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Does the crew know we've pre-paid gratuities?


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12 minutes ago, Sam Ting said:

We always remove this optional fee and tip as we go.  How the cruiseline convinced passengers to donate to their billion dollar company so it can pay its employees is beyond me. 

The same way that restaurants, bars, hair and nail salons, hotels, and other industries do it. No it's not automatic in all those cases, but it's certainly expected and I know that it's gone from an expectation of 15% not that long ago to 20% today. 

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10 minutes ago, Elsie26 said:

The same way that restaurants, bars, hair and nail salons, hotels, and other industries do it. No it's not automatic in all those cases, but it's certainly expected and I know that it's gone from an expectation of 15% not that long ago to 20% today. 

It’s expected you leave tips for the people who serve you directly, not to be given to the owners do do as they wish. 

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35 minutes ago, Sam Ting said:

It’s expected you leave tips for the people who serve you directly, not to be given to the owners do do as they wish. 

When you pay a tip at a restaurant onto a credit card, are you not giving it to the owner to distribute?

 

Anyway, a publicly traded corporation like RC gets independently audited.  With almost all pax transactions done electronically, I doubt that RC is secretly stealing tips rather than funneling them to the crew as claimed. With thousands and thousands of potential clients in the mix, law firms would love to hear any evidence for your suspicions. Even the minimal protections crew members have do not allow rampant and organized theft.

Edited by mayleeman
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4 minutes ago, Sam Ting said:

It’s expected you leave tips for the people who serve you directly, not to be given to the owners do do as they wish

 

My career is in food and beverage and I can tell you it is a widespread practice for the last 20 years that I can attest, that to tips go the owners whose computers crunch the numbers as they deem appropriate to pay a variety of positions. Where I work these monies go into a pool because the dining room staff all works together.  And that includes cash because we report that to the owners and the computer is programmed to work it all out accordingly. Then it goes to payroll were taxes and other deductions are made and we get our paycheck every two weeks.

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If you can’t afford - or don’t want to pay - the usual (i.e. typical, standard, whatever you want to call it) tip for whatever service you’re partaking in, then you should not be booking that service. 

 

This is different than deciding that the service was sub-par. A decision like that would come *after* the service was rendered. People removing gratuities ahead of time on a cruise and consistently tipping less than the standard amount? That’s a pretty terrible behavior, because those folks have decided in advance. And not only that, but they seem to be twisting themselves in knots to justify their behavior. Again, can’t (or don’t want to) afford it? Then don’t. But don’t punish the ones who are making the least money out of the whole corporation. Jeez.  

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50 minutes ago, Sam Ting said:

It’s expected you leave tips for the people who serve you directly, not to be given to the owners do do as they wish. 

 

    This is why I want fares to be increased by whatever amount cruise lines need to wages and not rely on service charge.

Then whoever wants to tip a bit extra  can do just that.

   

      I do not agree about "squealing" part in your previous post though. I do not want to wait till the end of the week to pay less in gratuities to my room steward (use it as a reason to save). If he is not servicing me right and my cabin is not done by 12-1pm daily, I do not want to chase him down and beg to do this. It is a responsibility of manager of housekeeping. I can probably get by for 1 day, but on the second I will definitely give his manager a call.

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4 minutes ago, Leeba25 said:

 People removing gratuities ahead of time on a cruise and consistently tipping less than the standard amount? That’s a pretty terrible behavior, because those folks have decided in advance. And not only that, but they seem to be twisting themselves in knots to justify their behavior. Again, can’t (or don’t want to) afford it? Then don’t. But don’t punish the ones who are making the least money out of the whole corporation. Jeez.  

 

 You bet. Majority of them yes, many of them do not tip at all.

 We cruise a lot (about 5-6 times a year) and hear all types of stories.

 Some are proud that they can afford balconies or even cruise because they can save on tips.

 

 They know that while majority is not removing autogratuities  they will continue getting a free ride.

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1 hour ago, Sam Ting said:

We would never jeopardize someone’s livelihood by squealing on them just because they are having a bad day or week.  Our pay as you go tipping is adjusted based on service received.  

Exactly as it should be...pay gratuities based on the service received, don't join the sheeple and contribute because you feel sorry for workers.  That's just charity.  Many posters here don't know the difference.

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16 minutes ago, ladybug.2009 said:

Exactly as it should be...pay gratuities based on the service received, don't join the sheeple and contribute because you feel sorry for workers.  That's just charity.  Many posters here don't know the difference.

 

Maybe a little bit of charity in the motivation...and that is bad? Good thing we have cruisers willing to stand up and hold the the line against ungodly charity! Let's see, I guess faith and love will have to abideth by themselves.

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The roughly $15/day standard grat goes to dining staff who spend 1+ hour with you each day and cabin steward who does your room twice daily.  

 

The grat on bev package also runs about $15/day and goes to bartender who maybe spends 10 minutes making you a few cocktails.

 

Unless I'm missing something I'd rather be a bartender.

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In the old days, I gave an envelope filled with the suggested tip.  Maybe I put a little extra in it.  It was common knowledge back than that the crew back-tipped other crew to help them or get things done.  It's a different society behind closed doors that is one that I don't care about.  Jump forward, you can charge your tips (prepay) them and be done with it.  I just don't care once it leaves my hands who gets the tip, how it is split.  It's no longer my business.  I don't care how much money they make, how small their living quarters are, what they eat for lunch, or what free time they get.  They have choices, and it's none of my business to speculate, or figure out. 

 

If you tip cash, there is still an accepted process behind the scenes that handles cash tips and the distribution of them.  What you think does not happen.  If you ask a person, they have a special book of "stories" that they choose from to convince you to tip more.  Most crew sees to have 10 kids, and a house falling over.  Whenever you ask a crew member a "personal question" the book comes out and they give you the sad story answer. They are pretty good at it.  

 

Prepay the tips, consider it part of your vacation cost and just enjoy. 

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10 minutes ago, Joseph2017China said:

In the old days, I gave an envelope filled with the suggested tip.  Maybe I put a little extra in it.  It was common knowledge back than that the crew back-tipped other crew to help them or get things done.  It's a different society behind closed doors that is one that I don't care about.  Jump forward, you can charge your tips (prepay) them and be done with it.  I just don't care once it leaves my hands who gets the tip, how it is split.  It's no longer my business.  I don't care how much money they make, how small their living quarters are, what they eat for lunch, or what free time they get.  They have choices, and it's none of my business to speculate, or figure out. 

 

If you tip cash, there is still an accepted process behind the scenes that handles cash tips and the distribution of them.  What you think does not happen.  If you ask a person, they have a special book of "stories" that they choose from to convince you to tip more.  Most crew sees to have 10 kids, and a house falling over.  Whenever you ask a crew member a "personal question" the book comes out and they give you the sad story answer. They are pretty good at it.  

 

Prepay the tips, consider it part of your vacation cost and just enjoy. 

 

Well said.

 

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55 minutes ago, ladybug.2009 said:

Many posters here don't know the difference.

What I know is that the people behind the scenes are often the ones working the hardest. Earlier in my career, I had a couple  of bosses who had no problem taking the credit for my ideas and hard work. When they got big bonuses, they didn't share them with me. In both cases these bosses left the company before I did and people finally recognized my contribution. That bartender couldn't do his job if the maintenance guy didn't keep the ice machine working, or if the purchasing department didn't do the inventory, or the dishwashers didn't provide clean glasses, shakers, etc., sometimes working long into the night to make sure customer service doesn't suffer. 
 

You do you and I'll do me, but at the end of the day, I know that $200 and whatever tips I decide to give out above that won't make or break me and could make a huge difference to that person. 

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32 minutes ago, Joseph2017China said:

  If you ask a person, they have a special book of "stories" that they choose from to convince you to tip more.  Most crew sees to have 10 kids, and a house falling over.  Whenever you ask a crew member a "personal question" the book comes out and they give you the sad story answer. They are pretty good at it.

 

 This is what we never do. I think it is strange to do. Personally I think it is a bit of invasion of privacy... and they feel it and play the same game. Do we ask our servers in US based restaurants about their living situation? 🙂  

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23 minutes ago, Elsie26 said:

What I know is that the people behind the scenes are often the ones working the hardest.

 

Yes they are. And before autogratuities they were making very little money.

 Waiters would probably split some of cash gratuities with kitchen stuff to get orders faster, but there are people cleaning general areas, doing laundry. They used to get $450-500 a month. Now with collected gratis they make $1200 or so. 

 

 This is why I think it is a good system to collect and distribute money more fair, but to avoid losing part of money because of "smart" removals of autogratuities lines would be better off including what they need to pay in common fare. Then whatever is paid on top in cash to most deserved can still be paid.

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10 minutes ago, Tatka said:

 

Yes they are. And before autogratuities they were making very little money.

 Waiters would probably split some of cash gratuities with kitchen stuff to get orders faster, but there are people cleaning general areas, doing laundry. They used to get $450-500 a month. Now with collected gratis they make $1200 or so. 

 

 This is why I think it is a good system to collect and distribute money more fair, but to avoid losing part of money because of "smart" removals of autogratuities lines would be better off including what they need to pay in common fare. Then whatever is paid on top in cash to most deserved can still be paid.

If you believe that to be true, keep tipping that way!   It is your money, spend it any way you like.  We will continue to give cash and remove auto gratuities.   Royal is just fine with either way of tipping. 

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10 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

I gotta ask, where's @Thorben-Hendrik? I mean, the entertainment in a tipping thread does come alive until he chimes in. 

 

 

I was wondering the same thing. Is he in CC jail or worse, been exiled?  I can imagine he'd write something like this:

 

"Why do sappy Americans fall so much in love with the crew and treat them like family members? They are getting paid to do a job that they voluntary applied for and will forget all about you 2 seconds after you step off the ship. Don't be sucked by any sad stories they tell"🙄😜😱🤪

 

Or something like that.

 

In my opinion.

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14 minutes ago, springfire said:

If you believe that to be true, keep tipping that way!   It is your money, spend it any way you like.  We will continue to give cash and remove auto gratuities.   Royal is just fine with either way of tipping. 

 

They are fine because majority is not removing.

 Majority of those who removing paying less if anything.

Because of that I am for rolling whatever is collected now as autogratuities into fare. 🙂

Whoever wants to pay more to deserving will pay.

Edited by Tatka
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3 hours ago, mayleeman said:

When you pay a tip at a restaurant onto a credit card, are you not giving it to the owner to distribute?

 

Anyway, a publicly traded corporation like RC gets independently audited.  With almost all pax transactions done electronically, I doubt that RC is secretly stealing tips rather than funneling them to the crew as claimed. With thousands and thousands of potential clients in the mix, law firms would love to hear any evidence for your suspicions. Even the minimal protections crew members have do not allow rampant and organized theft.

 

Enron was independently audited.  Doesn't mean there are no shenanigans going on.  I can't imagine non U.S. citizens are going to go through the trouble of hiring lawyers to get tips if they are being stiffed, and their winnings would go to lawyers anyway instead of them.  I am not accusing RCI of anything wrong, but it could happen... I do pay the automatic tip just for convenience.

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Twenty years ago, we all got envelopes addressed to the various individuals slated by the cruise line, for a tip. Into these envelopes went the suggested amount in cash. We would then distribute said envelopes on the last night of the cruise. I was always surprised by how empty the dinning room was on the last evening. It was eerily quiet in there. More empty tables than full. Then came auto gratuities. Business in the dinning room picked up on the last night, not ten to twenty minute wait busy like it had been all cruise, but almost full capacity. But the line at the customer service counter was huge! Then it dawned on me - people were lining up to remove their tips. 

 

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1 hour ago, Elsie26 said:

You do you and I'll do me, but at the end of the day, I know that $200 and whatever tips I decide to give out above that won't make or break me and could make a huge difference to that person. 

You proved my point exactly.

If you're giving them money because you think it 'could make a huge difference to that person' that's charity!!  If you can afford it, why not give them $300?  or $500?  or put their poor kid thru college?  Yeah, didn't think so.

 

It shouldn't matter who the person is, where you are, or what the job title is, all that matters is how they did that job, and how much you want to pay in tip for that service.

 

You let emotion enter into what is a purely economical equation, and that's wrong.

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