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News on the Westerdam

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Darwin is presently holding Australian residents flown in from China.  It does not have a facility capable of holding the number of passengers presently on the MS Westerdam.  Like the US Government, Australia is only repatriating its own residents at this point in time.  There is still no way of knowing if Westerdam is really free of the virus.

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On 2/7/2020 at 6:46 AM, Btimmer said:

That can be a real challenge since most of us can only get a maximum of 90 days supply.  I've been on a 79 day voyage with a land component at the end and had very few pills left when arriving at home.

 

We also have the 90 day program for medications.

 

BUT -- there were a couple of times when I knew that we would run out of pills on a cruise.  Our drug store will give us the extra pills we need -- they keep track of what has been "borrowed" from future refills.  Nice to know the people who work in the drug stores.

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38 minutes ago, Krazy Kruizers said:

 

We also have the 90 day program for medications.

 

BUT -- there were a couple of times when I knew that we would run out of pills on a cruise.  Our drug store will give us the extra pills we need -- they keep track of what has been "borrowed" from future refills.  Nice to know the people who work in the drug stores.

I, too, do the same thing.  I'll also only renew for a 30 or 60 day supply before a cruise so that the 90 days occurs just before we depart.  My insurance company will also give me an occasional 'vacation' over-ride.

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36 minutes ago, Btimmer said:

I, too, do the same thing.  I'll also only renew for a 30 or 60 day supply before a cruise so that the 90 days occurs just before we depart.  My insurance company will also give me an occasional 'vacation' over-ride.

 

Our drug store doesn't even notify our insurance company.  They just mark it on our records how many pills they borrowed.

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6 minutes ago, Krazy Kruizers said:

 

Our drug store doesn't even notify our insurance company.  They just mark it on our records how many pills they borrowed.

Ours has to notify the insurance company for every fill or refill.

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This new story indicates Thai social media users went nuts after HAL announced the Westerdam would go to Bangkok, so it seems political pressure came into play in Thailand's reversal. HAL had said earlier there was another port possibility, so incredibly, the best thing might be to keep it quiet and slip in under cover of night. A real mystery cruise.

 

Thailand yields to virus fears, bars docking of cruise ship
Associated Press 
Feb. 11, 2020 at 6:19 a.m. EST


BANGKOK — Thai health authorities have barred a cruise ship from docking that has already been turned away by the Philippines, Taiwan and Japan out of concern over a new virus, although no cases have been confirmed on board.

 

The chief of the Department of Disease Control, Suwanchai Wattanayingcharoenchai, said Tuesday that the Public Health Ministry had rejected a request from the crew of the MS Westerdam to dock at Laem Chabang in eastern Thailand.

 

He said the ministry will further consider how to deal with the ship’s situation. It began its cruise on Jan. 16 in Singapore. Shipowner Holland America Line says there are no known cases of the virus on board.

 

The virus has caused problems for the cruise industry. Japan’s health ministry has confirmed 135 cases of the disease aboard Carnival Corp.’s Diamond Princess, which is docked in Yokohama, Japan. The ship’s 3,700 passengers and crew are expected to remain under quarantine until at least Feb. 19.

 

Thai Public Health Minister Anutin Charnvirakulhad indicated on his Facebook page several hours before the official announcement that the ship would be denied entry.

 

He posted his declaration after Holland America announced it was sailing to Laem Chabang, where passengers would disembark on Feb. 13 to take flights home from Bangkok. The announcement by the shipowner attracted much attention among Thai social media users.

 

Holland America had already announced that passengers would receive a complete refund. It said a scheduled

departure of the Westerdam on Feb. 15 from Yokohama had been canceled and planned departures after Feb. 28 were being assessed.

 

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Currently in the press in the Netherlands (translated directly via GoogleTranslate);

 

 

The Netherlands is looking for a solution for the Westerdam cruise ship, which wanders around in Asian waters for fear of the new corona virus. The contacts are at diplomatic and political level, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs reports. The Holland-Amerika Lijn shipping line itself is also working on a solution for the cruise ship that is not allowed to dock in Thailand, for fear of spreading the new corona virus. Earlier permission to moor was withdrawn today. The Westerdam sails under the Dutch flag, but belongs to the American shipping company Holland-America Line. The Netherlands is therefore also working with the United States. There would be more than ninety Dutch people on board, among whom the frustration struck.

Edited by Alphen

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Latest Dutch news is that three people on board were suspected of having the virus.  All were tested,  and the tests came out negative.  Dutch Ministry for Foreign Affairs is working on a diplomatic and political level to resolve this matter.

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17 minutes ago, Lunar Dragon said:

Latest Dutch news is that three people on board were suspected of having the virus.  All were tested,  and the tests came out negative.  Dutch Ministry for Foreign Affairs is working on a diplomatic and political level to resolve this matter.

Given that testing requires sophisticated facilities not available on board, there can be no conclusive "negative" finding. It's possible that people who were ill, perhaps with a fever or other symptoms, have recovered but that means nothing. It could be they had something else, it could be that they had a mild case and recovered (but were still infectious and have infected others who have yet to show symptoms because of the extended incubation period) or something else.

Edited by voyageur9
typos

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The common cold and cruise cough is on most ships .How wouldone know if its just a cold or something more serious ?poor Westerdam passengers on this cruise to nowhere .I feel so sorry for them ...i think this whole thing is out of control 

why are cruise companiesstill inthe region ..cancel all.get your people out of there 

thisthing will get worse before better 

you could notpay me to take a cruise anywhere at this time ...too littlereal info available ....

if you have an Asian cruise plan ...cancel ...afew bucks out ofpocket is better than losing a life 

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The big problem is in the nature of this disease. Apparently, 12% of patients get pneumonia. So it is a dangerous disease.

 

Unfortunately, the disease manifests itself in 80% of the patients only as a minor cold. Only a medical test can determine if someone is infectious.

 

So, the safest way to end the quarantine of the Diamond Princess is to test everyone.

 

Similarly, all cruise passengers on the stranded ships need to be tested. This is something that governments are reluctant to undertake. Hence, the ping pong.

 

The upside is that the rest of us are being protected. The small number of confirmed infected persons outside China is a sign of success.

 

 

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IF there's a virus onboard and if no one has visible symptoms, in theory it's possible for infection to jump from the first to last person and to prolong to 14 x (1455+802) days which is over 86 years. 🙂

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8 hours ago, boze9999 said:

I understand the general ports in the Philippines rejected the Westerdam, However, can anyone share an explanation for why the Westerdam could not port at any of our numerous military bases in the Philippines and safely quarantine as the planes are doing at US military bases? 

Easy. The Philippines is a soverign state with control over it's air and sea areas, the US military must adhere to Philippines regulations.

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3 minutes ago, Minoushka said:

The common cold and cruise cough is on most ships .How wouldone know if its just a cold or something more serious ?poor Westerdam passengers on this cruise to nowhere .I feel so sorry for them ...i think this whole thing is out of control 

why are cruise companiesstill inthe region ..cancel all.get your people out of there 

thisthing will get worse before better 

you could notpay me to take a cruise anywhere at this time ...too littlereal info available ....

if you have an Asian cruise plan ...cancel ...afew bucks out ofpocket is better than losing a life 

Kind of hard to cancel and get your people out there for the Westerdam.  No country is allowing them to dock.  I would not hesitate in taking a cruise right now.  However, I would stay away from Asia, not directly because of the virus, but because of countries banning stops, airlines cancelling flights etc.  However a Carribean or Med cruise definitely would take one.

 

Someone  mentioned bases in the Philippines.  Two issues...First, there are no longer any navy bases, they are airbases or ground force bases.  Second the current President of the Philippines is not the most logical etc.

 

The navy bases in Japan would be a logical choice, but thereare tensions about the mere presence of bases.  Allowing the Westerdam would exacerbate these tensions.

 

Something has to give.

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1 hour ago, Alphen said:

Currently in the press in the Netherlands (translated directly via GoogleTranslate);

 

 

The Netherlands is looking for a solution for the Westerdam cruise ship, which wanders around in Asian waters for fear of the new corona virus. The contacts are at diplomatic and political level, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs reports. The Holland-Amerika Lijn shipping line itself is also working on a solution for the cruise ship that is not allowed to dock in Thailand, for fear of spreading the new corona virus. Earlier permission to moor was withdrawn today. The Westerdam sails under the Dutch flag, but belongs to the American shipping company Holland-America Line. The Netherlands is therefore also working with the United States. There would be more than ninety Dutch people on board, among whom the frustration struck.

 

It is not really accurate to say HAL is an American shipping company.  It owners Carnival Corporation is incorporated in Panama, and Carnival plc is incorporated in England and Wales.  https://www.carnivalcorp.com/static-files/ddd975ba-cef0-43fe-9bf9-bb4c376ed914

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2 minutes ago, dado123456 said:

IF there's a virus onboard and if no one has visible symptoms, in theory it's possible for infection to jump from the first to last person and to prolong to 14 x (1455+802) days which is over 86 years. 🙂

 

 

Well, not necessary to take that long. The Asymptomatic carrier would have passed on the infection to someone who would manifest a severe illness within 5 weeks(?).

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asymptomatic_carrier

 

The problem is the logistics and cost of the tests.

 

Ideally, the vessel should be docked and quarantined like the Diamond Princess. All passengers get tested at least once. Passengers released as their tests show negative.

 

IMO, the procedure will be in place the next time. Once, the cruise companies and their insurance companies agree to foot the bill.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Lunar Dragon said:

Latest Dutch news is that three people on board were suspected of having the virus.  All were tested,  and the tests came out negative.  Dutch Ministry for Foreign Affairs is working on a diplomatic and political level to resolve this matter.

 

1 hour ago, voyageur9 said:

Given that testing requires sophisticated facilities not available on board, there can be no conclusive "negative" finding. It's possible that people who were ill, perhaps with a fever or other symptoms, have recovered but that means nothing. It could be they had something else, it could be that they had a mild case and recovered (but were still infectious and have infected others who have yet to show symptoms because of the extended incubation period) or something else.

 

It is possible that samples were taken from those with symptoms suspected of having the virus and were taken off the ship for testing.

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4 minutes ago, cruiserchuck said:

 

It is not really accurate to say HAL is an American shipping company.  It owners Carnival Corporation is incorporated in Panama, and Carnival plc is incorporated in England and Wales.  https://www.carnivalcorp.com/static-files/ddd975ba-cef0-43fe-9bf9-bb4c376ed914

Like I said, copy paste, literally from google translate from a paper in the Netherlands!

 

https://www.ad.nl/buitenland/live-nederland-schiet-geweigerd-cruiseschip-westerdam-te-hulp~a02a08b7d/

 

I will spare you the details what other misinformation has been published in the past few days.

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8 minutes ago, cruiserchuck said:

 

It is not really accurate to say HAL is an American shipping company.  It owners Carnival Corporation is incorporated in Panama, and Carnival plc is incorporated in England and Wales.  https://www.carnivalcorp.com/static-files/ddd975ba-cef0-43fe-9bf9-bb4c376ed914

 

 

Regardless the company is headquartered in the USA (Miami), traded on the NY Stock Exchange, and its highest ranking officers are American (Donald and Arison).  All major decisions concerning the company are made in Miami.  

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8 hours ago, atexsix said:

I can't really, not without bringing politics into it and I don't think we want to go there. 

 

Maybe they can go around dropping off each country's own citizens like a bus. At least this way they wouldn't overwhelm any one places resources.

 

If it weren't for the time and fuel use, that would be a good idea.

 

Does anyone know if all the Japanese passengers were able to disembark in Japan?

 

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5 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

If it weren't for the time and fuel use, that would be a good idea.

 

Does anyone know if all the Japanese passengers were able to disembark in Japan?

 

Westerdam wasn't allowed to dock in Japan on this cruise. So, no.

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17 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

If it weren't for the time and fuel use, that would be a good idea.

 

Does anyone know if all the Japanese passengers were able to disembark in Japan?

 

 

 

At the rate things are going, they may have to make a fuel-only stop and continue to Australia.  This is exactly what QM2 is doing.    She is currently refueling in Port Klang (Malaysia) with no pax disembarking, then continuing to Fremantle Australia.  

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59 minutes ago, cruiserchuck said:

 

It is not really accurate to say HAL is an American shipping company.  It owners Carnival Corporation is incorporated in Panama, and Carnival plc is incorporated in England and Wales.  https://www.carnivalcorp.com/static-files/ddd975ba-cef0-43fe-9bf9-bb4c376ed914

If they want the $$$$ benefits of flagging the ship in the Netherlands, incorporating Carnival Corporation in Panama, and incorporating Carnival plc in England and Wales, then those are the countries they should be looking to for help with their problem. 

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9 hours ago, atexsix said:

Maybe they can go around dropping off each country's own citizens like a bus. At least this way they wouldn't overwhelm any one places resources.

 

that was my thought days ago. probably too many countries though.

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