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mahamelb
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And yet in this country we're still ignoring the very clear warnings coming from Italian doctors that we're not doing enough, and should be following the examples of other countries.  We're still following the Italian trajectory, and Italy, which left it too late, as we are, now has more deaths than China. It's health services are on their knees, yet they have twice as many intensive care beds per head of population as we do.

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19 minutes ago, Javert1969 said:

 

I'm not sure where that is in the official media.  What I've seen is that the government and news channels are pointing out the actual facts of the increased risk to those groups, based on the actual historical data, in order to help those groups to know what advice they must follow if they want to reduce their risk.  If it was the other way around and they just said everyone will be fine and it turned out not to be the case, wouldn't that be even worse?

 

I'm sure there are a few idiots on social media saying insulting things, but I try to ignore them.

 

Also - if we take a step back and think about it for a second, almost every country in the world, including many countries that are not known for being over-caring about their citizens, has decided to deliberately crash the entire global economy in order to save the lives of (rough calculation based on the quoted data) about 8% of people who are most likely to be at this moment (though not in the past of course) the least economically productive members of society. 

 

To me that appears to show that in spite of all the bickering and so on, the vast majority of people deeply love their older family members and don't want them to die prematurely, and most world leaders know that and are not going to risk just standing back and letting it happen in order to preserve the economy.

Sorry I don’t agree. I think the mainstream media have been so busy trying to make young/fully healthy people comfortable that they have effectively undermined the wider health messages.
 

People are still visiting pubs, restaurants etc because they think that if they are younger they are immune or will have very limited symptoms They are not and they will not.

 

 

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6 hours ago, davecttr said:

This shows what can be done if the state can enforce extreme measures on the population. However there are probably well over a billion Chinese who have not caught the disease and have no immunity. They could keep the disease out of China if they quarantined the entire country, no one gets in, however this is impossible with borders that long.

 

I was surprised by a local BBC news report from Seaforth. Lots of people ignoring the government advice. even had another example on my walk this morning. Guy walking toward me in the middle of the pavement and I had nowhere to go, hedge one side and busy road the other. I held my breath for as long as I could as we passed. I see draconian enforcement measures happening if the idiots keep on behaving like this.

Seriously, I know you are worried,but as long as anyone walking towards you is not coughing and spluttering,sneezing or shouting,all of which produce droplets,you will be ok.I stick out like a sore thumb here,being English,even though a lot know me,some still give me a wide berth,lol.

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6 hours ago, Adawn47 said:

No, we pay for our checkups and any dental work. We get an appointment  reminder by email.

Avril 

My last appointment email for hygienist and a check up arrived the day after I missed the appointment. I had the descaling and check up last week and there is a complicated filling needed, arranged for late April I reckon it isn't going to happen.

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2 hours ago, brian1 said:

Seriously, I know you are worried,but as long as anyone walking towards you is not coughing and spluttering,sneezing or shouting,all of which produce droplets,you will be ok.I stick out like a sore thumb here,being English,even though a lot know me,some still give me a wide berth,lol.

Thanks that's reassuring

 

More interesting thoughts, luckily for me I have a 'beast from the east' winter food reserve which I gently increased to 3 weeks. I also managed to make some weekly orders with the supermarket for home delivery, each for about 5 to 6 days and should last me until Easter. I am a glass half empty person. When they pick the orders I hope they pick them before the open the doors in the morning because if they don't there won't be anything left to pick.

 

If this supermarket madness continues I can see drastic measures will be needed to ensure the old and vulnerable get enough to eat. Food rationing maybe.

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No slots available from Sainbsburys and they take 3 weeks of bookings, Tesco the other day when I was ordering the slots moved on by two days when I came to book a slot and that was middle of April, impossible for over 70's to stay at home when food cannot be obtained without going out.

 

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2 hours ago, davecttr said:

 

 

If this supermarket madness continues I can see drastic measures will be needed to ensure the old and vulnerable get enough to eat. Food rationing maybe.

 

7 hours ago, Eglesbrech said:


 

People are still visiting pubs, restaurants etc because they think that if they are younger they are immune or will have very limited symptoms They are not and they will not.

 

 

 

The supermarket hoarding will begin to ease off anytime now. People will realise that they have other bills to pay plus 

having to restock on foods they really need . Having 60 loo rolls and a mountain of pasta and hand gel will not feed them .

More so when their bosses are telling them they are to be put on unpaid leave and the fact supermarkets are stopping bulk buying of their products anyway.

 

As for the ones that choose to  ignore the warnings  and are still visiting pubs, restaurants etc because they think that if they are younger they are immune or will have very limited symptoms. Some are in for a shock and would do well to read up on the amount of younger adults that are in the USA  ICU wards, possibly as they thought like wise.

It is not just the old or underlying medical conditions .People should be aware of the undetected conditions  that many people could have.This virus  goes for the body's weakness.

Better to be safe(sensible) than sorry as they say.

 

Edited by kalos
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6 hours ago, davecttr said:

Thanks that's reassuring

 

More interesting thoughts, luckily for me I have a 'beast from the east' winter food reserve which I gently increased to 3 weeks. I also managed to make some weekly orders with the supermarket for home delivery, each for about 5 to 6 days and should last me until Easter. I am a glass half empty person. When they pick the orders I hope they pick them before the open the doors in the morning because if they don't there won't be anything left to pick.

 

If this supermarket madness continues I can see drastic measures will be needed to ensure the old and vulnerable get enough to eat. Food rationing maybe.

I blame the supermarkets,they should have limited everyone from day 1.Hang in there mate,cheers,Brian.

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2 hours ago, brian1 said:

I blame the supermarkets,they should have limited everyone from day 1.Hang in there mate,cheers,Brian.

I first home delivery I ordered last week from Sainsbury's is being delivered this morning. I received the expected email this morning.

 

this is one weeks order -

Bread - 1 large loaf - not available

Milk - 2 x 2 litre semi skimmed - not available

Potatoes - not available

mixed veg - not available

carrots - not available

oranges - not available

fish cakes - not available

breaded cod - not available

cheese - not available 

 

apart from the milk I had only ordered ONE of each item and they say no substitutes are available

 

Apparently I will be getting

a pack of bacon

6 sausages

12 eggs

 

This has to be sorted. The panic buying is a national disgrace when you read about the calm response from the people in some other countries who are in a much worse position than we are.

 

Sainsbury had no more slots so I have a similar order from Tesco due  Friday next week, if that goes wrong I will start to panic.

 

Meanwhile I think a letter to my MP might be a good idea.

 

Keep well everybody

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2 hours ago, brian1 said:

I blame the supermarkets,they should have limited everyone from day 1.Hang in there mate,cheers,Brian.

That's my argument too, but let's be honest, it's all about the bottom line. Profits first. Keep drowning those germs with voddy🍷

Avril 

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1 hour ago, Adawn47 said:

That's my argument too, but let's be honest, it's all about the bottom line. Profits first. Keep drowning those germs with voddy🍷

Avril 

Will do,cheers.We topped up with 16lts from the "magical spring of eternal youth" today.It's a pipe with a tap on the end drilled into the side of a mountain 2 miles above us.It runs 24/7 and contains loads of vitamins and reduces blood pressure.When I begin to look like Kieth Richards (which I do most of the time),I grab a few glasses and wake up in the morning looking like Cliff.

Edited by brian1
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1 hour ago, davecttr said:

I first home delivery I ordered last week from Sainsbury's is being delivered this morning. I received the expected email this morning.

 

this is one weeks order -

Bread - 1 large loaf - not available

Milk - 2 x 2 litre semi skimmed - not available

Potatoes - not available

mixed veg - not available

carrots - not available

oranges - not available

fish cakes - not available

breaded cod - not available

cheese - not available 

 

apart from the milk I had only ordered ONE of each item and they say no substitutes are available

 

Apparently I will be getting

a pack of bacon

6 sausages

12 eggs

 

This has to be sorted. The panic buying is a national disgrace when you read about the calm response from the people in some other countries who are in a much worse position than we are.

 

Sainsbury had no more slots so I have a similar order from Tesco due  Friday next week, if that goes wrong I will start to panic.

 

Meanwhile I think a letter to my MP might be a good idea.

 

Keep well everybody

We did manage  to get some stuff at Sainsburys yesterday in the over 70's melee between 8 and 9am at our local branch. We did try to do an online shop but there were no slots for the next 3 weeks and the nearest Click & Collect store is a 12 mile drive away.

We have a Click & Collect order booked with Tesco for 31st March and we should have enough to last til then. However your post has raised the concern that the items on that order will not be available. I thought, perhaps unwisely, that if you've selected items for future delivery that they will effectively be "reserved" in their stock system so that they are available at the time of collection/delivery. Surely a computer based system should be capable of that relatively simple task.

Clearly not the case if your experience is anything to go by.

Also, is the government not aware that this panic buying situation is just the right environment to accelerate the spread of the virus with hundreds crammed into supermarkets and queuing for ages in close proximity.

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8 minutes ago, arlowood said:

 

Also, is the government not aware that this panic buying situation is just the right environment to accelerate the spread of the virus with hundreds crammed into supermarkets and queuing for ages in close proximity.

Government? What government? They've only just woken up to this, despite the fact that it's been obvious for weeks from China and Italy what was going to happen. Now we're all paying a heavy price for total incompetence.

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Breaking News - the delivery arrived as per the email but they have added a boil in the bag kipper pack and 400g of carrot batons. At least they are trying.

 

I was hoping they would have some form of reserving items as well but so far it appears their pickers might be picking once the store opens, in which case they will get trampled in the stampede. At a minimum the picking should take place after the store is stocked and BEFORE it opens.. also they need to sort the problem of people clearing the shelves in store AND ordering on line, maybe multiple times per week.

 

I received an email from the Tesco CEO and one of his points was trying to discourage people from ordering on line who don't need to do so. So they aware of some of the problems already.

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This is the result of a government that’s failing to act to protect vulnerable people - this one an intensive care nurse who can’t find food. Tear jerking, and the government’s doing nothing:

 

Coronavirus: Nurse's despair as panic-buyers clear shelves https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-51966337

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Definitely need to significantly ramp up deliveries - I guess the availability of refrigerated lorries will be the limiting factor.  But surely delivery lorries to clubs/restaurants/hotels etc will become available as their trade slows or they close.  

But 24 hour deliveries would be acceptable if you're desperate (I'd certainly be prepared to select a slot at 3 am if that's all I can get).  

And what if they said no one can re-order for at least 10 days?  That would generate 43% more capacity as compared with weekly deliveries.   Ok some fresh goods  won't last that long, but we'd have to resort to freezer stock, dry and tinned goods to bridge the gap.  

Mind..... none of that helps if, as Dave discovered, much of what you've ordered isn't available!!! 

Worrying times and more solutions needed.  

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It might not be a practical proposition for everyone but assorted “suppliers”, ex-cafes, etc, etc are setting up very local supply/deliver chains.  Stuff which would normally go to restaurants being diverted to households.

I don’t know which networks you need to look at for info.

Anybody any ideas?

Local branch of AgeUK?

Local Rotary/Lions?

Local authority?

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49 minutes ago, davecttr said:

Breaking News - the delivery arrived as per the email but they have added a boil in the bag kipper pack and 400g of carrot batons. At least they are trying.

 

I was hoping they would have some form of reserving items as well but so far it appears their pickers might be picking once the store opens, in which case they will get trampled in the stampede. At a minimum the picking should take place after the store is stocked and BEFORE it opens.. also they need to sort the problem of people clearing the shelves in store AND ordering on line, maybe multiple times per week.

 

I received an email from the Tesco CEO and one of his points was trying to discourage people from ordering on line who don't need to do so. So they aware of some of the problems already.

I was under the impression that  online shopping is a different entity altogether from the supermarket, though I stand to be corrected. My online Asda comes from a warehouse in Leeds. I know because when I contacted my local Asda supermarket about an issue with  an order they told me that they were two separate  businesses under the same umbrella. 

Avril 

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Our son in law is working from home.He phoned Currys to get another computer.The 1st recorded message he got was "sorry we have sold out of freezers of any description".Unbelievable.

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7 minutes ago, brian1 said:

Our son in law is working from home.He phoned Currys to get another computer.The 1st recorded message he got was "sorry we have sold out of freezers of any description".Unbelievable.

It sounds as if  big businesses of all types are going to make a fortune out of this pandemic. Just checked our Curry's store and no issues there in fact there's a sale on. It's obviously regional the same as food items.

Avril 

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17 hours ago, Harry Peterson said:

And yet in this country we're still ignoring the very clear warnings coming from Italian doctors that we're not doing enough, and should be following the examples of other countries.  We're still following the Italian trajectory, and Italy, which left it too late, as we are, now has more deaths than China. It's health services are on their knees, yet they have twice as many intensive care beds per head of population as we do.

 

Nobody in NHS or government is addressing this information which is circulating widely on social media about the UK having a lot less intensive care beds.

 

There's a bit of a case of apples vs pears hear because I seem to recall that in the UK, we have a system that's somewhat different to many other countries where we have several levels of care ward rather than just "normal" and "intensive care".  For example, we have wards called "HDU - High Dependency Unit" which is slightly lower than intensive care.

 

Therefore we would need some credible information from a fact checking organisation - my thought is that if the UK really does have half as many ICU beds as a country "needs", it would have caused all sorts of scandals long before now.

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24 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

I was under the impression that  online shopping is a different entity altogether from the supermarket, though I stand to be corrected. My online Asda comes from a warehouse in Leeds. I know because when I contacted my local Asda supermarket about an issue with  an order they told me that they were two separate  businesses under the same umbrella. 

Avril 

No, Tesco and Sainsbury pick online orders from the same shelves as the general public.

Just to comment on some of the other points mentioned in similar posts.  I was involved in supplying supermarkets for a number of years, so can add a little perspective, so would just make the following points:

1. Most major stores carry very little spare stock - they rely on frequent deliveries from their warehouses to keep their shelves full.

2. Most supermarket warehouses in turn do not carry much stock. In many cases they operate on a "pick to zero" system, whereby stock arriving from the manufacturer is immediately sent out to stores.

3. The majority of stock is held by the manufacturer ( so the supermarkets don't physically have to buy it until the last minute)

4. When demand suddenly increases therefore, there are pinch points in the delivery from the manufacturer to the warehouse, and then again from the warehouse to the store. When you get a doubling of demand overnight, you cannot suddenly increase supply chain supply at the same level.

So, before attacking the supermarkets etc, have a look at the larger picture. 

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13 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

It sounds as if  big businesses of all types are going to make a fortune out of this pandemic. 

Avril 

You don't reall mean that do you? Car manufacturers,  engineering firms, hospitality industry, non-food retailers etc are going to loose a fortune. 

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16 minutes ago, Adawn47 said:

It sounds as if  big businesses of all types are going to make a fortune out of this pandemic. Just checked our Curry's store and no issues there in fact there's a sale on. It's obviously regional the same as food items.

Avril 

 

I actually softened a bit here when I realised that one main driver of the continuing panic buying, is that there are many many people in this country who are thinking they are going to have no income a month from now and no way to buy food.  Therefore the rational thing for them to do is to buy as much as they can get now even if it means running up a credit card bill that they can't pay - the credit card company can't really come and take that food away again, or at least by the time they could, they will have eaten it anyway.

 

The government should have already moved to say that everyone, regardless of their financial situation, will be fed, even if it means that the government has to give out free food or food vouchers.  The government has already moved to stop people losing their  homes and their utilities, they need to do the same with food, otherwise it's completely rational for people to go out and buy as much food as they can get even if it means going into debt.

 

They should also temporarily relax competition rules so that Supermarkets can work together to manage the situation.

 

Maybe expect an email from your credit card company in the next weeks reducing your credit limit 😉

Edited by Javert1969
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