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Cruise Credit & Calculation and use of FCC (merged)


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6 hours ago, BBMacLaird said:

I’m not privy to what’s being thought behind our executive doors, but I’ll happily pass along your suggestion. Thank you for your 2021 Azamara bookings! 

Still seeking clarification can we use the credits toward existing booking in 2021?  Initially it was stating for new bookings but guests have reported persuading agents to transfer it to existing bookings.  This is important to us to find out the facts, because we cannot see any new use for the future cruise certificate if we cancel this way and would need to ride on until Azamara actually cancels the cruises which they will have to do (legs embark in Barcelona, Rome and Barcelona again). 

Also what is the status of the cruise again certificate that was used, is a future booking eligible for the LCV discount that attached to it or not?  
I’m already going to lose a shed load of OBC including some I won so trying to assess my total losses going forward.  

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On 3/27/2020 at 12:26 PM, BBMacLaird said:

Hello Makingupforlosttime, per our Travel Advisory and the letters sent to you/your travel agent, the refund should be expected 30-days after you submitted your request. Thus, yours should show up in about 2-weeks or so, depending on when you requested the refund instead of the 125% Future Cruise Credit.

https://www.azamara.com/travel-advisory 

  • You can expect to receive your refund 30 days after you submit your request.

 

p.s. I should point out that just because employees are working from home doesn't mean they are not working. I was just asking for a bit of understanding that everyone (worldwide!) is operating in new territory. 

Thanks for the response

 

I will ask again: As of what date were employees asked to work from home?

 

It has been 21 days since the cancellation of the cruise. Since we are expecting full refund as part of our compensation and the cruise as scheduled would have finished the cruise 3 days ago if we would have left, do you not think that it is only proper that we receive the money which we are owed?

 

People working from home is not the problem, management not releasing the funds is the problem. There are no calculations just a full refund which should have been started 3 weeks ago as we were the first cancellation Azamara accounting had to process.

 

I am starting to really be concerned as we are being told to be understanding. The passengers on the March 17th Quest who are expecting to be fully refunded monies they paid in full 90 days prior to the departure date need to be concerned. RCL and its group of companies are managing cashflow so they can survive at our expense. They used our money to fund the cruises before us. Our money was not held in trust for our cruise. They are only bleeding money as they have to find the money to pay us while keeping ongoing bills paid.

 

I am surprised not to hear more people raising the alarm.

 

After 22 cruises with RCL, I am 1 day away from never sailing on Royal Caribbean, Celebrity and Azamara ever again.

 

Sad!!!!!

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Makingupforlosttime - I am not agreeing or denying your supposition however can I just add another perspective from first hand knowledge

 

* The area I primarily consult in I have been helping people set up processes.  We are in absolutely uncharted territory about what we are making decisions about

* Even when we do make decisions, in most cases we do not have the back end processes in place or if we do they are not scalable to the level we need it.

 

Turning to working from home

My son works in the domestic gas supply industry at the front end supporting customers.  They have extremely well rehearsed contingencies but no desk top scenario planning could have prepared them for this.  Ten days in to home working, he reckons it will be another two weeks before they will be near 80% efficiency (their minimum) in terms of customer support as kit isn't performing in every persons house, there are wifi load issues, internet speed dips so that secure systems cannot be accessed remotely and they cannot call on the back up of the big suppliers as they would do if it was just them who were having problems.   (Thats just the tip of the iceberg, agents can't send their children to school so are having to work whilst caring for children, staff are stuck in supermarket lines when they need to go out - the list is endless)  The big suppliers who would provide  the telephony back up are stretched over to the NHS frontline and many of their staff are having to self isolate.  Its also tricky providing support on a call out when you are required by law to socially distance.

 

OK maybe the cruise line is slow, maybe the cash flow is an issue but don't underestimate the challenge of writing new rules and sending your entire workforce over to home working overnight.

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2 minutes ago, uktog said:

Makingupforlosttime - I am not agreeing or denying your supposition however can I just add another perspective from first hand knowledge

 

* The area I primarily consult in I have been helping people set up processes.  We are in absolutely uncharted territory about what we are making decisions about

* Even when we do make decisions, in most cases we do not have the back end processes in place or if we do they are not scalable to the level we need it.

 

Turning to working from home

My son works in the domestic gas supply industry at the front end supporting customers.  They have extremely well rehearsed contingencies but no desk top scenario planning could have prepared them for this.  Ten days in to home working, he reckons it will be another two weeks before they will be near 80% efficiency (their minimum) in terms of customer support as kit isn't performing in every persons house, there are wifi load issues, internet speed dips so that secure systems cannot be accessed remotely and they cannot call on the back up of the big suppliers as they would do if it was just them who were having problems.   (Thats just the tip of the iceberg, agents can't send their children to school so are having to work whilst caring for children, staff are stuck in supermarket lines when they need to go out - the list is endless)  The big suppliers who would provide  the telephony back up are stretched over to the NHS frontline and many of their staff are having to self isolate.  Its also tricky providing support on a call out when you are required by law to socially distance.

 

OK maybe the cruise line is slow, maybe the cash flow is an issue but don't underestimate the challenge of writing new rules and sending your entire workforce over to home working overnight.

Thanks for the response and thanks for not minimizing my suppositions.

 

I appreciate your experience setting up process and "get" what other industries are going through adjusting. I am not blind to this.

 

I do not underestimate the challenge.

 

Here is my problem:

 

1) I know from experience that refunding an entire cruise ship can be done within 10 days. We saw this last spring on-board the Quest when the entire ship received a 50% refund back on our credit card within 10 days of the captain announcing the compensation. (The cooling system was not functional). Since we were the only ship at that time that was cancelled and staff were still at their desks it could have been done. It was not done.

2) As of Dec 31st 2019 RCI had on their balance sheet 243m in cash. It had 3.4m in deferred revenue to which I can assume 1/3 would be deposits and fully paid cruises to happen within 90 days. So 1/3 of 3.4m is over 1.1m. With these cruises being cancelled and a portion being given back as FCC's and a portion a full refund there is no money to operate.

 

Here is your problem:

 

If RCL can make it through the shut down and is once again able to operate as it was in the past it will be left with very few customers because those that were thinking of a cruise will most likely wait a little and those like us who were loyal to you for 20 years and have obtained Diamond, Elite and Discover + status will be on another Brand and never be back. Because of what is happening now.

 

Management is responsible for these decisions today and they will have to answer tomorrow.

 

If you have the ability to reach the people at the top, now is your time to do so. Tomorrow will be too late. All the good work you have been doing and will do in the short term will be a waste of time.

 

This is no longer the time to ask for our understanding. It is the time to act. Send a message to Larry. I did three days ago with no response.

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On 3/31/2020 at 3:02 PM, MakingUpForLostTime said:

It has been 21 days since the cancellation of the cruise. Since we are expecting full refund as part of our compensation and the cruise as scheduled would have finished the cruise 3 days ago if we would have left, do you not think that it is only proper that we receive the money which we are owed?

 

People working from home is not the problem, management not releasing the funds is the problem. There are no calculations just a full refund which should have been started 3 weeks ago as we were the first cancellation Azamara accounting had to process.  

 

I too was booked on the 17th March 20 sailing and could not agree more with your comments. This certainly is the cruise that keeps giving, stress that is. Firstly, Azamara's management of the situation leading up to the cancellation of the sailing was beyond poor. But now the management of refunds is even worse. Given the way other cruise lines have dealt with this situation e.g Viking etc - it raises the question why anyone would ever take the chance and sail with Azamara again?  

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On 3/25/2020 at 4:56 PM, Host Grandma Cruising said:

Yes, quite. Everyone’s finding it hard at present and we should all think a bit before complaining, whichever cruise line we’re talking about - or even whichever company. I spent an hour on the phone today trying to talk to my bank. I eventually got through, but the customer service person I spoke to said exactly the same thing - people working from home in much less than ideal circumstances (especially regarding equipment etc) and not everyone able to work.

 

On 3/25/2020 at 4:41 PM, BBMacLaird said:

We continue to ask for your patience. As a side note, please keep in mind that all of Florida is under a statewide lockdown. Employees of all lines are working from home and doing the best they can in this unprecedented situation. 

 

Yes, I am sure that your customers understand it is a difficult time for everyone. However, there is a massive difference in the service that Azamara is offering. If you want to book a cruise, your call will be answered almost straight away. However, if you want customer service or to get someone to refund your money you have a very long wait - so my question is, why is it only the customer service and accounts staff at Azamara that have been so badly affected? Be honest and admit Azamara simply do not want to give people their money back.

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Have you read and reread the new CDC requirements for Cruise companies, like a full medical facility on board, plus many other safety regulations.  You will never see prices like the ones you booked ever again.  Those FCC credits will be not worth a lot for you when booking a new cruise

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35 minutes ago, lasvegaswinner1 said:

Have you read and reread the new CDC requirements for Cruise companies, like a full medical facility on board, plus many other safety regulations.  You will never see prices like the ones you booked ever again.  Those FCC credits will be not worth a lot for you when booking a new cruise

 

More likely, profit margins will drop.  

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2 hours ago, lasvegaswinner1 said:

Have you read and reread the new CDC requirements for Cruise companies, like a full medical facility on board, plus many other safety regulations.  You will never see prices like the ones you booked ever again.  Those FCC credits will be not worth a lot for you when booking a new cruise

 
I don't fully agree with lasvegaswinner1 regarding the CDC regulations massively boosting cruise fares and thereby reducing the value of Future Cruise Credits. Here are my reasons:
  1. Yes the new CDC regulations will require some (but not extensive) expanded medical accommodation on most cruise ships, more rigorous disposal procedures for contaminated waste and additional medical PPE. This will certainly need some capital investment. Additional staff and training are also likely to be needed to operate these facilities if they are required to be activated. 
  2. If you add $10 per person per day to current cruise fares, on a 700 passenger ship, for example, that generates an extra $7,000 per day. It is not possible that the operation of the additional facilities, staff, etc could come anywhere near this number per day. The $ number increases proportionately with larger ships.
  3. Remember that medical treatment on cruise ships is not free. It is very expensive compared with on shore medical treatment (in Australia at least). That is not going to change so the user will continue to pay. 
  4. Cruise lines are in a dilemma. They need to attract new bookings urgently and restore confidence for their loyal passengers. Yes, they could take advantage of the large number of Future Cruise Credits to be redeemed and increase prices to gouge people who need to spend their FCCs. This would undoubtedly lead to a furore on forums and a loss of the repeat bookings that cruise lines need to survive. On the other hand, cruise lines could offer discounts to get new bookings flowing. There is clearly no need to discount extensively while so many FCCs are in circulation. However, people who opted for a refund will likely rebel if they attempt to rebook and find prices have increased substantially. These people can choose to book or not, and with any cruise line. Better to get them to rebook with the line that refunded their fare, so the offers need to be attractive.
No doubt, cruise lines are working through scenarios to try to find a way through so that they remain viable and don't alienate loyal customers. On a more cynical note, I am sure that cruise lines are in it for the money and not for the financial benefit of passengers. It was ever thus. 
 
PS. We are also waiting for two Azamara refunds. We will take them at their word and wait the 30 days promised for refunds. After that we would be much less understanding.
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You can't just raise prices and have the same demand for product.  It doesn't work that way.  Not only that, but demand for cruising and getting new people to cruise isn't going to be there.  This industry is going to take it hit.  It was a great business and, hopefully, will still be a very good business.  That's why they kept building new ships.  New ship building orders will really slow down and the industry will attempt be in a maintain (not growth environment).  

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23 hours ago, Cruising Kangaroo said:
 
I don't fully agree with lasvegaswinner1 regarding the CDC regulations massively boosting cruise fares and thereby reducing the value of Future Cruise Credits. Here are my reasons:
  1. Yes the new CDC regulations will require some (but not extensive) expanded medical accommodation on most cruise ships, more rigorous disposal procedures for contaminated waste and additional medical PPE. This will certainly need some capital investment. Additional staff and training are also likely to be needed to operate these facilities if they are required to be activated. 
  2. If you add $10 per person per day to current cruise fares, on a 700 passenger ship, for example, that generates an extra $7,000 per day. It is not possible that the operation of the additional facilities, staff, etc could come anywhere near this number per day. The $ number increases proportionately with larger ships.
  3. Remember that medical treatment on cruise ships is not free. It is very expensive compared with on shore medical treatment (in Australia at least). That is not going to change so the user will continue to pay. 
  4. Cruise lines are in a dilemma. They need to attract new bookings urgently and restore confidence for their loyal passengers. Yes, they could take advantage of the large number of Future Cruise Credits to be redeemed and increase prices to gouge people who need to spend their FCCs. This would undoubtedly lead to a furore on forums and a loss of the repeat bookings that cruise lines need to survive. On the other hand, cruise lines could offer discounts to get new bookings flowing. There is clearly no need to discount extensively while so many FCCs are in circulation. However, people who opted for a refund will likely rebel if they attempt to rebook and find prices have increased substantially. These people can choose to book or not, and with any cruise line. Better to get them to rebook with the line that refunded their fare, so the offers need to be attractive.
No doubt, cruise lines are working through scenarios to try to find a way through so that they remain viable and don't alienate loyal customers. On a more cynical note, I am sure that cruise lines are in it for the money and not for the financial benefit of passengers. It was ever thus. 
 
PS. We are also waiting for two Azamara refunds. We will take them at their word and wait the 30 days promised for refunds. After that we would be much less understanding.

No more inside cabins with 4 people sharing a room. All rooms and public areas disenfected all day long

No more self serve buffets.  Less seating in all dining areas.  Less seating in show rooms. less Shore excursions passangers 

  All pasanger will have temperature and other health screenings every port going on and off.

Travel insurance will become mandatory Way more crew and staff. Sounds like costs going way up

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On 4/14/2020 at 1:18 AM, lasvegaswinner1 said:

No more inside cabins with 4 people sharing a room. All rooms and public areas disenfected all day long

No more self serve buffets.  Less seating in all dining areas.  Less seating in show rooms. less Shore excursions passangers 

  All pasanger will have temperature and other health screenings every port going on and off.

Travel insurance will become mandatory Way more crew and staff. Sounds like costs going way up

Cannot see any travel insurance policy covering COVID 19 for bookings made after March 2020. The risks of falling ill, perhaps requiring hospitalisation & ICU and being prohibited from flying home is uninsurable. Until a vaccine is found, I see this as the biggest problem for the travel/cruise industry. Cost of self-funding care abroad could wipe you out. 

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On 4/12/2020 at 8:18 PM, Cruising Kangaroo said:
 
I don't fully agree with lasvegaswinner1 regarding the CDC regulations massively boosting cruise fares and thereby reducing the value of Future Cruise Credits. Here are my reasons:

 

Nothing ever really boosts cruise prices other than demand.  If anyone thinks cruise lines don't charge as much as what the market will bear, then you don't understand economics.  Does anyone really think that Azamara charges more Japan in spring time other than that it's an incredibly popular time for tourism?  Demand for cruising is going to drop and prices will drop as well.  However, the glut of all of these 125% cruise credits on the market is an artificial price increase for cruise lines.  For 2021, if you combine the flooding of the market with the cruise credits with the long term booking already out there for 21. and you get prices that are not sustainable in the long run.  The industry is hoping that once they get a year of normal operations back on line that enough customers come back to justify close to 2019 pricing.  Time will tell if that strategy works.  

 

 

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Hi. We received 50% refund and 50% future cruise credit for the May 26 Barcelona Quest cruise.  Under normal circumstances we have a great time on cruises, so I’m not here to knock them.  But, due to obvious issues pertaining to coronavirus, we don’t have ANY enthusiasm about booking a cruise with our FCC.  Does anyone have any insight into whether we have any options in regards to using or losing our fcc?

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3 hours ago, Maybelle mom said:

Hi. We received 50% refund and 50% future cruise credit for the May 26 Barcelona Quest cruise.  

  Does anyone have any insight into whether we have any options in regards to using or losing our fcc?

 

You have actually received 50% refund and 50% FCC for a May 26 cruise you have cancelled ? ?

 

No insight sorry. At the risk of sounding a little trite, be grateful you have 50% of your cash back !

 

We still have nothing for our 17 March cruise cancelled by Azamara ! !

 

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Oh, Baynanno, that’s terrible.  I hope you get compensated for your cancelled cruise.  

My question was for those people who got FCC, though. I was wondering if any of them were in a quandary. That’s the position I’m in.  Far less awful than your’s Baynanno, but irksome nonetheless. 

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It seems to me that the people who received 50%cash and 50% FCC received their refunds faster than those who got the 100%cash or 125%fcc. It took me almost a month to receive the 50/50 cash and FCC but at least I received it. A bird in the hand...and all that!😁😁

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2 hours ago, ptrpanpens said:

It seems to me that the people who received 50%cash and 50% FCC received their refunds faster than those who got the 100%cash or 125%fcc. It took me almost a month to receive the 50/50 cash and FCC but at least I received it. A bird in the hand...and all that!😁😁

 

You too are lucky!

Indeed I believe you are quite right there as far as speed goes and I may be wrong, but I believe many of those have cancelled their cruises themselves.

 

Yet we are still waiting for our refund promised in an email from Azamara on 10 March for the 17 March cruise, one of the first Azamara cancelled.

 

As more cruises are cancelled each month, so the workload increases for those handling compensation. It irks to hear of refunds being received for more recently cancelled cruises while we continue to wait . . . . . . 🤐

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15 minutes ago, Baynanno1 said:

 

You too are lucky!

Indeed I believe you are quite right there as far as speed goes and I may be wrong, but I believe many of those have cancelled their cruises themselves.

 

Yet we are still waiting for our refund promised in an email from Azamara on 10 March for the 17 March cruise, one of the first Azamara cancelled.

 

As more cruises are cancelled each month, so the workload increases for those handling compensation. It irks to hear of refunds being received for more recently cancelled cruises while we continue to wait . . . . . . 🤐

 

I also cancelled on March 10 but the cruise was for May 14. I received my fcc letter in about two weeks but they did not attach the FCC to it so it had to be redone. It took me almost two more weeks to receive the 50% cash refund for the cruise and the air refund but at lest I received it. I still can’t figure out how it was computed but since it was a little more than I expected I just accepted it and moved on.

 

Reading these boards I realize I was lucky.

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9 hours ago, Baynanno1 said:

 

As more cruises are cancelled each month, so the workload increases for those handling compensation. It irks to hear of refunds being received for more recently cancelled cruises while we continue to wait . . . . . . 🤐

 

That is very naughty. There should be regulations that dictate refunds be paid in chronological order. 

 

We had a little situation in the UK a few years back with a FOREX firm called Crown Currency Exchange (shudder). Some UK posters might remember them. Anyway, when they ran into financial difficulties they selectively chose who to refund and who to delay. Turned out, those that got there money back lived closest to their offices in Cornwall,  we suspect in an effort to stop the locals arriving with pitch forks. No relevance to Az situation, I'm sure, but they should be dealing with refunds is proper order.

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ptrpanpens . . . words fail me . . . they don't really, but are not printable here . . . .  🤐

 

Cruiser6270 . . . interestingly, I have noticed most of those who have been refunded live in USA . . . others are unknown, as their country of residence is not displayed. 🤔

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Some help please, sorry if these points are already covered elsewhere.

 

As per Azamara website -

If you’re scheduled to sail with us before 11 June, you will receive a 125% Future Cruise Credit to rebook with us 
 by 31 December 2021 for any sailing through 30 April 2022.
This amount will be based on your total cruise fare paid. And, we’re giving you a little extra, knowing that this 

is such a unique circumstance.

 

I have just had notification of a cancelation of a late May 2020 cruise. Trying to calculate my entitlement to make future cruise decisions, i.e. is it best to take a 100% refund, or a FCC, through a combination of Azamara direct and my TA, the FCC offered to myself is clearly 125% of cruise fare, minus any taxes and fees. Whereas I expected to be offered the 25% uplift on the cruise fare, plus 100% refund of taxes and fees, or perhaps even 125% of total cruise fare paid, which in my simple mind, is all the money I paid to Azamara for this cruise, my total invoice value. The %'s will change on every calculation depending on the amount of taxes and fees, but in my case the FCC represented a 16.6% uplift on total invoice value and not the 125% FCC widely advertised. Is that the experience of anybody else?

 

A second point -

 

As per Celebrity website -

Can you use your Future Cruise Credit (FCC) on an existing booking?

Yes. FCCs can be applied to an existing booking.

 

Having searched the Azamara site and also on advice from my TA, it seems that Azamara are only allowing FCC to be used against new bookings. I have another Azamara cruise booked later this year and would like to use the FCC received as part payment. Celebrity are allowing this to happen, are Azamara?

 

 

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I find myself in the same boat (🙄), so I am interested to read whatever you discover.

 

I don't know whether the following helps.

 

I posted a similar query related to validity of these FCC's elsewhere in these boards. I received a response as follows:

The wording in the Cruise with Confidence statement says ‘you have the option to cancel any voyage sailing now through September 1, 2020, and receive a 100% Future Cruise Credit – good toward voyages that depart through December, 31 2021’.
It doesn’t say good for new bookings! Anyway that’s what I will point out to my TA if we do end up cancelling and the Cruise with Confidence policy still applies to cruises departing in October.

 

Now: note that this refers to 100% refund, not the 125% offer. 

 

My next cruise (fully-paid) with Azamara is in July. My TA is aware of the fact that I have another cruise booked with Azamara, but she may not have been aware of any potential limitation on these specific FCC's.

 

Please keep this thread updated! I have a substantial sum at stake: we have paid for a suite! 

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On 3/12/2020 at 6:09 PM, BBMacLaird said:

Dear Bromley,

I am unprepared to answer questions just yet. But given your cruises are in August 2020 and beyond, I ask for your patience.

I'm sure there will be plenty of updates well before you're within final payment. 

Please ask me again when we get close to that date, if you haven't had your questions answered.

And thank you for your loyalty to Azamara. We really appreciate it ❤️

On 3/12/2020 at 1:48 PM, Bromley said:

Hello Bonnie,

 

We have a couple of cruises already booked and would like to ask a few questions:

 

Q1. We are currently booked on a cruise, where a Future Cruise Certificate was applied.
If we need to cancel, do we get it back ? 

 

Q2. The Cruise With Confidence policy currently applies to cruise sailing up to 31st July 2020. Will this date be reviewed as the virus situation develops ? Our cruise departs 1st August 2020.

 

Q3. We have another cruise booked for 2021, when hopefully this virus situation will be resolved.
If our 2020 cruise need to be cancelled and we get back the original Future Cruise Certificate, we wondered whether it could be applied to the 2021 cruise. We acknowledge that current policy is that an FCC cannot be applied to an existing booking, but wondered if this might be relaxed with the consequences of the current situation.

 

Q4. On our 2020 cruise booked we have been granted a substantial OBC. If this cruise needs to cancelled would this OBC be transferable to another cruise. Our existing 2021 cruise or would it be a new booking ?

 

 

This post appears to be unanswered. In particular the answer to Q3 is of particular interest to me.

Do you have answers, please?

(I apologise if you have already replied elsewhere) 

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On 3/12/2020 at 6:09 PM, BBMacLaird said:

Dear Bromley,

I am unprepared to answer questions just yet. But given your cruises are in August 2020 and beyond, I ask for your patience.

I'm sure there will be plenty of updates well before you're within final payment. 

Please ask me again when we get close to that date, if you haven't had your questions answered.

And thank you for your loyalty to Azamara. We really appreciate it ❤️

On 3/12/2020 at 1:48 PM, Bromley said:

Hello Bonnie,

 

We have a couple of cruises already booked and would like to ask a few questions:

 

Q1. We are currently booked on a cruise, where a Future Cruise Certificate was applied.
If we need to cancel, do we get it back ? 

 

Q2. The Cruise With Confidence policy currently applies to cruise sailing up to 31st July 2020. Will this date be reviewed as the virus situation develops ? Our cruise departs 1st August 2020.

 

Q3. We have another cruise booked for 2021, when hopefully this virus situation will be resolved.
If our 2020 cruise need to be cancelled and we get back the original Future Cruise Certificate, we wondered whether it could be applied to the 2021 cruise. We acknowledge that current policy is that an FCC cannot be applied to an existing booking, but wondered if this might be relaxed with the consequences of the current situation.

 

Q4. On our 2020 cruise booked we have been granted a substantial OBC. If this cruise needs to cancelled would this OBC be transferable to another cruise. Our existing 2021 cruise or would it be a new booking ?

 

 

This post appears to be unanswered. In particular the answer to Q3 is of particular interest to me.

Do you have answers, please?

(I apologise if you have already replied elsewhere) 

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