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Post-Corona What Changes Would You Like To See With Cruises?


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1 hour ago, phoenix_dream said:

Or the problem can be solved by carrying a small hand sanitizer in your purse or pocket and using it after you have handled the menu.  Been doing it for years.  

 

There are always the sensible people. The people who carry sanitizer, the people who cough or sneeze into their arm, the people who wash their hands before entering the buffet, the people who do not board cruise ships when sick... Health precautions are implemented because there are a great many people who do not follow one or all of those sensible actions.

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36 minutes ago, Pinboy said:

IMO--- This is the most realistic answer.

Staff to serve food in the buffet , Staff to enforce washing hands or use sanitizer or no entrance to buffet or dining room, and lastly, if you are sick--- cancel your cruise !!!!!

I would also like the see Staff tell, not ask, " slobs " that don't adhere to the above and come " barging in " laughing and sweating to " Get the xxx out ,and clean up before coming  back ".  We all have seen that Staff are too timid for fear of complaint by " slob " to GR. 

 

 

You would be surprised though at the number of people who would find even your suggestions to be a "burden". Someone is always going to be unhappy with rules.

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1 hour ago, WonderMan3 said:

 

There are always the sensible people. The people who carry sanitizer, the people who cough or sneeze into their arm, the people who wash their hands before entering the buffet, the people who do not board cruise ships when sick... Health precautions are implemented because there are a great many people who do not follow one or all of those sensible actions.

Great thread! I wash my hands on cruise ships before I touch my privates. You just dont know what my hands have touched.:classic_blush: 

Have Luminae, Blu and specialty restaurants open for lunch on port days. 

 

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19 hours ago, Baron Barracuda said:

When cruising re-starts don't expect ships to be very full, so lots of opportunity for social distancing.   They can do all the thermal scans they want but the non-symptomatic will still slip through.  

 

Once a vaccine emerges and I get my shot I am safe.  Doesn't matter whether others are vaccinated or not.  Have no problem though if they try to require proof of vaccination.  I'm sure civil libertarians will have an issue as they do with requiring kids to be vaccinated in order to attend school. 

 

 

You are safe only if the vaccine is 100% effective. The flu shot is rarely even 50% effective. I still get the flu shot and would get a shot for this. I would not object to a proof of inoculation.

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The COVID-19 PCR test in the US has been widely reported to show a lot of False Negative results.  Many doctors are advising patients who think they have the symptoms but had a negative test result to stay in quarantine anyway.  The test kits were developed very rapidly and rushed into use for very good reasons.  But not 100% accurate unfortunately.

 

https://www.livescience.com/covid19-coronavirus-tests-false-negatives.html

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56 minutes ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

Exactly.  Lots of emphasis on testing and that's great for those who are symptomatic...not so much for those who show no symptoms.

 

So what is your take away from this?  Just curious...

We won't consider cruising until there is a vaccine.

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1 hour ago, OuiOnboard said:

We won't consider cruising until there is a vaccine.

My wife and I are going to enjoy our Long Beach, beautiful beach this summer! 😉

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Since the virus will mutate several times in the next 12-18 months, just like the flu vaccine, this vaccine will be a bit of a shot in the dark. 
We still have our January 2021 Reflection cruise booked, data over the next few months will be crucial to our decision.

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36 minutes ago, PTC DAWG said:

Re a vaccine...they have a Flu Vaccine...tens of thousands still die from it every year. 

You do realize that many of those that die have NOT be vaccinated.  Of course you do....

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On 4/2/2020 at 2:42 PM, billdddd said:

my thoughts are. 1 it is going to be a longGGGGGGGGGGG time. once a vaccine is found or you have letter from dr that you have survived corona. you will need to show a vaccinated card. no card no entry to ship.only way.... it is not going away. everyone will a vaccination or it will never go away.

Interesting.  Could expand it to reflect Flu shots too?

 

For noro, could they haveforced hand washing stations for entering eating areas and for leaving bathrooms?

 

 

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On 4/2/2020 at 5:45 PM, WonderMan3 said:

 

We will eventually have minutes tests for this virus. Not sure there will be cruising though as long as this is virus is active and if a new virus comes along there won't be minutes tests for it right away. My suggestions are more to stop the spread of the typical viruses (noro, colds, flu) as opposed to something unexpected like CoVid. But if you have procedures like this already in place it could definitely help limiting spread for any new unexpected virus.

That is an issue for cruise lines.  By September, flu season will be starting up and if covid 19 is seasonal and also starts up this fall/winter with no vaccine, it may be impossible to fill a ship's cabins.  

 

Having said the above, maybe for the first few months, cruise lines might sail, say 50% capacity vs higher.

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There are some dozen different tests today. The almost instant test by Abbot is probably the most accurate - reportedly about 80-90% according to CNN this morning - with others having huge numbers of false positives and negatives.  What is a joke is waiting a week to get test results.  Take a look at Texas where they have no idea of the number tested, in hospitals or infected.  All done locally or by county - about 200 counties in Texas - and reported whenever.

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2 hours ago, ECCruise said:

You do realize that many of those that die have NOT be vaccinated.  Of course you do....

And I would suspect that some of those who die HAVE been vaccinated.  I don't think these numbers are published anywhere, so this is all just idle speculation.

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21 minutes ago, Happy Cruiser 6143 said:

And I would suspect that some of those who die HAVE been vaccinated.  I don't think these numbers are published anywhere, so this is all just idle speculation.

Actually there are a number of studies that have been cited.  Relating to both children and adults.  And yes, vaccinated people did die from Influenza B.

But what is the point?  That since you can die with a vaccination you should skip it when it is available?

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On 4/5/2020 at 1:04 PM, Mike981 said:

Since the virus will mutate several times in the next 12-18 months, just like the flu vaccine, this vaccine will be a bit of a shot in the dark. 
We still have our January 2021 Reflection cruise booked, data over the next few months will be crucial to our decision.

 We are scheduled to do a B2B on Reflection in January 2021, seriously considering slipping both until later in the year with the hopes that a vaccine will be out.  Only time will tell.

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I think that for the first time ever, the cruise lines know that their bottom lines (and very existence) are at stake. A norovirus outbreak here and there never really put the fear of God into to them that they have now since Uncle Sam isn't going to be helping them out.

Going forward I think you're going to see a lot more screening at ports, and enforcement of pax activity onboard. In the past it might have been about not wanting to "rock the boat" (pun intended); now it's all about getting people onboard to spend money, which they will not do unless their health is guaranteed. I'd imagine security will be on the lookout for pax who exhibit signs of illness - I can also see the cruise contracts being amended to say that you can be compelled to be seen by the ship's medical staff if you're suspected of being sick.

Until a vaccine or some type of cure is found I expect you will continue to see enforcement of health policies that restrict seniors over 70, and those with ongoing health issues. The cruise lines are in a fight for their very survival, and some will not make it. I know I will not set foot on a ship unless my they health of my family and friends is secured.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

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On 4/5/2020 at 4:13 PM, Happy Cruiser 6143 said:

And I would suspect that some of those who die HAVE been vaccinated.  I don't think these numbers are published anywhere, so this is all just idle speculation.

Yes check out the US CDC site on Influenza for some numbers.

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12 hours ago, JonnyCT81 said:


Until a vaccine or some type of cure is found I expect you will continue to see enforcement of health policies that restrict seniors over 70, and those with ongoing health issues. The cruise lines are in a fight for their very survival, and some will not make it. I know I will not set foot on a ship unless my they health of my family and friends is secured.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk
 

 

Well good luck with restricting those over 70.  I'd say we're 40-50% of their passengers.  I just finished cancelling around $50,000 of cruises for this year.  Won't be back as long as they discriminate against those over 70.

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I don't think cruise enthusiasts on this forum really understand the degree of disdain the general populace has over cruises right now.  The whole celebrity eclipse and  ruby princess won't be looked on favorably.  That the cruise lines are willing to basically go through any means to not get their ship locked down and get passengers off will not bode well for restarting until a vaccine.

 

When the quarantine restrictions are lifted and we go into a surveillance mode, I think cruises will be one of the last to start up if they do start up at all.  It's non-essential leisure.  No community is going to accept having the risk of coronavirus spread just so some minority of relatively wealthy people can have their cruise fix. 

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Thanks, @UnorigionalName , for a touch of realism.

16 hours ago, UnorigionalName said:

When the quarantine restrictions are lifted and we go into a surveillance mode, I think cruises will be one of the last to start up if they do start up at all.  It's non-essential leisure.  No community is going to accept having the risk of coronavirus spread just so some minority of relatively wealthy people can have their cruise fix. 

A lot of wishful assumptions are being made.

1.  An effective vaccine or treatment -- I hope so, but there are many viral and bacterial diseases that have had vaccine research and trials for over 40 years with no workable vaccine.  Science keeps progressing, but viral vaccines and treatments are few and far between.  I pray we get a successful vaccine, but the odds are about even.

2.  You can screen for Covid19 and prevent infected people from entering a cruise ship.  No, you can not.  You can spread the disease for days before you have any symptoms.  More importantly, 20-30% of people who have the disease never have any symptoms at all.  Testing for current disease has poor sensitivity.   Testing for convalescence antibodies is the best way to show prior infection and a lesser likelihood of being susceptible to some diseases, but we don't yet know if there is any long-term protection from a prior infection of COVID19 yet.  Many respiratory viruses do not confer any lasting immunity.  Some children get RSV several times a winter.  Finally, the presence of antibodies don't always equate to disease resistance.  

3.  This is not the last novel respiratory virus we will ever see.  Various SARS and MERS have appeared in the past 20 years and there will be more.  This one happened to be more contagious that prior ones  There is no way to tell how severe/infectious the next one will be.  Do you want to be on a cruise the next time this happens?

4.  The cruise lines will be able to stay financially "afloat".  The big 3 here, Carnival, Royal, and NCL are already in debt trouble and now have no income stream.  Their survival (especially NCL) is questionable.  If they don't restart soon, they will fail.  If they restart too soon, they will be shut down after the next outbreak.  They are in a lose-lose situation.  I bought some Carnival stock a long time ago for the perks, and while they are in the best financial shape of the 3, it will be a long time before it's worth anything (if ever).

Sorry to be so Debbie Downer.  I love cruising.  Or I used to. I am supposed to sail in early June from Venice.   Waiting on Celebrity to cancel it.  I can not believe they would be irresponsible enough to risk 1000s of people by launching that ship.  I may have been on my last floating petri dish. 

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1 hour ago, newcruiserdave said:

Thanks, @UnorigionalName , for a touch of realism.

A lot of wishful assumptions are being made.

1.  An effective vaccine or treatment -- I hope so, but there are many viral and bacterial diseases that have had vaccine research and trials for over 40 years with no workable vaccine.  Science keeps progressing, but viral vaccines and treatments are few and far between.  I pray we get a successful vaccine, but the odds are about even.

2.  You can screen for Covid19 and prevent infected people from entering a cruise ship.  No, you can not.  You can spread the disease for days before you have any symptoms.  More importantly, 20-30% of people who have the disease never have any symptoms at all.  Testing for current disease has poor sensitivity.   Testing for convalescence antibodies is the best way to show prior infection and a lesser likelihood of being susceptible to some diseases, but we don't yet know if there is any long-term protection from a prior infection of COVID19 yet.  Many respiratory viruses do not confer any lasting immunity.  Some children get RSV several times a winter.  Finally, the presence of antibodies don't always equate to disease resistance.  

3.  This is not the last novel respiratory virus we will ever see.  Various SARS and MERS have appeared in the past 20 years and there will be more.  This one happened to be more contagious that prior ones  There is no way to tell how severe/infectious the next one will be.  Do you want to be on a cruise the next time this happens?

4.  The cruise lines will be able to stay financially "afloat".  The big 3 here, Carnival, Royal, and NCL are already in debt trouble and now have no income stream.  Their survival (especially NCL) is questionable.  If they don't restart soon, they will fail.  If they restart too soon, they will be shut down after the next outbreak.  They are in a lose-lose situation.  I bought some Carnival stock a long time ago for the perks, and while they are in the best financial shape of the 3, it will be a long time before it's worth anything (if ever).

Sorry to be so Debbie Downer.  I love cruising.  Or I used to. I am supposed to sail in early June from Venice.   Waiting on Celebrity to cancel it.  I can not believe they would be irresponsible enough to risk 1000s of people by launching that ship.  I may have been on my last floating petri dish. 

 

David- you are a realist, not a Debbie-Downer (or David-Downer).

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