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Cause for cautious optimism?


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5 hours ago, SusieQft said:

If not enough people are vaccinated to reach herd immunity, then all those people with the virus but no symptoms (as well as the ones with symptoms) will just help perpetuate the status quo.  Herd immunity will almost certainly be necessary to stop the pandemic.

 

Yes, there are a lot of unknowns.  We are used to getting flu shots once a year and if the COVID immunity does not last we will probably need to do the same for that.  But hopefully with better compliance than we have with flu shots.

 

I think the news just came out of Oxford that immunity after contracting the virus lasts at least 6 months, double what was said 3 months ago.  It has not been around long enough to know yet if it lasts longer.  Some reports have said that the immune response to the vaccines pending emergency use approval is more robust than the natural immunity.  I think it is very realistic to hope that it will also last as long, and that the duration will be more than 6 months.  Time will tell.

I do hope we don't go the herd method because this would result in way too many deaths in the USA and would overwhelm the hospitals. 

 

Yes the challenge will be getting a high number of people vaccinated.

 

However, I truly believe this can be done.  People are funny "creatures".  One day everyone thinks something is bad and the next day (figuratively speaking could be months later) people see it the opposite way.

 

The key will be education and lots of it and talking up the importance of the vaccine.

 

If the vaccine(s) are successful and they look promising.  If the side effects turn are minimal.  If there is a concerted effort from our elected officials starting with the President down to the Governor's and the Mayors and we get all of them in sync promoting this, and if the medical community supports this (I have not reason to think they wouldn't) and a massive AD campaign and schools pushing it,  along with people of faith (Rabbis, Ministers, Priests) etc., etc., etc., I truly believe we will turn around the 50/50 present view of getting and not getting it. 

 

There will always be naysayers but I am optimistic on this.

 

I also think if it was not made political and supported by day 1 masks would have been warn by many more people.  I watched the COVID-19 task force meeting when masks were announced and cringed the way it was explained.  If explained in a 100% positive manner we would have started in a much better place.

I would hope all of this would be done before there is any talk about herd immunity.  That would be horrible IMHO.

 

As to the predictions of the vaccine if something knows something that has not been released yet because it is way too knew to know. 

 

I haven't seen the Oxford study but one study.  My own doctor told me that the have tested some of her patients and at three or four months the antibodies diminished and were pretty much gone at six months.  Have no idea if you have lost some if that makes you prone or not.

 

This virus is still relatively new and with each passing day we learn something new.

 

What?

 

One day we're told it stays on everything so wash your clothes when you get home.  Then we are told it doesn't.  Now we learn with the cold months starting to be felt in the USA they are learning it even stays around for along time on Wood.  Changes in views on how long it's in the air.  They now say longer than the thought.  Some say social distance by six feet yet studies say not enough and that is true if someone who is sick with it sneezes and coughs. 

 

I am not faulting any of this and realize it is work and learning in progress.

 

Even viruses which have been around forever or diseases science learns new things all the time. 

 

Realistically though studies can vary by study on the same item.  Sometimes it is simply because of the number of people or mix of people studied.


Back to the vaccine.  If the vaccine(s) work as good as stated and side effects low I do think a lot of the American Public can be won over and I hope this is the case with the World Population.  Of course lots of challenges vaccinating people around the world including those in very remote areas.

 

Keith

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13 minutes ago, Keith1010 said:

I do hope we don't go the herd method because this would result in way too many deaths in the USA and would overwhelm the hospitals. 

I was referring to herd immunity achieved with a good vaccine (or multiple good vaccines), not by having everyone be infected with the actual virus.  It is still herd immunity.  So I think you actually do want us to get to herd immunity, which really is the only way out of this.  This term has been misused in the media, leading to the false impression that it only means everyone getting the disease.

 

As for the antibody levels, I would expect them to be very high while you are actively fighting an infection (or initially responding to a vaccine), and then diminish over time.  Your body would not need to continue to produce a lot of antibodies when the threat (inside you) is gone.  (In fact, if you continued to produce a high level of antibodies to everything that your body had encountered over your life that in itself would probably cause other problems.)  But the cells that make the antibodies should hopefully remember how to do it, so that if the threat returns they can ramp up quickly to produce the antibodies again.  I think that is how long lasting immunity works.  I am not sure how they measure this memory ability -- perhaps by having some antibody present and detectable, but it would not be by continuing to have high levels of the antibody.

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2 minutes ago, SusieQft said:

I was referring to herd immunity achieved with a good vaccine (or multiple good vaccines), not by having everyone be infected with the actual virus.  It is still herd immunity.  So I think you actually do want us to get to herd immunity, which really is the only way out of this.  This term has been misused in the media, leading to the false impression that it only means everyone getting the disease.

 

As for the antibody levels, I would expect them to be very high while you are actively fighting an infection (or initially responding to a vaccine), and then diminish over time.  Your body would not need to continue to produce a lot of antibodies when the threat (inside you) is gone.  (In fact, if you continued to produce a high level of antibodies to everything that your body had encountered over your life that in itself would probably cause other problems.)  But the cells that make the antibodies should hopefully remember how to do it, so that if the threat returns they can ramp up quickly to produce the antibodies again.  I think that is how long lasting immunity works.  I am not sure how they measure this memory ability -- perhaps by having some antibody present and detectable, but it would not be by continuing to have high levels of the antibody.

That's great.  I hadn't realized what you meant. Now I do.  Maybe it's too late or early at night where I am.    I agree with you as do the scientists.  As Dr. Fauci has said if we can get a high percentage of people to get the vaccine and if it is 95% effective and given a number of people who get the virus have no or mild symptoms we could be in a much better place.  I hope this is possible and am very encouraged. 

 

I still think the challenge after everything is said and done is the sheer challenge of the actual vaccination of people with not one but two vaccines required. 

 

This is one that I know the new administration wants to wrap their arms around and hopefully when the transition begins they can start to do just that.  I envision it being given our in parking lots across the country rather than indoors. 

 

An equal challenge is the Pfizer vaccine given that it has to be kept so cold meaning it has a short shelf life.

 

On antibodies one of the things they have been discussing is how this can vary by person.  At least from what I read seems to indicate the amount of antibodies you have  could be based on how severe and how long you had the virus and any medicines you were given.  For example, they were speculating with the medicine POTUS was given he could have far less antibodies than someone not given the cocktail.  I have no idea if any of this is based on fact as again we are dealing with something relatively new but it was food for thought.

 

I love going back to the topic at hand.

 

I am more optimistic by the day. 

 

What drives my optimism is 95% success.  I hope this is true as I realize the study is not as large as normally would be the case with a vaccine that is years in the making.  Hoping that since more than one drug maker came to the same conclusion that says something.  While note 100% I will take 95% over the other numbers people were talking about even a couple of weeks ago. 

 

In the meantime, if we can all do the proper things we could get control of this such as wearing a mask.

 

Oh and I have to add wearing the right mask and wearing it correctly.  Saw a couple in the grocery store the other day.  Yes, they had masks on but over their nostrils.  I politely mentioned this to them.  I have chosen the path of speaking up on this including when I've seen employees removing mask to drink something in the grocery store.  This defeats the purpose. 

 

Keith

 

 

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11 hours ago, cruisr said:

I do not know anyone that died.  I don’t know anyone that knows anyone that died.  I don’t know anyone hospitalized.  I know 7 people that had it.  One was 29 the other 6 ages 62-91.  All recovered within a week to 10 days.   I also know that one hospital, where a friend’s DH is a MD, who had an admission in the ER who had been in a massive motorcycle accident and died in the ER.  He was hit by a car.  He had covid in his body but died of massive trauma due to a motorcycle accident.  His death was listed as CV.  Again, I am not denying it exists I just don’t believe anything the “experts” or the people in charge say.  Sad commentary and most I know feel the same way.

 

Its sad entire segments of the economy and one of the biggest global industries, tourism, is being destroyed.  It will be sad if many cruiselines, including Crystal, do not make it.

I am really glad that you are so fortunate in not knowing anyone who has died from Covid, I cannot say the same thing. I know 3 people who died of Covid without any other health issues. One guy was a very fit healthy 53 year old, his elderly mother is devastated, the other 2 were in their early 60's, again no underlying health issues. The last lady died on Monday of this week, 3 days after her grandchild, who she never saw, was born. 

I am continually amazed by some of the thoughtless remarks made on this board, I love to cruise and take vacations, but I would rather be spending time with friends and family without the fear of contracting this horrible, deadly virus.

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My daughter who presently lives in Sydney, Australia sent me this link.

 

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/nsw-records-14-day-incubation-cycle-with-no-local-covid-19-cases-20201121-p56gnn.html

 

As the article notes one of the approaches taken is if you have even a sore throat to get tested for COVID-19.  My daughter did just that the other day getting her test results back within 10 hours and showing negative.  About two weeks ago she took our granddaughter for a COVID-19 test as well.

 

Contrast this in the USA where in some places where people are worried they have COVID-19 the lines are very long, testing sites are not always convenient and results can take days.

 

Most recently,  in the USA 2,000 daily deaths from COVID-19, 185,000+ new cases and a new report saying one in five of our hospitals are understaffed.

 

One of the other things I applaud is how long they quarantine versus our guidelines.  

 

Where I live we just went into the red zone.  This is not the zone you want to be in and I believe 42 of 50 states are in the red zone.

 

Friends of mine have lost three parents to COVID-19.  One lost her parents within days of one another.

 

My next door neighbors had COVID-19, another neighbor went to an event for her granddaughter (I recommended they not go given her husband has health issues including  COPD).  Guess what?  Three family members testing for COVID-19 have COVID so this couple is in quarantine.  I pray they will not get it.   A few days after November 26 we may find ourselves starting to enter a period even darker then now.  I expect new cases to break previous daily highs and four to six weeks from now to see daily deaths at the level or even higher seen on 9/11/01.

 

Those lines for COVID-19 tests could be miles in length and we will max out many medical facilities.

 

My heart goes out to all of the first responders and all medical care professionals and support staff who are putting their lives on the line.  Keep in mind many do not have the proper PPE and are reusing items because new ones are not available.  They are doing this to keep as many patients alive as possible.  

 

I fear for those in nursing homes and other similar facilities whose odds of getting COVID-19 will increase should those who work there have COVID-19 and not realize it.  This is how the two parents of my friend died a couple of months ago.  While she was unable to visit her parents since March and could only wave to them outside their window facing the outside, it was a worker who brought the disease into the facility.

 

If you don't know someone who has had COVID-19 (by the way some people have it but don't want others to know) or do not know someone who has died from it, remember this is not a hoax, it is real, it is the greatest health threat we have faced in our lifetime, the remedy is still six to eight months away when hopefully distribution of the vaccine will go to anyone who wants it, and in the next two months I am afraid because many people are selfish we will may see 150,000+ deaths and 10 Million+ new cases and people possibly dying in the street.  

 

My advice.  Don't travel this Thanksgiving, and only socialize with those under your roof or in your bubble.  I know.  There are exception such as the persons who get together who each quarantines for 14 days and can see one another without stopping along the way.  Remember though this requires a true quarantine. Going to the food store doesn't count as any of us can pick up the virus there.  I suspect the vast majority of people traveling this coming holiday weekend will not fall into the exception category.

 

We will be at home and by ourselves and Tom The Turkey  on our favorite family holiday of the year.  We figure while there arare no guarantees in life by sacrificing this year hopefully will allow us to have future Thanksgivings with family.  

 

With that said we will have a short family get-together as I have scheduled a zoom call with our families in Australia and our State.   While virtual, for us its still the real deal.  

 

Whatever you do in the USA or around the world, stay safe, stay well, stay healthy and don't let your guard down.

 

Keith

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On 11/20/2020 at 1:58 PM, cruisr said:

I do not know anyone that died.  I don’t know anyone that knows anyone that died.  I don’t know anyone hospitalized.  I know 7 people that had it.  One was 29 the other 6 ages 62-91.  All recovered within a week to 10 days.   I also know that one hospital, where a friend’s DH is a MD, who had an admission in the ER who had been in a massive motorcycle accident and died in the ER.  He was hit by a car.  He had covid in his body but died of massive trauma due to a motorcycle accident.  His death was listed as CV.  Again, I am not denying it exists I just don’t believe anything the “experts” or the people in charge say.  Sad commentary and most I know feel the same way.

 

Are you speaking of a different incident than this summer in Florida that was widely reported on both mainstream and social media?  Because that incident was ultimately removed from the list of Covid deaths. 

 

https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/fox-35-investigates-questions-raised-after-fatal-motorcycle-crash-listed-as-covid-19-death

 

My Sister/Niece and family felt the same as you and others you know. Until their ex-Husband/Father wound up hospitalized with Covid in October. And a few weeks later their Brother-in-Law/Uncle. Both survived and were

ultimately released. But it was the post-hospital 14-day in-home quarantine that altered their opinion of the situation. It took three households to provide meals, monitor meds, oxygen, etc, all without physically entering. All while maintaining their own work schedules and home schooling kids. A home health nurse came twice a week, in full PPP,  to take blood. They were the only ones who could enter the home. 

 

Our local Fox News station this morning said area hospitalizations are up threefold, and the newly-enforced community restrictions have been put into place to guard against overcrowding as well as overtax medical staffing. 

 

So protect yourself in the best way possible to avoid exposure and possible hospitalization. 

 

 

 

 

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Just a quick update of the rapid recent further developments concerning vaccines. The Pfizer vaccine has now published it's safety review and our government has submitted it to our independent UK regulator for approval and licensing consideration. The developers have stated that they will also be filing for emergency approval to the US regulator. We have another independent body here in the UK responsible for the prioritisation, on a risk basis, of the vaccines national roll-out and we are getting geared up for vaccination of our care home residents and staff, the first category, to start in early December, subject to regulatory approval, of course. We are also told that our Oxford University/ Astra Zeneca vaccine looks extremely promising. The scientists are working now with the regulator with the aim of a very speedy approval process of this vaccine when the time comes.

Don't forget, we have got this far in substantially less than a year. IMHO great and positive further news.

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4 hours ago, kool kruiser said:

Just a quick update of the rapid recent further developments concerning vaccines. The Pfizer vaccine has now published it's safety review and our government has submitted it to our independent UK regulator for approval and licensing consideration. The developers have stated that they will also be filing for emergency approval to the US regulator. We have another independent body here in the UK responsible for the prioritisation, on a risk basis, of the vaccines national roll-out and we are getting geared up for vaccination of our care home residents and staff, the first category, to start in early December, subject to regulatory approval, of course. We are also told that our Oxford University/ Astra Zeneca vaccine looks extremely promising. The scientists are working now with the regulator with the aim of a very speedy approval process of this vaccine when the time comes.

Don't forget, we have got this far in substantially less than a year. IMHO great and positive further news.

Yes, such hopeful news! I am actually interested in the Oxford AZ vaccine as my preferred of vaccines so may wait for that - my health system has been involved in clinical trials on that one. In my state (where we have Mayo Clinic) response has been intelligently done but Sturgis South Dakota motorcycle rally has led us into tragic levels again.

 

I am very hopeful to cruise in 2022, and am happy to conform as necessary and follow all precautions! Those not fully committed are people I will avoid!

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Today's NY Times has an interview with Dr. Fauci. Here is his response regarding return to "normalcy." Interesting.

 

"When do you think we’ll all be able to throw our masks away?

I think that we’re going to have some degree of public health measures together with the vaccine for a considerable period of time. But we’ll start approaching normal — if the overwhelming majority of people take the vaccine — as we get into the third or fourth quarter [of 2021]."

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9 hours ago, edgee said:

Today's NY Times has an interview with Dr. Fauci. Here is his response regarding return to "normalcy." Interesting.

 

"When do you think we’ll all be able to throw our masks away?

I think that we’re going to have some degree of public health measures together with the vaccine for a considerable period of time. But we’ll start approaching normal — if the overwhelming majority of people take the vaccine — as we get into the third or fourth quarter [of 2021]."

 

Maybe keep the mask like the Japanese and Chinese do during flu season. When I cruise again, I will bring masks post COVID. I remember seeing a Japanese cruise ship in Dubrovnik about 10 years ago and practically everyone who got off was wearing masks.  Japan, Taiwan, China, all have ridiculously low COVID rates compared to COVID ridden US and Europe.

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15 hours ago, edgee said:

Today's NY Times has an interview with Dr. Fauci. Here is his response regarding return to "normalcy." Interesting.

 

"When do you think we’ll all be able to throw our masks away?

I think that we’re going to have some degree of public health measures together with the vaccine for a considerable period of time. But we’ll start approaching normal — if the overwhelming majority of people take the vaccine — as we get into the third or fourth quarter [of 2021]."

Glad you shared this.

 

I follow what he says in print such as this interview and on TV interviews.

 

Yes, as this interview points out Dr. Fauci and as is the case with other  health experts I follow stay they will continue to recommend masks, social distancing and the frequent washing of hands for quite sometime.

 

Unless there is a surprise, we will have the capability for people who want the vaccine to get it in the second quarter of 2021.  Those getting it before in many places such as the USA will be based on priority which is why they say sometime in the second quarter.

 

However, the key issue is what you referenced and that is how many people will get the vaccine.

 

I believe when it comes to the flu vaccine about 50% of Americans age six months and above get it.  


We will need to do a lot better on this one.

 

It can be done with one set of messages/communications which is consistent unlike all of the mixed messages on the wearing of masks.  However, when I say it can be done the question is how high they can drive the percentage up.  The more the better.

 

The other question is how long the vaccine lasts so I do think the unknown is how long the recommended practices continue to be recommended and exactly what happens with this virus.  At some point does it go away or is here for a very long time?

 

Dr. Fauci does expect us to get to a normal by this time next year such as people being able to get together for Thanksgiving in the USA next year as well as Christmas, Channukah and New Years.  

 

I hope he is right and most importantly I hope the rollout of the vaccines can be done in an orderly way and one which maximizes the ability to get each person who wants the vaccine, vaccinated. with a strong communication package to encourage people to get the vaccine.  

 

Getting back to some type of normal is what most everyone wants.  Can't wait.

 

In the meantime I wish everyone would heed the advice of Dr. Fauci and many of the other experts who say to be careful over Thanksgiving and the holidays which follow and in most cases do not recommend family gathering other than those who live under the same roof.

 

For those who don't follow this I do hope they will at least follow portions of this and that includes if you are inside a home with others who don't live there and have a meal inside in addition to all of the distancing etc to keep windows open because ventilation is key.  I am afraid the disaster we are experiencing now is going to be compounded by this Thursday.  We should know the results a few days following this and in the next few weeks.  So sad.  We have to honker down IMHO before the vaccine is available to most of us.

 

Keith

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17 hours ago, mskatiemae said:

Yes, such hopeful news! I am actually interested in the Oxford AZ vaccine as my preferred of vaccines so may wait for that - my health system has been involved in clinical trials on that one. In my state (where we have Mayo Clinic) response has been intelligently done but Sturgis South Dakota motorcycle rally has led us into tragic levels again.

 

I am very hopeful to cruise in 2022, and am happy to conform as necessary and follow all precautions! Those not fully committed are people I will avoid!

You must be psychic🙂. Today we have news that this vaccine has a 70%+ level of immunisation. However, it seems that this could be increased to 90% by tweaking the dosages. In any event, a much higher immunity level than most flu vaccines.

Our independent regulator has been asked to consider approval and it is hoped to start roll out before the end of the year. In the UK, we have purchased 100 million doses, enough to vaccinate at least 50 million people. This vaccine is much less expensive and easy to store. Astra plan to produce 3 billion doses per annum. We are advised that we could start to see a return to normality by Spring/Summer. Great news, bearing in mind that this has been achieved in just 10 months!

 

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4 hours ago, kool kruiser said:

You must be psychic🙂. Today we have news that this vaccine has a 70%+ level of immunisation. However, it seems that this could be increased to 90% by tweaking the dosages. In any event, a much higher immunity level than most flu vaccines.

Our independent regulator has been asked to consider approval and it is hoped to start roll out before the end of the year. In the UK, we have purchased 100 million doses, enough to vaccinate at least 50 million people. This vaccine is much less expensive and easy to store. Astra plan to produce 3 billion doses per annum. We are advised that we could start to see a return to normality by Spring/Summer. Great news, bearing in mind that this has been achieved in just 10 months!

 

I heard on the news that the current percentage is based on about 12,000 people.  Evidently it does not include everyone who was part of the study including those from the USA and I believe more results will be added from other Europeans.  

 

The other two vaccine vendor I believe had studies based on results of 42,000 for Pfizer and somewhat lever for the other company.

 

Personally, I like the two which have a 95% success rate.  Keeping fingers crossed that this level of success continues and is consistent across various age groups, etc.

 

Keith

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8 hours ago, kool kruiser said:

You must be psychic🙂. Today we have news that this vaccine has a 70%+ level of immunisation. However, it seems that this could be increased to 90% by tweaking the dosages. In any event, a much higher immunity level than most flu vaccines.

Our independent regulator has been asked to consider approval and it is hoped to start roll out before the end of the year. In the UK, we have purchased 100 million doses, enough to vaccinate at least 50 million people. This vaccine is much less expensive and easy to store. Astra plan to produce 3 billion doses per annum. We are advised that we could start to see a return to normality by Spring/Summer. Great news, bearing in mind that this has been achieved in just 10 months!

 

I just did more reading and this is indeed good news.

 

I now understand the tweaking and how fabulous they believe they can get to 90% and that the storage will be much easier than the two other companies making it great for many nations.

 

What is amazing is how in the past it's taken 15 to 20 years to develop an effective vaccine where we now have three companies which if their information proves accurate that could be great solutions and the development was on a very fast track.

 

Some really positive news.

 

Keith

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5 minutes ago, ryndam said:

Qantas announced that all travelers will be required to show proof of COVID vaccination in order to fly on its planes.


I watched the interview last night and he said that would be the case on international flights in and out of Australia - the situation for domestic flights is still to be determined 

 

Here’s the interview 

 

https://9now.nine.com.au/a-current-affair/coronavirus-exclusive-the-compulsory-conditions-for-australians-to-travel-internationally-as-lockdowns-ease/e4bf2f6c-faab-46dd-8528-b7f8120ede2f

 

 

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13 minutes ago, FlyerTalker said:

Of course, this will not apply to other carriers unless:

 

a) they chose to follow suit, or

b) this becomes a governmental mandate rather than a corporate decision


Qantas have taken the Corporate decision to require this and sure things can change but I suspect they’ve done so after considering the commercial consequences to it

 

I’m sure Alan Joyce, the CEO, is talking to other airline CEOs. He did say “I think that's going to be a common thing talking to my colleagues in other airlines around the globe.”

 

Don't worry the antivaxers are already responding with their concerns but I’d say Qantas is not likely to change based on those protests 

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10 hours ago, Stickman1990 said:


Qantas have taken the Corporate decision to require this and sure things can change but I suspect they’ve done so after considering the commercial consequences to it

 

I’m sure Alan Joyce, the CEO, is talking to other airline CEOs. He did say “I think that's going to be a common thing talking to my colleagues in other airlines around the globe.”

 

Don't worry the antivaxers are already responding with their concerns but I’d say Qantas is not likely to change based on those protests 

Is Quantas the only airline flying from/to Australia? I do not think that in Europe vaccines will be mandatory. There has always been (and now more because many think that in the short time not enough knowledge has been acquired about the side effects) a strong resistance to vaccines. Will that mean that those people who are not vaccinated will not be able to come to Australia?

Ivi

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23 hours ago, Keith1010 said:

I heard on the news that the current percentage is based on about 12,000 people.  Evidently it does not include everyone who was part of the study including those from the USA and I believe more results will be added from other Europeans.  

 

The other two vaccine vendor I believe had studies based on results of 42,000 for Pfizer and somewhat lever for the other company.

 

Personally, I like the two which have a 95% success rate.  Keeping fingers crossed that this level of success continues and is consistent across various age groups, etc.

 

Keith

I'm afraid that what you heard was incorrect ( I hesitate to say fake news😀).

Having looked into this, the results are based on the data from 24,000 volunteers in the UK, Brazil and South Africa. Further results from volunteers in the US, Kenya, Japan and India are due to be incorporated, whereupon the volunteer headcount will increase to c60,000.

Bearing in mind that here in the UK the developers were tasked with developing a vaccine with 50% efficacy, 90% (or even 70%) seems terrific, when we are told that the flu jab has only a 40-60% efficacy.

Here in the UK, any vaccine will be provided free of charge, will not be available on a private paid for basis and we will not have any choice on which vaccine any of us gets.

Having spoken to quite a few people over the last few days, the overwhelming response I have received is of great positivity.

Colin

 

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Remember in all this that all the countries that a cruise visits must have vaccine or other rules that we and the lines find safe.  There is a large % of people in the US who say they won't take any of the vaccines even when available to all.  I'm sure there will be many in other countries that will refuse vaccine. 

I'm sure that at least for a while after vaccine cruises will have to run with only cruise sponsored land tours and no one will be allowed to venture on their own.  I expect a long time before things return to "normal"

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20 hours ago, Keith1010 said:

I just did more reading and this is indeed good news.

 

I now understand the tweaking and how fabulous they believe they can get to 90% and that the storage will be much easier than the two other companies making it great for many nations.

 

What is amazing is how in the past it's taken 15 to 20 years to develop an effective vaccine where we now have three companies which if their information proves accurate that could be great solutions and the development was on a very fast track.

 

Some really positive news.

 

Keith

Sorry Keith, I responded to your earlier post before reding this one !!

 

Colin

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20 hours ago, Keith1010 said:

I just did more reading and this is indeed good news.

 

I now understand the tweaking and how fabulous they believe they can get to 90% and that the storage will be much easier than the two other companies making it great for many nations.

 

What is amazing is how in the past it's taken 15 to 20 years to develop an effective vaccine where we now have three companies which if their information proves accurate that could be great solutions and the development was on a very fast track.

 

Some really positive news.

 

Keith

 

Are you going to give any credit to Operation Warp Speed?  No, not going to happen; no credit for funding, risk sharing, or distribution assistance.  Nothing; nada; not going to happen.

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