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I am of the opinion that travel insurance is very much a personal matter and can't be generalized. For instance, I've never purchased travel insurance and have never needed it, so I've saved myself $1,000s by not purchasing it. Furthermore, the only time it might have been handy was a time I agreed to go on a trip and later found out I wouldn't be allowed to go because of work, and none of the insurance policies at the time would have covered it (this was back in 2009). Furthermore, some people speak of "Cancel for any reason" as some kind of panacea, but it isn't. Every insurance policy has some kind of exclusions or conditions. There's ALWAYS fine print. We looked into getting CFAR insurance for a cruise some months ago but, even though we were months away from final payment date, all of the travel insurance sites said "no." All of the ones I've seen require you to get the insurance within 48 hours of making your initial deposit, but that is usually defined as the earlier of hotel reservations, cruise deposits, car rental, train tickets, or airline reservations. Unless we buy insurance at the outset, it's useless to us. This is a popular topic in general but there's clearly renewed interest due to the Coronavirus, and yet every day I read of insurance companies that don''t cover cancellations due to epidemics and pandemics. So the very reason some people are even CONSIDERING insurance is excluded, which is my point in the first place. And lest anyone think he/she could just say "we changed our minds," look at the fine print and also hope the insurance companies don't have people monitoring social media or Cruise Critic. There are already documented cases of people filing for workman's comp and then later being denied because they fessed up on FB. I wouldn't put it past the insurance industry to deny coverage to someone who claimed he/she cancelled "for no reason" and later admitted online that it was due to an excluded event like the Coronavirus.

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6 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

I am of the opinion that travel insurance is very much a personal matter and can't be generalized. every day I read of insurance companies that don''t cover cancellations due to epidemics and pandemics.

I think you may have posted some information that was incorrectly applied to the CFAR insurance.  The people you speak of who are complaining that their insurance won't cover pandemics or epidemics are people who did not purchase Cancel For Any Reason insurance, they purchased "cancellation insurance."  "Cancellation Insurance" only covers cancellations for specified reasons (illness of the insured, illness of a defined family member, loss of employment, having military travel orders rescinded etc...) I've never seen a plain cancellation policy cover cancellations made due to fear of contracting an illness.  Cancel For Any Reason does cover that and the insurance company doesn't care why you cancelled - as long as you cancelled within their time guidelines.

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Just now, Daniel A said:

I think you may have posted some information that was incorrectly applied to the CFAR insurance.  The people you speak of who are complaining that their insurance won't cover pandemics or epidemics are people who did not purchase Cancel For Any Reason insurance, they purchased "cancellation insurance."  "Cancellation Insurance" only covers cancellations for specified reasons (illness of the insured, illness of a defined family member, loss of employment, having military travel orders rescinded etc...) I've never seen a plain cancellation policy cover cancellations made due to fear of contracting an illness.  Cancel For Any Reason does cover that and the insurance company doesn't care why you cancelled - as long as you cancelled within their time guidelines.

No, there was a thread recently that quoted an insurance company that offered CFAR insurance and there was a * with language to the effect that such insurance did NOT cover cancellations due to epidemics/pandemics. I will post the information I read as soon as I find it.

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Here's an article I found that addresses one company's policy, but note that:

1. It has to be purchased within the 1st 21 days of the FIRST trip booking

2. It costs 40% more than other plans

So unless you have money to burn and/or could have predicted a major flu epidemic at the time you booked, it's useless. Now, of course you could say that EVERYONE should just automatically purchase insurance every single time and get CFAR, but as I pointed out above, insurance would have cost me $1,000s of dollars if I'd bought it every time I traveled, and I'd rather have that money in the bank. We typically travel overseas at least twice a year and that's excluding cruises. For me, and me only, I'd rather use the money I save by not buying travel insurance and go on more trips. Others must do what they think is best, of course.

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37 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

Here's an article I found that addresses one company's policy, but note that:

1. It has to be purchased within the 1st 21 days of the FIRST trip booking

2. It costs 40% more than other plans

So unless you have money to burn and/or could have predicted a major flu epidemic at the time you booked, it's useless. Now, of course you could say that EVERYONE should just automatically purchase insurance every single time and get CFAR, but as I pointed out above, insurance would have cost me $1,000s of dollars if I'd bought it every time I traveled, and I'd rather have that money in the bank. We typically travel overseas at least twice a year and that's excluding cruises. For me, and me only, I'd rather use the money I save by not buying travel insurance and go on more trips. Others must do what they think is best, of course.

You will never realize how much you need insurance until you actually NEED insurance, and by then it will be too late if you haven't already purchased it.  The Platinum Princess Vacation Protection is available as a free upgrade (when you purchase the standard vacation protection) to anyone with Ruby Loyalty Status and it includes CFAR.  

 

I wish you safe travels.

Edited by Abercrombie2019
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1 minute ago, Abercrombie2019 said:

You will never realize how much you need insurance until you actually NEED insurance, and by then it will be too late if you haven't already purchased it.  The Platinum Princess Vacation Protection is available as a free upgrade to anyone with Ruby Loyalty Status and it includes CFAR.  

 

I wish you safe travels.

Thanks, I do have very, very good insurance, I just don't feel the need to pay for additional travel insurance over and above what I already pay for-my wife and I have 4 properties and all are insured, we aren't anti-insurance by any means. Interestingly, I can only think of two medical events I had in the last 10 years while on vacation, one was a sinus infection and the other was a skin infection. The sinus infection started just before an Italian cruise and I was healed on the 2nd day by the ship's physician, the other time I was in the UK and paid 50 quid out of pocket to be treated at a local clinic. Both times, I was able to submit the claims to my US medical insurer. We've never cruised on Princess so I'm sure we have no loyalty status, but it might be something to look into as time goes on and we get older. So don't think we don't believe in insurance, we do. 🙂

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1 hour ago, DCGuy64 said:

No, there was a thread recently that quoted an insurance company that offered CFAR insurance and there was a * with language to the effect that such insurance did NOT cover cancellations due to epidemics/pandemics. I will post the information I read as soon as I find it.

I do not believe this to be correct. 

 

And even if it is, if you want/need to cancel with CFAR you can just say "we changed our minds" without mentioning coronavirus at all. That would indeed be "any reason".

 

 

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2 minutes ago, LDVinNC said:

I do not believe this to be correct. 

 

And even if it is, if you want/need to cancel with CFAR you can just say "we changed our minds" without mentioning coronavirus at all. That would indeed be "any reason".

 

 

Yes, as long as you stick to that story and don't let the insurance company know the real reason. On a related note, Princess Cruises recently posted to its website that if an embarking passenger lies about his/her medical condition in an attempt to elude detection, that person could face legal consequences. Personally, I have an ethical issue with telling an insurance company that I'd simply changed my mind when it was in fact due to concerns about a virus. But that's just me.

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54 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

Thanks, I do have very, very good insurance, I just don't feel the need to pay for additional travel insurance over and above what I already pay for-my wife and I have 4 properties and all are insured, we aren't anti-insurance by any means. Interestingly, I can only think of two medical events I had in the last 10 years while on vacation, one was a sinus infection and the other was a skin infection. The sinus infection started just before an Italian cruise and I was healed on the 2nd day by the ship's physician, the other time I was in the UK and paid 50 quid out of pocket to be treated at a local clinic. Both times, I was able to submit the claims to my US medical insurer. We've never cruised on Princess so I'm sure we have no loyalty status, but it might be something to look into as time goes on and we get older. So don't think we don't believe in insurance, we do. 🙂

and so, as previously stated, you have made a financial decision not to purchase the CFAR insurance as provided by Princess

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30 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

Yes, as long as you stick to that story and don't let the insurance company know the real reason.  Personally, I have an ethical issue with telling an insurance company that I'd simply changed my mind when it was in fact due to concerns about a virus. But that's just me.

I still don't think you're getting it.  You are blurring cancellation insurance with cancel for any reason insurance.  If you cancel the cruise under cancel for any reason insurance, the reason why you cancelled is none of their business.  Knowing the reason for cancellation is only a requirement of the lower level cancellation insurance.

 

You still have not produced a single policy which disallows Cancel For Any Reason when the reason is that you don't want to sail because "there was a * with language to the effect that such insurance did NOT cover cancellations due to epidemics/pandemics."   If you're only quoting what other posters have said, then you were given bad information.  As I said before they probably only got cancellation insurance and now they have buyer's remorse since what they bought wasn't enough to cover the current circumstances.

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23 minutes ago, voljeep said:

and so, as previously stated, you have made a financial decision not to purchase the CFAR insurance as provided by Princess

No, we have never purchased travel insurance for any trip, period. Ever. And I've been traveling to Europe twice-3x per year since 1984. I think nearly 40 years is a pretty good record. But as I stated, not purchasing travel insurance isn't the same as being uninsured. We have medical insurance, auto insurance, homeowner's insurance, and insurance benefits provided by the credit card issuers we use to pay for our trips. We just elect not to purchase supplemental insurance because it's been demonstrably proven to be unnecessary for us. But as I get older, I would look into it.

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3 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

I still don't think you're getting it.  You are blurring cancellation insurance with cancel for any reason insurance.  If you cancel the cruise under cancel for any reason insurance, the reason why you cancelled is none of their business.  Knowing the reason for cancellation is only a requirement of the lower level cancellation insurance.

 

You still have not produced a single policy which disallows Cancel For Any Reason when the reason is that you don't want to sail because "there was a * with language to the effect that such insurance did NOT cover cancellations due to epidemics/pandemics."   If you're only quoting what other posters have said, then you were given bad information.  As I said before they probably only got cancellation insurance and now they have buyer's remorse since what they bought wasn't enough to cover the current circumstances.

No need to be rude. I'm not failing to get it. Wow. And with all due respect, the reason I have, to use your words, "not produced a single policy..." is that I'm at work, which I need to get back to. You don't agree with me, fine. If I don't get insurance, that's on me. Jeez....

Edited by DCGuy64
Added the word "I"
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1 hour ago, Daniel A said:

I still don't think you're getting it.  You are blurring cancellation insurance with cancel for any reason insurance.  If you cancel the cruise under cancel for any reason insurance, the reason why you cancelled is none of their business.  Knowing the reason for cancellation is only a requirement of the lower level cancellation insurance.


Cancel for any reason is still subject to general exclusions - failure to disclose, travelling against official warnings, illegal activities, etc. 

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2 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

No need to be rude. I'm not failing to get it. Wow. And with all due respect, the reason I have, to use your words, "not produced a single policy..." is that I'm at work, which I need to get back to. You don't agree with me, fine. If I don't get insurance, that's on me. Jeez....

I'm not being rude to you.  You made a statement that I think may be misleading others about what CFAR insurance covers.  If simply asking you to back up your previous statements is being rude, then I'm guilty as charged.  What I do find interesting is that you have never sailed on Princess, never purchased any travel insurance but feel qualified to give others advice about travel insurance.  I just never thought challenging a statement with facts was being rude.

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2 hours ago, lcmortensen said:


Cancel for any reason is still subject to general exclusions - failure to disclose, travelling against official warnings, illegal activities, etc. 

 

I believe what is being discussed is the CFAR that Princess offers is actually referred to as Non-insurance coverage.  They even have a box to check if you are not cancelling due to a medical (or covered) reason.  You just check the box and send it in for reimbursement.  They don't even ask for a reason ... just check the box that you are not qualified for the insurance reimbursement.  The caveat here is that you receive your compensation in the form of future cruise credits and I believe they must be used within a year or two ... so, it is different than the CFAR that you'd actually receive their a third party insurance company.  You don't even have to purchase this insurance within so many days of booking the cruise ... only upon final payment of the cruise.  The standard product will reimburse you 75% of your cruise fare and the platinum will provide you with 100% of these same non-refundable costs ... both with future cruise credits only.  It's a nifty type of insurance to purchase ... doesn't really provide a great deal of medical care or emergency evacuation costs .... however, you pay it upon paying your cruise in full (by final payment date), the premium is based on the price of the cruise (age is not factored in) and it is reasonably priced.  If you have decent medical coverage outside of the US through your own insurance company it is really a pretty good policy....just bee sure to call your specific insurance company to ensure you have necessary coverage and, btw,  Medicare does not cover costs in a foreign country.  

The only other policy I think is beneficial is an annual emergency evacuation policy.  It is crazy expensive to be airlifted off a ship and I've seen it happen several times in over my lifetime of cruises.  It will run into tens of thousands of dollars on the low end for one of these rescues.  The product Princess offers does not cover this adequately, IMO ... so, I think an annual policy may be my next insurance purchase.  

Anyway ... that was way more than I meant to write on that topic ... but, important, nevertheless.  

 

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On 2/29/2020 at 7:20 AM, healthworker said:

Cfar insurance is not available to people from Quebec or Puerto Rico so we are unable to purchase

Its also not available in New York State, and where its available, its very expensive.  It might be 50% of the price of a cruise. So lets say I cancel and lets say they DO give me a 100% refund. I get all my money back right? Yeah, do the math. The cost of the insurance IS NOT refunded if you use it or not.  There is no free lunch. 

 

Great article on CFAR here....

Cancel For Any Reason Insurance

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14 hours ago, Daniel A said:

I still don't think you're getting it.  You are blurring cancellation insurance with cancel for any reason insurance.  If you cancel the cruise under cancel for any reason insurance, the reason why you cancelled is none of their business.  Knowing the reason for cancellation is only a requirement of the lower level cancellation insurance.

 

You still have not produced a single policy which disallows Cancel For Any Reason when the reason is that you don't want to sail because "there was a * with language to the effect that such insurance did NOT cover cancellations due to epidemics/pandemics."   If you're only quoting what other posters have said, then you were given bad information.  As I said before they probably only got cancellation insurance and now they have buyer's remorse since what they bought wasn't enough to cover the current circumstances.

 

You are right Daniel - he just doesn't get it.

They all say they haven't insured and saved thousands. If you need a Medivac or a stint in a foreign hospital, the thousands they have saved will be gone before they wake up.

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19 hours ago, DCGuy64 said:

No, there was a thread recently that quoted an insurance company that offered CFAR insurance and there was a * with language to the effect that such insurance did NOT cover cancellations due to epidemics/pandemics. I will post the information I read as soon as I find it.

 

Just because its on the internet doesn’t make it true.  This is just blatantly false information, and spreading it just confuses people.  Unless you can show me a link to a policy that lists “Cancel for any reason” and has stipulations on cancelling then please stop sharing this information.  The reason you won’t find this is the company would get sued immediately, you cant say you can cancel for any reason and then say well not because of epidemic, etc.

 

This is VERY different than being able to obtain this rider for a policy, yes many companies offer stipulations on purchasing this rider, but again its very easy to find a policy that you can get CFAR without many restrictions,.  I posted about one earlier, Princess directly offers it as long as its before final payment.  

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3 hours ago, Ombud said:

My B2B on the Grand begins March 22, 2020. 😁

 

Added: I have CFAR but still hoping Princess won't cancel (kids super excited but we've talked about a cruise to Alaska if Princess cancels)

You are in California Coastal cruises.  There is very little risk of going to the US, Mexico and Canada.  I would not worry at all 

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1 hour ago, memoak said:

You are in California Coastal cruises.  There is very little risk of going to the US, Mexico and Canada.  I would not worry at all 

I'm not worried about Covid 19 and, in all honesty, I'm not worried about Princess cancelling.  But in the oft chance that they do I'll enjoy my %% off an Alaskan cruise & refund

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After an unfortunate incident where Princess would not let me cancel without penalty just 12 hours after I booked directly with them...even though they had not yet put the charge through and they had offered me a 24-hour courtesy hold that I foolishly declined....I always buy their CFAR insurance and I have used it.  There are those who would have been so upset that they would never have traveled with Princess again, but I considered it a painful lesson...they were technically correct in what they did, but obviously had no heart.  I will never forget this important lesson.  Despite all the talk about how they value their loyal customers and the little buttons they give you..it is a purely transactional relationship, as it should be.


Having said that, Princess, I believe, is being financially shortsighted in this case.  How much do they spend on marketing.  How much marketing will they need to erase the perceptions caused by the Diamond Princess quarantine...especially when it has been followed by, I believe, questions about Coronavirus on the Grand Princess, the Caribbean Princess having two instances of bad norovirus, the Sun Princess being turned away from various ports and then stoned at another.  And let’s not forget the sanitation score of, I believe, the Regal...was it the worst of all ships inspected?

 

Now would be a great time for Princess to show leadership and generate some positive headlines and goodwill with its customers. Why not allow a few cancellations and take they money from the marketing budget.  Frankly aggressive marketing now would appear tone  deaf.  So with the money they save by stepping back from marketing, they can afford to behave in a way that would appear compassionate but actually be financed astute.  There is no reason why the industry cannot survive and thrive in the long run.  I believe now is the time to at least feign  some compassion, but maybe I’m wrong.

 

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Just read that the cruise industry is beginning to relax its cancellation policies.  So far Princess is not listed as one of the companies doing so, and I’m not sure the changes announced would have helped the OP.  But the good news is much of the industry is  beginning to accept that this is not a normal situation.  So there is hope that more cruise lines will follow suit.

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