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Are vaccines the light at the end of the tunnel?


Ken the cruiser
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There was a really disheartening story on the news last night.

 

Fulltime residents of Florida are having a difficult time obtaining the vaccine as the state policy is that non-residents (snowbirds and other tourists) have complete access to the very limited supply of the vaccine.

 

The newstory last night was about charter flights being offered from Canada to Florida for the sole purpose of obtaining the vaccine.

 

Florida needs to wise up and stop the pursuit of the dollar and think about saving the lives of those full time residents that contribute year round to the state.

 

We had 17,783 new cases reported on Wednesday, January 7.  January 8 showed and increase to 19,816 new cases.

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8 minutes ago, Homosassa said:

There was a really disheartening story on the news last night.

 

Fulltime residents of Florida are having a difficult time obtaining the vaccine as the state policy is that non-residents (snowbirds and other tourists) have complete access to the very limited supply of the vaccine.

 

The newstory last night was about charter flights being offered from Canada to Florida for the sole purpose of obtaining the vaccine.

 

Florida needs to wise up and stop the pursuit of the dollar and think about saving the lives of those full time residents that contribute year round to the state.

 

We had 17,783 new cases reported on Wednesday, January 7.  January 8 showed and increase to 19,816 new cases.

Yes both the FL and AZ vaccination policies currently allow this. Fair or not to US citizens from these states.  Or to snowbirds from other US states.  

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/canadian-snowbirds-chartering-private-jets-to-fly-south-for-faster-covid-19-vaccine-access-1.5257752

 

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44 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

Probably outside patios are OK.  Still not really sure what is causing the surge unless it is no-mask young people as you say.  Most older folks even from other states are typically very careful.  Keep safe in AZ!

 

I doubt it's just young people who are non compliant.  How do you define old?

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13 hours ago, mimbecky said:

No worries- I get you. Our family only gathers outside. Here in Southern California restaurants are closed now, even outside. Some argue this actually pushes people to gather indoors at home. My experience is that most people mask when out and about. A lot of spread apparently is in the workforce. 

But here, a lot of the spread that leads to hospitalization is home with the family. I would hazard a guess that 80% of college students that aren’t commuters have had it, and a whole bunch of them brought it home to their parents and grandparents. Testing was offered, but no one wants to know, because then you have to quarantine.

Yes, those are broad generalizations, but a lot of truth.

Our hospitalizations are up, the age of hospitalized persons is down a bit and death rate is down (number of deaths a day is up, but the rate continues to slowly, slowly drop.

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Wouldn't this be wonderful. One million people in the US getting vaccinated every day by locally-based federal, state and local folks working together as a team to make it happen. What a concept! If they can even come close to pulling this off, we may be back to cruising before you know it. One can at least hope! 

 

https://www.msnbc.com/all-in/watch/-it-can-be-done-fauci-on-biden-vaccination-plan-of-100m-doses-in-first-100-days-98789957734

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49 minutes ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Wouldn't this be wonderful. One million people in the US getting vaccinated every day by locally-based federal, state and local folks working together as a team to make it happen. What a concept! If they can even come close to pulling this off, we may be back to cruising before you know it. One can at least hope! 

 

https://www.msnbc.com/all-in/watch/-it-can-be-done-fauci-on-biden-vaccination-plan-of-100m-doses-in-first-100-days-98789957734

Jan 20 is coming...

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I live in Arizona,, effective Mon We will be eligible for the Vaccine.  Az has mobilized 750 of its National Guard Medical personnel to assist in the Vaccinations.  Hopefully this will speed up the process, also received an E Mail yesterday from Walgreens, that they hope to be able to open their Vaccine Stations open to all phase 1b eligible people within a week or two, presently they are only doing Vaccines at local Elderly Assisted living facilities. Do believe this past month has been a learning experience for everyone involved, hopefully some of the reasons for the log jam will improve. Hopefully sometime in the next week or two we will both be vaccinated.  I know it is difficult to remain positive in these times, I encourage all of us to do our best with remaining calm during this storm.

 

Do wish we would get a more definite position from the Cruise Industry as to their thinking regarding their approach to Vaccines and how it may effect if the Vaccine will be a requirement to future cruising. 

 

 

 

 

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I am in AZ and it upsets me that they are moving to 1b when my husband, living in a memory care/assisted living facility  and 1a, has not been vaccinated nor does his facility have any date for their supposed vaccine clinic for which I gave permission over three weeks ago. It is not going smoothly at all, at least in my county. And i Know of people who "have jumped the line" even though they are not health care workers or in long term care. The best laid plans?????

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10 hours ago, TeeRick said:

No need to panic.  I do not think that any US president can dictate a policy like this even by executive order.  They maybe can try to influence it.  But the scientific experts, FDA, HHS and CDC are in control as are the states.  There is a lot of resistance in the US by these expert groups to go against the established dose spacing protocols from the clinical trials.  Or to reduce to half doses on the first shot as some have recommended.  But this is the wrong fix really IMO.  The issue is to immediately distribute and use the current doses as promised.  Period.  That will go a long way in getting the population vaccinated.

DW and I were talking about this earlier.

Who does have the authority? The CDC only makes recommendations. No authority.  States make up their own rules based on whatever they want (perhaps cdc recommendations). 

 

Does any body have federal level authority over how vaccines are distributed? I'm not thinking they do. 

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2 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Wouldn't this be wonderful. One million people in the US getting vaccinated every day by locally-based federal, state and local folks working together as a team to make it happen. What a concept! If they can even come close to pulling this off, we may be back to cruising before you know it. One can at least hope! 

 

https://www.msnbc.com/all-in/watch/-it-can-be-done-fauci-on-biden-vaccination-plan-of-100m-doses-in-first-100-days-98789957734

Yes, would certainly be nice.  But based on US population, it would still take close to a year to vaccinate everyone at this rate.  Ugh!  Patience is not one of my best virtues.

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22 hours ago, Arizona Wildcat said:

Almost exclusively young people congregating and older winter visitors.  Sadly many hospitalized here are not residents of Arizona.

Amazingly today DW went to eat lunch in an outside patio.  The staff greeted her and noted the regulars were stating home.  Who was eating there were mostly from NJ NY MN IL etc.  Seasonal rentals here are fully booked and these visitors are enjoying their visit.  No idea how many of these are spreading COVID but it cannot be helping.

The good news is hospitals are not full.  Capacity slowly going away.

I see the same thing along the Central Coast of California.  At Pismo Beach the locals generally are wearing masks and social distancing.  Those visiting from outside of the area (either out of state or from other areas of California) tend to be less likely to wear masks, and ignore distancing.

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1 hour ago, D C said:

DW and I were talking about this earlier.

Who does have the authority? The CDC only makes recommendations. No authority.  States make up their own rules based on whatever they want (perhaps cdc recommendations). 

 

Does any body have federal level authority over how vaccines are distributed? I'm not thinking they do. 

Only to the degree that if the Feds buy it, they can also set the rules on its use.  Don't follow the rules, no more federal purchased vaccine.  Same way the feds influence other areas where they have no direct authority, the power of the purse.

 

 

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50 minutes ago, nocl said:

I see the same thing along the Central Coast of California.  At Pismo Beach the locals generally are wearing masks and social distancing.  Those visiting from outside of the area (either out of state or from other areas of California) tend to be less likely to wear masks, and ignore distancing.

Curious how you can tell by looking who is local and who is not?  Or are you just assuming if they are not wearing masks they must be from outside the area?

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2 hours ago, D C said:

DW and I were talking about this earlier.

Who does have the authority? The CDC only makes recommendations. No authority.  States make up their own rules based on whatever they want (perhaps cdc recommendations). 

 

Does any body have federal level authority over how vaccines are distributed? I'm not thinking they do. 

 

Public health authority generally exists at the state, county, municipal, and tribal government levels in the US. Execution is almost exclusively at the local level, whether that's county, city, or tribal. Federal public health authority is interstate and international. And those local health departments are notoriously underfunded, competing for pothole repair dollars, and in many states public school funding. Some health departments are partially fee funded, so your restaurants, for instance, pay fees that fund inspection and enforcement. So, yes, you're seeing what I'd consider normal practices for incident management of pretty much everything other than a nuclear accident or a weapons of mass destruction attack (not being facetious; those are two actual exceptions to local management that I recall) where the federal government exerts primary control.

 

As to authority over how vaccines are distributed, yes, the Federal government is buying vaccine and paying for shipping. For the most part, at the macro level, that's not the problem. Over 22M doses of vaccine have been distributed to the states (beyond that level, you probably have to look at each individual state, and maybe even locality). Only about 1/3 of that has actually been administered.

 

For administration, no. With the exception of federal contracts with CVS and Walgreens for vaccinating long term care residents, where the facility choses to participate, the actual administration of the vaccines is more or less following the standard emergency management model. Everyone defers to the local government, and the entire system is designed to support the local government. But in emergency management, you get emergency declarations and requests for assistance. That mostly produces a flow of money, and possibly some degree of state and federal manpower, but it's really about money. From all appearances, the states are exerting authority on prioritization, then deferring to local governments, which may well be self-funded for this, to execute. Various pharmacies are partners for administration of the vaccines, but I honestly can't figure out who's paying (the vaccine is free, but there's a cost to CVS, Giant, Wegman's, HEB, etc. to actually manage the vaccines and give the shots, and they're apparently allowed to charge for some of that). Here in Virginia, we're moving into the federal 1b on Monday, and my wife as a teacher can get vaccinated, but there's no information from the county on how that will work, and the major pharmacies still haven't updated their information. Policy is moving faster than execution, and policy is being reported.

 

Stumbled across a fascinating article in the Post this evening that's essentially a first person account from a county manager in Florida. At his level, the details he needed for planning didn't come to him, and even now, he's struggling with inconsistent vaccine availability, and trying to put in place systems to manage demand and to schedule vaccinations. It's a crappy analogy, but it sounded like what happens in the Mid-Atlantic up to at least NYC at 10:00 on the day Springsteen tickets go on sale. Or Hamilton. Phone lines crashing, over a million people trying to get one of the 5000 appointments he actually has staff to support as he tries to gear up for a county with roughly 230,000 people eligible for vaccines. That was Florida, which has 67 counties. In Virginia, we have 95 counties and 38 independent cities that are politically and administratively completely separate from the county. Multiply that by 50, plus the District of Columbia, and then add in Tribal governments where they're receiving vaccine directly from Pfizer and Moderna (so far), and don't forget the VA and DoD (possibly but not necessarily including beneficiaries who receive most of their vaccines from civilian pharmacies, such as Walgreens...).

 

If memory serves, the Pfizer advisory meeting was a month ago tomorrow. The only thing similar I can think of was childhood polio and smallpox vaccinations, and even though there was some sense of urgency, everyone pretty much realized those were multi-year and ongoing programs. Everyone wants this to end now...

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10 minutes ago, phoenix_dream said:

Curious how you can tell by looking who is local and who is not?  Or are you just assuming if they are not wearing masks they must be from outside the area?

1. License Plates both the state and the dealership mentioned around the plate. Observing which vehicle they got out of or returned to

2. Talking and listening to people (visitors will usual say where they are visiting from to just about anyone they meet).

3. Behavior - One can get a pretty good idea by observing the locals vs visitors. One recognizes the locals that frequent the beach area simple because you have seen them week after week. Keep in mind that Pismo Beach is around 8,200 people.  Even if you lump in the 5 cities you are talking 50,000. if someone is fishing from the pier they are usually local, if the chairs they use on the beach are used they are usually local.  If they have chairs that have a hotels name or have one of the hotels beach towels they are usually visitors.  People hitting the tourist focused gift shops are usually visitors. If someone enters or leaves one of the local hotels or vacation rentals they are usually not local. On and on.  In this small of a community, that tends to be a tourist destination, one gets a good idea who is local and who is not.

 

 

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11 hours ago, phoenix_dream said:

Curious how you can tell by looking who is local and who is not?  Or are you just assuming if they are not wearing masks they must be from outside the area?

I know you were asking about California in your post, but it is very easy to tell at times here in my section of Florida. 

 

In one of my pre Christmas visits (eight days before Christmas to lay in supplies for the next two weeks), there was a thirties something couple shopping mask free in the store.  It was a safe assumption they were from out of state.

 

We were having one of our cold snaps. The low temperature the night before was below freezing and the high was only in the mid sixties.   Locals were wearing long pants and light jackets.  Ding Dong 1 and 2 were in bath suits; his covered onto by a tee shirt, hers by a lacy cover up.

 

Repeat them by  I don't know how many hundreds of thousands, and it is no wonder we have the unmitigated community spread here in Florida. (Yes, local "it's a hoax" dummies also are a big factor.)

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14 hours ago, SJSULIBRARIAN said:

I am in AZ and it upsets me that they are moving to 1b when my husband, living in a memory care/assisted living facility  and 1a, has not been vaccinated nor does his facility have any date for their supposed vaccine clinic for which I gave permission over three weeks ago. It is not going smoothly at all, at least in my county. And i Know of people who "have jumped the line" even though they are not health care workers or in long term care. The best laid plans?????

Definitely check with your state or county health authority about your situation.

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14 hours ago, D C said:

DW and I were talking about this earlier.

Who does have the authority? The CDC only makes recommendations. No authority.  States make up their own rules based on whatever they want (perhaps cdc recommendations). 

 

Does any body have federal level authority over how vaccines are distributed? I'm not thinking they do. 

I think the distribution of the vaccine is controlled by CDC and Warp Speed in the US.  Everything after that in the hands of the states and counties and cities.  

 

I was more wondering about the dosing and dosing protocols.  One dose to more people?  A half dose to more people?  Versus the current two doses.  Who decides?  The FDA?  HHS?  I think this is above a state level decision.

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12 hours ago, nocl said:

If they have chairs that have a hotels name or have one of the hotels beach towels they are usually visitors.  People hitting the tourist focused gift shops are usually visitors. If someone enters or leaves one of the local hotels or vacation rentals they are usually not local. On and on.  In this small of a community, that tends to be a tourist destination, one gets a good idea who is local and who is not.

 

 

 

There's the problem! It is not taking the pandemic serious. People on holiday and staying in hotels during this stage of the crisis. I am surprised that gift shops are open. 

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