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12 hours ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

X has two very popular people they're associated with, they extended their partnership with Michelin Star chef Daniel Boulud and there's also the most popular cruise ship "employee" in the world, Captain Kate.  Integrate them into the PUP program.  Or heck, videos of Daniel showing Kate how to cook and Kate showing Daniel how to "Captain" a ship would go viral. 😄 

Yes, webinars or videos with Captain Kate and Daniel Boulud, together or individually, would be a great addition to the PUP program. Wonderful idea!

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2 hours ago, C-Dragons said:

They should. Otherwise they could end up with their clients being sued over copyright laws.

Even CC has a warning about members using copyright materials.

I would not get too excited about potential litigation over copyrights as they apply to things like lifting photographs for use in collecting PUP points...

 

You need to know now a little about Copyright law.

 

First, there is the doctrine of “Fair Use”:

 

https://www.copyright.gov/fair-use/more-info.html

 

...which pretty much throws out most actions when the “violation” is of non-commercial use.

 

If you get by that bar, there is the question of “damages”:

 

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/504

 

Problem is that “actual damages” are measured by the value derived by the use for the violation.  So, what exactly is the dollar value of 3 Captain’s Club points?  In lieu of that, one can get statutory damages...in a case such as this, likely the minimum...which is $750.  The per hour fees of a decent Copyright lawyer in 2021 exceeds that $750...so, unless protection of the image is really worth a whole lot to the copyright holder, they are not exactly likely...or rather, would have to be crazy to file litigation.

 

Take this from a 43 year corporate attorney who has handled a few copyright and trademark matters.

 

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On 2/14/2021 at 11:28 AM, hvbaskey said:

More duplication ... unreal.  Could give benefit of the doubt that Korry & Rhonda are spouses and they have different surnames, but then why go to the trouble of getting a “snap shot” of the original to make it look a bit different? 

 

Oh well - his Karma!  

 

@garyl62 - I couldn’t find the duplication of your beautiful creation, so maybe it was deleted (DW recognizing the error of her ways).  

 

.1099969355_ScreenShot2021-02-14at12_23_35PM.thumb.png.b178a8a14df9d99499588c05d8ac6d1b.png

Setting the facts straight here for all interested.  The original picture and posting is from my bff cruise and travel buddy Rhonda, who's married to Max.  We would be enjoying a beautiful trip together as we speak but hell froze over in Texas and we're stuck at home with flights cancelled through Weds. 

 

 Max is an amazing cook!  Hubby and I know from personal experience.  This is HER post, not the Pearls who plagiarized her post. She'll be contacting Captain's Club to report. 

 

IMO, this should not be tolerated/allowed/accepted by the Captain's Club.  Some of us did not even receive this opportunity and it's not right that someone takes advantage like this. I'm sure I'll be receiving negative replies on this and I don't care. "Aggies don't lie, cheat or steal nor tolerate those that do."  

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19 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

I never looked at the curricula of Marketing majors.  Do they have a required course on ethics?

 

6 hours ago, C-Dragons said:

They should. Otherwise they could end up with their clients being sued over copyright laws.

Even CC has a warning about members using copyright materials.

 

3 hours ago, Bruin Steve said:

I would not get too excited about potential litigation over copyrights as they apply to things like lifting photographs for use in collecting PUP points...

 

Perhaps you need to re-read my post. It had nothing to do with PUP's, it was ethics.

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1 hour ago, LuvCruzn4Evr said:

Setting the facts straight here for all interested.  The original picture and posting is from my bff cruise and travel buddy Rhonda, who's married to Max.  We would be enjoying a beautiful trip together as we speak but hell froze over in Texas and we're stuck at home with flights cancelled through Weds. 

 

 Max is an amazing cook!  Hubby and I know from personal experience.  This is HER post, not the Pearls who plagiarized her post. She'll be contacting Captain's Club to report. 

 

IMO, this should not be tolerated/allowed/accepted by the Captain's Club.  Some of us did not even receive this opportunity and it's not right that someone takes advantage like this. I'm sure I'll be receiving negative replies on this and I don't care. "Aggies don't lie, cheat or steal nor tolerate those that do."  

Thanks for setting the record straight.

Edited by C-Dragons
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37 minutes ago, C-Dragons said:

 

 

Perhaps you need to re-read my post. It had nothing to do with PUP's, it was ethics.

Of course, the entire thread is about PUPs...and the subject of copyright infringement came up on several posts almost immediately prior to yours.  It appeared important to set the record straight on what constitutes copyright infringement and the realistic applicability to exactly what we are discussing here on THIS thread.  I get that you had been talking about Marketing majors and Ethics... BUT you veered over to the LAW...talking about being "sued over copyright law".  Although "ethics" are indeed important, "ethics" and "law" are actually two distinct areas of consideration.  

 

"Ethics" in the "marketing" business is usually more concerned with issues of misleading or false advertising or unfair competition...though I would advise a client to be concerned also about trademark infringement--which is very different from copyright infringement.  But those concerns are largely ones of both ethics AND law--and the law part is actually the real consideration.  Marketing is far different than, say, Attorneys or Doctors, for example, where ethical considerations are enforced by professional organizations which control licensure...and there is a remedy of disbarment or loss of a medical license.  Such organizational enforcement does not exist in "marketing".  There, the only enforcement is by LAW--through the courts.

 

Most often, there is little that happens with posting of photos or otherwise "copyrighted" intellectual property on social media.  Unless the property lifted contains a valid copyright notice and is being used for the marketing purpose of a rival business or for a lucrative business purpose, it is likely either going to fall into that Fair Use exception I cited or it is not going to be worthwhile pursuing by the copyright owner.

 

If you're thinking of "ethics" as in it's not nice to do, well...sure...

 

But this whole discussion is reaching some bizarre places.  People are talking about reporting "violators" to Captains Club.  Seriously...does anyone think Celebrity would devote time, finances and personnel to investigating or following up on any such complaint and manually adjusting or denying these largely meaningless PUPs?  Heck, I am guessing the whole thing is done by computer bots and they couldn't care less as to what is actually posted.  And they are certainly not matching up every photo posted with every other photo posted or throughout the internet to look for "violations" of copyright law...And they are certainly not researching every post for violations of anyone's notion of what might cross the line of anyone's sense of completely unenforceable "ethics"...

Edited by Bruin Steve
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1 hour ago, Bruin Steve said:

 

But this whole discussion is reaching some bizarre places.  People are talking about reporting "violators" to Captains Club.  Seriously...does anyone think Celebrity would devote time, finances and personnel to investigating or following up on any such complaint and manually adjusting or denying these largely meaningless PUPs?  


But ... it’s so much more than “just a photo” and “just three points".  

It’s the time and effort that people took to engage in the activity offered by Celebrity.  It’s very offensive to many of us who spent time printing off the recipe, gathering (and / or shopping for) the ingredients, watching the video, then performing the task and THEN for someone to steal the photo and post it on social media for their own personal gain.

As to whether Celebrity cares?  I believe they do.   I have reached out to Celebrity Engagement for missing points from activities that I have completed and they were exceptionally eager to assist and correct my account.   They are going above and beyond to ensure every inquiry is answered and are most helpful.  

I applaud “RM” (via @LuvCruzn4Evr) for reporting the Pearls who not only posted RM’s activity once, but had the kahunas to post it twice on two different accounts.   

 

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2 minutes ago, hvbaskey said:


But ... it’s so much more than “just a photo” and “just three points".  

It’s the time and effort that people took to engage in the activity offered by Celebrity.  It’s very offensive to many of us...
 

And...when they did the "quizzes", many people took the time to read all the materials--do the work...and others asked people to just post the answers and then skipped right to the points.  Did YOU call Celebrity on those PUP opportunities and report all of the people who asked for the answers?  Or try to figure out who short-cut the process and rely on the work of others there and rat all of them out to Celebrity?   Do you know how many people DIDN'T painstakingly follow the recipe and just posted a picture of whatever steak they cooked.  Is THAT offensive to you?  Have you searched through Facebook and Instagram looking for people who posted something that didn't quite look like the recipe?  I mean, THEY didn't take the "time and effort" either...

How about the points they gave away for "attending" one of the webinars?  Did you catch all of the posters saying they didn't really watch--they just let it run in the background to get the points?  Have YOU contacted Captains Club to turn all of those people in?

 

You know something...Life isn't always fair.  Some people get away with stuff.  Maybe you always play by all the rules (good for you).  But, before you get this bent out of shape over things, ask yourself what the thing is really worth.  Maybe YOU got YOUR three PUP points AND you also learned how to cook a really nice meal...AND you got to enjoy eating the meal.  It worked for YOU, right?  You got everything you bargained for...Why do you care what others did?

 

For ME, I didn't do this...It isn't worth it to me--no matter how I would get the points...You see, I got to Elite, then Elite Plus by actually paying for and going on a lot of cruises...I didn't short-cut the system by getting a lot of free giveaway points.  Maybe, to me, it is YOU that is short-cutting the system to reach the same status that was much harder for me to get to?

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2 minutes ago, Bruin Steve said:

And...when they did the "quizzes", many people took the time to read all the materials--do the work...and others asked people to just post the answers and then skipped right to the points.  Did YOU call Celebrity on those PUP opportunities and report all of the people who asked for the answers?  Or try to figure out who short-cut the process and rely on the work of others there and rat all of them out to Celebrity?   Do you know how many people DIDN'T painstakingly follow the recipe and just posted a picture of whatever steak they cooked.  Is THAT offensive to you?  Have you searched through Facebook and Instagram looking for people who posted something that didn't quite look like the recipe?  I mean, THEY didn't take the "time and effort" either...

How about the points they gave away for "attending" one of the webinars?  Did you catch all of the posters saying they didn't really watch--they just let it run in the background to get the points?  Have YOU contacted Captains Club to turn all of those people in?

 

You know something...Life isn't always fair.  Some people get away with stuff.  Maybe you always play by all the rules (good for you).  But, before you get this bent out of shape over things, ask yourself what the thing is really worth.  Maybe YOU got YOUR three PUP points AND you also learned how to cook a really nice meal...AND you got to enjoy eating the meal.  It worked for YOU, right?  You got everything you bargained for...Why do you care what others did?

 

For ME, I didn't do this...It isn't worth it to me--no matter how I would get the points...You see, I got to Elite, then Elite Plus by actually paying for and going on a lot of cruises...I didn't short-cut the system by getting a lot of free giveaway points.  Maybe, to me, it is YOU that is short-cutting the system to reach the same status that was much harder for me to get to?

 

WOW - you really are passionately against those with a strong moral compass.  

 

You “assumed” that I called in to complain.  I commented (applauded) the person who is going to do it (as it was their post that was stolen).  


Finally, how ludicrous to state that people participating in this program by Celebrity are "short-cutting the system”.  

Cutting out the crazy and won’t further respond to these personal attacks and rants.

 

 

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26 minutes ago, hvbaskey said:


But ... it’s so much more than “just a photo” and “just three points".  

It’s the time and effort that people took to engage in the activity offered by Celebrity.  It’s very offensive to many of us who spent time printing off the recipe, gathering (and / or shopping for) the ingredients, watching the video, then performing the task and THEN for someone to steal the photo and post it on social media for their own personal gain.

As to whether Celebrity cares?  I believe they do.   I have reached out to Celebrity Engagement for missing points from activities that I have completed and they were exceptionally eager to assist and correct my account.   They are going above and beyond to ensure every inquiry is answered and are most helpful.  

I applaud “RM” (via @LuvCruzn4Evr) for reporting the Pearls who not only posted RM’s activity once, but had the kahunas to post it twice on two different accounts.   

 

I agree. Unfortunately, there seems to be a certain segment of society that no longer seems capable of differentiating between right and wrong. 

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11 minutes ago, Bruin Steve said:

And...when they did the "quizzes", many people took the time to read all the materials--do the work...and others asked people to just post the answers and then skipped right to the points.  Did YOU call Celebrity on those PUP opportunities and report all of the people who asked for the answers?  Or try to figure out who short-cut the process and rely on the work of others there and rat all of them out to Celebrity?   Do you know how many people DIDN'T painstakingly follow the recipe and just posted a picture of whatever steak they cooked.  Is THAT offensive to you?  Have you searched through Facebook and Instagram looking for people who posted something that didn't quite look like the recipe?  I mean, THEY didn't take the "time and effort" either...

How about the points they gave away for "attending" one of the webinars?  Did you catch all of the posters saying they didn't really watch--they just let it run in the background to get the points?  Have YOU contacted Captains Club to turn all of those people in?

 

You know something...Life isn't always fair.  Some people get away with stuff.  Maybe you always play by all the rules (good for you).  But, before you get this bent out of shape over things, ask yourself what the thing is really worth.  Maybe YOU got YOUR three PUP points AND you also learned how to cook a really nice meal...AND you got to enjoy eating the meal.  It worked for YOU, right?  You got everything you bargained for...Why do you care what others did?

 

For ME, I didn't do this...It isn't worth it to me--no matter how I would get the points...You see, I got to Elite, then Elite Plus by actually paying for and going on a lot of cruises...I didn't short-cut the system by getting a lot of free giveaway points.  Maybe, to me, it is YOU that is short-cutting the system to reach the same status that was much harder for me to get to?

Funny thing, I got some PUP points deposited to my "account" 3 in total, but I did not participate in a PUP activity.  I am hoping PUP police don't report me.

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1 minute ago, hvbaskey said:

 

WOW - you really are passionately against those with a strong moral compass.  

 

You “assumed” that I called in to complain.  I commented (applauded) the person who is going to do it (as it was their post that was stolen).  


Finally, how ludicrous to state that people participating in this program by Celebrity are "short-cutting the system”.  

Cutting out the crazy and won’t further respond to these personal attacks and rants.

 

 

Gee whiz!!  I have nothing against people with a "moral compass"...I just think it's crazy that anyone is that riled up about this thing...It's a silly little marketing gimmick...It's not one of the great moral questions of our day...

 

Yeah, sure:  Racial injustice, Climate Change, threats of autocracy and the destruction of democracy, the Covid-19 Pandemic, terrorism...and the theft of photo shots in order to get three free Captains Club points....Yeah, maybe I left one or two other great world problems off the list...but, yeah, those are the big ones!!!

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1 minute ago, Bruin Steve said:

Gee whiz!!  I have nothing against people with a "moral compass"...I just think it's crazy that anyone is that riled up about this thing...It's a silly little marketing gimmick...It's not one of the great moral questions of our day...

 

Yeah, sure:  Racial injustice, Climate Change, threats of autocracy and the destruction of democracy, the Covid-19 Pandemic, terrorism...and the theft of photo shots in order to get three free Captains Club points....Yeah, maybe I left one or two other great world problems off the list...but, yeah, those are the big ones!!!

Don't forget the utter indignity of "infinite verandas"!!  

Edited by LGW59
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8 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

Don't forget the utter indignity of "infinite verandas"!!  

Oh and I forgot, Celebrity CEO Lisa Lutoff-Perlo and designer Kelly Hoppen, who we all know of the "havoc" they have wreaked on the world, totally upending the lives of experienced cruisers who know "what is what".

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1 hour ago, goofysmom99 said:

TMI. 🤐 I thought the food pictures looked tasty.  Wish someone would cook that for me so was motivated to book a cruise today.  Food porn works.

Hi Ruth! Good for you......:) Who  knew that Silhouette cruise would be our last for a while.

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1 hour ago, ChucktownSteve said:

OMG.  The PUP has jumped the shark!

Yeah ChucktownSteve, it did something. LOL. I have done a couple of those PUPs and received absolutely nothing. 😞

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  • 2 weeks later...

I finally got both and was very pleased. Oddly enough I was looking at my Azamara account and I saw my tier points reflecting that they had been added on before I had checked Celebrity.  Thank you Celebrity.

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