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Think twice about a chargeback...


oceanlovinmama
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45 minutes ago, Roberto256 said:

 

If a client has lost their job, and really needs the refund for essentials ... like food.

Should they wait?

 

 

Either my post wasn't clear or you didn't get it - of course they shouldn't wait.  I notified my T/A of my intentions to file a chargeback weeks ago, she offered to help in any way she could with documents etc. which is what an agent should do. The OP is only looking out for herself, it is pathetic.

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2 hours ago, Hawaiiorbust2021 said:


With all that said, I can’t believe people are treating their refund for their cruise like a bank account that won’t give them any money. $10,000 just to sail for 15 days and spend a single day each on four Hawaiian islands as well as a crummy last day in a crappy Mexican town...Seemed like money down the toilet just for a good time in the first place.


...Sounds like the answer in most cases is that people broke the bank to go on vacation expecting money to be free-flowing. If princess cruises goes bankrupt, The fault will lie with people who spent their life savings on a cruise and now want it back to survive. I have never actually been on a cruise before but I know that when I throw my time, energy and money into something... follow through until the end is crucial. It makes no sense to not support princess cruises through this troubled time.
 

If they file bankruptcy and go out of business, I will have lost a great deal of money, but I will not have sunk my life savings and my families future on a vacation...That’s just outright stupidity. Like having an emergency kit with nothing in it... Jumping out of a plane without a parachute... If you have kids like me, you just don’t take chances like that. I fully intended on never seeing that $10,000 again. I genuinely hope to get what I paid for but The way I see it, vacations are a gamble. A lot like going to a casino, you risk Certain amount of money in hopes of getting a exciting payout. Sometimes the money you wagered was well worth the risk. Other Times you walk away broke and upset. There are even times where you lose your money long before you ever even get to the casino, this might be one of those times. In any case you don’t go to Las Vegas with your rent money... So maybe you shouldn’t expect to feed your family on a credit card refund. Just saying!

 

 

I think you are miss reading the situation and how is life at the Santa Clarita office?  

 

I am sure plenty of us have plenty of money and did not take the risks you suggest and I know I do not have to save anything to go on a cruise if I want too and it does not break my bank.  Plus, we lived in Hawaii for many years and I find a cruise to Hawaii definitely not money well spent, if you want to truly experience Hawaii,  because you can have a much better vacation taking that money and staying on island and get a lot more for your money then a cruise.

 

The issue is with Princess who set into a contract with me,  had me pay a lot of money for a promised 31 day cruise, broke the contract by canceling a cruise with out a heads-up so I could have canceled myself and got my money back it other ways,  left me only 2 Options to chose from regrading receiving my money back and then proceed to lie, deceive, and make fraudulent claims that they were willing to refund my money in a timely manner and have not done so and are probably not going to do so either.

 

I have no idea where you are so wise to know about everyone's life situation on these boards and then give a moralistic lecture on why we need to be so kind and patient to poor little old misunderstood Princess Cruise Lines for not doing what they say they are doing.  Maybe you are use to being swindled but it is not something I tolerate and will do everything in my power to stop the culprit from hurting myself or my family.

 

I hope you get to go on your cruise next year but do not be surprised if a "deal seems to good to be true" it just might not happen."  Plus, it might be a long time before Hawaii allows cruise ships into its port again  so you might think about a true Hawaiian vacation and book a land stay for you and your family to enjoy Hawaii.  Aloha....

Edited by PrincessLuver
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18 hours ago, bluesea321 said:

 

You have posted the same message all over Cruise Critic, not nice.

Yes, on several forums.  And is called out on those forums as well,  To those waiting, I wish you the best and hope you get your refunds soon.  

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1 hour ago, BLK03GT said:

Either my post wasn't clear or you didn't get it - of course they shouldn't wait.  I notified my T/A of my intentions to file a chargeback weeks ago, she offered to help in any way she could with documents etc. which is what an agent should do. The OP is only looking out for herself, it is pathetic.

 

I apologize for not being clearer.  My comment was directed at the original poster, and possibly in a sarcastic manner.  

 

Lots of people have lost their jobs.   Lots of people have no income.

They need to do what is best for themselves, particularly for essentials.

 

For the original poster ... commision based positions are always risky.

Something can stop the supply chain.

Something can scare off buyers.

 

Or, another company can make a better widget, killing sales on the widgets you represent.

 

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3 hours ago, Hawaiiorbust2021 said:

As a first time cruiser, Who was due to leave on his first cruise on March 13 before princess cruise ships pulled the plug on the whole operation on March 12, I read all the posts here and my heart sinks.

 

Naturally, I was devastated like all of you and I almost felt like a family member and died the moment I got the news that I was not going on my cruise. I planned and saved and paid almost $10,000 for a 15 day Hawaii cruise for A family of four which took me over three years... It was supposed to be a make up honeymoon for our fifth anniversary because our wedding costs way too much for us to be able to afford a honeymoon at a time. All that planning, saving, working, dreaming... so much more went into my first cruise vacation than just money. I am by no means wealthy or even financially secure. I live paycheck to paycheck. Married with two kids, both of us have Full-time jobs. Me and my family probably went through and lost as much if not more than anyone here.


With all that said, I can’t believe people are treating their refund for their cruise like a bank account that won’t give them any money. $10,000 just to sail for 15 days and spend a single day each on four Hawaiian islands as well as a crummy last day in a crappy Mexican town...Seemed like money down the toilet just for a good time in the first place.
 

I read all of the plans that got canceled and all of the expectations you now have for your money and I ask myself...” I wonder if any of these people thought about their savings for emergency situations before they went and put their money into a cruise?” ...


...Sounds like the answer in most cases is that people broke the bank to go on vacation expecting money to be free-flowing. If princess cruises goes bankrupt, The fault will lie with people who spent their life savings on a cruise and now want it back to survive. I have never actually been on a cruise before but I know that when I throw my time, energy and money into something... follow through until the end is crucial. It makes no sense to not support princess cruises through this troubled time.
 

Like everyone else, I too have not received a refund. I did elect to leave my money with princess cruises and decided to rebook my cruise for next year. They offered a pretty sweet deal in cruise credit and despite the setback of The deposit required to be paid by cash or credit (more money out of my pocket), I decided to leave my money with the company and take my chances. I will not pay the deposit on the new cruise booking until they refund some of the money they claim they have to refund. In the meantime, they have been gracious about extending the deposit due date.
 

I was also told at first 30 days before a refund could be expected, only to be told after that had expired they would take up to 60 days. That deadline is almost up. I will most likely call and check the status if they have much of any as they have not really had much information before now. If nothing changes, I will request an extension on the deposit and sit back and wait longer.

 

If they file bankruptcy and go out of business, I will have lost a great deal of money, but I will not have sunk my life savings and my families future on a vacation...That’s just outright stupidity. Like having an emergency kit with nothing in it... Jumping out of a plane without a parachute... If you have kids like me, you just don’t take chances like that. I fully intended on never seeing that $10,000 again. I genuinely hope to get what I paid for but The way I see it, vacations are a gamble. A lot like going to a casino, you risk Certain amount of money in hopes of getting a exciting payout. Sometimes the money you wagered was well worth the risk. Other Times you walk away broke and upset. There are even times where you lose your money long before you ever even get to the casino, this might be one of those times. In any case you don’t go to Las Vegas with your rent money... So maybe you shouldn’t expect to feed your family on a credit card refund. Just saying!

 

I will hold onto the hope that I will one day be able to enjoy the paid vacation I have been planning for more than five years now. My confidence, sympathies, hopes and prayers are all with princess cruises as well as my money...Maybe we can all start hoping for the best otherwise we can all expect the worst. Either way, I planned my life to survive like only the Strong can... Cruise or no cruise, refund or bankruptcy... Life will go on for me.

Great post ..... just want to note that taxes / port expenses / fees / insurance amounts paid can be transferred from your Hawaii 2020 to Hawaii 2021 once they're done with processing your account (you can tell by seeing if you've got your FCC) so you might not have to come up with any more cash

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1 hour ago, PrincessLuver said:

I think you are miss reading the situation and how is life at the Santa Clarita office?  

The Santa Clarita office is closed by Governor Newsom. But did you mean the Seattle office? That's where the accounting office is. Oh yeah, it's closed by Governor Inslee. It's all being done in individual residences 

Edited by Ombud
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What’s the saying you can lead a horse to water but you can’t force it to drink...

 

There seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding of bankruptcy.  For the vast majority of companies of Princess’ size...bankruptcy is about shedding liabilities/debts and continuing on with the same executives collecting the same (and often higher) outrageous salaries despite their poor performance that likely got them to bankruptcy in the first place.  It happens when companies face ‘cash flow’ problems.  The absolute biggest indicator of an upcoming bankruptcy is a company failing to timely pay its obligations (sound familiar?).  
 

Trust me - none of you want to be an ‘unsecured creditors’ forced to file a proof of claim when and if bankruptcy rolls around.  The secured creditors and other priority debts such as the banks, the companies’ lawyers, the executives’ salary will be fully paid...the unsecured creditors, they in most situations get nothing and are forever precluded from trying to chase down the debt from the company.  
 

It is certainly your money to do with what you want. No one is forced to go a prudent collection route through the credit card company.   But advocating for others not to chase down their own hard earned money so a travel agent can collect a fee from the customer’s money (despite that a travel agent is supposed to advise for the benefit of their customer) does not sit well with me and seems that it is setting the travel agent up for liability in the event Princess ultimately does not pay the money back.
 

What does a travel agent know about Princess’ cash flow and financial well being?  I’d guess none.   Travel agents ought to consider their fiduciary/contractual obligations of loyalty, good faith and competence before advising their customers to gamble on Princess ultimately delivering.  

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1 minute ago, SCOOTERNINJA said:

It is certainly your money to do with what you want. No one is forced to go a prudent collection route through the credit card company.   But advocating for others not to chase down their own hard earned money so a travel agent can collect a fee from the customer’s money (despite that a travel agent is supposed to advise for the benefit of their customer) does not sit well with me and seems that it is setting the travel agent up for liability in the event Princess ultimately does not pay the money back.

 

 

I'm completely in agreement with you.  What's more, especially after all this time, I am so tired of people talking about the "unprecedented" nature of it all. It's unprecedented for everyone and other companies with much higher number of refunds seem to have no problems returning moneys owed.  It's not like Princess doesn't understand it's own refund process, even though we don't.  They knew even well before they cancelled on March 12 what all this would entail.  There should be very little impact due to working from home.

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11 minutes ago, CarelessAndConfused said:

There should be very little impact due to working from home.

kitchen table … wine … kids … pet … spouse … secure internet? … yeah, right ...

 

not defending Princess at all, but working from home, IF YOU ARE NOT SET UP FOR IT  is not that easy, I'm sure ...

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1 minute ago, voljeep said:

kitchen table … wine … kids … pet … spouse … secure internet? … yeah, right ...

 

not defending Princess at all, but working from home, IF YOU ARE NOT SET UP FOR IT  is not that easy, I'm sure ...

 

So you're saying that working from home brings down their effectiveness to a point that they can't work at all? VPN, email, zoom, cloud applications and working from home is that hard?  Tons of people have been doing it even before the pandemic.

 

If their employees are that inefficient, then they should be let go.  If their definition of working from is that of yours (e.g., spend first hour playing with cat, have sex with spouse in the second hour, spend hours 3-4 recovering and showering, spend hour 5 arranging the kitchen table in a way to maximize their mental efficiency, spend hour 6-7 turning on this VPN laptop because I don't normally push the power button on these things, hour 8 open the application for refunds...oops, that 8 hour day went by real fast)

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7 minutes ago, CarelessAndConfused said:

  Tons of people have been doing it even before the pandemic.

and I'm one of those … for 25+ years now … I'm set up for it, with a dedicated office

 

all I'm saying is, for the people not used to it, those who went to their cubicle , well, that's totally different

 

cruise cancelled by Princess - 30 days max for all refunds, paybacks, FCC, etc

cruise cancelled by you - 60 days max … 

 

day 61, contact credit card company for a chargeback, regardless of TA situation, is more than reasonable

 

edit … I filled up the Jeep on 4/8 - still have over 1/2 a tank left ...

 

stay safe

peace out

Edited by voljeep
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Just now, voljeep said:

and I'm one of those … for 25+ years now … I'm set up for it, with a dedicated office

 

all I'm saying is, for the people not used to it, those who went to their cubicle , well, that's totally different

 

cruise cancelled by Princess - 30 days max for all refunds, paybacks, FCC, etc

cruise cancelled by you - 60 days max … 

 

day 61, contact credit card company for a chargeback, regardless of TA situation, is more than reasonable

 

stay safe

peace out

 

I have toggled off working from and not for decades.  There is no adjustment as far as I'm concerned.  But at it's most lenient, that excuse might fly in week one.  For you to excuse them at this point is playing unnecessary devil's advocate after two months and only one or two confirmed refunds from the entire 60 day pause period.

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1 minute ago, CarelessAndConfused said:

For you to excuse them at this point is playing

i'm not excusing anyone … your handle is perfect, as is mine

 

peace out

"timely" refunds for all

 

j/s

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20 hours ago, bluesea321 said:

 

You have posted the same message all over Cruise Critic, not nice.

No, I posted it with 3 cruiselines and under General.  My clients said they did this because they read on Cruise Critic that people were doing it.....some people don't book with a TA.  If I posted it all over, I would have done a lot more than 3 cruiselines!!

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2 minutes ago, oceanlovinmama said:

No, I posted it with 3 cruiselines and under General.  My clients said they did this because they read on Cruise Critic that people were doing it.....some people don't book with a TA.  If I posted it all over, I would have done a lot more than 3 cruiselines!!

 

What a selfish excuse for a travel agent you are.  If I pay for something, and it's not delivered, and I'm having trouble getting a refund processed, I ABSOLUTELY will do a chargeback. That's the reason to use a card.  Who are you to say you need to keep the commission for a trip that never happened? Do you think you're the only person being affected by this?  I'm hemorrhaging money as I keep my business going, and you sit at home selling cruises over the internet and think ANYONE here is going to feel bad for you?  Pathetic.

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16 minutes ago, oceanlovinmama said:

No, I posted it with 3 cruiselines and under General.  My clients said they did this because they read on Cruise Critic that people were doing it.....some people don't book with a TA.  If I posted it all over, I would have done a lot more than 3 cruiselines!!

If Princess does not pay the refunds and goes through bankruptcy...are you going to personally guarantee and reimburse your clients for the many thousands of dollars that they could lose by not going through with a credit card chargeback?

 

I’m sure your clients would like to know this.  Perhaps you should offer a secured interest in your house as collateral to your clients.  

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11 minutes ago, SCOOTERNINJA said:

If Princess does not pay the refunds and goes through bankruptcy...are you going to personally guarantee and reimburse your clients for the many thousands of dollars that they could lose by not going through with a credit card chargeback?

 

I’m sure your clients would like to know this.  Perhaps you should offer a secured interest in your house as collateral to your clients.  

As I said before, I think my clients should do what they have to do, BUT I think they and anyone could wait 90 days.  If at 90 days nothing, then by all means.  I had 2 cruise cancelled personally....I GET IT... All I was saying is that you should think about it.  I truly didn't think it would be this big of a deal.  I just thought that people who booked with a agent didn't know the ramifications, that maybe they would think twice, or wait a tad longer.  

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19 minutes ago, oceanlovinmama said:

As I said before, I think my clients should do what they have to do, BUT I think they and anyone could wait 90 days.  If at 90 days nothing, then by all means.  I had 2 cruise cancelled personally....I GET IT... All I was saying is that you should think about it.  I truly didn't think it would be this big of a deal.  I just thought that people who booked with a agent didn't know the ramifications, that maybe they would think twice, or wait a tad longer.  

Maybe you ought to explain the downside of waiting longer too rather than advocating for what could line your pockets.  
 

The terms of many cards require chargeback claims within a certain period. For those that fail to meet those deadlines, they could be precluded.    
 

Perhaps more importantly, many cards don’t provide protection in the event of ‘financial insolvency.’  So for these cardholders and once a company announces ‘the ability to continue as a going concern,’ they may be out of luck to go the credit card chargeback route.  Bankruptcy comes swiftly and is harsh. 
 

Those that wait, wait at their own peril.  But hopefully they will be educated about the real potential risks of losing all of their money by waiting.  

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55 minutes ago, leisuretraveler223 said:

 

What a selfish excuse for a travel agent you are.  If I pay for something, and it's not delivered, and I'm having trouble getting a refund processed, I ABSOLUTELY will do a chargeback. That's the reason to use a card.  Who are you to say you need to keep the commission for a trip that never happened? Do you think you're the only person being affected by this?  I'm hemorrhaging money as I keep my business going, and you sit at home selling cruises over the internet and think ANYONE here is going to feel bad for you?  Pathetic.

First of all you do not know me, I'm anything but selfish or pathetic.  I agree you should get your money, but...can't you wait 60 days or so?  These cruise lines are faced with hundreds of thousands of requests and not one is more important than the other, but you all seem to think yours is.  If it were just the commission I would care less, but to pay for your cruise that you never got, but got your money for, to me is unacceptable.  It happens....perhaps because the cruise is cancelled it won't, but another supplier just went after another rep in our office...yes, office, I don't sit home booking just cruises on the internet, and she has to come up with the $750.  Luckily we have insurance in the office, but it's got a limit.  Your cruise is $7000 and I pay for it with your credit card, on your behalf, but you chargeback and get the whole $7000 and I'm out $2000 because our insurance only pays $5000 per claim IF it even will pay since this is a pandemic.  I have gone to bat for a lot of my customers to get their refunds back.  I've called and waited on hold for 2 hours, I've checked online, I've sent them their invoices and made ones that said cancelled so they can have proof....so don't tell me I'm not a good agent.  All I was asking is for people to think twice.

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24 minutes ago, oceanlovinmama said:

First of all you do not know me, I'm anything but selfish or pathetic.  I agree you should get your money, but...can't you wait 60 days or so? 

 

It's so nice that you agree we should get OUR money back.  How magnanimous of you.  But more importantly, virtually ALL of us have waited MORE than "60 days or so" already!!!

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30 minutes ago, oceanlovinmama said:

First of all you do not know me, I'm anything but selfish or pathetic.  I agree you should get your money, but...can't you wait 60 days or so?  

I am past 70 days.

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36 minutes ago, oceanlovinmama said:

  I have gone to bat for a lot of my customers to get their refunds back.  I've called and waited on hold for 2 hours, I've checked online, I've sent them their invoices and made ones that said cancelled so they can have proof....so don't tell me I'm not a good agent.  All I was asking is for people to think twice.

Can you tell us how many of your customers have got refunds from Princess and what their ship/sail dates were? That might help those who are (at this stage) "thinking" of a chargeback, maybe? Personally, I can state that NONE of my Princess clients have received refunds on cruises cancelled by Princess.

Edited by ceilidh1
clarity
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