has a very loyal following and sails full most of the cruises.

 

And there is a limit to size (therefore "stuff") into Baltimore, due to the bridges.

[rimmit]

3 minutes ago, SRF said:

 

If they get rid off all their smaller ships, and remove Baltimore as a port, it will GREATLY affect my cruising in RCI.

 

I think removing a Baltimore option greatly decreases their brand expansion.   A lot of people I know did their first cruise out of Baltimore.  It’s almost like a loss leader for them.  While they do make money on it,  it’s not really a huge money maker like the newer ships,  but it does get people in the door and introduces them to cruising.

 

13 hours ago, ONECRUISER said:

That's been going on for 30yrs. When I first on Royal back then those that Cruised were called Newlywed, and Nearly Dead. We were 22, and only maybe half dozen younger then us. This on the Brand New Sovereign of the Seas, largest Cruise ship in the World. Was no kids or Teens, not a one. 95% were 40+ But then who could afford it back then, $3600 total for 2 of us in tiny Port Hole Deck 2 cabin. Had to Finance it for 12 months. Now it's cheaper take my Family on a Cruise then week in Orlando

 

Disney is crazy expensive compared to cruising these days.  We do both,  but cruise more and most of my friends are blown away at just how cheap cruising a mass market line can be when I show them the prices.  This pricing is for a family of four.

 

If staying on resort and getting tickets for a week you are looking at at least 3500-4K/ week and that’s off season and we haven’t started talking food and incidentals yet.

[SRF]

10 hours ago, John Reid said:

I think the wording is a smokescreen to obfuscate that it is going to be a major downgrade from the current South Pacific lounge arrangement on Grandeur.

 

Looking at the deck plans, the entire Deck 12 is the D lounge on Enchantment.  So it seems it is actually larger.

 

And the deck plans show it the same size as the combine CL and Viking Crown Lounge on Grandeur.

 

https://www.royalcaribbean.com/cruise-ships/enchantment-of-the-seas/deck-plans/1874/SH

 

Where Giovannis is on Grandeur (or at least part of it), it a Conference Center on Enchantment.  So maybe they will do a dry dock and convert that to a restaurant.

[SRF]

3 minutes ago, rimmit said:

I think removing a Baltimore option greatly decreases their brand expansion.   A lot of people I know did their first cruise out of Baltimore.  It’s almost like a loss leader for them.  While they do make money on it,  it’s not really a huge money maker like the newer ships,  but it does get people in the door and introduces them to cruising.

 

Funny, there are a LOT of people who have MANY cruises on Grandeur.  Out last cruise, the Top Tier event overflowed the theater.  BEYOND standing room only.

 

Those are NOT new cruisers.

 

I will be Diamond after my next cruise (4 points away), and have ONLY cruised on Grandeur.

 

And as mentioned, for those of us in the area, having to fly to take a cruise, greatly increases the cost.  Airline, at least one night hotel to arrive the day before, meals, etc.  And it will affect my planning on whether to cruise, or just fly to an island for a week.

[rimmit]

4 minutes ago, SRF said:

 

Funny, there are a LOT of people who have MANY cruises on Grandeur.  Out last cruise, the Top Tier event overflowed the theater.  BEYOND standing room only.

 

Those are NOT new cruisers.

 

I will be Diamond after my next cruise (4 points away), and have ONLY cruised on Grandeur.

 

And as mentioned, for those of us in the area, having to fly to take a cruise, greatly increases the cost.  Airline, at least one night hotel to arrive the day before, meals, etc.  And it will affect my planning on whether to cruise, or just fly to an island for a week.

 

The grandeur obviously has a massive amount of repeat cruisers per cruise. We are some of them.  Heck my daughter who is 4 is emerald using ONLY her points from her grandeur cruises and makes diamond easily when adding in all the rest.

 

 I am not arguing that it is primarily a newbie boat at all.  I am simply stating that for many who have never cruised before that don’t feel like flying to FL it is an easy option and gets them in the door when they wouldn’t cruise otherwise.  Given it does 5 days Bermuda cruises sometimes as well it can capture the short cruise bachelorette party market introducing many new people to cruising.  My wife just did a quick 5 night girls trip on it.  She was the only one who had cruises before.  The rest are now hooked.  That is 4 more cruisers they didn’t have before just because it was in Baltimore and easy.

 

The grandeur likely has the largest contingent of repeat cruisers just given the occupancy for cruises 1.5 years out.  They are all nearly filled to 80+ percent capacity when they release the bookings.  Those are not new cruisers.

 

i agree 100 percent that it is primarily repeats.  Also the more repeats you get the lower your revenue as repeaters spend less,  thus my “loss leader” comment.

[bowler15547]

15 minutes ago, rimmit said:

While they do make money on it,  it’s not really a huge money maker like the newer ships,  but it does get people in the door and introduces them to cruising.

 

Highly disagree with this. Baltimore has one of the highest percentages of repeat guests. Travel in the winter months and there are well over 1,200 C&A guests, with usually around 500 Diamonds. 

[rimmit]

5 minutes ago, bowler15547 said:

 

Highly disagree with this. Baltimore has one of the highest percentages of repeat guests. Travel in the winter months and there are well over 1,200 C&A guests, with usually around 500 Diamonds. 

 

Please see my above comment.  I explain that I agree 100 percent regarding repeats.  But I stand by the “money making” aspect. Having that many diamonds “myself included” only kills revenue.  Ds and above are less likely to spend the cash that Newbies do.  And it in no way makes the kinda cash the oasis class does.  

 

 

We have been on the grandeur many times and agree it is a primarily repeat cruising population.  Again see above comment so i am not rehashing all my points.  

 

As in the comment directly above your most recent post.

Edited October 17, 2019 by rimmit

[Rewind]

Haven't sailed on Grandeur yet and I don't know if we will be able to make it happen (not enough vacation time and already have two cruises planned next year).  I have sailed out of Baltimore on Enchantment before (sailing immediately after her 2012 dry dock).  She is a good ship and didn't feel crowded to me, but my only comparison at the time was against Monarch the year previous.

 

Enchantment will be a good fit for now and will be replaced again in a few years with something else.  Just be glad that you are within driving distance to a port - we're 8 hours from Baltimore and while it is doable, it requires an extra day on each end plus a hotel stay.

[rimmit]

6 minutes ago, Rewind said:

Haven't sailed on Grandeur yet and I don't know if we will be able to make it happen (not enough vacation time and already have two cruises planned next year).  I have sailed out of Baltimore on Enchantment before (sailing immediately after her 2012 dry dock).  She is a good ship and didn't feel crowded to me, but my only comparison at the time was against Monarch the year previous.

 

Enchantment will be a good fit for now and will be replaced again in a few years with something else.  Just be glad that you are within driving distance to a port - we're 8 hours from Baltimore and while it is doable, it requires an extra day on each end plus a hotel stay.

 

We are 6.5 hours from Baltimore and 10 from Bayonne.  Not ideal but doable.  We drive in the day before and stay in a hotel as well.  We self disembark off the boat in the AM and immediately start driving and typically get home at a reasonable time depending on the number of potty stops my daughter has.

 

we’ve gotten back to KY by 3:30pm before on disembarkation day which leaves us half a day to get stuff done.

Edited October 17, 2019 by rimmit

[Beachammo]

We live in Virginia Beach

 

I find Grandeur more expensive per person per night than similar ships sailing out of Fort Lauderdale, Tampa and Miami. I can fly to FLL/MCO/TPA out of Norfolk, spend the night, and get on a Radiance class ship for a similar price as driving to Baltimore, getting a room, and paying for parking.

 

Plus I'll start my cruise in warm weather.

 

Guess that's the reason I've never been on Grandeur

Edited October 17, 2019 by Beachammo

[John Reid]

1 hour ago, SRF said:

 

Looking at the deck plans, the entire Deck 12 is the D lounge on Enchantment.  So it seems it is actually larger.

 

And the deck plans show it the same size as the combine CL and Viking Crown Lounge on Grandeur.

 

https://www.royalcaribbean.com/cruise-ships/enchantment-of-the-seas/deck-plans/1874/SH

 

Where Giovannis is on Grandeur (or at least part of it), it a Conference Center on Enchantment.  So maybe they will do a dry dock and convert that to a restaurant.

Looking at what is marked as the Diamond Club on the Grandeur map does not account for the entire South Pacific Lounge being used as the club during the "happy hour." And on the 12-days, it is often completely filled. And the Concierge Club up top is in addition.

[John Reid]

21 minutes ago, Beachammo said:

We live in Virginia Beach

 

I find Grandeur more expensive per person per night than similar ships sailing out of Fort Lauderdale, Tampa and Miami. I can fly to FLL/MCO/TPA out of Norfolk, spend the night, and get on a Radiance class ship for a similar price as driving to Baltimore, getting a room, and paying for parking.

 

Plus I'll start my cruise in warm weather.

 

Guess that's the reason I've never been on Grandeur

This is not what I have experienced. Balconies run higher on Grandeur because there are so few. I haven't found the 10-day cruises out of Fort Lauderdale to be that comparable in price. 

Living in Virginia Beach, you could drive to Baltimore the same day. It's the same distance I drive same day to Bayonne.

I'm guessing parking isn't free at the Norfolk airport either.

Yes, one does start in warmer weather, but Grandeur cruises with similar itineraries are longer, more days for the money, and go to the same ports except the ABC islands.

I have never been able to price flying out of BWI to FLL and staying one night equal or less expensive than sailing Grandeur.

[Knighton]

20 hours ago, Another_Critic said:

 

Radiance class fits under the bridge.

I would LOVE to see a radiance class come to baltimore.  I live really close to the port, but I am tired of the ships that have been there forever (Grandeur for awhile, then Enchantment, then back to Grandeur and don't forget Carnival Pride) and I'm totally over the itineraries.  If they gave better resident rates or at least were cheaper it wouldn't be so bad, .  I know Bmore is a more expensive port to sail out of, but been there, done that Bahamas, Bermuda, Grand Turk or Northeast itinerary on those ships.  Multiple times.  (Haven't done the longer ones-to me it's cheaper to fly to Florida and get on a bigger ship with more stuff to do if I want a longer cruise.  Too many at sea days from Baltimore.) At least a different ship would make it more interesting for me to use Baltimore again.

Edited October 17, 2019 by Knighton

[rimmit]

2 hours ago, SRF said:

 

Looking at the deck plans, the entire Deck 12 is the D lounge on Enchantment.  So it seems it is actually larger.

 

And the deck plans show it the same size as the combine CL and Viking Crown Lounge on Grandeur.

 

https://www.royalcaribbean.com/cruise-ships/enchantment-of-the-seas/deck-plans/1874/SH

 

Where Giovannis is on Grandeur (or at least part of it), it a Conference Center on Enchantment.  So maybe they will do a dry dock and convert that to a restaurant.

 

Deck 12 is not much.  I can assure you having been in both the DL on the Enchantment is a noticeable downgrade without an overflow area to absorb.  It worked well on the 3-4 night cruises as there didn’t seem to be as many Ds but the grandeur runs a very highly d population and it’s gonna strain that small area tremendously.

[FLACRUISER99]

1 hour ago, rimmit said:

 

Deck 12 is not much.  I can assure you having been in both the DL on the Enchantment is a noticeable downgrade without an overflow area to absorb.  It worked well on the 3-4 night cruises as there didn’t seem to be as many Ds but the grandeur runs a very highly d population and it’s gonna strain that small area tremendously.

I have seen deck 11 VCL used as the DL overflow.

[John&LaLa]

9 hours ago, Saab4444 said:

Older ships might be much more expensive to operate but they are more amortized so the total costs might still be ok. Look at MS Europa (30 years old) or MS Artania (over 40 years old), both look excellent from the inside and outside, they go into long dry docks at least every two years and their companies are very profitable.       

 

Just because they are older,  doesn't mean they haven't re-financed them every chance they get.

 

I'm certain they carry debt load.  It's just good business 

[John&LaLa]

2 hours ago, John Reid said:

Looking at what is marked as the Diamond Club on the Grandeur map does not account for the entire South Pacific Lounge being used as the club during the "happy hour." And on the 12-days, it is often completely filled. And the Concierge Club up top is in addition.

 

Enchantment did overflow into the VCL when she was in PC. Worked very well since both lounges are up there

[smalltimecruiser100]

On 10/16/2019 at 10:35 AM, OACAggie said:

I didn't know Enchantment was in Baltimore before. When was that?

We were on it in spring 2012 , 5 night Bermuda. I would like to see a 12 night to the ABC islands

[John&LaLa]

2 hours ago, Beachammo said:

We live in Virginia Beach

 

I find Grandeur more expensive per person per night than similar ships sailing out of Fort Lauderdale, Tampa and Miami. I can fly to FLL/MCO/TPA out of Norfolk, spend the night, and get on a Radiance class ship for a similar price as driving to Baltimore, getting a room, and paying for parking.

 

Plus I'll start my cruise in warm weather.

 

Guess that's the reason I've never been on Grandeur

 

We should do a northeast cruise next fall.

[Clarea]

1 minute ago, smalltimecruiser100 said:

We were on it in spring 2012 , 5 night Bermuda. I would like to see a 12 night to the ABC islands

 

That would be a excellent itinerary out of Baltimore.

[rimmit]

26 minutes ago, FLACRUISER99 said:

I have seen deck 11 VCL used as the DL overflow.

 

It can definitely and has been used as overflow.  I guess a better way of putting it is a “convenient”

overflow.  No one wants to be on that ramp and have a drink.  You can walk out of the grandeur DL and sit down immediately.  It’s nice and connected.  There is quite a distance between deck 12 and 11 when carrying a drink and hors d’œuvres.

 

Is it “that” far?  Not really but it’s just so easy on the grandeur as they are right next to each other rather than some long ramp to get up to deck 12.

Edited October 17, 2019 by rimmit

[SRF]

58 minutes ago, John&LaLa said:

 

We should do a northeast cruise next fall.

 

We are looking at doing that.

 

We booked a July cruise, but somethings have changed, and that timeframe is not great.

 

So maybe a Sept NE cruise.

 

And have to see what we can do about our now canceled April 2021 cruise.

[FLACRUISER99]

51 minutes ago, rimmit said:

 

It can definitely and has been used as overflow.  I guess a better way of putting it is a “convenient”

overflow.  No one wants to be on that ramp and have a drink.  You can walk out of the grandeur DL and sit down immediately.  It’s nice and connected.  There is quite a distance between deck 12 and 11 when carrying a drink and hors d’œuvres.

 

Is it “that” far?  Not really but it’s just so easy on the grandeur as they are right next to each other rather than some long ramp to get up to deck 12.

Have also seen a bar & hors d’œuvres set up on 11.

[SRF]

59 minutes ago, Host Clarea said:

 

That would be a excellent itinerary out of Baltimore.

 

That would be a lot of sea days.

 

The current 12 night is 3 sea days to VI.  And 3 sea days back.

 

[Clarea]

2 minutes ago, SRF said:

 

That would be a lot of sea days.

 

The current 12 night is 3 sea days to VI.  And 3 sea days back.

 

 

Just what we love.🙂