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11 hours ago, CruisingFA said:

Thought I remember reading somewhere monarch/sovereign met up with constellation to transfer the crew before heading to Aliaga...anyone else see that or know if it’s true?

I think it may have been Infinity, but yes, both ships met with an X ship and unloaded crew just before their Aliaga arrival.

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5 minutes ago, CruisingFA said:

Infinity is slowly making its way towards Malta now

True, and it is her first meaningful move away from Greek waters in a long time, but not sure how that relates to Empress.

Edited by Biker19
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26 minutes ago, ipeeinthepool said:

Has anyone seen any recent pictures from the beach in Turkey?  Maybe they've made enough progress there's room for more ships.

All 5 ships are still beached (Looks like they are actively working on two)  and I believe that there is another 3-4 anchored offshore waiting. 

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2 hours ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

Can you share any recent pictures or supply a link?

Here are the 5 ships on the beach at Aliaga:

 

123048909_1060547084382082_2645289688032582421_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&ccb=2&_nc_sid=b9115d&_nc_ohc=NIg8tXnPeDQAX9JKaQm&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-2.xx&oh=de5c172a33ff3f1ea82ac2fa8fdd6429&oe=5FC564B4

 

The next cruise ships due for scrapping (Horizon, Marella Dream and Celebration) are not off Aliaga but tied up just south Elefsina, Greece (about a day sailing away from Aliaga):

 

123064723_10221055475809978_8358211046574441976_n.jpg?_nc_cat=100&ccb=2&_nc_sid=b9115d&_nc_ohc=eSCbkyvZjhAAX-TcWuT&_nc_ht=scontent-ort2-2.xx&oh=7989f1add33b6ae204959d24ad87ab21&oe=5FC674B8

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5 minutes ago, ipeeinthepool said:

It would seem to be more economical to just bring the Majesty and maybe the Empress to the collection of ships off Greece after they have removed everything of value to RCL. 

The ships have been to Malta before. The only potential sign that either ship may be divested from RCI is if they spend considerable time (a week+) docked at the pier - have not seen that for either ship.

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2 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

The ships have been to Malta before. The only potential sign that either ship may be divested from RCI is if they spend considerable time (a week+) docked at the pier - have not seen that for either ship.

 

You're probably correct but I wonder if they have been doing more than crew transfers when they dock in Greece.  maybe they won't need that much time in Malta.

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1 hour ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

You're probably correct but I wonder if they have been doing more than crew transfers when they dock in Greece.  maybe they won't need that much time in Malta.

Even if RCI wanted to get rid of Empress, the line waiting to get on the beach at Aliaga is pretty long (several months).

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11 hours ago, Biker19 said:

True, and it is her first meaningful move away from Greek waters in a long time, but not sure how that relates to Empress.

Meant it for majesty. And the CFO had an interview a few days ago saying they could potentially move some ships

Edited by CruisingFA
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1 hour ago, CruisingFA said:

Meant it for majesty. And the CFO had an interview a few days ago saying they could potentially move some ships

 

I think Jason Liberty's answer to the analyst question is about as vague as you can get.  They could potentially move some ships, they could potentially do nothing.  They could move ships, they could invest to make them fit where they are.  Nothing definitive in his response, he was elusive as he always has been. 

 

A bigger takeaway for me was the new build projection 4 or 5 years down the road.  Effectively he answered there will be slower new build growth in the latter part of 4 or 5 years away.  What I took from that was limited new orders beyond what has been contracted or committed already.  

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22 minutes ago, twangster said:

 

I think Jason Liberty's answer to the analyst question is about as vague as you can get.  They could potentially move some ships, they could potentially do nothing.  They could move ships, they could invest to make them fit where they are.  Nothing definitive in his response, he was elusive as he always has been. 

 

A bigger takeaway for me was the new build projection 4 or 5 years down the road.  Effectively he answered there will be slower new build growth in the latter part of 4 or 5 years away.  What I took from that was limited new orders beyond what has been contracted or committed already.  

I’m not taking it as it’s a definitive  they are leaving, but with the past comments of empress/majesty aren’t being sold to now we could potentially make some moves and majesty/infinity both on the way to Malta the timing is just odd.

 

there is a bunkering ship next to majesty now so could be just getting fuel 🤷🏻‍♂️

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19 minutes ago, CruisingFA said:

I’m not taking it as it’s a definitive  they are leaving, but with the past comments of empress/majesty aren’t being sold to now we could potentially make some moves and majesty/infinity both on the way to Malta the timing is just odd.

 

there is a bunkering ship next to majesty now so could be just getting fuel 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

The last two analyst calls contained the same elusive verbiage for ship movements.  They too were during the Q&A portion so it's not like he was making a statement for the purpose of indicating an intention, he was answering a specifc analyst's question.  

 

Empress did a jaunt over to Malta to top up a few weeks ago before returning to Souda without ever going to the dock in Malta.  

Edited by twangster
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10 minutes ago, Blue Eyed Belfast Belle said:

Does GRHER stand for Heraklion in Greece?

 

Suspect so.  Whenever Majesty or Empress have returned to the island they have stopped in Heraklion before heading to Souda Bay.   A local media outlet reported this was for COVID-19 testing.  

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I wonder if RCI is waiting for the results of the election today to determine the fate of these two ships.

 

They were both their Cuban ships which was closed last year by the current President.  If he gets re-elected lower possibility of them opening Cuban itineraries again.  No need for those ships any longer I would suppose.

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There is no way it is simply coincidence that both Empress and Majesty are hanging around this part of the world.

There are so many reasons pointing to both these ships being scrapped (or sold, or??) vs. so few reasons to keep them in the RCG fleet. I really don't care what a blog or company spokesman says in a press release.

 

If sailings had started sooner (less billions of dollars bleeding) I think there would've been a better argument for them staying. 

Edited by Hoopster95
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Could be a lot of different factors in play.  Cuba will be a long game IMO.  They could have secured debt or credit using these ships and once Odyssey is acquired they can shift that collateral security to her.  It could be waiting to see if there is consumer appetite for a Pullmantur relaunch.  It could be that the boutique type Empress cruises to unique destinations had the potential to be high margin so one year of such sailings was attractive.  It could be a combination of all or some of the above.  

 

Grandeur was excluded when they rejiggled 3 other ship itineraries recently.  She has no bookings past March.  If they planned to keep her surely they would try to get something out there to take deposits on.  At least MJ and NE have future cruises on the books.  Yet they keep all 3 around maybe looking for the BBD (Bigger Better Deal)?  In my mind Grandeur is the one to watch with Majesty and Empress in peripheral vision.   

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52 minutes ago, twangster said:

In my mind Grandeur is the one to watch with Majesty and Empress in peripheral vision.   

 

Interesting thoughts....

Now seeing that a Q2'ish start-up is more likely than ever, I am convinced that MJ, EM as well and Grandeur are gone.

I also still believe Vision & Rhapsody are in great danger of being sold/transferred./whathaveyou.

 

I feel if "test" sailings go well in Feb/March, that a somewhat "normal" itinerary schedule can perhaps be in place by late summer or early fall. This would bode well to keep ships. However, if test sailings fail, USA C19 2nd & 3rd waves become disasters, or a severe economic downturn occurs, I cannot see RCL keeping any Vision Class (or under) ships whatsoever.

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3 hours ago, Hoopster95 said:

 

Interesting thoughts....

Now seeing that a Q2'ish start-up is more likely than ever, I am convinced that MJ, EM as well and Grandeur are gone.

I also still believe Vision & Rhapsody are in great danger of being sold/transferred./whathaveyou.

 

I feel if "test" sailings go well in Feb/March, that a somewhat "normal" itinerary schedule can perhaps be in place by late summer or early fall. This would bode well to keep ships. However, if test sailings fail, USA C19 2nd & 3rd waves become disasters, or a severe economic downturn occurs, I cannot see RCL keeping any Vision Class (or under) ships whatsoever.

 

Grandeur has one 7 night cruise currently and that's on Jan. 2, 2021.  All other current Grandeur cruises are too long to satisfy the CDC's CSO.  

 

Unless something changes, she'll never sail with Royal guests again.  

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