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SS Future Re-Open Plan: Timing, Testing Needs??!!


TLCOhio
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1 minute ago, Lois R said:

What time frame are you referring to though? It can't start here anytime "soon" with the way things are going........

looks like cases are going up worse now than they were back in the spring.........60,000 a day recently.😲

 

So, 100,000+ new cases per day in Europe and they are still cruising.  

 

Marc

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Mexico makes sense and certainly is a possibility but I still think after the new year.  Alaska in the winter.....hmmm.   They must mean next summer or maybe earlier in late spring.   Canada kind of in the way of those itineraries.   

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On 10/14/2020 at 6:31 PM, CruiserFromMaine said:

I watched a presentation this afternoon featuring Mark Conroy.  A few highlights:

-Hoping to start Caribbean cruises in December, probably late December.

-The Moon will come over to Ft. Lauderdale empty this fall.

-Masks will be required when social distancing is difficult

-Testing will be multiple times before embarking.

-All crew will get a vaccine once it’s available. They won’t require pax to have it.

-They will require pax to take their shore excursions through Silversea for the time being

-You can dine with other pax if you choose. Dining tables will be separated for social distancing.

 

Appreciate this excellent above summary and the many key points from our cruising friend from Maine.  Very interesting and helpful!!!  From the start of this thread way, way back in early May, it was based on a wide-range of serious information that I received from Silversea's top Americas' executive, Mark Conroy.  Most of these items seem along those original lines and nothing is too "new" and/or unexpectedly dramatically new.  BUT, I find of interest that phrasing of "Hoping to start Caribbean cruises in December."   Hoping is a key word!!  Your phrase or his?  Many good questions as to how much future credit is being offered by Silversea and other cruise lines.  What does it mean to only be offering a 100% credit??  Not a good sign, in my view with limited information.  

 

Clearly doing multiple pre-testing sounds very reasonable and good.  BUT, how will those "mechanics" and the testing "process" work.  I don't think they can just mail us a testing kit a week or so before we depart.  It's unclear as to who manages and funds these tests.  PLUS, most important, what happens (and pays) if you test as having Covid-19?  Many other very good posts that have been added recently on this thread.

 

From Travel + Leisure magazine today, they had this headline: “Major Cruise Lines Will Now Require COVID-19 Testing Prior to Embarkation” with these highlights: “As travelers slowly wade back into the waters of travel, cruise lines are finding ways to ease concerns about the close quarters and communal nature of their seafaring vessels. Now, several major cruise companies have agreed to implement new regulations that will require passengers to prove their negative COVID-19 status before embarking on any ships. The Cruise Lines International Association released a statement that all of its members worldwide have agreed to test passengers and crews on all ships with a capacity to carry 250 people or more. Only those with a negative test result will be allowed to embark. While most of these cruise lines have canceled their sailings through November, they may be revving up for a return to their North American ports before the end of the year.”

 

This article, like what was shared by Mark Conroy, gives no type of "road map" as to how this pre-cruising testing would work, who is at risk, payments/costs, etc., etc.  

 

Full story at:

https://www.travelandleisure.com/cruises/cruises-mandatory-covid-tests

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

AFRICA?!!?: Fun, interesting visuals, plus travel details from this early 2016 live/blog. At 50,229 views. Featuring Cape Town, South Africa’s coast, Mozambique, Victoria Falls/Zambia and Botswana's famed Okavango Delta.

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2310337

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O

18 hours ago, Lois R said:

I hope it is less than 2 years! I have a deposit down for an Oct 2021 cruise and hoping it will sail.

Fingers crossed for you for October 2021.Enjoy and let us know your experience of the new era of SS cruising which regular SS cruisers will value.

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10 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

 

PLUS, most important, what happens (and pays) if you test as having Covid-19? 

 

I agree that is a very important question that has not been clearly answered by SIlversea or RCCL.  While the standard terms and conditions of the passage contract provide that those denied boarding or disembarked early are entitled to no compensation, refund, FCC or other relief, I believe that Silversea and RCCL have an obligation to clearly and transparently answer the simple question you pose: 

 

If a passenger is denied boarding or disembarked early, will they receive a refund and if so, will it be a cash refund or FCC?

 

It is troubling that SIlversea and RCCL continue to market cruises departing as soon as early December without bringing clarity to that issue.  (And it isn't just Silversea, it appears no major cruise line has answered that question).  Failure to answer that question is s true disservice to those who entrust significant sums of money to the cruise industry for future travel. 

 

At this point, unless their travel insurance policy provides clear, unambiguous and specific coverage for such an event, each passenger should be prepared, in the event they are denied boarding or disembarked early, to forfeit all of their cruise payments AND bear all of the additional expenses of repatriation without reimbursement, remedy or recourse.

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My money is on a vaccine sufficient for us to cruise being available by mid-2021 - which is why we have been promised by SS via our TA that we can postpone (as soon as they release the dates this November) our Alaska cruise yet again to July 2022, and we will do.

 

I guess Mark Conroy wants people to keep booking (and postponing if still not able to travel) so they have some cash flow, and don't go under before 2022 - and that sounds reasonable to me.

 

PS Yes I think we will need to re-vaccinate each year - but I do that with the flu vaccine anyway. That's only £9 in the UK.

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12 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

BUT, I find of interest that phrasing of "Hoping to start Caribbean cruises in December."   Hoping is a key word!!  Your phrase or his? 


That was his wording. Hard in a a post to capture the full context of what he said, but I took his hope to be around 50-50 of cruising. 
 

In regards to the overall presentation, which was around 45 minutes if I recall, I thought it was encouraging to hear a major cruise line talk about restarting rather than which ships are going to the scrap yard. Cruising without masks and the ability to tour ports on your own is not going to happen without first cruising with masks and with exclusively ship-sponsored shore excursions. So let’s have that play out and go from there. We can each decide when we want to jump back in to cruising for ourselves.

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We too miss cruising, traveling, going out to dinner, visiting with family and friends living life to the fullest.

That said I am in my mid 60's with COPD stage 3 and my husband is mid 70's decent heath, we have been self-isolating since the beginning of this pandemic (mid-February).  This pandemic is frightening to us, one of the scariest of times was when I needed a battery replacement for my pacemaker, knowing I had to go to a medical facility and risk coming in contact with others. This pandemic is real to us.

I am reminded of how this pandemic and the AIDS epidemic in the early 80's were/are similar but all so different. We learned in HIV infection there was to be no cure at least not yet and maybe never, but it is treatable. We learned that a negative test result is only a snapshot in time. We learned it was NOT an airborne disease and it showed us that a negative test result will remain a negative only as long as that individual practiced safe protocols. It really came down to how patient X interacted with the people around them, and how the sanitary procedures of those they come in contact are adhered to. 

How they are different? We know with Covid it is an airborne virus, that can be contracted by close proximity, and that many experts suggest the use of masks, distancing and personal hygiene will help stop the spread.

And with Covid hopefully we will have a vaccine soon. I miss traveling, but if my last voyage was my last so be it. We will not rush, that is why our next booked adventure is not until 2022.

Just my take.

Stay Safe,

Joseph

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23 minutes ago, Lois R said:

Hi Joseph,  thanks for the nice post🙂 can you make the font one size larger though? (going forward).......even with

my readers on, that is really small print.

Sorry about that @Lois R I thought 12 was big enough for most (not me either)should I try 14 or 16 next post? 🙂

Joseph

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Chrism23 ... I have been reading the boards here, interested in what frequent cruisers have to say regarding COVID and sailing again.  Your post was very personal to me, as my brother died of AIDS in 1988.  He was 32.  A dancer with the San Francisco Opera Ballet.  He was one of the lucky ones, who had a loving family by his side, and great healthcare thanks to his union, the American Guild of Musical Artists.  I have been saying the same, although not quite as eloquently as you.  I have been calling it 'ground hog day', comparing the early research of COVID with the early research of HIV.  I too was on the front line of the battle, along with my mother, working with local AIDS orgs in the 80's.  I helped educate young people to the virus, however, I found many who refused to be educated.  Denial is strong in so many people.  We are seeing the same thing today we saw then.  All we can do is implore our fellow citizens to wear a mask, social distance, and use proper cleaning protocols.  

I am in entertainment, so I'm sure you know how my industry has been decimated.  Some of the original Artists of Silversea have had to leave New York, including a few who were in Broadway shows.  Broadway has announced they will not reopen until May of 2021, and even that may be pushed back to a later date.  My Music Director for the Artists of Silversea program was writing the music for Radio City's new Christmas Spectacular, which of course has been cancelled this year, and now, next year is in doubt as well.

These are trying times indeed for many industries, not just the cruise lines, and entertainment.  Europe has now surpassed the US in cases, with cases in the US up 29% in the last two weeks.  We are not finished with this by a long shot.  My post here is a long way of saying, thank you for sharing your story.  My hope is that your post results in more people taking this virus more seriously.

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11 minutes ago, Older Party said:

I have been reading the boards here, interested in what frequent cruisers have to say regarding COVID and sailing again.  Your post was very personal to me, as my brother died of AIDS in 1988.  He was 32. All we can do is implore our fellow citizens to wear a mask, social distance, and use proper cleaning protocols.   I am in entertainment, so I'm sure you know how my industry has been decimated. These are trying times indeed for many industries, not just the cruise lines, and entertainment.  Europe has now surpassed the US in cases, with cases in the US up 29% in the last two weeks.  We are not finished with this by a long shot.  My post here is a long way of saying, thank you for sharing your story.  My hope is that your post results in more people taking this virus more seriously.

 

Sincerely appreciate the above comments and follow-up from Older Party.  Your posting puts a very "personal" connection as to what has been happening.  And, not!  Sadly!  Many people have been very directly impacted!!  Others not as much!!??  As the original poster on this thread, I have tried to be very, very realistic in sharing a wide range of hopefully solid information as to what it will take to resume safe, reasonable sailing and traveling.  If and when!!??   My view has been that such a re-opening will not be as quick and simple as some have hoped.  Your point about Europe's high numbers is an important reminder as to this being a world-wide challenge where few have figured out the perfect solutions and fixes.  Keep up the great sharing on this thread.  

 

From the Wall Street Journal this morning, they had this headline: “Should You Travel Abroad During Covid— and Where Can You Go?” with this sub-head: "Two avid travelers debate the merits and madness of vacationing overseas right now. Plus: A look at 5 of the few—and especially tempting—countries that now welcome U.S. tourists."

 

Here are some of their story highlights on one side of the debate/discussion: “The thought of air travel is the first stumbling block. Even before Covid, boarding a plane felt like stepping into a petri dish to germaphobes like me. But even if all seats are sold on a two-hour flight, the probability of getting Covid-19 from a nearby passenger is one in 4,300, according to a recent MIT study (They don’t have data for long-haul flights.) Airlines say that high-tech HEPA filters ensure that the air on planes is cleaner than that found in many restaurants or shopping malls.  America’s rising virus rates do raise the question: Am I being a jerk by exposing overseas communities to possible infection?”

 

Here is more on the other side: "Right now the fares are low, planes and hotels have lots of room, and destinations are eager for business. Why not take advantage? Given the distressing state of the domestic landscape, is an international jaunt the ticket?  Are you kidding me? Are you mad? Okay, so the canaries flying the skies in the world’s airplanes don’t seem to be getting any sicker than the rest of us still down on the surface. But no, no thank you very much, this old budgie is not currently drawn to budging.  Life is always unpredictable. But right now, that’s not so much fun. Changing flight schedules, longer or shorter waiting times, public bathrooms, seat mates, taxis and car rentals, all with face mask and hand sanitizer."

 

This WSJ profile cited: "Five countries— among the few open to Americans—tempting adventurers with their outdoor diversions."  Those areas listed with details included Barbados, Croatia, Ecuador, French Polynesia and Zambia/Victoria Falls.  In recent years, we have been to four of these five spectacular areas.  All nice and very interesting, including Tahiti in March of this year.  Had planned for Ecuador and the Galapagos Island in late January 2021, but that adventure has been postponed.  Others been to these locations?

 

Full story at:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/should-you-travel-abroad-during-covid-and-where-can-you-go-11602866626

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Kotor/Montenegro:  Exciting visual samples, tips, details, etc., for this scenic, historic location. Over 47,905 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1439193

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4 hours ago, chrism23 said:
4 hours ago, chrism23 said:

Joseph, Your post brought tears to my eyes.

 

@chrism23Thank you for the kind words and thank you for your years of service.

As @Older Party so graciously reminded us we all know people who have suffered, died and know those who by the grace of god lived to tell the story of our last big health crisis. Apparently citizens of the world go through such health crisis every 40-60 years 2020 Covid..Late 70 early 80s HIV... the 1918 spanish flu pandemic, and before that the 1862 cholera epidemic.. And most of us will get through this one as well..

I imagine during the outbreaks before my birth, society had pretty much the same reaction as we do today.. humanity doesn't fall far from its tree.

All we can do is protect ourselves and the one we love that will allow us to do so and wait it out..

In the meantime let's do just that and get back to dreaming of the time when we can all safely rejoin our love of travel and cruising, personally I for one cannot wait to have our first voyage on Silversea! 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Older Party said:

Chrism23 ... I have been reading the boards here, interested in what frequent cruisers have to say regarding COVID and sailing again.  Your post was very personal to me, as my brother died of AIDS in 1988.  He was 32.  A dancer with the San Francisco Opera Ballet.  He was one of the lucky ones, who had a loving family by his side, and great healthcare thanks to his union, the American Guild of Musical Artists.  I have been saying the same, although not quite as eloquently as you.  I have been calling it 'ground hog day', comparing the early research of COVID with the early research of HIV.  I too was on the front line of the battle, along with my mother, working with local AIDS orgs in the 80's.  I helped educate young people to the virus, however, I found many who refused to be educated.  Denial is strong in so many people.  We are seeing the same thing today we saw then.  All we can do is implore our fellow citizens to wear a mask, social distance, and use proper cleaning protocols.  

I am in entertainment, so I'm sure you know how my industry has been decimated.  Some of the original Artists of Silversea have had to leave New York, including a few who were in Broadway shows.  Broadway has announced they will not reopen until May of 2021, and even that may be pushed back to a later date.  My Music Director for the Artists of Silversea program was writing the music for Radio City's new Christmas Spectacular, which of course has been cancelled this year, and now, next year is in doubt as well.

These are trying times indeed for many industries, not just the cruise lines, and entertainment.  Europe has now surpassed the US in cases, with cases in the US up 29% in the last two weeks.  We are not finished with this by a long shot.  My post here is a long way of saying, thank you for sharing your story.  My hope is that your post results in more people taking this virus more seriously.

Sending you my heartfelt condolences and thank you for the post.

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21 minutes ago, rucrazy said:

@TLCOhio I very much appreciate your FACT based posts... thank you...  Joseph

 

Appreciate these above two kind and nice follow-ups from our "neighbor" in Maryland.  Do try to share key reporting that is both realistic and hopefully informative/helpful.  Not always "positive" and/or good news for those who want a quick return to some form of "normal".  Below are two examples of news stories that some will not welcome, nor celebrate. 

 

From MSN News and the Miami Herald yesterday, they had this headline: “Carnival ships will need court approval 60 days before restarting cruises, judge says” with these highlights: “A federal judge said she plans to require Carnival Corp. to certify that each of its cruise ships is compliant with its probation obligations 60 days before those ships reenter U.S. waters to restart cruises.  The forthcoming order from U.S. District Judge for the Southern District of Florida Patricia Seitz could inhibit the company’s plans to resume cruise operations in the United States on Dec. 1. Seitz made the announcement at a status conference Friday in the company’s ongoing criminal case for environmental crimes.  Seitz said the order will require ships to notify her 60 days in advance of reentering U.S. waters, and each ship will need a certification from CEO Arnold Donald regarding its environmental compliance status.  Carnival has been on probation since April 2017 after pleading guilty to environmental crimes — dumping oily waste into the ocean for a period of eight years from its Princes Cruises ships — and paying a $40 million fine.  Carnival lawyers David Kelly and David Markus begged her to reconsider. Kelly claimed her announcement had already hurt the company financially during the hearing. Markus said the order was 'not justified.'  'The market has already reacted to this,' Kelly said. 'This could have a huge negative impact on the company.' ”

 

Not sure how and/or if such a court order would affect Royal Caribbean, Silversea, NCL, etc.  But, it raises a "red flag" to Federal officials and other countries that the cruise lines do not have perfectly "clean hands" as to how they have operated and followed the rules during their recent years.  

 

From USA Today yesterday afternoon, they had this headline: Eight passengers test positive for COVID-19 on Costa Cruises ship” with these highlights: “Eight passengers who sailed on Costa Cruises' Costa Diadema have tested positive for COVID-19, Roger Frizzell, spokesperson for Carnival Corp., the parent company to Costa, confirmed to USA TODAY Friday. The cruise ship, which continued on its journey carrying all French passengers, will cut its voyage short as France has reinstated its state of health emergency in relation to COVID-19.  Costa Diadema, which was chartered by a French company and had all French passengers, departed from Genoa on Sept. 28 and ended its journey on Oct. 12.”

 

Full stories at:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/carnival-ships-will-need-court-approval-60-days-before-restarting-cruises-judge-says/ar-BB1a6w8v

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/cruises/2020/10/16/costa-cruises-eight-passengers-have-covid-19-cruise-ship-italy/3677815001/

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Dubrovnik!  Nice visual samples, tips, details, etc., for this super scenic location. Over 47,522 views.    

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1439227

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For our friends in the UK, are things as challenged and difficult as reflected in the below news article?  Seems that "things" are sliding downhill fast for some major parts of Europe.  Right or wrong?

 

From the London/UK Telegraph today, they had this headline: “Curfews planned across Europe as restrictions put UK holidays at risk” with these highlights: “More than half the population of England is now living under increased Covid-19 restrictions, including rules on domestic travel, while curfews are coming into effect across Europe. Pub-goers enjoyed a last night out in London on Friday before tier-two regulations came into force in the city – and several other areas of England – which prohibit different households from meeting indoors. In Paris, people headed to bars and restaurants ahead of month-long restrictions for the capital and eight other French cities that will affect around 20 million people from Saturday. Belgium, too, is set to impose a month-long curfew; Italy is also considering a nationwide curfew.”

 

From the New York Times yesterday, they had this headline: “The Future of Hotel Design," with this sub-headline: "Mobile guest rooms, enhanced contactless room controls, robotic servers and pop-up dining areas are just a few of the ideas hotel designers are considering for the post-Covid travel world.”

 

Here are a few of their "hotel future" story highlights: “Hotel occupancy is down 50 percent nationally in the pandemic-stifled world of travel. While hundreds of hotels nationwide remain closed because of the crisis, new hotels continue to open. Whether they are banking on the swell of tourism that many predict will follow the introduction of a vaccine, or bound financially to open, hoteliers are making plans for a future that now must consider new outbreaks and pandemics. Boutique hotels that once acted as cultural commons with art exhibitions and buzzy public spaces will be toned down and disperse guests rather that draw them together. Hotels have long been moving toward automation with self-check-out and keyless guest-room entry via cellphone. The pandemic has only heightened the importance of these features. Now, travelers can expect more automation.  Not every hotel can offer outdoor dining year-round. Neither can their restaurants thrive with the capacity restrictions forced by social distancing requirements. The solution: Make the entire hotel a dining area. And throw in robotic servers.”

 

As the hotels seek to innovate, what ideas will the cruise ship lines borrow and learn from their experiences to adapt for sailing use??

 

Full stories at:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/10/17/travel-covid-news-restrictions-quarantine-italy-greece-wales/

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/14/travel/future-hotel-design-virus.html

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Athens & Greece: Many visuals, details from two visits in a city with great history, culture and architecture.  Now at 36,524 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1101008

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3 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

Appreciate these above two kind and nice follow-ups from our "neighbor" in Maryland.

Terry, you are in one of my favorite places in Ohio.. Columbus .. lived in Bexley for many years while working in Columbus, at G.D Ritzy's and the Drake Student Union on the campus of OSU!

 

Joseph

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1 hour ago, TLCOhio said:

For our friends in the UK, are things as challenged and difficult as reflected in the below news article?  Seems that "things" are sliding downhill fast for some major parts of Europe.  Right or wrong?


I definitely and unfortunately will have to say “right” with four countries of what I call the Big Six reporting significantly increased cases it makes me very nervous.    France, Spain, and the United Kingdom have all taken a step back to more restrictions and I think Germany is on the verge with Merkel urging better adherence to present restrictions.   Not sure about what is happening in Italy or Greece my other two Big Six countries.   Italy suffered greatly during the first wave and as one of our favorite countries I’m holding my mental breath for them right now.  Greece somehow relatively dodged the first wave and I hope that continues.   I’m really hoping and praying for some positive news but there isn’t much of that right now.   

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10 minutes ago, worldtraveller99 said:

We have 10 to 14 day quarantines if we go to most European countries, and/or then come home.  So travel is out for us for the next 6 months certainly. I hope the vaccines being tested will bring new hope in the spring!


It is sad, almost heartbreaking.   ☹️  
 

I actually wrote the following for another forum but I think it fits here: 


I was just sitting in my front porch this morning watching the first few leafs start to fall from the trees in my front yard. What struck me was six months ago I was sitting on my porch watching these same trees putting out new leafs and hoping that the then emerging and growing pandemic would be short lived. In those six months the US has suffered over 200,000 deaths and the world very close to 1,000,000. Makes me a bit sad and also a little anxious as I really don’t see a short term resolution. I am concerned about this coming fall and winter without a viable vaccine or vaccines and effective treatments for the multiple symptoms. I’m afraid I’ll be sitting on my porch watching these same trees leaf out again next spring still hoping this will all be over soon.

 

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54 minutes ago, Randyk47 said:


It is sad, almost heartbreaking.   ☹️  
 

I actually wrote the following for another forum but I think it fits here: 


I was just sitting in my front porch this morning watching the first few leafs start to fall from the trees in my front yard. What struck me was six months ago I was sitting on my porch watching these same trees putting out new leafs and hoping that the then emerging and growing pandemic would be short lived. In those six months the US has suffered over 200,000 deaths and the world very close to 1,000,000. Makes me a bit sad and also a little anxious as I really don’t see a short term resolution. I am concerned about this coming fall and winter without a viable vaccine or vaccines and effective treatments for the multiple symptoms. I’m afraid I’ll be sitting on my porch watching these same trees leaf out again next spring still hoping this will all be over soon.

 

Randy, your post is spot on........things could have been so vastly different but as the time goes on, everything gets

worse....it is as if we have 2 different countries. In my opinion, anyway.......1/4 of the people (well, almost 1/2)

think nothing is wrong.....while the other part knows how wrong things are------it is really a sad, sad situation.

17 more days.........

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Terry...re your earlier query re UK .Things are deteriorating with a botched selective programme of top tier problem areas being introduced today based upon science,so they tell us! Daily cases UP ,Hospitals filling up to crisis point again,Daily death figures rising again.The instructions seem to be confusing the population with the resulting non compliance by large numbers of the population.Worst of all is the non adherence to latest Government Instructions being ignored by the Mayor of Manchester!! Happy days.

How can Cruising Companies plan worldwide holidays for us all who would love to cruise again when safe when the member countries of the UNITED Kingdom each have different regulations .The Governments are confused and so are the mere inhabitants.Are you any wiser Terry with my attempt at answering your straight forward and simple question.??

 

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