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MisterBill99

Did they fix Nieuw Amsterdam's azipod or is she sailing with one operational?

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First of all - Fatcat, it sounds like you are off to a great start in 4166 and enjoying that big balcony! We enjoyed it back in December!

Having said that, I would like to indulge in a bit of speculation. If you don’t want to read that sort of thing, stop reading now....

Another thread mentioned that there is a large group sailing with them on the NA on the Jan 11 cruise. So I popped over to the CC thread that lists charters, groups and dry docks. Looks like NA is chartered for the Jan 18 and 25 cruises, as well as the Mar 7 cruise.  Also, there are large groups sailing on Jan 11, Feb 8, Feb 22, and Feb 29, Mar 14 and Mar 28.  So IF HAL is trying to schedule the azipod repair for February as suggested at the Captain’s talk, that only leaves Feb 1 or 15 cruises without large groups or charters. Just a thought and sorry to indulge in speculation, but that’s all the info HAL is providing at this point.  It’s baffling to me why they are withholding this info. I just checked, and all February cruises are still available to be booked on their website?? What a mess. I really feel for those with an upcoming booking. I know these things can’t be helped and mechanical things do break, but I can’t help feeling they are handling this very poorly.

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Excellent analysis from sp2. Now some psychology 101. What are our normal human nature choices when we know that we need to do something that we would rather not do. We either do it right away to get it over with, or, we put it off as long as we can. Looks like the latter to me. I still think March 28. 

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Yes, and I'm booked on the March 28th.  Nothing coming up after that appeals - Veendam is not a consideration for me at this time, and the Nieuw Statendam cruises will be overrun with kids once we get to April/Easter season.  Plus, my 2 subsequent cruises are both on Nieuw Statendam, so for this cruise I am looking forward to a slightly smaller ship.  We'll see - whatever HAL does, I hope they don't make it a last minute announcement!

 

Sue/WDW1972

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4 hours ago, sp2 said:

First of all - Fatcat, it sounds like you are off to a great start in 4166 and enjoying that big balcony! We enjoyed it back in December!

Having said that, I would like to indulge in a bit of speculation. If you don’t want to read that sort of thing, stop reading now....

Another thread mentioned that there is a large group sailing with them on the NA on the Jan 11 cruise. So I popped over to the CC thread that lists charters, groups and dry docks. Looks like NA is chartered for the Jan 18 and 25 cruises, as well as the Mar 7 cruise.  Also, there are large groups sailing on Jan 11, Feb 8, Feb 22, and Feb 29, Mar 14 and Mar 28.  So IF HAL is trying to schedule the azipod repair for February as suggested at the Captain’s talk, that only leaves Feb 1 or 15 cruises without large groups or charters. Just a thought and sorry to indulge in speculation, but that’s all the info HAL is providing at this point.  It’s baffling to me why they are withholding this info. I just checked, and all February cruises are still available to be booked on their website?? What a mess. I really feel for those with an upcoming booking. I know these things can’t be helped and mechanical things do break, but I can’t help feeling they are handling this very poorly.

 

Thank you for your concise analysis. I came to the same conclusion when I observed the following: a. January 18 - Soul Train Charter, b. January 25- Country Music Charter. I was not aware of the Feb. 8 sailing but cabins are still open for purchase. As you pointed out, That leaves February 1 or 15. We are on the Feb. 15 sailing and are doing a back to back with Celebrity. Idf this isn't going to work out on Celebrity, just release me. I could even stay on the same Celebrity ship . 

 

A mess but hopefully we will zig when others are zagging. 

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4 hours ago, sp2 said:

First of all - Fatcat, it sounds like you are off to a great start in 4166 and enjoying that big balcony! We enjoyed it back in December!

Having said that, I would like to indulge in a bit of speculation. If you don’t want to read that sort of thing, stop reading now....

Another thread mentioned that there is a large group sailing with them on the NA on the Jan 11 cruise. So I popped over to the CC thread that lists charters, groups and dry docks. Looks like NA is chartered for the Jan 18 and 25 cruises, as well as the Mar 7 cruise.  Also, there are large groups sailing on Jan 11, Feb 8, Feb 22, and Feb 29, Mar 14 and Mar 28.  So IF HAL is trying to schedule the azipod repair for February as suggested at the Captain’s talk, that only leaves Feb 1 or 15 cruises without large groups or charters. Just a thought and sorry to indulge in speculation, but that’s all the info HAL is providing at this point.  It’s baffling to me why they are withholding this info. I just checked, and all February cruises are still available to be booked on their website?? What a mess. I really feel for those with an upcoming booking. I know these things can’t be helped and mechanical things do break, but I can’t help feeling they are handling this very poorly.

Any idea what the group on Feb 29th is?

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4 minutes ago, Fredric22 said:

Any idea what the group on Feb 29th is?

 

29 February 2020 – 06 March 2020 : Caribbean : Phillips, Craig & Dean/Inspiration Group

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10 hours ago, sp2 said:

First of all - Fatcat, it sounds like you are off to a great start in 4166 and enjoying that big balcony! We enjoyed it back in December!

Having said that, I would like to indulge in a bit of speculation. If you don’t want to read that sort of thing, stop reading now....

Another thread mentioned that there is a large group sailing with them on the NA on the Jan 11 cruise. So I popped over to the CC thread that lists charters, groups and dry docks. Looks like NA is chartered for the Jan 18 and 25 cruises, as well as the Mar 7 cruise.  Also, there are large groups sailing on Jan 11, Feb 8, Feb 22, and Feb 29, Mar 14 and Mar 28.  So IF HAL is trying to schedule the azipod repair for February as suggested at the Captain’s talk, that only leaves Feb 1 or 15 cruises without large groups or charters. Just a thought and sorry to indulge in speculation, but that’s all the info HAL is providing at this point.  It’s baffling to me why they are withholding this info. I just checked, and all February cruises are still available to be booked on their website?? What a mess. I really feel for those with an upcoming booking. I know these things can’t be helped and mechanical things do break, but I can’t help feeling they are handling this very poorly.

I am trying to understand the logic.  Lets assume that every cruise is full (or near full).  Whether it is full of one group or simply lots of individuals...what difference does it make?  

 

As to replacing an adizpod, one major drydock facility in Freeport was seriously damaged in last Fall's hurricane and knocked out of commission.  This created a difficult situation where some scheduled maintenance of cruise ships had to be postponed or cancelled.  HAL cannot simply choose the dates they want for a drydock.  Much depends on the availability and the cruise line has to take what is available.  In a simple sense, beggars cannot be choosy.   The facility in Freeport is heavily booked several years in advance so finding an available drydock facility is one of those situations where the cruise line must take what they can get.

 

Hank

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**I am speculating only**. I would think it is more difficult for HAL to cancel a large group that has been, perhaps, heavily promoted to a particular target market by the organizers, special on-board events planned for that group, special guests, speakers, and entertainers perhaps booked by the organizers for that particular week.  These cruisers may have paid a premium over what others have paid for the same cruise, although it may not all have been paid to HAL (some would have perhaps gone to the organizers to defray costs like booking the entertainment). It may be difficult for organizers to refund those costs to clients if a cruise is cancelled by HAL. They would also be disappointing a group of customers which were perhaps  not particularly loyal to HAL, and they might lose the potential for those customers as repeat customers. Again, it’s only a theory; I have no inside info.
 

I agree that it must be difficult and take planning to find dry dock space, as I would imagine it gets booked up in advance. That’s why I find it hard to believe they don’t have it already on the schedule at the dry dock. The captain said it will happen in Freeport in February, according to another poster who was at last week’s Captain’s talk. So why can’t they communicate the date as early as possible to their clients who will be affected, so they know what’s happening? It’s not like they are going to just drop in for an oil change. That was the point I was making.

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Call me crazy, but I just booked the February 1st cruise. We will see how this plays out!

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19 minutes ago, sp2 said:

I agree that it must be difficult and take planning to find dry dock space, as I would imagine it gets booked up in advance. That’s why I find it hard to believe they don’t have it already on the schedule at the dry dock. The captain said it will happen in Freeport in February, according to another poster who was at last week’s Captain’s talk. So why can’t they communicate the date as early as possible to their clients who will be affected, so they know what’s happening? It’s not like they are going to just drop in for an oil change. That was the point I was making.

It's my experience that scheduled drydockings can slip some, either ending late or early, so there is always a bit of uncertainty in the schedule.  And since Carnival owns a large part of the shipyard, they can decide if it is possible to add workers and shifts to get a particular ship out early, so that it creates a short window for an emergency docking.  They can also negotiate with the scheduled clients (most of whom are not cruise ships) to see if their ship's schedule could afford a few day delay for which te yard could give a discount.  Given all of this, and the short nature of cruises (most are 7 days or less), I think HAL does not want to tell people a particular week is cancelled, when it might not come to pass (scheduled docking runs late, or they can't create the window they hoped for).

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8 hours ago, Hlitner said:

I am trying to understand the logic.  Lets assume that every cruise is full (or near full).  Whether it is full of one group or simply lots of individuals...what difference does it make?  

 

As to replacing an adizpod, one major drydock facility in Freeport was seriously damaged in last Fall's hurricane and knocked out of commission.  This created a difficult situation where some scheduled maintenance of cruise ships had to be postponed or cancelled.  HAL cannot simply choose the dates they want for a drydock.  Much depends on the availability and the cruise line has to take what is available.  In a simple sense, beggars cannot be choosy.   The facility in Freeport is heavily booked several years in advance so finding an available drydock facility is one of those situations where the cruise line must take what they can get.

 

Hank

 

A large group would make a difference, as everyone in the group would want to be rebooked to the same cruise. Individuals will scatter. That said, we don't know the size of the group bookings, so it's difficult to know how much of a factor a group booking would be. I agree with you that the availability of a drydock slot is the bigger issue.

 

All we can do is wait for HAL to make an announcement.

 

 

 

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15 hours ago, *Miss G* said:

 

29 February 2020 – 06 March 2020 : Caribbean : Phillips, Craig & Dean/Inspiration Group

Thanks!  Any idea how big these groups are?  I am hoping it doesn't really affect our cruise/entertainment? 

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38 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

A large group would make a difference, as everyone in the group would want to be rebooked to the same cruise. Individuals will scatter. That said, we don't know the size of the group bookings, so it's difficult to know how much of a factor a group booking would be. I agree with you that the availability of a drydock slot is the bigger issue.

 

All we can do is wait for HAL to make an announcement.

 

 

 

I see your point about the groups.  But the dry dock situation will likely rule the roost.  If the ship were in Europe there would be more drydock options but in the Caribbean the options are very limited.  Nobody wants to hear it, but the cruise line is as much a victim as the passengers.   Whether the breakdown was just one of those things, or related to substandard maintenance is something we will likely never know.  But assuming that the cruise line followed all the manufacturers required maintenance then it is fate.  

 

Hank

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My question is are their spare azipods sitting in storage or do they have to be ordered and manufactured?

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Got into Grand Turk on time this am. Smooth ride last night and this am despite rain rain rain. So the weather outside is frightful but the ship is so delightful.

Waiting for Dive In to open. Need my fix. 

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41 minutes ago, aliaschief said:

My question is are their spare azipods sitting in storage or do they have to be ordered and manufactured?

It is not a complete azipod that normally needs to be replaced, it is a "cartridge" that contains the propeller shaft, shaft thrust bearing, and shaft seal assembly.  During normal drydock operations, these cartridges are removed from the azipods on the ship, and spare ones installed.  The removed cartridge is then overhauled and kept in spare for the next ship.

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Good points as always from chengkp75. Let me ask a question ….what if it is the propulsion motor inside the pod that has failed, for one reason or another? How would a propulsion motor be replaced? Maybe that is why the Captain implied that the entire starboard azipod unit would need to be removed and replaced.

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7 minutes ago, NavArch64 said:

Good points as always from chengkp75. Let me ask a question ….what if it is the propulsion motor inside the pod that has failed, for one reason or another? How would a propulsion motor be replaced? Maybe that is why the Captain implied that the entire starboard azipod unit would need to be removed and replaced.

Not typically.  When the shaft cartridge is out, the motor stator can be drawn out the end of the azipod.

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To HamOp …. thank you for the fabulous video from ABB. I am still always learning. I am impressed with the details of the assembly … not much room for error. Doing this all in reverse in Freeport for Nieuw Amsterdam's starboard azipod unit is a challenge to say the least. Not to mention reassembling with repaired components (whatever they may be) and getting it perfect.

Then testing at sea to make sure before guests embark.

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2 minutes ago, NavArch64 said:

To HamOp …. thank you for the fabulous video from ABB. I am still always learning. I am impressed with the details of the assembly … not much room for error. Doing this all in reverse in Freeport for Nieuw Amsterdam's starboard azipod unit is a challenge to say the least. Not to mention reassembling with repaired components (whatever they may be) and getting it perfect.

Then testing at sea to make sure before guests embark.

You're most welcome.  I found it very interesting and educational as well.

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A follow-up question to chengkp75 after viewing the ABB azipod assembly video … how do you get the stator out of the pod housing if it was shrink fit during assembly in the factory? Sounds difficult at best in a repair shipyard environment.

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, NavArch64 said:

A follow-up question to chengkp75 after viewing the ABB azipod assembly video … how do you get the stator out of the pod housing if it was shrink fit during assembly in the factory? Sounds difficult at best in a repair shipyard environment.

That all depends on the actual shrink fit tolerance, and from the video there weren't any thermal blankets or the like, so I believe it is a fairly small interference, which can be overcome using heat coils and blankets and hydraulic presses.  I would suspect that tenting the azipod, and using kerosene blast heaters to heat the pod body, while leaving the stator at ambient temperature (especially in winter) would be enough.  I've had problems with interference fits where one part was at outside temperature, and the other was at indoor temperature, so that we had to let them both sit inside for a couple days to get the mass to the right temperature.  Again, getting the coils out would require cooling blankets (refrigerated) inside and heat on the body.  These kinds of repairs are thought out during design of the machinery, so any special equipment, jigs, tools, etc are produced when the first units come on line for future repairs in the field.

 

The process for stator removal would be the same, regardless of whether it is hanging under a ship in a drydock, or in the manufacturer's shop, it's just that the shop repair would most likely be done vertically as shown in the video, while the field repair is done horizontally.  Just requires more special equipment.

Edited by chengkp75

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