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Future of Fleet below Voyager Class


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As Carnival announced it will be retiring most of their Fantasy class ships last week, speculation comes if RCL will follow suit and retire some of the older ships in its fleet as well.

RCL has already sold and transferred some of the older class ships like the Sovereign and Vision class ships to its sister companies. It seems like Pullmatur may be seizing operations. The Monarch and Sovereign are currently disembarking valuable equipment and art off the ship. Sad if their run has come to an end and will be scrapped due to this pandemic. Monarch of the Seas being my first cruise, kind of hits a soft spot to see it end this way. 

The vision and radiance class have not been scheduled to be Amplified as like the larger ships in the fleet.

Do you think the Empress, Majesty, the rest of the Vision and Radiance Class will still sail under the RCL flag? Or will RCL follow Carnivals suit and start selling their older ships? 

I think the Radiance class should survive since RCL still needs mid sized ships to fit in to the smaller ports. 

Thoughts?

Edited by tx121
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Carnival didnt say fantasy class was being sold.. Carnival CORP said it will sell 6 ships, from among their 10 criselines. No ship was mentioned, much less they were retiring all of their fantasy class ships.

 

If you want to speculate about rcl great, but please starting rumours that the ships sold will all be fantasy class starts off your post with inaccurate information. I spoke with a carnival agent just last friday who was annoyed people read carnival corp, and dont know they own 10 cruiselines. Sure there is speculation  see carnival threads. P & O, some others. Could even be a couple fantasy class, but unless you have a link saying fantasy class is being sold, and post it, please dont post as fact if you dont know.

 

See thread on carnival if you want to speculate. Only fantasy class can get under the bridge at high tide to Jacksonville port. Miracle at low tide. You are wiping out a florida port with your statement.

Edited by firefly333
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Sovereign Class not suprizing, 32+ years old. Vision could also possibly leaving, but dont see Radiance yet. Size needed and pretty much same age as Voyager phase 2 Class or whatever last 3 were called. Also Rumors, been those with Grandeur and Vision being sold off for almost 10yrs here on CC

Edited by ONECRUISER
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12 minutes ago, ONECRUISER said:

Sovereign Class not suprizing, 32+ years old. Vision could also possibly leaving, but dont see Radiance yet. Size needed and pretty much same age as Voyager phase 2 Class or whatever last 3 were called. Also Rumors, been those with Grandeur and Vision being sold off for almost 10yrs here on CC

 

Well, the Grandeur is already slated to leave in the spring.

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35 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

Carnival didnt say fantasy class was being sold.. Carnival CORP said it will sell 6 ships, from among their 10 criselines. No ship was mentioned, much less they were retiring all of their fantasy class ships.

 

If you want to speculate about rcl great, but please starting rumours that the ships sold will all be fantasy class starts off your post with inaccurate information. I spoke with a carnival agent just last friday who was annoyed people read carnival corp, and dont know they own 10 cruiselines. Sure there is speculation  see carnival threads. P & O, some others. Could even be a couple fantasy class, but unless you have a link saying fantasy class is being sold, and post it, please dont post as fact if you dont know.

 

See thread on carnival if you want to speculate. Only fantasy class can get under the bridge at high tide to Jacksonville port. Miracle at low tide. You are wiping out a florida port with your statement.

Thanks for correction on my first paragraph.  Do you have thoughts on the topic/question?

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3 hours ago, firefly333 said:

Carnival didnt say fantasy class was being sold.. Carnival CORP said it will sell 6 ships, from among their 10 criselines. No ship was mentioned, much less they were retiring all of their fantasy class ships.

 

If you want to speculate about rcl great, but please starting rumours that the ships sold will all be fantasy class starts off your post with inaccurate information. I spoke with a carnival agent just last friday who was annoyed people read carnival corp, and dont know they own 10 cruiselines. Sure there is speculation  see carnival threads. P & O, some others. Could even be a couple fantasy class, but unless you have a link saying fantasy class is being sold, and post it, please dont post as fact if you dont know.

 

See thread on carnival if you want to speculate. Only fantasy class can get under the bridge at high tide to Jacksonville port. Miracle at low tide. You are wiping out a florida port with your statement.

 

Agree. Supposedly one Costa ship has already been sold.  I doubt Carnival will sell either Paradise or Elation as they have better propulsion and more substantial upgrades than the rest of Fantasy class, and they are the newest.  On the other hand, those features could make them more attractive to a buyer, but the whole class of 8 ships has been posted for sale on broker websites for years. If there was no demand in the past, this is hardly the time to be buying old ships.

 

Now back to the topic at hand, that lawyer who is always bashing the cruise industry says he has insider scoop that at least a couple of old Pullmantur ships - formerly sailed under the RCI banner - are being dismantled as we speak in Italy.  If Pullmantur resumes operations, it's possible it could be with transferred ships from a sister line under the RCCL umbrella, such as the ships being discussed here.

Edited by KmomChicago
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3 hours ago, Merion_Mom said:

 

Well, the Grandeur is already slated to leave in the spring.

 

After the last round of cancellations, Grandeur only has 20 cruises left under the RCL flag and maybe less if there is another round of cancellations.  I'm starting to wonder if it still makes business sense for RCL to re-crew and make any Covid required modifications to the Grandeur for so few cruises.   I'm still booked on a November trip on the Grandeur but I am starting to doubt if she will ever sail as a RCL ship again.

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4 hours ago, tx121 said:

As Carnival announced it will be retiring most of their Fantasy class ships last week, speculation comes if RCL will follow suit and retire some of the older ships in its fleet as well.

RCL has already sold and transferred some of the older class ships like the Sovereign and Vision class ships to its sister companies. It seems like Pullmatur may be seizing operations. The Monarch and Sovereign are currently disembarking valuable equipment and art off the ship. Sad if their run has come to an end and will be scrapped due to this pandemic. Monarch of the Seas being my first cruise, kind of hits a soft spot to see it end this way. 

The vision and radiance class have not been scheduled to be Amplified as like the larger ships in the fleet.

Do you think the Empress, Majesty, the rest of the Vision and Radiance Class will still sail under the RCL flag? Or will RCL follow Carnivals suit and start selling their older ships? 

I think the Radiance class should survive since RCL still needs mid sized ships to fit in to the smaller ports. 

Thoughts?

Carnival has made no such statement. Carnival Corporation announced retiring 6 ships but none of those ships are from Carnival Cruise Line. Please verify your facts before starting rumors.

 

I haven't sailed Royal enough to know the names of all of the classes but I enjoy the smaller ships like the Enchantment. I don't care much for all of the bells and whistles and would prefer not to have to pay for them.

Edited by Computer Nerd
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1 hour ago, KmomChicago said:

Now back to the topic at hand, that lawyer who is always bashing the cruise industry says he has insider scoop that at least a couple of old Pullmantur ships - formerly sailed under the RCI banner - are being dismantled as we speak in Italy. 

Sovereign and Monarch happen to be in Naples, but very much doubt they are being scrapped there.

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12 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

Sovereign and Monarch happen to be in Naples, but very much doubt they are being scrapped there.

 

The good stuff is removed before the ships make it to the scrappers in Alang. SS Norway's art and other valuables were removed in Germany where she was laid up before her sad demise in Alang.

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5 hours ago, tx121 said:

As Carnival announced it will be retiring most of their Fantasy class ships last week

 

1 hour ago, Computer Nerd said:

Carnival has made no such statement. Carnival Corporation announced retiring 6 ships but none of those ships are from Carnival Cruise Line. Please verify your facts before starting rumors.

 

5 hours ago, firefly333 said:

Carnival didnt say fantasy class was being sold.. Carnival CORP said it will sell 6 ships, from among their 10 criselines. 

 

Screenshot_20200622-074128_Chrome.thumb.jpg.3ba5245687382c1821ce08f50094c2ec.jpgScreenshot_20200622-074155_Chrome.thumb.jpg.883fd968f7ddc4bd0659cf869888593c.jpg

https://cruiseradio.net/carnival-sells-six-cruise-ships-more-to-come/

 

I saw this article and it does bring up the question about the sale of the older ships like the Fantasy Class. However it does go on to say that they are popular and they need to be fresh and maintained because of this.  

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I believe  HAL's Veendam and Maasdam are among the Carnival ships being sold. Not just Fantasy class will go. These HAL ships only hold 1250 to 1350 passengers and often sell at rates lower than newer ships. I love them for that reason, but I get the current business environment and the need to make some tough decisions now. Sold as being sold to scrappers also.

Edited by coaster
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19 minutes ago, coaster said:

The good stuff is removed before the ships make it to the scrappers in Alang.

One would think if they are being scrapped, Horizon would not bother leaving India after she just dropped off crew in Mumbai.

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12 hours ago, coaster said:

 

The good stuff is removed before the ships make it to the scrappers in Alang. SS Norway's art and other valuables were removed in Germany where she was laid up before her sad demise in Alang.


Yes the lawyer guy claims to be in touch with the crew or workers who are removing that stuff, apparently in preparation to sail partially gutted to their final destination.

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here's the article. Pullmantur may not be going under but using the stoppage to scrap Monarch 😪, Sovereign 😪, and the former Celebrity ship. Then RCI can move some of its' Vision class ships to Pullmantur.

 

https://www.cruiselawnews.com/2020/06/articles/disease/is-pullmantur-cruises-ending-operations/?fbclid=IwAR3Rn8VjKU_i1UxUAKroL4a3Alciv4iEYpnsR6gN7AvnyuKgW62axbJZLrs

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Enchantment is one of our favorite ships...looking at a cruise out of Baltimore in 2021.

But we have been considering what RCI will do about social distancing, and/or limited passenger #'s on a small ship.

if that becomes policy.

More easily done on one of the Mega ships.

The Vision clsss is the size ship that can pass under the bridges.

 

Just have to wait and see how all this plays out.

Edited by B-52
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11 hours ago, Germancruiser said:

If they remove valuables and good stuff of the Pullmantour ships I suppose we can see them in Alang or any other scrapyard in the not so distant future!

One would think if they are to be scrapped, Horizon would not be sailing back toward Europe from India.

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Carnival Cruise Lines' Fantasy class are integral to their small port strategy.

 

Royal has a different strategy, big ships and big terminals in big ports.  But, the 6 smaller ships give them a lot of flexibility for destination cruising so I'd predict most will be staying for a while.

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I’m old enough to remember when Sovereign class and Fantasy class were the newest and greatest ships ever created. I was on Big Red Boat, docked in Nassau right next to Carnival Something or Other. It was massive, shiny and new, and even in port it looked like a nonstop party on deck. I was so jealous on our tiny old barnacle barge (still had a fab time on those Premier ships, not sure if I was on the Royale or the considerably larger Oceanic at the time. 
 

There’s been some additional innovations since then! How the mighty have fallen. Later on Disney Magic someone was telling me they liked Sovereign of the Seas better!

Edited by KmomChicago
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2 hours ago, KmomChicago said:

I’m old enough to remember when Sovereign class and Fantasy class were the newest and greatest ships ever created. I was on Big Red Boat, docked in Nassau right next to Carnival Something or Other. It was massive, shiny and new, and even in port it looked like a nonstop party on deck. I was so jealous on our tiny old barnacle barge (still had a fab time on those Premier ships, not sure if I was on the Royale or the considerably larger Oceanic at the time. 
 

There’s been some additional innovations since then! How the mighty have fallen. Later on Disney Magic someone was telling me they liked Sovereign of the Seas better!

I remember my cruise on the Legend when it was less then one year old.  I had only sailed on the Viking Serenade and the Monarch, and I could not be believe how big and grand the Legend was.

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9 hours ago, WeMissSeaView said:

I remember my cruise on the Legend when it was less then one year old.  I had only sailed on the Viking Serenade and the Monarch, and I could not be believe how big and grand the Legend was.

Same for me on my very first cruise on a very big ship- in those days considered a " Maga- Liner"- the ship was the Grandeur of the Seas... for us- Titanic ( without the desaster) reborn.

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